ML12275A474
| ML12275A474 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | San Onofre  |
| Issue date: | 03/24/2011 |
| From: | NRC/OI |
| To: | |
| References | |
| 4-2011-024, FOIA/PA-2012-0185 | |
| Download: ML12275A474 (135) | |
Text
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10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 2 3 24 25 jaiM;dM e e e Lt UNITED STATES OF AMERICA NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION OFFICE OF INVESTIGATIONS INTERVIEW
x IN THE MATTER OF:
INTERVIEW OF (b)(7)(C)
- 01 Case No.
- 4-2011-024 (CLOSED)
x March 24, 2011 San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station San Clemente, California The above-entitled interview was conducted at 1:36 p.m.
BEFORE:
r-pecial Agent (b)(7)(C)
I NOTE:
AS NO SPELLINGS OF TERMS/NAMES WERE PROVIDED, BEST GUESSES WERE USED.
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10 12 13 14 13 16 17 18 19 20 22 23 24 25 P-R-O-C-E-E-D-I-N-G-S 1:36 p.m PECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
For the record this is an interview of (b)(7)(C) who is employed by Southern California Edison at San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station.
Today's date is March 24, 2011.
The time is approximately 1:36 p.m.
This interview is being conducted at San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station.
(b)(7)(C) could you please state and spell your full name for the record?
I(b(7)(C)
My name is (7)(C)n am e s
l a st
)(7)C)
Imiddle initial; last name, I (b)
(b)(7)(C)I ESPECIAL AGENT T
I Okay.
And,l I
I i'm) 7 )
I'ma ISpecial agent] with the Office of the Investigations Region IV for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, and this interview is being recorded and transcripts will be produced from this.
I need to ask you at this time do you have any recording devices on you?
(
INo, I do not.
[PECIAL AGENT b)(7)(c)
I Okay.
And the purpose of this interview is to discuss claims of discrimination against you by SONGS management for you NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 2 5 raising safety concerns?
(b)(7)(c)
I That is correct.
rPECIAL AGENT bX7)C)
I Okay.
Would you raise hand for me, please, sir?
Do you swear the information you're about provide is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
[(b)(7)(C)
I d.
I do.
[SPECIAL AGENT I Okay.
Okay.
I([j7)(cI could you go over your background employment history here at San Onofre?
(b)(7)(C)
-]Yes, I've been employed at San Onofre since (b)(7)(C)
I've filled a number of different positions.
I was hired as aI(b)(7) C (b)(7)(C)
I did most of the.--
or a lot stat ion.
of the I(b)(7)(C) that was done at the I
(b)(7)(C)
[
(b)(7)(C)
I and I helped them get to the right people, get their questions answered.
I went to th (b)(7)(C) b)(7)(C)ib*,o I did the same thing with a couple (b)(7)(C)
And then after that I moved over to the (b)(7)(C) for about I(b)(7) C where I
worked on thel (b7)(c)
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[nd then I took another job after that.
for about(
And then at -- at about -- after about(c)
(b)(7)(C)
I I
was (b)(7)(C)
And then since --
from Ib)())(c)
(b)(7)(C)
And then some time I J all the (b)(7)(C))
I(b)(7)(C)
I All Of Iare (b)(7)(C) now i nII
[PECIAL AGENI(b)(I)(c)
Okay.
I So right now I'm technically in I (b)(7)(c) although I stilI(b
)(C)
(b)(7)(C) phone off i FECIAL AGENT Yes, I'm going i
it's not off already.
6PECIAL AGEN mb)(7)(c)
[(b)(7)(C)
Just to make s NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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to turn my cell Okay.
- ure.
- Oops, it (202) 234-4433 www.nealrgross.com
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-7c.
1 was not off.
2 PECIAL AGENTT()(7)(c)
So your current
)(b7)(C) 3 position is a
correct?
4 1 (b)(7)(C) 1 That's correct.
5
'SPECIAL AGENT
)(7)(c)
And you've been 6
in that position for I)()(c) lis that what you 7
said?
(b)(7)(C) 8 11I've
-- I've been in -- we've 9
been in (b)(7)(C)
Ibut I've been a 0
b(7()
isince the 1i VPECIAL AGENTEc 1(
Okay.
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 12 And, I7I our office received an allegation, a
13 concern raised by you regarding your treatment, here at 14 San Onofre.
