ML20040D370
| ML20040D370 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Diablo Canyon  |
| Issue date: | 12/16/1981 |
| From: | Mccraken J ROBERT L. CLOUD ASSOCIATES, INC. |
| To: | |
| Shared Package | |
| ML17083A976 | List: |
| References | |
| NUDOCS 8202010228 | |
| Download: ML20040D370 (32) | |
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-1 I UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION
}, .
3 -
l 4 INVESTIGATION OF 5 DIABLO CANYON UNITS 1 & 2 6 INTERVIEW OF t' '
., 7 JAMES J. MCCRAKEN 8 -
9 Pacific Gas & Electric.
Headquarters _ Offices to Law Department Conference Room ij 77 Beale StreetL San Francisco, California 12 Uednesday, 13 December-16, 1981 14 The above-entitled. matter came on for further hearing, 15 pursuant to adjournment, at 3:00 p.m.
16 APPEARANCES:
2 37 On behalf of the NRC staff:
- 18 OWEN C. SHACKLETON, JR., Moderator l B. H. FAULKENBERRY j 19 i
20
_ 21 a
22
-23
- 24 25 8202010228 820127 FDR ADOCK 05000275 G i, PDR _jj_
4 ...
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4 i
ERRATA SHEET l
4 Interview of J. J. McCracken, December 16, 1981 The following corrections should be made:
! Pages 71 through 93 - Wherever McCraken appears, change to McCracken'.
i 4
The above corrections have been identified by Bobby H. Faulkenberry.and J. J. McCracken.
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- A. F,T_ E E E q q E g g g g I, q E 2 'MR. SHACKLETON: This is December 16, 1981.
3 The time is now 3:18 p.m.
4 This is an interview of Mr. James J. McCraken,
) 5 senior mechanical engineer'for the Pacific Gas and Electric
.6 Company. This is interview is taking place in Room 3101 7 of the corporate headquarters for PG&E at 77 Beale Street, 8 San Francicco, California.
9 Present for this interview from PG&E-is Mr.
10 James J. McCraken and from the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory it Commission, Region Five is Mr. Bobby H. Faulkenberry, 12 chief of reactor construction, projects branch.
13 My name is Owen C. Shackleton, Jr.. I am a
('
14 senior investigator, v
15 The purpose of this interview is part of an-i investigation being conducted by the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory.
16 17 Commission to develop the facts and information surrounding l 18 the reverification program presently being conducted by g
19 Pacific Gas and Electric Company concerning the Diablo
- j 20 Canyon Nuclear Power Plant.
a
! 21 Mr. McCraken, I've advised you prior to the f 22 interview and wish to make it a matter of record. Do you a
j 23 desire to have legal counsel present?
24 MR. MCCRAKEN: I vaive that right.
25 MR. SHACKLETON: Thank you.
1
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-j. 1 At this time, I place Mr. McCraken under oath.
2 Whereupon, 3 JAMES J. MCCRAKEN 4 was called as a witness and having been first duly sworn, 5 was examined and-testified as follows:
6 MR. SHACKLETON: .Please be seated.
7 I would like to remind you also, Jim, that we're 8 asking each of the interviewees to keep the testimony 9 that is given here inth is given here-in this room to to yourself.
f 11 At this time, I'll turn the interview over to 12 Bob Faulkenberry.
13 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, what are your 14 current job responsibilities as regards to the work effort 15 being performed by Dr. Cloud on the seismic reverification 16 of Diablo Canyon?
8 17 MR. MCCRAKEN: I have been assigned by the l 18 chief mechanic nuclear engineer, Mr. Jim Rocca to 3 19 assist Dr. Cloud and his staff in getting any information 5
j 20 from '/G&P that he requires to do his verification.
f a
21 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, when were-you f 22 first assigned these job responsibilities?
l 23 MR. MCCRAKEN: Approximately within a week after 24 the date that the seismic reverification program was assigned 25 to PG&E.
+
(b 1 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Did you have any responsibilit7 2 in this work area ' prior to the date that you just quoted?
3 MR. MCCRAKEN: 'Please clarify that.
4 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Did you have any job 5 responsibilities with relation to Dr. Cloud and his work
-6 on the seismic reverification of Diablo Canyon prior to
.7 the time period that.you just referenced in question number 8 two?
g MR.-MCCRAKEN: No.
10 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, have you ever 9
11 received draft or final copies of Dr. Cloud's work?
12 MR. MCCRAKEN: I have received all of Dr. Cloud's
,. 13 draft and also-a copy of the draft which he submitted to 34 Region Five which I transmitted to our licensing department 15 for transmittal to Region Five.
