ML20078L631
| ML20078L631 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Catawba  |
| Issue date: | 05/19/1983 |
| From: | Vandoorn P DUKE POWER CO. |
| To: | |
| Shared Package | |
| ML20078L617 | List: |
| References | |
| FOIA-83-434 NUDOCS 8310240018 | |
| Download: ML20078L631 (150) | |
Text
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UNITED STATES OF AMERICA NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION BEFORE THE ATOMIC SAFETY AND LICENSING BOARD InRet :
DUKE POWER COMPANY, Et & : DOCKET NUMBERS (Catawba Nuclear Station : 50 413 Units 1 and 2) -
- 50 414 G
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DEPOSITION OF:
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PETER K. VANDOORN
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8310240018 830810 PDR FOIA AHLERS83-434 PDR
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. Evelyn Berger Assodate STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE P. O. SOX 19444 CNARLOTTE. NORTH CAROLINA 28119
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l 2 ROBERT GUILD, ESQ.
C ha rle s to n, S. C.
3 i Counsel on Behalf of Inte rveno r, Palmetto 4 A lli a n c e , Inc or po r a te d 5 D E B EV OIS E k LIB ER M A N, ESQS.
W a s hin gt o n, D. C.
6 BY: Anne W. C o ttin gh a m 7 RONALD L. GIBSON, E S Q.
Charldte, N. C.
8 Counsel on B eh alf of A p plic a n t, Duke Power 9 Company 10 GEORGE E. JOHNSON, ESQ.
W a s hin gton, D. C.
11 Counsel on B ehalf of Nuclear Re gulato ry 12 C o mmi s s ion
(' 13 A LSO PRESENT:
14 Michael F. Lowe Director 15 Palmetto A lli a n c e , Incorporated 16 Jim Jos P alm e tt o A lli a nc e. In c or po r a te d 17 Larry D avid s o n 18 Project QA M anager Duke Power Company 19 Mike Child e r s 20 E ngin e e rin g A s sociate Design Di vi s io n 21 Duke Power C ompany 22 W. Ouellette Roger Lic e n s in g D e p artm ent U Duke Power C om p a ny 24 M aur e en O ' B ri en Catawba A ctio n 25 EVELYN SE89GEfl ASSOCIATES. STEpsOTYPE stEPOfl73DNB SERVtCE. CMAfE.OTTE. 8800rTM CAROUMA
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1 J ennif e r P hilli p s
' G o ve r nm ent A c c o u nt a bility P roj ec t 2
Betsy L e v,i t i c u s 3 C ar olin a Environmental Group 4 Lee Ann K o r n e~ g a y Electronic Recorder 5 P alm e tt o A llia n c e 6
7 I N D E X 8 Direct Cross Wit ne s s 8 VanDoorn 5 --
Peter K.
10 11 12
( E X H I B 1 T S D e s c riptio n Page Number 14 L e tt e r f rom NRC to M r. 22 1
15 G uild dated M ay 19, 1983 16 2 Case C h r o nolo gy 90 17 Stipulation 147 3
18 19 l
20 21 22 23 24 ,
25 EVELYN SENGER ASSOCIATES. STEMOTYPE HEPOsrTNee SEsMCE. CMAHLOTTE. MORTH CAROLaMA
o o 4
1 The Deposition of Peter K. VanDoorn is 2 taken' at the o f fic e s of Duke Power C om pa ny, 3 Cha rlott e, North C a r olin a, on this the 19 th .d a y of 4 W.ay, 1983, in the presence of Robert Guild. Attorney 5 on behalf of the Inte rven o r, Palmetto A llia nc e, 6 Incorporated: Ronald G ib s o n and Anne C o tti n gha m, 7 A ttorney s on b e half of th e A p p lic a n t, Duke Power 8 Company; and George E. Johnson, Attorney on behalf 9 of the Nuclear R e gulato ry C o mmi s s io n.
10 It is agreed that Lynn B. G illia m, Notary 11 P u blic in and for the State of North C a r oli na , may 12 take said D e po sition in m a c hin e shorthand and
( 13 transcribe the s am e to typewriting.
14 MR. GUILD: Mr. VanDoorn, my name is 15 R ob e rt G u il d , Counsel for P a lm e tto A llia n c e ,
16 Int e rv en or. I understand at my request Counsel for 17 the NRC s ta ff has id e n tifi e d you as a person mo s t 18 knowled g e able to respond to qu e s tions concerning our 19 C on te n tion Six which relates to the subject of N Catawba in s t ru c tion.
l 21 MR. JOHNSON: Can I have everyone in the 22 room id e n tifi e d for the record?
23 MR. GUILD: If we could move f r om my 24 left back, if you would state your name and your 25 a f filia ti on with the o r g aniz ation s you are with ?
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1 MS. O' BRIEN: M aure en O ' B ri en, Catawba i
2 A ction.
3 MR. JOS: Jim Jos, Staff A s sis tant to 4 Palme tt o A llia n c e.
5 MR. LOWE: Palmetto A lli a n c e, Director.
6 MS. C O T TING H A M : Anne C ottin gh am, here 7 on behalf of the A p p lic a n t .
8 MR. GIBSON: Counsel for Duke Power.
9 The other persons present are Larry D a vid s o n, 10 Project QA Manager, Mike C hild e r s , an Engineering 11 A s s oc ia te in Design En gin e e rin g, and Roger O u e ll e t t e .
12 MR. JOHNSON: I am George Johnson, C 13 Counsel for the NRC staff.
14 MS. KORNEGAY: Lee Ann Kornegay, 15 P alm e tt o A llia nc e.
16 MS. PHILLIPS: J e nnif e r P hillip s ,
l 17 Government A c c o un t a bilit y P r oj e c t.
18 19 PETER K. VANDOORN, 20 havin g been fi r s t duly sworn to tell the truth, was 21 examined and t e s tified as f ollow s :
22 M DIR EC T EX A MIN A TION 24 BY M R. GUILD:
25 Q Le t's see if we can get some of these
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o a VANDOORN - DIR E C T 6 1 f o rmalitie s over with, M r. VanDoorn.
2 In responses to que stio ns by P a lm e t t o 3 A llian c e to the NRC staff, we received a document 4 dated F ebruary 17, 1983, NRC Supplemental Responsoo 5 to Palmetto A lli a n c e Interrogatories and Production 6 R eque s t on C o nt e nti o n Six and Seven.
7 I show you this document and ask if you 8 can id e ntif y th a t A f fid a vit that is attached to that 9 document (in dic a tin g) ?
10 -
A Yes.
11 Q I have to ask you if you will state yes or 12 no so that she can pick it up.
('
13 A That is my A f fid a vit.
14 Q Are you f a milia r with this d ocume nt; you l 15 have seen this Response to the s taff ?
16 A I am aware of my portion of it.
17 Q As that A f fida vit r e fle c t s , you participated 18 in p ro vi din g in f o r m a tio n with respect to some of th e 19 .I n t e r r o g a t o r i e s on your C o n t e n ti o-a Nu m b e r Six?
M A Yes.
21 Q Now turning to Page 2 of that d o cu m e n t, 22 the t e xt of Contention Six as admitted by the 23 Licensing Board in the case, will you take a m om ent 24 to examine that?
M It appears as the last paragraph on that
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o a VANDOORN - DIR E C T 7 1
page?
2 , A This paragraph (indic ating) ?
3 Q No, sir; the cir cle d paragrdph admitted as 4 the text of Contention Six.
5 A Okay, I' v e read it.
6 Q And you have seen that before ?
7 A Yes.
8 Q And you are f a milia r with the terms of 9 Palmetto A lli a n c e ' s Contention Six?
10 MR. JOHNSON: One second; with 11 respect to obj e c tio n s . I would like to reach 12 some kind of ag r e e m e nt about f o r m alitie s of
( 13 making o bj e c tio n s here.
14 Do you have a procedure that you 15 worked o ut with Duke Power Company?
16 M R. G UIL D : Let me suggest this: I 17 would ask George if Couns el has an o bj e c tio n 18 to the form of the que s tio n, that you state 19 it and I will make every effort to ref rame N the que s tion and try to avoid the i
21 o bj e c tion able character of the que s tion, i
22 If you have an obj ec tion on the ground a U of relevancy, I would ask you to reserve 24 that. and I don't expect you to have waived D any o bj e c tion on the grounds of relevancy.
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1 M R. GIBSON: Can I put that into 2 terminology we may be f a milia r with; that 3 is, that all questions except as to form 4 are deemed o bj ec te d to and all obj e c tion s 5 as to form are reserved?
6 M R. GUILD: I have no problem with 7 that, Mr. Johnson.
8 MR. JOHNSON: Do I understand that 9 to mesa if I don't o bj e c t as to form it is 10 deemed o bj e c t e d to?
11 M R. GIBSON: It is deemed waived as 12 to form.
( 13 MR. JOHNSON: Okay.
14 MR. GIBSON: But all others are 15 preserved.
16 MR. JOHNSON: That s ti pula tio n is
. 17 okay with me.
18 MR. GUILD: By us as well, t
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M BY MR. GUILD:
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21 T hi s D e po sition is taken for the purposes j Q 22 of gathering E vid e n c e and inf o rm ation regarding our 23 C onte ntion Number Six; and while it is s o m ewh at 24 'f o rm al in b e in g tr an s c ribe d, I w ou l'd' a s k that you 25 view . i.t as an informal process in which we are tryin g
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 9 1 to exchange information; and I trust that you will be 2 responsive and cooperate.
3 If I ask a que s tio n and I am not clear on 4 the terms I use or you don't f ollow the d rif t of what 5 I'm asking, please s to p me and ask for an 6 explanation.
7 In the absence of your stopping me and 8 asking for cla t ific ation. I will presume that you 9 understood the que stio n and that your answer was 10 responsive. Is that ag re eable ?
11 A I will agree to that; yes, sir.
12 Q When did you become the R e sid e nt Inspector 13 at the Catawba s tation ?
14 A I was assigned as the R e sid en t Inspector in -
15 late 1980. I a c tu ally reported to the site in 16 l February of '81.
l 17 Q What was your title at that time ?
18 A Junior M e t allu r gi c a l En gine er. At that time ,
19 I was just prior to being assigned to the Senior 20 Resident Inspector at C a t a wb a.
21 Q At the time you came to the Catawba 22 station were there any other NRC staff personnel 23 p e rma ne ntly assigned to the site ?
b 24 A Not at that tim e; we had a R e sid e nt 25 Inspector previously, but this was a period in which EvtLvve sEnoEn AssocaATEs. sTENGTYPE REPCMmeeG SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. PeOfmg CANOWNA
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o , J VANDOORN . DIR E C T 3n l 1 he had been transferred p rio r to my b ein g assigned.
I 2 Q Track it backwards th en. You are 3 currently the R e sident Inspector?
4 A Yes.
5 Q And you came on site in February of '81.
6 Who preceded you in that p o sition ?
7 A Mr. George M axw ell.
8 Q What would his title have been at that time ;
9 do you r e c all ?
10 A He would have been also the Senior Residen t 11 Inspector.
12 Q And can you help us with his te nu r e , when 13 was he on site; when did he depart?
14 A I don't have the exact dates, it was less 15 than a year he was assigned to Catawba, and he left 16 before I went out there.
17 There was some months between when he 18 left and when I arrived.
19 Q Six months, just your best e s tim a t e ?
20 A I b e li e ve he left in the summer of '80.
21' Q Prior to Mr. M a xw ell was there a R e s id ent 22 on s it e ?
U A No, there wa s n' t.
24 Now help me understand g e n e r ally, M r.
Q M VanDoorn, the organisation of your area of work.
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VANDOORN - DIR E CT 'g g 1 To whom do you report now?
2 A I report to the Projects and R e sident 3 In s p e c to r Branch in R e gion II, A tlanta, for the NRC.
4 Q And to who m did you report?
5 A Pr e s ently, M r. Vir gil Brownlee; during 6 mo s t of my tenure I reported to Mr. Jack B r ya nt.
7 Q Is that the same Mr. Bryant who also 8 assisted in preparing answers to P alm e tto A llia n c e 's 9
que s tion s ?
10 A Yes, sir.
II Q Who has been id e nti fi e d as Counsel for the 12 staff, as also knowled g e able on C o nt e ntio n Six, he
( I3 accompanied you here today?
14 3 y,,,
15 Q What was his po sition ?
16 A He was a S ec tion C hi ef.
17 Q Do you know his exact title or a more 18 elearer d e fi ni tio n of his title ?
19 and--
A S e c tio n Chief, PRP Divis ion--Proj ec t s -
20 what is PRP? We change title s fairly of ten.
21 Q Would that have been over P r oj e c t s and 22 R e s id ent In s pection ?
2 A Yeah, the same.
b 24 Q Mr. Bryant was s t a tione d in Atlanta at that 25 time ?
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 12 1 A Yes.
t 2 Q' At the R e gion al O f fi c e "/
3 A Y e s. ,
4 Q And what is Mr. Bryant's p o s iti o n now; do 5 you kno w ?
6 A He is the Senior R e side nt Inspector at the 7 Oconee Nuclear Station.
8 Q When did Mr. Brownlee take over M r.
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9 B ryant's p o s itio n as your superior?
10 A A p pr oxim at ely, about a month ago. It 11 w t a n' t--th e r e wa s an in te rim period when we had an 12 A ctin g Section C hi e f b etw e e n Mr. Bryant and M r.
( 13 B r owale e.
14 Q What p erio d of t i tr. e was that approximately P 15 A Several mo nths . Mr. Al Ignatonis, 16 I-5-n-a-t-o-n-i-s.
17 Q Was M r. Ignatonis in his a c tin g capacity 18 in 1982?
19 A '83 p r im a r ily.
20 Q What is Mr. Ignatonis' primary dutie s ?
21 A Proj ect C o ordinato r.
M Q In the same branch?
U A Yes.
l 24 Q And he is in that position now?
2 A He is.
EvgLvpe SERGER ASSOCIATES. STE8eOTTPE REPCHWIreG seENICE. CHARLDTTE. feONTM CAstOLafeA
4 5 VANDOORN - DIRECT 13 1 Q Then furth e r up the chain, Mr. VanDoorn, 2 to wh o rn does your superior, Mr. B r ownle e, repo rt ?
3 A He reports to Mr. Hugh Dance, D-a-n-e-e.
4 Q What is M r. Dance's po sition ?
5 A He is the Branch Chief in the PRP 6 Division.
7 Q Re gion II ?
8 A Yes, sir.
9 Q He is Chief of th e Proj ects and R e s id e n t 10 Inspector Branch?
11 A That r e ally is a D ivi s io n; I mis s p oke when 12 I said Branch. We have Branches, S e c tion s.
( 13 D ivi s io n s , and the R e gional A d mini s t r a to r in descend -
14 ing order.
15 Q So M r. B ro wnle e would have been over a 16 projects and R e gional In s pe c tion Division ?
l 17 A S e c tio n.
18 Q Thank you. Mr. Dance is a Branch Chief, 19 one step up from that, and then the Division?
20 A Mr. Richard Lewis, L-e-w-i-s.
21 Q And his po sitio n ? , ,
22 A Would be Division Dir ec to r of PRP Di vi s io n ,
23 Q Now in that s ec tio n, branch, division 24 s truc tu r e, is the structure organised on the basis 25 of s p e cifi c sites or c e rtain s it e s within a cestain
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DIR E C T 14 VANDOORN -
1 division and if not, help me un d e r s ta nd.
2 A Yes, b a s ic a lly each s ection has certain site s assigned within it, not n e c e s s a rily one 3
4 u tilit y per s ection, but several sites roughly 5 assigned to each s ection.
6 Q What sites were grouped with C atawb a in 7 the s e ctio n in whi ch you work?
8 A Duke s it e s b a s i c a lly.
9 Q Any others ?
10 A No, I do n't believe so.
11 Q Has that been consistent, the consistent 12 o r g ani z a ti on al s tru ctur e during the ti me we have 13 referred to here when you had a R e s ide nt on site ?
14 A Yes, during that ti m e period, yes; it does l
! 15 change. There is a rotation in th e interest of t
16 obj e c tivity and having :lif f e r e n t p eo pl e look at 17 dif f e r ent s it e s .
18 There is a rotation o c c a s io na lly of who is 19 assigned to which site.
M Q Let's talk about that a second; when last i 21 would they have rotated e ithe r s e c tio n s or personnel l
22 assigned to the section s ?
23 A I' m not sure, j 24 Q Not since you have been at the site ?
I 5 A T h a t's correct.
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 15 1 Q And do you know wh e th e r all of the Duke i
2 s ite s were in a single s ection as far back as the 3 commencement of c on s tru c tio n at Catawba ?
4 A I c an' t speak to that; no, sir.
5 Q The PRP Division and Mr. Lewis report to 6 whom ?
7 A Mr. James P. O'Rielly, 0 - R -i- e 1- y ;
8 R e gio n al A d mini s tr at o r .
9 Q Aad Mr. O ' R i e lly to whom ?
10 A You are getting far above me. You should 11 have told me to bring the chart.
12 Q Do you know who he reports to?
( 13 A I b elie ve he reports to the Director of 14 Mr. Dircks, D -i- r - e - k - s , I think. I O pe rations ,
15 don't know all of thos e titles.
16 Q And if we can get further up the chain of 17 command there. Mr. Dircks to whom ?
18 A He r e po rt s to the C ommis sion.
19 Q And the Commi s sion to--
20 A God, I d on't know.
21 Q All right, sir; how long, if you know, 22 a p p r o xi m a t e ly , has Mr. O ' Ri elly been eith e r a 23 R e gio n al A dminis tr at o r or in a comparable po sition ?
b 24 A W e ll, I can't speak totally for M r.
25 O'Rielly 's background; but he came to R e gion II I amn. .. .. o.oc n.. n on - c.. c== ens. o- caou.
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 16 1 b eli e v e in August of '77. That was the same month 2 I came to Region II.
3 Q Wh e r e had Mr. O ' R ielly been before that.
4 if you know?
5 A I' m not sure about that. R e gio n I, as I 6 understand it, the R e gional Director just p rio r and 7 prior to that, I' m not exactly sure, several places.
8 MR. GUILD: Now with that as some 9 background, C oun s el, I b eli e v e before the 10 D e po sitio n staff has produced some 11 a d.ditio n al Discovery mat e rials ; and in 12 response to a request of mine, some 13 ma t e rials with respect to administrative 14 procedures em ploye d by the staff and Mr.
15 VanDoorn's area of r e s po n s ibility may have i
16 been made available or not.
17 At that tim e , fir s t can you tell me 1
18 whether or not M r. VanDoorn has brought 19 with him any of the Nu cle ar Regulatory l
20 C o mmi s s ion's Ins pe c tion and Enforcement 21 procedures?
22 MR. JOHNSON: W e've b r oug ht several l
23 documents, M r. VanDoorn has b rou ght 24 several d o cum e nt s.
l 25 THE WITNESS: R e gion al O ffic e l
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In s t r uc tion N um be r 1030.
2 MR. JOHNSON: There is also a 3 reference in this In s p e c to r's M a nu al that wo 4 identified this morning as changing somethin g 5 that could be p e r tin en t.
6 THE WITNESS: This is a pretty broad 7 training manual u s ed in a training course 8 for NRC.
9 We receive training in Basic In s p e c tion to Pr a c tic e s and P oli ci e s fairly soon when 11 they come with the NRC.
I
- 12 There is guidance in here th a t a ll of l
C 13 us are trained on; and which I think is 14 p e,r ti n e n t to this Deposition since it involve s 15 all e g a tio n s .
16 There is a special s e c tion on h a n d lin g 17 of alle g a tion s .
I 18 l
19 BY MR. GUILD:
20 Q If you can, give me the reference to that 21 s pe cific s e c tio n, just identify it.
22 A It is In s pe c tion and Enf or ce men t Center, 23 Inspector's Manual is the title of the document; and b 24 the location I'll get in a second.
2 Q Sure.
EVELYN SERGER ASSOCLATE S. STE8eOTYPE REPOwTING SE RVICE. CHARLOTTE, NORTH CAROL #MA
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VANDOORN - DIRECT <
18 1 A It wo ul d be Chapter Eight.
2 Q And what is the title of that chapter ?
3 A "Inve s tigation and F o llo w Up of A lle ga ti on s. "
1 4 Q And before you close the book, is there a 5 revision numb e r or date, an indication of how curren t 6 that is?
7 A This is a somewhat dated manual sinc e I 8 received this in 1978; and obviously it was prepared 9 prior to that ti m e . But there is no s p e c ifi c r e vi sion 10 on this chapter, pages, although I' m sure this manua l 11 has r ec eive d some updating.
12 This is my personal copy of the manual.
( 13 We all get a copy when we fir s t come.
14 Q The fi r s t document that you i d e n tifi e d was 15 Regional Offic e and In s tru c tion s , and I wonder if I 16 can examine that?
17 MR. JOHNSON: Sure, we have several 18 copies.
19 MR. G U IL D: Now just to kind of 20 ho p e fully c omplet e some of this house-21 ke e pin g , M r. VanDoorn, C oun s el; I b e li e ve 22 prior to th e b e ginning of the De po sition 23 also we hand d elive r e d a letter of May 19, l C 24 1983, r efle c tin g the i d e n tifi c a ti o n and 25 availability of a number of documents.
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19 !
1 And I wonder if for the Record I could
(
2 ask you to describe what was made 3 available so that the Record will r efle ct ?
4 M R. JOHNSON: Right, the staff made 5 a v ail a b le to Palmetto A llia n c e this m o rnin g 6 s o me further documentation responsive to 7 the fir s t Inte rr o gatorie s and Pr o du c tio n 3 Requests relating to C o r.i s a tio n Six of the 9 p r o c e e din g.
10 D o cume nt s contained largely Duke 11 source material; that is m ate rial that 12 originated from the A p plic ant that was in
( 13 'the NRC file th at was put together for 14 purposes of responding to a Freedom of 15 Inf o rm ation Act R eque s t.
16 It also contained some lett e r s and 17 memos that are NRC sources. In addition
! 18 we are providing today another several 19 do cume nt s that are currently being tele- p 20 copied to this lo c a tion to be turned over.
21 MR. GUILD: Mr. Johnson, I have two l
l 22 stacks of documents separately bound
{
M (in di c a tin g) . Is there a divi s io n between b 24 the t w o thit _ wo uld be helpful to explain for f
I E the R eco rd ?
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20 1 MR. JOHNSON: T hi s packet here i
2 (indicating), Docum ent 821 on the top. I 3 b e li e v e this is all Duke source m at e rial.
4 MR. GUILD: But for c la rifi c a tio n, 5 source material f rom Duke but contain ed 6 in the NRC file s ?
7 MR. JOHNSON: Yes, that is contained 8 in the NRC files, yes; and th e other packet 9 has both NRC source material and Duke 10 source m a t e r i al.
11 It alsa was in the NRC fil e s .
12 M R. GUILD: What is the dis tinc tio n
( 13 between the two?
14 MR. JOHNSON: I di d n ' t make the 15 dis tin c tion s . I was just given these 16 documents from the Freedom of Inf o rmation 17 Act people; but I b eli e v e they were sent 18 forward in this manner and that is the way 19 they c o ntinu e to be treated.
20 MR. GUILD: Counsel, there is no 21 other inf o r m a tion about the basis for th e 22 divi sio n between the two sets that were just 23 given to me this mo rnin g ?
24 If there is any administrative 5 di s tin c tio n between the two that would be
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, o 21 1
1 helpful in being able to process an j 2 in s pe ctio n without delaying the Deposition 3 further, I would as k that you give that 4 d e s c rig. tion at this time.
