ML111940286
| ML111940286 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Crystal River  |
| Issue date: | 06/28/2011 |
| From: | Office of Nuclear Reactor Regulation |
| To: | |
| Doyle D, NRR/DLR, 415-3748 | |
| References | |
| NRC-962 | |
| Download: ML111940286 (82) | |
Text
Official Transcript of Proceedings NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION Title: Crystal River Unit 3 Environmental Review Afternoon Session Docket Number: 50-302 Location: Crystal River, Florida Date: June 28, 2011 Work Order No.: NRC-962 Pages 1-81 NEAL R. GROSS AND CO., INC.
Court Reporters and Transcribers 1323 Rhode Island Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20005 (202) 234-4433
1 1 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3 + + + + +
4 PRELIMINARY SITE-SPECIFIC RESULTS OF THE 5 LICENSE RENEWAL 6 ENVIRONMENTAL REVIEW FOR CRYSTAL RIVER UNIT 3 7 + + + + +
8 Tuesday, June 28, 2011 9 The Plantation Golf Resort & Spa 10 9301 West Fort Island Trail 11 Sabal Room 12 Crystal River, Florida 13 14 The above-entitled hearing was conducted at 15 2:00 p.m.
16 BEFORE: GEORGE SMITH, Facilitator 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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2 1
2 I N D E X 3 AGENDA PAGE 4 I. Welcome and purpose of meeting 3 5 II. Overview of License Renewal Process 9 6 III. Results of the Environmental Review 15 7 IV. How Comments Should Be Submitted 20 8 V. Public Comments 9 Rob Brinkman 21 10 Norman Hopkins 28 11 Joyce Brancato 34 12 Art Jones 35 13 Steve Lamb 39 14 Dixie Hollins 40 15 John Siefert 42 16 Andy Houston 43 17 Kevin Cunningham 44 18 Theresa Waldron 46 19 Betty Berger 48 20 Mark Klutho 51 21 Barbara Sieling 57 22 Thomas Saporito 60 23 Charles Riggs 71 24 Helen Spivey 72 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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3 1 Clay Clements 74 2 VI. Closing 74 3
4 I N D E X (Continued) 5 AGENDA PAGE 6 VII. Additional public comment 7 Brian Patrick Moore 75 8
9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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4 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 2:02 P.M.
3 MR. SMITH: All right. Good afternoon.
4 My name is George Smith. I'm from NRC Region 1. That's 5 up in King of Prussia in Pennsylvania. I'll be 6 facilitating the meeting today.
7 Can everyone hear me fine? Good.
8 I would like to welcome you to the Crystal 9 River Draft SEIS which is the Supplemental Environmental 10 Impact Statement for the licensee renewal of Crystal 11 River Unit 3, Nuclear Generating Plant.
12 Again, the purpose of this meeting today is 13 to present the results of the NRC's Environmental Review 14 for Crystal River License Renewal Application as 15 published in the Draft SEIS that is publically available 16 in the Agencywide Documents Access and Management 17 System, which is ADAMS. This Session Number is 18 ML11139A153. And that was issued May 26th of 2011.
19 Before we start I have three simple rules 20 that we, as facilitators, like to go over. I don't know 21 if you can see them, but the first rule we have up is 22 respect. And what we mean by respect is that we 23 understand that we all have information that we may want 24 to provide for the meetings.
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5 1 For example, we have the comment cards and 2 we would like to have everyone to have an opportunity to 3 provide their comments. So in doing so, we would like 4 to ask that you try to minimize or refrain from side-bar 5 conversations while either the presenters or 6 stakeholders are providing their comments.
7 Also, cell phones. If you have a cell phone 8 if you could put it on the silent mode.
9 Also, if others are speaking we ask that you 10 don't try to over-speak the other person. You know, just 11 stand up and shout comments, those type things. Again, 12 because it slows down the process of the meeting and also 13 it doesn't allow everyone to have their opportunity to 14 provide their comments. We understand that all the 15 comments are important and you want to get that 16 information out. We only ask that just, you know, 17 provide it at the appropriate time.
18 The comment cards. Again, if you have a 19 comment card you can please give it to Mike in the back 20 of the room and I'll collect the comment cards. And 21 during that portion of the meeting we'll allow you to 22 provide your comments in the time frame.
23 Right now we don't have a lot of comment 24 cards in the back of those who have expressed interest NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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6 1 in providing comments. So we haven't put a time limit 2 on the comments, per se, but if there's information --
3 for example, if you've given your information and either 4 the NRC representative can actually provide you an 5 answer, you know, I may step in and say, "Hey, Dan, or 6 Mike, can you provide that information?" If it's 7 something that we may not be able to answer at that point, 8 we have a parking lot that I'll write the information 9 down.
10 I ask that if I don't represent what you're 11 actually asking as a question and I write it on the 12 parking lot, just come and let me know, and that's no 13 problem. Also, at the end of the meeting the NRC 14 representatives will -- they'll stay around and they'll 15 answer questions as long as you have questions to ask.
16 So I think the bottom line I want to -- the 17 point I'm trying to get across is that whatever question 18 you have, if you don't feel that that question has been 19 answered sufficiently enough, the NRC representatives 20 will stay around and answer those questions. It may get 21 a little hard to get too extensive of an answer if we're 22 trying to let everyone get their questions in.
23 Again, I've talked about the parking lot.
24 We'll put the information on the easel.
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7 1 At this time I will allow the NRC 2 representatives to introduce themselves and we'll go 3 from there. Dan?
4 MR. DOYLE: Good afternoon. My name is Dan 5 Doyle. I just wanted to, like George said, is to 6 introduce some of the NRC staff that we have here if you 7 haven't met them yet, if you wanted to talk after the 8 meeting.
9 I'm Dan Doyle. I'm an Environmental 10 Project Manager in the Division of License Renewal. We 11 also have Farideh Saba from the Operating Reactor 12 Licensing Branch, and Mr. Doug Broaddeus sitting over 13 here.
14 At the back table we have Mike Wentzel, 15 another Environmental Project Manager from the Division 16 of License Renewal. We have the Senior Resident 17 Inspector, Mr. Tom Morrisey in the green and blue shirt 18 back there. Let's see. Who else? And then we have Mr.
19 Roger Hannah, who is Public Affairs in the Region.
20 And I think that was everybody today.
21 Anybody, any other NRC staff?
22 Okay. Great. Thanks.
23 We had also set up a telephone line for 24 someone to call in to participate.
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8 1 Do we have anyone on the telephone at the 2 moment?
3 (No response.)
4 MR. DOYLE: I just wanted to check and see 5 if there's someone there.
6 (No response.)
7 MR. DOYLE: They may call in later. They 8 may have their line muted at the time. But they are able 9 to participate or to give their comments via telephone 10 and we're going to accept those comments at the end.
11 Okay. So I'm going to present today the 12 preliminary results of the NRC's review, the 13 site-specific issues related to the proposed license 14 renewal for Crystal River Unit 3. I hope the information 15 we provide will help you understand the process that 16 we're going through and what we've done so far, and the 17 role that you can play in helping us make sure that the 18 final environmental -- Supplemental Environmental 19 Impact Statement is accurate and complete.
20 I'll start off with a brief project 21 background and then move on to presenting the preliminary 22 findings in our environmental review which assesses the 23 impacts associated with renewing the operating license 24 for another 20 years.
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9 1 Then I'll provide some information about 2 the schedule for the remainder of our review and how you 3 can submit comments. After my presentation there will 4 be time for you to present your comments. For those of 5 you who would prefer to send in your comments after the 6 meeting I'll explain some options for doing that.
7 The NRC was established to regulate 8 civilian uses of nuclear materials, including 9 applications that produce electric power. The NRC 10 conducts license renewal reviews for plants whose owners 11 wish to operate them beyond their initial license period.
12 The NRC license renewal review addresses 13 safety issues related to managing the effects of aging 14 and environmental issues related to an additional 20 15 years of operation, as well as any potential major 16 refurbishment activities the plant owner or operator may 17 undertake during or in preparation for an additional 20 18 years of operation.
19 In all aspects of the NRC regulation our 20 mission is three-fold: To ensure adequate protection of 21 public health and safety; to promote the common defense 22 and security; and to protect the environment.
23 Before getting into the preliminary 24 findings of the environmental review I would like to take NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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10 1 a few moments to acknowledge two topics of public 2 interest: The containment delamination at Crystal 3 River Unit 3 and the nuclear accident in Japan.
4 While the plant was shut down in 2009 to 5 replace the steam generators, the licensee discovered 6 cracks or delamination in the containment wall. This 7 structure serves as an important barrier to prevent 8 radioactive material from escaping to the environment in 9 the event of an accident. The plant has been shut down 10 for repair since this discovery, and there is no impact 11 on public health and safety currently. Additional 12 delamination was discovered in March of 2011 and the 13 licensee announced their intention to repair the 14 containment yesterday.
15 So, the two main issues that I wanted to 16 address in this meeting is to explain what the impact is 17 of this event on the licensing renewal process and then 18 how it relates to this meeting.
19 So as far as the impacts to the license 20 renewal process. This is a current operating issue at 21 the plant. The applicant is going to -- the licensee is 22 going to work with state regulators and federal 23 regulators to develop a plan for repair; to implement the 24 plan and make sure that the plant can operate safely prior NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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11 1 to restart. So, the plant is shut down and the repair 2 would have to be completed before the plant can start back 3 up.
4 So this is a current operating issue which 5 is managed in a separate process from this specific 6 review that we're talking about today, which is, what 7 would the environmental impacts be of an additional 8 20-years of operation.
9 It does relate, though, to the safety review 10 aspect of the application, which is that we've asked 11 questions. We have issued a request for additional 12 information about how the applicant would manage the 13 effects of aging and how they're going to, you know, to 14 answer some questions associated with how this happened, 15 and what their plan is.
16 So, for the license renewal process to move 17 ahead the applicant would have to respond to those 18 questions and the NRC would have to review those 19 questions and feel that the answers were satisfactory.
20 So that's one impact on the renewal process, is that we've 21 asked questions they would have to answer.
22 Another impact is that we've issued the 23 Draft Supplemental Environmental Impact Statement.
24 These are our preliminary findings.
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12 1 We have a -- the next step in the 2 environmental review process is to issue the Final 3 Environmental Impact Statement. The date for issuing 4 that has not been set so that is pending responses from 5 the Applicant and their plan.
