ML20199D951
| ML20199D951 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Sequoyah  |
| Issue date: | 06/13/1986 |
| From: | Advisory Committee on Reactor Safeguards |
| To: | |
| References | |
| ACRS-T-1521, NUDOCS 8606230143 | |
| Download: ML20199D951 (93) | |
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O UN11EU STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION IN THE MATTER OF: DOCKET NO:
ADVISORY COMMITTEE ON REACTOR SAFEGUARDS AD HOC SUBCOMMITTEE ON TVA O
LOCATION: DAISY, TENNESSEE PAGES: 1-85 DATE: FRIDAY, JUNE 13, 1986 i
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ACRSDFFICECDPY Jo Kot Remove from ACRS 0"fice 62 g 3 860613 l T-1521 PDR . mE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
l OfficialReporters l 444 North Capitol Street Washington, D.C. 20001 (202)347-3700 NATIONWIDE COVERAGE
PUBLIC NOTICE BY THE UNITED STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSIONERS' ADVISORY COMMITTEE ON REACTOR SAFEGUARDS FRIDAY, JUNE 13, 1986 The contents of this stenographic transcript of the proceedings of the United States Nuclear Regulatory.
Commission's Advisory Committee on Reactor Safeguards (ACRS), as reported herein, is an uncorrected record of the discussions recorded at the meeting held on the above date.
No member of the ACRS Staff and no participant at
() this meeting accepts any responsibility for errors or inaccuracies of statement or data contained in this transcript.
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f~ 1 h 00000101 marysimons 1 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION
- 3 I 4
5 ADVISORY COMMITTEE ON REACTOR SAFEGUARDS 6 AD HOC SUBCOMMITTEE ON TENNESSEE VALLEY AUTHORITY 7
8 9 Sequoyah Nuclear Power Plant Plant Conference Room 10 Plant Office Building Soddy-Daisy, Tennessee
.11 Friday, June 13, 1986 12
. f m. _
The subcommittee reconvened, pursuant to notice, i 13 at 8:45 a.m., Charles J. Wylie, Chairman of the 14 Subcommittee, presiding.
15 16 ACRS MEMBERS PRESENT:
17 C. WYLIE, Chairman M. CARBON 18 J. EBERSOLE C. MICHELSON 19 G. REED D. WARD 20 i
21 ACRS CONSULTANTS PRESENT:
22 P. BARTON H. HAGEDORN 23 24 COGNIZANT ACRS STAFF MEMBER PRESENT:
25 R. SAVIO O -
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, Q marysimons 1 NRC. STAFF AND PRESENTERS PRESENT:
2 C. STAHLE J. YOUNGBLOOD 3 L. CROCKER D. CLARK 4 R. HERNAN R. GRIDLEY 5 C. MASON H. ABERCROMBIE 6 M. TAYLOR L. NOBELS 7
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(_) marysimons i 1 PR0CEEDINGS 2 MR. WYLIE: The meeting will come to order.
3 This is a continuation of the ACRS meeting of the 4 review by the Advisory Committee on Reactor Safeguards 5 Subcommittee.
6 I am Charlie Wylie and the other ACRS subcommittee 7 members here today are Dr. Carbon, Mr. Ebersole, Mr.
8 Michelson, Mr. Reed, Mr. Ward and our consultants Mr. Barton 9 and Mr. Hagedorn, and Dr. Savio is the cognizant ACRS staff 10 member for the meeting today.
11 We will continue where we left off last evening, 12 and we are here to further hear and ask pertinent questions
('
( 13 regarding the Sequoyah Nuclear Performance Plan and other 14 questions which were deferred to this morning.
15 So with that, I think we can continue, and I 16 believe Mr. Chuck Mason is here and I will turn it over to 17 him.
18 MR. MASON: Before we get started, I guess I would 19 like to verify some housekeeping items, and one is the 20 schedule. I want to make sure that you see the exit at 21 12:15 if that is what your desire is.
22 We do have a plant tour, not a general tour. We 23 are going to arrange for you to go, as I understand you 24 wanted to, to some areas where we are doing some work in
,e- 25 regard to environmental qualification and alternate analysis l
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( ) marysimons 1 or whatever, and we have got some people picking out some 2 reasonably easy to get to areas where we have done that kind 3 of work and we will be ready to take that tour.
4 Am I right that you want to get out of here at 5 12:157 6 MR. WYLIE: 12:45 I guess.
7 MR. MASON: 12:45. Okay, we will try to finish at 8 12:45. I don't know how much time you want to spend on the 9 tour right now. We are scheduled to start the tour at 11
- 10 o' clock. That will give us an hour and 45 minutes. Is that 11 enough to see what you want to see?
12 MR. WYLIE: I think so, yes.
p
(_) 13 MR. ABERCROMBIE: If there are specific areas, and 14 I don't know what Chuck mentioned, that you would like to 15 see, if you would let me know those, we could go ahead and 16 make some arrangements now so that you could get in and look 17 at anything you want to look at.
18 MR. YOUNGBLOOD: Does anybody want to see the dog 19 house?
20 MR. STAHLE: Yes, I would to see that for a 21 specific purpose.
22 MR. ABERCROMBIE: Okay, the main steam valve 23 vault.
24 MR. WARD: I don't know that that means the fs 25 committee wants to see it.
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q 00000101 5 l,j-marysimons 1 MR. EBERSOLE: The main steam valve dog houses?
2 MR. ABERCROMBIE: Yes.
3 MR. EBERSOLE: I would like to see it.
4 MR. ABERCROMBIE: Okay, we can do that.
5 MR. EBERSOLE: About the dog house, I might ask a 6 question. I hear there is a big flap going on about the 7 superheat problem.
8 MR. MASON: There is a superheat issue here.
9 MR. EBERSOLE: Suppose that you get a superheat 10 problem and argue that you are going to lose everything in 11 one train anyway, which you would be likely to do if you had 12 a hypothetical failure of the pipe near the valve. Is that
() 13 right?
14 MR. MASON: I don't understand the question.
15 MR. EBERSOLE: You are going through a great deal 16 of effort for environmental qualifications for superheat, 17 and it ain't going to be superheat that is going to tear the 18 system up, but bit is going to be physical violence of a 19 hypothetical local rupture, isn't it?
20 MR. MASON: I would imagine you are probably 21 correct.
22 MR. EBERSOLE: Then you can save yourself a lot of 23 work.
24 MR. MASON: Carl, did you get that?
-s 25 (Laughter.)
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'1 MR..EBERSOLE: Why worry about dying from one -l l
2 cause'when another is going to get your first?
l 3 .(Laughter.) l 4 But. MASON: I understand you wanted to ask Marilyn
-i 5 Taylor some specific questions'for about a half hour about '
6 training and testing and that' sort of thing. I would like 7 to-do-that at the end of our morning's session, if that iis 8 okay'with everybody so we can.let most of these other people 9 go and we will keep Marilyn-in here and talk specifically 10 about personnel management matters. There is no use to keep 11 everybody tied up.
12 MR. WYLIE: That's fine, q(_/ 13 MR. MASON: So we will try to do that starting 14 about 9:45 I guess. That will give us a half hour to 10:15 15 and.then NRC for 15 minutes and then we will start th'e plant
- 16. tour.
17 MR. MICHELSON: Would it be possible.to arrange
{- 18 perhaps this afternoon to see of your fire protection 19 features in certain vital areas like switchgear rooms?
20 MR. MASON: That was one of the things we were 21 going.to show, and Appendix R is one of them.
22 MR. MICHELSON: Depending on what I see this 23 morning, I may not want to see any more, but if I don't, 24 maybe I could go back this afternoon and look in detail 25 around your 40 volt transformer rooms and ---
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,1 MR. EBERSOLE: Along that line, Chuck, I would 2 like to have you show and tell us what they did to keep
'3 these guys that designed the CO-2 system from blowing the 4 rooms that they were trying to protect. I don't know 5 whether you built stronger doors or relief ports or 6 qualified valves or what you did. That was fascinating in 7 an attempt to provide safety.
8 MR. MASON: We are relooking at our CO-2 system in 9 all the plants right now.
10 Is there anything else we need to discuss before 11 we get started of general housekeeping type matters?
12 (No response.)
() 13 I would like to go around the room and introduce 14 the TVA people.
- 15 I am Chuck Mason, Deputy Manager of Nuclear Power, i
16 MR. GRIDLEY: Dick Gridley, Director of Safety and 17 Licensing.
- 18 MR. LAMBERT
- David Lambert, Manager of Fuels and
- 19 Standards, Licensing.
20 MR. TORMEY: Mike Tormey. I am on the Restart
. t 21 Task Force.
I 22 MS. TAYLOR: I am Me.rilyn Taylor, the Director of i
23 Nuclear Personnel.
, 24 MR. SMITH: Gerald Smith. I am also on the task 25 force.
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,! ,[.00000101-marysimons 1 MR. PRIEST: I am Alan Priest.- I am also on the 2' task-force. ~
3 MR. JONES: Henry-Jones, Division of' Nuclear 4 Engineering.
5
, MR..MATTHEWS: Mike Matthews, Restart Task Force.
l 6 MR. HALL: G. T. Hall, Division of Nuclear '
e
' 7 Engineering.
- 8 MR. HUTSON
- Jim Hutson,_ Division of Nuclear-9 Engineer'ing.
10 MR. WILLIAMS: Bob Wiliams, Division.of Nuclear
- l. 11- . Engineering.
12 _MR. JENISON: My name is Ken Jenison. I am the
[ 13 Senior. Resident Inspector.
f 14 MR. NOBLES: I am Larry Lobles. I am the j 15 Superintedent of Operations, i
t 16 MR. STAGNOLIA: I am Steve Stagnolia, Field 17 Services Manager.
i
- j. 18 MR. BUCHHOLZ: Bob Buchholz, Site Representative.
19 MR. KIRK: Glen Kirk, Compliance Licensing.-
j 20 MR.-BIRCHELL: Bob Birchell, Compliance. Licensing.
l 21 MR. JOHNSON: Charlie Johnson, Division of Nuclear 22 -Engineering.
l 23 MR. ANDREWS: Walter Andrews, Site Quality- 1-24 Manager.
c.
25 MR. KEG: Jim Keg, Lead Mechanical Engineer.
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( j marysimons l' MR. COX. I am John Cox, Assistant Project 4 2 -Engineer, Sequoyah Engineering Project.
3 MR. ELKINS: I am Don Elkins, Instrument t
4 Maintenance.
5 MR. ABERCROMBIE: Herb Abercrombie, Site Director.
6 MR. WALLACE: I am Phil Wallace, Sequoyah Plant 7 Manager.
8 MR. MASON: I don't have a lot of slides, and I 9 know you looked at a lot of slides yesterday. I do have 10 three that I want to put here.
11 (Slide.)
12 You heard in the introduction that we do have, and
'() 13 I am sure you heard about it yesterday, too, we do have a 14- restart task force out here. The task force was formed 15 right after Mr. White made his presentation to the 16 Commission on March the lith.
17 The members of the task force are myself, Herb 18 Abercrombie, the Site Director, Bob Buchholtz, who is Mr.
19 White's Site Representative, Mike Matthews, QA, and Alan 20 Priest. Mr. Matthews is a Stone and Webster employee and 21 Mr. Buchholtz is a General Electric employee. Mr. Priest is 22 a Bechtel employee. Joe Smith is also a Bechtel employee, 23 and March Tormey, Stone and Webster.
24 We have got various backgrounds and experience _
25 -
represented by the task force and it represents a pretty O-1 l
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1 broad spectrum of the issues that we are dealing with at 2 Sequoyah.
, 3 Mr. White gave us a charter of assisting him in
. 4 the restate of Sequoyah, and our primary objectives were-to 5 revise.V'olume.2 of the Nuclear Performance Plan to make it 6 compatible with Volume 1 for submitted to the NRC.
~7 Now Volume 2 of the Sequoyah Restart Performance '
i
- 8- plan was submitted initially to the NRC in November of last 9 year, and after the change in management and the change in 10 philosophy that was reflected in the revised Volume 1, we 11 have to go back and revise Volume 2 to makefit compatible
- 12 with that.
( 13 We were also to identify problems and initiate
! 14 actions for resolution and inclusion in Volume 2, and that 15 _is pretty broad across the board to get allithe issues up on
[ 16 a table and make a decision of which worked out on Sequoyah
- 17 needed'to be done before restart and which ones could be.
i 18 postponed until after restart, and we needed to include this 19 list of work items in Volume 2. --
20 .We briefed the Manage of Power, Mr. White. I talk 21 with him daily'on-the task force progress and problems,-and e
~
22 starting next week we are going to have a face-to-face
- 23 meeting with him once a week to go over our schedule of
- 24 activities and how well we are doing on it.
