ML20129H715
| ML20129H715 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Vogtle  |
| Issue date: | 05/07/1996 |
| From: | NRC OFFICE OF INVESTIGATIONS (OI) |
| To: | |
| Shared Package | |
| ML20129H719 | List: |
| References | |
| FOIA-95-211 NUDOCS 9611040014 | |
| Download: ML20129H715 (41) | |
Text
- _ _ - _ . . - - .. - . . . . - . .. .. . . - - - .- . - - ..
OFFICIALTRANSCRIFT OF PROCEEDINGS i
7 et a
1
.4
.~ .. ..
vr
. - - ~ . -- ... -... .
, 4 1 -
I N U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission 3
l 1
Title:
rneervi.w or marcel c. wilkins 4! -
l 1
- . s
, Docket No. .
{il
. J. .
x
- l. ,9 ~" ' -
- - ;f.;
- .; 5.; -- v; . gp ..y ' . .g t
- > . .; n t-y.s
.;y i tOCADOtt WA7885b0r0i GA ' . J
. . .r. a.v .'
+1 OAm May 7, 1992 prom 1 - 39 ,
4 l 4 *
- a. 1
.rA ,
j f .- 4 ,.*
v.
< - ' -l~X;. .. i 1
.A.. .14 0.1 l
1
,;: s-
,g.,
- hiN REEY& A$SOCMM, erd. !
1 1612 Ka.N.W.Sube 300 l Mddnpon,D.C.20006 )
(202) 295-3950 9611040014 960827 PDR FOIA 4
. ._KOHN95-211 _ PDR ._, , _ . _
Page 1 BEFORE THE U. S. NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION l
In the Matter of: )
)
INVESTIGATIVE INTERVIEW OF )
)
MARCEL CHRISTOF WILKINS )
Conference Room Administration Building Vogtle Electric Generating Plant Waynesboro. Georgia i i
Thursc'ay, May 7, 1992 1 l
The above-entitled matter convened for INVESTIGATIVE INTERVIEW, pursuant to notice at 3:59 p.m.
APPEARANCES: i On behalf of the U.!f. Nuclear Reaulatory Commissions LARRY R. ROBINSON, Investigator U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Office of Investigations i Suite 2900, 101 Marietta Tower Atlanta, Georgia 30303 i l
-and-BRIAN BONSER, Senior Resident Inspector U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Vogtle Electric Generating Plant Waynesboro, Georgia On behalf of the Witness:
MARCEL C. WILKINS, Pro Se i
i
Page 2 1 PROCEEDINGS 2 MR. ROBINSON: Okay, for the record, this is'an 3 interview of Mr. Marcel Wilkins, employee of Georgia Power 4 Company at the vogtle Electric Generating Plant, Waynesboro, 5 Georgia. It is Thursday, May 7, 1992, the time is 3:59 p.m.
6 This interview is being conducted on site at the 7 Vogtle Electric Generating Plant. The nature of the 1 8 interview pertains to apparent falsification of data sheets 9 involved with a surveillance conducted by Mr. Wilkins and I 10 guess Mr. Davis.
11- Mr. Wilkins, do you have any objections to being 12 sworn to your testimony here today?
13 MR. WILKINS: No, sir.
14 MR. ROBINSON: Will you please stand and raise your 4
15 right hand?
16 Whereupon, ,
17 MARCEL CHRISTOF WILKINS I
! 18 appeared as a witness herein, and having been first duly i 19 sworn, was examined and te7tified as follows:.
20 EKAMINATION j 21 BY MR. ROBINSON:
22 Q Would you please --
23 MR. ROBINSON: Oh, also for the record, also 24 present at this interview are Mr. Brian Bonser, the Senior 25 Resident Inspector of the NRC here at the Vogtle plant, and d
i i
Page 3 1 my name is Larry Robinson and I'm with the Office of 2 Investigations of the NRC out of Region II. And as you can 3 see, this interview is being transcribed by a court reporter.
4 BY MR. ROBINSON:
5 Q Would you please state your full name and spell it 6 for the record?
7 A Marcel Christof Wilkins, M-a-r-c-a-1 Christof, 8 C-h-r-i-s-t-o-f Wilkins, W-i-1-k-i-n-s.
S Q And what'is your current job title here at Vogtle?
10 A I'm an instrumentation technician. l l
11 Q And how long have you held that position? )
12 A For approximately six years. l 13 Q And how long have you been an employee of Georgia 14 Power Company? ,
15 A Six years.
16 Q Has all of your employment been here at the Vogtle i
- 17 Electric Generating Station?
9 18 A In IEC, yes, sir.
19 Q On January 28 of this year, 1992, were you and Mr.
20 Davis engaged in conducting a surveillance in accordance with 21 Vogtle Procedure 24812-1?
22 A Yes, sir.
23 Q And if you would please, in your own words, just 24 describe to me what happened during your conduct of that 25 procedure?
I 1
l
Page 4 1 A Just in a roundabout way or --
2- Q No, just kind of specifically, chronologically 3 start from when you started executing the procedure and what 4 happened.
5 A Okay. J.D. was in the racks.
6 Q J.D. meaning Davis?
7 A Right. And I was transcribing information and 8 reading the procedure. It's a complicated procedure and it 9 has a lot of test equipment. So what I.was doing was reading 10 a'nd J.D. was doing. And we were going along just fine --
11 J.D. was calling out the values to me and I was writing them 12 down. Whin we got across that one bistable that was out, I 1 13 said wait a minute, you know, this one is out. J.D. says 14 well let me do it again. ,Wb' do it again, it was out.
15 Atthatpoint,kT;D. just wanted to tweak it in and 16 I said n,o. And J.D. -- I told J.D. we need to go to the 17 calibration portion of the procedure,and we went to the 18 calibration portion of the procedure and what the calibration 19 has you do is it has us put in different values in our decade 1 i
20 boxes.