6 So once we receive that we'll set a date for 7 issuing the Final Supplemental Environmental Impact 8 Statement and that will include responses to comments and 9 also have some discussion about how this relates to 10 environmental impact. So that date is to be determined.
11 When we make that decision for when it will be released 12 we will issue a public letter. It will be updated on the 13 website, on the NRC's website.
14 And the other question we wanted to answer:
15 Is it possible that the NRC could issue a license renewal 16 prior to the repairs actually completed? And the answer 17 I would say is, yes, if we have an approved plan for moving 18 forward and that the NRC feels that they have a good 19 understanding of what the impacts would be.
20 But as I said, again, this is a current 21 operating issue that would need to be resolved prior to 22 the plant actually restarting. So, that's the impact on 23 license renewal.
24 For this meeting, we will accept comments NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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13 1 from the public. I just want to make it clear that the 2 purpose of this meeting is to solicit comments on the 3 environmental impacts for license renewal. We're 4 trying to prevent the meeting from being focused solely 5 on the containment repairs. I know that's a major 6 concern. We're certainly interested in hearing your 7 public comments, but what we're specifically looking for 8 is a comment about the draft SEIS; comment about things 9 that you think the NRC should consider in our 10 environmental review for an additional 20-years of 11 operation.
12 This past March an earthquake and 13 subsequent tsunami led to a nuclear accident at the 14 Fukushima Daiichi site in Japan. The NRC is conducting 15 an analysis of the lessons learned -- the lessons that 16 can be learned from the events in Japan in order to see 17 if there are changes that we need to make here in the 18 United States to further protect the public.
19 NRC's staff will present the 90-day update 20 to the Commission on July 19th. You can find more 21 information about this effort on our website, 22 www.nrc.gov under the link for Japan Nuclear Accident NRC 23 Actions. The direct link to the website is on this slide 24 and also in the meeting handout.
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14 1 To date there have not been any immediate 2 changes to the license renewal process as a result of the 3 NRC's review. Seismic risk is considered in the design 4 basis for all plants and the license renewal review 5 includes an analysis of severe accident mitigation 6 alternatives which are potential changes that the 7 licensee could implement to reduce the effects if a 8 severe accident were to occur.
9 The results of this review are presented in 10 Appendix F of the draft SEIS.
11 I am now going to move on to talk about the 12 potential site-specific impacts of license renewal of 13 Crystal River Unit 3. These findings are contained in 14 the Draft SEIS which the NRC issued on May 26th, 2011.
15 There are copies on the table in the back 16 of the room there. There's also CD's that have Adobe PDF 17 versions of the document, so a little smaller. And the 18 CD's also have a lot of other good background information 19 for reference, including the license renewal application 20 and other brochures. All of the brochures that are on 21 the table are also on the CD, plus there are other --
22 there's other background documents included there.
23 So, please feel free to take a copy of one 24 of those CD's or any of the hard copies that are on that NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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15 1 table.
2 The draft SEIS contains analyses of all 3 applicable site-specific issues as well as a review of 4 the issues common to many or all nuclear power plants.
5 Issues for which the environmental impacts are the same 6 across some or all nuclear power plant sites are 7 discussed in the generic environmental impact statement.
8 The NRC staff reviewed these issues to 9 determine whether the conclusions in the generic 10 environmental impact statement are valid for Crystal 11 River Unit 3. The NRC staff also reviewed the 12 environmental impacts of potential alternatives to 13 license renewal. In other words, other ways to replace 14 Crystal River Unit 3's electrical generation capacity if 15 it were shut down to determine whether the impacts 16 expected from license renewal would be unreasonable.
17 This slide lists the environmental issues 18 that the NRC reviewed for the continued operation of 19 Crystal River Unit 3 during the proposed license renewal 20 period. Overall the indirect impacts of license renewal 21 for most issues was found to be small, which means that 22 the impacts would either not be detectable or would not 23 noticeably alter the environment.
24 The impact to aquatic resources ranges from NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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16 1 small to moderate due to the effect of the plant's 2 once-through cooling system on fish and shell fish in the 3 Crystal Bay aquatic community. A finding of moderate 4 indicates that a noticeable but not -- indicates a 5 noticeable but not destabilizing effect.
6 And the section in the draft SEIS that these 7 issues are discussed is listed on the slide.
8 When reviewing the potential impacts from 9 license renewal on the environment, the NRC also looks 10 at the effects on the environment from other past, 11 present, and reasonably foreseeable future actions.
12 For example, the NRC continued -- considered the 13 operation of the coal plants at the Crystal River Energy 14 Complex, the possible construction and operation of new 15 nuclear reactors in Levy County, and a possible uprate 16 of Crystal River Unit 3, among other things.
17 The NRC preliminarily concluded that there 18 are moderate cumulative impacts on water resources due 19 to non-point sources of pollution and the potential 20 increase in the ocean water temperatures over the next 21 20 years.
22 For aquatic resources impacts are moderate 23 due to multiple stressors affecting aquatic resources in 24 the Crystal Bay such as continued operation of the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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17 1 Crystal River Energy Complex, continued withdrawal of 2 water for various human uses, commercial and 3 recreational fishing and boating, residential, 4 commercial and industrial development, invasive 5 species, disease and climate change.
6 For terrestial resources impacts are 7 moderate due to the extent of expected wetland losses and 8 habitat fragmentation from ongoing and planned 9 development projects, continued widespread manipulation 10 of habitats for commercial forest management, and 11 anticipated losses of habitat for important species.
12 For socioeconomic resources, impacts are 13 moderate to large due to the possible extended power 14 uprate in the proposed new nuclear power plant in Levy 15 County.
16 For air quality, impacts are moderate due 17 to the cumulative impact to ambient air quality from the 18 continued operation of the plant and other sources of 19 criteria pollutants in the region of interest.
20 In other areas that the NRC considered, the 21 preliminary conclusions are that the cumulative impacts 22 would be small.
23 A major step in determining whether license 24 renewal is reasonable or not is comparing the likely NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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18 1 impacts of license renewal with the alternatives 2 including other methods of power generation or not 3 renewing the Crystal River Unit 3 operating license.
4 In the draft SEIS, the NRC considered 5 natural gas, combined cycle generation, super critical 6 coal-fired generation, and as part of the combination 7 alternative, natural gas with conservation and 8 efficiency.
9 Finally, the NRC considered what would 10 happen if no action is taken and Crystal River Unit 3 11 shuts down at the end of its current license without a 12 specific replacement alternative.
13 The NRC found that the impacts from energy 14 alternatives would vary widely based on the 15 characteristics of the alternatives. In most cases 16 construction of new facilities created significant 17 impacts. This is discussed in detail in the document.
18 Based on a review of the potential 19 environmental impacts from license renewal and 20 alternative to license renewal, the NRC staff's 21 preliminary recommendation in the draft SEIS is that the 22 adverse environmental impacts of license renewal for 23 Crystal River Unit 3 are not great enough to deny the 24 option of license renewal for energy planning decision NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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19 1 makers.
2 To state it more simply, the NRC is saying 3 that license renewal would be an acceptable option from 4 an environmental standpoint.
5 The environmental review, however, is not 6 yet completed. Your comments today and all written 7 comments received by the end of the comment period on July 8 25th will be considered by the NRC as we develop the final 9 SEIS. Due to the containment damage the NRC has not set 10 a date to issue the final SEIS. When the date is set the 11 NRC will issue a public letter and we'll update the 12 schedule on the website.
13 The final SEIS will contain the NRC's final 14 recommendation on the acceptability of license renewal 15 based on the work we've already performed and the input 16 we receive in the form of comments during the comment 17 period. Your comments can help to change the staff's 18 findings in the final SEIS.
19 The primary contact for the environmental 20 review is Ms. Elaine Keegan. Rob Kuntz is the primary 21 contact for the NRC's safety review. This information 22 is on the website.
23 Hard copies of the draft SEIS are available 24 on the table as are copies on CD. In addition, two local NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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20 1 libraries, the Central Ridge Library and the Coastal 2 Region Library, have agreed to make the document 3 available for public review.
4 You can also find electronic copies of the 5 draft SEIS, along with other information about the 6 Crystal River Unit 3 license renewal review online from 7 the website on the screen, which is also included on the 8 handout on the table by the door.
9 The NRC will address written comments on the 10 draft SEIS in the same way we address spoken comments 11 received today. To submit written comments you may send 12 them to the NRC by mail to the address listed here and 13 in your handout. You may also submit them 14 electronically via the Federal Rule Making website, 15 www.regulations.gov.
16 If you have written comments this evening 17 you may give them to any NRC staff member. Again, to 18 ensure consideration, comments must be received by 19 Monday, July 25th, 2011.
20 I would like to be available or just open 21 up the meeting for any clarification comments prior to 22 receiving prepared comments or other comments about the 23 review, if there are any comments about the slides or 24 something that I just presented.
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21 1 Are there any questions about something I 2 just presented that anybody has?
3 (No response.)
4 MR. DOYLE: Okay. That concludes my 5 remarks. I'll turn the meeting back over to George for 6 receiving public comment. Thank you.
7 MR. SMITH: All right. Thank you, Dan.
8 If there are no clarifying questions, I have 9 a list of all the comment cards. I'll come around with 10 the -- actually we'll have them to come up to the 11 microphone, to the podium, and you will be able to make 12 your comments.
13 Again, we would ask that-- just to make sure 14 everyone remember the rules and to allow everyone to have 15 an opportunity to express their concerns and to make 16 their statements.
17 The first person we'll have is Rob Brinkman.
18 MR. BRINKMAN: Good evening. I'm glad to 19 see a reasonably full room here. I think a lot of people 20 are justifiably concerned about nuclear power.
21 Unfortunately our modern lifestyle is very 22 dependent on energy, specifically electricity, and there 23 are no really good options. I mean, the coal plants next 24 to the Unit 3 nuclear plant probably emit as much NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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22 1 radiation into the atmosphere as does the nuclear plant 2 in normal operation, because coal has small amounts of 3 radioactive thorium and small amounts of radioactive 4 uranium. And when it burns some of this is released into 5 the atmosphere.
6 Indeed, the presumption has always been, 7 though, that these amounts were very low and that they 8 were, indeed, often generally below the background level 9 that everybody on the planet receives from outer space, 10 basically from the sun, et cetera, and also from uranium 11 in the earth and other nuclear elements.