25 The task force has I think been very effective in
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( ) marysimons 1- getting issues upon the table and providing assurance that 2 we are examining all of the possible restart items and 3 making decisions regarding whether they have to be done 4 before restart or they can be postponed until later.
5 The preparation of Volume 2 and a schedule for the 6 restart of Sequoyah, we are working very diligently on both 7 of those tasks, and I think the NRC last week indicated that 8 they expected to see something by the end of the month. I 9 am not sure that they will see it. Like I say, we are 10 working on it hard and we have got to present both of these 11 things to Mr. White, and I am sure he is-going to look at 12 them very carefully before he releases them either publicly r"N
( ,) 13 or to the NRC.
14 (Slide.)
4 15 This is the site organization as it existed before 16 Mr. White came, and I want to point out the major features 17 of it. We will address the change as a result of Mr.
.18 White's leadership and direction.
19 The Site Director of course is at the top. You 20 have Staff, Personnel Services, Financial Planning and an 21 Assistant.
22' On the top horizontal line over on the far right 23 we have the Division of Quality Assurance with a dotting i
24 line reporting to the Site Director for coordination and day- _
- 25 to-day integration of activities. They have always been J
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(_) marysimons I hard lined to corporate QA.
2 Then we have a Site Services Branch and they 3 provide various engineering services as well as a 4 administrative services, document control, codes and 5 standards and that sort of thing.
6 Coming over to the left of the vertical line, we 7 have the Division of Engineering. You notice that is a 8 dotted line before the Design Services Manager. These have 9 always been dotted lined. The Engineering Organization has 10 been dotted line to the Site Director and hard lined, if you 11 want to put it that way, back to Knoxville to the Office of 12 Engineering before Mr. White.
/~%
(,) 13 We did have a Design Services Manager with design 14 engineering experience and background directly on the Site 15 Director's staff. She had a' smaller staff in the Design 16 Services Group. With this particular arrangement if we had 17 a modification to do, the Design Services Group would go to 18 our engineering people who were'on site for the last two 19 years, and the Design Services Manager could get a quote
. 20 from our engineering to do the design of a modification or
! 21 they could quote from an outside organization.
22 Almost exclusively I think we use our own people.
23 I don't know of any particular modifications that we bid out 24 to others than TVA. But he did have that capability I guess
.25 if he wanted to use it.
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- 1. MR. EBERSOLE: Let me ask you a question. This 2 mix of' functional' duties and' excellence is interesting and 3- interfaces with the career advancement, et cetera,.and in 4 short these guys work for you but they are from Knoxville.
5 MR. MASON: That.is right.
j- 6 MR. EBERSOLE: Who recognizes the people for i .
l 7 exceIIent and non-excellent performance and properly judges )
8 whether they should climb up or go down?
i j
! 9 MR. MASON: Well, basically I guess I would answer 10
~
that by saying both the Site Director's organization and the 11' Knoxville organization. We may have a hard runner in 12 engineering on site that functionally reports to Knoxville,
( 13 but he may have a career desire to go into operations and 14 get a license and we have the capability of doing that, and 15 if he is an excellent performer we will certainly do that.
16 MR. EBERSOLE: Does it work?
17 'MR.' MASON: yes. As a matter of fact, I think we 18 have got some design engineers in License training right 19 now. We have some construction engineers in License 20 training.
21 MR. EBERSOLE: So they may go either way.
22 MR. MASON: yes, they may go either way.
23 Now over on the far left we have a Modifications 24 Group which are the ones who implement the modifications. _
25 The Modifications Manager also has the capability of either ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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( ) marysimons 1 doing the modifications in-house or-deciding whether to go 2 to our Division of Construction to have them done or 3 possibly even going outside and having an outside contractor 4 do it.
5 Now directly underneath the Site Director on the 6 vertical lines, the Plant Manager, his immediate staff, and 7 he has an Operations and Technical Support Group 8 Superintendent and a Maintenance Superintendent.
9 Now I would like to put the next slide up and show 10 you what changes we have made since January that are site 11 specific.
12 (Slide.)
(D s_/ 13 Immediately under the Site Director we have given 14 him some more staff. We have moved the Planning and 15 Scheduling Organization up. They used to report to the 16 Plant Manager. We have moved that up to report directly to ,
17 the Site Director.
18 He still has Personnel Services and Financial 19 Services, and we have moved the Manager of Projects up to 20 report to the Site Director.
21 The Manager of Projects has varying responsibility 22 depending on the major projects that we have got going, and 23 each major project, like Appendix R, for example, we count 24 upon a Project Manager to shepherd that from cradle to 25 grave. He will be responsible for taking it from conception
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I all the way through implementation and testing.
2 I don't know right now how many Project Managers 3 we have got, but we have got several in that category.
4 Over on the left on this chart is Quality i
5 Assurance and you can see again the dotted line to the 6 Quality Manager. That is hard lined to Mr. White's staff 7 downtown, and the Director of Quality reports directly to 8 Mr. White.
9 Over on the far right we have the Licensing Group i
I 10 reporting to Mr. Gridley hard lined and dotted lined into 11 the Site Director for Coordination on the day-to-day 12 activities. This is the first time we have had a Site N .
._)
s 13 Licensing Group in TVA. I think'it is going to work out 14 well and we are going to more responsive to some of our i- 15 licensing concerns as a result of that.
16 The second block in from the right is the Project 17 Engineer, and he is dotted lined into the Site Director and 18 hard lined into Knoxville.
19 We no longer have a Design Services Manager in 20 that chain.
4 21 The most significant ch'ange associated with that 22 particular group is that now the Project Engineer has a 23 responsibility for the design integrity of the plant.
24 Before January, even though we had the people on 25 site, the responsibility for the design integrity of the O
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es 00000101 16 I J marysimons 1 plant rested with the Branch Chiefs in Knoxville. We have 2 now given that responsibility to the Project Engineer and we 3 have moved additional staff, and right now we have a lot of 4 contract people also working for the Project Engineer.
5 MR. EBERSOLE: In the modifications area how do 6 you tie back to the engineering sector? I don't see 7 anything.that ties it, unless there is supposed to be a link 8 between the dotted and vertical lines under the Division of 9 Nuclear Construction.
10 MR. MASON: Well, it is tied on the dotted line on il site, and it is also tied in the same manner with the 12 corporate level. The Director of Construction had a
/
(_) 13 responsibility for the Modifications Group at the site and 14 of course he responds to the requirements of the Site 15 Director and works hand in glove with the Design 16 Organization.
17 MR. EBERSOLE: So there is a connection there --
18 there is a black dot where those lines intersect I guess, 19 the Director of Nuclear Construction and Modifications line.
20 MR. MASON: Right.
21 MR. EBERSOLE: Can you mention the makeup of your 22 Chemistry Section. I always envision changing the steam 23 generators out ---
24 MR. MASON: We'll get down there just in a 25 minute. The Site Services Group, we have changed the makeup O
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- 00000101 17 (s) marysimons 1 of.that group a little bit. Mostly now they are more 2 administrative in nature and less technical support in Site 3 . Services since we do have more engineering capability on 4 site. We have moved some of the technical responsibilities i
5 out of site service and back into the Project' Engineer's 6 group, i 7 Going on down to the Plant Manager, of course his 8 immediate staff hasn't changed much other than Planning and 9 Schedules has been moved up to the Site Director, i 10 The most significant changes under the Plant l 11 Manager has been pulling the health physics function. The i
12 Radiological Control Group in the middle used to report to
() 13 the Operations and. Technical Support Superintendent, and 14 they have been elevated to report directly to the Plant 15 Manager.
16 Also under the Operations and Technical Support, I
i 17 we have moved Chemistry up to report directly to.the 18 Superintendent. I think before on-the previous chart that 19 group was a member of the Technical Support Section.
20 As far as-makeup of the Chemistry Section, Phil or 21 Larry, do you want to addr,ess the makeup of the Chemistry l
22 Section and tell who all you have got in there and what kind 23 of capabilities?
24 MR. NOBLES: Larry Nobles, Superintendent of 25 Operations. The Chemistry Section is composed of the i
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( ) marysimons-I engineering side and the lab side. The engineering side is 2 composed of approximately 10 chemical engineers, and on the 3 lab side there is an engineer-over them more or.less that 4 .has responsibility for the count room and the lab room. We 5 can analyze anything. We are state of the art and becoming 6 more so every day in. buying new equipment and so on. We 7 have our own AA lab.
8 MR. EBERSOLE: So you don't intend to change out 9 the steam generators, do you?
10 MR. NOBLES: No, sir. We are doing everything we 11 can to prevent it.
12 MR. MASON: Jesse, I might comment that we learned
() 13 the hard way that we need to pay more attention to 14 chemistry. When Unit 1 started up, we didn't pay good 15 attention to chemistry, and I guess in an outage we.went in 16 and did some eddy current testing about 12 months ---
17 MR. NOBLES: After 64 power days.
18 MR. MASON: We hadn't been operating very long 19 anyway.
20 MR. EBERSOLE: Isn't this recovery from cold 21 shutdown going to be a nightmare?
22 MR. MASON: Is this one?
23 MR. EBERSOLE: Yes.
24 MR. MASON: It is going to be tougher than usual, 25 but let me finish my explanation on the steam generator. We ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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...(3,)- marysimons 1 .found evidence of denting pretty widespread. It was just 12 starting, but it was enough to get our attention very 3
. quick. We were in the process at that time of fixing to 4 start up Unit 2. So when Unit 2 started up, we applied real
- . 5 stringent' chemistry _ controls on Unit 2. We took the unit 6 -off line and we got a spec and we blew down an'd we' cleaned- '
7 up. I thinkLwe maintained real tight control on Unit 2 and 8 we have applied the same controls for Unit 1.
9 I guess our experience since then is we have found
-10 no denting on Unit 2 and we have arrested the denting on 11- Unit,1. It hasn't gotten any worse, significantly worse 12- than it was during that first outage. It has really paid- ,.
i'
( .
-13 .off. We-have put some good people in our Chemistry Group 14 and we have state of the art equipment and we are giving i-15 -good training.
16 MR. EBERSOLE: Did the scale'come out of the dents-1 -17 that was causing the problem?
18- MR. MASON: No. I don't guess our visual looks l-
~
19 -have verified that the scale has fallen out of the cracks.
l- 20. MR. REED: What model steam generators are these?
! 21. Are these Model D's?
22 MR. MASON: No.
i 23 MR. REED: These are not preheater types?
24 MR. MASON: Model 51's. The heat treating problem 4
25 makes them susceptible to primary stress corrosion.
1
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20 (s)_marysimons 1 MR. NOBLES: We plan on annealing them, and I l
2 think we have that scheduled for cycle three. ,
3 PUt. EBERSOLE: Annealing them did you say? !
4 MR. NOBLES: Yes, with'an annealing process, row 5 one and two. This is a new process that Westinghouse has 6 developed supposed to relieve thSt stress.
7 MR. EBERSOLE: What are you going to do g heat 8 them?
9 '!Gl. NOBLES: Probably electrical.
10 MR. MASON: We are going to do that oq Watts Bar 11 here probably within the next six weeks.
12 MR. MICHELSON: Have you finished your slide here?
(s
(_) 13 MR. MASON:
i Yes, I an basic 611y through with the 14 slide, unless anybody has got any other questions.
15 MR. CA'RBON: I have a question. When you provide 16 engineering support to maintenance?
- 17 MR. MASON: Well, each maintenance section, 18 electrical maintenance, instrumentation maintenance and
. .t.
19 mechanical maintenance is set up kind of like Larry i i 20 described for Chemistry. They have got an engineering side 21 and they have got a craft s$de. They have got a Craft 22 Supervisor and they have got an Engin,eering Supervisor.
- 23 In addition to that under,the Project Engineer we 24' .have some operational support capabilities. They are people s
25 who used to be in our Chattanooga operation that were ACE FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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,. 000001011 -21 (j7marysimons i- 1- maintenance specialists, turbine specialists, pump and heat 2 exchanger specialists. If we run into a problem that the 3- engineering group and maintenance is unable to resolve, then 4- we turn to our Engineering Group and get the additional 5 support.
6- MR. EBERSOLE: Do you have any trouble with these 7 jurisdictional cuts between maintenance? For. instance when 8 you come to a valve, which is a mechanical device, does it
).
9' take a bunch of folks to work on it and is there no 10 godfather for the valve as an entity?
,, -11 MR. MASON: We have come a long way in that regard f
l~ 12 in particularly the last five years since the labor market.