5 MR. JOHNSON: As I said, I did not 6 make the copies. They were forwarded in 7 this way, but these were all id e ntifie d as 8 one matter in the incidents involved in the J
9 FOIA material.
to MR. GIBSON: Is this being produced 11 as part of the Freedom of Inf o rm s.tio n-12 R e qu s s t or as part of the Discovery in the
(. 13 case?
14 MR. JOHNSON: It is being produced 15 in the Discovery, in Response to Diacovery.
16 There is a letter to accompany it, anc 17 the lette r is to be received by mail today 18 ind ic a tin g to all the partt,s and the Board 19 that this is being done.
20 Perhaps the s i mple s t way for clari-21 fic a tion, I will let you examine th e letter.
22 MR. GIBSON: If it is going to be 23 served, that is fine. There is a qu e s ti on b 24 wh e the r you were furnishing Freedom of 25 Inf o r m ation documents that were cot part
. .u- .. .. c.... m onn m ... vie . c mn. om c..
22 1
of the Discovery.
2 MR. . JOHNSON: The documents are not 3
being served, so if you want to arrange for 4
having copies made of these do cum e nt s . I 5 think that is fi n e .
6 MR. GUILD: Are these co pie s for meP MR. JOHNSON: Those are for you, 7
8 and as the letter says, it is without 9 enclo sur e s.
10 MR. GUILD: If we could ask that a 11 copy of this letter be appended to the 12 De po sitio n, that would be fine.
(- 13 We will identify it as the First 14 Exhibit to the D e po s itio n.
15 (Whereupog the document referred 16 to as le tte r from NRC to M r. Guild 17 dated May 19, 1983, was marked and 18 received by the Court R epo rter as 19 V anDoorn D e po sition Exhibit Number M One and entered into the R ecord. )
21 22 MR. GUILD: I guess finally if Counse l 23 could help me by identifying the materials h 24 as you said e a r li e r are expected to be
'J d e liv e r e d later today but are in t r a n s it--
Et gLyn etmGE R ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPG fuRPORTING SepMCE. CHAAU3775. NOMTM CANOWNA
e .
VANDOORN - DIR E CT 23 1 MR. JOHNSON: Those documents are, 2 I b elie ve at least some of them, are NRC 3 Source in Terminal M emo r anda, the type of 4 do cume nt, if not all of them; and they have 5 material th a t h a.s been deleted to protect 6 th e identity of confidential inf or m a n t s .
7 A nd to my knowled ge it is 18 pages.
8 Let me just ide ntif y another document which 9 I brought along which did not come from to eithe r of the In sp e c to r s but f rom my 11 inquiries in Wa shin gt on.
12 I was informed that there was a
( 13 do cume nt titled, " Safety Sug ge s tion s R e c eiv od 14 Du ring In s p e c tio n , " which was enforced.
15 It was issued 2/29/80. It ' s got a 16 nu mb e r T I1210 /1. To my knowledge I have 17 been informed that it is no loeger in 18 ef g e e g, 19 MR. GUILD: Counsel, is this ANSI 20 do cume nt policy document?
21 A I b elie ve it comes from I and E. I b e li e v e; 22 and it is an I and E document or was at some point 23 a current d o cu m e n t.
24 MR. JOHNSON: It was a f orme r docu.
25 m e nt, so that completes what we b r ou gh t. l l
l swatm osnoen assocuns. snuones menosmua semnes. caamana. aom camou==
- a VANDOORN - DIR E CT 24 1 BY M R. GUILD:
2 Q I will ask th e Witne s s, M r. VanDoorn, did 3 you take part in identifying any of the do cume nt s 4 th a t have been produced this mor ning ?
5 A I did not decide wh a t was to be forwarded 6 to you. That was for Counsel and R e gion al 7 personnel to m s. k e that decision.
8 Some of those do cum ent s, of course, were 9 forwarded to the R e gional O f fic e by me.
10 Q A ll right, sir; and you forwarded them 11 from your file s ?
12 A Yes.
( If that is not a c om ple t e de s c ription, I 13 Q .
14 don't want to leave the Record flawed. If there is 15 another source--when I say "your fil e s " in terms 16 that they were under your control in some fashion--
17 A They were received by me, and at one polnf i
18 were located in my office at C atawb a.
19 M R. JOHNSON: A re you speaking to 20 all the documents, p a r tic ula r docum ents ?
21 THE WITNESS: The ones I was U responsible for sending to the R e gio n; I l
8 have not looked at the packet so I can't 24 say that I am responsible for fo rwa rdin g
(
25 all of thos e.
I avstra esnoen associans snwovTre nerosmuo senv cs. canamovia. nom c.mmouwa
- +
VANDOORN - DIR E CT 25 1 MR. GUILD: C oun s el, can I ask 2 whether Mr. B r y a nt, who is not present in 3 this Deposition, would be responsible fo r 4 some p o r tion s of the identification of these 5 documents ?
6 MR. JOHNSON: What the source is of 7 the independent do cum ent s , you will have to 8 ask him.
9 to BY MR. GUILD:
11 Q Mr. VanDoorn, do you pe rf orm your work ,
12 under guidance contained in written p olic i e s or
( 13 procedures?
14 A S u r e ly.
15 Q Can you id e ntif y thos e written p olic ie s and is procedures?
17 A I certainly c an ' t id e n tif y all of them; there i
18 We have an I and E m a nu al, training are many.
19 manuals, in te r nal memoranda, verbal guidance as 20 ,,gg, 21 There are a great many sources of guidance U
that we receive.
23 sir; I will show you a document Q All right, b 24 that is an excerpt from what I see is noted as an l
25 In s p e c ti on and Enforcement M a nu al (indic a tin g ) .
EVELTM DEmGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTTPS REPOWTwee SS RW8CE, CMARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA I . _ _ , , . . _ , _ _ . . _ _. . . _ _ _ _,. . _ . , - _ _ . . . - . . - . . . _ . . . _ _ _ _ . . . _ . . _ _ .
o ,
VANDOORN - DIRECT 26 1 Can you id e ntif y that as an excerpt f r om 2 the manual you had reference to?
3 A That is one document that p r o vi de d guidanco ;
4 yes, sir.
5 Q For clarity, that is the Table of C ont e nt s ;
6 is that what that appears to be (indic atin g) ?
7 A It appears to me to be, yes, sir.
8 Q Is it a fair d e s c ription that is a primary 9 source of written guidance for pe rf ormanc e of your 10 work?
11 A Yes, I think that is probably an appropriate
. 12 d e s c riptio n.
( 13 Q Is there a more s i g nifi c a nt source?
14 A More s i g nific an t, probably not.
15 Q Now, the internal memos just g e n e ric ally 16 that you made reference to as a source of guidance, 17 would that include the previously identified R e gion II 18 p oli c y entitled, " A lle g a tion s, Complaints and 19 In ve s tig ation s " ?
20 A Yes, that is a R e gional O f fic e in s truc tio n, 21 one of many; and th e y also p r o vi d e guidance.
22 Q And finally you me nti on ed a verbal 23 guidance. Where would the sources of the verbal 24 guid an c e be?
25 A Supervision, other persons at NRC primarily
.m. ...... .....- - - -..c- - -
1 - . - -
- i VANDOORN - DI R E C T 27 1 within R e gio n II.
t 2 Q Including the persons id e n tifi e d in the chain 3 of command that we have dis cu s s ed ?
4 A Surely.
5 Q Now let me s ho w you a document that was 6 made available to me e a rli e r by Counsel. I brought 7 just two copies of this because this has been identi-8 fled to me by your C ouns el as a speech by the 9 R e gional A dminis trator, Mr. O ' R 4 e11y (i r.di c a t in g) ,
10 titled, " A to mic In du s t rial Forum Info '83 Confe renc e,.
11 NRC'S Response to W hi s tle Blo we r s; James P.
12 0 Rielly, R e gi o nal A d mini s t r a to r, U.S. Nuclear
( 13 R e gulat o r y C o mmi s sion. "
14 Are you aware of this d ocum ent ?
15 A I am aware as of this mo rnin g of the 16 d oc um en t. Mr. Johnson informed me that he had 17 given it to you.
18 Q A ll right, sir; I will ask you to take a 19 minute, if you would like to read the whole thing, 20 fine; but I want to direct your attention to a portion 21 of this speech which is on the su bj e c t the title U indicates, beginning at the top of Page 3, and this 23 is a 5 page and portions of a 6 page d oc u m e n t.
~
24 B e ginnin g at Page 3 it begins with what 25 gill represent to be an example of how to h a n cil e a
.mm .. .. ...oc n .n om. a.- -.. c=- ao-m caa==
o a VANDOORN - DIR EC T 28 1 whistle blower complaint or alle g a tio n s of wo rkm a n-t 2 ship p r o ble m s p o te ntially e f f e c tin g safety on a plant 3 under c o n s t ru c ti on.
4 If you will take a few mo me nt s and read 5 this to you r s e lf, I will ask you some qu e s tion s about 6 it, 7 A ALL of Page 3?
t 8 Q Just read the discussion of the example, 9 It begins on Page 3 and I think extends through the 10 b ala n c e of the top.
11 MR. GIBSON: C ouns el, may I read it i 12 at the same time or perhaps get a copy
(' 13 made while he is doing that?
14 MR. GUILD: Counsel, while the 15 Witne s s is reading the do cume nt I b elie v e 16 we can agree that this was produced in 17 response to a request by me for some 18 guidance from the R e gional Of fi c e on 19 this document; and the R e gion al A dminis tr ator
- provided this as r efle c t ive of the R e gional 21 p o li c y on the s ubj e ct.
22 MR. JOHNSON: That is a fair state-23 ment. A nd you were under the impr e s sion 24 this reflected a speech M r. O ' R i e lly 25 presented to this Body s o m e tim e in A p ril ?
.mv .. .. ocar... .v. ovm a.mm ca. c .um . o- ca.ou.=
, , - - . _ _ - . - . . , . -- .. - _ _ . _ , , , , , , , . , . . , _ , . _ , . ~ , _ _ . , _ - , - . . - . . . - , _ . _ . , . - . , , _ . , - _ - _ . . _ _ . _ , . . -
l - ..
- a 24 1 MR. GUILD: A p ril 18, yes. Ron, is 2 Mr. Davidson id e ntifie d as one, of th e peopl e 3 in response to our Supplemental 4 Int e r ro g a to rie s 23 and 257 5 We can discuss this off the Record.
6 MR. GIBSON: I would prefer that we 7 stay on.
8 MR. GUILD: That is fine with me.
9 Is he identified as one of the people ?
10 Let me repeat 1 on the Record.
11 I understand there is a Larry Da vid s on 12 in the room, and I missed his title, some-C 13 thing Quality Assurance.
14 MR. GIBSON: He is Project QA 15 Manager for Catawba.
16 MR. GUILD: E a rlie r last week when 17 we were taking D e p o s ition s of o the r compan r 18 Witn e s s e s by letter C ouns el for the 19 A p plic a nt committed to making available 20 , persons at my request identified in respons e il 21 to two Interrogatories on C ontention Six.
22 Those persons were id e n tifie d by class 23 rather than by specific na m e ; and my b 24 qu e s tio n, C oun s el, is is M r. D a vid s on 25 am on g s t that class of persons?
. ua .. .. assocures. svumorm no-a se=vics ce==orra. ao= caaouaa
-- - , -- , , , , - . , - - - - - , - . . , - , - , - . - --- -, n ---n , , . , - . -
.-~ .
30 1 MR. GIBSON: I don't r em embe r the i
2 s p ecific document. It is possible that he 3 is because he was there at the site for the 4 last several years.
5 MR. GUILD: I am referring to a 6 May 5 le tte r.
7 MR. GIBSON: Let me see it.
8 MR. G U ILD : The id e n tific a tio n is 9 c o ntaine d, o n the fi r s t page, and on the 10 Schedule of Witne s s e s on Page 2, and the 11 point of th e que s tio n, I guess, Ron, is if 12 Mr. Davids on would be other than that class
( 13 of persons, then I would desire to que stion 14 him under oath on the subject of C o nte n tio n 15 Six; and since he would likely be a Witne s s 16 on this que stion. I would ask th a t he be 17 excused from the balance of this De po sitio n ,
18 MR. GIBSON: Mr. D a vid s o n is a QA r
19 official whose name does appear in some of 20 the d o cum e nt s.
21 He is not p r e s ently off e r ed as a perso n M to be deposed as one of the knowledgeable 23 officials on C o nte ntio n Six.
24 However, he is one of the perhaps 25 90 or so people in the entire QA D e p a r t rn e n t
. .ov. .. . . .ocar. .. m =om. .o.maa .. = vie s. c =em. - camaa
31 1 that ~ you may choose to depose.
i 2 We have asked him as opposed to Mr.
3 G rie r and some others to be the company 4 representative h ere today because he is 5 probably less likely than many of th e other 6 people to eit h e r, one, be deposed by you 7 or to be a Witne s s.
8 I' m not s af i ng he will not be a 9 Witne s s in the case; I' m saying of all he 10 people involved because the grouping 11 involves p r a c tic ally every official in QA, 12 he is perhaps a less li k e l y- -
13 I cannot say one, he will not be a 14 Witne s s or you will choose not to depose 15 him.
16 We will not know who you s p ecifically 17 want to depose on QA.
18 MR. GUILD: I would ask that you 19 would excuse Mr. D a vid s o n.
l 20 MR. GIBSON: No, the company has 21 chosen him to be the r e pr e s enta tive absent 22 a de signation by you.
23 McGarry MR. GUILD: I inf orm ed Mr.
24 early last week that I intended M r .. David s o n l
' 25 as one of the s p e cific~ named p e o ple that I
.. 6, .. .. .ocar... m ow. a - ave.. c==um.. e.o= c.aou=
6 o
J 32 I
desired to qu e s tion in Discovery on this 2
C o nt e n tio n.
3 And f ollo win g our practic e of last week 4
and the p ra ctic e by which you have asked 5
for many Witne s s e r on this Contention of 6
Messrs. Hoopengardner and M c A f e e, I 7
would ask that a potential Witne s s or 8
, Witn e s s e s not be present during the t e s ti-9 many of other Witnes s e s on the su bj ec t 10 matter.
11 MR. GIBSON: Given the nature' of th e 12 QA C ont e ntio n, an d s in c e your potential
( 13 D e p o s ition li s t in clud e s almo s t every QA 14 employee that is here, balancin g between 15 the company's right to have a knowledge-16 able official present and your interest in 17 s e que s t r ation of Witne s s e s and your s p e cific 18 d e s i gna tion today which I was not aware of 19 until today that you somehow want to depose 20 Mr. D a vids on, I don't b eli e ve overrides 21 that interest, p a r ticula rly s in c e he would 22 be able to r e vi e w this D e po sition before 23 bis D e po sition would be taken.
24 In view of your ha vin g to ask the D
Board for an extension of Discovery, it is
.mm .. .a ..ocuns. .n om mm aves. -- am- ca-
> n 33 1 our position he is the company representa- .
2 tive at this step of the D e p o s ition, and he 3 will remain present.
4 MR. GUILD: W e ll, sir, I hate to be 5 troublesome about this; but if we are to 6 accede to any of the c o mp a n y's requests 7 for s eque s tr ation of our Witne s s e s, who a r e-8 only two in numb e r; it would seem to be 9 minimal par at this time to ask the compan y 10 to do likewi s e.
11 Now we can adjourn the De po sition and 12 discuss the matte r further or seek guidance
( 13 from the Board.
14 But it is our nickel.
15 MR. GIBSON: Would you clarify what 16 you me an by "Witne s s. " As a Witne s s at 17 this he a r in g we do not at this time 18 anticipate he will be, but we cannot say he l
19 will not be a Witne s s at the hearing.
8 It depends on the nature of the 21 C o n t e n tio n. Once it is narrowed, our 22 Motion for Su pplem enta ry Dis p o s itio n, 23 should it be fil e d , is ruled upon.
24 We are saying he is less likely to be 25 a Witn e s s of all the responsible officials .
EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE HEN SEW. W6 N MGM
-__ _= _ _ . _ . - _ . _ _ _ . .. _ _ _ . - _ . _ . _ . _ _ .-__ _. _,_, __ - _-_ _
34 in QA. That is why we chose him as a 1
i 2 r e pr e s entativ e today.
3 Given the broad grouping and given 4 your request th at e s s entially everyone be 5 made available, though you have n't used than 6
ter minolo gy, we would not have an official 7 here.
8 It is th e company's p o sitio n he would 9
be th e official and is going to be here for 19 this D e p o sition.
11 M R. GUILD: The Depo sitio n is being 12 taken at our request, the request of 13 Palmetto A llia n c e .
14 We appreciate the courtesy of th e 15 company making available its f a cilitie s.
16 Since we will be making available our 17 Witne s s e s later today at the same locale, 18 but to the extent the D e po s ition is at our 19 request and on the subject of Witne s s e s 20 which I a m. t ellin g you Mr. D avid s on will
?! be a Witne s s ,
I' m a s kin g that he be excuse <i.
GIBSON: And I'm t ellin g you we 22 MR.
23 are entitled to have knowled ge ab le ma na g e -
and Mr. D a vid s on 24 ment r e p r e s e n t a t.iv e s here,
{ 25 is that r e p r e s e nt ative and he is going to b e .
W8A EVELYN SENGER ASSOCLATES. BTEs*OTYPE REPORTH86 SenytCE. CHARLOTTL NQfrTH CARO
35 1 present.
2 MR. GUILD: Let's adjourn the 3 D e po sition at this p o in t .
4 MR. GIBSON: T h at o p tio n re mains 5 available to you.
6 MR. GUILD: That o p t. i o n is exercised, 7 We will seek some guidance f ro m the 8 Board on the s ubj e c t, Mr. Gibson.
9 If the D e p o s ition could r efle c t the 10 time of adj ou rn me nt.
11 (Whereupon, t h 's time was 12 indicated as 11:15 a.m.)
13 14 MR. GIBSON: As I say, the ball is 15 in your court in terms of what we are going 16 to do for the rest of this period of 17 adjournment.
l 18 I ask the Court Reporter to ta ke this 19 down. At this point we have reiterated 20 our position Mr. D a vid s on would remain I
21 present.
22 J u d g e K e l:l e y is not available for some l
23 reason or another, and you have left a 24 message fo r the s ta tu s of the situation.
25 MR. GUILD: If you will excusa Mr. -
l . m ,- .. .. co m . m - ~.c..c m - r c..ou .
- ~., , -. -
36 1 D a vid s o n so we can go forward with the 2 D e p o s ition now adjourned - !
l 3 MR. GIBSON: I will not do that, and i 4 I'm a s kin g you what do you intend to do at 5 this point?
6 MR. GUILD: I will a s k you to ' maint ai n 7 the present state of adjournment.
8 M R. GIBSON: We have an adjournment 9 u n til we can reach the Judge or untti M r.
10 . Guild takes a dif f e r e nt opinion. -
11 MR. GUILD: Mr. Gibson, do you have 12 any other people besides Mr. D avid s o n to
('
13 p r o vid e whatever assistance you need?
14 MR. GIBSON: Given the broad range 15 of who you wanted present, we selected a
>:n 16 ',. less likely m ana g e m e nt figu r e who in our 17 judgment is knowledgeable on the s ubj e c t to 18 be a manager r ep r e s e ntative here today.
19 You have indicated and discussed wit h 20 Mr. McGarry and M r. Carr that you wante d 21 to depose George G rie r.
2 Because of your in di c a tio n that you 23 wa nt ed to depose him and because we 24 anticipate fairly certainly that Mr. Grier 25 will be a Witne s s at the he arin g, we did .
SWELY9e SE AGER ASSOCMTES. STEREOTYPE REMNm886 SG NW3CE. CHA6. PeONTH CAROuseA
- O 37 1
not have him here to accede to your reques that anybody who is involved not appear.
1 2
3 Then the company would not have a As I indicated e arlie r ,
4 re p r e s entative here.
5 Mr. David s on is a knowledgeable official.
6 He is,of the other people,less likely 7
to be a Witne s s ; and we didn't know until 8
this morning th at you s pe cific ally want to 9 depose him.
10 There has been no Notice of D e p o s ition D a vid s o n. As a matt e r 11 i with r e s p e c t to Mr.
12 of fact, there has been no N o tic e of
( 13 D e po sition filed with re gard to any of th e 14 C o nt e ntio n Six people.
15 As I understand from the recert
- y 16 co nf e r enc e c a ll s f r om Jud ge K ell e y, Discove 17 closes tomorrow and we have not been n o tif ie d that you w a nt e d to depose M r.
18 19 D a vid s on, i
l GUILD: The me eting of F riday 20 MR.
I
! 21 set the schedule for these D e po sitio n s .
22 inf ormed Mr.
McGarry that I wanted to U depose Mr. D avid s o n.
s a ll 24 Our schedule prior to that 25 persons identified in response to two .
T CAmouMA EVELYN SEfDGEft ASSOCIATES. STEseOTYPE pepo 8rftf*G sepysCE. CMAsmATTE. Moer M
b o l
38 1 Interrogatories, which Mr. David s on is 2 one, and I told you today s p e cifi c a lly 3 further bases for my belief it is 4 inappropriate for M r. D avid s on to be present.
5 MR. GIBSON: Do you have a copy of 6 your letter where you indicated M r.
7 D a vid s on is the s p e cifi c person you wanted 8 to depose?
9 MR. GUILD: No, sir, but C orns el 10 for NRC was present at and--
11 MR. GIBSON: Maybe I can fin d the 12 letter in the file; what was the date ?
(' 13 MR. G UILD: May 5 letter f rom Mr.
14 McGarry to me.
15 MR. GIBSON: Is that the letter that 16 designates M r. Da vid so n ?
17 MR. GUILD: Is designated by close--
18 I inf or med M r. M cGarry in the presence of 19 Counsel for the s ta ff and perhaps Ms.
l 20 l
Cottingham as we ll in Wa s hin g ton on that l 21 l
same day that I wished to depose, amongst l
M that clas s of people, M r. Lee and M r.
M D avid s on.
k 24 MR. GIBSON: It was Mr. Lee, Mr.
25 Owen, and M r. Grier; those are the persona
...uu ...c.. o.ocan s. r norm -=. ...v c . c===orr . no m. camou=.
.n- - - , . - - _ . . - - - - - - , . . - - - - - - - . - .
o .
39 1
i I' m aware of that you have s p e c ific a lly 2 dis cu s s ed with people.
3 As I say, the qu e s tion before us now 4 is do we adjourn, do we proceed, or what 5 do we do?
6 MR. GUILD: You have my position.
7 M R. GIBSON: A nd you have mine, so 8 I a s s um e we are in adjournment; is that 9 correct, Mr. Johnson?
10 MR. JOHNSON: I would li k e to correc t, 11 for the Record, a l t h o u g h:-3 was at that 12 m e e tin g I do not r e c olle c t who was me ntion ed
( 13 as a potential De po ne nt.
14 MS. COTTINGHAM: Nor do I, sir.
15 MR. GUILD: We have another Witn e s s 16 here, if you would li k e to s wea r.-
17 MR. JOHNSON: Whether you s aid .it 18 or not, I just do not know.
19 MR. GUILD: Perhaps we can do some 20 work in the me an tim e.
21 MR. GIBSON: You feel free to use 22 the C onf e r enc e R oom. We are off the U
Record and a dj ou rn e d.
24 (Whereupon, th e De po sition was 3
adjourned for a recess, af te r which
. or= u .. nocuru. m orre. .o- av.c caaamvr. ~o- ca ouaa 1
a e \
l 40 1
1 the following p r o c e e din g s were had:) ,
i '
2 !
i 3 MR. GIBSON: We are r e s umin g the 4 D e po s itio n. Mr. George G rie r, who is 5 Corporate Quality Assurance Man a g e r, is 6 here as the company's re p r e s entativ e 7 instead of Mr. D a vid s on.