12 But I think that presumption just might be 13 mistaken, and that we have made the mistake of assuming 14 that the effects of radiation are a straight line 15 response, dose to effect. And we base that dose to 16 effect relationship -- dose to impact, I should say, 17 health impact -- based on our studies of the people we 18 bombed in Japan at Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Now that was 19 a very brief, very prompt high-level exposure to ionizing 20 radiation.
21 All of us on the planet are exposed to low 22 level doses of ionizing radiation. Indeed, if you fly 23 in an airplane you're exposed to a significantly higher 24 dose than you are on the ground. If you live in Denver, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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23 1 Colorado you're exposed to more of a dose.
2 But my concern -- and this is why I oppose 3 -- this is how my comments relate, just for the NRC's 4 benefit, to the draft Environmental Impact Statement and 5 the continued operation of this plant -- because I simply 6 do not feel that it is safe or advisable to continue 7 operating nuclear power plants.
8 Now, I have to admit I was kind of trying 9 to get more comfortable with nuclear power and I have been 10 doing a lot of research, and, they do take a lot of safety 11 precautions. But I think that the experiences in Japan 12 and Russia, Chernobyl, and even in this country, show 13 that we are humans, we are fallible. And the problem to 14 me with nuclear power is it, is the world's most expensive 15 and most hazardous way to boil water that humans have ever 16 developed.
17 And one book I read recently is this book 18 by Professor Jay M. Gould and Benjamin A. Goldman, Deadly 19 Deceit: Low-Level Radiation, High-Level Cover-Up. And 20 they basically allege that the dose response impact ratio 21 is not a straight line. That actually people are more 22 susceptible to very low doses of radiation per unit of 23 radiation received than they are to very high-level 24 brief. For instance, getting a chest x-ray probably has NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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24 1 less impact to your health than a continuous low-level 2 exposure.
3 And there's another difference. When we 4 -- I'll use the example of Chernobyl. When Chernobyl 5 happened the entire world, including in this country, 6 received essentially radioactive fallout. It went up 7 fairly high into the atmosphere; it was distributed 8 throughout the world. And most people in this country 9 didn't worry about it because the levels were thought to 10 be very low and not much cause for concern.
11 But actually public health data published 12 by the United States and by various counties and states 13 shows increases in the months immediately following the 14 arrival of that radiation in the United States in May of 15 1986 of increased infant mortality, increased cancer 16 mortality, and numerous other health impacts.
17 Indeed, I've often wondered if the 18 continued decline -- what I see as decline in the health 19 of our population in this country, both as evidenced by 20 cancer statistics, and also frankly in the mental health 21 of our society. It seems to me we have more people who 22 are -- have more mental issues now.
23 I think our intelligence level is dropping 24 as a society. I think the SAT test scores bear that out.
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25 1 And I had previously made the assumption that a lot of 2 this could probably be attributed to the use of various 3 environmental chemicals that we have also become very 4 prevalent in our society, especially since World War II.
5 But I think we also have to examine the possibility that 6 it's also an impact from low-level radiation.
7 And as I started out saying -- and I'm not 8 going to go on all afternoon, I'm going to wrap up with 9 this -- that the radiation that the world received from 10 Chernobyl, is receiving in smaller amounts from Japan, 11 and we have received in various localities in this 12 country, from what we thought were relatively minor 13 nuclear accidents in this country, may be doing us more 14 harm.
15 Because this occurs in elements like Iodine 16 131, which blessedly has a very short half-life, but if 17 it does get absorbed in sufficient amounts into your 18 body, your thyroid cells and only your thyroid cells will 19 take it up and it can lead to thyroid cancer.
20 Indeed, my former wife recently 21 successfully combated thyroid cancer, which I believe 22 was probably caused by Chernobyl.
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26 1 products is Strontium 90. Your body views this as 2 calcium and takes it up into your bones and your teeth.
3 And from there it resides in your body generally for the 4 rest of your life and continues to irradiate you.
5 Besides the obvious effect that most of us 6 would fear of genetic damage causing cancer, this book 7 suggests the possibility that it also causes the 8 formation of increased amounts of free radicals, 9 particularly the oxygen free radical.
10 And alternative health people have been 11 very concerned about free radicals for several decades 12 now. And this source of radiation may be a significant 13 or more significant source of free radicals in our body, 14 which can cause numerous health effects from cancer to 15 autoimmune diseases, et cetera, from this radiation 16 which we take into our bodies and resides in our bones 17 and our teeth.
18 These are just a couple of examples, and I'm 19 by no means saying that I know this is true for a fact.
20 But the possibility is there. There is a lot of evidence 21 that strongly suggests it. And I would suggest to you 22 that it's time to get serious about the impacts of our 23 energy, whether it's from nuclear, or coal, or even 24 natural gas.
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27 1 Talk to some of the people up in the states 2 where they're doing hydraulic factoring about the 3 impacts to their gas wells -- I mean, to their water wells 4 from natural gas wells.
5 And so as much as I want to hold the NRC and 6 the companies responsible, I'm also going to suggest that 7 we all have a responsibility. We're sitting here in a 8 room that's frankly pretty cold in a very hot climate.
9 And we're using a lot of energy to do that.
10 If you really are worried about the effects 11 of nuclear energy, or even coal, the impacts to our 12 environment, climate disruption, the climate -- the 13 coming climate crisis, I suggest to you we all need to 14 learn to use a lot less energy.
15 I personally manage to live on about 100 16 kilowatts a month. That's about one-tenth the average 17 Floridian. If every Floridian in this state reduced 18 their energy consumption by 90 percent we wouldn't need 19 -- Progress would not need its nuclear plant, it would 20 not need its coal plants. Indeed, they would be 21 struggling to stay out of bankruptcy.
22 Thank you.
23 MR. SMITH: Thank you very much, Rob.
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28 1 would like to check to see if there's anyone on the phone.
2 (No response.)
3 MR. SMITH: We'll check periodically.
4 Also, I've received about 10 comment cards. Initially 5 we only had four. I would like to say we would limit the 6 amount of time for your comments. Right now we will 7 allow you to provide your comments without putting a time 8 period on it, but if you could please be conscious of the 9 fact that we have a lot of stakeholders that would like 10 to provide their comments.
11 And also, if you could focus your comments 12 on the "SIZ" that would be great also.
13 The next person would be Norman Hopkins.
14 The SEIS, rather. I'm sorry.
15 MR. HOPKINS: Good afternoon, ladies and 16 gentleman. My name is Norman Hopkins and I'm Director 17 of the Amy Remley Foundation which is engaged on science 18 research of published peer-reviewed documents and 19 produces the results on a website for teaching of 20 environmental science. And we have researched 21 extensively into alternative sources of energy because 22 it has a major impact as far as the environment is 23 concerned.
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29 1 I've had time to review the documentation which has been 2 made available here. And I will send that in in due 3 course before the 25th. In fact, I have papers already 4 prepared that I can submit.
5 My principal concern today is safety. And 6 as a member of the environment I hope I can air this 7 situation at this particular time.
8 My main source of concern is that after 9 Hurricane Josephine we assembled in the City Hall in 10 Crystal River where we were addressed by FEMA officials 11 and others. And we were informed that a hurricane of a 12 certain source would put 35 feet of water over U.S. 19 13 and we should be prepared to evacuate.
14 Now, we're not sure because we don't know 15 the structure of the buildings concerned apart from what 16 we've read about the delamination of the containment 17 building. But we're concerned about the security of the 18 storage of the used fuel rods, which are more than 6 19 million times more radioactive after they've been taken 20 out than when they first -- when they were first put in.
21 And the issue that we're particularly 22 concerned about is that I live seven miles from the plant.
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30 1 underway, we took particular attention to pay close 2 attention to it and we were in touch with my son in Japan 3 every day for a period of about four-or-five months 4 concerning that issue.
5 One of the things about the nuclear -- about 6 the Fukushima Daiichi plant was that water overran the 7 plant and collapsed the machinery that was keeping the 8 fuel rods quiet.
9 And what we're concerned about is that if 10 we get 35 feet of water over U.S. 19, from a hurricane 11 which comes ashore in this region, then what is going to 12 happen out at the nuclear plant?
13 And although we can see on a photograph, 14 which we've all been given today, the building containing 15 the used fuel rods, we have no idea how robust that is 16 or how it's been designed to withstand an inflow of water, 17 say, 30, 35 feet, with, say, 180 mile wind behind it from 18 a suitable storm.
19 And that is something that we would like to 20 learn to be satisfied that it has been designed not with 21 simply a hundred year storm, which means that there's a 22 1 percent chance in any year of it happening. We need 23 to consider that with rising sea levels, which are rising 24 quite markedly and increasing temperature of sea levels, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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31 1 and the weather is going to become more ferocious than 2 it has been over the last 20 or 30 years.
3 And so that is one question that I will 4 certainly put in the paper that I submit. But if anyone 5 here from either the NRC or from Progress Energy can put 6 my mind at rest on that issue of what happens.
7 Now, it's important to ask, not only because 8 we live seven miles from the plant, but the insurance 9 means that because of what happened under the Price 10 Anderson Act in the 50's, there is no provision in any 11 homeowner's policy for any nuclear accident loss. And 12 it's governed instead by an inter-corporation fund to 13 repair damage.
14 Now, we have been told that that is 15 insufficient for the total risk to which we're exposed.
16 And so that is an issue of whether the insurance is going 17 to be enough. Because if there's a leak coincident with 18 a storm event of that size, it means that the property 19 we own is going to be uninhabitable for a very long time.
20 There is another issue from the 21 environmental point of view, and that is critical and 22 becoming even more critical. And that is the security 23 of the fresh water supply in this part of Florida.
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32 1 by the name of the Ghyben-Herzberg lens, and it means that 2 the fresh water supply is exposed to up-coning from 3 underneath by salt water, which will ruin the fresh 4 water, and also from the intrusion underground of salt 5 water from the Gulf of Mexico.
6 And that causes us great concern because it 7 could approach a tipping point which will enable the salt 8 water from the various sources of either up-coning from 9 underneath or underground intrusion from the Gulf of 10 Mexico. And that tipping point could be reached and 11 destroy the entire supply of fresh water in this part of 12 Florida.
13 So, we're very concerned about that and we 14 want to know what particular environmental impacts 15 provisions are made to govern that.