To my knowledge, the 1ast copy that we h' ave
~
16 17 was marked draft and to this date, there is no final copy.
l 18 'MR. FAULKENBERRY: .;Mr.-McCraken can we try.t'o g 19 identify the particular drafts of Dr. Cloud's work that a
j 20 you mentioned?
f 21 First of all, could you tell me how'many i
f
- 22 different drafts of his report have you seen?
- j. 23 MR. MCCRAKEN: There was a first draft which we 24 commented on and returned comments to Dr. Cloud.
25 There was a second draft with a subsequent page I
i 5'I ' 1- change transmittal from Dr. Cloud to us which.due to time i
2 constraints we did not have a chanc e to return comments 3 to Dr. Cloud on. i
, .l 4 And there was a third draft which we transmitted 5 -to Region Five.
6 ,
MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, keeping the 7 ' designation of first,.second and third draft in mind,
- 8 could we identify the first dratt by date? Do you know the 9 date or approximate date of the first draft?
10 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes, could I see my marked up 11 copy, please?
12 The first draft was transmitted by Ihr. Cloud 13 to PG&E on a trancmittal dated October 21, 1981.
14 MR_ FAULKENBERRY: Okay. For clarification for
- 15 the rest of this interview, we will identify as the first 16 draft, the draft copy that is dated October 21, 1981.
17 With regard to the second draft that you men--
l 18 tioned, can you identify that by. specific or approximate
-g 19 date?
E j 20 MR. MCCRAKEN: I believe the transmittal that a
l8 21 arrived at PG&E was November 5, 1981 with changes from l Ef 22 Dr. Cloud dated November 6, 1981. Approximately ten of 23 the last pages.
24 (Pause) ,
i 25 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, you indicate the second e
g % & %&~ O
N ~1 draft was transmitted to PG&E. Was that under a cover 2 memo similar to the draft of October the~21st?
3 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes, I believe it was. '
4 MR. FAULKENBERRY: And if I understand you 5 correctly, the cover memo was dated November the 5th?
6 ,.. MR. MCCRAKEN: I believe that's correct.
7 MR, FRULKENBERRY: Pow, the November the 10th 8 date is somewhat confusing. Was there another draft 9 transmitted with a cover letter dated November the 10th?
10 MR. MCCRAKEN: Sorry. It was November 5 with 11' changes dated November 6 on draft two.
12 (Pause) 13 MR. FAULKENBERRY: 'Okay, Mr. McCraken, let's
(' 14 go on, then, to the third draft that you referenced. Can 15 you identify that by a date?
16 MR. MCCRAKEN: -Not from memory.
g 17 Yes, that is the draft dated Novembar 12, 1981, i
l 18 which we transmitted to Region Five on November 15, 1981.
i 19 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, Mr. McCraken, are there a
j 20 any other drafts that you are aware of that were submitted i
! 21 to PG&E containing Dr. Cloud's work?
a d 22 MR. MCCRAKEN: No.
2 l 23 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, I would like 24 to explore just a moment in our discussions with Dr.
25 Cloud. He referenced a draft dated October the 26th.
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1 Do you'have any knowledge of a draft that'was 2
submitted to PG&E that was dated October the 26th?
3 MR. MCCRAKEN: A draft of the preliminary report 4
or a draft of the program plan?
t 5 (Pause) 4 6 MR. FAULKENBERRY: It was my understanding that
-7 it was a draft of the preliminary report. However, it-8 could have been the program plan. I am not for certain.
9 MR. MCCRAKEN: I do not have any recollection 1() of that.
l 11 (Pause) 12 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Okay, Mr. McCraken on the
, 13 November the 5th draft which we're calling the second draft, 14 do you recall were comments provided by PG&E on this 15 particular draft?
16 .
MR. MCCRAKEN: I believe that the draft was
. 17 submitted within PG&E for comment, but I believe that the i
l 18 time pressure in deliverying draft number three to' Region g
t 19 Five precluded any formal return of PG&E comments to Dr.
j 20 Cloud. However, our electrical engineerirq department 21 did transmit comments by phone to Dr. Cloud and documented 8
f 22 that fact to me in a memo.
23 (Pause) 24 MR. FAULKENBERilY: Mr. McCraken, have you i
25 received either orally or in writing any results of Dr.
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\ 1 _ Cloud's work other than through the three draft reports that 2 you have identified?-
3 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes. I. talked to Dr. Cloud's 4 engineers informally just about everyday for material that 5 they required to do their analysis and also tried to keep 6 up on a day-to-day bases what progress.they are making in-7 their analysis.
8 (Pause) .
9 MR. FAULKENBERRY. Was any of that information io which you just described provided to you by Dr. Cloud for 11 purposes of you providing comments or clarification ~from 12 the PG&E standpoint?