And one of the issues that was raised was 15 it appears that in July of 2010 you wrote a
16 notification, declared notification titled (b)(7)(C) 17 is that correct, sir?
18 That's correct.
19 IPECIAL AGEN
') P I Okay.
And that (b)(7)(C) 20 went to the I believe that 2 1 (b)(7)(C) 22 (b)(7)(C) is that correct?
(b)(7)(C) 23 That's correct.
24
[SPECIAL AGENT 1(bl)(c)
Okay.
Can you 25 go over that situation for me?
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Let me -- could I just look at 2
that a little to refresh my memory?
3 FPECIAL AGENT I (b))c)
I Absolutely, yes.
4 Make sure we're talking about 5
the same one.
Yes.
6 It was a Friday afternoon about 10 minutes 7
to 4:00.
Our supervisor came around.
He was kind of 8
going cubicle to cubicle saying that when --
he was 9
going to be off the following week and that he was i0 going to put a --
a non-supervisory person in charge 11 of our group for the week he was gone.
And this -- as 12 stated in the notification, this person is not a 13 supervisor, is a I(b)(7)(C) has had no 14 supervisory training, has expressed on interest in 15 being a supervisor.
And at that point I said I'm not 16 taking direction from a (b)(7)(C)
I'm a 17 (b)(7)(C) 18
ýPECIAL AGENT 1b)()c)
I Yes.
()(
There were two other 20 supervisors present in the group who could have also 21 been in charge of the group for that week, so it 22 wasn't just me that, you know -- you know, there were 23 two other possibilities that the supervisor could have 24 selected.
25 And now at the time we were technically in NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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the I(b)(7)(C) but in the (b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C) there are very strict rules for upgrading 3
somebody to supervisor.
And we've had --
well, we're 4
just now, in the last couple of months, recovered from 5
a situation, a safety situation from a --
a battery 6
surveillance that was a white finding and one of the 7
root causes of that was inadequate supervision.
So I 8
guess I was surprised that my supervisor was trying to 9
slip this one in on us.
He didn't lay any groundwork 10 for it.
He didn't announce it openly.
We have group i!
meetings every day.
He didn't say anything.
It was 12 one of these --
13
[SPECIAL AGENT T
You're talking 14 about selecting a supervisor?
(b)(7)(C) 15 That's correct.
16 EPECIAL AGENT O(b)(7)()
I okay.
17 I In his --
i8
ýPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C)
In his absence?
19 I In his absence.
20
[SPECIAL AGENT TII)7)C Okay.
21 (b)(7)(C)
Now when he had been absent 22
- before, he had picked one of the other supervisors, J(b)(7)(c) 23 (phonetic),
to be in charge, and was 24 going to be there that week.
25 I PECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(C) Yes.
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(b)(7)(C) 1 So this -- you know, basically 2
this --
I'll just say it my way; is this violated in 3
my mind all the nuclear principles and safety 4
conservatisms that we're taught to observe.
- Again, 5
I'm not saying anything against the individual, but 6
the individual was flat out not qualified to be a 7
supervisor.
This person has spent her whole life 8
and that's pretty much what she does 9
now.
She's very good at.
She's a greatl7 10 That's her interest level.
And I thought 12 this was way over the line, so I told my supervisor 12 that and he just turned around and walked away.
He 13 didn't say, you know, we need to talk about this, or 14 why don't you come down to my office?
15 So then I --
a little while later I wrote 16 that notification.
And the next day, which was a 17 Saturday, I came into work, you know, to do my normal 18 work, and I sent the I (b)(7)(c)
Idirector an email and 19 said, you know, we -- we need to talk about this.
And 20 he sent me an email back maybe 30 minutes later and 21 said, hey, get on my calendar and we'll talk about it.
22 So the following week three of us had a 23 meeting with the director, because three of us were 24 concerned.
25 ISPECIAL AGENT (b)I7)(c)
And who was the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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10 10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 director you sent an email to?
I(b)(7)(C) 7 it was a
guy named r,(7)(C)
I(phonetic).
E PECIAL AGENT ()m)C Okay.
r7 ()
-1He has since left.
PPECIAL AGENT
~
And your current
-- i'm sorry, your supervisor involved in this with you, what was his name?
rb)7(C)
](phonetic).
CSPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c)
Okay.
And who was the individual that was tasked to do the --
to fill in for the supervisor while he was gone?