16 So in summary, it's safety, as I've 17 explained. It's also the cost. We're extremely 18 unhappy with the recovery of cost from customers under 19 the Florida Statute 633.90 -- sorry -- 366.93, which we 20 do not support in any way. And, after all, as customers 21 we didn't break the containment building. Progress 22 Energy broke it. But we're being asked to pick up the 23 tab on large slices of that damage and its repair.
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33 1 the company can call upon, but it has a $10 million 2 deductible. And they may follow activities to recover 3 from customers rather than incur that. And we should be 4 looking for information about that to put our minds at 5 more ease than they are at the moment.
6 That's all I have to say. If there are any 7 questions I will be prepared to answer them now.
8 MR. SMITH: Mr. Hopkins, I think you have 9 a particular question for the NRC that you would like them 10 to address here. Did I hear you correct? Or are you 11 going to submit that?
12 MR. HOPKINS: Well, I will submit it but if 13 anyone can answer -- sorry. And I will submit the 14 questions that I've outlined, together with other 15 material that we have prepared, and we would like to see 16 a reasonable answer to that.
17 And, I'm glad to see that Betty Berger is 18 here, and she's a great lady, and she lives very close 19 to the nuclear plant. And if you can meet her she has 20 some wonderful stories to tell you.
21 MR. SMITH: And Betty did submit a comment 22 card.
23 MR. HOPKINS: But the --
24 MR. SMITH: Then did you want to --
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34 1 MR. HOPKINS: And I've asked the questions 2 as I've been speaking but I will repeat them in the 3 document that I submit.
4 No questions?
5 (No response.)
6 MR. HOPKINS: Thank you so much.
7 MR. SMITH: Okay. I'll announce the next 8 person who will come up to the podium, but I also will 9 announce the next two persons that will be after the next 10 person.
11 The next person is Joyce -- and you told me 12 how to pronounce your name -- it's "Becatta," is it?
13 MS. BRANCATO: Brancato.
14 MR. SMITH: Brancato. Okay. Thank you.
15 Also the person after her would be Art Jones and Steve 16 Lamb. So those are the next three people that will come 17 to the podium.
18 MS. BRANCATO: Joyce Brancato, CEO, Seven 19 Rivers Regional Medical Center, and I also serve as the 20 immediate Past President of the Citrus County Chamber of 21 Commerce. And I wanted to thank you for sharing the 22 preliminary findings today. And I just want to share my 23 support that, indeed, the social economic impact would 24 be large.
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35 1 So, I'm here to just share full support for 2 Progress Energy to renew their license for another 20 3 years on behalf of our community. Thank you.
4 MR. SMITH: Thank you, ma'am.
5 Okay. Art Jones?
6 And, before you start, Art, the next person 7 will be Steve Lamb and then Dixie Hollins.
8 MR. JONES: Yeah, my name is Art Jones. I 9 live here in Crystal River, I live within 10 miles of the 10 plant, right on Kings Bay. And I was just taking a glance 11 at this Environmental Impact Statement here. And it's 12 interesting that in the beginning of it they have 13 alternatives considered but dismissed. So, here they 14 are looking at alternatives but they've already 15 dismissed these.
16 They're dismissing offsite coal and gas 17 fired capacity; coal integrated gasification and 18 combined cycle, they're dismissing new nuclear power.
19 They're dismissing energy conservation and energy 20 efficiency. Theyre dismissing wind power. They're 21 dismissing solar power, et cetera, they're dismissing 22 wave and ocean energy, geothermal power, municipal and 23 solid waste, fuel cells. They're also dismissing 24 delayed retirement of the plant.
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36 1 It's a little upsetting to see that in the 2 index. I thought they hadn't made their decision yet.
3 So, I did a little more homework here and you bounce over 4 here to solar power. They have barely a page on solar 5 power. And it's interesting, they talk about 6 photovoltaic cells and how it's not practical because 7 it's going to take up too many acres to put these cells 8 all over to create the same amount of electricity.
9 They need to think outside the box. They 10 have power corridors that run all over Citrus County, all 11 up and down Florida, these huge power corridors.
12 There's no reason that solar photovoltaic cells couldn't 13 go up in those power corridors and follow the 14 transmission lines.
15 We're claiming to be smart people, but are 16 we really smart people? We can't even figure out how to 17 make energy from the sun. I mean all of our energy 18 ultimately comes from the sun.
19 They're also dismissing concentrated solar 20 power. Now, concentrated solar power I think we all --
21 a good example of that is you take a magnifying glass and 22 you can start a fire with it. They're saying, "Oh, it's 23 not going to be reliable enough because sometimes, you 24 know, the sun goes down at night or there's cloudy days."
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37 1 Well, oh, gee, this nuclear power plant, it's been out 2 of commission for two years. How about that for 3 reliability?
4 So, I mean, we need to go back and visit 5 these. These people are not being really honest or 6 they're not doing their homework or they're just plain 7 being stupid. Solar power really is the answer. It is 8 a viable alternative. It can be done. Don't tell me it 9 cannot be done.
10 I have Christmas lights on my house that 11 have little photovoltaic cells that work just fine.
12 Now, you can't tell me that we can't, with all these great 13 minds here in Crystal River, figure out how to make solar 14 power work here in Florida, the Sunshine State.
15 You know, I really want Progress Energy to 16 be a viable company and be smart and intelligent. So, 17 let's be smart and intelligent and let's just not be 18 dismissing all these wonderful alternatives out there 19 for power.
20 Now, they were talking about their plant 21 there now, and they want another 20 years for it. Well, 22 if it's already delaminating after 40 years, maybe trying 23 to fix that up isn't the best idea in the world. There's 24 nothing more dangerous than nuclear power, as we saw in NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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38 1 Japan, and who's to say what's going to happen in the 2 future. Why play with fire like that when you don't have 3 to?
4 You know, talk about environmental impact.
5 If we had an accident out there, what will happen to Kings 6 Bay? What will happen to all of the Manatees that we're 7 trying to save? I mean, talk about an environmental 8 impact. It would destroy this place. So, I mean, why 9 shoot ourselves in the foot and go for such a dangerous 10 way to make electricity when it's not necessary. Let's 11 smarten up. And let's not buy what they're putting here.
12 They can't just dismiss solar power, wind power, all 13 these other things.
14 And he's saying here, "Oh, well, gee, the 15 concentrated, it's going to use too much water." Well, 16 concentrated solar power can also use mineral oil, so you 17 heat up the mineral oil that gets hotter than water and 18 then you store it and you can use it for up to seven days.
19 You can use it at night so you've got continuous energy.
20 I mean they're using that out in Nevada now.
21 Why can't we use it here in Florida? Why do we always 22 have to figure out, oh, there must be a better way, you 23 know, to do something when it's already been proven there 24 is.
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39 1 So, I don't know, I don't think we should 2 relicense it. I don't think they're going to be forced 3 to look and find a really good alternative until they're 4 forced to do it. For some reason they've got this idea 5 that nuclear power is fun to use or something, I don't 6 know. But it's not very much fun when there's an 7 accident. So, I'm opposed to recertifying it. I think 8 we need to look at alternatives once again, so.
9 It's already been shut down for two years.
10 The lights are still on. Let's look at some solar power 11 and some other alternatives. Thank you.
12 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Art.
13 The next person will be Steve Lamb. And 14 then after Steve we'll have Dixie Hollins and John 15 Siefort, is it?
16 MR. LAMB: Short and sweet. I've been a 17 member of this community for 28 years. I have a business 18 here, big investment here. I'm not worried in the least 19 about the nuclear power plant. You all are controlling 20 over 130 of them in this county, I understand.
21 Congratulations. You do a great job, and I would urge 22 you to renew the license. Thank you 23 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Steve.
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40 1 Hollins will be John Siefort and Andy Houston.
2 MR. HOLLINS: Ladies and gentlemen, my 3 name's Dixie Hollins and I'm proud to be here as a citizen 4 here of Florida. I'm a third generation land owner, and 5 my grandfather bought property here in 1942, and I 6 watched Progress Energy -- back then it was Florida Power 7 -- build Units 1, 2, Units 3, 4, and 5.
8 I'm also a member and past president of the 9 Chamber of Commerce, with over 1200 members and we 10 support the renewal of license of Crystal River Unit 11 Number 3. This is a job generation machine here in 12 Citrus County. It produces electricity the cheapest way 13 that man has found, and the most friendly environmental 14 that I have looked at.
15 I have also lived on that property for in 16 excess of 30 years. Sold that property with the force 17 of my father's passing with inheritance tax. And if my 18 father hadn't of passed and I hadn't paid inheritance tax 19 I'd still be living there today.
20 They are a great neighbor and they have gone 21 beyond the call of duty to make that a safe place. I've 22 been in the timber and cattle business for over 50, 60 23 years in this community, and they have cooled the water 24 to help our fishery industry out there in the Gulf of NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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41 1 Mexico. They have also put fish hatcheries to put the 2 fish back in the Gulf of Mexico. And they have cooled 3 down and planted grasses and all kind of things out there 4 to help this environment.
5 They have supported this community from one 6 end of Citrus County to the other, and they pay over 30 7 percent of the taxes in this community. And this 8 community needs to get behind Progress Energy and support 9 the renewal of this license.
10 They have also, as I mentioned, are the job 11 engine here. And I just heard from this morning's 12 newspaper that they are going to reconstruct the nuclear 13 power plant and spend in excess of probably a billion 14 dollars and have over three years of job employment here 15 in Citrus County. And we embrace that as the Chamber of 16 Commerce.
17 I have had people come to me on my property 18 to look at biomass fuel, and it's very cost prohibitive.
19 I've had several people with solar, same problem, cost 20 prohibitive; big issue here with clouds and storms.
21 I've also had people with wind generation, and there's 22 just not enough sustainable winds here and it's very cost 23 prohibitive.
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42 1 looking at the most economical way to put the lights on 2 as we enjoy here in this building today.
3 I salute Progress Energy and their staff, 4 and I also thank the Nuclear Regulatory Commission for 5 coming here and holding these public hearings, and this 6 community, the Chamber of Commerce, and the EDC is behind 7 you all one hundred percent.
8 Thank you very much.
9 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Mr. Dixie Hollins.