13 MR. MCCRAKEN: Not the material that I received k,.'
14 by telephone from Dr. Cloud's staff.
15 MR. FAULKENBERRY: But what the material other
.16 _than that you received by telephone -- other than that 17 contained in the three draft reports that you have mentioned?
l 18 MR. MCCRAKEN: Allow me to clarify the situation g 19 here.
C j 20 Dr. Cloud transmits formal requests, written e
l: 21 requests for specific PG&E information to me. I gather the f 22 information and transmit them back to Dr. Cloud. That'is t
l 23 the only written transmission of information which takes 24 place.
25 I try to, in discussions with Dr. Cloud's ,
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-(h i engineers, understand what work.they are doing so that 2 I can'suggest to them additional material which might be 3 beneficial in their analysis.
4 MR. .FAULKENBERRY: Is that the extent of your 5 involvement in information between Dr. Cloud's office and 6 PG&E other than that contained within the three draft 7 reports, to the best of your knowledge?
8 MR. MCCRAKEN: That is correct.
9 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, Mr. McCraken, were you 10 as an individual, ever asked to review and comment on 11 Dr. Cloud's work as contained in the three draft reports 12 that you've identified?
13 MR.'MCCRAKEN: Yes. I was asked to comment on 14 drafts one and drafts two.
15 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, did you provide comments 16 on draft one and draft two?
- , 17 MR. MCCRAKEN: I provided comments on draft one
=
l 18 and I do not believe the comments that I had reach'ed Dr.
g 39 Cloud prior to issuing draft three, if at all.
c j 20 MR. FAULKENBERRY: I think I need to clarify that.
21 I'm not sure I understood. You stated, I believe, that you i
4 22 Provided comments on draft one. Is dutt correct?
23 MR. MCCRAKEN: That is correct.
24 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you believe these comments 25 on draft one were returned to Dr. Cloud?
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~:r 1 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes. '
2 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Did you provide comments on 3 draft two?
4 MR. MCCRAKEN: I was given a draft to comment 5 on, but due to time pressure, I do not remember commenting 6 on them or returning any comments to Dr. Cloud.
7 (Pause) 8 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, who asked you 9 to review and comment on each of-these draft reports?
10 MR. MCCRAKEN: My supervisor, Mr. Jim Rocca, 11 chief mechanical nuclear engineer.
12 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Could you give us an idea 13 of when you completed the review of each report and how
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- 14 you provided your comments on these reports?
15 MR. MCCRAKEN: My comments on draft one are
, 16 documented by my memo dated 1-23-81, which went to Ihr.
] = 17 Cloud. And I do not believe that there is any documentation j 18 on comments, if any, made on draft two.
'g 19 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, how were these comments a
j 20 on draft one provided? Were they handwritten comments on
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! 21 the draft itself? Were they attachments that were provided a
- f 22 or how were they provided to Dr. Cloud?
2 g 23 MR. MCCRAKEN: They were handwritten on the 24 draft and'there was also a half page cover sheet written 25 and dated by me.
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($? 1 MR. FAULKENBERRY: This half page cover sheet 2 that-you're describing, is this what I show you here that
.3 is dated 10-23-81,-title, General Notice, and with your 4 stamped signature?
5 MR.MCCRAKEN: That is correct.
6 MR. FAULKENBERRY:- In what form were your comments
.7 on draft two put together? You indicated that they may not 8 have actually been provided to Dr. Cloud, but how did you 9 make these particular comments?
10 MR. MCCRAKEN: If I made them, I would have made 11 them on a written directly on the draft as they were on 12 draft .one.
13 (Pause) k,,
14 MR. FAULKENBERRY: If I understand you correctly, 15 you say that you are not sure whether or not you actually_
16 made comments on this particular draft. Is that correct?
g 17 MR. MCCRAKEN: .tk). The compression of timeframe l 18 between drafts two and and draft,s three, I think, basically 3 19 precluded any meaningful review of draft two.
a j 20 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, I just want 21 to explore this a little bit more to make sure that the a
f 22 record is clear with regards to draft two.
t l 23 Do you recall actually making comments on draft 24 two?
25 MR. MCCRAKEN: No, I do not. I remember being
1
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1- given draft two to comment on,;but I do not ~ remember 4
2 making comments on it.
3 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now,.with regard to draft 1 4
.three, I asked the question before, but I want to ask it-5 again, just for the record.
6 Did you provide any comments on draft three?
7 MR. MCCRAKEN: No. Draft three was hand-deli-1 8 vered by one of Dr. Cloud's engineers. It remained in 9 our office just long enough to have the cover letter 10 typed transmitting it to the licensing department and was 11 hand-carried by me to the licensing department within two
, 12 hours of its receipt in PG&E.
