ML20136H386

Intervenor Exhibit I-32-I,consisting of marked-up Pages 118-129 of Transcript of R Lentz 841015 Deposition in Harrisburg,Pa Re in-core Temp Readings

ML20136H386
Person / Time
Site:	Three Mile Island
Issue date:	12/14/1984
From:	Lentz R AFFILIATION NOT ASSIGNED
To:
References
SP-I-032-I, SP-I-32-I, NUDOCS 8508200288
Download: ML20136H386 (12)

Text

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1 UNITED STATES OF Af1 ERICA NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 2

3 IN THE MATTER OF:  :

4 tiETROPOLITAN EDISON COMPANY  : DOCKET NUM3ER 50-289 (THREE MILE ISLAND NUCLEAR  :

5 STATION, UNIT 1)  :

6 7

8 DEPOSITION OF: RICl!ARD LENTZ g TAKEN DY: T!!REE MILE ISLAND ALERT 10 DEFORE: VIRTI!!IA T. BENGEL, CSR NOTARY PUBLIC 11 DATE: OCTOBER 15, 1984, 1:00 P.!!.

12 PLACE: FRIENDS ttEETING !!OUSE

'y .' 13 GTl! AND 4.,

14 IIARR KLi g"TRESTS NSYLVANIA 9 ~g 15 b va. . us in ,a AUG 719058" t D

17 APPEARANCES:

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. 118 1 A Sometime during the course of analyzing the accident, 2 plotting ut the actual millivolt rea ngs for the in-core 3 temperature and noticed what a red t be broken in-core 4 thermocouples etually indi ted a real pat ern of tempera'ture, 5 and that if you lieve the temperature valu that t y were, 6 that it would have n possible to get that ki f a reading, -

7 that when you pl e it out, the correlation fd a as plotted.

l l 8 out agreed wi each ot r, with the readi s that yo got.

9 Q sorry, I'm a ittle -- wh kind of data a you N

W talking ut? Are you talki g abo other data other than  ;

11 tempo ature data?

l i j 12 A No, the temperature ata itself, the millivolt l* 13 readings coming from the i core the ocouples.  :

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! 14 Q And if you re mber, those re dings were ava le to 15 you sometime during our analysis?

16 A The rea ings on the computer, jus -

l 17 Q No I'm talking about the milli t eadings now '

i the thermocouple.

18 coming fr 19 V It was several days befo we got a hold f a sheet '

20 offpaper that had the actual mil'livolt readings on them.

w-l 21 Q If you can remember, how many readings were there?

< 22 In other vords, how many did you have to work with, approximately? <

! 21 A It was two or three pages handwritten that Ivan Porter 24 had taken. -

?

25 Q And how many thermocouple readings? ,

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119

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l A I believo we took all of them.

2 Q So that would be, if I'm correct, around 527 3 A 52 or 69 or some number like that.

4 Q At any rato, as you understood it, there were a 5 complot.o set of in-core temperaturo readings handwritten taken 6 by Ivan Porter?

7 A Right.

8 Q And you received thoso within a couple of days aftor D March 28?

10 A It was -- the first timo I recall scoing them was 11 savoral wooks aftet the accident.

12 O I thought you said you had them available to you somo-

) 33 timo --

11 A Yes. In the group of tho four of us that woro 15 analyzing the data, my primary job wan going down this and la picking out significant things liko that. Now, como of the 17 other onen woro taking the plota and taking the data and plottir g 18 them. And that group, which I believo wan van llhitic+or --

ID Q Van Whitback.

3) A Van tihitbock or comothing liko that. And Bill Bohrlo 21 or John Flint, one of thoso, had that data, and they took a 22 aquaro grid, you know, criancronned and started plotting that ZI ntuff, and it suddenly mado nonno that --

21 0 okay. And thny had accono boforo you did, that in, 25 during the namo period af ter tho accident? You nald you didn't

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. 120 I see it you don't think for two or three weeks?

2 A Right.

3 0 What you're saying is that they had access before 4 because they were working on it?

5 A Right. We were all working on it there together, 6 but I just never looked at it. It took me a long timo just to 7 go through here and pick out alarms that were of significanco.

8 0 What I'm asking you is, to your knowledge, when did 9 they becomo aware of this data?

10 A I really don't knou. I think it was somewhere around 11 the third or the fourth day af ter the accident that I got the u impression that tho thermocouplos that wo thought woro bad all

'5 13 along actually woro good.

J lt Q And your memory in that those woro handwritton reading s 15 by Ivan Portor?

111 A Right. And at that timo, wo wont ahead and got actual 17 thermocouplo roadors that had a higher rango than what thu m computer was so that we could got good roedings on the thermo-19 couplos.