8 Now we are r e s umin g the D e po sitio n; 9 is that correct, Mr. Guild and Mr.
10 Johnson?
11 MR. GUILD: Yes, if ve could have 12 the R ecord reflect the time that we have
( 13 resumed?
14 MR. LOWE: I have 1:38, 15 MR. GUILD: Counsel, we have agreed 16 that M r. G rie r is p r e s e nt at the comp a ny's 17 ple a s u r e, and that Pa lm etto A llia n c e has no 18 obj e c ti on to his presence in place of Mr.
19 D a vid s o n.
20 We do want the Record to r e fle c t we 21 are not w aivin g any potential obj e c tio n s we 22 may have to ha vi n g anyone with an interest 23 at the D e po sition, but in the interest of k 24 going forward we have this objection on the 25 l Record.
EVELYN SE RGER ASSOCIATES. STSpeO*TPE REPOffTtNG SE8'veCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROLANA l
41 VANDOORN - DIR E C T 1
t 2 BY MR. GUILD:
3 Q Mr. VanDoorn, when we left off I had askett 4 you to examine a do cume nt that has been identified h1 r .
5 as a speech by your R e gio nal A d minis t r a t o r, 6 cigg,y, 7 Have you had a chance to look at thati 8 A Yes, I certainly have. 9 Q Having dir e ct ed your attention to Page 3 to of that document, do you have a copy that is marked ? 11 MS. COTTINGHAM: Th is does not 12 appear to have any m a r king s on it. 13 14 BY M R. GUILD: 15 Q On P a ge 3 and c o ntinuin g through the final 16 page 6, M r. VanDoorn, is the R egional p.g, 17 A d mini s tr ato r 's example of how to process an a ll e . 18 g a ti on regarding s af ety and c on s tru ction or construc-tion a c tiv iti e s h a vin g a potential safety s ig nific a n c e l I8 20 at a plant-- 21 Have you r e viewe d that? 22 A I have read it, yes. 23 Q Is th at consistent with your understanding h 74 of the mannar in which you and others p e rf o r min g 25 your ins p e ctio n f u n c tio n s handle ma tt er s of that sor t? ,- l ... . . . . . _ . . _ , _ . . - . . _ _ _
VANDOORN - DIR ECT 42 1 A It is, I would say, c on sis t ent. He states 2 as I read this, that every case is c e r tainly in here, 3 dif f erant; and of course, this is simply an example. 4 Each case is diff er ent, and it is ge rmaine 5 based on each case, the seriousness and so forth is 6 obviously a p plie d to all cases. 7 Q Is this d e s crip tio n of this e xa mpl e by M r. 8 O ' R i e lly c on si s t ent with your understanding of curren t 9 R e gio n 11 p o lic y with respect to those matter s ? 10 A 7,,, II Q Are there any elements in the example as 12 described by Mr. O ' R i elly that reflect significant I d e via tio n s from either Region II policy as you under. I4 s tan d it or your experience as an Inspector, how 15 matters of this sort are, in fact, ha ndle d ? 16 A I would say there are no significant I deviations. 18 Q Now directing your a t t e n ti o n to the do cum en t I' that you identified e arlie r, and that is the R e g ional 20 O f fi c e In s tru c ti on 10 3 entitled, " Alle gatio ns , 21 C omplaint s and In ve s ti gatio n s , " does this als o 22 r efl e c t R e g io n 11 p o lic y with respect to handling the 23 complaints of this character? ' b 24 A I would say g e n e r ally, yes. However, this 25 navtt ent a v i n s tru c ti o n la n a m e wh at dated. It dama evatra esnosa asocurus. svuaorreu mepowrw.o sums. cmmorra. womw camou m . . - . - . . . ,. _.. n ,. , _ - . _ _ , , , , . , , , , , _ , . . . . . , _ _ _ , . - _ _ . , _ _ . , , . _ _ _ . . . , - _ _ _ . _ . . . - - . _ _ . , _ - -
, a VANDOORN - DIR E C T 43 1 reference a Security and Inve s tig ation S e c tio n of th e 2 Safegtard Branch, which no longer exists.
3 However, the general descriptions concernir.g 4 how a lle g ati on s are handled, a ll of that inf orma tion 5 is c ommunic at ed to all the involved individuals, l 6 including inv e sti gation s personnel. 7 It would be appropriate. 8 Q All right, sir; this is dated, the R e gional 9 O f fic e Ins truc tio n is dated March 6, 1978. Should I 10 understand it was current as of that date, but may 11 not be as of present? 12 A It may not be absolutely current as of this ( 13 date; th a t 's correct. However, it has not been 14 r e s cind e d. 15 Q This is the mo s t recent revision of that 16 policyl is that right? 17 A I understand that it is. 18 Q. By the terms of thi s, po li c y memorandum, 19 do you understand that this of fic e, that is the Of fic e M of Security and Inve s tiga tion Safeguards Branch, was 21 to have been assigned primary re s pon s ibility for, as 22 the te rm s are used, c o n t r o lli n g and investigating 23 alle gation s ? 24 A I would apply that as saying that is now the 25 Office of Inve stigations. i eveLTw esmoe R ASSOC 4ATES. STENOTYPE me POffTlNG SeRVsCE. CHARLOTTE. PeO8tTH CANOuMA
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o a VANDOORN - DIR E C T 44 1 Q Now is there an O f fi c e of Investigations 2 staff at the R e gion II O f fic e Yn A$1 a n t a ? 3 A Yes, there is. 4 Q Who is responsible f.o r the Of fice of 5 In v e s ti g a tio n s down there? 6 A I b e li e v e it is pr e s ently h' r . Vorse, 7 V-o-r-s-e. 8 Q Do you know wha t M r. V o r s e 's title is ? 9 A l' m not exactly sure. 10 Q Would reference to a d o cu m e n t-- 11 A C hie f In ve s tig a t or, we have it in one of the 12 memos. Le t's look it u p. ( 13 O It is not a c ritic al q u e s t i o n '. L e t's see if 14 we can come to his name. You have a memorandum 15 addressed to him which would have his title on it ? 16 A Director, O f fic e of In ve s tig ation s, J. Y. 17 Vorse. It is a February 1, 1983, memo in your 18 possession which has a copy to J. Y. Vorse. 19 Q Is he the R e gional Director of that o f fi c e ? 20 A Yes. 21 Q Give me a general d e s c ription, if you can, 22 M r. VanDoorn, of the s t affin g that reports to him. 23 Who does he have working for hi m"a t the R egion ? ( 24 A I don't have a really strong knowled g e of 25 the total nu mb e r s of p e o ple that are wo rkin g for t h e rn
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o 3 VANDOORN - DIR E C T ' 45 I at the present time. I have been out of the R e gion a l 4 2 O f fi c e , o b vi ou s ly, for two and a half years. 3 On this matte r we have d e a lt pretty much 4 with him dir e c tly. 5 Q He has a number of In ve s tigato r s wo r kin g 6 with him in that o f fi c e . 7 A I'm not e x a c tly sure of the numbe r. 8 Q But it is your unde rs tandin g that the O f fi c e 9 of Inv e s tigation s at the R e gional level under M r.
. l 10 Vorse has displayed the role now of a former 11 s e c tio n, S e curity and In ve s tig a tio n s S e c tion, 12 S af e guar d Branch?
'13 A The in ve s tig ative a c tivitie s of that branch, 14 yes.
i 15 Q A nd now this O f fic e of In v e s ti g a tio n s would 16 have p rim a r y r e s p o n s ibility as described in the i 17 M a r ch 6, 1978, R e gion al O f fi c e I n's t r u c ti o n s ? l 18 A C o n c e r nin g inv e s tig atio n s, that's correct. 19 Q Now, would the O f fic e of Inve s tigation s at N the R e gional level be re s po nsible for a ll alle g a tio n s l 21 and complaints that are of potential safety 22 significan ce ? l 23 A I guess I would have to have you d e fi n e 24 " r e s pon s ibility. " R e s po n s ible, c e r t a l ril y we are 25 o bli g a t e d to m ake sure they are inf o r m ed of . l
. ....... -.. m-- -..~,.- -
o 1 VANDOORN - DIR E C T 46 1 alle g ation s . 2 They meet, get actively involved in their 3 pur s uit, as I have s a l .>. previously. Each group of 4 alle g a ti o n s is g e n e r all y a unique case. 5 Q Let me ask you to again refer back to Mr. 6, oeD.ietly's epeech, his example. Are you f amilia r I 7'. with the O f fic e of Inspecter and Auditor of the d Commis sion ? 9 A .? I am aware of th e m, yes. ~ 10 Q Would you give me a d e s c rip tion of your 11 understanding of who they are and wh at they do? 12 A W e ll, I understand them to be more or less l ( 13 our inte rn s t Inv e s tig r to r s. If there are ac cu s a tions 14 of impropriaty against one of our Inspectors. they 15 would be responsible for p erf o rmin g that in ' e s tig atio:2, 16 and they have some audit functions as well as I 17 b eli e v e Program Audit may be one of the things that 18 f :.11 under that branch as well. 19 Q All right, and with reference to M r. 20 g ,(,gg y.s speech, take a.Look again at the last 2I paragraph on Page 3, and f o llo win g , and I ask you if that r e fle c t s your understanding of the role of the 23 O f fi c e of In s pec to r and A u dit with respect to those 24 matte rs ? 25 A Yes, if an alle ga tion of wro n ga ni n g taunt--A
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> 1 VANDOORN - DIR E C T 47 1 an NRC staff re pr e s entativ e, as it states, then the i
2 OIA O f fi c e, Office of Inspector and A udit o r -- 3 O That is the ac r on ym, and Office of 4 Inspector and In ve s tiga tion is OI? 5 A I guess, yes. 6 Q Is there a Dir e c t o r of the O f fic e of 7 In s p e c tio n and Auditing, R e gion II ,7 A' 8 I don't b elie v e so. 9 Q And on the bottom of Page 4 of the 10 O ' R ie lly speech, there is a d e s c riptio n of Mr. 11 O ' R ie lly 's views on the qu e s tion of m ain t ainin g 12 source c on fid e n c e with respect to these a ll e g ation s . ( 13 And I ask you to look at that briefly and 14 tell me if that is consistent with your un d e r s tandin g 15 of your current R e gion II po li c y and secondly, of
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16 actual p ra ctic e as you are f amiliar with it? 17 A I would agree with it. j 18 Q Is that consistent with current R e gion II l 19 p oli c y as you unde rs ta nd it? M A As I understand it, yes. 21 Is it consistent with actual practice with Q 22 respect to those matters as you understand it ? 23 As I understand it, yes, A j b- 24 Q A ll right, sir; now let's, if we can, if we 25 can shif t slightly remaining on the same general i gygLyse SE AGER ASSOCBATES. BTWeeOTYM memeNo Sam. Cmm. N ONNA _ . . _ _ _ . . . . _ . . _ . . .._ .._ _- _ _ _ _ _ . . _ _ , , , _ . _ _ . . , ,_..-m . - - _ - _ . - . __. _ _ . . - - ,
o 1 1 1 VANDOORN - DIR E C T I 43 i 1 subject; but to your personal experience and ; 2 knowled ge. de s c rib e, if you would, with respect. to 3 th e sample that M r. O 'R ie lly uses here as an 4 exa mple, what you would do as a R e s id en t Inspector 5 if you were the fi r s t NRC contact for receipt of 6 such inf o r ma tion, le t's say f r o m -w present worker 7 at the Catawba Center? 8 A I cannot describe e xa ctly what I would do 9 in his speech example because there is not enough 10 inf o rm a tio n there to say r e a lly what I would do. 11 G e n e r a lly if I wculd receive an a ll e g a tio n, 12 k, the fi r s t thing is to try to get it exactly clear what 13 the g e ntle ma n is t ellin g me and document it somehow ; 14 and then immediately, which would g e ne r a lly be 15 v e r b a lly, contact my s u p e r vi sion. 16 Q I' m sorry, let me stop you right there-- 17 get it clear f rom the source verbally; is that what 18 you meant by " verbal?" 19 A Allegations almo s t always are verbal. 20 Q So when you say "get it clear ve r ba lly-- " 21 A Try to get as much information as I can 22 f r om the alle g e r fi r s t. It may not be possible, he 23 may prefer to m ee t s o mewhe r e, but whatever I can v 24 a get at the moment, as much information; and I would a 25 forward th at information to the R e gion by telephone,
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l VANDOORN - DIR E C T 49 1 Q Who would you c a ll at the R e gio nal Of fic e ? 2 A U s u ally it would be my s u pe r vi s io n, my 3 immediate supervision f i r s. t . They may choose to 4 immediately get an In ve s ti ga tor on a conference lin e ; 5 or d e pe ndin g on the issue, they would fairly quickly. 6 one way or th e oth er, be dis s eminated as w e ll to 7 s uppo rt staff and in ve s ti ga tion people. Whethe r they 8 d id that dir e c tly or my s u pe rvisi on did would vary, 9 d e p e n d e nt on that particular case. 10 Q When you say " u s u a l l'y " , what would be the 11 instances where you would not contact your im m e di-12 ate supervision fir s t ? Give me an example. ( 13 A When he is on va c a tio n. 14 Q A ll right, he is not a v ail ab l e. 15 A Not available, I would contact m a yb e an 16 A ctin g Supervisor, or in that case, or my super-17 visor's su pe rvis or, whoeve. in that chain of comman d 18 is available. 19 Q Would there be any instances where you N would no' contact either your supervisor or h is 21 sub s titute ? 22 A There would be instances in which I may 23 not have an oppo rtunity to imm ediately talk to my 24 immediate s u p e r vi s o r or his s ub s titu te. 25 As I said p re viou sly, I may have to talk i EVELY9e SERGER ASSOctATES. STEpeOTYPE REPORTNWB SE NYCE. NN. N N
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> 1 VANDOORN - DIR E CT sc 1 to some other person in m ana g e ment.
2 Q 1 am trying to understand the e xc e ptio n s as 3 a m atte r .o f course, if you w ou ld c all your boss and your 4 bose is not th e r e. or a v a ila bl e , you would call your 5 bos s' boss or your acting .bo s s . 6 Are there instances when you would go to 7 someone o th e r than someone la the chain of command 8 dir e c tly above you? 9 A If it were urgent enough, we would go to 10 whoever we had to. C o n s tru ction is pr ob ably 11 dif f e rent than o p e r atin g s it e, ,but if there were an 12 imm e dia t e concern f or . s a f ety. .i f it was Sunday at ( 13 midnight we would go to W a s hin g ton if we had to, if 14 it had a n -im m ed ia t e safety concern. 15 The no rmal mode would be to go up th e 16 chain of command, but you can alw ay s invent 17 s c e na rio s where that may be viable, clear to the 18 C ommis sio n if we had to. 19 We may be c allin g a Commi s sio n e r if we 20 had to. 21 Q Are you drawing the distinction between an 22 ob viou s urgency and a f a cility under co n s tru c tio n ? 23 A The immediancy is probably the diff ere nce; 24 an o p e r a tin g site, you are imme dia t e ly concerned 25 with possible rele as e s ; whe r ea s C a ta wb a, no fuel yet , i eveLyse semeest Assoc 4ATes. STapecTvre nePostTwee senveCE. Ce4AnLDTTW. poosrTM CAmouMA
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l g VANDOOBN - DIR E C T 51 I and certainly there are things that are very urgent i 2 at C a tawb a as w e ll, depending on the issue again. j 3 Q- W h a' t about the urgency, im plic a tion s of the I 4 circum s ta nc e s 'o f tho' a lle g e r; would that bear on who 5 you went to? 6 A I assume we are talking about the W eldin g 7 Inspector concern, for in s't a n c e ? 8 Q 1 w o uld turn to some s p e cific s, but let's 9 talk first about the example and th e n we can s hif t to to the s p e cific s, but let's say as a que s tion of 11 general p r a c tic e and policy, would the circ um s tance s 12 of the all e g e r bear on who you talked to, the ( 13 urgency you attached to th e a ctio n to be taken? 14 A Circum s tance s, what do you mean by 15 "cir cu m st anc e s of the alle g e r" ? C ould you explain 16 that? 17 Q L e t's use as an e x a m ple , let's say that an 18 a l '. e g e r fears--that a ll e g e r is a current w o r k er --a nd 19 the alle g e r fears physical reprisal fr)m his super-20 vision for having brought the m atte r to your attention . 21 How would that bear on your course of 22 a c tio n, if it would at all? 23 A 1 would say initially that would be treated b 24 with very high p rio rit y. I say " initially" because 25 there would be some almo s t im m edia t e -eviw hy _
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> f VANDOORN . DIR E C T 52 I m ys elf as to the le g itim a c y of the a ll e j; a t io n .
i 2 C e rt ainly to me it would be very urgent 3 to immediately try to figu r e out whether it was a 4 le gitim a te alle g a tion o r, you know, what is involved 5 b a s ic a ll y, and in our initial jud gm ent there was such 6 a thing possible, then you know, we would treat it. 7 M R. JOHNSON: Do you mean some kin.1 8 of per.onal danger to the person? 9 MR. GUILD: That s eemn a reasonable 10 e x am ple. 11 . hi R . JOHNSON: I'm not sure whe th er 12 you understood the circums tance s of the ( 13 all e g e r . 14 Are you saying he was facing a person al 15 danger apart from the plant danger, danger 16 in v olvin g a plant? 17 THE WITNESS: W e ll, I guess with l 18 that clarification our p r im a r y concern l 19 certainly has to be the safety of the l 20 plant; and I guess when you s ta rt talking 21 personal dangers, that may not be as urgen t. 22 However, to me it would be u r ge nt. i 23 If someone feels threatened, that is going 24 to possibly eff e ct his ability to do proper 25 c o n s t ru c tio n, so it is important. f systv es moun assocarse. s amorves aeroaTu'* *sav'ca. cwamuma. nowrw c.amouma l
e t VANDOORN - DIR E C T 53
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1 i 2 BY MR. GUILD: 3 Q I guess what I'm trying to drive at, tell 4 me if I am not being cle a r -- M r. Johnson, as w e ll-- 5 but if by the cir cum s t an c e s of the alle g e r and in this 6 s p e cific e xa mple let's say an a ll e g e r is fearful of 7 im m e dia t e r ep ris al f rom his s u p e rio r s for bringing 8 a matte r of safety concerning him to your a tt en ti o n, 9 my qu e s tion is I think you answered part of it, yes, 10 that would be of concern to you. 11 Yes, that would represent s o.m e urgency; 12 but the second part of th e q u e s t i o'n is how would that (, 13 a lt e r your processes? 14 What would you do if it were? 15 A I d on 't know as it would alter it; it would 16 still be, you know, a timely c all to R e gion and 17 inf o rmin g them of the circum s tanc e s; and certainly 18 the R e gio nal ma na g e m e nt would make the decision as 19 to e xa c tly how we would handle the issue. 20 Q All right, sir; hypo th e tic ally, what would , 21 be the s i g nific an c e if any of th e -- a g ain, at a site 22 under c o n s t ru c ti o n lik e C atawb a--o f a ll e g at io n s whic h 23 either on their face suggest potential enf orcement 24 action or critical c o n s tr u c tio n on the part of the 25 licensee, would effects of that alle g a ti o n-- wha t would i gwatyn sanoen AssocaATus, sTanoTYPE nePonTwNs senwics, cuanLcTTE. Nowm cAnouma
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- I VANDOORN - DIR E C T 34 1 be your fir s t initial judgment as to the urgency of i
2 the matter; and secondly, your processing of the 3 alle g a tio n ? 4 MR. JOHNSON: C ould you d i vi d e it 5 up for him ? There are two conditions 6 precedent that you ran together, c riminal 7 and safety was the other one. 8 9 BY MR. OUILD: 10 Q Let's take the fir s t part which r ela te s to 11 the potential enforcement action of any character 12 involving a lic en s e e ? ( 13 A There, of course, is a wid e variety of
~ 14 enforc em ent a c tio n s ; and I would have to go back to 15 s ay, as I did previously, every case where you are 16 talkin g about a ll e g a tio n s is unique in s om e ways, i
17 If you are talking about enf orc em e nt a ction s, 18 a r ela ti ve ly minor violation may re sult and no 19 immediate concern to the public, it may not be as l 20 urgent as one whic h would have immediate health and 21 safety consequences to the p u b li c-22 We a s sume a lle g a tion s are true, and we
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l 23 start looking into it, id e n t i f'y Th e motive a c tio n, as 24 I think is stated in the speech. 25 Q L e t 's take th e most serious alle g a ti o n s on i i i avetva en assocmas. svuworvre asposmaa seavecs. caaatorra. nonen camou-a l l
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. 3 2,. s VANDOORN - DIR ECT 44 4
1 their face that appear to be the basis for a serious 2 enforcement a c ti o n. -- 3
, . Let's say a S eve rity Level III or higher 4
violation, would that bear fir s t on your j u d g ns e n t as 5 to the urgency of r e's p o n s e and the type of response 6 that you have? _ 7 A I would say the higher you go in enforce-8 mant a c tio n, probably it would have some effect at 9 least on the urgency. 10 A g ain, the big thing here is the health and 11 safety of th e pu bli c, not whe th e r they get a II I or 12 a IV violation out of it. ( 13 They will get that one way or the other, Id e ve ntu a lly. We do a great many thin g s o th e r than 15 s irr. p l y issuing viola ti on s . 16 The fir s t thing is the health and safety of 17 the public. I8 M R. JOHNSON: If I may interject I8 here, I have just received by telecopy a 20 copy of a let te r dated today to Mrs. Billy 21 Guard from Frank W. Karas, K-n-r-a-s, E in R e s pons e--ref e r to FOI A -- 8 3 - 2 0 0. 23 It is signed by J. N. Fe lt e r , Division 24 of R ule s and R ecord s Office of Administrati on; and it has an annendir a t t a c h .d ta it at t=a i aveLyss samaan AssoCaATus. sTENOTYPE REPOfrmeG SEmVics. CHA8EETTE. DeO8rrH CAROueeA
t -_ . i VANDOORN - DIR E CT 56 4 1 pages and A p p e n d ix B of three pages, but i 2 one page is mis sing, I think. 3 I am turning it over to Mr. G u il d. I e think this is what you requested e a r li e r to 5 help you identify what docu m e nt s you have 6 in that file in front of you. . 7 M R. GUILD: Let's c o nti nu e. I may 8 need to take a. break in a minute and revie w
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9 that, but let's c o n t.[DR4 . f o r a moment. M r. 10 VanDoorn. 11 12 BY MR. GUILD: 13 Is it fair to say that unless the enforce-Q I4 ment ac tio n--le s s than the alle ga tion which suggests 15 th e basis for entorcement ac tio n--b e a r s dir e c tly on 16 health and safety of the public, it probably would 17 not pr ovid e an urgency basis for you to take a 18 s p e cific response? 19 A I don't think that is r e ally a fair s ta t emen t. 20 What I said was, and again I think I'm speaking for 21 m ys elf and the a ll e g a tion s I have been involved in. 22 and certainly as a R e gion II r e pr e s en ta tive--I c a n' t 23 speak for the other R e gion s or what e ve r--but asfar l h 24 as I'm concerned all alle g ation s are ur ge nt; but
! 25 certain cr ue nt s. there are degrees of urgency and.