. 13 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, with regard to your 14 comments on draft one, who did you provide these comments 15 -to?
16 MR. MCCRAKEN: Dr. Cloud or one of Dr. Cloud's 17 engineers along with drafts three, four and five.
g 18 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, could you specify what.
19 you mean by drafts three, four g and five? Were these copies l j 20 three, four and five or drafts three,-four and five?
i g 21 MR. MCCRAKEN: Copies three, four and five --
! 3
! d 22 MR. FAU,KENBERRY: Of? -
- 3 g 23 MR. MCCRAKEN
- -- draft one.
24 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, you did not return your 25 marked up copy of draft number one to Mr. Rocca. Is-that -
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2 MR. MCCRAKEN: I did not mark up draft one.
3 Draft one was copy one of' draft one -- Copy one of draft one 4 was retained as a master to show the original condition of 5
.the draft as it was received.
6 MR. FAULKENBEhRY: I'll rephrase my question - just 7
a little bit.
Your comments with regard to draft number one 8
9 y u indicated that you returned those to Dr. Cloud. Did you return those to anyone within PG&E prior to them being 0
returned to Dr. Cloud?
MR. MCCRAKEN: I don't believe so.
12 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Did you return these directly
. 13 g to Dr. Cloud?
MR. MCCRAKEN: Either to Dr. Cloud or to one 5
of Dr. Cloud's engineers in the building.
. 17 NN' FAULKENBERRY: With regard to draft number E
no, did you enter your comments on copy number five of l 18 gg draft number one?
MR. MCCRAKEN: That is correct.
j- 20
! e i ' MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, if you will i
I 22 look on copy five of draft number one, page 21, about the middle page, there is a recommended change of the word 23 "if" t "because". Did you make that change?
24 25 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes, I did.
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3: '1 'MR. FAULKENBERRY: Can you explain to us your i 2 justification for making this change?
3 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes. Based on the work that I 4 had done in the reverification program, I was told by PG&E 5 civil engineers that John Blume's report indicated that-6 tha intake structure was rigid and that equipment mounted
-7 at the minus two feet elevation was particularly rigid 8 since it was close coupled to the base rock at that point.
9 The change was meant to clarify the conditions s to under which the auxillary saltwater pumps were qualified, 11 not as a comment pertaining to the building.
12 MR. FAULKENBERRY: If I understand you. correctly, t 13 you state that you were told by Dr. Blume's people --
(. 1-4 MR. MCCRAKEN: Not Dr. Blume's-people. PG&E's 15 people.
16 MR. FAULKENBERRY: By PG&E's people'that the I
g 17 rigid conditions existed. Do you have actual documentation
- l 18 within PG&E to verify this or is this -- was this change g 19 made based upon just an individual stating ~that these c
4 j 20 conditions existed?
l a l
i l8 21 MR. MCCRAKEN: I believe that we have a Blume
{ 'd 22 Report within PG&E which documents the fact that the intake t
j 23 structure is rigid. However, this comment or this change 24 was mado by me based on verbal comment from another PG&E ,
25 engineer.
b..
(h 1 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Did any of Dr. Cloud's people 2 -- excuse me. I'll retract that. I'd like 6 ask one other 3 question before that.
4 Do you know whether or not that change was in-5 corporated into the November 12th draft that was submitted 6 to the NRC?
7 MR. MCCRAKEN: That's draft three?
8 MR. FAULKENBERRY: That is correct.
9 MR. MCCRAKEN: I know that it was not incorporate <1 10 into draft three.
11 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you, per chance, know the 12 reason why it was not incorporated?
,, 13 MR. MCCRAKEN: I presume because Dr. Cloud chose k
14 not to include it.
15 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, Mr. McCraken, at the 16 time you reviewed draft number one and also at the time
- 17 that you received draft number two, had you ever been made j 18 aware by people within PG&E, by people within the NRC or g 19 any other persons that the results of Dr. Cloud's work should j 20 not be reviewed by PG&E prior o the results being in final 21 form for submittal to the NRC?
d 22 MR. MCCRAKEN: No.
0 l 23 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Have you since been made 24 aware of this?
25 MR. MCCRAKEN: No. The only qualification.that
,[
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hk 1 MR. MCCRAKEN: No. It is my understanding that f 'i2 Dr. Cloud's instructions are to complete his report in a
- 3. method which he sees fit and to report the facts as lua 4 sees them. And that communication with PG&E is a necessary 5 part of gathering information.