3) Q What do you moan by thormocouplo roadors?

i 21 A They'ro little digital roadors, the ones that I think Z: are still up thoro in the control Room now. But beforo, wo 23 just had some of them put on tho hottost ono and so on to givo 21 indication to tho oporators. ,

25 0 Uhon you said wo got tho thormocouplo rondors, wt.at di d 1

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. 121 1 you do with them? I mean, this data had been taken from the 2 first day of the accident, right?

3 A Right.

4 Q Okay. What did you do with the digital readers when 5 you got them?

6 A They were attached to the thermocouple elements 7 themselves to give the operators an indication of what the in-8 core thermocouples woro reading.

9 Q But this was long past the danger point?

10 A Right. It was soveral days after --

11 Q Past March 287 U A Right. I think it was at least Saturday or so before

' D they got any kind of an indicator up there in the Control Room.

14 Until we plotted this stuff out -- and I don't remember who 15 plotted it out -- we thought it was all junk. It's kind of likt 16 taking a bunch of rod, yellow and green beans and throwing them 17 in a bowl and it doesn't mean anything. But when you number B them, you know, like in Bingo, and lay them out, then, oh, goes ,

19 it's real hot right hero and it's much colder over there and 30 thoso things really aro good.

21 Q Regardless of whether you believed them or not becausc Z1 it appears you didn't believe them --

23 A That's right.

21 Q When did you first roccivo the readings? In other 25 words, when did you hear that thoro woro readings, ovon though i

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. 122 7~-

1 you didn't believe they were good readings?

2 A Pinning down the day and time, I don' t know. I 3 remember sometime, during the first several days, talking to 4 Ivan Porter, and there was someone from the NRC sitting there 5 at the computer console getting a group printout of the thermo-6 couples. And every 15 minutes he was punching them out, and 7 it was printing out all question marks. I remember asking Ivan 8 or someone, you know, why are they doing that? It's printing 9 out all question marks. Well, he wants the temperature 10 recording and something or other.

11 During the conversation, I said, "Did you try getting U thermocouple readings down at the input to the computer and 4 13 converting them?"

14 lie said yes, and he passed the information on to Gary.

15 But to him it looked like they were all failed, broken.

16 Q And did he indicate that he would pass on this complete 17 set?

B A Yes, that he had given a copy of that data to Gary D Miller.

20 0 In his conversation to you, did he indicate that ho 21 had given a complete set, that is, readings for all the thermo-22 couples or all the plots?

21 A I don't recall whether he had told Gary Miller that 24 he had -- that the thermocouples were no good or that he had 25 given him a copy of the data itself to analyze.

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123 1 Q one last exhibit. I will mark as Lentz Exhibit 10 2 what is identified as D-10 (3) in discovery-labeled April 15, 3 1979, strip chart identified by Bruce Center, Energy, Inc.,

4 and John Flint, B & W, as Reactor Building temperatures 0 to '

5 200 degrees Fahrenheit.

6 (April 15, 1979, strip chart identified by Bruce 7 Center and John Flint marked Lentz Deposition Exhibit Number 8 10.)

9 BY MS. BERNABEI: .

10 Q Can you identify that data for us?

11 A I guess it would be what they say it is here.

12 Q What is that, sir?

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{ 13 A A recording of the Reactor Building temperatures, '

j 14 primary shield, etc.

15 Q That would not be the core temperatures; is that right ?

16 A No.

17 Q But that was the type of analysis or plotting that Mr.

18 Flint was doing in that period of time?

19 A Well, this comes right off the chart recorder. Taking l10 this data and, you know, plotting all of it out, you know, 21 taking some of this data and plotting it out into a graph that i 1

22 shows you something that you can look at to see. It's extremely j 21 difficult to look at that and develop any kind of correlation i l

, 24 as to what happened. .

25 Q So that is simply the chart itself? l l $

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1 A Right.  ;

2 Q Exhibit 10.

3 I'm going to_show you what has been previously marked '

'4 as Porter Exhibit 1. Is that the thermocouple data that you 5' previously indicated Mr. Porter had handwritten of all the 6 thermocouple readings? I'm referring you now just to the first 7 three pages. '

8 A oh, okay. Yes,.it looks like the range of millivolt 9 values, this column here.

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W Q Just for the record, what is that column labeled 11 to which you just pointed?

i 12 A Transducer Signal Minimum.

]?

' 13 Q And those appear. to be the values that you or Mr.

14 Porter had taken down on March 287 15 A ~Right.

16 i Q When you reviewed this temperature data, was it in 17 the form that is before you?

E A No, it was a -- the form I recall seeing it in was a 19 notebook page, a page out of .a notebook in two columns'. .

2D Q And those were essentially readings and millivolts 21 of the --

( 22 A' Right..

El Q And your memory is-that that was all the thermocouples?.