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 57
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1 like I say, alm o s t invariably the same day or within i 2 the second day we would attempt at least to inf orm 3 the appropriate people if we have any a lle g a tion s . 4 C e rtainly there are some alle ga tion s that 5 are absolutely me a ningle s s , and you know there are 6 certainly degrees of urgency a p pli e d. . 7 If I am involved, for instance, pursuing 8 s om e thin g that is very s i g nific an t and I get a r. 9 a lle g a ti o n from a local person that one of their pets 10 is glowing in th e dark, then I will obviously pursue 11 the safety c on ce r n that I am p r e s ently involved in; 12 and I will talk to my boss tomorrow about the 13 neighbor down t' h o street. 14 Obviously, every case is diff e rent. 15 Q Mr. Gibson's dog-- 16 M R. GIBSON: I happen not to own a 17 dog. M r. G u il d . 18 THE WITNESS: There are certainly 19 degrees of alle g ation s and c e rtainly d e. g r e e s 8 of urgency. 21
" BY MR. GUILD:
U But you did say, and I d o n' t want to put Q 24 words in your m ou th, but to try to get a fair under-3 standing of your views on the subject. if it is a f avstra semasa assocuras. sienorvas aeroarme seavoca. cuantorra. woarn camouma
e i VANDOORN - DIR E CT 58 i que s tion of what level of vi o l a t 1 o'n is assigned,
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i that 2 will come out in the wash and it does not bear on 3 how you respond in terms of the urgency of how you 4 respond. 5 Is that f air ? 6 A It do e s n' t largely effect it. 7 Q Turn tc th e second prong of the compound 8 que s tio n that C oun s el wanted to bring up; an alle-9 gation on it s face appears to p ro vide the basis for 10 potential criminal charges, say a criminality on th e Il part of a lic e ns e e. 12 How would you view that in te rm s of ( 13 urgency; and secondly, what would th a t urgency, if I4 any, dictate in terms of your response? 15 I think that certainly is very A A g ai n, 16 s en sitive anytime you are talking about possible 17 criminal charges, and th at would be amongst the - 18 most urgent of concerns. 19 Q All right, and on the basis of that, M r. 20 VanDoorn, how would you deal with it in te rm s of 21 your response? 22 a s s ume that it then is very urgent L e t's 23 How would that alter for purposes of this example. , b 24 if it would, your response? ! 25 How would it alte r my resoonse? A 7 aveLyn sanoan AssoCaATES. STerOTYPE REPORTw.o samvCs. CMARLOTTE. NORTM CAmouMA e
VANDOOPN - DIR E CT 59 i 1 MR. JOHNSON: Y ou asked him i 2 already if it were serious, and he said it 3 would be treated a s ' v ery u r ge nt. 4 1 think he answe red your que s tion. 5 6 BY M R. GUILD: _ 7 Q And how would it eff ect your response, if 8 at all? 9 A As I said e a r li e r , if wa looked at it as a 10 very urgent, important thing, then we would treat 11 it as such and I would talk to my m ana gement. 12 Q All right, wo uld it alter s p e c ifi c ally the 13 procedure th at you w auld f ollow in terms of who 14 you would report to and when you w o uld report and 15 what specific steps you wo uld take as the recipient 16 of that inf orm atio n ? 17 A To talk about s p e cific alt e r atio n s as to how 18 a particular alle g ation may be treated is difficult I9 without having all the details of the s p e cific exampl e 20 that you wish to talk about. 21 Q Let's talk about an example that M r. 22 O ' R i e lly uses, and let me see if I can find the actus.1 23 language he uses on Page 3 of his speech. h 24 He r e cite s the example-- 25 JOHNSON: What ca r a traoh ? MR. F EvgLyse esmOEP ASSOctATES, STWeeOTTPE REPOATING SENylCE. CHA6. N CANOL.JNA
e a VANDOORN - DIR ECT 60 4 1 BY M R. G UILD: 1 2 Q Let's a s s um e that the initial in s p e c tion of 3 th e d ef e ctiv e weld s reveals that c e rt ain records may 4 have been f alsified. 5 Would you agree that, as he characterizes, 6 "in general, f alsific ation of records required by the 7 NRC, could c on s titut e a material false statement and 8 in certain cases, a criminal of fe ns e" ? 9 Would you agree with that cha racte riz ation ? 10 A Y e s. 11 Q L e t 's a s sum e that is the example that come s 12 to your attention by an a ll e g e r that is a potential ('. 13 c riminal off ens e; and then my qu e s tio n to you is in l 14 that s pe cific example what do you do? 15 A R e -inf o rm Regional man a g e m e nt of the 16 alle g a tion s in as much d e t ail as we possibly can. 17 Quite of ten we have to initially inf o rm th em and them 18 back and maybe spend hours trying to fi nd what. go 19 ever additional information we can find. 20 There may be several phone c alls involved. 21 In fact, there would be some initial contact that we M have, this type of thing. 23 With the R e gion II people ? Q 24 With the R e gion al personnel, ye s; that is l A 25 any way. the fi r s t step, t , EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPOsrTues Se RyeCE. CMARLDTTE. FeO8tTH CARouMA l l
i e VANDOORN - DIR E CT 61 4 1 Q A ll right, would it be your i nt e nt, M r. t 2 VanDoorn, i n this example where the matte r come s 3 to your attention, to make the contact with the 4 r ep r e s e ntative s of the O f fi c e of Inv e s ti ga tio n ? 5 A Would it be my r e s pon sibility to talk to the 6 O f fi c e of Inve s tigati on s dir e c tly ? 7 Q Yes. 8 A Not n e c e s s a r ily.
. 9 Q Would you explain that?
10 A A g ain, depending on the issue. C e r tainly, 11 since I would be the most knowled g e a bl e of the 12 p a r ti c ula r a lle g a ti on s . ( 13 There is a good po s sibility that I might be 14 on the phone with somebody f r om the Inve s tig atio n s 15 Division; but depending on the is su e, my supervisor 16 in a given case may say, "O ka y, we need to inf o rm 17 S e c tio n. Stay on the phone," and we may have a 18 conference c all as an example, 19 It depends on the issue. 20 Q Let's take the example we are w o rkin g with 21 that is th e one e s s e ntially d e s c rib e d by Mr. O ' R i e lly M in this speech. 23 As he uses the example, it involves p ot e nti al 24 falsification of do cu me nt s; and the r e a f t e r a potential i* 'I 25 criminal off ens e. r evetvm senoea assocuTus sTumoTves ampoemme same.caensmarra. nowm canotsma
--.---w-,-.- , , , . , .- , - - - - , , - - , - , - - , , , - , ,y_-,,, , . , , . - - . , , _ , , _ , , _ _ - , , , . , , . , , . , _ _ _ . -
__g. -, ,- - - - ,,,n ,-,m_, _ - . _ , . _ , . , - , , . , . , , , - _ , _ _ - , _ ,
, i VANDOORN - DIRE C T 62 4
1 W ould you agree with his c ha r a c te ri z a tion t
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2 under those circum s tanc e s it 'b ec ome s a matte r for 3 the O f fic e of In ve s tigation s ? 4 A It becomes a ma tt e r that the O f fi c e of 5 In ve s ti g ation s , if the r e is a po s sibility of falsifi. 6 c ation , be aware of it. 7 D e p e ndin g on the issue, they may request 8 us to do some p r e limina r y r e vie w, find out further 9 details and ma ke ' fur' he r j u d g m e'n t s . 10 When we are talking about f alsific ation 11 issues, certainly we are o blig a t e d to make sure ther e 12 1.s a. ,p o s s ibility of f alsific ation. ( 13 MR. GUILD: I ask the Record to 14 r e fle c t C ouns el and the Witn e s s are 15 c o nie r rin g. l l 16 Do you want to c on s ult with your 17 Attorney about that last que s tion ? 18 THE WITNESS: I thought I had 19 answered it. ! 20 21 BY MR. GUILD: 22 Q All right, you said it would be your 23 r e s po n s ibilit y to make sure there is a po s s ibility of b 24 f alsific ation. D- A My answer was that we have an obli g a tio n
.m. .. . . .oc..n . .n om. - ..-.. c-.um.. o= -a
- m. . _ __. , , - . . _ . . _ . _ . _ . .
> 4 63 VANDOORN . DIRECT 2 ,
are ! I te make sure that the inve s tig a tion personnel i 2 aware of the p o s sibility of f alsification, if that is the l 3 case. , Q Io s. I understand; and wh a t I'm. tryin g to 4 understand, 2va r . VanDoorn, is if. you received the 5 alle g ati on af 6 a lle g a tio n and you identified it s. s an 7 this character, the character described by Mr. 8 O ' R i e lly , here (in dic a tin g), how would you discharge 9 your r e s p on s ibility to see th at the matter came to 10 the attention of the O f fic e of Inv e s ti g a tio n ? 11 A I would f orward as much information as I had to the R e gional O f fic e, initially ve rb ally; and 12 ( ' 13 e v e ntu ally , if anything came to me in the way of 14 d o c um e n t a tio n , I would f orward that to the O f fi c e 15 for their r e vie w. 16 Q This is to your direct supe rvis o r ? l 17 A Almo s t everything would go through my 18 direct supervisor, yes; that is the normal chain. 19 Q What I'm trying to understand is would you 20 inf o rm your supervision, in your jud gm ent, this was 21 a matter that should be referred to the O f fic e of 22 Inve e tigation ? j 23 W ould you make that as a r e c omm e n da tion 24 to your s up e r vi s io n ? 25 A There may be a scenario in which I might r evaten se nos a assoeurus. stenarves nacosmwo senvoca. cnamu:rtru. wowrw canovna _ _ __ .-._ - __,__, .~.
t 4 VANDOORN - DIR E C T 64 I do that. n a 2 Q Would you as a matter of co ur s e ? 3 M R. JOHNSON: As a matt e r of course 4 as to what? What mat t e r of course are you
$ ref e r ring to, what the course is?
6 MR. GUILD: It seems clear to me; 7 does the Witne s s have a p r oble m with that? 8 THE WITNESS: I guess I have a 9 problem with would I r-e c o m m e n d that the 10 Of fi c e of In ve s tig atio n s handle the inv e s ti-11 gation or-- 12 13 BY MR. GUILD: i 14 Q Or that they be inf o r m ed ? 15 A I would recommend they be inf o r m ed, yes. 16 Again, we have an obligation to keep them inf o r m ed. ( 17 Q Would you do that in written form? 18 A B o th ways. 19 Q You. would do it o r s.ll y fir s t ? 20 A T y pic ally, o r ally fi r s t because that. is the 21 quickest mode. 22 Q Would you confirm th at r e c o m me nd a tio n in 23 a writing, a document? 24 A You don't always confirm all phone conver-25 s ation s . I as sume my boss hears me when he ? I evetvn senose associares, stumorves menosmwo seaves, cuantoTTs. wowm camouma
VANDOORN . DIR E CT 65 1 answered me. 2 I w ould f ollow it up with anything I 3 received in writing relating to the alle g a tio n. 4 Q What do you mean by-n at, "f ollow it up?" 5 A If I received s om e thin g later in w ri tin g, 6 say a d o c u rn e n t f r om the a lle g e r, for instance, or 7 s om e thin g in handwriting or something lik e that, ther. 8 I would f o rward th e m to them. 9 Q Tc whom ? 10 A G e n e r a lly with a cove r memo to R e gional 11 p er s o nn el through my direct supervision. It would 12 either go to support staff or the O f fi c e of k_ 13 Inve s tig ation s people. 14 If you are talking f alsific ations , the goal 15 would be to make sure they received those docum ents . 16 Q You would copy them with d o cum e n t s that i 17 you send to your s up er vi sion ? 18 A There would be m ayb e scenarios where I 19 would copy them since I may do some leg work, som e 20 f o llo w up. 21 There would be cases where he might say, 22 " Send the original to me," or s o me thin g. M Q Yes? C 24 A And g e n e r a lly I would try to keep a copy of 25 what I sent to the R e gion, at least for a t i rr; e . If r swnm osacaR ASSOCMTES. STENOMPE REPoemMG SERWCE. CMApuMTE. N CANOUMA
~
y 4 VANDOORN - DIRE C T 66 I there is a change. I may have to look into it. 2 Q What I me a n t, you misunderstood. If you 3 sent a copy to your su p e rvi s ion r e fle c tin g your 4 receipt of those alle g a tion s and you had already mad-e 5 the judgment that it was a matte r that s h ould be 6 referred to the O f fic e of Inv e s tigatio n, because in 7 that example it included potential f alsific ation and 8 potential c r imin al wrongdoing, would you see that a 9 copy of tho se ma t e rials is sent directly to the O f fic e 10 of Inv e s tigations staff ? 11 A I would' s end it to th e ' R e gio n and as sume it 12 would be passed on a p p r o p ria te ly. I don't 13 n ec e s s a rily have the r e s p o n s ibility o f, you know, in 14 my po s ition at C a t awb a, of ve rif ying that it got 15 there, if that is what you are asking. 16 Q Yes. .. .a 17 A As a matter of course, I would say that I 18 probably try to at least ve rb ally make sure that they 19 are aware of the situation. 20 There is a lot of conversation amongst the 21 various in di vid ual s within the R e gion. M Q Just for clarity, when you say they were 23 made aware, when you say "they", you mean the 24 O f fi c e of In ve s tigation s staff? 25 A Yes, at one point I did talk to M r. Vorse r sveLyn sanonR ASSOCuTES. SmeOME pePONTwee SemnCE. CoumuMTE. Nonne camouMA
VANDOORN - DIR E C T 67 3 1 during all of this. I don't remember the exact date i 2 of that. 3 Q I want to turn to some specifics in a 4 mom e nt; let me see if we can fini s h with this 5 process. 6 hi r . VanDoorn, le t's look further at the 7 example that your R e gio n al A d minis tra t o r uses at 8 the bottom of Page 3, and it involves an NRC staff 9 r ep re s e nta tiv e, Di s t ri c t O f fi c e , the O f fic e of 10 Inspector and A udit o r. mus t be immediately informed . 11 ht r . VanDoorn, would it be your responsi-12 bility if such information came fir s t to your ( 13 attention, to ~ see that that O ffi c e of Ins pector and 14 Auditor, CIA, is immediately inf orm ed ? 15 A That would not be my i m m edia te responsi-16 bility. Is that what your qu e s tion was? 17 Q Yes, it was. And whose r e s p on si bilit y 18 w ou ld it be th en ? 19 A That would be the R e gion al O ffi c e . 20
-Q Through your s up er vi sion ?
21 A I would say so, yes. M Q Are you aware of any procedure, eithe r 23 written or verbal, that would detail what your 24 r e s po n s ibilitie s would be in'the example suggested 25 here?
...m .. . . .m .. - -. -.. c-.u=. - c. ou-I
. _ _ . . _ . . _ . . ___ _ _ . ~ , _ __ _ . , . _ _ . . - . _ -
t a eVANDOORN - DIR E C T 68 2 1 Le t's say in a situation where wrongdoing 2 involvin g NRC s taff r e pr e s entative s comes to your 3 attention 2
. .s 4 A Am I aware of--please repeat your qu e s tion ,
5 Q Sure; I'm interested, fir s t, wh e th e r you 6 know of any procedure, written or ve rb al; and then 7 secondly, for some help in describing what that 8 procedure is, If the re is one. 9 A I don st off the top of my , head r e c all a 10 s p e cific procedure numbe r, etc., that deals with 11 exactly how we report things to OIA. 12 I' m awar e, certainly, you know that sort 13 of inf o r ma tion, if we know about it, should be 14 reported to s u p e r vi s ion. 15 And I as sume that they have processes and 16 dire c t or s to handle it. 17 Q Have you ever had occasion to carry such 18 inf o rm a tio n to the O f fic e of Inspector and A udit o r ? 19 A To OIA, no; I don't r e c a ll any. I' m sure 20 g_. l 21 MR. JOHNSON: What was that; I 3 did n' t hear the a ns we r. 23 THE WITNESS: To p r o vid e inf o r m a tion 24 to me from OIA, as I understand it, concez n-25 ing wh at e v e r we just said f oll o wi n g an NRC E l l evetyn senoen Associates. svuwovere nerosmme senwce. cuanunve. nomen camou=A
VANDOORN - DIR E C T 69 s I staff r e p r e s entativ e. t 2 3 BY MR. GUILD: 4 Q Y e s ', sir. 5 A No, I have not talked to OIA di r e c tl y on it. 6 Q All right, sirl M r. VanDoorn, are you 7 aware there is a p e ndin g O f fic e of Inspector and 8 A u dito r in ve s tig stion of R e gion II's h andlin g of th e e 9 s o- c a lle d C a ta wba w el din g inspector incident? 10 A I am not aware of what that investigation 11 e n t ail s . 12' Q Have you heard there was such an inve s ti-(, 13 gation ? 14 A I read the Observer article. It was my 15 understanding they were r e vi ewin g c e rtain of the 16 package, the case file and documentation, that R e gio n 17 II has, the case file. 18 Q Has a re pr e s e nta tive of OIA contacted you 19 on the ma tt e r ? M A Not as yet, no. 21 Q Do you know of any c o nta c t that they have 22 made with any of the persons in your chain of l 23 c omm and ? 24 A I thought a r ep r e s entative was in th e R e gion i 25 about a week ago to r e vi e w the d o c u m e nt a tio n ; but r evetva esnosa assoeurus. sr==ame memarma seaves. cuaauma. nom ca ouma , e
, o I
70 VANDOORN - DIR E CT 2 1 I' m not absolutely sure of th at or what his name was. 2 Other th a n that, I ha ve no knowledge of how 3 they are involved. 4 Q How did you b e c o m.e informed of the involve-5 ment of a r e pr e s entative of OIA at the R e gion ? 6 A Are you talking about the OIA r e p r e s entativ e 7 that went to the R e gion to look at s o me of the 8 d oc um e nt a tio n s that I just stated about? 8 Q Yes. , , 10 A I b e li e ve one of our staff members in 11 Region 11 m e ntio n e d that an OIA r e pr e s en tative was 12 g oin g to the R e gio n. 13 Q Who was that ? I4 A I b elie v e it wa s Mr. Puckett, P-u-c-k-e-t-0 , 15 I b e li e v e. 16 Q What is Mr. Puckett's po s itio n ? 17 A He is one of M r. O ' R i e lly 's support s taff. . 18 1 don't have his exact title. JOHNSON: i 19 MR. L e t's see if we can 20 help heres. 21 THE WITNESS: He handles e nf o r ce - 22 me nt que stio n s. 23 MR. JOHNSON: I saw the gentleman's l' h 24 name e a rli e r , I b elie v e . He signed a 25 document for s omebody .se. as I r e c all, r
, 1 avetm senoen assocuras. svumorres aseoarwee senvecs. cMantom. acam caaouma
e s VANDOORN - DIR E C T 71 i 1 to m e. It was a document to m e. 2 THE WITN ES S: He is ha ndlin g many 3 of the things that M r. Alderson was 4 handling, I b e li e v e , before M r. Alderson 5 left the NRC. 6 MR. GUILD: Mr. Johnson, did you 7 put your hands on what it is that M r. 8 Puckett signed ? 9 MR. JOHNSON: I b eli e v e it was a 10 memorandum sent to me on February 22nd 11 from A ld e r s on; and Puckett signed it for 12 Alderson, but I don't have it right in front ( 13 of me. 14 MR. GUILD: I have that memo. Let 15 me show it to you, Mr. VanDoorn 16 (indicating). I i 17 l 18 BY MR. G UILD: l ! 19 Q Is that the M r. Puckett that you had refere nce 20 to ? 21 A Y e s. 22 Q Do you know what his title is ? 23 A I'm not exactly sure, no. I'm s o rr y.
- ; 24 Q Where is M r. Ald er s o n ?
25 A I'm not sure; I understand he has left the MRC EVELYN maiPGER ASSOCaATES. STENOTYPE REPO8Ff1NG SERVCE. CHARLOTTE. NO8FTH CANOWNA
VANDOORN - DIR E C T 72 4 I Q Do you know what kind of work he is d oin g 2 now? 3 A I believe he is with a c o n s ultin g fir m 4 s om ewhe r e, I' m not sure. 5 Q Any information where? 6 A l' m not sure. 7 Q I wo n' t hold you to it; if you have any inf o rm a tio n at all that would be helpful, to the best 8 9 of your kn owle d g e. 10 A He lives in A tlanta, so it would be a 11 p r ob a bilit y that it may be a firm in Atla nta. I 12 d on' t b eli e v e he wished to move. ( 13 Q Did Mr. Puckett tell you about the OIA 14 inve s tig ation ? 15 A Very simply, as I understood hi m, that he 16 did not describe an in v e s ti g a tio n to me of any sort. 17 He s i na p ly stated there would be an OIA representa-18 tive in t h e' R e gio n to review th e docum entatio n -that 19 the R e gio n had, s p e c ific ally involving welding l l l N inspector concerns at C atawb a. i 21 Q Would you understand then t h at the O f fic e i ! 22 of Ins pector and A u d it o r , OIA, inv olv e m e nt in this 23 matte r, whether you want to char ac te ri z e it as an b 24 inv e s tig ation or not, whether it is or not, would be 25 on the basis of some inf orma tion that consisted of f E VELTN SE RGt R ASSOCIATES. STENOTTPS REPORTING SE RVICE. CMA854TTE. NOfrDe CAROUNA
- i j
VANDOORN - DIRECT 73 I 1 e vid e n c e of wrongdoing involving NRC staff t 2 r epre s entative s ? , 3 A I have no idea what the basis of their 4 involvement is or in fact wh at their in volv e m e nt is 5 at this point, even if they are in v e s tig atin g . 6 I can't speak for him, in other words, 7 obviously. 8 Q I' m not asking you to do that, and I 9 a pp re cia te your candor; but is there s o me thin g else 10 they c ould be doing if it is not involving e vid e nc e 11 or alle g ation s of w r on gd oin g in volvin g NRC staff 12 repre s e ntative s ? (, 13 A Sure. 14 Q How about helping me understand what elce 15 would be involved. 16 A l'm not e xa c tly sure of all their dutie s , bu' 17 I understand t h'e y have other d u ti e s other than 18 internal inv e s tig atio n s of the NRC staff. 19 They are Inspector and A udit o r, so they 20 could be d oin g any number of things, simply r e view-21 ing do cum e n tatio n in p r e par ation for Inf o rmatio n 3 reque sts for s o m e thin g for instance. I don't know,
" I have no idea what th ey are doing.