6 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you know any directions 7 that have been given to Dr. Cloud at this point in time 8 with regard to how his -- me reports of his results should 9 be handled?
10 MR. MCCRAKEN: Dr. Cloud works directly for our 11 senior vice president, Mr. Maneatis and I do not know what-12 directions Mr. Maneatis has given Dr. Cloud.-
. 13 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken were any of the k" 14 comments that you provided in Dr. Cloud's draft report, 15 which would be copy number five of draft one, intended by 16 you to remove adverse information from the report?
- 17 MR. MCCRAKEN: No.
l 18 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Were any of-the comments that g 19 you provided to Dr. Cloud in draft number one or in draft c
j 20 number two, if they were made, intended by you to place 21 PG&E or its contractors in a more favorable light?
a
.f 22 MR. MCCRAKEN: No. The intent was to make the 2
l 23 report as complete and accurate as possible.
24 MR. FAULKENBERRY: That was the intent of all of 25 your comments that were provided to Dr. Cloud?
MR. MCCRAKEN: That is correct.
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.j 49/ 1 PG&E was given was that the report was to be independent.
2 The definition of independence was not defined.
3 (Pause) l 4 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you know when this 5 statement was made within PG&E that the quote, results 6 should be independent? When did you first become aware 7 of the fact that Dr. Cloud's results should be independent?
8 MR. MCCRAKEN: At the very beginning of the g reverification program.
i 10 MR. FAULKENBERRY: So, that would be back around jj the October 9th time frame. Is that correct?
12 MR. MCCRAKEN: Yes.
13 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Could you teli me how.you i
(s were made aware of the fact that Dr. Cloud's'results should 4
14
- 15 be independent'back at that time. frame?
16 MR. MCCRAKEN: Probably through the newspapers.
- - 17 MR. FAULKENBERRY
- Do you recall anyone within "
l 18 PG&E or the NRC making you aware of this?
g 19 MR. MCCRAKEN: Definitely no one in the NRC.
j 20 Possibly either Mr. Rocca or someone else within PG&E..
21 MR. FAULKENbERRY: Are you aware at'this point
- I J 22 in time of any written or otherwise directions that had been s
given to Dr. Cloud or to_yourself with regard to how the
! 23 24 results of Dr. Cloud's work should be handled with regard 25 to the independency issue?
{
I MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, have you 2
seen Dr. Cloud's final report which was forwarded to 3
the NRC by letter dated November 1Rth,1981?
4 MR. McCRAKEN: Yes, it was delivered to me 5
and I was responsible for getting the cover- letter typed 6
and transmitting it to our licensing people.
7 I also have a copy in-house.
8 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Can you give us the date 9 uhich you received this copy from Dr. Cloud? Or, this 10 draft from Dr. Cloud?
11 MR. McCRAKE7: I presume it was November 12th 12 due to the rushed conditions that existed at the time.
13 As I recall it was typed that morning and 14 delivered around 11 o' clock to me and transmitted to 15 licensing ar. approxiuately 2 p.m. on the 12th of November.
16 MR. FAULKENBERRY : Okay, ny un3erstanding then, g 17 you gave this to your licensing . people, the P.G. &E.
l 18 licensing people on the 12th of November about 2 p.m. ,
g 19 is that correct? I
- 20 MR. McCRAKEN
- That is correct.
a
!a 21 Do you have knowledge of when this report f 22 was actually signed out by a representative from P.G.&E.
I y 23 and transmitted to the NRC?
24 MR. McCRAKEN: Yes, looking at the cover letter 25 dated Novenber 13th, l'hil, I uould say that Novenber 10th
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is the correct date.
2 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you kno'.e for sure that 3 it actually went of the P.G.&E. offices hers on November 4 the 18th? ]
1 5 MR. McCRAKEN: No, once I turned it over to l; 6 licensing, it was out of my hands.
7 MR. FAULKENBERRY: So you were not sure the 8 exact date it went out of here, is that correct?
9 MR. McCRAKEN: That is correct.
10 It's my understanding that it went from our 11 licensing department to our lay department and then to 12 Region 5 with the signature of Phillip Crane on the
- 13 transmittal.
14 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, have you 15 reviewed that third draft or the November 12th draft of 16 Dr. Cloud's work?
g 17 MR. McCRAKEN: November 12th is draft 2.
j 18 I'm sorry, November 12th is draft 3. I have i 19 had it and have not had a chance to read it.
j 20 MR. FAULKENsERRY: Would you be in a position i
i ! 21 at this time to show us or tell us uhich comments that 5 22 you made in copy number 5 of draft number 1 which were n
$ 23 subsequently incorporated into draft number 3?
