ML20086T919

Applicant Exhibit A-55A,consisting of Tape 41 of 900411

ML20086T919
Person / Time
Site:	Vogtle
Issue date:	06/01/1995
From:	GEORGIA POWER CO.
To:
Shared Package
ML20086T912	List: ML20086T910 ML20086T919
References
OLA-3-A-055A, OLA-3-A-55A, NUDOCS 9508030199
Download: ML20086T919 (15)

Text

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Lil TAPE 41-(April 11,~1990)

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.2s Tr. 40-56 (Line 12)  !

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i 41 VdICE: Eight a.m.-.

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.5I VOICE: .(Inaudible)

'6- BOCKHOLD:. Whatever'. yesterday's- . mode'- 1 .i h

C7 < projection,is the~same.

l 8' VOICE:7 But (inaudible) Saturday ' night atL l 9.: eight o' clock. . -l i

.10- PARTON: We were showing three o' clock' Tuesday 1 11I (inaudible) yesterday. i

-12. BOCKHOLD: Three o' clock . . Tuesday. .- .

We' re ' not .j 13 going to lose any_ time. . Mode 3 will come quickly. That's_my- I

?14 projection'.

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' 15 VOICE: Mode 2 (inaudible). 1 16 VOICE: -Okay. (Inaudible) mode.4.

17 BOCKHOLD: Tomorrow. afternoon. l i

VOICE: Okay. .(Inaudible)1we don't need to:

- 18 '

-l 19 worry about (inaudible).

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i 20 VOICE: (Inaudible) engineers (inaudible).' [ l

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21 VOICE: (Inaudible). +

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. .--t . i s I'm leaving, I.just (inapdible).

.22 VOICE:

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-i 123 BOCKHOLD: On'my nickel. 1 J 1

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24 BOCKHOLD: Let me read a paragraph) "GPC has[ ~

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25- reviewed air quality of the diesel. generator ~of l ~coursef I

.26) focusing on ' the 1A diesel air system incl'udingl ;dewpoint:-

, & i ! >y 27 controlandhasconcludedthatairqualityisls'atisfactory.", ,.

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'l " Initial reports of higher than expected dewpoints later f

'2' attributed to faulty' instrumentation.  !

3: That specific sentence was in reference to the March 29, i

4 March 30, and March 31 work order associated with the 5 instruments that we later determined was bad, and we got the 6' V.C. Summer instrument and'we figured out how to work the EG&G 7 instrumentation. Okay.

8 This was confirmed by.an internal inspection of one' air 9 receiver on April 6, 1990. We looked in there and we found a

• 10 light film of oil and found some minor corrosion on some weld 11 surfaces. We told the NRC that. The periodic replacement of 12 control air filters were done in March, 1990. From .all 13 reports that I've heard on that is that those air filters were 14 always clean. Even in the previous outage'they were very 15 clean and practically brand new.

16 We showed no indication c; corrosion and air receiver and i 17 daily air receiver blow (inaudible) which showed no indication 18 of corrosion and daily air receiver blow down with no 19 significant water discharge.

20 We believe, although Swartzwelder is checking, is ever ,

21 since we started up we've been doing daily air receiver -

22 blowdowns as part of operations.

23 Further, I guess, Mike Horton, when the air quality came

-24 up, spoke to the Cooper people. And the cooper reaction was, 25 gee, if you do these daily blowdowns, and you don't have a air. ,

26 receiver full of water, because of the, these are marine i i

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.7 11; engines" and because you'havaia pressure reduction going to' the-2 ' controls,you!really' don't.have to worryfabout' air quality.

i31 Yout used the word that;would:be,LyouLknow,;why you' guys' 4: bothering.us, air' quality at'Vogtle was great. .That was.the-

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5. flavorfthat came to me, okay.