I 24 Q Let's take a minu t e. I'm not a s kin g you to 25 speculate about the factual matters that are beyond r evatva esacan associares. sis =ovves auro =Tw o samvics. cuanuarra. nonvu caaouna
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VANDOORN - DIRECT 74 1 your knowledge, so I appreciate your candor in tellir.g i 2 me you do n' t know. 3 I guess I' m asking you for f actual infor-4 mation that is founded on your knowled g e of what 5 this O f fic e's r e s p o n s ibiliti e s are and how their work 6 is based on your personal experience. 7 Let's assume th e y are not inv e s tig a tin g 8 alle g a tion s or in f o r m a t io n c o r.c e r ni n g wrongdoing by 9 NRC staff r epre s entative s, and they are doing some-10 thing els e. 11 Please give me an idea, based on your l 12 experience, what els e they may be doing. What is ( 13 within thei- charge, within their pu r vie w, within 14 their area of r e s pon s ibility ? l l 15 A I think I stated pr eviou sly what I know 16 about th at O f fic e. I have not had any direct co n ta c t 17 with that Of fic e, m y s e lf, per s onally. 1 l 18 Q Do you have any other in f o r m a tio n on w hi c h 19 to base an answer to the que s tion what are they 20 d oin g; what might they be doing other than investi. 21 g a tin g wrongdoing on the part of NRC staff? 22 M R ., JOHNSON: You have asked the U qu e s tio n and he has answered it several 24 tim e s. 25 M R . ' G U I' L D : I don't think he has, r EVELYN SERGER ASSOCsATES. STENOTYPE REPOfWNB SEnW3CE. CMARLOTTE. NOWTM CANOUNA
0 o VANDOORN - DIR E C T 75 l i 1 MR. JOHNSON: He doesn't know, but 2 he has made an attempt. 3 THE WITNESS: I have given you all o f 4 my kno wled g e. 5 6 BY M R. GUILD: 7 Q What do they a u dit ? You answered one 8 question e a rli e r saying they inve stigat e and audit; 9 and you emphasiaed " audit". What do they audit. Mr . 10 VanDoorn, if you know? 11 A I don't know the broad scope of their 12 charge. I simply know they audit NRC, for instance, ( 13 They audit expense programs, that sort of thing, and 14 they may be involved in that type of ef f ort. 15 A g ain, I don't have a broad knowledge of 16 what their acope of ac tivit y is. 17 Q You then use as an example they may be 18 involved in preparing Responses to ' document 19 Requests? l l N A Possibly, l 21 Q What is the basis for your answer to th at ? l 22 A Well, when they were in the R e gion it was 23 in a time frame that the R e gion, again, was
- 24 responding to an FOIA R eque st, so I thought that 25 may be something th at they are interested in; that r
EvaLYM SE NGER ASSOC 6 ATE S. STEMOTYPS mePORTises SEnv1CE, CManLOTTE. NORTM CanovenA ,
VANDOORN . DIRE CT 76 . a 1 may be why they were in the R e gion to assist in 2 that Inf ormation gathering a c tivit y in some way. 3 Q Excuse me, I didn't mean to cut you off. 4 A l' m done. 5 Q Is this the FOIA R e qu e s t (indicating) to th e I 6 best of your knowledge that is reflected by the ! 7 Answer? This T elef ax came in addressed to ; 8 Government A c c oun ta bilit y P r o[e c t. 9 A Yeah, the only knowledge I have is the GAP 10 R eque s t regarding the Inspector concerns at Catawba. 11 Q Did you participate, Mr. VanDoorn, in 12 R e s po ndin g to that FOIA R eque s t ? ( 13 A Pa rticipa t ed, yes, to a li mit e d degree I 14 did; eir. 15 Q De s c rib e your p a r ticipa tion. 16 A M a kin g sure th at everything that I had in 17 my possession, handwritten or whatever, that related 18 to the Inspector concerns at C atawba were in the 19 hands ef Re gional people. 20 Q How was that r e s po n s ibility c om munic a te d 21
. to you; how were you asked to do th at ?
22 A I don't r e c all the exact person who asked 23 me to make sure of that. C e rtai nly, M r. Puckett b 24 was involved since he was acting for M r. Alderson, 25 and he indicated that they had an FOIA and a n ythi n g , r EVELYN esmGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE AGPONTING SamveCE. CMARLOTTE. NORTM CAmouMA
o 77 VANDOORN - _DIR E C T T r 1 as minimal as even calendar notes are appropriate 2 to package up and put together r ela tiv e to the FOIA 3 R eque s t. 4 I don't make th e decision as to what pa rt 5 of that gets r eleas ed; but I was held responsible 6 for f o rwa r din g to the Re gio n any inf o rm a tion I had, 7 however minimal it was. 8 Q Did M r. Puckett c a ll you on the phone? 9 A Yes, I did travel to Atlanta oas day as p ar t to of that effort and ha nd -c a r ri e d some thin g s to 11 A tl a n t a. Other things had been forwarded previously 12 by m a il . ( ?3 Q When did you -go to Atlants; do you kn o w ? 14 A I don't r e c all off hand. I can look it up 15 during a break or s o m e thin g and probably find it 16 for you. 17 Q Last F rid a y ? it was before th at, the week before, I 18 A No, 19 think. It was a F rida y. 20 Q A ll right, did Mr. Bryant go to A tlanta 21 y. i t h you? E A Yes, he did. Yes. Mr. Bryant was there. 23 too. 24 Q Did you me et with Mr. Puckett in A tla nt a ? D A Yes. r j .
t , 4 4 VANDOORN - DIR E CT 78 3 1 Q Who else was p re s e nt ? 2 A W e ll, there were several m e etin g s. The 3 primary m e e tin g in which we passed on the infor-4 mation, I don't r e c a ll M r. Puckett. 5 M r. Bryant, my s elf, M r. Craig Todd, 6 T-o-d-d. was at that w e etin g: and that is all I 7 recall. 8 Q Who is Mr. Todd? 9 A He works with the support staff with M r. 10 Puckett. 11 Q Do you know what his title is or job? 12 A l'm not exactly sure of his ti tl e . (- 13 Q This m e e tin g that you have reference to, as 14 you aaid, the primary m e e tin g to talk about the 15 l F OI A - - t h e info r m atio n relative to the FOIA-- l 16 A It was simply a m e eting in which we handed j 17 over anything th at we had and explained what it was, j 18 And then the R e gional people and some i i 19 Headquarter s p e ople , I guess a lot were involved and l 20 created the package to g ethe r. 21 Q You are looking at your lawyor. What do 22 you mean? 23 A Some people in W a s hin g to n were involved. , b 24 Everyone in NRC has to determine whethe r they have 25 any relevant d o c um e nt ati on. , T eveten senose assocutas. stenovvre nerosmme seaves. cmmunts, nomw camouma - i
g vANDOORN . DIRECT 74 4 l 1 Even George was asked if he had any 2 r ela tive inf ormation, relative to the FOIA. 3 Q Mr. Johnson isn't talking, but I assume-- 4 did you have any o th e r meetings when you we nt. to 5 A tla nt a to talk about eit h e r the FOIA or the s u bj u c t 6 of the FOIA ? 7 A Other me etin g s o the r than to talk about 8 yoga ? 9 Q We will make it a -sim ple r que s tion -- cth e r 10 than just r outine , other things with other Inspectors, 11 unrelated c o nv e r s a tion s with other people. 12 A That was my primary purpose of that 13 particular day. We meet and pass on the inf or ma tt or- . 14 that we had, explained what it was and the source of 15 the in f o r m a tio n. 16 Q Yes, I have a document that has been 17 produced this m o r nin g, Mr. VanDoorn. It is 18 e n ti tl e d , "C a s e Chronolo gy" (in di c a tin g ) . 19 Have you seen that? 8 A I' v e seen this, 1 don't b eli e v e no. 21 MR. JOHNSON: T hi s was part of what 22 was released, I b eli e v e , in our R e s pon s e. 23 THE WITNESS: Ye s, sir, in part. 24 MR. JOHNSON: But it was only up to 25 a certain date and I see one item is dated p sygLYN SENGER AssoCaATES. STWooOTYPg sesPomTwee SEleveCE. CMA8MlpTTE. peostTM CAseOuma
l VANDOORN - DIR E C T 80 3 1 4/21/83, and our Response was 4/8/83 2 T his .wa s an additional item. 3 MR. GUILD: Who s e case was that? 4 Can Counsel help us with the source of tha t 5 document ? 6 MR. JOHNSON: Some of this is 7 appa r ently signed or ente re d by Todd. 8 TIIE WITNESS: 2/1/83, entry seems 9 to be by Todd. It seems to be T odd's 10 signature at the b o t t o m. 11 M R. JOHNSON: T hi s is a R e gion al 12 (. case f!!e, so the entries w ould be made by 13 someone in the R e gion. 14 THE WITNESS: The In ve s tig ation s 15 Of fic e and Puckett and Todd's group 16 certainly worked very clo s ely to gethe r, 17 although Puckett and Todd are r e all y part 18 l of the R e gion. 19 l
- BY MR. GUILD:
21 Q It is not your Case Chronology; is th at 22 correct, M r. VanDoorn? 23 A No, that is the R e gio nal--it looks lik e a 24 log that happened when the case file was a c tiv e , 25 i apparently. - r evnm senoea assocures. stemorves aspoemas seavece. cammoorts. woam camouma ~ l
- 3 VANDOORN . DIR EC T 81 i a 1 Q May I read it ?
2 A C e r t ainly, if you would like to examine it. 3 Q Have you seen this Case Chronology before ? 4 A No, I haven't seen it. 5 Q Have you ever talked with th e /R e gio nal 6 A dminis tr a to r about this matter ? 7 A Yes, we did; sure did. 8 Q When was that, c. p p r o xi ma t e l y , to the best 8 you can r emember ? 10 MR. GIBSON: Excuse me , M r. G uild . 11 You uned.the ter m "this m att e r". I'm not 12 sure what you are referring to. 13 MR. GUILD: I think the witne s s does. 14 MR. GIBSON: I'm trying to understan<1 15 wh e th e r you are referring to a specific 16 document or the o v e r all case. 17 MR. GUILD: I'm talking about the 18 ,,,,, 19 MR. JOHNSON: You mean the case 20 gg g,7 21 Yes. MR. GUILD: 22 23 BY MR. GUILD: b 24 Q Can you answer the qu e s tion ? 25 YesS I think the answer would be yes. A E i ' EVELYN SIERGER ASSOCtATES. STENOTTPS REPOWTING SE NytCE. CMARLDTTS. MONTH CamouMA ,
- i VANDOORN - DIRECT 82 3
1 Q Give me an idea when it was to the best of 2 your knowledge. 3 A We had a imirly recent m e etin g with M r. 4 O ' R ie lly. 5 Q Start with that one. 6 A That is the one I remember s p e cific ally 7 with Mr. O'Rielly c o nc e r ni n g this case. Let me 8 think, that was du rin g--la s t week, I b e lie v e it ras-- 9 I was tr yi n g to think of the day for you to try to tie 10 it down. 11 I think it was Thursday. 12 Q Where was that m eeting ? 13 A In A tlanta, I was in Atlanta again for one 14 of our R e sid en t Inspector me etin g s . 15 Q And who else was present at the m e etin g 16 with O ' R ie lly on the subject? 17 A M r. Bryant was there. I'm tr ying to r e c all; 18 there may be-- l 19 Q To the best you r e m emb e r . l 20 g ge m trying to be as accurate as I can. 21 g 7,,, ,g,, 1 22 A Mr. Dance, Mr. L e wi s , Mr. B r ownl e e , M r. I 23 Puckett, I think M r. Brad Jones, who is R e gio n al f b 24 Counsel. 25 M R. JOHNSON: Can I confer - E EVELY98 SERGER USOCIATES. ETEpeOTYPE IEEPostflose ,EeveCE. CD4ARLOTTE. Decerfte CAmoussa ,
VANDOORN . DIR E CT 83 r i 1 with the Witne s s dor a second? e 2 MR. G UILD: Sure. 3 (Whereupon, the Witne s s and his 4 C ou n s el conferred off th e R e co rd). 5 6 BY M R. GUILD: 7 Q Were there o th e r s present that you r e c all ? 8 A To the best of my r e c o lle c tio n that was all 9 there was. 10 Q Were there any other NRC people th e r e ? 11 A No. 12 Q D e s cribe the m e e tin g then, please. (~ 13 MR. JOHNSON: Just to make it cle a r, 14 I just ad vi s e d Mr. VanDoorn to the e xt e nt 15 that his convey sations at this m e e tin g 16 involved the d e ci sio n-m akin g processes to l 17 the A g e ncy; and it r e fl e c t e d A tt o r n e y - Clie nt I 18 contacts, that they would be p rivile g e d. 19 subject t o' the privile ge anyway, and who 20 said what to whom may be off er ed in the l 21 scope of the p rivile g e. 22 MR. GUILD: Please answer the U qu e s tio n. L 24 THE WITNESS: Do I s till answer? 25 JOHNSON: You don't have to MR.
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EVELYN SG AGE R ASSOCBATE S. STEfeOTYPE REPoerns.e SE RveCE. CMARLOTTE. NOWTH CAmouMA ,
s e i VANDOORN - DIRECT 84 5 1 answer, I would suggest that you could
& 2 describe in general what the su bj e ct matter 3 was.
4 THE WITNESS: Fine; we discussed the 5 case and wh e th e r , certainly, we felt 6 strongly that we had done a good job on 7 this particular issue, s 8 As I r e c all, we did not discuss a lot 9 of s p e cific s . That is ba s i c ally wh at the 10 co nve r s a tion wac. 11 MR. GUILD: I would lik e the Record 12 to r e fl e c t that Counsel was indicating that ( 13 was all the Witne s s should answer. 14 15 BY MR. GUILD: 16 Q Have you been asked to d e s c ribe your 17 involywm ent in this case, Mr. VanDoorn? 18 A Not in any d e t ail . 19 Q In any way? 20 A Mr. O'Rielly was aware of my involve m ent. 21 I didn't have to de s c ribe that to hi m .
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22 Q Were you required to make any pr e s enta tio n s 2 about th e case? 24 A I said a few words, not exa c tly. 5 Q To the best of your knowledge? _ r
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EVELYN SEnGE R ASSOctATES. STENOTYPE NEPORTING SEmysCE, CMAmLOTTE. NOWTM CANOuena
. i , VANDOORN - DIRECT 85 1 A G e n e r ally I stated we have done a thorough 2 review of th e welding in s p ec ti o n concern; and I felt 3 c o nfid e n t that .they had been properly reviewed and 4 the case had been properly closed.
5 6 BY MR. GUILD: 7 Q When was it properly clo s ed ? 8 A That is a R e gional date; I think it may be 9 on your Chronology there that you were s ho win g me. 10 Q I s e.- a n indication on this same Case 11 Chr onolo gy, an indication that 12/'50/82, "r evie w 12 case fil e ; no further a c tio n required, case closed." ( 13 And then there is a signature. Perhaps 14 you can id e ntif y that. 15 A l' m not sure, I believe that is Mr. T o d d's 16 signature, you are talking about the 2/1/83, e ntr y ? 17 Q No sir; I' m talking about the 12 --lo ok 18 further up the Chronology, if you would. 19 MR. JOHNSON: This looks like N Alderson. l 21 THE WIT N ESS : With the crossed out 22 spot, but that appears to be Mr. Alderson' s M signature, 2/31/82. 24 l 25 BY MR. GUILD:
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EVELYN SENGER ASSOCIATE 5. STENOTYPE REPONTING 3Epygt. CHARLOTTE. MCNTH CANOUMA ,
e i VANDOORN - DIR E C T 86 1 1 Q And that indicates that the case was closed, 2 and if I read it c o rr e c tly-- 3 A It s ays ,, "C a s e Closed", part of the words. 4 MR. JOHNSON: It is crossed out, 5 t h'o u g h . I believe it was a mis take in entry. 6 THE WITNESS: There is no date when 7 it was crossed out. You would have to ask l 8 the people involved with that entry. 9 , 10 BY M R. GUILD: 11 Q Can you tell me, M r. VanDoorn, whether in 12 fact the case was closed on 12/30/82? ( 13 A A g ain, that is a R e gional decision as to 14 when they clos ed the case involving the O f fic e of 15 In v e s ti g a tio n s . 16 As w ell as I understand, they did clos e it 17 based on my r e c om m e nd a tion. I' m not sure they did. 18 MR. JOHNSON: When was your 19 re co mm endation 7 20 i THE WITNESS: I would have to look 21 up the memo. 22 JOHNSON: MR. That was a mistake U in entry. 24 THE WITNESS: To the best of my 25 the memo r e c o mme ndin g closure kn owled g e, _ r EVELTN SEIDGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTTPE REPONTING SElWWICE. CMABE.O N E. NO8rTM CAltOUNA - _ _ _ . _ _ . . _ . , _ _ _ _ _ . . _ . . _ . _ . _ _ _ . _ . . _ - _ _ _ . . . . . . _ _ , , . . _ . _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ . . ~ . , , , . _.
I 3 VANDOORN - DIR E CT 87 a 1 1 to the best of my knowledge, that was the 2 date. 3 MR. JOHNSON: For axampic, one 4 do cum ent that we gave over in Discovery wa s 5 dated. Feb ruary 1st, '83, it was. "I 6 completed my review and my r e c om me n da tion 7 is that we considered Case 2G0220 c l o s e d ." 8 9 BY MR. GUILD: 10 Q And that is dated ? 11 MR. JOHNSON: February 1st, '83, 12 THE WITNESS: Obviously the case ( 13 should not have been re ally clos ed until 14 after that memorandum. 15 MR. JOHNSON: I think that ea rli e r 16 date is in error. 17 THE WITNESS: It is clear that was 18 some sort of mis - e nt r y, because it is 19 crossed out, I b e li e v e . Is that not correct ? I 20 MR. GUILD: They have several things 21 crossed out. Let's see what th ey are. You 22 have a copy of the same Case Chronology. 23 24 BY ..R. G UI LD : 25 Q What is the last e ntr y on yours, sir. Mr.
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EVELYN BERGER ASSOCLATES. SUNOTYPE R2PONTwe4 SE RvtCE, CMAMLA3TTE. MONT*4 CAfMUNA .
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o . VANDOORN - DIRE C T 88 s 1 VanDoorn?? i 2 A T wo /15 / 8 0. 3 Q I will show you my copy; do you see af ter 4 12/30/82 entry, what appears to be "Alderson case 5 clo s ed" ? 6 A S o me thin g reviewed "No further action 7' r equir ed. " 8 Q 3efore th at 12/30/82, review case fil e , 9 followin g th e li n e , " Case closed " and there is a 10 signature. 11 A C. E. Alderson; and there is a cross out 12 and s ome initials, and I' m not sure of the i ni ti al s . ( 13 Q And th e next line says, " Case still open." 14 A That would have been written when t h at cro is 15 out was made. I' m not sure. I can't speak to this. 16 I had no inputs to this. We are going over some-17 thing I have absolutely no idea about. 18 The next entry appears to be, Q from my 19 copy, 1/28/83, 1
" Case reviewed and closed." It 20 appears.to be A lder s on's s ig na tu r e .
l 21 A My best guess would be that is true. I' m 22 trying to read a poor copy here with crossovers. 2 Q A ll right, sir; then we have an entry that 24 seems to r e fle c t receipt of your m e mo; does it not, 25 2/1/83, "R e vi e w of DPC Task Force, Interviews with _ r EVELTM SERGE R ASSOctATES. STENOTYPE REPOWTING SERvtCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA =
l VANDOORN - DIRECT 89 i 1 QA/QC Personnel. Case reviewed and closed. No 2 further a c ti o n required." Is that correct? 3 A T ha t 's right. 4 Q That has reference to you r 2 /1/ 8 3, memo. 5 A Apparently that is a reference, I would 6 a s s ume it is. 7 Q Wh a t do the initials L/M refer to ? 8 A l'm not sure. 9 M R. JOHNSON: They are pa renthe s e s. 10 11 BY MR. GUILD: 12 Q That e ntr y has a signature by it. Can you ( 13 id en tify that ? 14 A A g ain, it appears to be M r. Fred Todd's 15 signature. 16 MR. JOHNSON: That is In ve s tigato r 17 Todd. 18 19 BY MR. GUILD: i 20 Q Ie there a Greg Todd; Greg I said? 21 A It is G, I believe it is G re g with a G, 22 Todd. Mr. 23 Q And help me, he is on Mr. O'Rielly's 24 support staff; he is the gentleman filling in for Mr. 25 A ld e r s on ? I'm sorry, M r. Craig Todd; and Greg _ r EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STEMOTYPE REPORTING SERysCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTN CAROUNA
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VANDOORN - DIR E CT 90 i' 1 Todd, who would he be? 2 A My knowledge is he is helping Mr. Pu c k e tt, 3 and M r. Puckett is handlin g some of what were 4 forme rly Mr. Alderson's dutie s ; and Mr. Todd is 5 a s sis tin g Mr. Puc k e tt. 6 l' m not sure of his titl e. He may be 7 t e mpo r a rily a s si s ting, but he would be an Inspector 8 in the R e gio n. 9 We have people assigned to areas but do 10 not have a title n e c e s s arily that is relevant te wha t 11 they are doing at a given mom en t. 12 MR. GUILD: I think what I'll do is ( 13 ask that this Case Ch ronolo gy be id en tifie d 14 as Exhibit 2 to this D e po s ition so we can 15 have a clear reference to it. 16 MR. JOHNSON: No obj e c tio n. 17 ( Whe reup on, the document 18 referred to as Case Chronology was ( 19 marked and received by the Court l 20 R eporte r as VanDoorn D e po sition 21 Exhibit Number Two and entered into M the R eco rd). 23 24 BY MR. G UILD : 5 Q R e co gnizin g that it is not your Ch ro nolo gy, F EVELYN SENGER ASSOCRATES. STENOTYPE REPONTING SERWCE. CMANLOTTE. NORTM CANOWNA . _m._ . _ __
1 VANDOORN , DIR E CT 91 e l l 1 M r. VanDoorn, can you tell me whether the Chronolo gy i 2 r e fl e c t s this case was reopened since the fir s t eithe r ' 3 incorrect entry reflecting I't be clo s ed, or sinc e l 4 your 2/1/83, memo r e c omme ndin g closure, that it 5 remains open now? j 6 A You are asking does it appear a f t er entries 7 of 2 /1/ 8 3, that the case has been reopened? 8 Q Yes, 9 A Let me read it a gain. I don't read that to any of the additional four entries, that the issue, 11 case, has been reopened according to the Case 12 C hr onolo g y. ( 13 Q Do you know whether the case has been 14 reopened? 15 A To my knowledge it has not been reopened. 16 Q The la s t entry on the Case C h r o nolo gy, M r. 17 VanDoorn, " M e e tin g with R e gional Admini strator and 18 Public Aff air s regarding press release (see case 19 file), P alm e tt o A llia n c e and G A P. " 20 Do you have any knowledge of th a t meeting ? 4 21 A I was not in attendance at that m e e tin g. 22 Q Do you know of that m eeting. 23 A I understood they were having the m e e tin g 24 I was sinc e I b e li e v e there was a press release. U at 'a training session, I believe, when you and GAP _ y EVELYN SERGE R ASSOCRATES. STEMOTYPE REPOsm88G SE NytCE. CHAmLOTTE. NOMTM CAROUMA ,
, ~ . _ _ . _ _ _ _ . , _ _ _ _ _ _ . _ . . _ _ _ _ , , . . . _ _ _ _ , _ _ _ _ _ _ . - . _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ . _ _ _ . . . _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ , _ , _ _ _ _ . _ , . . _ _ . . _ , _ , . _ _ . . _ . .
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VANDOORN - DIRECT 92
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i I made th at press release to the Observer, I b eli e v e. 2 I don't know that exact date, but they did 3 discuss it in the R e gio n. I heard, but I was not 4 in v o lv e d in any way with that m eeting. 5 Q How did you hear about that? 6 A I heard about the press article from my 7 wif e since I called her from our training session. 8 I was in t r a inin g at that point, and I called my 9 supervisor to see if, you know, they did need any 10 info rma tio n from me. 11 There woulu o o vi ou s ly be inquiries 12 concerning the press release; and a p p a r e n tly they ( 13 were fully abreast of whatever inf ormation that they 14 required. 15 They s aid they did have a m e e tin g, but they 16 didn't need me to attend or anything. 17 Q And who was th e supervisor that you 18 informed? 19 A I c alle d, I talked to eith e r M r. Ig n a t o ni s 20 or Mr. Brownlee, and asked if they needed any 21 in f o rm atio n from me. 22 I t alke d to both of them that week and U diff er ent s u bj e c t s , I don't r e c a ll which one I 24 s pe cific ally talked to about the press release 25 a nnou nc em e nt. ..
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EVELYN SERGER ASSOctATES, STEMOTYPE REPONTING SENytCE. CMAmLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA .
.r- - - + , -- , . - - , , , . _ . - . - - - - - , , , , - - - - , - , . , . - - , - , , . - , , _ . , _ _ , , , , ,.,.,.,_-.-_,,.--y.-- - . - , . _ .-_ .-,
VANDOORN . DIRE C T 93 i- i 1 Q L e t's talk s p e c ific ally about the w eldin g :
- 1 2 inspector concerns at C a tawb a. You understand 3 g e n e r ally w ha t I mean by that?