24 A' Right.

25' Q But the temperatures which appear now before you in 1

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't 125 1 Porter Exhibit 1 were the same range that you viewed on the 2 notebook page?

3 A Yes..

4 Q Now, regardless of whether you interpreted it in terma 5 of production of hydrogen or hydrogen burn, when did you first 6 learn about the pressure spike?

7 A. Sometime that Saturday, I believe, af ter the accident.

8 Q So you learned'about it after you learned about the 9 production of hydrogen?

W A Yes.

11 Q And if I understand correctly, the in-core thermo-l 12 couple data you saw or you viewed several weeks after the

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A 13 accident but had knowledge or became aware of several days 14 after the accident?

15 A I -- right. I had not seen -- I did not see this 16 printout in any form other than until right now.

17 Q No, no. I'm talking about, you had knowledge within 1

a few days of the accident that in-core thermocouple data had 18

19 been taken?-

t l 20 A Yes.

1 21 Q And it indicated' temperatures in excess of 2500 degrees?

22 (Short break while the. reporter changes paper.)

ZI BY MS. BERNABEI 24 Q I will start over on.the question. Within a few days

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25 of the: accident, you learned that Ivan Porter had taken a complete ,

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l 126

I set of thermocouple -- in-core thermocouple readings?

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2 A Yes.

3 Q Which indicated temperatures of over 2500 degrees?

l 4 A Yes. Several days af ter -- within the first several l

[ 5 days, I had learned that Ivan had taken that data.

6 MS. BERNABEI: I have no further questions.

7 MS. FINKELSTEIN: I have no questions.

8 MR. WILSON: I have a few questions, Mr. Lentz.

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9 CROSS-EXAMINATION 10 BY MR. WILSON:

11 Q How many times pre ously have you tes i fied concernirig 12 the -2 accident?

', A None, other than the de

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t 13 sition I de wit the NRC, '

( 14 whatever t was, back June 1st.

15 Q S there was one previous s nt?

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16 A Yes, that one depositio . /

17 Q Were y ever a rea or operator at Three Mile Islahd?

! 18 A No.

19 Q A document identified to you as Lent hibit 8 i

20 and you paged throu th t and stated that you r ogn zed some

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l 21 documents as hav g come f m your files and ome that you could 22 not recognize Do you have w th you tod your original file 23 of the do ents that you could eco ize they were taken out of ?

i l 24 A I believe so. ,

25 Q Could you compare that exhibit with your file to

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128 1 consists of two handprinted pages.

2 A ' es, that's correct. I have'no idea where they came 3 from.

4 Q Mr. Le tz, do you recall when the N interviewed you 5 in 1979 that you uested and took with ou a GPU System person 6 as your comp y repre ntative?

-7 ' A es.

8 q What was his name 1

9 A I don't reme r.

10 Q Do ou ha a copy of you -- maybe if ou would look 11 at the intervi transcript, first cou e of ages. We have an 12 unnumbered p ge w ch would be page 1. a you see on page 1 7 who the

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13 ndividual w  ?

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! 14 A Yes, J. G. Ilo r. -

l 15, O Mr. Lentz, do you have any way of telling what data 16 Mr. Porter may have shown of his hard copy data to Mr. liiller 17 on !! arch 28, 1979, which recorded in-core thermocouple readings?

18 A No, I don't.

l 19 Q Did you discuss with Mr. Porter the nunber of in-core l 20 thermocouple readings that were taken on that day, !! arch 28, l

! 21 19797 22 A No. lie. discussed the fact that he had taken in-core ,

21 thermocouple readings. I don't remember asking him if he took i

24 all of them or not.

25 Q  !!r. Porter did not say that he took all of them?

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1 A He may have.

2 MR. WILSON: I have no further questions.

3 MS. BERNABEI: I just have a few.

4 REDIRECT EXAMINATION 5 BY MS. BERNABEI:

6 Q I understood that it was your best memory that Mr.

7 Porter told you he had handwritten notes, perhaps all, of the 8 thermocouple temperatures for some time on March 28?

9 A Yes, something along that line, that he had read the 10 thermocouple readings with the millivolt reader and the ones 11 that appeared -- either appeared to be open or short of giving E incorrect readings.

7 13 Q But your understanding was that he took a complete J

14 or near complete set of readings on March 28?

15 A That's my impression of the situation, that he took 16 most of them or all of them.

17 Q And that would be around 51 or --

18 A Yes.

19 Q Now, it's fair to say that the core was only in the 20 range -- the temperatures in the core were only in the range of 21 2200, 2500 degrees for a period on the morning of March 28; is 22 that correct?

23 A I don't know.

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21 '4S7l3ERNABEI: I havo-no other questions.'

25 7 Can I say,som [ething h, ore'/

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