6" We've.done some I guess additional research. -We have-t

'7;

'duringJ the~ '88 . time frame . -- well, . ;we hadi some : PM :: program

8 problems on working.out.some PM. program problems.z O~ 9 The '88 time frame from like 5/10/88 to 5/2/89, somewhere' 10 in that time: frame, approximately a year ago, the year before 11.- that,. we may have had one or more of the dryers out of service'.

' 12- for several months-, okay, and that's indicated here.

1 13 We probably were not doing good PM's on checking dryer-m 14 quality.at that particular period of' time, okay.

15 I guess my question to the group is would that affect the 16' statement that we made in our letter at all?

~17- Is the other facts, the fact.that hey, we blow down the 18 air dryers, the fact that we looked at.an' air' dryer, the' fact.

19 that essentially a- year or approximately a. year before the 20 overhaul, you know, we did have good dewpoints would that-21 leave'this statement, item four, whole.and good?

4

-22 KOCHERY: The question.I need to answer first,-

23 the-dewpoint we were taking until you for t.he period,.was 't' i 24 used the right way? You know,.we have'(inaudible). seventeen, 25 twelve, twenty-two, these are good, you got a good number.

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j 1That's> theoretically.notlpossible.

21: LMOSBAUGH::' ,(

I.mean,/whatLwe've got'to basically.~

--2 -.BOCKHOLD: : {

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.)31 .sayVisJourlPM program;before, ILdon't know - - , j 3 -

$ 4- .MOSBAUGH:.  : J u n e ,1 July, '89.; right?'

'!5- ~BOCKHOLD:- Yeahksomewhere.-- S

.6: KOCHERY: . (Inaudible). '89 1 e

^ ' j 17' BOCKHOLD: Yeah,-somewhere inEthat timerframe

'8 our PM program was-suspect. Okay, the readings were suspect.7 .;

.s 9 You know, that doesn't mean that you.didn't.have good air. We: j a

10 don't know if we'had good air ~or bad air,-okay. .

T 11- But in the meantime we did pull the filter, okay,'and we: -

12 had been doing the blowdowns)and all of that' implies that thef h 13- air, although .it- may not 'during this' period? of time .l c14 demonstrate the-best quality,.was' satisfactory.

15' KOCHERY: (Inaudible) you can't say_ that z we 16 have a bad air and during the period because anytime you've'  ;

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.17 got a minor corrosion, you-can see anytime (inaudible)'. i

.i (18 BOCKHOLD:. You'know,.I _ guess'I would -tend ' to --

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19 ,believe that we had good air based upon J two' things; one, 'l 20! ' pulling the air- filter and' inspecting' it,.~which- was_

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l 21 . essentially new. We didn't see any buildups of air' things.=  ;

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-22 The second thing I guess Ifwouldl tend:.to'believe,.-you j 23- know, you get two hundred'and fifty pound air orsthereabouts .

i24? and it sets there at kind'of room temperature,s okay, and'a a r 25- dryer tries to dry -it and' it goes through and expansion?

26. process, even if you didn't have a dryer, it'goes through an-4

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4 1 expansion process, the control air gets drier in my opinion.

2 At-least I think that's correct.

3- You know, you go from two hundred and fifty pounds or two l 4 hundred and ten pounds at the lowest to sixty pounds. It gets 5 a lot drier. So the controls themselves are gonna see dry l 6 air. '

7 So I would then conclude, if my logic is correct, I would 8 conclude that our statement here we made on air quality is-

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9 still a valid statement, right.

10 VOICE: (Inaudible).

11 MOSBAUGH: Yes. You know, we responded in this 12 generic letter and stated what our air quality was.

13 We did state that our air quality, the maximum dewpoint 14 acceptance criteria for the Vogel air start system has been 15 established at fifty degrees F at system pressure. See FSAR 16 table. That's what we said our requirements are.

17 Dewpoint criteria was established based on a design 18 capability of the air start system and a minimum diesel 19 generator room design temperature.