4 I'm not trying to trick you or anything; 5 but without ha vin g to go through lots of d e t ail, we 6 understand when I' m talking about the subject of 7 this c a s e file, the welding inspector concerns at 8 Catawba ? 9 A I believe I have an und e r s ta ndin g of what 10 that means, yes. We can ask qu e s tion s later? 11 A Yes, and if I'm not being clear in what . 12 I' m r ef er ring to, please let me know. Let's try to (' 13 identify th e NRC staff that were involved in pu r s uin g 14 that m atte r, the welding inspector concerns at 15 C at awb a. You were, obviously. 16 3 y,,, 17 Q And you were the R e sid ent Inspector during 18 that time ? 19 A Y e s. 20 Q Who else was involved at NRC staff? 21 A W e ll, I don't know as I can give you every 22 name of every person that in putt e d or was aware of U th e concern. 24 l I can give you as much as-- 25 l Q Yes, just as much as you can.
?r EVELTN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTTPE REPOfrTING SEurveCE. CNARLOTTE. SeONTH CAROUNA ,
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 94 i 1 A My immediate s up e r vi s o r, the entire chain 2 of command f rom my s elf through M r. O ' R i elly. 3 Q Let's id e n tif y them by name ve ry briefly. 4 A I did once. 5 Q Yes. 6 A Bryant at that time was my immediate 7 s up e r vis o r, Dance, Le wi s , O ' R i e lly, O f fi c e of 8 Inve s tig ation s , was aware of the concerns. 9 1 don't know who initially, I'm not sure. 10 1 don't know, M r. Vorse at least was a w a r e-- du rin g
- 11 a pa rtic ular period I sent some documentation 12 directly to him at one ti ni e , and I t a lk e d to him
( 13 another time during the o v e r all p e rio d. 14 It was a pretty long period of tim e, I don't 15 know if he was the person in OI that was initially 16 inf o r m e d. I' m not sure. . 17 Various support s taff people, I b e li e v e , 18 ,,,, , , , ,f e of it, M r. Alderson. 19 Does ha fit in that administration of Q 20 support staff? 21 3 y,,, 22 Help me understand what the dis tinc tion is. Q 23 if there is a general use of that t e rm, support 24 staff? 25 A No, th a t is a more s p e cific group, a small in EVELYN SENGE R ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE 18EPO8FTtfee SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. NOWTM CANOWNA l ..-- - ._. - _ _ _ _ ._ - - .. - - - - ,__ - - _ _ __ .__ . _
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l . , _ VANDOORN - DIRECT 95 a 1 group of individuals which assist Mr. O'Rielly. ( 2 Support staff isn't the a c tu al term of that group, a nc; 3 it changed a couple of ti mes . It keeps changing, but 4 it is a group of individuals as signed to assist him. I 1 5 And one of the areas that they assist him 6 in for the more important issues, for instance, 7 alle ga tion s and inv e s ti gatio n r e view s , decisions, they 8 input his decisions in that area. 9 Q I' m sorry I interrupted you; you identified to M r. Ald e r s o n among that group, and who els e ? 11 A I' m sure there were others, but I c an 't 12 tell you who they were. Eventually all these other ( 13 names we have mentioned in previous que s tion s 14 became aware of it. 15 Mr. Pu c k e t t, Mr. Todd, obviously. There 16 is a M r . - -I ' m trying to give you e ve r ythin g I can 17 absolutely think of. Was it Mr. T obin, I think' 18 T - o -b-i- n ? 19 Who is M r. Q T obin ? 20 A I think he had some in v olve m ent. 21 Q Who is he? 22 A I' m not sure of his title; I know he has - 23 done some reviews relative to hara s s ment issues. V 24 I b e li e v e those are two very important issues we nee d 25 to r e vi e w; and I know he has had some involvement in . i-
...u .. .. mocum. .n.<nm wom n =.. c==om. o== caaou= .
VANDOORN - DIR E CT 96 3 1 r e view of ha ra s s ment charges. 2 I'm not e x a c tly sure of his title, I' m sorry . 3 Q Do you have.any awareness of M r. T obin's 4 background, training ? Is he a s p e ciali s t in some 5 sort of inve s tig ation s, or do you know? 6 A I understand that he is not an Inve s tig a t o r. 7 However, he is f amilia r with what we need to do 8 regarding har a s s m ent. 9 For in s ta nc e, and my only understanding of 10 his involv em e n t was that he had done some review 11 during the course of this eff ort r e g ardin g the harass - 12 ment is sues that were involved. ( 13 I' m not sure in total what his involvement 14 waa. 15 Q There are memos that have M r. T o bin 's 16 name attached in the file ? 17 A I b elie v e there are. 18 Q And just in short, those would reflect his 19 p a r tic ul a r involvement on this point, b ein g in vo lv ed 20 in hara s sme nt issues, to the best of your knowledge? 21 A I b e li e v e they would, yes. They probably 22 l should. 23 Q Wh a t info rma tion came to your att ention. l 24 VanDoorn, when you fir s t a r rive d on site at M r. i 25 C atawba as the R e sident or as you' were preparing - r EVELYN SENGER ASSOCMTES. STEMMPE REPOstTweG SE RvtCE. CHARLOTTE. NOffTH CAROUMA . l r
- E VANDOORN . DIRE CT 97
- i I to come here regarding concerns of C atawb a welding 2 ins pector s ?
3 MR. JOHNSON: Can I clarify the date 4 you are talking about now? 5 THE WITNESS: You said a time p e riod . 6 7 BY M R. G UILD : 8 Q You arrived on site February, '81? 9 A Yes. 10 Q That time f ra m a, February, '817 11 A Yes. 12 Q Now the qu e s tion was again, what inf o rma-t (~ 13 tion came to your a t t e nt io n, if any, r e g a r din g 14 concerns of C atawba w eldin g inspectors? 15 A I would assume that you are asking were 16 concerns expressed to me right in the b e ginning of l 17 my tenure at C a ta wb a by welding in s pecto r s ? l 18 Q Did you learn eithe r by direct inf o rmation 19 from welding inspectors or f ro m any other source; 20 did you learn of any concerns involving w eldin g 21 in s p ec to r s at C a ta wb a ? 22 Inspectors always have--I r ou tin ely talk l; A 23 with all types of inspectors. O b vi ou s ly, there is 24 goin g to be some degree o f, you know, d e s c rip tio n 25 of what they are doing and whether they have had to , EVELYN SERGE R ASSOCLATES. STENOTYPE RENHNG SERVICE, CHARLOTTE. NowfM CARouMA .
VANDOORN - DIRECT 98 3 i 1 reject a weld recently o r, you k no w , o bviou sl y there 2 is going to be r ou tin e c o nv e r s ation. 3 Concerns is a very broad d e finitio n. 4 Q Is the answer y e s-? 5 A Given a very broad definition of concerns, b a . 6 I guess it w ou ld have to be yes. 7 Q All right, your predecessor was Mr. Bryann ? 8 M R. JOHNSON: I think it was M r. 9 M a xw e ll. 10 THE WITNESS: Yes, Mr. M a xw ell. 11 12 GUILD: BY M R. ( Maxwel l 13 Q Did you ever learn from either M r. 14 or Mr. Bryant at th e tim e you arrived at Catawba of 15 concerns by welding L t. sp e c t o r s ? 16 A W e ll, I understand in my overall kn o wle d g e 17 of the C at awb a project that there have been concerns l 18 expressed prior to my c o min g to C a t awb a by some 19 l in s p e c tion p e r s onn el. 20 And th ey had been e s s entially already , 21 reviewed or had been addressed in some way or
" whatever was done.
" It was closed out, in essence; and so I was 24 re gar ding aware of no open issues, open case fil e s ,
25 It is very common to have C atawba at that ti me . , r
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EVELY9s sEnGER Assc* SATES. STSNOTTPE REPORTING SEmKE. CMAsasTTW. m CAROUNA
VANDOORN - DIRECT 99 .t s 1 at a construction s it e regularly, concerns expressed 2 to us. 3 It is very c omm o n. T hi s goes on through. 4 out the co n s t ru c tio n process, and we handle each of 5 them as they come u p, obviously. 6 Q But your answer is you were aware of 7 concerns expressed by welding inspectors at the t i me 8 you took the p o s itio n at C a t a wb a ? 9 MR. JOHNSON: He said he was aware 10 of no open issues. 11 MR. GUILD: I heard him, let him 12 answer the qu e s tion, please. ( 13 THE WIT N E SS: To the best of my 14 r e c olle c tio n as I r e c a ll from M r. M a x well, 15 I don't mean I don't remember any d e t ail s ; 16 it is kind of--I think that Mr. N a xw e ll may 17 have been involved with concerns of some 18 welding inspectors. 19 I' m not ab s olu t ely sure of that, but as. 20 I r e c all he had m ention ed some w eld in g 21 inspectors that had mentioned some concern s 22 to him. M I know the r e were concerns that 24 involved welding, okay? 25 . f emn, .. .. u.oema . en orm ==mnr-a eaves. c==unr= - aa== -
VANDOORN - DIRECT 100 s 1 BY MR. GUILD: 2 O A ll right, do you know whether those 3 concerns were ever reflected in an ins pe c tion report ? 4 A I know the R e gion did a review of some 5 concerns that were expressed at one time. I think 6 there is, at least to the best of my r e c o lle c tio n, 7 th e r e is at least one ins p ectio n that was done as a 8 result of othe r concerns other than, you know, the 9 Task Force concerns. 10 Q Other concerns by w eld in g inspectors? 11 A I' m not sure of the inspectors' title s. It 12 may very well have been a welding inspector. It ( 13 involved some degree of w eldin g. 14 MR. JOHNSON: I think Mr. Bryant 15 would be in a better po sition to answer 16 these particular qu e s tio ns. 17 THE WITNESS: It was prior t o -- w ell, 18 let me think--I don't r ec all the date but it l 19 was a R e gional In s p ecto r f ollow up of that M particular concern, wh a te v e r it was. 21 As I r e c a ll I didn't get involved 1 3 p e r s o nally. 23 24 GUILD: r BY M R. 25 Q Did M 'r . Bryant bring to your a t t e nt io n in _ f
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l
i
. E VANDOORN - DIRECT 101 1 the course of you taking up your dutie s at Catawba 2 previous concerns expressed by welding inspectors?
3 A I d on ' t r e c all that he did, no. 4 Q Bryant bring to your attentiot Did hi r . any 5 matte r s of special empha si s or concern that he was 6 inf o r me d of th a t ne passed on to you as you took 7 over there? 8 A C e rt ainly he informed me of issues and 9 c ertain areas tl.at he may have wished me to inspect, 10 There was a c o ntinuin g effort and certainly some of 11 that happened at the very b e ginning a w e ll . 12 I don't r e c all every c o nve r s a tio n and advico 13 that he gave me. He conducted a large team 14 in s p e c ti on at the b e ginnin g of C a t a wb a, and there 15 were some items identified in that team in s p e c tio n 16 w hi c h required quite a bit of f ollow up. 17 That would be an example of one of the 18 t hin g s , that team in s p ec tion would b e an example o f, I8 for in s tan c e, an area that he w a nt e d to make sure 20 that I f ollow ed up on. 21 Q Help me unde r s tand what that te rm m e an s, 22 "a team in sp e c tio n". 23 A It means multiple Inspectors. We take a C 24 team of people q u a lifi e d la various e ngin e e rin g 25 dis cipline s and look in the multiple areas at the _ 5 EVELYN SENGEP ASSOCIATES, STENOTYPE REPOWNG SENveCE. CMARLOTTE. NOfrTM CANOUNA .
1 VANDOORN . DIRECT 102 s 1 s ame ti m e . 2 Q Would that be a routine ins pection or 3 special in s p e c tion ? 4 A Team ins pe c tion s are not r e ally routine, no . 5 Q Would it be d e s c rib ed as special in s pe c tion P 6 A Yeah. 7 Q Can you id en tif y that d o cum e n t that you 8 are referring to ? 9 A This is a docum e nt that was . 10 MR. JOHNSON: R ele a s ed to all 11 pa rtie s in this case on, I believe it was 12 S e ptemba r 14, 1982, attached to a le tt e r to ( 13 the A d mini s tr a tiv e Judges by me; and this 14 t, page 6 of the enclosure thereto. 15 It is titl e d , " Excerpt F r o rn a Special 16 C o n s t ru c tio n Team In s p ec tion Report." 17 18 BY MR. GUILD: 1 19 Q Is there fu r th e r identification of that 20 in s p e c tion ? Can you give me an in s pec tion report l 21 numbe r ? l 22 A That was our Report 50-4/13,4/i4/81-02. l 23 All right, sir. Q L 24 A And you have a copy of that. l 25 Q Is there s o me thin g else you wanted to add? . l !- EVELYN SE RGEm ASSOCLATES. STENOTYPE REPONTHe4 SemnCE. CMAWEATTE. NO8rTM CAmouMA {
ni
- VANDOORN - DIR E C T 103 5 .
1 A No, he was a s kin g me if that was correct. 2 Q Do you have that in s p e c tio n report 3 available to you? 4 A Not immediately. 5 Q Le t 's see if we can put our hands on it. 6 I have a copy of it, but it is marked u p. 7 MR. JOHNSON: Do you have available 8 to you this document because it is ins erts 9 from it (indica ting) ? 10 M R. GUILD: M a yb e we can work from 11 that. 12 THE WITNESS: The re po rt was fairly k 13 lengthy, as I recall. It was a t e am 14 ins pection in volvin g lots of pe ople, so it 15 was fairly lo n g. 16 MR. GIBSON: Is this a good ti m e to 17 take a fairly short break? 18 MR. GUILD: Y e s' , I have a stack her o 19 that came from the Document Room that was M tagged as all the in s p ec tion reports; and 21 they seem to be broken down for copying M purposes. 23 Maybe s omeon e from the company can C 24 help me find that in s pec tion report. 25 MR. GIBSON: I'll see if R o ger can - r EVELYN BE RGER ASSOCIATES. STEMOTYPE REPOfrTweG SafrvaCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAnouma -
O , VANDOORN - DIRECT 104 3 1 help me during the break, five minutes. 2 MR. GUILD: How about until quarter 3 to 4:00? 4 (Whereupon, the Depo sition wa s 5 adjourned for a recess, af ter which the 6 f ollo win g proceedings were had:) 7 8 MR. GUILD: If we can go back on the 9 Record, the tirr.e is 20 minute s to 4:00 10 11 BY MR. GUILD: 12 Q Mr. VanDoorn, were you able to get a c opy ( 13 of the Ins pection Report 81,02? 14 A I believe I have one in front of m e, sir. 15 Q That is the t e a m, the r e s ult s of the team IG in s pec tion that you had reference to that was conduct ed 17 at the tim e you fi r s t came on site, appr oximat ely ? 18 A Yes, that's correct. l 19 Q What prompted th e in s p e c tio n that was l ! N referred to in this report? 21 A Mr. B r ya nt would be best served in E answering that que s tion. I b elie ve he directed this 23 team in s p ec tio n. L 24 Q What is your und e r s ta ndin g ? 25 A My understanding is we had at that period - r evetem ennaam associatus srewovves nepowrwee senvca.cMam.oTTu. moarn cascLama -
D , VANDOORN . DIRECT 105 1 in time, we, NRC. I'm not e xa c tly sure'who in NRC, 2 decided NRC ought to do some team ins pe ctio n s ; and 3 beyond that, Catawba was an active construction site l l 4 and was chosen a's one of those ins pe ctio n sites. ' Q How many other sites were chosen; do you 6 know ? 7 A I don't recall. 8 Q A large number of site s, s m a ll num b e r of 9 sites; I'm trying to get a sense for how unique th e 10 team in s p ec tio n was. 11 A At this p o int there was a large num oe r of 12 site s a v a ila b l e, so I c ould n' t determine that. Mr. ( 13 Bryant could give you that, I b elie v e . 14 Q Do you have a feel for whether this was 15 a unique in s p e c tion ? 16 A To some degree. I think we would have to 17 say that special in s p e c ti on s alw a y s have s o me 18 u niqu e n e s s to th em, and this was termed a special 19 in s p ec tion to the best of my knowled g e; special in 20 that we do not ne ce s s a rily do routine team in s p e c ti o r.s. 21 I w o uldn ' t c ha r a c t e riz e it as special for 22 other--to my kno wle d g e I don't b eli e v e it was any 23 conducted as a r e sult cf any alle g a tion s, for instanc o, b 24 Q All right, in the docum ent s that were 25 June 30 provided by C ou n s el this morning there is -. _
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gYgLYN ggpGER ASSOCRATES. ETEpeCITYPE IEEPORTI8e8 senytCE. CMAsEDTTE. f*ORTM CamouMA , l I I. . - . _ _ . _ _ _ . _ , . _ . . . . . _ __ _ . . _ _ , _ . _ _ , . _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ , . . _ _ - . _ , . _ _ _ _ . . _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ , ,
t VANDOORN - DIR EC T 106 i 1 1982, memo from Mr. Lewis to Mr. Isenhut. 2 C o ul d Counsel make that available to the 3 Witne s s ? 4 MR. GIBSON: What was the date of 5 that document again, Bob? MR. In hand on the face of 6 GUILD: 7 the document it says original of fic e 8 document s t a m ,9 indicates July 30, 1982 9 M R. GIBSON: From whom to whn? 10 M R. GUILD: R. S. Lewis, Director 11 of P ro j e c t, R e sid ent Pro gram s, to Isenhut, 12 Dir e c to r of Division of Licensing, NR C. k 13 MR. JOHNSON: For some reason this 14 is mi s sin g, it should be right in here, and 15 I don't have it. 16 MR. GUILD: Rather than being an 17 excerpt from the a c tu al in s p e c tio n report, 18 can we agree that what you have is an 19 excerpt f rom this memo, Counsel? 20 M R. JOHNSON: Okay, I do have it. 21 it appears to be a ve rb a tim excerpt. The 22 d o cume nt says selected p o r tio n s are given 23 below, paragraph title s are as they appear 24 in the r e po rt; and I b eli e ve it is ve r b atim 25 from the original in s p e c tion report, and it _ i-EVELYN BERGE R ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE 88EPOfrTwe4 SE RVICE. CHARLg7TTE. feORTM CAnouMA ,
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, 1 DIR E C T 107 VANDOORN -
s I comes f rom the memo to Isenhut as you i 2 have in your hands. MR. G U I L'D : The original do cu m e n t-- 3 4 I see what you are talking ab ou t-- t hi s is ! 5 the same thing, yes. 6 7 BY MR. GUILD: 8 Q Now does it read, for the Record if you l 9 would, I think probably the s im pli e s t way of doing it, l 10 M r. VanDoorn, the fir s t paragraph th at appears at l 11 Page 6 there, it will cla rif y that. t 12 A Entitled, " A v a ile.b ilit y of T e chnic al ( 13 A s sis tance"? 14 Q No, sir; the top paragraph on the page. 15 A "In du s t ri al In s p ec tion T eam In s p e c tion s conducted at one or two sites. Such an 16 were 17 in s pec tio n was conducted at C a t a wb a on January 26th 18 through February 6th, 1981. Integral part of this and 19 in s p e c tion was to de te rmine by ob s ervatio n, 20 c onve r s ation s , qu a lific a tio n s of craf t smen and QC
.s 21 p e r s o n n'e l; another part was to question these person concerning assistance available when needed. Any 22 i
23 indiention of hara s sment in inspectors and workers, 24 and wo rke r's recourse if they were harassed and/or 25 saw poor wo rkma n s hip. " , 5 evettu samosa assocess. svamorves espontwo sanyca.cwn.oTTs. m cAnouma ,
6 , VANDOORN - DIR E CT 108 i 1 Q Were you aware of that d e s c riptio n of th e 2 basis for this i nsp ec t i o n prior to now ? 3 A I don't know as this paragraph serves to 4 indicate the basis of the inspection. It states what 5 was done, and the fact that some Industrial Team 6 In s p e c ti on s were conducted. 7 This paragraph is stating what was 8 included in this in s p e c ti on. Part of it was included 9 in this in s p e c tio n. 10 Were you aware of that? Q 11 A That they did that review as pa rt of that 12 in s p ec tion ? 13 g yes,
-4 14 A Yes, I was.
15 Q Were you aware that this team in s p e c tion 16 was conducted on the basis of a s ele c tion of one or 17 two sit e s in each R e gion in 19817 18 A I don't r e c all as to how many s it e s , no. 19 I stated that e a r li e r . 8 Q A ll right, sir; now the in s p e c tion report 21 that is th e product of this in s p e c tion, would you
" describe that as a typical in s p e c tio n re po rt in your U experience at C a tawb a ?
b 24 A No, because again, it was a team in s p e c ti o n. 25 Mor e r outin ely we do dif f e r e n t types of in s pe c tio n s ; w EYELYN BERGER ASSOctATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SENveCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUMA _a -
VANDOORN - DIR E C T 109 3 1 u s u ally involving a s in gl e Inspector at a tim e. 1 2 Q A ll right, is this an un u s u all y lon g and 3 detailed in s pe c tion report by comparison to mor e 4 routine reports that we would find for the f acility ? 5 A I would say it is a longer report, yes, 6 because it involves more individuals than are 7 routinely involved with ins pe ction s. 8 It is a t e m in in s p ec tion, you can count the 9 signatures, five diff erent people, at least, it appear : 10 to me were involved. 11 Q The report, its elf, is five pages long ? 12 A The copy you have handed me is numbered ( 13 th ro u g h 25 with some cover sheets on top of th a t. 14 Q Yes, is that a typical length for an 15 in s p e c tion r epo rt in your experience? 16 A No, I repeat, this is a longer report than 17 would be a routine report. 18 Q Were any viola tio n s found as a r e su lt of 19 this ins pe ction ? M A Yes, there were. 21 Q Now le t's turn to the cover sheet on the 22 report, it s elf, Mr. V a nD o o r n . U A Okay. 24 Q Did you participate in this in s p ec tion ? 25 A No, I did not. I was th er e during a p o r tio n . ! + A whitM esRGER ASSOC 8 ATE S. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CMARLDTTE. NORTH CAROUNA
O r VANDOORN - DIR E C T 110 3 1 of it, I b e li e v e the last, second week of the i 2 ins p e c ti o n. 3 Q You had not signed the report? 4 A I did not participate in the in s p e c tio n. 5 Q And you are not li s t e d as an Inspector on 6 the cover sheet? 7 A That's correct. 8 Q Will you turn to the third page, that is 9 a c tu ally Page 1 of the d e taile d portion of the report. 10 Do you see that? 11 A The 'irst page of the Details, yes. 12 Q Does that indicate your experience at the ( 13 Exit Int e r view ? 14 A Yes, it does. It is standard p r a c ti c e that 15 the R e side nt Inspector will attend Exit In t e rvi e w s if 16 possible for any in s p e ction s. 17 Q Can you t e ll me why you did not p a r ticip a t e 18 as an Inspector? 19 A Because I wa sn't assigned to the team. It 8 was a R e g io n ally directed eff or t. 21 Q Can we agree that a maj o r subj ec t of this 22 team in sp e c tio n was a r e view of the implementation 23 of Duke's Quality A s suranc e Prog ram ? 24 A "M aj o r s u b j e c t/ " I gY2 e s s that is a fair 5 d e s c riptio n. _ 5 avam main usocum. .mome wem.o ...vice. comorra. om c-ou. .