21 Q Okay.
22 A Anh I started listing those values and J.D. -- I i 23 ddn't know, he didn't like that idea and he said let me see 24 the procedure. I gave him the procedure and he looked at the 25 data sheet, the specific data sheet because I told hLa that 1
i
Page 5 1 the values were different for the decade boxes. He' looked at 2 the cal. data sheet -- this one here --
3 Q For the record, I'll show you a sheet entitled 4 Analog Channel Operational Test Data Sheet 1. It is headed 5 VEGP 24812-1, Revision 16, page 92 of 158. It's titled Delta 6 T TAVG Loop 3 Protection Channel III, Sheet 1 of 3. And ask 7 you if you recognize that sheet.
8 A Yes, sir.
9 Q Are the handwritten numbers on that sheet in your 10 handwriting?
11 A Yes, sir.
12 Q All right. I will show you a handwritten reading 13 that is 10 lines down from the top indexed as 1TL/431H '
14 extinguished and over in the as-found column it shows a 15 handwritten reading of 4.130. Is that the out-of-calibration 16- reading that we're talking about here? ,
17 A Yes, it is.
18 Q Okay. Go ahead, you were saying that J.D. was 19 balking at going through the steps that you were planning on i 20 going through and he wanted to see the procedure. Go ahead 21 and go from there.
22 A He took the procedure and looked at the right-hand l 23 margin and said look, Marcel, it's not Tech Spec related. And 24 he said we can just tweak this in, and I'm going no, we 4
25 can't.
1 1
Page 6 1 Q What did you think had to.be done?
2 A The calibration procedure.
3 Q And is the calibration procedure itself contained 4 in 24812 or is it a separate procedure?
5 A It'll be in this one here -- it'll be here but then 6 it's also -- I'm not exactly sure. Can I look? I think 7 there's a field cal procedure also, 23300-C.
All right, go ahead. Which procedure did you think 8 Q 9 you needed to be going to,'the 23300?
10 A First of all, this one, we needed to go to the 11 right section in the procedure we currently had at that time.
12 Q Okay. For the record, I'm now referring to Vogtle !
l 13 Procedure 24812-1, Rev 16, page 22 of 138. I am referring to )
14 paragraph number 4.3.2.79 which states, and I quote, "If as-15 found readings are not within limits specified on Analog 16 Channel Operational Test Data Sheet.1, or more accurate 17 readings are desired, proceed as directed below."
I 18 Subparagraph (a) "If technical specification 19 allowable limits have been exceeded, notify OSOS and I&C 20 foreman to determine if TA equation in technical 21 specifications reactor trip system has been satisfied. Then 22 proceed as directed." l 23 Sy> paragraph (b) "If calibration limits have been l l
24 exceeded," which was your situation, correct? l 25 A Correct.
8 l
Page 7 1 Q "or more accurate values are desired, proceed to appropr! ate subsection." Now I notice in this procedure, it 2_
3 doesn't tell you what the appropriate subsection is. How do 4 you know what appropriate subsection to go to?
5 A Well you go and look at your -- well.this is how I
. 6 do it -- you go back here -- here it is -- we go to this. l 7 Q Let the record reflect that the witness went to l 8 page 87 of procedure 24812-1, which shows a dia' gram entitled j 9 Figure 1.
10 A And then what you do is you look at your number 11 here. ,
12 Q And that is the number on test data sheet 1.
13 A Right.
14 Q And you would want to know what card it was.
15 Q Okay.
16 A Because -- you'd want to know what NAL card it was.
17 So then you'd go to that number and you'd look around, what i
18 was that 431H -- 431H. If this was clearer, you could see 19 the NTC -- it's NAL bec'asse you'd know it's bistable. .
1 20 Q Yes, let the record reflect that the copy of the 21 procedure that we have is a little blurry. But that's the 22 page that you would find the appropriate subsection or the 23 card in which to go to?
24 A Well you'd want to find out what card it was.
25 Q All right. j 1
. o I
Page 8 1
1 A. Because when you're looking at the rack, you're not f 2 looking.at the card that you~need to adjust when you're doing 3~ this procedure. So you'd go to this and it'd give you a card 4 location number. Okay? Or you could do this, you could go l
5 and say okay that's 431H -- you'd probably do this first and !
6 then you'd go over to your data sheets and thumb through 7 them. This is the hard way. You could just look at the TL 8- and -- here comes an NAL -- I don't know what that number l 9 is -- is that TL or TB7 l 10 (The witness reviews a document.)
11 Q Looks like TB.
i 12 A Lead / lag.
13 Q So what you're doing is you are thumbing through 14 various data sheets that are appendixes to that procedura and 1
l
~ '
15 looking for the appropriate data sheet for the card in '
i
- 16 question? ,
! 17 A Right. What I would do first is go to the back of
- 18 that schematic and I would look, if it was clear and I wasn't I
19 so nervous -- I'd sit there and I'd look at my cross 4
20 reference, this number -- that number there.
l 21 Q Okay.
4 23 MR. ROBINSON: Yeah, ILT 431H.
24 THE WITNESS: Right. That's the -- represents a 25 bistable number and you'd go and look at that on the back i
Page 9 h
I here and --
2 'BY MR. ROBINSON:
3 Q I'm going to show you a Data Sheet 37 which refers 4 to a 1TB 431G or H.
5 A Uh-huh.
6 Q Would that have been the appropriate data sheet in 7 this case?
8 A Yes, uh-huh.
9 Q It would have. This da'ta sheet that I'm showing )
10 you now was the appropriate data sheet for the card in i 11 question?
12 A Yes.
13 Q Okay -- all right.
l 14 MR. BONSER: What did you do to determine at the l 15 time then that that was the appropriate data sheet?
16 THE WITNESS: Well that's what I was -- what you do 17 is that these numbers, they don't change. Let me do it for 18 you, let me just take a little bit of time here.
19 MR. ROBINSON: Okay, sure.
20 THE WITNESS: I hate to be telling you guys 21 something that isn't true or that you don't think I can do.
22 See, this is what was happening, I was going 23 through this and that may have --
24 BY MR. ROBINSON:
25 Q You think J.D. was becoming impatient? Did you
? .. .
i Page 10 1 perceive that?