24 MR. McCRAKEN: We went through this completely 25 yesterday and a list of which changes from draft 1 were
('iq
" I incorporated in draft 3 exists, however, I do not have 2 a copy of that list at the moment.
3 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Can you provide us a copy 4
of that list?
5 MR. McCRAKEN: Yes.
6 (pause) 7 MR. FAULKENBERRY* Just for the record, do you 8 have any fee 1~ for the types of changes or nature of 9 changes that were made in the report? The number or 10 the extent of changes that were made in the draft 3 11 report as a result of your comments in the draft 1 12 _ report?
7 13 f1R. McCRAKEN: Yes, I.believe the list
(' 14 that P.G.&E. filed contains approximately 35 to 40 15 ch anges .
16 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Would that be the j 17 result of your comments or would that be the result of l 18 the collective comments made by all of P.G.&.E.'s i 19 reviewers?
c j 20 MR. McCRAKEN: That is the result of the a
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i
!a 21 collective comments on copies 3, 4, 5 of draf t 1.
f 22 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you have any feel for i 23 how many of these changes would be the result of your l 24 comments?
- 25 MR. McCRAKEM
- Approximately 25%.
() 1 MR. FAULKENBERRY: You've indicated and made 2
stat' aments with regard to copies 3, 4, and 5 of draft 3
number 1, is that correct?
4 MR. McCRAKEN: That is correct.
5 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Have you mentioned copy 6
number 2?
7 MR. McCRAKEN: No, I have not.
8 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Do you know what has happened 9 to copy number 2-where it is?
10 MR. McCRAKEN: Copy number w was routed to our 11 vice president of engineering, Mr. Don Brand who did not 12 comment on it and did not return it.
,.. 13 MR. FAULKENBERRY: So the cnly comments
(~
14 that were submitted back to Dr. Cloud were the comments 15 contained in copies 3, 4, and 5, is that correct?
16 MR. McCRAKEN: That is correct.
17
! MR. FAULKENBERRY : And just for the record, j 18 copy number 1 is what? Would you explain that?
I9 MR. McCRAKEN: Copy number 1 is the unmarked l
j 20 master which I retained as a precaution ~against loss or a
21 garbling of information in draft 1.
f d 22 With regard to copies MR. FAULKENBERRY:
I
! 23 3, 4, and 5, do you have knowledge of the people that 24 actutlly commented on those three copies?
25 MR. McCRAKEN: Yes. I commented on drafts k..
k 1 5, 2 MR. SHACKLETON: Iir. McCraken, you mean 3 copy number 5, currently?
4 MR. McCRAKEN: Correction, yes. Copy Number 5 5 of Draft 1.
6 (Pause) 7 Mr. Rocca commented on copy number 4 and 8 Mr. Battinger our chief civil engineer and members of 9 his sraff commented on copy number 3.
10 MR. FAULKENBERRY: To the best of your 11 knowledge, were there comments from any other individuals 12 of P.G.&E. entered into cocy number 5 besides.yourself?
,, 13 MR. ficCRAKEN: No.
(' 14 MR. FAULKENBERRY: To the best of your 15 knowledge, were comments from any other individuals 16 other than John Rocca entered into copy number 4?
i: 17 MR. McCRAKEN: I have no knowledge of any.
l 18 !!R. FAULKENBERRY : Now, copy number 3 you
- 19 communicated Mr. Be .tinger and members of his staf f 5
j 20 commented on copy no. 3.
~
I 21 Can you identify who the other members of i
f 22 his staff would be?
23 tiR. McCRAKEN: I belive Vince Chio, Senior 24 Civil Engineer also commented on copy nunber 3.
25 However, I do not know of any other person who
(.s .6'
..- 1 may have commented.
2 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, to the best 3 of your knowledge, does P.G.&E. have a policy written or 4 otherwise of not volunteering information to the NRC unless 5 it is specifically asked for?
6 MR. McCRAKE?i: Please clarify that question.
7 MR. FAULKENBE RRY : Do3s P.G.&E. have a 8 policy that has been conveyed to you or that you are aware 9 of that is in writing or has bsen conveyed verbally to 10 instruct its employees not to volunteer information to 11 the NRC unless it is specifically asked for by members 12 of the NRC?
,. 13 MR. McCRAXEN: I think P.G.&E's policy is k' that written material within P.G. &E. is considered 14 15 internal naterial and should not be divulged to any 16 outside source unless it is either requested or there 17 is a question of concealing that information as being l 18 an illegal matter.
g 19 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Now, is this a policy
- 20 that is directed toward the NRC specifically or is it fa 21 directed toward all government and non-govsrnment f 22 aqsncies equally?
s j 23 MR. McCRAKEN: It is directed to all outside 24 agencies equally.