I (b)(7)(C)
Her name was -- first name was (b)(7)(C)
[PEAL AGENTII Okay. And last.
name?
I(b)(7)(C) 7 EPECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(C)c Okay.
Well, her first name was
=
If (b))
)(I EPECIAL AGENT 1b()C Okay.
I(b)((c)
I Yes.
Yes.
[SPECIAL AGENT (b(7)(c)
Okay.
Now you said there were two other supervisors that were NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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qualified to fill in for him?
2 That's correct.
3 tPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C) 1 okay. Well, had 4
they filled in for him in the past?
5
[)(C)
Yes.
6 PECIAL AGENTZ b)(7)(c)
And had you --
(b(7)(C) 7 IAt least one of them had.
8 tPECIAL AGENTpc*(7)(c)
Had you ever 9
filled in for him in the past?
I0 C(b)(7)(c)
No.
11
[PECIAL AGENTIb(
Do you know if 12 anyone other than[ (b)(7)(c) was asked to fill in?
13 Ib()C) do not know.
14 IS PECIAL AGENTI b)7)C)
Okay.
Did you 15 ever speak with the two supervisors to see if they 16 were asked or if they expressed an interest in filling 17 in for him?
18 1 --
I didn't ask them.
You 19
- know, we have a fairly mature organization that we 20 have lots of rules and regulations we observe.
I 21 won't say a military chain of command, but we have a 22 very, I guess, I don't know, professional approach to 23 how we do things like that.
We have an "Excellence 24 Guidebook" that talks about how ops is supposed to 25 model the best behavior for the site and yada, yada, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE.. N.W.
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yada.
2 Like I sayf ihad tilled in for 3
the supervisor in the past, you know, so in my mind 4
the issue was there were two qualified supervisors 5
present and available and they were bypassed.
And 6
that's --
7 PECIAL AGENT
[)j And to your 8
knowledge is that the first timel (b)(7)(c) had ever 9
filled in for him?
(b)(7)(C) i0 Yes.
11 SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
And you 12 said you brought it up to your supervisor's attention 13 and he just turned around and walked off.
Did you 14 ever get a chance to talk to him later about why this 25 happened?
16 No, I --
I didn't feel it was 17 as this discussion unfolds, you know, hopefully 18 those reasons will remain clear, but I didn't ask him.
19 I just --
I --
I informed him I was not going to take 20 direction from al (b)(7)(C) because I am a (b)(7)(C) 22 SPECIAL AGENT GONSOULIN4 Yes.
23 (b)(7)(C)
And he just turned around and 24 stormed off and, you know, didn't come back a few 25 minutes later and say, hey, let's let's
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work this work, you know?
2 PEdAL AGENI Okay.
And this 3
notification was written on actually July 9, 2010.
4 How long before the incident happened did you write 5
this notification?
(b)(7)(C) 6 I wrote --
i --
I wrote it the 7
same day.
8
@PECIAL AGENTII The same day?
9
[(b)()(C)
I Yes.
10
- PECIAL AGENýI b)(7)(c, Okay.
And how 11 long did (b)(7)(C) fill in for him?
Was it a week, 12 you said?
13 1
Yes, it must have been.
- Yes, 14 because one of the things we discussed with the 15
[
director -- the first thing he said -- he 16 asked us was,
- well, are you guys --
are --
are you 17 guys in revolt or what?
You know, those are my words; 18 not his.
And I said, no, we're -- we're going to do 19 what we're told to do, but we just think this 20 situation is
-- you know, violates common sense, good 21 judgment and, you know, basic nuclear principles of, 22 you know, excellent performance.
23 FPECIAL AGENT Okay.
24 (b)(7)(C)
And Edison has a very strict 25 hierarchy of job families and positions.
It's
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10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 13 I say, it's not quite at a military level, but --
so, you know, this in in my mind was so far over the line and it's typical of the behavior of this individual and his boss.
SPECIAL AGENT [
Okay.
(b)(7)(C)
Which again, we'll get into I think as time goes on.
[SPECIAL AGENT [b)(7)(C)
Okay.
And just on this particular issue, in your opinion did b7) have the qualifications to act as supervisor while he was gone, the supervisor was gone?
I(b)(7)(C)
Certainly not.
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
All right.
And what made you say why not or why didn't she have the qualifications?
What was her lacking?
What was she lacking?
(b)(7)(C) rb(7 5)7CI (b)(7)(C)
And again, I'm not saying that she's a bad person.