I perceived that he wanted to get the job done.
4 2 A I
3 I wish I could read this.
4 Q Do you independently recollect it could have been a l
- 5 two-card?
6 A Excuse me, sir?
7 Q Does the phrase two-card mean anything to you?
8 A No, sir.
S Q It doesn't. I'm now referring to page 64 of that 10 procedure. Do you think that this -- and I'm po'inting to 11 paragraph 4.3.38. ,
12 A Uh-huh.
Which says signal comparator NAL two-card
~
13 Q 14 calibration, 1TB 431G/H, location cabinet QP -- what is that 15 S-3? ,
I 16 A Yeah, it was QPS-3.
17 Q Would that have been the appropriate location in l
18 the procedur.a to go to at that point?
19 A Yes, uh-huh. l 1
20 Q It would have? I don't want to put words in your 21 mouth.
22 A Oh, okay, well let me think about this.
23 Q Yeah, I don't want to put words in your mouth.
24 (Brief pause.)
25 Q That particular portion of the procedure matches 1
, . l Page 11 1 Data Sheet 37, but I want you to be sure in your mind if 2 you're on page 22 of the procedure and you get something 3 that's out of cal --
4 A Right.
5 Q -- and it says to go to the appropriate 6 subsection --
i 7 A Yes, sir.
8 Q -- I want you, you know, to be sure in your mind 9 that subsection 4.3.38 is in fact the appropriate section.
10 A Okay, well let me spend some time reading this.
11 I'll have to look at this, this diagram is kind of fuzzy.
12 (Brief pause.)
13 MR. BONSER: I'll see if I can find another one.
14 MR. ROBINSON: Yes, if you would, Brian, go see if 15 you can find a clearer set of that entire procedure 24812-1, 16 it appears to be 158-page procedure. And the page, the 17 clearer page that you might want to look for specifically is 18 page 88.
- 19 THE WITNESS
- And 87.
20 MR. ROBINSON: And 87.
21 (Mr. Bonser departs the room.)
22 BY MR. ROBINSON:
23 Q While we're looking for a clearer diagram, let me 24 ask you this. On the Data Sheet 37 that I have described 25- before --
i- e :* l f
Page 12 1
- 1 A Yes, sir. ;
I 2 Q -- are the numerical entries on '_his copy of that 3 data sheet your entries?
4
, 4 A Yes, sir..
4 5 Q. And the signature under " Performed by" in the lower !
6 right-hand portion of that data sheet, is that your 7 signature?
8 A Yes, sir.
?
Dated 1/28/92, is that correct?
[ 9 Q i
10 A Yes, sir.
11 Okay. Does this data sheet pertain to the system Q
i
! 12 that J.D. wanted to tweak?
1 *
- 13 A 'Yes, sir.
14 Okay. Tell me about the numbers that you entered
[ Q 15 in this data sheet. DD1'those numbers come from readings i
~
16 that J.D. made?
4 .
I 17 A No, sir, those numbers were fabricated by me.
1 18 Q Why? .
} . 19 A Because I never got any data.
! 20 Q And why didn't you get any data?
j I
21 A Because this portion of the procedure was never 22 done.
23 Q All right. AnS'why wasn't it done?
24 A It wasn't done for a couple of reasons.
25 Q Okay.
Page 13 1- A It wasn't done because J.D. was insistent upon 2 tweaking it in and at my saying I don't want to do this,;I's 3 not going to do this, he or we decided that he should go and 4 talk to Bob and one of us stay back there at the rack.
5 Q Bob being Bcb who?
6 A Neal.
7- Q And who is Bob Neal?
8 A My foreman.
9 Q Okay, so you left the area that you were in and 10 went to talk to Bob?
11 A Yeah, J.D. did. ,
12 Q Okay.
13 A I stayed there and J.D. came back and said Bob said 14 tweak it in.
15 Q Okay. i 16 A And he had a DC card in his hand.
17 Q J.D. did?
1 18 A Yeah.
I 19 So I sat there, you know., or whatever and Bob came 20 in, I believe it was Bob came in, and QC came in right after 21 that.
4 22 Q Okay.
23 A So --
24 Q Everybody's there, Bob and QC and you and J.D. 9 25 A Right. Bob was never really at the rack, he was Y
.e
4 0 i
i Page 14 f
l l 1 kind of behind it, a little bit to the side because it's a i 2 crowded aisle and we had a big cart and a lot of stuff on it.
3 Q Okay.
4 JL And so we were there and I think Bob took the DC ;
i S card from J.D. I had an impression it was already written. )
) 6 Q Do you have any idea why the DC card was written?
7 A Oh, yeah. )
I 8 Q Because you were out of cal? ;
S A Right.
10 Q Do you think that was appropriate that a DC card !
4 11 should have been written?
{ 12 A Yes, sir.
m 13 Q But when J.D. came back from Bob, he told you that
[ 14 Bob said to go ahead and tweak it in?
~
15 A R!ght.
16 Q And had you tweaked it in before Bob and the QC guy
, 17 came?
s 18 A No, sir.
! 19 Q Okay, go ahead. l 20 A S'o .'the QC guy comes in relatively quickly, Bob is ;
I 21 probably at the BS' desk. And4*srbante with the . data. I I
22 shest'"and'J.D. M arts talking to the QC fellow and goes into 23 telling him, this the light, this is the card right here and j 24 the QC fellow looks at the card and this is the as-found 1l 25 value.
l I
4
4 i
Page 15 1 Q Now when you're talking about the data sheet in
) 2 this case, you're talking about the Test Data Sheet 1, is i 3 that correct?
- 4 A They were all stapled together.
5 Q Okay, was Data Sheet 37 already in existence at
! 6 this time?
7 A No,-sir.
- 8 Q Okay. )
- 9 A But there's a whole bunch of data sheets and J
! 1 10 they're all stapled togethe'r. '
11 Q Right.. You had been doing a reading on a number of
. 12 bistables?