20 So basically we said that our criteria is fifty' degrees 21 F at system pressure. -

22 BOCKHOLD: Yeah, that's what we said in the FSAR 23 (inaudible).

24 BOCKHOLD: -We sometimes will not meet that and 25 we haven't met that in the past or where we didn't have a good 26 PM program to demonstrate it periodically. My question really 5

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1; focuses on this~recent George Hairston letter and how long -- ,

R you know, I.believe.from what I've heard from all the experts 25 j L3l .that Item 4 here;is'still valid.-  !

, 4- .I mean, we believe that.we've'had satisfactory.. quality.~

5 . air going to the' control system.- l 6 KOCHERY

Yes, I.think that because th'e dryer i 7, ..

. the filter-(inaudible). I 1 8- BOCKHOLD:' Given the fact that you chave an

9' expansion process that makes the' air drier.

• l ' 10 :. MOSBAUGH: Again, George, I say, you Nnow, it.  !

11  ; depends on what_you're going to call satisfactory.

12 If you're-going to say satisfactory is what we said in .

13 . response to the generic letter, I'm not sure that we can show .

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14 that we've met that criteria. 1 1

15 The problem is that you can't tell what any of - those  :

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-16 numbers are because the way the PM's done, you just can't 17 tell. '

18 You know, there's a ' number down' here, but there's - no 19 calculation. They're doing the. measurements:at atmospheric 20 pressure, yet they need to be corrected back to a system l

21 pressure, you know, -- -

22 HORTON: You can't prove tnat ctatement.

23 MOSBAUGH: -- and we're getting high numbers. j 24' HORTON: (Inaudible) documented evidence- to -

25 prove that statement. There's nothing to back that. You've- j I

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1 got to figure that that statement is true based on our 2 observations and --

3 BOCKHOLD: We've made engineering judgments, 4 okay, on this particular statement. I would go ahead and --

5 MOSBAUGH: You know, we're saying there's no 6 internal corrosion that we're observing, therefore air quality

.7 is met and that may or may not be relatable.

8 KOCHERY: The air receiver was good you can see 9 the wedge filter you can see the difference.

10 STOKES: I guess it doesn't meet the specific 11 numbers criteria but based on our judgment when we blow it 12 down three times a day and operations says based on what we've 13 seen on the filter and everything else no corrosion, we have 14 to say it's acceptable --

but it doesn't in fact meet the 15 numbers.

16 HORTON: I think Al's concern is the lack of 17 documentation.

18 MOSBAUGH: The IIT team has made recent 19 requests, George, for all these work orders,'okay. They've 20 asked for all these -- '

21 BOCKHOLD: I think at ten o' clock I'll talk to ,

22 IIT team about going back on our past work orders in our PM 23 program in '88 was not as good as our PM program has been in ,

24 the past year, basically, in '89 and going to '90, and we'll 25 provide ' hat information. It's still our engineering judgment 26 that we had satisfactory air quality. I think that's --

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1 i 'lL BURWINKLE: Thel expansion of ' air.'from receiver i 2- pressure-. to ' eighty pounds - is going to r e s u l t .- i n about.an e

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'3 eighty 1. degree depression of dewpoint --

pardon me, thirty-4 - degree depression at dewpoint.

5 . VOICE: (Inaudible).

6 VOICE: Yeah.

7: VOICE: Yeah. 4 8 MOSBAUGH: So the receiver -- ,

9 BURWINKLE: The absolute worst case would be i

10 water laying in the bottom of the tank on a hot day, you'd' '

i 11 have had, what, a ninety degree dewpoint or so. l 12 MOSBAUGH: Okay. The other thing that~happens ,

13 with a system like that is normally your receiver temperature l

14. is elevated when your compressors are operating because of the J

l 15 heat,.but a ninety or a hundred would be a good number.

16 BURWINKLE: But we store air in those for such a  !

17 long time, i i

18 MOSBAUGH: That would only be a short period 19 effect.

20 BURWINKLE: Yeah.

21 MOSBAUGH: I think that's probably a good

• 22 starting point.