II 13 has kind of-turned around. We have got a mixed group
). 14 concept and right now we are fixing.to implement a new 15 agreement with the Labor Council that will basically tur:
i j 16 backing down to about'six mayor crafts-and only one 17 mechanical I guess, and that problem is going away..
18 MR. EBERSOLE: For instance, to-go back, our
- 19 problem has always been there is no real godfather to 20
~
anything 1n TVA. What about a valve that stands away and j
21 says it is ready to go? One person?
22 MR. NOBLES: The operator really does that.
23' , MR. EBERSOLE: So you make a private inquiry to f
24' each of the sectors that did work on it?
.gss 25 MR. NOBLES: We generally participate in post-t
(_)
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'l maintenance testing.
2 MR. BARTON: In doing station modifications, are 3 all of them completely done by your Modifications Section, 4 or dk) .your maintenance people-do some of your modifications?
5 MR. MASON: The only. modification that the 6 Maintenance Section does is instrumentation and controls as 7 a routine. They do do all of the instrumentation because 8 the Modification Group does not have the instrument 9 mechanics and the specialists that are required to do the 10 instrumentation modifications, and we don't anticipate 11 building the modifications up with that capability.
12 On certain selected modifications, if we are doing.
() 13 maintenance on a pump, for example, and there is a 14 modification that changes an "O" ring or something like 15 that, the maintenance people will go ahead and do that, and 16 there is some swap-off. If Modifications is doing big 17 modifications and there is a little bit of maintenance to be i
18 done there, the two groups get together and decide who is
- 19 going to do what part of it.
20 MR. EBERSOLE: "O" rings are in high interest now.
<- 21 MR. MASON: Yes, and they always have been.
22 (Laughter.)
' 23 MR. EBERSOLE: Before they change out an "O" ring, 24 what sort of surveillance and judgment do they apply?'
25 MR. MASON: Basically the part number and i
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,f - 00000101 23 (j marysimons 1 traceability and of course a comparison of physical size, 2 but it is~a part number and traceability question.
3 MR. BnRTON: With the mixed responsibility for the 4 modification and the paperwork that confirms the 5 modification, are there two systems, one for maintenance and 6 one for the Modification Group, or is it all one complete 7 system of paper?
3 8 MR. MASON: It is one complete system of paper. If 9 we are doing a modification,_it requires a work plan, which 10 is very rigid in what is required in that work plan. If 11 Maintenance is doing an instrumentation modification, they 12 fill out the same type of plan-and it goes through the same
( 13 review cycle as if Modification was changing out a pump.
14 MR. BARTON: So you don't have two sets of 15 controls for the two different groups?
16 MR. MASON: No, the same set of controls and the 17 same set of paperwork.
18 MR. WYLIE: Maybe you covered this and I just 19 missed it, but where does the responsibility lie for.the ,
20 management and control in the coordination of modifications?
21 MR. MASON: Let me address that a little bit.
22 Under this matrix organization where we have got the 23 Modification Group reporting to the Division.of Construction 24 which is headquartered in Knoxville and the Design Group s 25 which is headquartered Knoxville, I guess the easiest way to ACE FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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. l 1 00000101 24 faarysimons 1- explain it in my terms'is the Site Director. decides what is 2 to be done and when.it is to be done. He specifies the 3 schedule and he specifies-the way we are going to do this 4J .particular modification during this outage or next outage or 5 he comes up and says we'need a modification to fix-this.
6 The Division of Engineering,.the Project Engineer 7 decides how that is to be done and who is going to.do the 8' design on it, whether it is going to be done by TVA'in-house:
9 or whether~1t.is going to go outside or whether it-is going 10 to go to Knoxville.
11 And the same thing applies to modifications. The:
12 Modifications Manager is responsible for doing that-() 13 modification'on a schedule specified by the Site Director, 14 just like the design group has to respond to the schedule 15 set down by.the Site Director.
16- As far as the coordination of the implementation 17 of that modification, that is primarily.within the Plant 18 Manager's house. He is responsible for the' coordination of 19 the health physics and operations activities to get the 20 system in and out of service and test it before restart.
21 MR. WYLIE: Does it review it for compatibility of 22 systems and what-have-you as far as safety significance is 23 concerned? ,
24' MR. MASON: The Project Engineer is responsible 25 for doing the 50.59 review on modifications. The Plant
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()marysimons 1 Operation Review Committee is responsible-for reviewing that 2 safety review.
3 Now as a part of the review process of the 4 detailed modifications package, the Operations Section and, 5 other people in the Plant Manager's staff looks at it for 6 compatibility as far as putting this particular part of a 7 modification in would make a-system inoperable from a tech 8 spec standpoint.
9- MR. WYLIE: And as far as the sequence of '
10 modification?
11 MR. MASON: Right.
12 MR. MICHELSON: Chuck, can you tell me in a few (D
(,,/ 13 words how you assure and overview the safety of operation?
14 MR. MASON: I guess I would like to defer that to 15 Herb. That is more in his ball park.
16 MR. ABERCROMBIE: I guess principally the safety 17 of Sequoyah rests w3.h the Managers who are in those i 18 positions there and on their training, knowledge and 19 experience. ,
20 I think the best thing that we have on safety is 21 my knowledge and the Plant Manager's knowledge of those 3
22 Managers' backgrounds, experiences and their attitudes-23 towards safety because we do look to the,m, day to day to' 24 ensure that the plant has operated in accordance with the. - . . . - .
25 technical specifications and in a safe manner.
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l-00000101 26 (es -) marysimons 1 Aside from that as an overview, there are several.
2 organizations to provide that overview. ISEG, for example, 3 in a surveillance mode that would' determine whether or not 4 we are operating the systems, et cetera, in accordance with 5 the~ technical specifications.
6 Quality Assurance and Engineering'certainly has an 7 . input into the safety of the plant and whether or not they 8 would make a recommendation to me for a particular 9 modification or a change to improve safety or to ensure 10 safety.
11 MR. MICHELSON: You do not envision that.you have 12 a single focal point here at all, but rather it is diffuse O)
(_ 13 throughout ---
14 MR. ABERCROMBIE: No, it is not diffuse. The 15 Plant Manger for example, is held accountable for compliance 16 with the technical specifications for ensuring that all 17 activities in the plant are conducted in accordance with 18 those.
19 For example, we just talked about modifications. _
20 If we get into the area of breaching fire stops or something 21 of that nature, the Modifications Organization is working 22 under the Plant Manger's requirements.
23 MR. MASON: Now you operate from day to day in 24 generating power and experiencing events of various sorts 25 and whatever. In this process is there anyone who can spend ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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'significant amounts of time' thinking about the operation and 1:
c- 2' the events that are occurring.and so-forth? Do you'have 3 anybody delegated or designated in that manner, keeping in 4 mind that your managers are all very-busy managing? _,
5- This sort of thing, the safety reviews and
- 6. whatever, . takes a significant amount of time and 7 concentrated thought. It isn't a matterHof complying with 8 tech specs, as you well know. That-doesn't necessarily 9 ensure safety of operation. That only ensure that you are j 10 within your license.
11 So do you envision that you are going to have the 12 people who can really think about what is happening, or do I 13 -you intend to have the managers.doing,that?
14 MR. ABERCROMBIE: Certainly I think the ISEG will 15 do'that, and you.are talking about someone who sits back.in t
16 .an atmosphere of where they can think and review properly-17 has the opportunity to take an event and work it all the-way
, 18 through the consequences.
i 19 MR. MICHELSON: Could you tell us a.little bit
' 20 more about your ISEG and its composition here?
i i 21. MR. CARBON: Where is it on the chart?
f - 22 MR. ABERCROMBIE: That is under the Site Licensing 23 and under Dick Gridley really. They report back to the j '24 Licensing and Safety Manager. . _ _ . _
25 l,O L
As you know, this is something that we ---
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- - -c00000101' 28 marysimons 1 MR. WARD: Can I interrupt.you. We heard 2 yesterday from Dick that the emphasis of his Division was
- 3. . going-to-be on licensing issues as o <>osed to safety 4 issues. I don't like to separate those',-but Dick did'make 5 -the separation. So I.am kind of puzzled by this.
61 MR. MASON: Well, that is not unlike what we are 7 saying. The ISEG-is an independent group. They have 8' nothing to do but think about safety and-provide overview.
9 ;;R. WARD: Are they thinking about safety or are 10 they thinking about. licensing?
11 MR. MASON: They are thinking about safety. They 12 ' don't have anything to do with licensing. The ISEG does'not c ()- 13 have anything to do with licensing.
14 MR. EBERSOLE: Where is ISEG up here? I don't see 15 ISEG7 16- MR. MASON: I don't know if it specifically shows 17 on that chart. But let me explain that~under the. Site 18 Licensing Group we are going to have three dedicated-people 19 that meet the requirements of I believe NUREG.0760 in regard._
20 to ISEG. They have nothing to do but think about safety and 21 verifying that we are doing what we ought to be doing across 22 the board.
23 The Site Licensing Manager is responsible for them 24 only in regard.to making sure they have an office and paper i 25 and pencils. They don't report their safety problems or
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'L[H l00000101-J marysimons 11 findings to.the Site Licensing Manger. They report them to 2 -a Manager on_ Dick Gridley's staff who has nothing do-with 3 . licensing.- All he has got to do is think about safety, and.
4 the same function at all the other plants.
'5 MR. MICHELSON: Maybe Dick could clarify for me at 6 least and perhaps others the confusion that arose yesterday 7 then on what you presented?
8 MR. GRIDLEY: Let me address that. What I tried +
9 to make you aware of is that I have two hats. One hat is 10 licensing and the other hat is safety. The safety aspects 11 of my organization is the ISEG activity and the Nuclear-12- . Operating Experience ~ Review activity.
() 13 I didn't mean to confuse you that we wouldn't be 14 looking at the activities that are going on at all the sites 15 from an independent safety evaluation overview. We plan to 16' do that.
P 17 The other thing that I wasn't ready to get into a 18 lot of detail with you on was the specific nature of 19 implementing the ISEG function within the new organization.
+
20- I am not ready to do that, but that will-be fully described
- 21. In the Performance Plan as we develop and implement that
! 22 function.
[ 23 So once again, we covered this safety issue
', 24 yesterday. I know what you are looking for. The other hat . _ . . - _
,. 25 that I am wearing for Mr. White is the nuclear safety hat.
iC )
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( marysimons 1 And as we develop our plan and implement that I can be more 2 specific on it.
3 MR. MICHELSON: We11'maybe I misunderstood you 4 then, but I recall almost specifically that you said the 5 word safety probably didn't even belong in that name.
6 Therefore, I was led to believe that you were coordinating 7 licensing and then the question of conflict of interest on 8 judging the safety of GE really wasn't a question.
9 But now we are back to the same old question that 10 arose-yesterday which I thought was put away.
11 MR. GRIDLEY: Well, let me address that issue 12 since it was brought up yesterday. I have a responsibility,
() 13 whether I am a GE employee or working on a loan basis to 14 TVA, to meet the requirements of Part 21 of the Code of 15 -Federal Regulations and I fully intend to carry that out. I 16 would have as much interest in a safety issue at Browns 17 Ferry as I would on Sequoyah.
18 So I don't see a conflict with regards to my 19 responsibility as an individual in the function I am 20 performing for TVA as an General Electric employee to meet 21 all of the requirements of the law. I hope that is not an 22 issue.
23 With regards to how TVA and the office of Nuclear
- 24 Power will handle. safety in the broad perspective of looking
- 25 at providing an oversight on the activities carried out at V
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( ) marysimons 1 each site, we have several ways in the organization we plan 2 to fulfill that.
3 Only one of those ways will be the operation 4 activities of the ISEG, and when we have that implemented I 5 am sure it will support and complement what the Site 6 Director has at his disposal to be sure that he is covered 7 on the safety aspects of his site activity.
8 Chuck, that is my view of where we are right now.
9 MR. CARBON: Well, I need to comment here, too. I 10 certainly understood yesterday the kinds of things that Carl 11 is saying. I understood you to say that basically safety 12 plays no role in your organization and that effectively it (O,/ 13 is a' licensing organization.
e 14 You indicated, for example on LER's that you would 15 process them, but not make any effort to evaluate them. I 16 guess I am just thoroughly confused because yesterday didn't 17 seem at all to fit with ISEG and the Site Operations 18 Director's tie in.
19 MR. WYLIE: Maybe we could clear this up by maybe 20 having Mr. Gridley prepare a writeup or something that 21 describes this and not pursue it too much more this morning.