13 A Right. Well'we only actually use this Data Sheet 1 t
14 of 3 for the ACOT, it's probably got three data sheets just 15 for the ACOT and that's what we were doing, but we had the
]
- 16 others in case something goes out, then you go to the
! 17 appropriate subsection and find the card that's out and then 18 you calibrate that card --
l 19 Q I'll tell you what we'll do, we'll make it easier 20 on our court reporter. I'll sit over here and you can look
- 21 at me.
i 22 A Okay. Where were we at?
23 Q You were saying that you had the data sheets in ;
24 your hand and that J.D. was talking to the QC guy about ,
25 something.
a l
[
.= .
Page 16 1 A Right. He was talking to him about the 2 calibration.
3 Q Okay. Did you hear what was said?
4 A Yes, this is the card that's out.
5 Q Okay.
6 .A Pointed at it. Look and see the light -- it's got 7 a little light on it, tell you when it trips and extinguishes 8 -- and tweaked it in.
- 9 Q Okay.
10 A And he yelled -- he didn't yell, he spoke the as-11 left values to me. .
12 Q Okay, he called out the es-left values to you.
13 A Right.
14 Q The m a y.iq.there observing this.
15 A Right.
16 Q All right, you record them. ,
17 A I recorded it right there (indicating).
i 18 Q And that was 3.990?
19 A Y'es, sir. That's the values that were given to me 20 and I documented them.
21 Q Ag(,where was Bob Neal at this time, could he see 22 what was going on?
4 23 A No, sir, I didn't see Bob -- I did not see Bob 24 there at all.
25 Q No, I -- had he left already? I mean you said for
I l
i I
' Page 17 l' awhile he came in and was standing on the other side of the 2 racks l
3 A It was all -- I explained to you that J.D. came
, 4 back, J.D. was the first one in, he said -- I said what's the i
- 5 deal, Bob said tweak it in. Bob must have been the second 1 .
- 6 one'in -- yeah, must have been second one in, took the DC 7 card from J.D.
8 Q Oh, that's right.
S A QC'comes in right after that. This whole thing
]
f 10 took about, ggg_,know, probably a minute. Bob was at the SS' i 11 desk.
12 Q He had taken the DC card.
13 A He was talking to the SS, that's what I believe.
a 14 Q Okay. 1
- 5 15 A And it was us three back there and it was a big
{
16 crowded cart and the QC guy got right behind that cart, took l
17 the card, and that's what happened.
(
18 Q Aad. J.D.- tweaked it in, he reads out the as-lef t v f 19 value, all right. +y g s
20 A Right. Q/
21 Q And then what does the QC guy do? kP 22 A He,says okay, where do I sign? And I gave hLa the 23 whole data package, I just had it all stapled together, this 24 comes with this and this is altogether in one lump, piece of 25 paper. I gave the whole thing. And he had a little bit of 1
l 1
- Page 18 1 difficulty you know, finding where he was supposed to sign,,I 1
I '2 be}ieve.J.D. helped him with that. '
3 Q Okay.
4 A And he wrote that there.
! 5 Q That's Whitaker's -- do you know Whitaker?
6 A I don't know him personally, I know him by face.
7 He's slender, brown-headed fellow.
8 Q Okay. You didn't point out to Whitaker where he T'
9 was supposed to sign?
! 10 A No, sir.
! 11 Q Did you see J,.D. point out to him where he was i
12 supposed to sign?
, 13 A Well with the package together with both of them 14 they figured out where to sign.
15 Q Okay. Now I notice that they signed, and where I l
16 say Whitaker's initials, I am now looking at a document 17 identified as page 154 of VEGP Procedure 24812-1, Rev '6, 1
- 18 which shows the initials RSW, the date 1/28/92, the notation i 19 IR No. 3438. This handwritten notation was made in between l
l 20 paragraphs nrTber 4.3.38.18 and 4.3.38.20 on this document 21 entitled Checklist Step Verification.
22 To your knowledge, Mr. Wilkins, what do those 23 initials mean to someone who would be reviewing that 24 document?
i
' 25 A That is the initials of the QC inspector, the date 1
Page 19 1 that he inspected it and the number of his investigation 2 report -- inspection report.
3 Q And to your knowledge, what do those initials mean?
4 A That means that he has verified per that section of 5 the procedure --
6 Q That section being 4.3.38.18.
7 A Have you got a straight edge? I can just use this.
8 Yes, sir.
l 9 Q What does that mean? Does that mean that that --
10 that he is initialing that he has seen that part of the )
11 procedure being performed?
12 A Yes, sir, there's a QC hold point.
13 0 or does it just mean that he's verifying an as-left 14 value?
15 A It means that he has actually witnessed the as-left ,
pen-16 values. l i
17 Q Does it mean that he has witnessed the procedure l 9
18 being performed, the calibration procedure that --
19 A Yes, sir.
20 0 It does, to your knowledge?
l 21 A Yes, sir. f 22 Q And that --
23 A Well wait, -- it means --
24 Q I'm going to ask him, you know, what it means, 25 but --
i 4
~
Page 20 1 A I think that the hold point is -- I think this hold i
2 point is when you go ahead and you find out and you calibrate 3 the card and then he has got to witness as-left values.
i 4 Q As-left values.
j 5 A Yes, sir.
i J 6 Q So you think that initials probably means that he 4
7 has witnessed the as-left values at that point in the 4
- 8 procedure.
9 A Yes, sir, that's exactly what's happening.
. 10 Q Okay. And he -- from what you just told me, he did
-11 in fact witness those as-left values, is that correct?
f i 12 A He didn't witness it per that section of the 13- procedure. .
i 14 Q Okay, let's see what that section of the procedure f .
l 15 says.
16 MR. BONSER: I think it's right here.
i 17 THE WITNESS: 4.3.38.18 -- right there.