I'm just saying, you know, wrong person for the wrong job.
- Now, she said on --
on --
you know, I --
I won't say a lot, but I've heard her say, you know -- you know, she doesn't want authority, she doesn't want responsibility.
When she came over to the (b)(7)(c)
I she came over from the rb)7)(c)
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I Ibasically as a (b)7)(C) 1 2
And I know I spoke to her a couple of 3
times about
- saying, well, that you're in I~b)()(C)
~b)(7(C) 4 (you need to get some 5
(b)(7)(c) you need to take some (b)(7)(C) 6 so when you deal with these C) people they 7
have some kind of respect for who you are.
And she 8
basically refused to go to any training.
Well, she's 9
not under any obligation to do anything i say, but I 10 was just -- I've known her for, you know, 15-20 years.
(b)(7)(c)I 11 I just said now that you're you (b)(7)(C) 12 need to learn something about And she 13 basically refused to do so.
I talked to her twice 14 about it.
She joined the group; I don't remember 15 exactly when, maybel(b)(7)(c) 16
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
l(b)(7)(c) 17 1 So she's doing the same job in is (b)(7)(C) th (b)(7)(C) 18
,that she did in 19 although she's aAnd she got a 20 promotion to --
to take that job, so so she's 21 exhibited no leadership interests, not demonstrated 22 any leadership qualities whatsoever.
b) 7 (C )
23
[SPECIAL AGENTII Okay.
And with 24 regard to this particular issue, other than writing 25 notification, did you raise it to anybody else?
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- mean, I know you said you discussed it with your 2
supervisor and there was no discussion of it.
He just 3
walked away.
(b)(7)(c) 4 That's correct.
5
[PECIAL AGENý(b)(7)(C)
Anybody else you 6
raise a concern to?
I(b)(7)(C)I 7
1 Well again, the next day when 8
I came into work Saturday, you know, I sent the[7 9
director an email and said there's an issue we need to 10 talk about.
And then we met with him, I think it was 11 like the following Tuesday or Wednesday.
12 SPECIAL AGENT 1 Okay.
And 13 again, his name was?
(b)(7)(C) 141 is
@SPECIAL AGE NIIb(7(C And what was his 16 response or what did he say when you brought the 17 subject --
(b)(7)(C)
IS He --
he --
first of all, he 19 just wanted to make sure that, you know, everything 20 was okay, that people weren't, you know, up in arms.
21 And we said, no, we're going to do what we're told to 22 do, but we think it's wrong.
And he said, well, I'll 23 look into it.
24
[SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
And did 25 anything ever become on his inquiry?
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ic-(b)(7)(C)
He he turned it over to 2
another manager in our chain of command,)Z 3
(phonetic) and then I had several meetings witi]ZL 4
Iabout 'It.
5
[PECIAL AGENT TII(7(C Okay. And what 6
was the end result?
Or to date what's the end result 7
of it?
(b)(7)(C) 8 i was suspended for a week.
9 PECIAL AGENT TI(b)(7)(C) Okay.
As a
.0 result of raising this issue and pursuing it?
11 That's correct.
12
[SPECIAL AGENT I
Okay.
Okay.
13 Well, we'll get into that particular issue.
I just 14 wanted to make sure --
15 J~~(b)(7)(C)
J Y s 15 7
Yes.
16 PECIAL AGENT ]b7--
we get 17 everything.
All the preliminary work laid before we 18 get to that issue.
19 Okay.
We had --
we had two (b)(7)(C) 20
- meetings, and I had two meetings and I Z I documented the second meeting.
- And, you
- know, 22 basically he just said, well, you know, this is like 23 no big deal and, you know, I don't know why you're 24 kind of responding the way you did, why you think 25 that's anything to worry about.
And I said, you know, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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this -- we're in
-- we're in the Z
I(b)(7)(C) division.
2 You know, we prepare quality affecting documentation.
3 You need to have people in charge that know what 4
they're doing and understand the ramifications of what 5
could go wrong if you screw up a procedure.
6 You know, you might --
you might not get 7
the (inaudible) evaluation done or get it done 8
right or, you know, there are some things that, you 9
know, you got to be up to speed on.
You have to know Ic if a problem comes up.
Somebody calls her from the 11 field and says I need this procedure changed now, 12 whether that's really something you need to do or 13 whether, you know, you can put it in the normal, you 14 know, oueue.