22 MR. WARD: It sounds like it is a little bit in a 23 state of flux and maybe it could be clarified for us.
24 MR. WYLIE: I think they are getting ready to 25 prepare the Revision 2 of the Plan that would cover this.
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( ,) marysimons 1 MR. MASON: I think that you would probably 2 recognize that we are going rewrite all of our job 3 descriptions and responsibility profiles and we are in the 4 process of doing that. They are not all fleshed out. I can-5 assure you that when they do get fleshed out, ISEG is going 6 to evaluate LER's and they are going to evaluate other 7 submittals to the NRC for adequacy and trends just like any 8 other ISEG in the country does.
9 MR. WARD: Let me make a comment before we change 10 the subject. This issue of whether or not there is a 11 conflict of interest that Mr. Gridley has as a GE employee 12 and taking a role in TVA of evaluating the safety of.the
() 13 Browns Ferry plants, I guess, and I don't know what the 14 lawyers would say or what the legal position of the NRC is, 15 but I personally am not particular concerned about that. I 16 am pleased to have somebody who knc'ws something about the 17 plants.
18 MR. WyLIE: Well, I am not too concerned with it 19 myself. I think this might be a right move in the right 20 direction as far as having knowledgeable people on l 21 particular facets of a plant along the lines that Mr. Reed 22 refers to as designated representatives, which I happen to 23 endorse. ,
4 24 MR. EBERSOLE: I would like to make a comment 25 about the history of this plant.
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( )! marysimons 1 Chuck, your plant came in behind Browns Ferry, and 2 it came in at a time where the hierarchy had learned that 3 there were regulations that hypothetically provided safety 4 if you followed them religiously. But it was built on a 5 aura of don't tell me about anything beyond the 6 regulations. I am going to make this plant perfectly safe 7 by the regulations in the book and not a dang thing more.
8 And that is the way your plant was built, and to that extent 9 it is less extrapolated from the basic regulatory process 10 that Browns Ferry is because the hierarchy had learned a-11 little bit and then applied the full thrust of having 12 learned that in your design.
( ) 13 So I would argue that your design may have more 14 snakes in it than Browns Ferry. I am just telling you 15 that. I was a party to these flaps.
16 MR. MASON: you were a part of that hierarchy.
17 (Laughter.)
18 MR. MICHELSON: you want your safety reviews to be 19 independent. So I don't have any difficulty with Mr.
20 Gridley reviewing Sequoyah. That is perfectly all right.
21 But from the public perspective viewpoin; I have great 22 difficulty with him reviewing the products of the company
! 23 that he is still working for, and that'in a logical thing. .
24 I don't care what the lawyers might say. It is a logical 25 thing that it is a practice that you ought not to get 7g l
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( )s marysimons 1 involved with if you are trying to increase your credibility 2 with the public. That is all.
3 MR. CARBON: What is the makeup of the ISEG and 4 what qualifications are these people going to have to do 5 that and what kind of training do you expect them to have?
6 MR. MASON: Glen, have we split them out yet?
7 MR. KIRK: No, sir, not yet.
8 MR. MASON: You can talk in generalities about the 9 type of people we are talking about.
10 MR. KIRK: At the time there are STA trained 11 individuals filling those positions. I assume when they 12 make the split there will be people of a similar sort of
() 13 qualification either through experience or through 14 training. Not knowing who the people are going to be, they 15 may not be STA trained, but they will have experience 16 equivalent to an STA trained person.
17 The individuals I have now, if I can add to this, 18 the individuals that work for me now are acting as the 19 Sequoyah ISEG. Somebody was asking about a review of events 20 a while ago. We have what we call a potential reportable 21 occurrence system where the operations personnel and the STA 22 primarily are the ones that initiate the items. This is a 23 four or five page document. They have a guideline of when 24 they have to write them, and then they can write them g- 25 whenever they feel an evaluation of an event. But that is V
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-,)'00000101 L( marysimons 1 basically what it is for is your reportability.
2' MR. EBERSOLE: Have you got an organized' plan to 3 . minimize spuriousftrips and shutdowns?
4 MR. KIRK: yes, sir.
5 MR. EBERSOLE: On the feedwater system and so 6 forth?
7 MR. KIRK: Right. There is a reactor trip scram
- 8' ' reduction program. The PRO's, to go back to that, get 9 reviewed by my engineers and they are reviewed by the-l 10 cognizant section. They are sent to the cognizant.section 11 when the section needs to evaluate what happened, and they
~ 12 need to recommend corrective action in the short term and
() 13 they need to recommend corrective action in the long term.
?
14 Then he comes back to my people again for another 15 review. They review them again and if there are LER's, my 16 people will go out and make sure they write LER's, and they 17 write all the LER's.
18 MR. MASON: I am basically finished with the slide 19 and I am basically finished with the presentation.
20 We want to answer whatever questions you have got 21 or may have as a retult of yesterday.
22 MR. MICHELSON: Can we get copies of this slide?
23 , MR. MASON: Certainly.
24 MR. WyLIE: Any questions that anyone wants to ask '
25 that were left over from yesterday?
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.( ) marysimons 1 MR. EBERSOLE: I would like to get your own views 2 as to what happened when you were running this operation and 3 what was then found out that caused this critical and 4 expensive shutdown and was that in fact.the rationally 5 arguable or was it something that the Directors or somebody 6 said I must do for the public? I don't really understand.
7 MR. MASON: Well, I will give you an opinion. I 8 was part of the hierarchy and I managed Sequoyah from '81 to I
9 '84 and it ran well. I think during that period of time 10 from the time Unit 2 got fuel loaded and in the startup 11 process that we had a good operation at Sequoyah. It was 12 was well run and it was a well maintained plant and it had a
() 13 good record to prove it. We set several industry records 14 during that period of time. Morale was good and we had well 15 qualified people and we had no licensing problems with 16 operators. It was just a damn good plant.
17 I think it is reflected in the fact, and I didn't 18 comment on it, but on the organization chart I guess one 19 thing I would like to point is of all the new infusion of 20 people, we are not having wholesale changes at Sequoyah.
21 MR. EBERSOLE: Browns Ferry was the same way and 22 it set a few records.
23 MR. MASON. The Project Engineer is basically the i
24 only individual that has changed, and that is because of the 3 25 increased responsibility. So we don't have a massive
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00000101 37 (qj marysimons 1 management problems at Sequoyah.
2 We shut Sequoyah down last fall because of 3 environmental qualifications. We thought we were 1
4 environmentally qualified and there were enough questions 5 generated by QA and in-house as to really whether we met the 6 requirements or not that we hired Westek to come in and look 7 at us to give us an opinion on whether we met the 8 requirements or not.
9 Westek looked and it was very obvious that we did 10 not meet the requirements and that it would not stand up to 11 scrutiny. I think it was a laxness on the part of the 12 Engineering in digging into the regulations and making the
() 13 interpretations that were required at the time.
14 MR. EBERSOLE: It would have to have been in the 15 interpretations, wouldn't it?
~
16 MR. MASON: Yes.
17 MR. EBERSOLE: That is the looseness of the 18 regulation process that I sometimes have trouble with.
19 MR. MICHELSON: I thought there were documentation 20 difficulties.
21 MR. MASON: Well,.there were documentation 22 difficulties, but when we got into the documentation l 23 difficulties we discovered that in addition to documentation 24 there were hardware difficulties because of interpretations
,- 25 of questions.
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( ) marysimons 1 For example, we ended up doing a lot of physical 2 modifications and environmental qualifications, a lot of 3 modifications.
4 MR. EBERSOLE: Chuck, you could have easily said 5 and could say today why didn't the hell didn't you tell me 6 what I should do so I would have done it right, or then you 7 could also say don't tell me what to do on account I am 8 going to do it right anyway.
9 MR. MASON: Jesse, I can't really make that 10 argument when other plants have obviously met the 11 environmental qualifications with the same regulations that 12 we had. They interpreted them properly and we didn't
() 13 interpret them properly.
14 MR. BARTON: I guess I have got a question on that 15 one. In other words, when you found, according to your 16 paperwork that you weren't fully qualified, most of the 17 other people went in for a waiver and fixed it as quick as 18 they could and kept running. Now why did you all not choose l 19 to go that path?
20 MR. MASON: Because ours were more massive. I 21 think our deficiencies were more massive than what other 22 plants were finding.
23 MR. EBERSOLE: Well, how have you written out this 24 organizational defect which made those inappropriate 25 interpretations? j 7-NJ l l
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) marysimons 1 MR. MASON: Well, I guess the big thing, and you (
2 asked also about what have we found in addition since we 3 have been down that is keeping us down, and we found other 4 difficulties in our engineering.
5 MR. EBERSOLE: Were they interpretative 6 difficulties?
7 MR. MASON: I think in large part I would classify 8 them as interpretative difficulties, on whether we needed to 9 keep records, for example. In some cases we have destroyed 10 records that should have been in hindsight retained on 11 seismic calculations that were made in the 70's.
12 MR. EBERSOLE: I am trying to find the roots of
) 13 the problems so you can dig them out and throw them away.
14 MR. MASON: Well, it is basically I think a change 15 in philosophy in our engineering organization and the 16 engineering assurance that we are applying to it now that we 17 didn't do before. We didn't do good checks and balances in 18 engineering.
19 We did squad checks, and you are familiar with 20 that process, but the squad check process did not challenge 21 the assumptions that were made in the calculations.
22 The other things that we have found since we have 23 been shut down have been primarily engineering rel,ated.
24 MR. WYLIE: If I understand the Performance Plan
,s 25 and the statements of yesterday, they are committed to go t)
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()..marysimons 1 back and look at every one of these items to assure that the
'2 quality assurance'is adequate on each one of these, and the 3 staff is following that and will write an SER to 4 ' substantiate that review. If we don't agree with it, then I J 5 think we may take an exception to it, but I don't think we 6 can do it this morning.
7 MR. HAGEDORN: I have two questions about the 8 organization of the site. Have you yet completed, Mr.
t-9 Mason, the rethinking of the goal of the site Director under 10 the new organization, and if you have, could you kind of of 11 categorize what has happened to that job? You told us what 12 has changed in the reporting relationship as such. What I
() _ 13 .am asking about now is the role and the scope of 14 responsibility and the actual nature of the job is that is 15 changing in particular ways.
16 MR. MASON: The' nature of the job really hasn't '
17 changed that much. I guess the focus of the job may have
'18 changed a little bit in that he is more of a project manager 19 in a typical project manager sense than he was before.
20 MR. HAGEDORN: Can you say a little more.about 21 that?
22 MR. MASON: Well, for example, before he was 23 totally responsible for the Modifications Group. He was 24 . responsible for hiring and firing and evaluating their 25 performance totally within his house. Now those people are ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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1 matrix to him from the Division of Construction and the j 2 Division of Construction is responsible for hiring and 3 firing. On the evaluation of managers, it is a joint 4 evaluation by the Site Director and the Manager of 5 Construction.
6 The QA working relationship really hasn't changed 7 that much over what it was before.
8 The Engineering I guess has changed somewhat, 9 although not significantly in that he has less flexibility, 10 the Site Director has less flexibility now than he did 11 before in deciding who does his work. Before he could make 12 a decision to contract it out if he felt like our Design
(-
(_)y 13 organization was not responsive to his schedule of needs.
14 Now he can't make that decision. That will be made within 15 our Engineering Organization, but they have got to be 16 responsive to his schedule and requirements.
17 MR. HAGEDORN: It sounds like he is in a less 18 powerful position with respect to kind of pulling things 19 together.
20 MR. MASON: I guess I would have to agree with 21 that. He is less powerful and there is more of a checks and 22 balances now. I guess the way I see Mr. White managing the 23 organization is he is counting on each of his managers, if 24 they have a problem with another organization, or if Herb 25 has a problem with Engineering being responsive, then Herb 7-(_)
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( ) marysimons a
1 is held accountable for going to'Mr. White and saying the 2 Engineering Organization is not responsible and I want.
3 something done about it, and Mr. White will do something 4 about it.
5 And by the same token he holds Engineering 6 responsible for notifying him if the Engineering 7 Organization has a problem with the site.
8 MR. EBERSOLE: Do you like the new organization?
9 MR. MASON: Yes, that is the one I am working 10 under.
11 (Laughter.)
12 MR. HAGEDORN: Has it been shaken down enough yet O,
(_ 13 that you can say anything about how does it work and whether 14 it is speeding up decisions or slowing them down and whether 15 it is making it easier to take care of gaps and overlaps or 16 whether it is making it harder or whether it really hasn't '
17 made much difference yet? I suspect you can't really answer 18 that yet.
19 MR. MASON: I don't think we have had enough time 20 to really evaluate it in that regard. I think it has 21 advantages and disadvantages like any organization you come 22 up with, and we don't have enough experience under t!is 23 organization to really evaluate it.