I 18 BY MR. ROBINSON:
I 1 19 Q Okay, 4.3.38.18 in the procedures says "QC hold
! 20 point. Obtain QC authorization to proceed before continuing i 21 with this procedure."
i' 22 A Yes, sir.
- 4 i 23 -Q Are the paragraphs preceding this something that '
I 24 the QC guy should have observed or -- -
25 A Okay, right here, you've taken your as-found i
i 4-I
?
o
?
1 Page 21 1 values. )
l 2 Q Okay, let the record reflect he's pointing to i
I 3 paragraph 4.3.38.15.
i 4 A That's where you would take your as-found values. I 5 Q Okay.
6 A That we didn't take, we didn't take those.
7 Q But at this point, aren't we talking about this as- i 8 left value on Test Data Sheet 17 Isn't the 3.990 the value 1
9 that this QC signature-verifies as having read? !
10 A He, verified and he diligently did so'-- he verified 11 this value. ,
12 Q Okay.
13 A But that wasn't the value he was supposed to be 14 verifying.
)
15 Q I see. TKis is the value he was supposed to be '
16 verifying on Data Sheet 377 17 A Yes, sir, i
1B Q Because -- and why -- what makes you say that?
19 Does paragraph 4.3.38.18 refer'to Data Sheet 37?
20 A It would be in this data sheet, tv has you record 21 these in the data sheet, everything is Data Sheet 37.
I 22 Q Okay, let the record reflect that paragraphs 23 4.3.38.11, .13, .14, .15 and .16 all refer to Data Sheet 37.
l 24 A Yes, sir.
l 25 Q And at the point in time Mr. Whitaker signed the
-- <-,w
l..
i
! Page 22 1 Checklist Step Verification, Data Sheet 37 had not even been J
2 created yet, is that correct?
3 A It was in the package, but there were no values, l't .
e was blank. l 5 Q It was blank.
6 A Yes, sir.
7 Q Okay. And to your knowledge, it was J.D. that 8 pointed out to Whitaker where to sign the checklist.
{
9 A Yes, sir, I donft think he could have found it ;
10 himself.
11 Q Okay. Whose idea was it to put the fabricated
)
12 values in Data Sheet 37.. 1 13 A I'd have to explain that.
1 I
14 Q Okay, please do. ,
15 A Agt,sr..QC.left and.he had signed the paper, I j
- 1 16 complained to J.D., I said this ain't going to make it, I ;
17 can't do this, I don't have any values, and I kept on, and 18 J.D. closed out the loop and put the loop back in service. I 19 kept on complaining and,Ja D. said well maybe we can talk to 20 beb and we can write in the comment section of the data sheet 21 that we tweaked in per the ACOT.
22 Q Okay.
23 A Ang,that's when I said okay. ;
24 Q You agreed with that idea? I 25 A It's the only thing I could have done, he put the I
1 I
i
l Page 23 1 loop back in service, QC had signed off on it, and then J.D.
2 is running around a little bit and he says, Marcel, go back l I
to the shop and check the rev on this procedure, I spoke to 3
4 David Wallace and there may be a problem with the procedure, j 5 the procedure was just rev'd.
6 Q That's what J.D. said to you, that he had just 7 spoken to David Wallace.
8 A Yes.
S Q And the procedure may have just'been rev'd. j
, 10 A Right.
11 ,
Q Okay, go ahead. Did you go back to the shop?
12 A Yes.
13 Q Was Bob Neal still in the control room at the time, ,
14 when you went back to the shop?
15 A No, sir, Bob was in the shop over by David.
16 Q Had Bob Neal ever come back and'done any 17 independent verification of any readings?
18 A No, sir.
19 Q Okay, go ahead.
20 MR. BONSER: Had you restored the system before you 21 went back to the shop? Did you say you had or had not?
22 THE WITNESS: The system was restored before I went 23 back to the shop.
24 MR. BONSER: Who had verified that t he system had 25 ben restored, had you all done that?
Page 24 l
1 THE WITNESS: Yeah, we did that. But I had not l
2 gotten the procedure signed off because I was having these 3 problems about no values.
4 BY MR. ROBINSON:
5 Q Had Bob verified that the system had been restored 1
6 to service? 1 7 A No, sir, I think me and J.D. did.
8 Q Okay, go ahead.
9 A And -- I went back to the computer terminal, j 10 checked the rev, Rev 16, I said whew, you know, normally'the 11 lead guy, the guy that gets the package when your boss gives 12 you a package -- you know, you're going to work with so and 13 so, you've got the package, you're the lead guy, right?
14 Q So you thought you were the lead guy here? i
_ I
~
15 A No, J.D. was the lead guy. I 16 Q Oh. .
17 A And he should have checked the rev. Bob gave him
! l 18 the procedures, the first thing you do is you check the rev l 1
19 for that procedure and it's got a big red' stamp on it and you l 20 put your name on it every day. So I was relieved to know 21 that the procedure was the correct rev, and Bob says Marcel, _
22 is there a problem, from across the shop. I said no, and I 23 go back and J.D. was already working on Unit 2, he had told 24 me he was going to go ahead and work on Unit 2. Well the 25 system was back in service and I think the SS had come back
. .-- - ~- . . , .. . . - - - - . - . - . . --.--. -_. - -... .-.
e i
1 l
4 ,
) Page 25 l j 1 there one time, you know, to y h=t === holdina us up. I i 2 didn'texplaintohimbutsomebodyexplainedtohimthath 1
3 h Q card out, so I realized he wanted to get the paperwork 1 4 signed off, so I went up there and I --
i 5 Q Who wanted to get the paperwork signed off, the SS?
i '
6 A I felt that they wanted the loop back in service I 7 and they will not call the loop back in service, even though 8 it is, until you are signed off.
9 Q Okay.
1 j 10 A So I had no data on Data Sheet 37, all I had was 1
l 11 data sheets of -- you know, the applicable ones.
i i 12 Q Data Sheet 1, which showed at least the apparently 4
13 out-of-calibration value.
i
. 14 A Right. ,
15 Q And the apparently within-calibration value after l 16 the tweakint.
' 17 A Yes, sir, and the other sheets that went along.