25 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Is this a written policy?
. 4 4 , >,.,4.; .o . ,m, ... , ,
. . . .u.._.~........_.,..__. ,
1 11R . McCRAKEN: I could not find a document 2
that states this.
3 (Pause)
MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, again, do you 5
know of any conscious or pre-arranged plan again in writing 6
or: conveyed orally to P.G.&E. employees for P.G. &E, 7
personnel while in neetings with members of the NRC to 8
limit or otherwise constrain their response to NRC 9
questions?
10 (Pause) 11 11R. ItcCRAKEN: Not for an individual being 12 questioned.
13 (Pause) 14 f tR. FAULKENBEPRY: Okay, this brings up 15 the next question.
16 Is there a policy that exists for people -
j 17 directed to people that are not being questionned?
l 18 MR. !!cCRAKEN: No.
'O
! MR. FAULKENBERRY: Could you clarify the 20 answer to your first question? The answer to your f
21 f first question kind of raised a question in ny mind f 22 which led me to ask the second question so I really 2-l 23 don't understand the response to your first question.
24 MR. McCRAMEN: Someone representing P.G.&E.
25 makes a statement that is not comnletely understood by a N..
a (5%M 1 employee of P.G.&E. -- it's his responsibility to repor t 2 it to his supervisor and allow the supervisor to take 3 proper corrective action.
4 MR. PAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, I feel 5 there's still a little bit of confusio., with regard 6 to the last question I asked and I'd like to rephrase 7 this again.
8 The question is, do you know of any conscious 9 or pre-arranged plan which has been put in uriting or 10 which has been given verbally by any members of P.G. &E.
11 management to P.G.&E. employees that while they are 12 in meetings with the NRC, they've been informed to
,. 13 limit or otherwise constrain their responses to NRC k' 14 questions?
15 MR. McCRAKEN: No.
16 (Pause) j 17 MR. FAULKENBE RRY: Mr. McCraken, I believe i 18 that's the extent of the questions that I have.
j 19 Owen, do you have anything that you would j 20 like to ask?
21 !!R. SIIACKLETON : Yes. Mr. McCraken, do a
f 22 you recall large numbers of members of your senior I
i 23 staff from P.G.&E. attented a nesting in Washington, 24 D.C. on October 9 th , 19 81 with NRC?
25 f tR. McCRAKEN: Yes.
bb
"" 'i And as I understand it, MR. SHACKLETON :
- 2. is it correct that your immediate supervisor, !!r. Rocca 3
attended that?
MR. McCRAKEN: That is correct.
5 Are you also aware of a second MR. SHACKLETO'T :
6 meeting which transpired on November 3rd 1981 again 7
between senior members of your management and the NRC 8 in Washington, D.C.?
9 MR. McCRAKEN: Yes, I an.
10 MR. SHACKLETOII: Upon the return of the 11 the meeting on November 3rd,.1981, P.G.&E. people after 12 did you hear any discussions concerning -- discussions-13 that took place betuaen P'.G.&E. personnel and NRC k..
14 personnel and Dr. Cloud concerning the issuance of 15 Dr. Cloud's interin report?
16 MR. !!cCRAKE'i: No.
j 17 MR. SHACKLETON: Did you hear any discussion l 18 from management personnel that attended that meeting 19
.[ concerning the drafts and I'm now referring to what we-have j 20 been terming in our interview here drafts 1 and 2?
21 MR. !!cCRAKEN : Please repeat the question.
l 22 From the second meeting
!iR. SHACKLETON:
f
$ 23 which took place on 'lovember 3rd, when merbers of your 24 senior staff returned, do you recall hearing any 25 discussions from these gentlemen concerning drafts nunber 1 k..
, a (4##%1 1 and 2 from Dr. Cloud?
2 MR. McCRAKE'i: No.
3 (Pause) 4 MR. SHACKLETON: I have no further kquestions 5
at this point. Bob?
6 At this time -- do you have any additional 7
questions?
8 MR. FAULKEllBERRY: No.
9 MR. SHACKLETON: Mr. McCraken, before we 10 close of f the record, going off for the transcription, 11 are there any closing renarks that you would like to 12 make?
13 MR. McCRAKEN: No.
(- 14 MR. SHACKLETON: I again would like to 15 remind you that we would appreciate and the comnission 16 requests each interviewee to keep the testimony that's j 17 taken place here to yourself.
l 18 MR. McCRAKEN: I understand.
19 l MR. SHACKLETON: All right, ve ry good.
20 q We will then close this interview. We thank you very 21 j much'; Mr. McCraken, for sitting here with us and going 22 f through these questions.
I 23
- The time is now 5 ninutes after 4 in the 24 afternoon and this is the end of this interview.