10 Mr. John Siefert now. Also after him will 11 be Mr. Andy Houston and Mr. Rob Brinkman.
12 MR. SIEFERT: Good afternoon, and thank you 13 to the NRC for holding public hearings and listening to 14 the commentary on both sides.
15 I am John Siefert. I am the Executive 16 Directive of the Economic Development Council of Citrus 17 County, and we support the NRC in granting the license 18 extension and -- for another 20 years, and we do that 19 understanding the environment and the impact that 20 Progress Energy has on this community and has had for many 21 many years, and will continue to have.
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43 1 contributor to local causes and efforts to make this 2 community successful, and will continue to do so.
3 They are building a $70,000 training center 4 -- 70,000 square foot training center, and we held, along 5 with Progress Energy, local vendor proposals to ensure 6 that the local people in Citrus County are utilized 7 whenever appropriate to assist with Progress Energy and 8 their numerous projects.
9 We support them and salute them and thank 10 them for their presence here. Thank you 11 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Mr. Siefert.
12 I'd like to take a pause and see if -- do 13 we have anyone on the telephone at this time?
14 (No response.)
15 MR. SMITH: Okay. Thank you. Next will 16 be Mr. Andy Houston and then Mr. Rob Brinkman.
17 MR. HOUSTON: Thank you. My name is Andy 18 Houston. I'm the City Manager of the city of Crystal 19 River. It's been mentioned and I would like to reinforce 20 Progress Energy's a great corporate citizen for Citrus 21 County, they are a mainstay of our economy, they have been 22 nothing but a good corporate citizen. I think that is 23 something that's very important in an area like this. I 24 hope it's duly taken into consideration.
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44 1 I don't claim to be an expert in nuclear 2 power or any of the other powers. I have had the 3 opportunity to tour the plant. I know they take security 4 and safety very seriously. I think their record is very 5 strong, and I think that warrants a favorable 6 consideration of their permit application. I would like 7 to also point out that Progress Energy, I think, is a good 8 steward of the resources. We are currently in an 9 agreement with them to take the treated effluent from our 10 wastewater plant, take that out to their power complex 11 for their use in lieu of groundwater withdrawal. It's 12 a fairly expensive project and they have been good 13 corporate citizens, stepping to the plate with a 14 financial contribution to make that possible.
15 So, I am here personally to support their 16 application. Thank you.
17 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Mr. Houston.
18 Now we have Mr. Rob Brinkman, Mr. Kevin 19 Cunningham, and then Ms. Theresa Waldron.
20 Mr. Kevin Cunningham.
21 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Good afternoon. Thank 22 you for having us come up and speak at this public 23 hearing.
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45 1 of ReMax Realty One, I'm a relator in Citrus County, I'm 2 also past president of the Chamber, past president of 3 Economic Development Council, and immediate past 4 president of Relators Association of Citrus County.
5 And I've lived here over 20 years under the 6 power of Unit 3 here in Citrus County. And one of the 7 things that people always ask me, as a realtor -- I mean 8 I pride myself on trying to keep the pulse of Citrus 9 County because home ownership is the American dream in 10 the United States. And so when people move to Citrus 11 County people ask me -- what is the first question they 12 ask? It is not anything about Progress Energy, it is not 13 about the nuclear plant. It's about where they -- the 14 location they want to live; if they want to live on the 15 water, golf course, what's the best neighborhoods to live 16 in.
17 And, comments about the nuclear power, the 18 safety, hardly ever come up. And I think that's a great 19 indicator of how Progress Energy and Florida Power have 20 succeeded in the safety standards in bringing that 21 feeling of safety to the community, where that question 22 never comes up.
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46 1 Number 3. Thank you.
2 MR. SMITH: Okay. Thank you, Mr.
3 Cunningham.
4 I'd like to check again to see if we have 5 anyone on the phone line?
6 (No response.)
7 MR. SMITH: Okay, thank you. Ms. Theresa 8 Waldron. Then Ms. Betty Berger and then Mr. Mark Klutho.
9 MS. WALDRON: Good afternoon, everyone. I 10 am Theresa Waldron. I have been a citizen here for 11 11 years. I'm a Cracker, born in St. Pete. My father moved 12 here in 1954. I'm the past printer, everything, from the 13 Sierra Club for like eight years. I am speaking for 14 Public Citizen. I am the president of Public Citizen 15 CEO. I have been the treasurer of Public Citizen CEO.
16 I have many accolades also.
17 I am speaking here because I am boiling. My 18 blood is just boiling over. This is total insanity.
19 Proof has been done that nuclear power is old -- is an 20 old, outdated method of making energy. We advance as a 21 people and a society and we learn new things. We cannot 22 continue to base our economy on old methods. The old 23 methods have killed people, they are not safe, there's 24 not proof that you're not going to kill me and my family NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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47 1 from the storms, the nuclear waste, the mercury.
2 Public Citizen, my private rights, public 3 citizens rights are being denied. I am totally opposed 4 to nuclear. It is ignorant as a society to continue 5 investing our economics on this method. We, as the State 6 of Florida, have so many miles of coast land that we could 7 have tidal energy so easily; it's pure. The sun is pure.
8 Why do we want to continue to take the chance of killing 9 our children, our grandchildren, our society? There is 10 no going back.
11 I'm not a doomsday person. I love life, and 12 I want to continue to live. And I'm invested in energy, 13 I'm invested. I have stocks just like everyone else. I 14 have a living. But we have to start new paths.
15 There is the interstate system, there is the 16 -- we have so much open, unused land that Progress Energy 17 could put solar panels. They are just doing it because 18 they don't want to invest in new methods.
19 I'm sorry. But all of your people that have 20 been in nuclear for 40 and 50 years, it's time to retire.
21 The solar industry needs more rebates, not tax credits.
22 We need more industrial support for solar and thermal and 23 tidal energy. It's here waiting to absorb.
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48 1 same mistakes. The cycle of life. When are we going to 2 learn? And the people have to stand up for your private 3 rights. I have the right to clear air, clean water, and 4 a happy life. That's all I ask. I don't ask for 5 support, I don't ask you to feed me.
6 God given rights to live. You are taking 7 that away from each and every one of us. I am totally 8 opposed to nuclear advancement. It's a waste of time.
9 Invest in the new ways. You can continue to make money.
10 Your stocks will go up, you will create more jobs than 11 you ever dreamed of. There are so many young people 12 willing to learn a new job. Solar is the way to go. You 13 have the land, you have the money. Make the time. Your 14 infrastructure sucks. You can redo it. Thank you 15 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Ms. Waldron.
16 Again, do we have anyone on the line?
17 (No response.)
18 MR. SMITH: Ms. Betty Berger. Also we'll 19 have Mr. Mark Klutho after her and Ms. Barbara Sieling 20 after Mr. Klutho.
21 MS. BERGER: Well, I'm glad to see the NRC 22 rolled out the big guns, because I want to tell you 23 something you maybe don't remember. When I retired from 24 Florida Power more than 25 years ago, they had to replace NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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49 1 their containment building for one reason, they didn't 2 put ice in the water they mixed the concrete with. NRC 3 didn't catch that. And they replaced the whole 4 containment building.
5 So this is the third time now. I'm saying 6 I think that it's worn out. I don't want to license it 7 for another 20 years. And what I read in the paper --
8 and the paper doesn't always say the truth -- but it says 9 that they had to put three senators on the case because 10 you're lowering the standards. Every time they can't 11 meet something you lower the standards so they can meet 12 it.
13 Now, that isn't right. You have to think 14 about that, because if there is an accident we aren't 15 going to leave for a weekend or a month. If we escape, 16 and I think there's a 50 mile radius, you can never go 17 back because there are years and years of half life of 18 atomic -- of nuclear radiation.
19 I read also that three-quarters of all the 20 plants in Florida today are leaking tritium into the 21 groundwater which you're drinking, and it's cancer 22 causing. What SWFWMD says is all the aquifers south of 23 the Suwannee River is fed only by rainfall, and that's 24 why Florida Progress -- Progress Energy had to move NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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50 1 inland because they're running out of fresh water.
2 Better think about all the water that they're going to 3 have to use for nuclear plants.
4 Another thing. They were paid $83 million 5 for ten years of storing their own spent fuel rods.
6 They're owed 20 more years by our government because 7 there is no place to store them.
8 Another thing I don't like to see is -- I 9 live in Inglis. I don't like to see you going miles north 10 of Inglis and building nuclear plants away from the water 11 and having to pipe your cooling water south to the Crystal 12 River site, because you have to dig five feet deeper in 13 the barge canal and that is forbidden by the government 14 who gave that land to Florida, and they have stopped it 15 at 12 feet. But the State of Florida don't listen to 16 that. They give them permission to do it.
17 So, I just say, think about what you're 18 doing. Don't lower the standards. If the Crystal River 19 plant is not meeting the present standards, see that they 20 do if you're going to give them 20 more years. I would 21 like to see you go another route. But I still think that 22 NRC is a great organization. They just need to get their 23 act together. Thank you 24 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Ms. Berger.
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51 1 Mr. Mark Klutho. Also, Ms. Barbara Sieling 2 will be after Mr. Klutho, and Mr. Chuck Riggs.
3 MR. KLUTHO: Mark Klutho, Largo, Florida.
4 As I've said before I come to this from a unique 5 perspective. 1970 I was on a nuclear weapons assembly 6 team, arming 155 warheads for the U.S. Army.
7 Here I have the book, Non-nuclear Futures.
8 The Case For An Ethical Energy Strategy, copyright 1975.
9 And here is the book, National Geographic. Repowering 10 the Planet, Energy For Tomorrow, and in here is an 11 interview with Amory Lovins.
12 And the first question to him: "You 13 popularized the term `negawatt.' What are negawatts and 14 why should we care about them? Negawatts are watts saved 15 by more efficient use. It's enormously cheaper, 16 probably eight times cheaper on average to save 17 electricity than to make it.
18 And here in this neat book that I got from 19 the NRC there is, on 8-32, 8-44, Energy Conservation, 20 Energy Efficiency. It says, "Though often used 21 interchangeably energy conservation and energy 22 efficiency are different concepts. Energy efficiency 23 typically means deriving a similar level of service by 24 using less energy."
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52 1 No. That is only what it means. Nothing 2 else. And yet, to read further you find a contradiction 3 here. It says, "energy conservation/efficiency was not 4 evaluated as an alternative to license renewal except as 5 a component of the combination alternative." Now, this 6 is pretty ridiculous. I mean you're contradicting 7 yourself a page over from where you just said they're two 8 different things.