J 1
i 18 Q Okay.
i 1 19 A So I signed it off and I don't know what time of f
20 the morning it was, but it was in the morning, and I went 21 batek to my desk and I sat there and I looked at it and I 22 logked at it and I just stayed there I guess for awhile 23- looking at it, I didn't know what to do. J.D. k )
24 t<hrough, has his paperwork finished on Unit 2, walks right by 1
25 me_and goes into Bob's office and then he's gone to HEP.
t ,
a
- Page 26 1 Q HEP?
2 A It's a van that comes around to check your blood l
3 pressure, your eyes and everything.
4 Q How could he have done his work on Unit 2 without 5 anybody to help him? Isn't it the same kind of situation, 6 all these connections? Was he doing ACOT?
7 A Yeah, it was ACOT on Unit 1 and Unit 2.
8 Q Were you supposed to have been helping him on that 9 one?
10 A He went ahead' and did it himself, I didn't see :
11 anybody with him but I'm sure that he would have had to get ,
12 an independent verification. All you do is grab somebody in l 13 the ccatrol room.
14 Q Okay. He would have been filling out his own data 15 sheets 7 I 16 ,
A Right, it's not an impossible task but when you
! 17 have two people I find it easier.
j 18 Q Sure. So you're back at your desk.
19 A Looking at this thing.
4 20 Q And he comes through, he's gone already.
l 21 A He's gone. He didn't talk to Bob about what we 22~ were going to do. And I felt --
23 Q What were you going to do?
- 24 A I felt that that's what they all wanted, I felt 25 that --
i
e
- 1 l -
Page 27 i 1 Q That being the fabricating of the numbers?
2 A I felt at the time that -- sitting back there l 3 thinking about it, that just tweak it in, QC signed off, J.D.
t
- 4 saying we were ani ; + M alk to Bob but I know he really 5 didn't want t o do that because -- I told him that's not per 2 6 tha preser'.s.;, I r--- I ' " - _well just have gone and told 7 the DC guy richt then when he was doing it, stop, what he r,
) 8 deiac is wrona. But I hadn't.
! 9 So, I had to go to HEP and Bob came up and said l
10 what's wrong, Marcel, you ain't got that paperwork finished l 11 yet? I said no. ,
I 12 Q I mean theoretically, Bob told J.D. it was okay to i 13 tweak it -- that's what J.D. told you, right?
) 14 A Yeah, ,J.D.
J told me that.
15 Q So, okay, did you feel a reluctance to talk about 16 that to Bob?
- 17 A I wan kind of laf+ ^"+ in the cold, I think I was o
l 18 left, holding the bag. I didn't cet to make any of the 19 deetalon, I didn't -- I felt that I was left holdin'g the bag i
20 hera-and I felt that, looking at it, that Bob told J.D. to do ;
21 it this way, J.D. don't lie and QC signed off on it,-- and I l 22 pleaded with J.D. the whole time through this not to do this. !
)
23 Q What do you think would have happened if you had i 24 told Bob at that point that that's what had happened, you ,
1 25 didn't have a sheet 37 on the thing? i
}
Page 28 1 A Bob.wogld have act mad, QC would have got involved, 2 because;they_had witnessed the right thing.
3 Q Bob would have gotten mad at who? j 4 A BAlh ofJ s.
5 Q But not if he would have given the approval to i l
6 tweak it, right?
i 7 A Right. .
4 8 Q Do you think J.D. was lying to you when he told you ,
i 9 that?
1 10 A No, J.D. doesn't lie, he's never lied to_me.
11 Q So you were being serious when you said J.D.
12 doesn't lie, you weren't being sarcastic.
13 A I wasn't being sarcastic, J.D. is a very good nan 14 and I have the highest regard for him -- at least I --
15 Q So you think that Bob did in fact give J.D.
16 permission to tweak it?
i 17 A That's what I felt, yeah.
' 1 Okay, so if Bob had given J.D. permission to tweak i 18 Q 19 it and, like you said, you would have had to get QC involved, !
20 but wouldn't it kind of been okay -- guess if QC hadn't l 21 gotten involved, Data Sheet 37 wouldn't necessarily have had (
- 22 to come into creation, would it? It could have just been 23 tweaked into calibration and you wouldn't have necessarily 24 had to have had the Data Sheet 37, would you?
I l 25 A No,-sir, the procedure specifically -- if you find 4
8 m , - e
- c. '
i Page 29 1 I a value out of tolerance, you have to calibrate the card, 2 it's per the procedure. l 3 Q Yeah.
4 A And it was going against the procedure so much so - l 5 - everybody knows in any procedure that you do that's got a 6 loop to it, if you find one part out, you have to go 7 calibrate that part. That's a given, it's a known.
8 Q Okay.
9 A So Lt's like it was going against the thing that we 10 do. !
11 Q Okay, so you're sitting at your desk and you've got 12 this problem. j 13 A Yeah.
14 Q And you've got to make up your mind I guess whetner 15 you're going to talk to B:ob about it or whether you're going j 16 to put some numbers in Sheet 37, right?
i 17 A Yeah, J.D.'s done gone. He said we'd_ta_1V te- Bob ,
s !
l 18 and I didn't want to tell Bob because I didn't do it really, i
! V 19 I mean J.D. should have been the one to tell Bob.
20 Q Okay. So what happened.
. 21 A J.D. was gone, I was sitting there at my desk right
, 22 up front. Bob said have von not that nanarwork finished yet, l 23 I said no. J.D.'s done act his oaoerwork, he's gone to HEP.
24 I'm going like -- well -- he said here, give me that i
- 25 paperwork, or fill that paperwork out -- or anyway, a few j _
y - --,- p,- p- -
Page 30 1 minutes later after that I did what I did. And I feel bad
/ ~
2 about it.