24 MR. WARD: If I can just ask a clarification on 25 that. You are talking about a change from something. How 1
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(_s) marysimons i
1 long did that something exist?
2 MR. MASON: The Site Director was created in April 3 of '84 and we didn't actually get it functioning until the 4 fall of '84. I guess in September or so we got the 5 Engineering Organization pretty much all on site and most of 6 the people were in place in the fall of '84. So it 7 functioned for about a year and a half until January or 8 February of this year.
9 MR. HAGEDORN: The other questions is a similar 10 one having to do with the Project Engineer, and again you 11 were very specific and explicit in talking about changes in 12 reporting responsibility, and I imagine your answer will
()
13 have to be kind of similar that we haven't worked with it 14 long enough to really be sure how it is going to work in the 15 way it has been changed.
16 MR. MASON: Well, really, I am encouraged quite a 17 bit by the Project Engineer having the responsibility for 18 the design integrity, and we have been functioning with that 19 for two to three months, and I think that is a very 20 responsive organization and they know what they are 21 accountable for and they know what they are going to be 22 responsible for and that seems to be working very well and I 23 think it is very encouraging what we have seen in that ,
24 particular change.
gs 25 And I think that is the most significant change in
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( ) marysimons 1 the site is not the dotted line and the solid line, but 2 given that you have the responsibility for the design 3 integrity of the plant.
4 MR. BARTON: I have got a question that kind of 5 relates to the organization's morale. This plant ran good 6 from '81 up to '85. Now what is your feeling about the 7 importance of getting this plant back on line as soon as 8 possible for the effect on the organization and for the 9 morale and building the organization back up which right now 10 says it is the key point, to get the organization working 11 and get the people motivated again.
12 MR. MASON: Certainly that is a key, and the 13 morale has suffered during this long outage, particular when 14 we were operating right up to the day we shut down and 15 operating well and morale was high. Morale has suffered 16 significantly since we have been shut down.
17 I think when we come out with a schedule that 18 everybody has got confidence in and management is going to 19 back the morale will pick up significantly over what it is 20 now. There is no question about that. And I think when we 21 do get it back on line that the morale will go back to where 22 it was a year ago.
23 MR. BARTON: Is that basically your No. 1 priority 1
24 now to get this plant back up?
25 MR. MASON: Sequoyah Unit 2 is the No. 1 priority 7-l
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1 in getting the plants back on~line. But we have been 2 instructed and'certainly we are trying to live by the axion 3 that we'are not going to sacrifice anything in the way of 4 safety and we are not going to be pressured into putting it 5 back on before we are satisfied that it is ready. We are 6 being very careful in that regard, and we are not going to 7 be pressured by the Board of Directors, by Congress, by 8 ratepayers or the press or ACRS.
9 (Laughter.)
10 MR. WYLIE: Do you have any more comments 11 regarding the performance plan?
12 MR. MASON: No. I think we are making pretty good
() 13 strides in implementing Volume I and Sequoyah and across the 14 board in the organization as far as getting the people in 15 place and defining the jobs and getting on with our work.
16 We are moving very well in that regard.
17 MR. WYLIE: Does the subcommittee have any other 18 questions?
19 (No response.)
20 How about the staff, would they like to go ahead 21 and make comments?
22 MR. MASON: If you would like, we can cover 23 Marilyn Taylor, any questions you have got for Marilyn 24 Taylor from the personnel standpoint.
25 MR. WYLIE: However, yoa want to do it.
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. n '00000101 46' is_) marysimons 1 MR. YOUNGBLOOD: Either.way. Generally the. plan 2 so far; appears to be consistent with the corporate plan that 3 they.gave us. 01 course, this is the first we have'seen of
'4 i t ._ It does reflect the counterpart at the corporate level. ,
f 5 and at the site level that had-been_ indicated. .
6 MR. WYLIE: There is a document that you say you 7 are in the process of doing_some revisions to it.- Are they 8 significant revisions?-
.9 MR. MASON: Well, I would say significant 10 revisions over what we. submitted before. It is going to 11 take different flavor-because Volume I has taken a?different 12 flavor from what we submitted in November.
13 MR. WYLIE: Well I understand that volume I was 14 just' revised and it is also in the process of being revised.
15 MR. MASON: We have had staff questions on Volume 16 I that we have to respond to, and then of course in 17 responding to those staff questions we'will revise some of 18 the text of Volume I.
19 MR. YOUNGBLOOD: I would guess that the revisions 20 that they are making to it are more of a fleshing out and 21 additions:to it than changes in what-is there.
22 MR. EBERSOLE: Are we going to talk about 23 personnel selection now?
24 MR. WYLIE: Yes.
25 MR. EBERSOLE: In my years at TVA the way I got a O
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IL marysinons 1 new helper or employee was he suddenly appeared at my desk 2 and I never saw or heard of him before. He was a product of-3 a process. totally disassociated with the organization. I 4 presume that has been fixed, and I.would like to hear any 5 comments about how it has been fixed.
6 MR. WARD: Maybe I could ask a more general 7 question, Marilyn. We have been told by both the NRC staff 8- and by the TVA that the central problem and the reason that 9 the. TVA plants are shut down is that central 1:s perceived to 10 be kind of a attitudinal problem among management that there 11 is not a commitment to excellence throughout-the I gather 12 the whole management structure at TVA.
() 13 Now to correct that there has been sort of a large
- 14 scale reorganization and perhaps some clarification of' role, 15 although that is maybe a little bit in dispute. There has 16 also been a salting through the organization of a couple 17 dozen temporary managers from elsewhere.
18 But there isn't anything in the plan about 19 management training improved motivation practices. Mr . -
20- Gridley did talk yesterday some about an improved employee 21 appraisal system which sounds certainly pertinent to the 22 sort of problems you have, but as I recall, that wasn't 23 discussed in the plan.
24' It is not clear to me that the plan is really __
' 25 addressing what has been perceived to be the central issue.
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( )1marysimons 1 MS. TAYLOR: Let me first of all identify myself.
2 I~am Marilyn Taylor.
3 This central issue has been not only an i
4 attitudinal problem but as I perceive it or I would s
Q categorize it a management ski 11' deficiency.
6 We are about the process of attacking the primary 7 problems first, and of course Mr. White's priority was to
-6 put an organization in place and to clearly define and 9 communicate that organization and let everyone know what 10 their accountability is.. So our focus to date has really 11 been accomplishing that.
12 But in the meantime we have tried not to sit and
( 13 twiddle'our thumbs. We have tried to be. thinking through 14 the kinds of things we-would do to attack that. But I want 15 to be clear with you 'that what you are getting is the 16 benefit of my thought processes, and bouncing that off some 17 of the key managers, it is not formalized plan that Mr.
~
18 White has seen or anyone as a matter of fact has blessed.
19 Clearly I believe that the components are more .__
~
20 than just>one isolated piece, whether it be testing or 21 whether it tur, training or whether it be selection. It has 22 got to be a combination _of al'1 of those things laid out in 23 some proper formatting so'that it becomes institutionalized.
24 We need-to. break the old mold of somewhere appears 25 at the door step End you make that selection or you choose s
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()'00000101 marysimons 1 -from among two or three people.
-2 But I would say that over the last seven years 4
3 since I have been with TVA that I have seen a change in' 4 philosophy in the approach to training and development as 5 well as to selection. *
< 6 MR. WYLIE: Let me ask a question and maybe it 7 might at least simplify it for me. Maybe you can divide 8 these up into two things and talk about personnel selection, r 9 which.necessarily is not addressing management issues except 10 as they progress, but talk about the personnel selection and 11 training plans and then management development plans and put 12 them in two categories so we don't mix them up, if you don't l 13 mind.
1
- 14 MS. TAYLOR
- That's fine. Separating them.into 15 selection and then management and training and development.
16 Let's tackle section first then.
17 '
MR. WARD: Has selection of personnel been.
18 perceived as a problem? I know Mr. Reed talks about the 19- aptitude selection of particularly the hands-on people, and 20 I don't disagree that that is important. I don't what you 21 do in that area, but I think that is only kind of-distantly 22 connected to what everyone seems to agree is the primary 23 issue here.
24' MR. MASON: Let me take a stab at answering the 25 . question on selection.
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00000101 50 (s) marysimons 1 MR. WARD: We would rather hear about the 2 management development rather than selection.
3 MR. MASON: I would like to answer that and then I 4 will talk about management development.
5 Our selection process for operators, for example, 6 we do use a psychological test, and I have got the name of 7 that test. We have been using it since 1980. It is not a 8 verified test, but we have found that the people that score 9 in the top 30 percent on that make very good operators. If 10 anybody is interested, I can give you the name of the test, 11 the Differential Aptitude Test published by the 12 Psychological Corporation. It consists of three parts,
() 13 numerical, verbal and abstract reasoning. It is not a 14 validated test. However, we use it indirectly in our 15 selection process for operators.
16 In addition, our selection process for operators 17 requires that the individuals make at least~16 on the ACT or 18 7/11 on the SAT. We have tried for some time to get the 19 POSS test which is more widely used in the industry. It is_
20 an EEI validated test, but we can't get access to that test 21 because we aren't members of EEI and they have not seen fit 22 to give us access to that.
23 Selection of engineers, we really don't have a 24 problem in the selection of engineers. We are in an area es 25 where we have got a good supply of engineers coming out of ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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( ) marysimons l 1 college and we really haven't seen that as a problem.
2 Craft selection, we use a general aptitude test l 3 battery on apprentices going into the crafts. We have used 4 this general aptitude test battery for quite some time. It 1
5 is a requirement to go into the apprentice program. If we 6 hire a craft from the union we do not make them take a 7 general aptitude test battery, but we may make them take a 8 welding test or whatever other tests are required for those 9 particular skills.
10 Management selection, and that is where our 11 problem is and we are trying to recruit managers. There is 12 no question about that. That is tough because of our salary
,G
(,) - 13 cap and the problems associated with that to bring in new 14 talent from outside TVA.
15 MR. WARD: Is the emphasis on recruiting them or 16 growing them?
17 MR. MASON: We are emphasizing both right now 18 because we recognize that we won't be able to recruit from 19 outside enough people to fill all-of the top slots that need 20 to be filled. So we are trying to grow them in addition to l 21 recruiting them. We have had some success in recruiting 22 from outside, but it has been limited. So we are trying to 23 grow them.
7 24 MR. REED: I think you really have to grow and it
,,3 25 takes 20 years to get on a good track of developing people O
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(_.marysimons 1 from early selection, natural ability aptitude selection and 2 management selection techniques.
3 Marilyn, are you an industrial psychologist?
4 MS. TAYLOR: I am not. There are industrial 5 psychologists, however, that we have used who are on the 6 central personnel staff. I don't believe we have one on the 7 nuclear power staff, but there are two available to us from 8 Knoxville.
9 MR. REED: A couple of words of caution. There 10 are good ones and bad ones.
11 (Laughter.)
12 Real practicing genuine industrial psychologists
() 13 do a tremendous job in selection of leadership 14 characteristics and future managentent personnel. I thing it 15 all goes back to the natural ability that the person brings 16 to the job. I think it is interesting to note that here in
17 Tennessee Nissan has come in and they are really using 18 natural ability selection.
19 I am a great believer and I have seen in it l 20 practice for 30 years, I am a great believer in natural 21 ability selection. Not I am not talking about learning 22 ability at all, but natural ability right at the roots.
23 I don't feel about the POSS test being 24 unavailable. Have you explored that and the MAST test?
,,_ 25 MR. MASON: I haven't personally done it, but Lee b
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( -marysimons 1 Hallman on Marilyn's staff has been involved in trying to 2 get that POSS test in the past and EEI has been unwilling to 3 make that available to us.
4 MR. REED: Well, I am going to call somebody.
5 MR. MASON: We used it in Kansas and it was a very-!
6 effective test.
7 MR. REED: Wolf Creek?
8 MR. MASON: Yes.
9 MR. REED: I guess that is about all on 10 selection.
11 MR. WYLIE: I guess the next question is Dave 12 Ward's on management development.
f')s g_ 13 MS. TAYLOR: Before we move off of selection, I 14 would like to share with the committee that in our recent-15 selection for individuals in the employee concern program, 16 and we needed several individuals there, a model was 17 developed and used that was a very thorough selection 18 process,~and in that particular procedure we incorporated 19 psychological testing, we incorporated aptitude testing, we 20 incorporated role playing, mock sessions that we felt.
21 individuals would be up against, there were panel structured 22' interviews.