9 I mean, come on. And to go on to wind power:
10 It's not suitable, not feasible; geothermal, it's not 11 evaluated as a reasonable alternative -- the renewal of 12 CR-3, municipal solid waste, it isn't feasible to do this 13 either. Biofuels, can't do that; fuel cells, no; 14 delayed retirement.
15 The thing is, you can't take one and say, 16 this is the answer, this is the answer. What you need 17 is a mix. It has to be a mix. And as Amory Lovins says, 18 the only reason why people are saying that nuclear power 19 is cheap is because there hasn't been a plant built in 20 many many years.
21 The article that was written in the New York 22 Times last year talked about the plant over in Norway, 23 which is the same design as what they want to build in 24 Levy County. And this one is, in the article last year, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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53 1 50 percent over cost, and at the time they wouldn't give 2 a due date when it would be finished. And according to 3 the industry we have all these problems fixed.
4 Well, getting back to Crystal River. Now, 5 in the article that was written today, the Tribune 6 finally states that it was because of cutting this big 7 hole to take out the heart, the reactor core, that you 8 had the problem of the delamination. And in the St. Pete 9 Times you have this diagram here showing the tendons and 10 of course showing the rebar.
11 Now, the question I have -- I don't want a 12 big, detailed answer because I already know the answer 13 to this. I do concrete work when I build my waterfalls.
14 When you embed steel in concrete you can't pull these 15 things out of the concrete. It doesn't happen.
16 Just what's the difference between a tendon 17 and a piece of rebar?
18 But once either of them are embedded in 19 concrete you go and cut this big hole in a 42-inch wall, 20 which is something that was written -- in fact when I was 21 at this last hearing that was held, the talk by the NRC 22 and the utility both describe this big hole that was cut 23 as maintenance.
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54 1 any intention that a hole would be cut in that wall; that 2 that reactor core would ever be removed until that plant 3 was retired.
4 What we have here is a grand experiment like 5 nothing that's ever happened before. This is called 6 "rolling the dice." And there's a law, it's called 7 Murphy's Law. You don't know what's coming.
8 Like this article here that was in the paper 9 just recently. In bold prints says, "Nuclear plant 10 rules ease. Probe finds feds repeatedly weakened safety 11 standards." And I mean there are some damning 12 statements here: The NRC weakened the safety margin for 13 acceptable radiation damage to reactor vessels for a 14 second time. The standard is based on a measurement 15 known as reactor vessels reference temperature, which 16 predicts when it will become dangerously brittle and 17 vulnerable to failure. Over the years many plants have 18 violated or come close to violating the standard. As a 19 result the minimum standard was relaxed first by raising 20 the reference temperature 50 percent, then 78 percent 21 above the original, even though a broken vessel could 22 spill its radioactive contents into the environment.
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55 1 Laboratories, and also sits on the NRC Advisory 2 Committee. "They're trying to get more and more out of 3 these plants." Several nuclear engineers and former 4 regulators use nearly identical terminology to describe 5 how industry and government research has frequently 6 justified loosening safety standards to keep aging 7 reactors within operating rules. They call the approach 8 "sharpening the pencil" or "pencil engineering," the 9 fudging of calculations and assumptions to yield answers 10 that enable plants with deteriorating conditions to 11 remain in compliance.
12 Now, I'm just reading a portion here. But 13 we're talking about doing something that has never been 14 done before. And as I've said, and I've been before you 15 several times. You're talking about bombarding metal 16 and concrete with radiation, and this is not good. This 17 isn't something that's ever happened before. You don't 18 have any kind of reference standard by which to make any 19 judgment. You don't know what will happen down the road.
20 But, here is a perfect example of the 21 utility and the NRC giving the blessing saying: Go ahead, 22 cut through that 43-inch wall. And now it's, oh well, 23 September 2009. We'll have it back online in the spring.
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56 1 happen. Well, maybe, maybe not.
2 But supposedly this plant over there in 3 Norway, this is the new design where they said, we've 4 solved all the problems with nuclear power and we won't 5 have any cost overruns and we'll have it completed on 6 time. And neither of those were true. And I'm a child 7 of the `50s and I can remember when they said, it will 8 be too cheap to meter.
9 And, the Price Anderson Act is still on the 10 books. And I haven't heard anybody from the industry 11 say, let's get that Price Anderson Act off the books.
12 This power source is so safe and wonderful, we don't need 13 the Price Anderson Act any more. No, that hasn't 14 happened and I don't think it will.
15 But this is absurd. Absurd, this idea 16 about nuclear power to be the answer. And I just got the 17 word that this place is Green. I see incandescent bulbs.
18 Every time I've been at one of these hearings the lighting 19 isn't even right.
20 MR. SMITH: Thank you very much Mr. Klutho.
21 Okay. I'll allow you to come up, Ms.
22 Sieling.
23 We have someone on the line. I think I 24 heard someone come on the line?
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57 1 MS. SAPORITO: Yes. Yes, there's someone 2 on the line.
3 MR. SMITH: Okay. If you can hold on. We 4 have one more person to come up and we'll allow you to 5 ask your question.
6 And while we have that individual coming up, 7 who do we have on the line?
8 MR. SAPORITO: This is Thomas Saporito, I'm 9 the Senior Consulting Associate of Saprodani and 10 Associates in Jupiter, Florida.
11 MR. SMITH: All right, thank you.
12 Okay, ma'am.
13 MS. SIELING: Hi there. My name's Barbara 14 Sieling. I'm actually from St. Petersburg but I now live 15 just over the Levy County line by Bronson, Florida, which 16 I think is in that 50 mile area.
17 My thing is, and just so you all know where 18 I'm coming from. My shirt, and I like to demonstrate my 19 shirts, I demonstrated the last one: "Only when the last 20 tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and 21 the last fish has been caught, we will realize that we 22 cannot eat money." Because that's all this is about, is 23 it's all about the money.
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58 1 with the jobs, with the real estate, they're the ones that 2 are making the money. They say, profit has no conscious.
3 And that's basically where we are here.
4 The only thing that matters -- I don't 5 understand why you couldn't have jobs brought into this 6 County by -- instead of doing the nuclear plant, building 7 a solar energy plant for the manufacturer so we don't have 8 to go to China to get them, because they seem to be leading 9 us in that, like a lot of other things.
10 I don't understand why -- only positive 11 things people can say on the one said is, it's all about 12 the money, because that's what every person from Chamber 13 of Commerce, developers, realtors, everybody, it's all 14 about the money, or you already have the money, one or 15 the other. Or maybe you sold some of that land to Florida 16 Power so you got some more money.
17 There was an article in the St. Pete Times 18 earlier this month, it was in a Letter to the Editors, 19 that talked about the Duke -- John Blackburn, the former 20 Chancellor of Duke University published a study in 2010 21 showing that solar is cheaper than nuclear, and North 22 Carolina, where Progress Energy and Duke, which are in 23 the process of merging, are both headquartered. His 24 final statement was: Nuclear power is unsafe, unclean, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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59 1 uneconomical, and most important, unnecessary. Which 2 is why Germany and Switzerland is following Italy's lead 3 and doing away with it.
4 Energy efficiency, solar power, vanadium 5 redox batteries can exceed Florida's electricity demand 6 safely, cleanly, economically.
7 I haven't heard any real positive things 8 about nuclear energy except how much money. They're 9 getting their palms greased. Somebody's making money.
10 And most nuclear jobs, from what I understand, the good 11 jobs don't come from local labor, they come from 12 somewhere else.
13 Thank you very much.
14 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Ms. Sieling.
15 So the individual on the line, if you could 16 state your name and the organization again, and please 17 provide your question or your comments.
18 MR. SAPORITO: Can you hear me? I can 19 barely hear you. Can you repeat what you said?
20 MR. SMITH: Yes. My name is George Smith.
21 I'm the --
22 MR. SAPORITO: I can't hardly hear you.
23 MR. SMITH: Sir, we can hear you. My name 24 is George Smith. I'm the facilitator for the meeting.
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60 1 Can you hear me?
2 MR. SAPORITO: I can hear you now.
3 MR. SMITH: Oh, okay. Sorry about that.
4 We can hear you loud and clear. If you can just give us 5 your name, your organization, and you can provide your 6 comments at this time, sir.
7 MR. SAPORITO: All right, thank you. My 8 name is Thomas Saporito. I'm the Senior Consulting 9 Associate with Saprodani Associates and we're located in 10 Jupiter, Florida.
11 My comments today, which I'll get into here 12 in a second. But first I would like to follow the lead 13 of that previous speaker. You know, the utility here --
14 the operator of Crystal River nuclear power plant is 15 talking about expending approximately $1.3 billion in 16 addition to the millions of dollars they've already spent 17 in patching this nuclear reactor's containment building.
18 Whoever the Chief Executive Officer is that 19 made that decision should be fired. That's throwing bad 20 money after good. If you've taken out $1.3 billion and 21 provided that in the form of financing so that the 22 customers of Progress Energy could install solar systems 23 on their homes and businesses, the electric grid load 24 demand would be cut by more than 50 percent, just on that NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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61 1 one initiative alone. And you wouldn't even need the 2 Crystal River nuclear power, you wouldn't need any new 3 nuclear plants, the AP-1000 which the utility intends to 4 build. In fact, you would most likely have to start 5 shutting down a few of the other plants that are online 6 right now supporting that grid.
7 However, this utility has made a business 8 decision to expend $1.3 billion, and I hope they have 9 every intention for their stockholders to foot that bill 10 and not the customer.
11 The NRC should be gravely concerned about 12 this decision. And one of your prior speakers covered 13 some of the facts that came out in a recent AP 14 investigation on nuclear energy, which the Senate 15 Subcommittee now has asked the GAO to do a formal federal 16 investigation on the NRC.
17 With respect to the Crystal River plant, 18 however, that nuclear reactor is approximately 40 years 19 old. That reactor vessel, the metal that holds the 20 nuclear fuel is embrittled. The NRC knows it's 21 embrittled, science has documented that. Neutron 22 bombardment of the metal, which makes up the reactor 23 vessel, causes that vessel to become brittle. And, the 24 AP article also extensively investigated the issue of NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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62 1 these reactors becoming brittle.