3 Q You knew that those numbers on Sheet 37 there would 4 correspond to the readings on Test Sheet 1.
5 A I didn't know for sure.
6 Q In general.
7 A Yeah, it,was my best guess.
8 Q And did you have any conversations with J.D. the 9 next day or soon after that about the spot he put you on?
I 10 A Yeah, I think it was the next day, we were working 11 night shift. I heard somebody say that procedure was wrong 12 and then somebody told me, I think Bob said that Scott 13 Hammond, the supervisor, wanted to speak to me.
14 Q Okay.
15 A And I went back and I told J.D., I said man, I 16 said, it's about that second data sheet, I said what_.do% we 17 do. ,aJ .D. looked at me and he said tell the truth, that's the 18 onig_ thing we can do. You can tell J.D. -- he's.a pretty 19 happy-go-lucky guy, you know, but when his face turns all red 20 and his even ont big around.
' 21 Q It's kind easy for him to say when you're the one 22 that filled in the numbers right, to go tell the truth.
1 23 A Yeah.
24 Q Did he go tell the truth to Hammond? l 25 A We both went at the same time.
' % l
l Page 31 1 Q Oh, at the same time. Okay. What happened?
2 A Scott asked us what happened -- well he kind of 3 said I see what y'all did here, then he flicked it over and I !
4 saw my second data sheet. And J.D. I think said -- I believe 5 +--bad it in, told Scott that wa uJ.D. that said
- we 6 twe 9 d I And then I said that I -- I was so engrossed 7 with guilt that I said I did it, you know, I forged the N
8 values. Ana unen unau was aoout it for that meeting and they 9 kept us over a little while longer and they said our 10 superintendent wanted to speak to us, 11 MR. BONSER: Which is who?
12 THE WITNESS: Mike Hobbs. And then Mike Hobbs sat i 1
13 there and said -- well he had a real bad look on his face, he i
14 was hurt. I said I tried to stop it and he said what, 15 Marcel, what do you mean, after all the money we spent on 16 teaching you guys procedure compliance, you go on and do
$ 17 something like this. What did you do. And the other guy j 18 goes yeah, what did you do. And that's when I realized that l l I 19 if JLjpad just let J.D. tell what he was going to tell, you j i
20 know -- ;
i 1
21 BY MR. ROBINSON: l 1- )
22 Q You mean trying to make a comment on the Test 1 I
23 data sheet? l 24 A J.D. just spoken in generalizations. It's fine -- )
i 25 it wasn't doing me any good to speak in generalizations l
4- #
Page 32 l' because there was nothing -- you know, it was like yeah, we 2 tweaked.it in and it was in earnest basically -- I saw the 3 logic in what he was doing but it wasn't right and I kept on 4 saying that. Anyway, that's when I told -- really came in 5 and told probably exactly what happened.
6 Q Okay.
7 MR. ROBINSON: Go ahead, Brian. .
8 MR. BONSER: At any time when you were discussing S this with your supervision, either Mike Hobbs or Scott 10 Hammond, did you ever bring up the event'where Bob Neal had 11 toy you to go ahead and adjust it?
Did you ever bring that 12 up?
13 THE WITNESS: Q lways brought it up. It wasn't 14 until -- it was the short, meeting after that that I went up 15 and I told -- I had to speak to the Maintenance Manager and 16 that's when I told him Bob said to tweak it in.
17 MR. BONSER: That was Lewis Ward?
o 18 THE WITNESS: I told him that J.D. told me that Bob 19 said tweak it in. Bob ne'ver talked to me except what was 20 wrong, Marcel, and why ain't your paperwork tinished. And 21 the funny thing about it, I feel so bad about this, but I get 22 along with J.D., we don't talk about it. He's a good man, 23 J.D. is, just had it in his mind.
24 BY MR. ROBINSON:
25 Q Well two things are kind of ironic about this t
4
, ...-~
i 1
1
- 1 i Page 33 1 thing. One is that the original as-found value would have j 2 been okay if the data sheet would have had the new values in. f 3 there, isn't that correct?
4 A Yes, sir.. I checked that rev. 1 l
5 Q Yeah, yeah. Well I mean, it says Rev 16 on Test ]
l
~
6 Sheet 37, you've got to assume that that's correct. j 7 The other thing that's ironic is you probably would 8 not have been found out if the alarm still hadn't continued 9 to spuriously go off after you had tweaked it. l 10 A If I had known that, I would have gone back to Bob 11 and told him, but I did not know. I was at that HEP thing. l 12 Q Oh, yeah.
13 A I would have run back and told Bob, but I didn't j
j 14 know. ,
l 15 Q Have you ever done anything like this in the past,
\
i 16 Marcel? ,
l l
17 A No, sir, never.
18 Q The way I understand it, the reason you ended up 19 filling in those numbers is because you felt that J.D. was 20 gone and since Bob was putting pressure on you to fill out j 21 the paperwork and you knew that the QC guy had signed off at 22 that step in the procedure, that you were forced to put in 23 those numbers essentially.
24 A And because Bob told J.D. who told me, to tweak --
~-
l 25 just tweak it in. And that's exactly how I felt.
~
I
\
l l
o o Page 34 1 Q Okay. .
2 A I felt pressure.
3 Q S_o the initiator of the tweaking idea was really I
4 J.D. and he went and got Bob's authorization to do that, '
5 right?
6 A That === 7 :;'-ign, yes, sir. But let me tell you 7 about -- in hindsight on this thing, the word tweak is not a !
8 good word, it's a -- it's not calibration. Maybe I took it l 9 wrong, tweak to me --
10 Q Just to reset the wheel, right?
11 A Yeah. But that word --
12 Q Has a bad connotation?
13 A Yes, sir. ,
I 14 Q Yeah, well I understand that and we're using that i 15 word to describe the resetting of those values by the 16 adjustment of the wheel.
17 A Yes, sir, but tweak has a bad connotation to it.
. 18 Q Yeah. Okay, we understand what in fact was done.