0 , VANDOORN - DIR E C T 111
- 2 1 Q All right, sir; if you would turn to Page 2, t
2 and f o ll owin g, does that reflect the ins pection 3 fi ndin g s on the subject as indicated "QA Program 4 R eview" ? 5 A Page 2 titled, "R e s ult e " it is d e t aile d. 6 Page 2 D e ta ils -- 7 Q Which paragraph? 8 A B e ginning with C. 9 Q We will strike that, it is paragraph number to five and a ll of the sub-paragraphs af ter that. 11 A Five is titled, " Site P r o g r a m" . What was 12 your que s tio n ab out the program? ( 13 Q Does that r efl e c t the inspection of those 14 areas? 15 A 1 would a s sume that it does. A gain, I 16 wa s n't involved in those matters of the in s p e c tio n. 17 M r. B ryant conducted the in s pe ctio n. It would be 18 more appr op riat e to ask him that qu e s tio n. 19 Q page 5, Sub D, does that reflect viola tio n s 20 issued, lack of' knowle dg e and understanding of NR C 's 1. 21 evaluation and r e p o r tin g r equir ements ? 22 MR. JOHNSON: Let me interject, you 23 are reading f rom the do cum ent. The 24 document speaks for it s elf. j
' M He has alr e ady said he did not ,
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VANDOORN - DIR E CT 112 i l 1 participate in the writing of this report. I 2 If you have qu e stion s relating to this, fine, 3 I would suggest asking him; but asking him 4 to t e ll you what he can read in the report 5 is a wa s te of tim e. 6 7 BY MR. GUILD: 8 Q Can you answer the que stion ? 9 A The report speaks for it s elf is the. answer. 10 Q Were you aware of the finding s ? 11 A I was aware of the findin g s of this report 12 of this in s p e c tion, yes. 1 13 Q Were you aware of this s p e cific fin din g, 14 this violatio n ? 15 A Yes, I don't know as Ican repeat the 16 details off the top of my head; but yes, I was well 17 aware. 18 Q And this was when you had first come on 19 the job, you had just begun as R e sident ? N A Yes. 21 Q Turn to Page 4, and I direct your 22 attention to the sub-paragraph entitled F. "Reorga-
'U nization. "
24 A Yes. 25 Q If you would study that, look at it. , ! +
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e i DIRECT 113 VANDOORN - i I f amiliaris e you r s elf with it. Were you awar e of the 2 reorganisation described in that paragraph? 3 A l'11 read, " February 1, '81, all Q u alit y 4 Control persons were transferred from the 5 C on s t ru ctio n D e p artm ent to the QA D epa rtm ent. " 6 I was aware of that reorganization, yes. 7 Q Did that appear to be a s i g nific a n t fact to 8 you as you arrived on site ? 9 A 1 think at that time it was certainly too p , 10 early to judge the eff ect s of h eo r ganization. I had 11 just arrived and, in fact, the fir st week in February 12 was my fir s t week on th e site; so at that time 13 obviously I would not be able to immediately judge I4 what a re or ganiz ation means. 15 Q In li ght of your knowledge and experience 16 since then, was that a significant event in your 17 judgment? 18 a pretty l A "Si gnific ant" is a broad t e r m, l 19 broad description of s ig nific a nt-- a maj or reorganization 20 we look at and we consider th e m s ignific an t, 21 considering what it m e an s. 22 I'm a s kin g you in your j ud gment do you now Q 2 consider that a significant e ve nt ? l , l V 24 MR. JOHNSON: I think he does not 25 understand what you mean by "sig nific ant. " _ f' EVELYN Bf mGE R ASSOCsATES. STENOTYPE peponTING seNvG. CHARLOTTE. MONTH CanOuMA ,
VANDOORN - DIR E C T 114 1 M R. GUILD: If you have an obj e c tio n. 2 please state it. 3 MR. JOHNSON: Just trying to help. 4 THE WITNESS: George is r e p e a tin g 5 what I was trying to say. Your definition 6 of significant is unclear to me. 7 8 BY MR. GUILD: - ' 9 Q As you understand the term, you are the 10 man who is e s s e ntially on site. 11 A I have to understand your definition of 12 th e term to answer the qu e s tion. ( 13 Q Im po r t ant, I can define it any way you l 14 would like . 15 A Im po r tan t, yes. 16 Q In the term " I n s p e c t o r," as used in this 17 report, who do you understand that to r ef er to? 18 Is that you? l I . 19 A Inspector is a term always referring to an 20 NRC Inspector. T e c hnic ally we try to say QA 21 Inspector when r ef e r ring to a Licensee Inspector. 22 Q Whoever was in volv e d in this pa rticula r 23 paragraph, it maybe any one of the individu al s which: e 24 signed the r e p o rt's cover page? 25 A y,,, _ r EVELYN SERGER ASSOCaaTES. STENOTYPd REPOsrTweG SamveCE. CManLDTTE. PeostrM CAmoussa
V e VANDOORN - DIRECT 115 i
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1 Q It could have been one of those NRC 2 in d i vidu a l s , it uses the term " Inspector reports " 3 technically, Inspector is referring to NRC Inspector. 4 As a r e s ult of this in s p ec tion, the 5 In s p e c t o r's findings, who is the Inspector ? 6 A I c ould n' t tell you from reading this 7 particular paragraph. 8 Q Who would know? 9 A M r. B r yant might be able to tell you; I'm 10 not sure. We use that as a broad term d e s c ribin g 11 an NRC person involved in the t e am. 12 That is typtral t e rminolo gy referring back ( 13 to an NRC Inspector. We have a number of In s p ecto-rs 14 involved in this pa rticula r piece of workt it could 15 be any one of th e m. 16 Q It could be one or more. Is it In s p ec to r 17 g e n e r i c a ll y or-- l 18 A It could be one or more, we don't i d e ri* C f y 19 each person, each and every paragraph where we 20 refer to the NRC on a team in s p e c tio n. 21 Q When one or more Inspectors are in volved. 22 would there be a s p e cific Inspector r e s pon s ibility M for a particular part of the in a p ec tion and also a 24 part of the in s p ection report? 5 A Yes, that would be appropriate, welding r gytLYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. .TENOTTPE pePONTweg s pygCE. CHARLOTTE. m CAROLANA .
& a DIR E C T 11 6 VANDOORN -
9 1 engineer perhaps would c over the w eldin g r e vie w, i 2 Q So it would f ollow that one of the li s t e d 3 Ins pector s .who signed th e report is probably 4 Indicated by that reference to the In s pe cto r ? 5 A I would say so, yes. 6 Q When you came on tha job, M r. VanDoorn, 7 were you aware of the o r g anizatio n of Duke Power 8 C ompany at the site as described in the o r gani z atio n 9 s e c tio n th a t appears on that same page? 10 A G e n e r ally, yes. 11 Q Were you aware of the "f amily" as the , 12 te rm is used in this report, relationship a mon g s t ( 13 persons at the Catawba site? , 14 A 1 don't know as I would d e s c r ib e it as that. 15 I was aware that they handled a great many things 16 internally. 17 It was their own-- d e s ig n, construction, and 18 so forth was all within Duke Power C om pan y, primar ily 19 within the Duke Power C o m p any; if that is what you 8 are r ef e r rin g to. 21 Q I' m looking at an NRC do cume nt that uses 22 the word "f a mily r elation s hip. " 23 A You should ask that of Mr. Bryant; the 24 m ea nin g of this report is more appropriately 25 addressed to him. , i EVELYM BERGER ASSOctATES. STE9eOTYPE REMHrfleee SERveCE. CMAIEDTTE. peostTM CANOLpeA
O , VANDOORN . DIRECT 11 7 l 1 Q T hi s report is either r e fle c tin g or not t 2 reflec ting info rmatio n that became available to you 3 immediately upon your a r rival on site and upon your 4 undertaking r e s po n sibilitie s as b ein g th e Senior 5 R e s id en t Inspector at tho site; and to that extent 6 these are things you had no kn owle d g e about at that 7 time. 8 It would be helpful if you would tell me, I 9 understand your r ela tion s hip to this report and this to report was available to you when it was pu bli s h e d ? 11 A C e rtainly; I read the report when I got it 12 and r e view e d the r e s ult s of the report. The report (' 13 did not come out until A p ril 10, so I did not have 14 an idea of the exact words which were going to 15 appear in the report until th e report came out. 16 Q What s i g nific a n c e did you att a ch to Duke's 17 organisation as designer, conductor and operator ? 18 A What significance do I attach to Duke? 19 Q Yes. 20 A To the fact that they are their own designe: r 21 and operator ? n Q Yes. 23 A I think in a broad sense it probably makes L' 24 for better coordination oI ' thYs e ac tivitie s . In that 25 sense I would say that it is positive. , r
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6 s w VANDOORN - DIR E C T 118 3 1 It doesn't make me look at them any less 2 s tr o n gly. 3 Q In your e xpe rienc e is Duke at the site less 4 f o r m ally structured than other utiliti e s because, as 5 stated here on Page 4.- 6 A I c an't c ompa r e them to a ll of the 7 u tilitl o s , the utilitie s I have been involved with. 8 I would say it is kind of a broad que s tion. 9 I would say that probably there is less 10 formalization of some activities; yes. 11 Q Does,the "f amily r elation s hip. " as the t e r rr: 12 is used here, have any negative im plic ation s in your ( 13 judgment? 14 A I am sure that I could conceive s omething 15 negative, you know, when you have less f o r m aliza tion 16 and someone is tru s ting another person. 17 In other words, you know, s o me thin g could 18 be amis s or s o me thing, I suppose. It does not 19 eff e c t ins pection s that much whether they are f amily 20 ,, 3, g , 21 It is not significant. It does not have any 22 significant eff ect on my degree of in s p e c tio n, I will 23
,,7, 24 I mean I still look at them very c a r e fully.
Q Were you aware of th e ob s ervation that ~. T EVELYN WE nGER ASSOCIATE S. STENOTYPE REPORTING SEBnt9CE. CMARLOTTE. NOsme CAROUNA
- s DIR E CT 119 VANDOORN .
1 1 appears in the f ollowing paragraph, same page, i 2 "Or ganisatio nal charts do not reflect exa ctly how 3 the or g a ni za tio n s f un c tio n" ? A W e ll, sure, at the time I read the report 4 5 af ter it was r ec eived by me; I can't r e c all, ob vio u s ly . 6 off the top of my head all che words; but g e n e r ally, 7 yes, I was aware of what was stated in the report. ' 8 Q And the major change of functions in 9 progress that is referred to in that same paragraph, 10 C or po r ate Quality Assurance rather than site 11 m ar.a g em e nt ? 12 A I b elie ve that is talking about the Quality ( C ontr ol personnel b e c o min g part of the QA Deyartmen t, n 14 whic h we discussed. Yes, I was aware of'that, as I stated 15 16 previously. 17 Q What is your understanding of the reason 18 for the February 1 transfer of QC personnel from 19 C on s t ruc tion to QA? 20 A W ell, Duke could probably give you an 21 answer as w e ll on that, probably more of the o v'e r - M all answer than I would. 23 But reason or not, 1 guess I would support 24 that move and therefore I f e lt just as a broad 25 initial j ud gme nt, that that probably was a good move .
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y -- VANDOORN - DIRECT 170 i 1 1, personally, prefer to have Quality 2 C ontr ol in the QA D e p a r tmen t. I think it shows mor e 3 independence. ,, 4 Anything that is better from a Quality 5 A s surance standpoint. I suppo rt. It is my 6 r e c oll ec tio n there wa sn't any r ea s on that they were 7 not properly p erf o rmin g their duties in the 8 C on s t ru c tion D ep ar tm ent; it is just that it was better 9 performed, in their mind s , under the QA Department , 10 Q What was your un de r s t andin g of the reason i
~
11 for the change? l 12 A Broadly as I r e c all, to be able to perform ( 13 the Quality Control functions better. This was 14 functional versus a d mini s t r a tiv e. 15 I don't know ex a c tly how Duke describes 16 these s p e c ific terms but I understand the admini-17 strators were functioning, reporting to QA. 1 18 They were e s s entially functionally r e p o r tin g
" to QA, so they brought them administrative 1y under 20 ,,gg, 21 I look upon that as po siti ve because it is 22 a more co n s e rvativ e approach.
23 Q What was the NRC'S role in initiating that 24 !
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' s VANDOORN - DIR ECT 121 3
1 decision, to my kn o wle d g e . 2 Q Was the transfer a r e sult of any dir e c tion 3 by the NRC? 4 A Not to my knowle d g e. 5 Q Any r e c o ra m e n d a ti o n by NRC staff ? G A Not to my knowle d g e. 7 Q What is the R e gulato r y requirement as you 8 und er s tan d it. M r. VanDoorn, independent of Quality 9 Assurance? 10 A They have to be independent. That does 11 not mean they cannot report a d mini s t r a tiv e 1y to a 12 construction o r g aniz atio n. ( 13 They just can't be the s ame person pe rf orm . 14 ing th e work. They have to be someone in s p e c tin g 15 the work and not p e r f o rmin g it. 16 Q And what is the R e gulator y basis for that? 17 I ask your Lawyer to allow you to answer the 18 que s tion as best you can. 19 MR. JOHNSON: W ell, I' m not sure he 20 is qualified to give a legal conclusion. 21 THE WIT N ES S : That is a ba sic M independent r equir eme nt, Appendix B, we M apply that independence as w e ll . L 24 We g e n e r a lly insist thr ou gh a ll our , i 25 r e vie ws of th e Quality A s suranc e P r o g ra m, .l j j evet= .enarn associans. sunenne ne omme nenvies.c unums. onm camouma .,c
VANDOORN - DIR E C T 122 _
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I th e r e is independence e s t ab li s he d. It is 2 second nature to know the y have to be 3 independent. 4 I can't quote the re gulatio n. 5 6 BY M R. GUILD: 7 Q Can you give m e, to the best of your under . 8 standing, th e de s c ription of the R e g ula t o r y require-9 ment to meet th e independence criteria ? 10 A I would state that the basis for Quality 11 Assurance is in A p p e n d i x. B, and I would state that 12 probably A p p e ndix B would require that independence ( directly and indirectly. 13 14 Q What I'm asking, Mr. VanDoorn, I am not l 15 trying to hold you to quoting verbatim f r om m e mo ry. 16 I' m asking for you to tell me to the be st of your 17 ability, to describe that R e gulato ry requirement, th e 18 one that you use as you walk around the job site is 19 not what you see when you look it up in the 20 regulations. 21 What is the shorthand d e, s c r i p t i o n of that l 22 R e gulato ry r e quir e m ent for independence, as it I 23 relates to Quality Assurance? l 24 A He has to be someone who is not pe rf ormin g i, 25 th e same work that he is in s pe ctin g and independenc o , r e.aoe. etnot a ASSOctATES. STENOTYPE REPOWTwee SEntCE. CMAsu.OTrt. MonM CAmouMA
VANDOORN - DIRECT 123 1 further implie s that he has to be, in fact, 2 independent. 0 You know, In other words he cannot let 4 C on s tru ction or wh a t e v e r dictate to him as to whethe r 5 something is acceptable or not. 6 It has to be in his r e vi ew or in s p ec tion. 7 an independent decision that something is acceptable 8 and not the people doing the c o n s tru c tio n. 8 Q Are you aware of the s p e cific provisions 10 of Appendix B with respect to Quality A s surance 11 c riteria ? 12 A Sure. ( 13 Q Are you aware of one or more c rite ria that 14 relate to the s ubj e ct of independence? 15 A I b eli e ve there is a s p e c ifi c criteria to 16 in s p e c ti on. I7 And that is the R e gulat o ry basis you have Q I8 just described in shorthand? I8 That is one of the Re gulato ry ba s e s. A 20 c e r tai nly. 21 Q Is it your judgment that that independent 22 c rit e ria, c rit e rion, is better served where Q u a lit y 23 C ontrol pers onnel report both functionally and b 24 a dminis tra tive1y to the Quality A s surance Department 25 - as opposed to the C on s t ruc tion D e par tm ent ? r
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e VANDOORN - DI R. E C T 124 1 1 A W o ul d you repeat that? 2 Q Sures in your judgment is the independence 3 criterion of A ppendix B better served where Quality 4 Control personnel report to QA for f.u n c ti o n a l and 5 administrative purposes? 6 A You are a s kin g for a personal opinion, I 7 would say yes; I would prefer Quality Control to be 8 within the QA D e p artm e nt. 9 Q All right, sir; describe in general terms 10 your understanding, M r. VanDoorn, of how at the 11 C atawba site the Quality C ontrol ir spection function 12 of the company's Quality Assurance Program is ( 13 conducted? 14 A I think it is being co nducte d s a tis f a c t orily. 15 Certainly we have occasional violations, but we 16 identify where there have been s ome breakdowns. 17 Yes, Q I was n't asking for a value j ud gm e nt l 18 about good or bad or indif f e r ent. I was asking about 19 a functional d e s c ription of your unde r s tandin g of how 20 Q and A function is b e in g p e rf o rme d. 21 A You mean how it is set up? E Q Yes, what do the QA Inspectors do as part 23 of implementing their Quality A s s u.r a n c e Program and 24 how they are structured and how they do their work? U A We would have to get out the o r g a ni z a tio nal g avet . ea .ocwes. svenorne ==mmwe se=ves. c==orre. acam c.aoum - l . 1-.. ..,.-. . ____---. =.___ _ ..- _ .. .- - -- - - . - . . . . - - . _ - . - . . - . - . - - . . - - . . - - - - _ _ .-
O q VANDOORN - DIR E C T 125 i! I charts and everything else. We have them assigned l 2 in s p e cific areas and trained in s p e cifi c areas, and 1 3 a chain of command just like any other organisation ' 4 with specifle inspectors assigned to welding inspectic a 5 and electrical. 6 They are s plit up by areas, s p e cialtie s, 7 and that chain of command obviously goes up through 8 several levels of QC In s pe ction on up to M r. G rie r. 9 Q Yes, that is helpful. .W h a t is, in your 10 judgment, the primary re s ponsibility of a QC 11 Ins p ec tion ? 12 A To inspect in accordance with the Quality 13 Assurance P r o g r am. 14 Q What are they ins pectin g ? 15 A Thousands of it em s a ll through the various 16 construction processes, e v e r ythin g from R e c eiving 17 on thr ou gh the final w eldi n g in s p e c tion, if you are 18 talking about welding, electrical, in s ta lla tio n, many 19 steps in each of these. 20 Q What is the purpose of a Qu ality Control 21 Inspection in your j u dgm en t ? 22 A To provide assurance th at there is a q u a li ty 23 c on s tru c ti on, to assist in implementation of the ! L 24 Quality Assurance P ro g r a m. D Q How does a Quality Control Inspector, in . r EVELTN SENGER AStocaATES. STENOTTPE REPO8tTh.S SENVICE. CMAfu.DTTE. NO8rTM CAnouMA *
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i . VANDOORN - DIR EC T i 12 6 1 your understanding, id en tif y wo rkm an s hip at the 2 C at awb a site that is substandard? 3 A They have any numbe r of ways. G e n e r ally 4 it is done by hold points, processes where they will 5 e ith e r not sign that h old point or perhaps reject th e 6 particular it e m, dependent on what th e it em is. 7 Q Give me an e xa mple. 8 A There are other-- 9 Q Yes. 10 A G e ne r a lly that is it. 11 Q How do hold points work? 12 A Various documents issued which are r e q uir e d 13 to be signed by inspectors at various steps of the wa.y; 14 and there are variances on those that are hold points 15 that have to be signed or initialed by Inspectors. 16 Each of those blocks would be a hold point 17 or a fin al sign off point when it ju st has one 18 signature at the bott c m, for in s t an c e. 19 Q Do those s ignatur e s. reflect s atisf ac tory r e s ult s of an Ins pe ction at that hold point? 21 A B a s ic ally, yes, at that particular hold 22 point. Some documents have multiple hold points so 23 up to that point you would say that p a r tic ula r hold h 24 point is acceptable. 25 Q What is your understandinr of how a Q u a li t y EVELTN SE RGE R ASSOCIATES. NTENOTYPE REPO8mWG SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUMA
- s VANDOORN - DIR E C T 127 1
C ont r ol Inspector r efle c t s the re sults of an un s atis - 2 factory in s p ec tion ? 3 A I thought you just asked that in that he 4 r ej e c t s the pa rticula r i t e.m or at that hold point, or 5 he will no t sign for that hold point. 6 Q Let's stop at the fi r s t of those hold points , 7 he pe rf o rm s an in s p e c tion and decides th e r e s ult s ar <e 8 uns atisf ac to ry; he doesn't sign the hold point? 9 A Yes. 10 Q What happens then in your und er s t anding ? 11 A The particu1 Ar condition is corrected before 12 it gets signed. That is how it is supposed to work. ( 13 Q Who corrects the c ondition ? 14 A The people doing the co ns tru c tion g e n e r a lly, 15 Q y The individ ual .c y r af,t s m a n who is performing 16 the work? l 17 A It depends on who is doing the work, the 18
- individual d oin g the work.
19 Q What documentation is involved in the 20 Quality Control In s p e c tio n th at would c o n clu d e that 21 was an un s a tis f a ctor y in s p e c tio n at that particular 22 hold point? 2 A I can't begin to sit here and tell you about 24 every document involved in every hold point. 25 Q Ju st your explanation of how the program 9
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t 4 128 VANDOORN - DIRE C T i l l l I works g e n e r ally. l, 2 A Some documents provide hold points where 3 the inspector simply does not sign, and it is not 4 signed u n t il it is acceptable. 5 There are other do cum e nt s which he r ej ects 6 c olum n s , which he, in fact, rejects it and goes to 7 the ne xt c olum n and repair is done, and he accepts 8 or rejects it again. 9 It depends on the p articula r item in vo lv e d 10 as to how that is handled. There are o th e r d o c um e nt o 11 which esn id e ntif y-- the r e is what you c all a say 12 Non c o nf.or min g item Repo rt. which ie , in essence, ( 13 we had a problem here and we need to e v alua t e it. 14 There may be a case where you are not 15 r e ally covered well with a hold point or some issue 16 they are not sure of. 17 And there are other documents that you can 18 use to get answers, l'n s p e c t o r Discrepancy R e po rt s, 19 and Nonconf orming Item Reports. 20 They can identify a p r oblem to be evaluated. 21 Q 13 it your understanding that documentation 22 is required to be maintained r eflectin g each ins ta nc e 23 of uns atisf actory work that le reflected by a nam ed b 24 in s pe c tion ? l 25 No, not n e c e s s a rily. It depends on th e , A r EVELTM SFRGE R ASSOC 8ATES. STENOTYPE RSPOfrT19eG SERvlCE. CMAfE.DTTE. feORTM CAROUNA
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 129 y 1 it e m. 2 Q What is your under s tanding of the 3 documen t ation r e quir em e nt s of the Appendix B, 4 Quality A s surance ? i 5 A Broadly I would say there has to be 6 sufficient documentation to p r o vid e reasonable 7 assurance that there has been quality construction 8 at the site. 9 There are varying degrees of qu alific a tion s 10 required depending on the particular item and the 11 particular in s pe ction, _ obviously. 12 Q What is the purpose of documenting ( 13 substandard workman ship ? i j 14 A W e ll, there are several purposes. One is i 15 i obvious 1y to make a p ro p e r , w o r km an s hip, acceptable 16 w o r kma n s hip by th e tim e it is completed. 17 And secondly, there are certain e v alu a ti on s 18 that have to be done to see what caused that if it is 19 a s i gnific ant problem; and in some cases take 20 preventive a c tio n so you don't have the problem again , 21 It would depend on the s ig nifi c a nc o of the 22 is sue. R e tainin g hold points would not n ec e s s a rily get--s ach of them wouldn't nec e s s arily get a cause b 24 in preventive e v al u a ti o n. 25 Q Would you arree r e n e r ally in f lu e m tn j eveu. .. .. .ocians. sve-oms ==mariaa ==='ca canaiorra ao= c^=auaa -
e r VANDOORN - DIR E CT 130 1 1 imple m e nt a proper program of docum entation of 2 substandard work could r e s ul' in f ailure to accomplis h 3 both of the s e purposes that you just mentioned ? 4 A I don't think do cumentation nece s s arily 5 m ak e s work good. 6 Q ye s, 7 A But I would agree that im p r o p e r do c um e nta - 8 tion of significant problems could lead to incomplete 9 e valu a ti on s . 10 g y.., 11 A Which would perhaps lead to the same 12 problem recurring, and we require that they evaluate ( 13 o ig nific a nt c o n d itio n s adverse to quality so that 14 p o r ti o n of A pp en dix B, if improper d o c um e n t a ti o n is 15 found it may not be able to be met. 16 Q How does Duke at C at awb a document I7 significant c ondition s adverse to quality during 18 c ons truc tion ? 19 A G e n e r a lly through the N on c o nf o r min g Item 20 Reports P r o g r am. They have a QA procedure. 21 Are you aware of weakne s s e s that have Q 22 occurred at C atawba in the implementation of the l l-23 Program for documenting n on c o uie r min g items ? b 24 A Yes, I am. 25 Q Would you describe it for us g e n e r ally ? - T i i , EVELYM SE NGE R ASSOCaATES. STENOTTPE REPORTWe8 SERVICE. CMA8EAFTTE. MO8MM CAROUNA s - - - - + . , - - ., , . , , , , - _ - . _ _ , , . - _ _ _ _ _ _ , _ , _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ , , _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ___ __ _ ,
' s DIR E C T 131 VANDOORN -
Y 1 A We found and identified several violations 2 relating to in a d e qu at e no nc onf o rmin g item d ccum e nta-3 tion. Initially those were a part of that in s p e c tion 4 I b eli e v e you are looking at in front of you. 5 Q Yes. 6 A P r im a rily they involved documentation 7 r ath e r than any s i g nifi c a nt inadequate c on s t ru c tio n. 8 As a re sult of those violations, they reviewed 9 th ou s a nd s upon. thousands of previous NCIs to make 10 sure they hadn't mis s ed s o me thin g. 11 Q What 'wa s the nature of the we akne s s in the 12 N on c o nf o r mi n g Item Report system? 13 A D e alin g with documentation, the complete 14 story was not contained in the document, in the NCI 15 docum ent. 16 Ev er ythin g that had been done to evaluate 17 it was not d o cum ent e d; and of course we require 18 p r e tty good documentation of their e v alu a tio n s . I 19 We d e t e rmined th r ough discu s sions with 20 people, as I r e c all, and M r. Bryant again could 21 address s p e c ifi c issues in that report as well; my
" und er st a nding is that we found that they had, in 23 fact, qu ality c on s tru ctio n; but that it was p ri m a r ily 24 a d o c um e n t atio n problem rather than significant 25 har dw ar e p r o bl e m. ,
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. VANDOORN - DIR EC T 132 i .