2 How can the NRC possibly even consider 3 extending and operating a license for this nuclear plant 4 with a reactor vessel known to be brittle? This is 5 nothing more than a nuclear experiment on the part of the 6 United States Government as represented here today by the 7 Nuclear Regulatory Commission, with public health and 8 safety hanging in the balance of this nuclear experiment.
9 No one knows when these reactors will become 10 too brittle to crack and spill. Because the NRC, over 11 the years, has continued to adjust their own federal 12 safety margins and their own federal safety standards to 13 allow these embrittled nuclear reactors to continue 14 operating.
15 The NRC -- let the record reflect I'm 16 requesting that the NRC require the licensee to do 17 destructive testing on the metal of the reactor vessel 18 to determine the exact state of embrittlement and whether 19 or not that embrittlement is acceptable by the NRC to 20 allow this nuclear reactor to operate 20 years beyond its 21 original design basis and its original license issued by 22 the NRC.
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63 1 bombardment by neutron radiation during the fission 2 process, that would result in what's called a loss of 3 coolant accident, a LOCA, which is exactly what caused 4 the meltdown that is continuing at three, maybe four 5 reactors in Japan right at this time.
6 The water in the reactor core would 7 dissipate, because there would be no vessel to hold it.
8 It doesn't matter how many pumps you turn on, the water 9 would leak right out. The reactor core would melt down 10 and it would result in an explosion that would rip apart 11 that containment building and contaminate probably --
12 most likely the entire State of Florida and parts of 13 Georgia and Texas, and wherever prevailing winds would 14 carry the rest of the contamination.
15 The other issue the NRC should be gravely, 16 gravely concerned about is the licensee's evacuation 17 plan. The NRC is fully aware over the years that these 18 evacuation plans are nothing more than a joke. They're 19 some scribblings on paper that the NRC says, well, that's 20 good enough for us because, you know, we really don't have 21 any regulation with respect to your evacuation plan.
22 You just have to have a plan.
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64 1 sirens, we want to see you alert people. We want to see 2 whether people stay in their houses and believe you that 3 they're safe, or if everybody decides to leave at one 4 time.
5 The NRC doesn't look at whether there are 6 choke points which would prevent evacuation of the 7 populus within a 10 mile or a 50-mile zone of that nuclear 8 plant, because in reality the NRC knows it can never 9 happen. You can never evacuate the people. It's not 10 going to happen.
11 And, as the AP article addressed, the 12 population in and around nuclear plants in the United 13 States, have grown more than tenfold. So when the 14 Crystal River plant was originally designed and licensed 15 by the NRC, well, the population has exploded ten times 16 at least. But the NRC hasn't updated their assessment 17 of the evacuation plan for the Crystal River nuclear 18 power plant. The NRC has never required the licensee to 19 test the plant.
20 So, how can the NRC sit here today and tell 21 the public they're considering extending the operating 22 license by 20 years for this nuclear plant? It doesn't 23 have an actual workable, functional, validated 24 evacuation plan to protect public health and safety.
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65 1 Next, spent nuclear fuel. Crystal River 2 nuclear power plant has a swimming pool on site where they 3 put spent nuclear fuel. Every 18 months they add more 4 spent nuclear fuel to this swimming pool. We saw the 5 swimming pools in Japan catch fire and spew high level 6 radioactive contamination all over the world. It 7 touched California, went all the way across the United 8 States and was picked up in New Jersey, and now even in 9 Florida; Iodine 131.
10 Yet, the spent fuel pools were only designed 11 to meet the capacity of a 40-year license. What's the 12 NRC going to do -- or what requirements are the NRC going 13 to place on the licensee for operating this plant for 20 14 more years? 20 more years of high level nuclear reactive 15 waste for which there's place to store it.
16 It was the NRC's responsibility 30 years 17 ago, and for 30 years the NRC failed to meet its own 18 responsibility to protect public health and safety in 19 designing, constructing and authorizing a high level 20 nuclear waste storage facility.
21 The containment building. The containment 22 building's been the subject of discussion between the 23 NRC, the licensee, and the public, and personally, me, 24 because I have an enforcement petition filed with the NRC NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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66 1 specifically addressing the containment building and the 2 delamination event.
3 This delamination event is nothing new to 4 the NRC with respect to the Crystal River plant because 5 years ago the roof of the containment building had one 6 or more cracks in it, it was found to have delaminations 7 in it. And the NRC allowed the licensee to put band-aids 8 on the roof, patch it up, make the problem go away and 9 go ahead and operate that reactor at full power 10 nonetheless.
11 Now, because the plant has operated near the 12 very end of its safety design basis for which the NRC 13 initially issued a operating license, the steam 14 generators failed. Why did they fail? Well, they 15 plugged up. Contamination from the water going inside 16 the tubes, inside the steam generator. Why? Because 17 that's the end of their life. Forty years, they're 18 supposed to decommission these plants. The engineers 19 knew that, the NRC engineers knew it also. But what 20 happens? Well, the licensee says, we'll just cut a big 21 hole in the side of this containment building and we'll 22 put two more new generators in there so we can continue 23 to operate. The NRC says, go ahead.
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67 1 concrete that was originally poured to make up that 2 containment building was defective. That's right.
3 They found out that the aggregate used in the concrete, 4 which was originally poured to form the walls, the 5 45-inch thick walls of that containment building, was 6 defective. But they told the NRC, but really, you know, 7 what happened was we -- well, when we took the tension 8 off these tendons, these big metal cables that surround 9 the containment building horizontally and vertically, 10 well, we didn't do it right, and that caused extra stress 11 on this 42-inch concrete perimeter wall, and that's why 12 the delamination occurred.
13 Well, I'm here to tell you today, on this 14 public record, nothing could be further from the truth.
15 That concrete crack and the delamination occurred 16 because the concrete itself is defective. The aggregate 17 used in that concrete wasn't qualified. And, the Turkey 18 Point nuclear power plant is made of the same concrete.
19 The reactor -- excuse me -- the containment 20 walls of that containment building, they're 42-inches 21 thick, but the tendons of the outside are within 10 inches 22 of the perimeter of that wall, and the rebar inside that 23 is supposed to provide extra engineering strength to 24 ensure the integrity of that wall. That wall, as NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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68 1 required by the NRC Federal Safety Standards on the 2 licensee's final safety analysis report, is required to 3 be a consistent wall. Meaning, it has to be one solid 4 structure. You cannot patch it. You cannot put any 5 kind of adhesive in there. It has to be a one continuous 6 pour of concrete.
7 So the only way to effectively and correctly 8 repair that concrete is, you have to build another wall.
9 Another wall outside that wall or remove that wall all 10 the way into the reactor vessel's liner, the three-eights 11 stainless steel liner that surrounds the inside of that 12 containment. Well, you're not going to do that because 13 you might as well just go ahead and replace the whole 14 building.
15 So the only way to effectively repair that 16 delamination event is you're going to have to build 17 another containment building around that containment 18 building because that concrete's defective. I don't 19 care what the licensee tells you. No matter how many 20 engineers look at it, if you've got defective aggregate 21 in your concrete, your concrete's defective, no matter 22 how many -- which way you try to tighten those tendons, 23 which way you try to loosen them, you're always going to 24 have delaminations inside there. And some of them may NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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69 1 be so minute you may not even be able to detect them until 2 it's too late, until that containment vessel -- excuse 3 me -- until that containment building is stressed because 4 the reactor tripped offline or because there was an 5 accident inside that containment building which stressed 6 that building to a point where it broke, and it wasn't 7 designed to break. But, it failed because it has 8 defective concrete in it.
9 So if all these issues; the embrittled 10 reactor vessel, the failed evacuation plan, the problem 11 with where do you put the spent nuclear fuel, and the 12 containment building, which has more delaminations now 13 than it did a year ago, how can the NRC sit here today 14 in a public forum and even consider granting an extension 15 for the Crystal River nuclear power plant to operate that 16 nuclear reactor for another 20 years?
17 My research to date, and which was also 18 documented by one or more articles in the media over the 19 course of the last two weeks, shows that every time a 20 licensee applied for an extension to operate their 21 nuclear reactor 20 years beyond its original safety 22 design basis, the NRC reached under their desk, grabbed 23 their rubber stamp and rubber stamped, approved, on the 24 license application. Every time.
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70 1 Now, let's think about that. There's 104 2 nuclear reactors and approximately 65 of them have 3 already been rubber stamped, approved. Do you mean to 4 tell me not one of these nuclear reactors failed any type 5 of licensing reapplication, no matter how different in 6 design the numerous ones are?
7 Because they are very different in design.
8 You have boiling water reactors, pressure water --
9 pressurized water reactors, some made by GE, some made 10 by Westinghouse, some made by Combustion Engineering.
11 And they date back to the early `70s, if not earlier, some 12 of them in the `60s, but they're all fine and dandy.
13 Rubber stamped, operate another 20 years. It just 14 doesn't -- there's just no common sense there that all 15 these nuclear reactors could be fine and safe to operate 16 for 20 more years.
17 So, in closing comments I have to, again, 18 stress that this is a public record, and the people to 19 hold accountable here today are the United States Nuclear 20 Regulatory representatives both here in the room with 21 you, as represented today, and in Washington, DC, 22 including Chairman Gregory Jaczko himself. Because 23 there's something very, very wrong going on in the United 24 States Government vis-a-vis the Nuclear Regulatory NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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71 1 Commission, where these license extensions are being 2 granted just as if your child would ask you, "Is it all 3 right if I have a candy bar?" "Go right ahead, it's not 4 going to hurt you."
5 Thank you very much, NRC.
6 MR. SMITH: Thank you, sir, for your 7 comment. If we could also ask you, if you stay on the 8 line, please, sir, put your phone on mute because if not 9 we could hear you -- we'll be able to hear you. Thank 10 you, sir.
11 Next will be Chuck Riggs. Also after Chuck 12 Riggs will be Helen Spivey and then Clay Clements.
13 While Mr. Riggs is coming to the podium, is 14 there anyone else on the line?
15 (No response.)
16 MR. SMITH: Thank you.
17 MR. RIGGS: My name is Chuck Riggs. I'm 18 from St. Petersburg, and I'm opposed to nuclear power 19 because it just doesn't make any sense. Money is what 20 makes decisions here in America and around the world.
21 And, there is no common sense. There is no logic. There 22 is no reasoning. And if we had all those things, nuclear 23 power wouldn't even be an issue.