19 A Okay.
20 Q If other people in your section got into a
, 21 situation like you did, they had to get their paperwork
'22 finished and it was going to require fabricating some numbers l
- 23 on some data sheets, are there other procedures that your )
- 24 section works that would be susceptible to that kind of 25 fabrication if someone intentionally wanted to do it?
l 6
d 4
Page 35 1 A I don't understand.
J 2 Q How much of your work is doing ACOT procedures, ;
1 3 what percentage of your work?
4 A I really wouldn't know.
5 Q Ten percent? !
6 A I couldn't give you an answer. I would say of my 7 time, 25 percent -- of my time. Some people do surveillances 8 a lot. If you work on night shift a lot, you get a lot of 9 surveillances, they like to do them at night.
10 Q Uh-huh. I 11 A If you work during the day, you won't get any 12 surveillances, so it just depends on what your boss has got j l
13 and if you're really on days or nights. j 14 Q So if you're working nights, that other 75 percent 15 of your time may be spent doing other surveillances. I 16 A .Right. This whole thing only takes 45 minutes.
17 Q Right. I'm assuming that the other surveillances 1
18 are also composed of electrical readings and the record of i 19 electrical readings on data sheets, l
20 A Yes, sir.
21 Q And I guess I'll go back to my original question, ;
l I
22 those types of surveillances would be -- I guess I want your l
. i 23 assessment of how easy it would be to create fabricated 1 24 numbers on a data sheet to cover the non-performance of a 25 procedure.
i 3
- e I
h
- r- ,
- Page 36 i 1 A I+ wanid be very easy.
- r x.
- 2- Q .Okay.
But I want to say what happened here, it w'ouldn't 4
I 3 A '
, 4 have taken much more to take these values here, it wouldn't i
5 have taken much more. It would have taken putting in some 6 different values in some decade box -- in the decade boxes I 7 already connected, but then going through the procedure, d
8 finding what switches that had to be thrown, maybe some power 9 supply, some voltage sources, had to be hooked up, things
- 10 like that, to be able to get the system in this configuration 11 to do this, but really it wouldn't have taken much more. And i 12 that's what the hard thing is, it wouldn't have taken that 13 much more.
i 14 Q Was J.D. in a hurry to get to the HEP?
i 15 A I don't know if he was in a hurry. He works fast 16 all the time, he's a go-getter.
t 17 Q Does he normally -- is he normally thorough in his
.' 18 work, even though he works fast? .
19 A Yes, sir, I'd say he's a very conscientious man.
' s 20 Q Okay.
< 21 A I don't know where he came -- why he had this idea, I 22 'but I wouldn't have done it, I don't think anybody else would 23 have done it.
24 Q Well I guess looking at it from a devil's advocate 25- position, why not -- if you were to assume that the
U k
j Page 37 i
1 comparative values or the high and low settings on Test Sheet 1
j 2 37, were correct -- l 3 A Yes, sir.
l 4 Q -- and you were at a point where you could easily
) 5 get the set point to within value.
6 A Yes, sir.
l i 7 Q Why not do it? :
l 8 A It's not ethical, it's not right.
i 9 Q Is it just because there's a procedure that tells i 10 you to do something else or is it because you are really /b 1 l 11 taking a chance on messing up some other system by doing i Y l 12 that way? \\f l 13 A Yes, they're both -- we're raised on procedures, l 14 I've been raised on proc edure compliance. Since 15 I a grted workp c 4 n uds pr cedure -- you follow the j i 16 procedure, it's been dri and really -- especially 17 on a very complicated loop like this, you can't sit there and , _
18 mess around with an=athina you don't know what, because you
]
-l 19 will do exactly what you say, get on the wrong card,' do 20 These cards are two i
something wrong, <mamm ; an==thina mise up.
j 21 inches apart. I wouldn't have,gone it. ,
. 22 Q Okay.
- 23 A Nobody would have done that because this is
, 24 something you don't mess with here, and that's why I was so
}.
25 adamant. I would never -- I was weak I guess but I argued my l
o
- l l
l i
l i
4 Page 38 !
1 point and then I sat there and thought about it. And that's e
2 when I did it. ,
1 3 MR. ROBINSON: Okay. Do you have any other i
4 questions, Brian? !
5 MR. BONSER: No.
4 6 MR. ROBINSON: That's all the questions I have, i 7 Marcel. Do you have any final comments that you want to make
. 8 that we haven't tslked about that may clarify or add to the t
9 discussion?
10 THE WITNESS: No, sir, I just want to say I've been ;
I 11 totally honest with y'all, I've been totally honest,with my 12 bosses from right up front. I appreciate that Georgia Power 13 saw the situation and let me keep my job. And it hurts me 14 real bad that I've kind of sacrificed my honor because that's
)
15 one thing I always really care'a lot about, is that I'm 16 conscientious in the work I do. I've always prided myself on 17 that and I would just hope that whoever hears this tape or l l
18 the people that are making the decisions about what'I've said l 19 to you today realize I'm just a guy that.needs to work, you 20 know. I would never do this again and I've never done N-21 an thing 41k wht. 1;hbre.
22 MR. ROBINSON: That was my final question.
23 Okay. Well I thank you for your time, I appreciate 24 your cooperation. It's now 5:04 and this interview is over. ,
25 (Whereupon, the interview was concluded at 5:04 l
l i
,,m, .J m k + Mea e .O l l
Page 39 !
l 1 p.m.) !
2 3 I 1
4 5 l 6
7 8
.y' 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 9
18 19 20 21 22 23 24-
Page 40 CERTIFICATE This is to certify that the attached proceedings before the ,
U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission in the matter of Names Interview of Marcel Christof Wilkins Docket Numler Place: Vogtle Nuclear Generating Plant, Waynesboro, GA Date: May 7, 1992 were aald as herein appears, and that this in the original transcript thereof for the file of the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission taken stenographically by me and, thereafter reduced to typewriting by me or under my J l
direction, and that the transcript is a.true and accurate -
record of the foregoing proceedings.
k i b - ~ N h&
~
WIILIAM Ii. WARRER Official Reporter 9
- Ann Riley & Associates l
l l
1 l
l I