23 And in that two-day, three-day process comments 24- from.the individuals who went that that came back to-the _ _ _ _ _
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,-s 00000101 54 3 ,) marysimons 1 they'have ever seen inside the organization and felt that
- 2. the-best qualified candidates'would come out of that, That ;
3 is' kind of a prototype that we are experimenting with. Now 4 that.is certainly very focused and very narrow, but I 5 believe it is more than just a single thing. It is a 6 combination of all of those things.
7 All right, if I may move then to management 8 development.
9 Management development has grown over the years 10 ~ and of course it is a component of a lot of different
-11 courses, but. training is one aspect and there is also the -
i 12 rotational assignment, the developmental, the outside
-( 13 education'as-well as Mr. White's concept of identifying who 14 the individual is that is going to be the next in the chain.
15 MR. .HAGEDORN: The succession.
16 MS. TAYLOR: The succession, that is correct.
'17 Succescion planning'is one of the aspects that will be. ,
f 18 incorporated in this plan. I mean he.has been very clear 19 about that with me, ,
i: 20 MR. CARBON: Has that been started?'
21 MS. TAYLOR: The-succession plan?
22 MR. CARBON: Is it=a public succession list?
23- MS. TAYLOR: Up front I need to say that we are in 24 the developmental stages of the overall plan. There is no 25 established here is how we are going to do it procedurally.
- O.
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a 00000101 55 (tf)L'marysimons 1 We are putting together the components,.and my belief is I i
2 would like to'have some external people,1some consultants or
^ ') ;
3 whateve'r you would like to call them, work with nuclear .
)
4 I power to put this whole thing in place.
'5 We have the elements of succession planning. For- ' i 6 example, we have a data base system that can identify for us 1 7 the skills, knowledges and abilities that our individuals I
8 have. That data' base system is in place. It is presently 9 being used in a very narrow perspective. We need to broaden 10 how we utilize that and make that a cornerstone of-1 11 succession' planning.
, 12 But as you all know, it-is a narrow piece just to 1p j s 13 look at the qualifications of an individual. Then there are 4-14 'the other aspects and that is where we get into the i 15 psychological testing and that is where we get into the' I
16 frame of mind and that is where we get into the motivation, I 1
- j. 17 and-all those pieces for me need'to fit together ve,ry 18 nicely.
i 19 So I believe you are asking questions that perhaps 20 are two to three months ahead of us because our efforts:have. i 21 been focused on-structuring an organization and putting that 22
, organization together.
23 MR. EBERSOLE: I would like to make an observation
'24- in a practical context because I have been through'the mill __,
~
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. marysimons I and so forth that'I recall is a distinct requirement to
.2 advance in this whole organization was that. slavery shall be 3 theLentrance to the superstructure. Now I deplore that and
- j. 4 of' course I fought that tooth and nail and eventually quit.
- 5 it. .
6 Now'what.can you say about el'iminating that factor' ,
7 as a disagreeable and unprofitable way to advance the 8 organization? I would rather have a bunch of ornery people 9 working for me telling me.I am wrong all the time than
.10 anything else, not a bunch of slaves,:which was the:
- i. 11 characteristic of the organization which has run to the..
12 ' woods.
I -
13 Can you. talk about that in the personnel. context?
14 MS. TAYLOR: In the personnel context you get
'15 around that,.Mr. Ebersole, I think by putting the people 16 .into positions-and communicating with them the approach that 17 you want to take. -I see White doing that every single day.
- 18 I-see him bringing.in strong managers who are teaching our-4: 19- managers that there is room for-differences of opinion.
! 20 MR. EBERSOLE: You see a difference-in White then 21 from his predecessors?
l 22 MS.' TAYLOR: It is not only White. I see a 23 difference in the management capabilities of the strong team-24 1he.'is bringing in and some of the people who are presently
[
25 here that he has~ identified.
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( _) marysimons 1 MR. MASON: Jesse, I would like to answer that by 2 saying that I think that has definitely change over what it 3 was several years ago. To some extent I am an example of 4 that. I have also been a thorn in the side of some of the 5 superstructure.
6 RMR . EBERSOLE: Had you not left I would be 7 suspicious of you.
8 (Laughter.)
9 MR. MASON: I think, in addition, some of the 10 intermediate level managers we have put into a position and 11 jumped a grade level or two in the shuffle will demonstrate 12 that, that we are not locked into that.
(m) 13- MR. EBERSOLE: I will tell you something about
-14 your plant. It was one of'the plants in the state of flux.
15 As you may recall, it came out in an era where the operator 16 was not recognized as an aspect of the safety function 17 itself. Nobody ever looked at the operators. That was a 18 bitter and long drawn out fought battle.
19 The operators are in fact a critical element of 20 the safety processes. He needs therefore information for 21 his eyes and brain which is qualified and not just 22 commercial grade. That means that apart from the fact there 23 are no regulatory requirements, he needs 1-E and high level 24 instrumentation from which he can make an choice as to what . . _ _
25 is right. We should put that at Sequoyah.
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00000101 58 (r~,) marysimons 1 I don't really know what you have got out there, 2 but I know what was tried and what was tossed out.
3 MR. REED: Marilyn, you mentioned some successful 4 role playing and selection that you just went-through and it 5 sounded good to me, and then you mentioned that you do avail 6 yourself of outside industrial psychologists, and I didn't 7 finish my warning that some of those that are strictly 8 academic in universities, and I am not so sure of them, but 9 those who have really been in the work place and understand 10 the real human in the work place I think are very good.
11 But I was wondering. and TVA is a very large 12 organization, and it seems that the total success of the
() 13 organization depends on people, the development of people 14 and selection of people, and I would think that TVA would be 15 considering availing itself of a qualified industrial and 16 psychological operation, at least in nuclear. Nuclear I 17 think demands it like the airplane business demands it more 18 than other areas.
19 Really, human beings one of these days I think 20 will say we demand it because it is in our best interest and 21 in our own personal success.
22 So you thinking about in the nuclear group moving 23 towards getting an industrial and psychological testing 24 group and getting more of the aptitude testing as a regular
- 25 routine?
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( ,) marysimons 1 MS. TAYLOR: That is certainly one of the options 2 we are looking at,,but I can say we are moving in any one ;
3 direction. We aren't shutting down any of our options, and 4 that is one that certainly is being discussed.
5 MR. WYLIE: Let me ask a question. Have you got a 6 charge with developing an overall management develop plan 7 for the Nuclear Power Group?
8 MS. TAYLOR: Yes.
9 MR. WYLIE: You have?
10 MS. TAYLOR: Yes, I have.
11 MR. WYLIE: And what is your-time schedule?
12 MS. TAYLOR: Nine months or so down the track is
() 13 the number that I am shooting for, and that if for it to be 14 in place and approved. _
15 MR. WYLIE: That is a long-range program.
16 MS. TAYLOR: It is a long-range program because I 17 don't see us getting there overnight, but I see us putting 18 components in place.
19 MR. WYLIE: This is going to be a formal program, 20 a documented formal program?
! 21 MS. TAYLOR: I am sure it will be, yes.
I 22 MR. MICHELSON: How do you view your corporate 23 timetable of approximately two years in which to self-manage
- 24 TVA if it going to take the first year to even get the ._
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2 MS. TAYLOR: That is why I said we are beginning 3 to try to put the components in place already. It is not a 4 sit and wait until you get it on paper and it is a formal-5 document or program at some point down the road. It is to 6 put it into operation. You have an overall plan, but you 7 put it into operation building on what you have already got.
8 MR. MICHELSON: So you are going to put it into 9 operation earlier than nine months from now then?
10 MS. TAYLOR: There are pieces of it that are 11 operational right at this very moment.
12 MR. MICHELSON: Can you tell us about those 13' pieces?
14 MS. TAYLOR: Well, one of the pieces that I talked n 15 about was the data base. That is there and it needs some
[ 16 refining and it needs some marketing, if you will, to line 17 managers and some training on their part to ---
, 18 MR. MICHELSON: For how long has it-been there?
19 MR. MASON: Back in the days when we had the l
20 L
I 21.
l 22 23 24 25
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.( s) marysimons 1 three separate organizations, design, construction and 2 operations, operations has had a management development plan i 3 that utilized this data base and skills inventory, I guess 4 we have had that for five to six years in the operations end 5 of the house.
6 MR. MICHELSON: Yes, it has been around for some 7 time.
8 MR. MASON: Right now we have not yet applied that E
9 to the total organization, including engineering and 10 construction.
11 MR. MICHELSON: What are some of.the other f
12 elements besides the data base that you already have in
() 13 operation?
14 MS. TAYLijR: Excuse me.
15 MR. MICHELSON: I had asked my question and I 16 asked for a few examples. Are there other examples of'what 17 you have in place already?
18 MS. TAYLOR: We have an assessment center that is 19 available to us where we can send our managers. That is in-1 20 house of the corporate TVA level.
21 MR. MICHELSON: What does it do?
22 MS. TAYLOR: It is the standard assessment 23 center. You send someone in and they go through in-box 24 exercises and they develop --- ._
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( ) marysimons 1 this?
2 MS. TAYLOR: Yes, and it assesses their managerial 3 skills.- It also identifies where they need additional 4 training, additional development and then the line manager 5 ~ and the individual work together to develop an individual 6 development plan. They then work through that development 7 plan and what comes out the other end is the enhancement of 8 the skill deficiencies that I talked about.
9 MR. MICHELSON: Are there other elements in place 10 now?
11 MR. MASON: If you look back at the program that 12 the operations part of the group has had since 1980, there 7.
i s,, 13 are the various aspects of that that are certainly still in 14 place and have been in place.
15 MR. MICHELSON: I am looking for mostly kind of 16 new things because things that were in place for the last 17 six years have apparently not done the job.
18 MR. MASON: Well, they weren't applied across the 19 board.
20 MR. MICHELSON: I am looking more for new ideas.
I 21 MR. MASON: We have got a workshop, for example, 22 starting within about a week or 10 days. We are going to 23 have the first workshop under the new program.
24 MS. TAYLOR: The employee involvement workshop.
25 MR..MICHELSON: Is this the one that ---
()
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( y- marysimons 1 MS. TAYLOR: The one that Mr. White referenced 2 yesterday. i 3 MR. MICHELSON: --- Mr. White was telling us about 4 with 2,200 people?
5 MR. MASON: However many managers we have got.
6 MR. MICHELSON: That will go all the way from M-1 7 on up?
8 MR. MASON: Right.
9 MS. TAYLOR: It will also encompass some first-10 line supervisors who are not on our management schedule.
11 MR. MASON: I believe we have got about 1,300 M-12 skill employees, and then this would include craft foremen
> (q,) 13 and engineering specialist foremen.
14 MR. MICHELSON: I think that takes care of my 15 question.
16 MR. WARD: What is the nature of that?
17 MS. TAYLOR: The nature of that is skill 18 development and employee interaction between managers and 19 supervisors focusing on communication and handling difficult 20 problems.
21 MR. WARD: Just a quick follow-up. You mentioned 22 .the assessment center for management skills. How many 23 people have actually been through the process, through that 24 or whatever you call it? __
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.i )Emarysimons 1 give you an exact number.
2 MR. EAGEDORN: How many from nuclear?
3 MS. TAYLOR: I really don't have a number'on that 4 one. I am sorry. But there have been nuclear power 5 managers who have gone through that.
6 MR. CARBON: Can I inquire on the magnitude of the 7 management problem. I understood from Mr. White that he 8 feels that the most basic problem is filling out the upper 9 half of'the management chain. How many people are you 10 seeking here? You have talked about being able to recruit a 11 few, and certainly you are aiming at growing your own. Is 12 this a cycle that can be closed, or is it going to be
(~)
(,, 13 possible to meet your commitments, and how many people do 14 you need and how many can you realistically hope to recruit 15 and how many can you realistically hope to grow within the 16 next couple of years, and do you have the people here with 17 the potential to grow?
18 MS. TAYLOR: Let me start at the end, that one.
19 Yes, I do believe we have many of the people here with the 20 potential to grow. I believe we have to make a deliberate 21 effort in identifying ---
22 MR. CARBON: What is the potential to grow in that 23 period of a couple or three years?
24 MS. TAYLOR: I believe we have a number of those.
25 MR. CARBON: Enough?
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' ;(3ffmarysimons 1 MS. TAYLOR: Not to' tally, no. Let me start at the-l 2 top, the numbers, and what are we looking for. i 3- Presently we have got somewhere around, between
' 4 100 and 125 management scheduled positions at varying levels 5- throughout the organization that we are focusing on filling.
6 MR. CARBON: Is this primarily in this upper half' 7 that' White speaks of?
8 MS. TAYLOR: No, it is the management schedule I 9 from top to bottom.
In the upper half there are many j 10 fewer. The way we would address-filling the upper half'---
+
11 MR. CARBON: How many in the upper half?
12 MS. TAYLOR: Well, let's say there are 20 or 25 or i ). -13 so in the upper half.
14 MR. CARBON: And that is all the people you feel
[
15 you need, 20 or 25 new or grown people?