I mean, there -- there are some things 15 you need to know and there are some judgments that 16 need to be made.
l F) (7) (c)/
17 S_
_eally downplayed the whole thing 18 and --
and then he said your relationship with your 19 boss is broken, isn't it?
And I said yes it is.
You 20 know, there's a history with -- between myself and my 21 supervisor and his boss.
And i said yes it is.
And 22 then he talked about,
- well, maybe I can find you 23 another job out of this group.
And also at the same 24 time he --
in the first meeting he asked me -- he kind 25 of played this role like, oh, you got to help me.
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10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2C 21 22 23 24 25 18 got a problem.
You got to help me.
But eventually by
-he second meeting it was maybe I can find you a job out of the group.
And he did end up setting me up for training and and offering me a job in another group.
And then at some point; and I don't know where it happened, but the decision was to retaliate and then all that was taken off the table.
IPECIAL AGENT I
Okay.
So what job were you supposed to go and have training for and go into?
(b)(7)(c) b(
)
)
It was some kind of (b)(7)(C)
- job, which was outside of theEr(C)
()7c) that I'm in, but it was still under erl(b)(7)(C) span of control and he set me up for training and the whole thing.
[SPECIAL AGENTII(b)(7)(c)
Other than the management person that you've already named, who else had direct knowledge of this that was involved in this particular issue?
(b)(7)(C)
(phonetic) 6PECIAL AGEN (b)(C)
What was his position?
I(b)(7,(c)
IHe is
-- he's theF(b)(7)(c) rb)
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19 (b)(7)(C) 1 2
PECIAL AGENT I
Okay.
Did you 3
have a face-to-face meeting with him?
4 (b)(7)(C)
No.
- SPECIAL AGENT((C Okay.
6 Because what happened was we 7
got a meeting with Ithe 8
directol and then that kind of got rolled over to two 9 meetings withI(b)(7(c)
]And then I was set up for 10 training -- got a little cotton mouth here.
I should 1I go get a bottle of water.
12
[PECIAL AGENT Yes, we can take 13 a break whenever you want to.
14 (So I had two meetings with r()(nc) 15
[ja t
the conclusion of which he set me up for 16 training so I could go to this other job.
And then I 17 was sitting at -- at my desk on a Friday afternoon at 18 2:00 and i get a phone call from my supervisor I(b)(7)(C)
[
19 w
ho said collect your personal belongings 20 and come up to the personnel building just out of the 21 blue.
So I --
I thought they were going to fire me 22 for something.
23 LPECIAL AGENTE)C)
Yes.
24 (b)(7)(C)
And so I went up to the
,(b)?)()
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was there and the (b)(7)(C) director I~b)(7)(c)
]
Andl~b)7)(C) n or e i
2 E
(phonetic) was there.
Andllinformed 3
me that I was being suspended for a week because of a 4
couple of things; No.
1 was a bad performance -- a --
5 a
bad midyear performance appraisal.,
which was 6
actually the basis for my allegation.
When I got my 7
midyear in
- August, that's when I
submitted the 8
allegation.
So he said you're being suspended because 9
of that.
And --
and I didn't hear anything else that 10 he said.
He may have said more.
1i But when i came back from my week-long 12 suspension, I said, well -- because one of the guys at 13 work told me that in a --
in a group meeting they said 14 that i had been suspended for a work rule violation.
15 And -- and 1 --
so when I came back and --
and I had 16 my return meeting with my supervisor; andaL!G) 17 was there also, I said what's this about a work rule 18 violation?
What --
what are you guys talking about?
19 And l
said, well, when you were describing --
20 in one of our meetings when you were describing why 21 you thouqht- )(7)(c) was not a qualified supervisor, 22 you said some --
you made some disparaging remarks.
23 And so that was the basis for that portion of the 24 suspension.
25 So at no time during either of the two NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS ANO TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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21 i
meetings that I had with[
jdid he ever say 2
anything about he didn't like zhe way I characterized 3
that person's skill level and the reasons why I said 4
she was not qualified.
And further, he --
you know, 5
he offered me a job.
6 P[PECIAL AGENTZI (b)()(C)
Yes.
7 ISo, you know, I don't know how 8
you explain going from, hey, I'm going to give you a 9
job so you can get out of here to you're suspended.