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t Q How did you reach that conclu sion ? i 2 A Interviewing, f ollow up in spec tion s, review 3 of s pecific hardware involved, thos e type s of efforts 4 concerning each of the violatio n s . 5 Q Those are de t a il e d in the in s p e c tio n reports 6 and f ollow up documents ? 7 A Ye s, there was f ollow up in s pec tion s of 8 each of tho s e viola tion s. I continue to r eview 9 num e r ou s NCIs. We did identify violations in that to area early in my tenure at C at awba. 11 It was one of my p rim a ry dutie s to review 10 N CI s since we had identified p r oblem s there. ( 13 Q Did weaknesses and problems with company' s 14 nonconforming it em process recur? 15 A I would say yes, we had further violations 16 identified in a broad sense which involved noncon. 17 forming it em s . 18 As a r e s ult of my c o ntinuin g review of NCIs , 19 as I said, which I began doing very soon ir. my tenur e 20 at C atawb a. As a re s ult of that in s pe ction very soon 21 af te r I was at C atawb a, I began r e vi ewin g every NCI 22 written; and I'm t alkin g about thousands of NCIs 23 because it was an area that we wanted to make sure
- 24 was appropriately corrected, and you will find severa,1 i 25 additional violations identified in subsequent re po rt s. .
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8 i VANDOORN - DIR E CT 133 i 1 Q Are you f amilia r with the S ILP reports 2 relative to the company? 3 A A Systematic In s p a c tio n of Licensee 4 Perf ormanc e--ye s, I am. 5 Q The fir s t SILP report, M r. V an Doo rn, 6 NU R EG / 0 8 3 4 -- 7 A The NUREG is not a SILP report conducted 8 per NUREG. Thst is the n u m be r of the report. 0834. 9 Q Oh, that was the broad one is sued from 10 W a s hin g t o n; and I direct your attention to A pp en dix 11 B of that report; and d o e s :-t h a t reflect the finding s 12 of the S.IL P Review Board for Catawb a ? ( 13 A I should state this SILP review was done 14 before my a s signm ent to C at awb a. I was not 15 actively involved in this particular r e vi e w. 16 As I r e c all, Mr. Bryant has come here to 17 address more broad, o ve r a ll S ILP reviews as it 18 r elate s to C a tawb a. 19
- But I was aware of the re sult s of this S ILP ;
20 and obviously, in doing the next SILP which I was 21 involved in, I did review this one. 22 Q Were you aware of the finding that C a t a wb a
" received a r ela tiv ely large number of items, 24 nonc o nf o rma n c e, when compared with othe r reactor 25 -
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d VANDOORN - DIRECT 134 1 1 A I was aware of that. i 2 Q Does that refer to the NCIs we have just 3 talked about? 4 A No, the SILP b a s ic ally looks at NRC 5 violations. 6 Q Violations issued by the NRC? 7 A Yes. 8 Q There were numerous items of nonconf orman ce 9 involving f a ilu r e to f o llo w procedures in concrete 10 placement, design records control, and electrical 11 e quipm e nt in s t alla tion. 12 Are you a*w a r e of that f inding ? ( 13 A Yes. 14 Q Were you aware th at there were a large 15 number of NCIs at C atawba ? 16 A Yes. 17 Q And that there continued to be large 18 numbe r s of NCIs at C a ta wb a past the period for the 19 S.I L P One Report through the period you came on sito 8 as R e s ide nt Inspector? 21 3 y,,, 22 Q What was Duke's response to the large 23 numbe r of NCIs observed? 24 A I don't know as we s olicite d a response 25 regarding th e number of NCIs. We did s olicit a -
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VANDOORN - DIR E C T 135 1 1 response as to how they were going to be adequately 2 h an dle d. 3 There was some discussion. I b elie ve , of 4 various methods that you can take to ensur.e proper 5 handling of NCIs. Bryant could maybe further add to that 6 Mr. ; 7 but c e rt ainly when you have large numb e r s there is 8 a po s sibility that w ould dilute the qu alit y of the 9 r eview s that have to be conducted. 10 We did, I did c e rtainly later on, discuss 11 num be r s : that there ought to be maybe at least a 12 consideration to reduce the numbers. ( 13 You see th e NCI Program was very broad 14 at Catawbal it covered a lot of minor things as well 15 as ma j o r, so w e, in instances where the significant 16 things were not evaluated properly--that was the 17 o y,, g g rog,, 18 If we dilute that with minor things, th e r e 19 is a p o s s ibilit y you are not spending enough ti m e on 20 the significant things, and I did request the Licensee 21 to consider that aspect for imp ro ve m e nt. 22 When did you do that, M r. VanDoorn? Q 23 A P r ob ably fairly early in '81. 24 And in what manner did you do that? l Q 25 As I r e c all, it may have been primarily A . l
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y l VANDOORN - DIR E C T 136 1 1 v e rb a lly : I don't remember if we put anything in 4 2 writin g or not. 3 I don't recall. We would have to research 1 4 it to find out. 5 Q Who would you have talked tog do you r e ca ll ? 6 A Probably Quality Assurance M an a g em e n t. I 7 would expect that Site Q u a li t y Assurance Management 8 and on up through maybe M r. G rie r had some of 9 the s e discu a sion s. 10 Q Who would that be, if you would id e n tif y 11 the people we are talking about? 12 A David s on, Mo r g an, M r. Henry M organ works (' 13 in Ch a rlo tte for M r. G rier. 14 Q Larry David s on ? 15 A Yes. I 16 Q What was his position at th at time ? ! 17 A He held two dif f e r e nt positions when I was j 18 at Catawba. At one point he was at their Corporate i l 19 Offices and he is now the Sit e Quality A s suranc e l l 8 Manager. 21 I don't recall his title when he was wo r kin g 22 for M r. Grier in the Corporate O ffic e. 23 MR. GUILD: Counsel, maybe if you 24 could h elp--M r. D a vid s on 's po sition ? 25 M R. GIBSON: I don't know M r. _ 5
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! VANDOORN - DIR E C T 137 9 1 1 D avid s on's position at this point in time 2 being referred to.
3 THE WITN ESS: Are we considering 4 adjourning at 5:00 and reconvening later? 5 M R. GUILD: Your C li e n t wants to 6 talk to you. 7 (Discussion off the R e cor d. ) 8 9 BY MR. GUILD: 10 Q Mr. V a n D o o r n(( 5 a n t e d to find a list of 11 A p plie: a n t 's identification of QA people who have been 12 involved and w orked at C at awb a. ( 13 And I want to show you their Response 14 dated March 25, 1983, and it is in Answer to 15 Interrogatory li s tin g QA p e r s o n n e 11 and if you would, 16 sir, examine th at and if you can find the people we 17 are talking about and their title s , I wish you would 18 read it fo r the Record (indicating). 19 You identified fir s t these a r zt p e o ple with 20 whom you spoke ve rb ally just concerning r e s olu tion 21 of the volume of NCIs. t 22 And you mentioned Larry David s on. If you I 23 would identify Larry D avid s o n 's po sition as r e fle c t e d 24 in that do cument .at that time ? t 1 l 25 A He has two title s here, Senior QC Engineer . 9
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'i VANDOORN - DIR E C T 138 1
and QA Manager, Pr oj e ct. 2 Q As far as the time frame, I believe there 3 is a time Irwi t c a ti o n there at the time you are t alkin g 4 about. 5 A S e nio r QC and QA Manager, Project, from 6 3/1/81, to present. Present would be the date of 7 this do c um e nt. 8 Q Do you know what Mr. D a vid s on 's current 9 position is with the company ? 10 A I wo uld c all him the Site QA M a na ge r. 11 Q At C atawba ? 12 A Yeah. ( 13 Q Is he now assigned to Cattwba as far as 14 you know? 15 A Y e c. 16 Q And he was f orme rly at the C h a rl ott e 17 O ffi c e and now back at the site ? 18 . A He was at C a t a wb a., initially over QC 19 . In s p ec to r s , as I rec all the r eo r g aniz ation took place P N' and he went to the Corporate for a short period of 21 ti me , came back to the site ther eaf te r as the Site 22 QA M an a g e r. M Q And that is where he is now? ) 24 A Yeah. 25 Q Okay: Mr. V a n D o o rn , you were beginning to g svaten esaosa associatus. sesmonas nePoarme seavice. cwaaens. woam camouma l
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l VANDOORN - DIR E C T 139
! 1 l
1 t e ll me the other QA hi a n a g e m e n t that you talked to. 2 A As I r e c all, W. O. Henry would be aware 3 of the problems regarding NCIs. 4 Q I' m interested, for c la r i t y, M r. VanDoorn, 5 people that you re c a ll speaking with or d e a lin g with 6 directly on this qu e s ti o n. 7 A I r e c a ll talking to M r. Henry about the 8 l NCIs. 1 9 Q Who was M r. Henry; what is his po s ition ? j 10 A Title s, a ga in, QA M a na ge r, C on s t ru c tion, 11 11/1/ 7 8, to 7/1/82. He pre s ently carries a diff e r e nt 12 title, QA Manager, Technical Services. 3/1/81, to k 13 p r e s e nt. 14 I believe I also stated Mr. George G rie r, 15 Corporate QA M ana ger. l 16 Q Wh a t was Mr. G rie r 's position at the time , II we are talking about here? 18
, A Co rporat e Q' A , M a n a g e r , I believe. R. G.
I8 G rie r, 2/1/81, to present; and the r e is a Mr. Morgan , R. A. M o r gan. 21 L e t 's see if he is on your lis t here. I 22 d on ' t see him on this pa r ticular list. He is a 23 Supervisor within the Qu alit y A s surance Department b 24 on the s it e. b Q Do you know M r. Y. R. Wells ? _ EVELYN SERGER ASSOC 8AftS. STENOTYPE REPOaf7)NG SERygCE, CMA3EANTE. SOCMWH CANOUNA
VANDOORN - DIRECT 14o 1 A Yes, I do. 2 Q Who is M r. Wells ? 3 A He is the former Corporate QA Manager. 4 He was replaced by M r. G rier at the beginning of my 5 assignment to Catawba; so I r e ally haven't had any 6 d e alin g s with him. per se. 7 Q Did you me e t M r. G rier ? 8 A Yes. 9 Q Did you me et him in c o nn e c tio n with your 10 duti e s as Resident Inspector? 11 A Yes, many tim e s . 12 O Since he has left the posit on of Corporate ( 13 QA M ana ge r--you said M r. Wells or Mr. G ricr ? 14 I' m sorry, M r. W ell s . 15 A I had met Mr. W ell s , yes. ;
- Q In connection with your dutie s as R e sid ent I7 In s p e c to r ?
I8 A I don't r e c all any discussions with him I8 regarding my duties as R e sident Inspector. 20 " Q Why did Mr. W ell e leave that po sition; do 1 21 you remember ? I 22 A Duke had better answer that. It was my 23 und e r s ta ndin g he was assigned to the IMPO group in b 24 A tlanta to assist construction in s pe ction efforts there . 25 Q Did Duke provide any written response to g)
s v VANDOORN - DIR E C T 141 'I 1 your knowle d g e, M r. VanDoorn, to your discussions 2 or com nents or input on the qu e s ti on of NCIs ? 3 A This was a written response to each and 4 every violation involving NCIs; yes, sir. 5 Q That is not what I'm s p e a kin g of; but your 6 dicu s s io ns about minimizing the excessive numbers of 7 NCIs, as you described for minor m a tt e r s-- 8 A I don't r e c a ll s p e cific written answers to 9 that su gge stion. 10 Q Do you r e c a ll any written responses 11 wha ts o e ve r ? 12 A To responses f rom NCI concerns? 13 Q No, to s pe cific r eplie s to NCIs ? 14 A Yes, they were id e nt if yin g the numbers and 15 attempting seme sort of r e du c t io n in the nu m be r s . 16 They did take that s u g g e s tion and consider to make 17 some attempt to reduce the number s. 18 Q Was that response reflected in a writing, 19 in a document ? 20 A I would expset there are documents maybe 21 that relate to numbe r s of NCIs within Duke. I can't 22 tell you what th e y are at this point. 23 Q I guess I'm looking for, if you know and if b a4 you don't, say so; but you presented this guidance i 25
-to the m ve rb a lly and identified these num b e r s of h j EVELYN etnGem ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPO8rTING SS NWeCE. CMA8ERTTE. 3808FFM CAROLAPaA
r VANDOORN - DIR E C T 142 1 I people; and this is an important subject as you have
- 2 identified.
l l 3 My que s tion is did Duke's re s po ns e take a i l I 4 written form ? Is there some way a side f rom the oral l 5 or verbal exchanges you may have had whereby we 6 might see some r e fle c ti o n of Duke taking to heart 7 your .su g g e s tion s ? 8 A There was much written responsa to the 9 proble m s with N C 1's doin g better evaluations. Our a 10 key point wa s- do the p ro pe r. e valu ation s and document 11 properly what you do. 12 That was the key issue. The fact that they ( 13 perhaps could do a better job if they had less 14 numbe r s was not n e c e s s a rily key to this issue. 15 It was a professional s u g ge s tion that they 16 ought to consider that. 17 Q Well, on your part-- l l 18 A Yes, to my knowled ge on my part and maybe ' 18 by others within the NRC as w e ll . 20 Q Now we find s o me written answers and 21 responses by Duke to s p e c ific viola tio n s th at related 22 to NCIs; correct? 23 A (The Witne s s nodded his head af firmatively, t 24 Q Beyond those which are possibly available 25 and have been id e n tifie d , what I'm trying to understa nd . 9 EVELYN SENGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPowTwee SEnveCE. CHAflLOTTE NORTM CAmouMA
VANDOORN - DIR EC T 14 3 1 1 is are there any other documents that you know of 2 that would r efle ct Duke's response to your 3 professional s u g g e s tion s on this subj ect ? 4 A Off the top of my head, I ar not aware of 5 do c um e n t a tic a specifically talking with number s of 6 NCIs. 7 Q How about anything beyond the f ormal 8 responses to notic e s of violations on the subject of J 9 N CI s that would refleck Duke's response to your 10 s ug ge stion s ? 11 A I'm sure Duka has internal documenta I' m 1 12 not aware of. 13 Q Do you know of any that would reflect their 14 response to this d ocument ? 15 A My p r e vi ou s response r efle c t s , refers to 16 this que s tio n. 17 Q Whid is ? l 18 A Whia is I'm not aware of s p e cific 19 documentation of Duke's talking about numbers of 20 N CI s. 21 MR. GUILD: Counsel, we seem to 22 have reached pretty close to five o' clock, l 23 and I suggest we have a Record discussion l 24 or go off the R e C% d ; but the plan was to 25 try to take an hour's recess before Messrs. - '
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EVELTN SEstGER ASSOCIATWS. STENOTTPE 88EPOEUTHee SEfrWCE. CHARLOTTE. JeOsrTH CAnouma
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1 > A 1 Mc Af ee and Hoopengardner. i 2 A nd the que stion is when do we resum e 3 in the mornin g ? We can discuss that off 4 the Record af te r we a dj ou rn with M r. 4 5 M c G a r r y, who has stepped out of the room 6 and Mr. Carr. 7 M R. GIBSON: There is one thing I 8 want to correct if you are finie he d. When 9 you referred to the M arch 2 5, 1983, 10 Responses of A pplicant to Interrogatories, 11 in looking at the R e s pons e s, M r. Grier 12 noted a.date "tha [ks not correct, and I ( 13 want to correct th at. 14 It is on Page 19 or 20. The date that 15 M r. W e ll s left the position of Corporate 16 QA Manager should be 2/1/82; and the date 17 Mr. Grier as sumed that position should be 18 2/1/S2 i The R e s 'p o n s e's indic ate 2 /1/ 81, 19 N r e s p e c tively. 21 M R. GUILD: All right, thank you; 22 and let me just f ollow up th at. That is 23 h elpf ul. b ' 24 MR. GIBSON: Yes, I wanted to get M that in before we fini s h e d. . svgLTw gemotR ASSOCIATES. STEMOTYPE REPO8rTING SE RVICE. CDeamLDTTE. MORTM CAROuhA .
- y 145 VANDOORN - DIR E C T
-1 1 BY MR. GUILD:
i 2 Q In light of that c o r r e c tio n, the case that 3 Mr. W e ll s was the Corporate Manager sometime whils 4 you were R e sident Inspector-- 5 A He was there s ometime, but I didn't have W ells . l 6 a lot of c on ve r s ation with M r. 7 Q But he was Vanager of Quality Assurance 8 for Duke Power for a year while you were on s 15.e ? 9 A Yes. Would Mr. Wells be included among those 10 Q 11 with whom you talked on the subj ect of NCIs ? 12 A I quit e ho n e s tly don't remember talking ( 13 directly with M r. W ell s concerning NCIs. I very 14 w ell may have. 15 There have been numerous dis cu s s io n s on 16 NCI p roble m s . Obviously it was a key issue. 17 C e r t a inly M r. Bryant and his team talked with him 18 because th e e s tablis hm e n t of that was the key issue. 19 And he was available to receive the r e s ult s 20 of that particular t e am ins pe ctio n. I would very 21 much expect that Mr. W e ll s was also aware of 3 perhaps the need to review as to wh e the r they had U too many NCIs. 24 Q - You just don't r e c a ll a s p e cifi c c onve r s ati on 25 with him 7 a EvtLTN SG AGER ASSOCIATES. STEpsOTYPT REPONTING SSNylCE, CMARLOTTE. f*OWTM CAmo.Joen
y VANDOORN - DIR E CT 1dA , 1 A I d on 't r e c all, no. 2 MR. GUILD: A ll right, shall we go 3 - off the Record? 4 M R. GIBSON: Before we adjourn, I 5 wanted to--it is not clear to me whether 6 the s tipuittio n as to the taking of this 7 De po s itio n as executed between you and Mr. 8 Guild and M r. Johnson was f o rm ally sppend od 9 to the D e po sition; I don't recall. 10 If it was, then my bringing it up is 11 s u p e r flu o us . A re we goin g to append this 12 stipulation to the D e po sition ? ( 13 It was my original under s t sading it 14 was to be appended .but I d on ' t remember 15 that we had discussed it. 16 M ll, JOHNSON: We will append a copy 17 of the tr ans cript, and I was intending to 18 serve this on the Partie s so it would be 19 before th e Board. 20 M R ., GIBSON: I don't think this is 21 any problem with appending a copy to the 22 D e po sition. 23 M R .. GUILD: Do you want to c all this b 24 an Exhibit ? 25 M R .. JOHNSnN: T hi s would be three. . 9 EVELYN SENGE R ASSOCIATE S. f"TENOTYPE REPOHTING SERWKE. CHAMLOTTE NOfrTM CAROUNA .
4 7 147 3 1 (Whereupon, the document 2 referred to as s tipulation as to metho<i 3 of taking and use of Depositions was 4 marked and received by th e Court 5 R ecorder as VanDoorn Deposition 6 Exhibit 3 and entered into the Record. ) 7 8 MR. GUILD: Ju st before we leave the 9 Record, notwithstanding which s pe cific 10 Witne s s order we can s ettle off the R e c ord, 11 do we agree, M r. VanDoorn and M r. B rya nt 12 will be made available fo r th e c omple tion ( 13 of thes e Depo sitions ? 14 M R. JOHNSON: They will be available 15 to m o r r ow. 16 FURTHER T H. E DEPONENT SAITH NOT. l 17 l l l 18 (Whereupon, th e Deposition was 19 adjourned at 5:15 P. M. ) 20 21 22 l l 23 l 24 23 Y gvgLTN gam 4Em ASSOCsATES. STSNOTYPG REPORTwnB SamvtCE. CHAMTTE. m CAWM .
A 4 # 14 8 __ , 1 1 Peter K. VanDoorn, hereby c e r tif y that I 2 have read and understand the f or e g oing transcript 3 and b eliev e it to be a true, accurate and complete 4 transcript of my te s timony. 5 6 Peter K. VanDoorn 7 8 . 9 T hi s De po sition was signed in my presence by 10 Peter K. VanDoorn on the day of 11
, 1983.
12 ( 13 Notary Public 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 b 24 23 Y EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTWN3 SEh*:2. CHARLOTTE. nom CANOLaNA .
r-4 i j= l a 1 C E R T I F I C A T E 2 STATE OF NORTH C A R O LIN A 3 COUNTY OF M EC K LEN BU RG 4 I, Lynn B. Gilliam, do hereby c e r tif y that th e 5 proceedingr were by me reduced to machine short-6 hand in the presence of the Witn e s s e s , af terwards 7 transcribed upon a typewriter by me, p e r s o nally; 8 and that the foregoing is a true and correct 8 transcript of the proceedings. 10 I further c e rtif y that these proceedings were 11 taken at the time and place in the foregoing caption 12
. s p e c ifie d.
( 13 I further c e rtify that I am not a r e la tive , 14 counsel or attorney for eithe r pa rt y or o th e rwi s e 15 interested in the outcome of this action. 16 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my I7 hand at C ha rlot t e, North C ar olin a, on this the 18 day of June, 1983. 19 20 21 LYNN B. GILLI A M g C ou rt Reporter b 24 3 My commis sion expires 5/12/88. i-E WELTee SEPGER ASSOCEATES, STENOTYPE REPORTwetB SENvtCE. CMAfE.OTTE. feONTH CAROUNA ,
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