16 MS. TAYLOR: That is what I presently have in my c
17 hands to be looking for. It is not a static situation. You j' 18 identify your needs over a period of time. .And right'now, 19 first blush, what I have got is 20 to.30 positions.
20 We have both internal and external efforts 21 underway to recruit and to identify and select. So we are-l 22- . working that-from a dual perspective. If we get-a candidate 23 from the outside that is extremely qualified, we have no
. 24 reservations about bringing those people in. ___
25 It is our intention to identify on a continuing i
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-()marysimons
. 1 basis, however, the internal candidates.that can become 2 their deputies and that can move right into a position 3- un'derneath them, and,who can be tutored over that period of
- '4 time, a
5 MR. CARBON: Could I stop you a second. I know 6- you wouldn't hesitate.to' bring someone in, but what is the 7 realistic hope of how many people will be interested.in 4
8 coming? -
9 MS. TAYLOR: Ifhave been very encouraged. We have
, 10 made a substantial number of offers, and I can only recall i
L 11 one or two refusals that we have had.
i 12 MR. MICHELSON: At what level?
4
) 13 MS. TAYLOR: I am talking senior management level-
- 14 now.
i 15 MR. MICHELSON: What, M-10 and up or something?-
i i 16 MS. TAYLOR: M-8 and above.
! 17- MR. MICHELSON: And you have'only had one or two 18 - refusals?
19 MS. TAYLOR: Of the offers we have made. The 20 criteria is rigorous.
21 MR. CARBON: This is in this upper half?
22 MS. TAYLOR: Yes.
23 MR. CARBON: And how many have you offered 24 actually? How many are you talking about?
25 MS. TAYLOR: A dozen.
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- ()marysimons 1 MR.~ CARBON: So you had 20 or 25 positions and you Nave filed a dozen? ,
3 MS. TAYLOR: No. I wasn't' counting the ones we.
14 have already filled into that 20 or 25 I had given you.
5 Those would be in addition-to that.
6 MR. MASON: That is 12 since Mr. White.came 7' onboard.
-8' MS. TAYLOR: That's right.
9' MR. HAGEDORN: Well, that lis quite an
- 10. accomplishment.
11 MR.= CARBON: That is very impressive. Would you 12 believe that that will continue at that rate? .
( 13 MS. TAYLOR: I would like to believe that. I
-14 would certainly like to hope so.
15 MR. CARBON: That is certainly quite-contrary to 16 the impressions I got yesterday. I thought you were talking f- 17 of having-been successful in only two or three cases or '
18 something.
l 19. MR. MICHELSON: .So your argument I-think is that I' 20 the pay cap is not affecting your recruiting capabilities to
- 21. date then?
i
! 22 MS. TAYLOR: No, i
23 MR. MASON: I believe-that is true at~the Mi-8 i
e 24 level. .. -
j 25 MR. CARBON: Excuse me, what does M-8 mean. I am I' -
I t
i
~
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( ) marysimons 1 not acquainted with that.
2 MS. TAYLOR: It is the executive-level. It is the 3 senior level of the management positions. We have 13 levels 4- of management total TVA.
5 MR. CARBON: The upper half, is that M-8 to M-137 6- MS. TAYLOR: That is the upper third.
7 MR. MASON: Yes, it is the upper third in the 8 scale and not in numbers of people.
9 MR. BARTON: Are these levels similar to the other 10 government levels?
11 MR. MASON: No, they are not GS's 12 MS. TAYLOR: No, they are not GS ratings.
(N
'(_) 13 MR. MASON: Let me tell you some of the people 14 that we have been able to recruit. We have recruited a
,. 15 Deputy Site Director for Browns Ferry. That is at an M-9 16 level. The Site Director is an M-10 level and eventually we 17 hope that individual will be able to grow into that 18 position. Mr. John Walker, we recruited him from Bechtel.
19 We also recruited a Licensing Manager at grade M-8 20 for Browns Ferry just recently.
21 We recruited a Deputy Licensing Manager for Mr.
22 Gridley.
23 We have recruited a Health Physics Supervisor for 24 the Corporate Office and that is the M-8 level.
,_ 25 We recruited an M-9 Nuclear Services Supervisor.
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'1' -MR.'MICHELSON: What is the present pay scale for.
-2: an M-8 and M-9?.
3 :MR. MASON: M-8'is about $65 000 in that ,
4 neighborhood. An'M-9 is about $1,000 or $1,500 more than.
5 An M-10'is about $500 more than that.
6L They recruited an Electrical Engineering Branch 7 Chief in Knoxville at the M-8 level.
8 I don't know of any others in Knoxville-right off 9 thettop of my head.
10 MR. GRIDLEY: Dr. Carbon, yesterday when we were f 11 . talking about the difficulty of recruiting and the j.
12 ~ impression that we had been successful only in a few areas,,
() :13 it'was primarily in the direct report to Mr. White.
~
As I Eindicated to you, we have'about three new people in Mr.-
i 15 White's direct report category.
16 'But what Mr. Mason is referring-to and Ms. Taylor 17 is that we have been quite successful at the middle i i
- 18 management in that upper third, and I.think we are going _to
-19 be successful. ,
20 MR. HAGEDORN: At the base of the_ upper third.
21 MR. GRIDLEY: Right, at the base of the upper l 22' third.
23 MR. CARBON: And how many people do you need above-24- that? That is what I am trying to get a feel for. __
25 MR. GRIDLEY: Well, as you will remember, I
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_ (~)marysimons 1 pointed out that we have seven contractor people, I believe 2' the number was seven, reporting to Mr. White. Those have to 3 be filled. That is part of Marilyn's 25.
4 MR. CARBON: In this higher category there are 5 perhaps then a total of 10 or so senior managers that you
- - 6 have to find?
7 MR. MASON: I think we have to find or develop our 8 own, I would say in_the neighborhood of 10 people at the 9 direct report to Mr. White level.
10 MR. CARBON: And what are the prospects for 11 recruiting people at that level?
12 MR. MASON: We have got mixed possibilities. I
,. () 13 can't say that-we are not going to be able to recruit them.
- 14 We may be able to recruit some good people.
15 MR. CARBON: But would you guess a couple?
16 MR. MASON: I would say we will probably be able
, 17 to recruit a couple at that level like we did the guy at I
18 Browns Ferry, a Deputy Site Director, and I hope that within 19 two years or less that he is able to move up into that i 20 direct report chain and I have got a lot of hope for that.
21 We have recruited a deputy for Mr. Gridley and I 22 hope within two years.he will be able to move up to that 23 direct report chain.
24 We have recruited the Nuclear Services Supervisor.
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( ) marysimons 1 shortfall of about eight people that you are probably going
,2 to have to grow.
3 MR. MASON: Well, I think of the ones left we 4 might be able to recruit one or two of them and then grow 5 the rest.
6 MR. CARBON: And do you have the people here with 7- the potential to grow into these ---
8 MR. MASON: I think we do. For example, in 9 engineering Mr. White has made it known that he has three 10 potential replacements for the contractor who is now filling 11 that job. He is going to be looking at'three people. In 12 the Division of Construction we have got a contractor
'f~
13 heading that organization and he has two prospects that may 14 be able to move into that position. They will be in 15 competition for that position for that position for the next 16 two years or 18 months and either one of them could move 17 into that position.
18 But I think we have got the potential to grow a 19 majority of those people.
20 MR. BARTON: Do you have a formal salary review 21 program in place?
22 MR. MASON: We have a salary review or performance 23 evaluation program in place. It doesn't mean a lot for the 24 people who are M-8 and above because we still can't get over ..
f_ 25 that pay cap. But we are working on that. We are working (J
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~1 .withithe. Board of Directors on a plan to give some relief in 2 .that-regard. To the people M-8 and below that does
~
3 represent a bonus or an increase in-salary,' depending upon 4 their performance, and that is done every October as part of 5 'a' formal review' process.
- 6. MR. BARTON: Is it fairly well documented, their 7 reviews? Is there a documented system of what their 8 performance has been and why based on objectives or goals?-
9 MS. TAYLOR: Yes, there is.
i 10 101. MASON: Yes, very rigid.
11 MR. HAGEDORN: Well, what'are some of the steps 12 that you have under consideration for implementing over the f ) 13 next few months? -
] -
j 14 MS. TAYLOR: Well, clearly we have got to-get the
- . 15 plan outlined, and over the next few months pulling-together 1
} 16 a. body of' people externally and internally to work with me j' 17 personally, and this is one that I want to be very, very l 18 closely involved with to develop that plan.
[ 39 As far as the implementation is concerned ---
j -20 MR. HAGEDORN: I am talking about the more 21 substantive kinds of steps themselves. I think you are i
22' right that you ought-to put a lot of emphasis on getting a i 23 plan. You don't want to put a lot of pieces in place that
- 24 you then have to throw away because they don't fit the plan.
- - 25 MS. TAYLOR
- That's right, but again we need to 1O i
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( )-marysimons 1 evaluate the pieces that.already are in place, and I think 2 many of the pieces that are here and that have been here for 3 three to five years really are good components, but they 4 just need to be dusted off and made operable and used for 5 what they were put in place for.
6 MR. HAGEDORN: Are there some follow-ons, for 7 example, already contemplated to your workshop? Obviously 8 your workshop of the kind that is starting next week can 9 have some benefit, but unless there are some follow-ups it 10 is not likely to have very much benefit.
11 MS. TAYLOR: Well, let me tell you one of the by-12 products of that. We are going to be identifying and f m.
q,) 13 selecting internal line managers to be facilitators at this 14 employee involvement training. We looked long and hard at 15 do we go out and bring the people in or do we use the people 16 inside.
17 We felt it was very important to get commitment 18 for the plan, and therefore the people who would be come 19 committed and give us that lasting residue is our line 20 managers. So we will go through a selection process and 21 identify line managers.
22 Those line managers will develop some skills that 23 they didn't already have and we will use those individuals 24 kind of on a continuing basis. We think if we get them fs 25 interested and hooked in some of these things, then they can f a
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!( )Laarysimons 1' be this cadre of. people.
2~ It is clear that 2,200 managers cannot identified 3 to' move up. So we are going to be testing our theories on 4 who'are some of1those individuals and bringing them in and 5 then working with them to-develop their skills.
6 MR. HAGEDORN: And somebody who turned out to be a
- 7. skilled'facilitator might h' ave _-a leg up on getting what 8 -promotions there are'that are going to be available.
9 MS'. TAYLOR: We.are going to be observing while 10 they are there and evaluating.
MR. HAGEDORN:
11' How do you. plan to use these-12 facilitators when they are trained and you_get a cadre of j ) 13 them? For what kinds of things?
14 MS. TAYLOR: One that.comes.to mind.immediately is i-i 15 our assessment workshops, our assessment centers. They turn l '16 into excellent people. If they have observation skills and i 17 -good facilitative skil?a they can become internal assessors.
18 MR. HAGEDORN: They can help staff assess.
19 MS. TAYLOR: That is correct. They can help the l 20 staff with the assessments.
{ 21 MR. HAGEDORN: Any other possible uses?
22 MS. TAYLOR: We are going to clearly have a high 23- need for more expert trainers, for example, and I don't mean 24 just stand-up skill trainers. I am talking about people who 25 are technically competent in a specific area coming in and l
=
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,- 75 i,)00000101 marysimons 1 doing a piece of a program. I would see_them fitting into 2 those, but they are line managers with technical '
3 capabilities that we want to keep in the field, but there is 4 the whole scope of management skills that we want to develop 5 with these people over a period of time. ;
6 So you draw from them, you bring them in and you 7 put them back in their technical expertise as a short-term-8 assignment.
9 MR. HAGEDORN: I like that one. I have seen it 10 used in several companies to good effect. The problem is 11 that you usually do not identify enough people to make a 12 significant difference. It makes a significant difference
() 13 to those who get involved in it and they are of greater 14 benefit.
15 MS. TAYLOR: I suspect that is why we have started
-16 with 2,200. That is a pretty good pool to start with.
17 MR. HAGEDORN: This succession planning is 18 starting out Mr. White saying okay, here are some key gaps-19 and I am going to fill those with contract employees if I 20 -can't fill them directly. I am going to have folks come in 21 behind them as their deputies with the hope that we will 22 able to promote some of those folks at least.
- 23 What else is in the works with respect to 24 succession planning? .
25 MS. TAYLOR: Several years ago in my previous role gg
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76 1p)~00000101 marysimons ;
I as Director of Personnel we developed a succession plan. l 2 MR. HAGEDORN: A paper plan. !