23 BURWINKLE: Yev get about thirty degree 24 depression of a dewpoint for-that expansion so whatever we

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25 theorize the maximum in the receiver was, we're sure we had j l

26 thirty degrees lower at the controls.  !

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1 BOCKHOLD: If you said you had ninety degrees in 2 the summer time in that room and that room would never,

3. actually never rapidly fall to' sixty degrees.

l 4 BURWINKLE: The ISA standard was twenty -- how

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5 many degrees below room temperature?

j j 6 STOKES: Eighteen degrees.

7 BURWINKLE: Eighteen degrees. So we always are 8 going thirty, which is more than eighteen.-

9 BOCKHOLD: Okay. So we believed then we had 10 good air quality and a poor PM program in '88 and we fixed 11 that.

12 BURWINKLE: The PM program needs some minor 13 tuning up now.

14 KOCHERY: (Inaudible) minor tuning needs to be 15 done now.

16 BOCKHOLD: Oh, yeah, I agree. i l

17 VOICE: (Inaudible).

18 BOCKHOLD: Oh, yeah, we flapped around with the 19 fact that we got a, you know, on the 29th or so we got a 20 crummy reading and nobody knew about it until Milt Hunt picked 21 it up. .

22 MOSBAUGH: George, we had a bad reading today.

23 Sixty degrees on the 2A diesel.

24 BOCKHOLD: The 2A diesel I think we're working 25 on the problem; isn't that right?

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li STOKES: Thby had left the dryers off, Ilthink

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following the PM, both dryers off.

3 VOICE: (Inaudible).

o4- HORTON:

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Haven't we got:any. good readings. -}

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-5 BOCKHOLD: Not on 2A, 2B (inaudible). '

6- KOCHERY:. 2A was high. They're trying to drain 7 down the tanks..  !

8 BOCKHOLD: I can doublecheck with operations and 9 we should be bleeding that tank down. l i

10 KOCHERY: Cotty's going to do that today.  !

l 11 BOCKHOLD: Okay. When-I heard about it, and I 12 heard about it yesterday or so or the day before yesterday.-- I 13 actually, I heard about it just before the meeting withLthe 14 NRC.

-15 He mentioned there was a possibility and they finally 16 took the reading and I got the information just before they i

17 finally took the reading that if effective and I think it was 1

18 sixty degrees at that point. j 19 I thought I told Skip or somebody in operations to go

~20 ahead and start the bleed, feed and bleed on the tank:too.

21 BURWINKLE: For PM program improvement, the PM -

.22 currently says to use a pressure regulator upstream of the 23 instrument and the instrument manual'says that you should not 24 use a pressure regulator. It should be a needle valve. That-

25 needs to be changed. j l

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1:  ! STOKES:- (Inaudible) that had been changed'in

-every version of the ' PM a year ago.

p 2- . We put the correct'

-3: numbers -in thero and the correct procedure and they changed it 4 in the meantime. And I just'dispositioned'snother DC to have.

5 ne' write _another-procedure. So the PM-has been out of our

.. 6- hands. As soon as.I correct something they say redo it.  ;

~7' STOKES: (Inaudible).

b 8 KOCHERY: Also the dryers are out of service.

9 They still.run the compressors. I can't understand that. ,

10~ BOCKHOLD: I'll write a note to Skip Kitchens 11' (inaudible). I don't understand why.  :

12 BURWINKLE: And'the reading for (inaudible) the 13 reading at atmospheric pressure, they ought to convert the 14 acceptance criteria at atmospheric pressure and then they  !

15 wouldn't have to go correct back to receiver pressure every 16 time they did ' it with, you know, chance for error.and not 1

17 knowing how they do it. I 18 KOCHERY: (Inaudible) make that error. I

. 19 KOCHERY: (Inaudible).  !