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72 1 any good, but we want to stop this from happening. Thank 2 you.
3 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Mr. Riggs.
4 Mrs. Helen Spivey and then Mr. Clay 5 Clements.
6 MS. SPIVEY: Good afternoon. I'm speaking 7 today as a private citizen, but in my background I'm a 8 former member of the Florida House of Representatives and 9 a member of the Crystal River City Council.
10 I just really don't understand why you would 11 grant a 20-year permit to a nuclear plant that is not 12 operational, seems to be disintegrating, and still has 13 onsite all the nuclear waste generated since Day One of 14 its operation.
15 I have often told the incident when I was 16 on Crystal River City Council. I was interviewed -- not 17 interviewed -- I met with a member of the NRC and he gave 18 me a bunch of information and asked if I had any questions 19 and I said, yes. Do you ever feel like the gentleman 20 inventor who was attempting to invent a universal solvent 21 until it finally dawned on him he had nothing to put it 22 in? It's kind of like the spent fuel we're generating 23 here. I feel that what is happening with the attempt to 24 store spent fuel somewhere, and the safety of the spent NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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73 1 fuel chamber at Crystal River is adjacent to the damaged 2 containment building.
3 Citrus County government removed the five 4 mile safety limit for evacuation around this energy 5 complex saying it was useless, and besides, a developer 6 wanted to build with great density within the five mile 7 limit. So, the County just took it away.
8 Citizen safety appears to be a fickle 9 component with this plant in this County. And I would 10 strongly suggest that it not be given 20 years more when 11 it is not in a safe functional state, nor is its spent 12 fuel safe, and they have no place to put it and nowhere 13 to put it.
14 Nuclear technology is constantly 15 frightening citizens with what will never happen, but 16 does happen. Several years ago there was a meeting here 17 by Progress Energy, and they gave out a brochure. It 18 wasn't this one but it was about Progress Energy. And 19 the last chapter in there said that Florida does not have 20 enough sunshine to have solar power. It just really 21 didn't make sense.
22 Do not issue this permit, please. I have 23 grandchildren and friends who live here. And last but 24 not least, myself. Thank you NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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74 1 MR. SMITH: Thank you, ma'am.
2 Mr. Clay Clements.
3 Is there anyone else on the line that we have 4 not heard from?
5 (No response.)
6 MR. SMITH: Thank you.
7 MR. CLEMENTS: My name's Clay Clements.
8 I'm with Somex.
9 What we need in this County is responsible, 10 safe, employers. Progress Energy share in that. We 11 fully support the extension. They create jobs and 12 they're a good business partner. So, we really want to 13 support the extension. Thanks.
14 MR. SMITH: Thank you, Mr. Clements.
15 I'm showing this to be my last comment card.
16 Is there anyone that I mixed up the cards and did not get 17 to?
18 (No response.)
19 MR. SMITH: Or are there any other comments 20 you would like to make at this time?
21 (No response.)
22 MR. SMITH: On behalf of the NRC we would 23 like to thank you for your comments and thank you for 24 showing up today at the public meeting.
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75 1 I just want to emphasize the fact that the 2 public comments today will be utilized for the results 3 of the NRC Environmental Review, and this will be part 4 of the final review.
5 Also, you have the e-mail site and the 6 Federal Rulemaking website.
7 Sir, on the line, if you don't have that 8 information if you'll hold on we'll give you that 9 information once everyone has left. I don't want to hold 10 them up to provide you that information.
11 Okay. Good. We have your e-mail address 12 and we'll provide you that information.
13 Again, thank you very much. We have a 14 second meeting at 6:00, the open house will start at 5:00.
15 Thank you.
16 Again, that meeting is at 7:00, open house 17 is at 6:00, meeting's at 7:00.
18 (Off the record, 3:48 p.m.)
19 (Back on the record for public comment, 4:37 20 p.m.)
21 MR. MOORE: Good afternoon. My name is 22 Brian Moore. I live in Spring Hill, Hernando County, 23 approximately 25 miles south of the Crystal River nuclear 24 plant project. And I'm here today, on the 28th of June NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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76 1 of 2011, to voice my opposition to the NRC's conclusion 2 that the subject system's operability is reasonable and 3 insured.
4 NRC based its conclusions on licensing --
5 a letter report request from October of 2008 through 6 January of 2010, and possibly beyond. However, in light 7 of the recent developments during the previous three 8 months, it should be noted that the NRC, hopefully, will 9 update its various requirements for subject systems 10 current licensing design basis and regulatory 11 requirements and controls. One has the impression that 12 they're basing their decision based on data submitted 13 over the last two years and prior to the recent 14 developments that have occurred worldwide in the nuclear 15 industry.
16 We have seen and read about Japan's 17 experience and its problems with its nuclear reactors 18 because of the earthquake and subsequent floodings. We 19 also have recently read of the two Nebraska nuclear plant 20 floodings and the Yankee plant in Vermont where the 21 people have voted to discontinue its operation.
22 Just recently, in the last Sunday's New York 23 Times, there was a major article on Japan's situation, 24 and they addressed the issue of the safety myth. And the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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77 1 idea was that the government and the utility and power 2 companies kept promoting with the people the idea that 3 nuclear power is always safe, and they did it to the point 4 where it's almost a myth. And it caused a situation 5 where the population hardly questioned the danger, or in 6 the reverse, there were protestors. However, the press 7 and the media never gave them proper recognition as to 8 their concerns. And the subsequent result, of course, 9 has been the failure and contamination of a part of the 10 country and possibly a part of the globe.
11 Recently we're also read of Germany 12 deciding to close down its nuclear system, France 13 questioning its own nuclear power situation, and Japan 14 is now moving away from the use of nuclear power. In 15 fact, even though there's been no decommissioning of 16 plants in the United States, we have read of them 17 occurring in Germany, Italy, and now Japan.
18 Another issue I'd like to raise is the five 19 year hiatus of the plant operating. Apparently it went 20 down in 2009 due to a crack and it will not be up and 21 operating until 2014. And this would be a five year time 22 frame where the populous is being charged monies to pay 23 down without any power benefits. So now that a second 24 crack has occurred most recently, I would hope that the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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78 1 Nuclear Regulatory Commission would take that into 2 consideration.
3 My impression from their letter, of the 24th 4 of June of 2011, is that they have concluded that the 5 licensee here in Crystal River has adequately 6 demonstrated its ability to take appropriate action when 7 conditions adversely arise. However, they demonstrated 8 that fact in 2008, 2009 and 2010. And this was prior to 9 all of the subsequent failures that have occurred in 10 Japan and here in the United States, and even with regard 11 to Crystal River itself.
12 Another factor that I am concerned about is 13 that Progress Energy, apparently who are running this 14 nuclear plant, indicate that they have insurance 15 coverage for their repairs. However, one has to raise 16 the question about insurance for the nuclear plants.
17 It's my understanding that even the Lloyds 18 of London, and no insurance companies, will insure 19 nuclear plants because of the incredible costs involved 20 and the level of danger. So maybe the insurance coverage 21 that they speak to is just a repair factor.
22 Now, personally I have been a candidate for 23 Congress in 2002 and 2004, and I was a candidate for the 24 U.S. Senate against Senator Nelson in the Democratic NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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79 1 Primary in 2006, and I was a Presidential candidate in 2 the Socialist Party in 2008, and a Gubernatorial 3 candidate in the Democratic Party in 2010.
4 All of these times I have taken the position 5 of objecting to the use of nuclear power. And I not only 6 speak as an individual, but I'm chairman of a coalition 7 of people that represent a variety of political parties; 8 democrats, republicans and independents, who have 9 similar strong beliefs. And even though I speak as an 10 individual at this meeting, I know I reflect a serious 11 concern on the part of most people of the coalition.
12 And, finally, I want to acknowledge that our 13 Congressman, Richard Nugent, who was recently elected to 14 be Congressman for this District, which includes Crystal 15 River and Levy County, just this week came out in favor 16 of withdrawing from the wars in the Middle East. And he 17 represents a conservative republican philosophy, and we 18 not only oppose the wars over the last ten years, but we 19 have opposed nuclear power. And I think it's an 20 indication that the population is certainly open and 21 willing to change with regard -- if they can change on 22 major wars, then they can change on the use of nuclear 23 power, or the elimination of it and the closing down of 24 it.
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80 1 So, I am making this statement because I 2 want to go on record, but I also want you, the 3 Commissioners and the politicians, to understand the 4 concerns of some consumers, and that you also will be held 5 accountable in the subsequent future regarding the use 6 or misuse or abuse of this power. And we hope that you 7 will reconsider your position and do not extend the lease 8 until 2016, and also to decommission this plant and cease 9 construction of two new major plants in the Levy County 10 area.
11 I have brought with me several signs that 12 I used over the past years. Here's a sign that says, "No 13 nuclear projects," and it says, "Socialist `08." It had 14 my name there which I blacked out because I use it in 15 subsequent years. But it was opposition to the nuclear 16 projects in our country.
17 This is a recent sign banning the nuclear 18 power that our coalition is using and has used over the 19 past year-and-a-half. We question whether we are safe 20 with nuclear power or not.
21 And this just goes to show the history of 22 our concern in the community. In 2002 we have this sign.
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81 1 true of nuclear power, not only in Crystal River but in 2 the State of Florida and in the entire United States.
3 So, I thank you very much.
4 I forgot to mention that I have a letter here 5 from Congressman Nugent that was sent to my colleague, 6 Jerry Cox, on the 20th of April. And, the Congressman 7 mentions that the Crystal River nuclear plant has steel 8 lined pools which are approximately 43 feet deep from top 9 to bottom. And since 1977, when the nuclear plant went 10 online, the station has stored its fuel onsite. And as 11 of March 2011, 1,319 assemblies reside in this spent fuel 12 pool and reactor vessel.
13 Each fuel assembly is 14-feet long and 14 9-inches wide. And the assemblies are stored in the 15 pools and are covered by 20 to 30 feet of water, treated 16 with boron, which serves as a neutron absorber. Now, we 17 realize and recognize that Crystal River is very close 18 to the Gulf of Mexico, the major water body, and so was 19 Japan and also the two nuclear sites that are of concern 20 in Nebraska. So this raises another issue of, how safe 21 is the plant in proximity if a hurricane or some major 22 catastrophic thing should occur. Thank you.
23 (Afternoon session concluded, 4:51 p.m.)
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