3- MS. TAYLOR: A paper plan and put on computer. I 4 intend to pull that out and let'it see the' light of day and 5 work from that as a beginning.
~
6 MR. HAGEDORN: What will that do for you?
7' MS. TAYLOR: Well, it will identify the people for
(
8 us.
~
9 MR. HAGEDORN: That is you can use the process for 10 identifying a lot more people.
11 MS. TAYLOR: That is right. You can use the 12 process ~ to identify the people and broaden your pool.
(O
_) 13 - MR. EBERSOLE: During the course of your 14 personnel examinations and so forth, do you' apply any tests 15 to see whether there are abilities to interpret policies can 16 be found in the individuals you select 7 17 MS. TAYLOR: To date we have only done that 18 through' observation.
19 MR. EBERSOLE: Well, it is important to the 20 managerial sector to find that kind of capacity.
21 MS. TAYLOR: It is indeed, and that is one of the 22 tasks that one observes when you put people into an 23-] assessment center.
.6 You give them actual tasks to be 24 l' pe'rformed ---
- f. 25 MR. EBERSOLE: Do you give it in loose instruction
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- y 00000101 -77 d [?marysimons-e 1 form and let's see how you refine it?
2 -- 1(S. TAYLOR: You very well may. There are several t 3 kinds of exercises. One is you give.them very specific
! 4 ~ instructions and very detailed instructions, and another is c 5 you.give them-Ioose parameters.
6 Clearly, if your management talent is 'in fact 7 talented, they are going to respond once you have been 8 convinced that they have that capability.
, 9 MR. CARBON: Mr. White indicated again this upper i
' ~
,10 management problem and he identified what-seemed to him the i
11 most-import' ant aspects. He says he observes a lack of 12 How do commitment to achieving excellence in performance.
( )- 13 you hope to instill this belief ~and commitment and 14 willingness to achieve excellence. How are'you going to do i e,
,- 15 that?-
4
-16 MS. TAYLOR: Let me say that I think he 1:s doing i
= 17 an excellent job of instilling commitment'in his direct. ~
i 18 reports, one of which"I am. He is very definitely' outlining 19 for us what his standards are, and his standard is 20 excellence. He will accept nothing less.
l- 21- It challenges me as a manager under his direction t
22 because if I am to give him excellence, I have to rely on L
l '23 the people who work for me, and my standards have to1be high 24 because I can't do it all myself. Therefore, I have to 25 bring them to a higher level to be able to deliver the ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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'q ,) . marysimons 1- product he is excepting from me.-
2 MR. HAGEDORN: Could you.give me an example of one 3 of:the. standards for you that he has shared with you?
~4 MS. TAYLOR: I guess the most recent example of 5 that is he has going through this 6 responsibility / accountability profile writing process. It 7 is a very time-consuming process and very detailed. His 8 standard of excellence was not met and we are_ going to be 9 redoing it.
10 MR. HAGEDORN: The pieces of paper are not 11 explicit enough?
12 MS. TAYLOR: The pieces of. paper are not explicit r
1
(,j\ 13- enough and in some cases are too explicit because what he 14 wants is for people to have the sense that they are 15 responsible and will be held accountable for the overall 16 function, but he doesn't want them to say, you know, in 17 every detail how they intend to do that.
-18 MR. HAGEDORN: You can't succeed by meeting the 19 items on a check list.
20 MS. TAYLOR: That is correct, and that is the 21 message he is sending. You have got to succeed by 22 delivering the overall quality product that I am looking 23 for.
24 MR. HAGEDORN: Okay. That's good.
25 MR. CARBON: Are you going to be able to pass that L ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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.( marysimons 12 sort-of thinking along to new young people <that you are 2 trying to grow? -
Are you going to have that opportunity to L -3' work.-that closely?
4 MS. TAYLOR: I believe we will because I-believe 5 ~ that if you accept nothing less and_you pass it down, that-6 your subordinates will accept nothing less than the standard 7 'of. excellence. And-there are many people in the middle of
-8 of-the organization who, although they don't work with him 9 on a day-to-day basis, they certainly do get a sense because 10 - '
he is visible and he is out and about.
11 MR. HAGEDORN: Mr. Ebersole asked a question some 12- time ago that I didn't hear the answer to that I think is a
(- 13 very interesting one when you begin talking.about changing 14 people's' values and' attitudes, because one of.the devices-151 you can use is to identify key jobs. He identified the 16 operator's job, and maybe we didn't hear the answer to that 17 question.
18 But is that a strategy that you are using to 19 identify certain key-jobs around certain particular 20 responsibilities that really do need to cluster and you can 21 really' clarify them as an aspect of this general 22 responsibility definition process.
23 MS. TAYLOR: That certainly is one of the i
24 processes I can see playing out. It is not yet formalized r
25 in any plan because the plan has not yet been formalized.
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'( ) -marynimons 1 The answer to that is'yes. I see it-happening.
2 MR. HAGEDORN: You can see it happening, but in 3 order to really make it happen you need to identify quite a 4 few of these key jobs, and that means you have to work'with
~
'5 .some of the technical people to help you figure out what 6 goes on.
7 MR. HAGEDORN: Are you-identifying attitudes'that
- 8 need to change, and again Mr. Ebersole has been pretty 9 definite about describing certain attitudes that he things 10 were counterproductive in the days when he worked here. Has 11 there been a diagnosis of attitudes and values and an 12 ~ attempt made to think through a lot of explicit things that
() 13 could be-done to deal with these?
14 There are several implicit things that you are i 15 doing, and by bringing in people with different attitudes
'16 you have addressed that question, as you rightly pointed 17 out. Are you doing other things in addition to that?.
18 MS. TAYLOR: I think we have taken some attitude 19 kind of surveys and talked to people about ---
20 MR. HAGEDORN: To kind of verify what the
! 21 attitudes are.
22 MS. TAYLOR: Right, verifying at the attitudes L 23 are. We have broken it down so that we can tell what the 24 attitudes are by organization, organizational entity. We f
l 25 worked directly through our personnel system and fed a good i
i I
f i
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-()Lmarysimons 1 deal of that back to the managers.
2 Then of course the next step is once you have 3 validated that or gotten some more data, then you work on 4 solving the problems. You have to make sure you have got a 5 constant pattern before you try to address the problem. But 6 we have done some work in the area of attitude surveys and 7 we will as best we can continue to do that end be supportive 8 to the line managers as they identify those issue.
9 MR. HAGEDORN: But so far what you are most doing 10 .is letting the managers-know some of what potential 11 attitudes are that might be negative that they have to 12 wrestle with?
) 13 MS. TAYLOR: And giving them some individual 14 assistance in trying to address those.
15 MR. HAGEDORN: And some_ managerial guidance about 16 which attitudes are thought to be obsolete or counter 17 productive?
18 MS. . TAYLOR: Yes, and I think the other side of 19 that coin is you do not want to.have a work force or robots 20 in which you give'them all the things you want them to say, 21 think and do.
t 22 MR. HAGEDORN: That is one of the attitudes you 23 have got to deal with, s
24 MR. WARD: Can I ask one more question. Marilyn,
- 25 you apparently weren't asked to contribute a section on the ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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,. s -00000101 82 jLmarysimons 1 management development program to the nuclear performance 2 plan. I don't know if that plan -- is that in its final --
3 or I ought to ask Chuck this.
4 Is the nuclear performance plan, was that it, the 5 final version?
6 MR. MASON: I think we have got a revision in the 7 mail now.
8 MR. WARD: For Volume I?
9 MR. MASON: For Volume I, yes.
10 MR. GRIDLEY: It will be Rev. 2, Dave. I am not 11 saying that we are going to have a management development 12 plan in there, but we are revising the performance plan.
A
( ,) 13 MR. WARD: It sure seems to me that that is a 14 central issue and I just think it ought to be explicitly 15 considered in the plan. That is my suggestion, o
16 MR. MASON: Are there any other questions?
17 MR. BARTON: You mentioned that the people you put 18 in your technical training that you gave them tests, but 19 what about the people you don't put in technical training, 20 are you still drawing a majority of your maintenance people 21 from the union, whoever happens to be available and whoever 22 they send you for a particular job?
23 MR. MASON: Our work force has stabilized quite a 24 bit since we have stopped construction and we don't have a 25 lot of modifications going on. The maintenance forces are ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
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_; ] - marysimons-1 permanent TVA employees for the most part. When we get into 2 a large outage and we have got a lot of maintenance we will 3 call on the union halls for assistance.
4 But we have the ability to call on the union halls 5 and ask for specific people who have been out here before 6 and been through the badging process and have their health 7 physics training behind them and have experience out here, 8 and that is who we call first. ,
9 The same in the modifications group. The 10 modifications people, the craft people are almost all from 11 the union halls. They are not permanent TVA employees.
12 They are hourly employees. We are going to make some of s
) 13 them permanent, but there, too, we are able to call on the I
14 union halls for specific people who have been out here 15 before and are qualified and we are satisfied with and we 16 can call them by name.
17 MR. BARTON: Now under the whole organization it 18 seemed to be a real problem. Do you consider it still a 19 problem?
20 MR. MASON: It is not a problem at the current 21 time because construction in the general area has slowed
. 22 down and these people are generally more available. Back 23 when construction throughout the valley was booming and we 24 had a lot of travelers in the union halls and the people __
25 that work out here one week would go to California the next O_
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00000101 84 i(fmarysimons I week for a higher paying job. That situation is not there-2 now and the work force has stabilized significantly over 3 what it was two or three years ago.
4 MR. BARTON: Now one other thing. How independent 5 is your personnel organization from the overall corporate 6 personnel? Are you pretty well free or are you tied to 7 certain overall TVA policies you have to abide by?
8 MR. MASON: We are pretty well free since January 9 13th. We do still have to meet certain federal regulations 10 in regard to hiring and personnel policies. We have 11 Veterans preference requirements and that sort of thing that 12 we have to abide by as a government agency. But there is no
) 13 question about it, the nuclear personnel situation has 14 change dramatically since January 13 because Mr. White has 15 the authority to make changes that we didn't have before.
16 Now if we are going to get much time in the plant 17 we need to get started.
18 MR. WYLIE: Does the staff'have any more comments?
19 (No response.)
i 20 They have no comments.
s 21 Ih) any of our members have any more questions or 22 comments?
23 MR. BARTON: Are your security forces under 24 nuclear or are they still being furnished from the central t
25 group?
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fs. 00000101 85
( ) marysimons 1 MR. MASON: The security forces are TVA 2 . employees. First of all,'we don't have a contract service 3 for security. -They are a matrix to the Nuclear 4 Organization, and the Nuclear Organization specifies their 5 training and their qualification requirements, but they are 6 recruited by the central group, and if somebody doesn't meet 7 -the physical requirements for nuclear plants, we still have 8 the ability to put them on a hydro plant somewhere. ,
9 MR. WYLIE: Let me ask one other question. Is the 10 performance appraisal program a formal documented program 11 and using goal setting as a part of that program?
12 MR. MASON: Yes, it is.
() 13 MR. WYLIE: Any other questions?
14 (No response.)
15 If not, why don't we call this meeting adjourned.
16 (Whereupon, at 10:55 a.m., the subcommittee 17 adjourned.)
18 * * * * *
- 19 20 21 22 23
. 24
()
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O SEQUOYAH RESTART TASK FORCE Task Force Leader: . C. C. Mason Members: H. L. Abercrombie R. H. Buchholz M. R. Matthews A. K. Priest J. Smith M. T. Tormey, Jr.
Effective March 19, 1986, the Sequoyah Restart Task Force was established by S. A. White and charged to assist in the restart O of Sequoyah. Task force objectives are as follows:
- Revise Volume II of Nuclear Performance Plan (NPP) compatible with Volume I for submittal to NRC.
. e Identify problems and initiate actions for resolution and inclusion in Volume II.
e Compile list of work items for Sequoyah and identify l those required to be completed before restart for
- inclusion in Volume II.
A e Be prepared to brief the Manager of Nuclear Power on all issues.
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CERTIFICATE OF OFFICIAL REPORTER O
This is to certify that the attached proceedings before the UNITED STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION in the matter of:
NAME OF PROCEEDING: ADVISORY COMMITTEE ON REACTOR SAFEGUARDS AD HOC SUBCOMMITTEE ON TVA DOCKET NO.:
PLACE: DAISY, TENNESSEE Os DATE: FRIDAY, JUNE 13, 1986 were held as herein appears, and that this is the original
-transcript thereof for the file of the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
r (siqt) (1)r jj f (TYPED) MARY SIMONS Official Reporter ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC. Reporter's Affiliation O}}