-l 20 KOCHERY: They give the readings and they get'

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. 21 the temperature, you know. They just (inaudible). ,

22 VOICE: Yeah.

23 KOCHERY: And they go back to try to correct 24 that one --  :

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• >.o 1 BURWINKLE: ' So we're going to end up with an 2 acceptance dewpoint of like minus five degrees or something

- 3_ atmosphere.

4 STOKES: (Inaudible) are you saying take out' 5 the charts and --

6 KOCHERY: That's right.

7 BURWINKLE: Well, their procedure doesn't tell 8 them how to correct it. It just says to correct it, so we 9 don't know how they're doing it.

10 STOKES: Yeah. I just dispositioned a DC to 11 have them rewrite the field test procedure for each one of 12 those and make sure the (inaudible).

13 VOICE: (Inaudible).

14 BURWINKLE: Document control.

15 VOICE: (Inaudible).

16 HORTON: The one they had out the in field the 17 other day was an unapproved copy.

18 VOICE: (Inaudible).

19 VOICE: (Inaudible) equipment (inaudible).

20 BURWINKLE: The PM program.

21 VOICE: Right.

22 VOICE: (Inaudible) or region number, what's 23 that number?

24 VOICE: (Inaudible) just got a message 25 (inaudible).

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l' MOSBAUGH: The conclusion that -I- can draw, .

2- , George,'is.that I think that we know we've had compressors-

.3- that.- dryers out of service for a long period of time.  !

4 Kenny says that we-have continued at times to run the 5 compressors even though the dryers are out of service, and I j

believe.that when you do that, you have-a condition like you

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6.

7 have right now on 2A and you'll end up'with, you know, sixty  !

'8 degree or so dewpoint, okay.

9 And we have operated that way, okay, and'I think there's 10 an operating history like that, and I think having operated 11 that way in the past, you know, I don't think we can say we've

-12 always met the statements on air quality that we have in the i

13 FSAR.

~ 14 on the other hand what we're saying is that we have- l 15 inspected the receiver and we've inspected the filters and 16 from the extent of that inspection, we have not detected'a. -

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17 corrosion problem, and I think that's about as much as we can i

18 conclude.

19 BOCKHOLD: I think we can add that, you know, 20 the thirty degree dewpoint drop because of the way the 21 system's designed still gives us satisfactory air and its our 22 engineering judgment associated with that.

23 MOSBAUGH: I think you have an actual case right l

' 24' here now on 2A. l l

25 BOCKHOLD: That's sixty degrees (inaudible) --

26- BURWINKLE: -- dropped to thirty (inaudible).

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• y, ; .1 Youlwould meet-the requirements of 1' ' BURWINKLE: e

-2 sixty degrees certainly. *

'3 BOCKHOLD: -- on 2A.

~4' BURWINKLE: If you postulate the dryer being out1 >

i 5 for a long period of time in the summer and the ro'm getting  !

t 6 to ninety -- I guess' design maximum.the room is like ninety-7 eight.

8 'BOCKHOLD: You've got to~look over a course of- i 9 time, too.

10' BURWINKLE: Yeah.

BOCKHOLD: I mean, when you do the bubble test, i 12- yoa're bubbling moist air down the line. You know, that's for 13 a short period of time. You've got saturated air going-14 through the control. That's what the manufacturer is using, i l

15- but short periods of time is not a problem.  !

1 16 BURWINKLE: Yeah.

17 BOCKHOLD: The problem is that you get water 18 down the line and it sets there and corrodes.

19 BURWINKLE: And corrodes and (inaudible). 1 20 BOCKHOLD: That's a big problem.

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21 BOCKHOLD: Okay.  ;

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22 BOCKHOLD: I'll talk to the residents about j 23 this.

. 24 BOCKHOLD: I apptseiate it, folks. I'll pass l 25 (inaudible).

26 VOICE: (Inaudible).

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i 1 BOCKHOLD: I'll pass this on to Harvey and make 2 sure (inaudible) PM, i

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