25 jff
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2
{, NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3
4 INVESTIGATION OF 5
DIABLO CANYON UNITS 1 & 2 6 INTERVIEW OF 7
JAMES J. McCRAKEN 8
9 Pacific Gas & Electric Headquarters Offices H) Law Department Conf. Room 77 Beale Street 11 San Francisco, California 12 Thursday, December 17, 1981 13
( 14 The above-entitled matter came on for further 15 hearing, pursuant to adjournment at 12:57 p.m.
16 APPEARANCES:
17
! On behalf of the NRC Staff:
I g 18 OWEN C. SHACKLETON, JR. , Moderator B. H. FAULKENBERRY j 19 Y
l j 20 d
l 21
{
r 22 23 24 25 t
ERRATA SHEET Interview of J. J. McCracken, December 17, 1981 The following corrections should be made:
Pages 99,101,102, and 103 - Wherever McCraken appears, replace with McCracken.
Page 101, Line 13 - Change an erro to in error.
The above corrections have been identified by Bobby H. Faulkenberry and J. J. McCracken.
-100-
2.-
1
_P .R O _C _E _E D_ _I N_.G _S 2 12:57 p.m.
(gj y
3 MR. SHACKLETON: The date is December 17th, 4 1981 and the time is 12: 57 p.m.
5 This is a continuation of the interview of 6 Mr. James J. McCraken, Senior Mechanical Engineer for 7 the Pacific Gas and Electric Company.
8 The interview is taking place in room 3101, 9 of the corporate headquarters at Pacific Gas and Electric 10 Company at 77 Beale Street, San Francisco, California.
11 The persons present from PG&B is Mr. McCraken 12 and from the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission e Region 5, 13 Mr. Bobby H. Faulkenberry, Chief of Reactor Construction,
(
14 Project Branch, and my name is Owen C. Shackleton, Jr.
15 I am the Senior Investigator.
16 Mr. McCraken was being interviewed yesterday, a
17 December 16, 1981 and contacted the investigation team
- is today to present to us some clarifying information regarding i
j 19 the testimony that he provided to the Commission on December 20 16, 1981.
Mr. McCraken, you do understood sir, that you l -
21 22 do have a right to have legal counsel present?
l 23 MR. McCRAKEN: I waive that right.
24 MR. SHACKLETON: And you also understand, sir, 25 that the oath which was administered yesterday is still in
- 101.-
l 1
in effect so the testimony you are about to present to 'the j 2 Commission is still being given under oath?
(.1, 3 MR. McCRAKEN: I do.
4 MR. SHACKLETON: Thank you.
5 Whereupon, 6 JAMES J. McCRAKEN 7 having been previously duly sworn, was recalled as a witness 8 herein and was examined and testified as follows:
9 MR. SHACKLETON: Go ahead, Bobby.
10 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, I understand ti that since yesterday, you have determined that the date 12 you specified PG&E received the November 12 report was 13 an erro.
14 Would you please clarify this?
15 MR. McCRAKEN: The November 12th report was 16 received in-house on Friday, November 13th as opposed to h 17 Thursday, November 12th.
e
- 18 I recall this fact because I am certain it j ig arrived on a Friday, a
! 20 (Pause) 3 d
21 MR. FAULKENBERRY: Mr. McCraken, it is also i
r my understanding that you now have a better und erstanding 22 23 of what the PG&E policy is regarding either volunteering 24 or not volunteering information to the NRC unless it is l 25 specifically asked for by members of the NRC.
i i
-102-i ., . .. ....
' Would you please clarify this?
2 MR. McCRAKEN: Yes, the company policy on this
({-)
3 matter is taken from the employee's manual and I quote, 4
"It is the policy of this company that employees shall at 5
all times practice fundamental honesty. It is expected 6 that employees shall not deceive, defraud or mislead the 7 company, other employees 7or those the company has business 8 or other relationships."
9 That I believe is the company's policy.
10 Thank you, Mr. McCraken.
MR. FAU LKENBERRY:
11 That's the extent of my questions.
12 MR. S HACKLETON: Mr. McCraken, do you have any-13 thing further you wish to state at this time?
k.
14 MR. McCRAKEN: No.
15 MR. S!!ACKLETON: I have no further questions.
16 This will be the close of this interview of g 17 Mr. McCraken. The time is now 1:00 p.m.
g 18 (The witness was excused.)
j 19 MR. SIIACKLETON: We thank you very much, Jim, j 20 for coming in so that we can get this done and squared away.
21 Off the record.
22 (Whereupon a 30 minute recess was taken.)
23 ///
24 ///
k 2s ///
-103-
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