10
[SPECIAL AGENTII(b)(7C)
I Now during the 11 time that this was taking place, when you raised this 12 notification and when you got suspended, you hadn't 13 brought your issues to the NRC yet, had you?
(b)(7)(C) 1.4 1 don't -- no, I had initiated 15 the allegations before I was suspended.
16 IS PECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
I Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 17 The basis for my allegation 18 was my midyear performance appraisal.
19
[SPECIAL AGENT ffij Okay.
All 20 right.
And if you recall, what time span are we 21 talking about from the time you're --
22 (Whereupon, off the record briefly.)
23 PECIAL AGENTI I For the record 24 we're back on the record.
We had technical 25 difficulties and had to change the batteries with the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE iSLAND AVE., N.W.
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22 recorder.
2 E
i let's go back to what you were 3
talking about in 2007.
You said that you had an issue I(b)(7)(C) 4 with I
back in 2007 through your immediate 5
supervisor, is that correct?
6 (That's correct.
7 tPECIAL AGENT1Ib)(7)(C)
I okay.
Explain 8
that situation one more time, please, sir.
(b)(7)(C) 9
- Well, the. reason I'm raising
!0 this issue is that when I got suspended inI(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)i 11 one of the reasons cited for my suspension 12 was my midyear performance appraisal in 2007 that was 13 given to me by my supervisor.
And at the 14 end of our little session where he gave me the results 15 and I -- frankly, I gave my then-supervisor my frank 16 opinion of his value to the organization.
Two days 17 later without any kind of administrative action, 18 without either discipline or following any recognized 19 Edison personnel HR practice, they took me as a
(b)(7)(C) 20 It was 21 not --
it was not in my job family.
It was well below 22 my skill level.
23 So now you're saying, well, why would he 24 why didn't he do anything then?
Well, No.
1, I got 25 away from I
I thought I was getting away from NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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23 I
I as b)()(C 1
j(
but I knew I was getting away from 2
f(phonetic).
3 FPECIAL AGENTZ= -
An 4
was your immediate supervisor?
(b)(7)(C) 5 7
That's correct.
6 PECIAL AGENTI 7)(C)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 7 E
As luck would have it, at the 8
same time I went over to the (b)(7)(C) 9 took the job as -- he remained my manager.
I thought 10 T was going to go to a brand new group, but(
11 changed jobs such zhat he remained my manager.
12 PECIAL AGENTE(b)()(C)
Okay.
13 (7)(C)
So that's that's how that 14 happened.
Buz the reason I raise it today is that
{(~g(C) 15 when I was suspended in oone of the 16 reasons they cited was a bad midyear performance 17 appraisal from 2007.
18 ISPECIAL AGEN TII Okay.
1 9
- Yes, you
- know, it it 20 doesn't make sense.
- Well, it does.
When you 21 recognize that what they're doing is retaliating, then 22 it does make sense.
23 Now, the other interesting thing is that 24 I
rebutted that 2007 performance appraisal and I
25 rebutted the things that were lies in thaz midyear NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
24 i-7r 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 performance appraisal.
EPECIAL AGENT II7)C Okay. And, you I~)(7)(C) know, 1
-jwe just want to back up a little
- bit, because apparently the recording didn't get what you what led to your 2007 bad evaluation.
b J
Oh, okay,
[SPECIAL AGENT b)(7)(c)
Yes.
Just go over that briefly for us also, sir.
(7 IIf I can say this brieflybc had been out.
He had missed aboutI b()C (b)(7)(C) __
_I He. had lik6 al (b)(7)(C)
I
{*%t 7 \\It'* \\
or whatever, I don't know.
(b)(7)(G)
And that's he eventually picked an (b)(C)(c) outage to schedule his so he was gone most of the outage.
And when he came back, the outage was almost over and and he was he --
we were in meeting, group meeting.
He was trying to tell us something about we needed to do this and we needed to do that.
He didn't know what he was talking about because he'd been gone.
And I --
again, I'm --
I can't, you know, say anything other than what I
- said, but I just in exasperation I
said,l l
you're full of shit, you know?
So that's.--
so that in my --
my belief is why he subsequently retaliated NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-7c,-
25 1
against me on my performance appraisal rather than --
2 SPECIAL AGENT (11(7)(C)
From 2007?
(b)(7)(C)
- yes, that's correct 4
rather than handling it, you know, one-on-one meeting, 5
like don't ever do that again or -- or -- or some kind 6
of disciplinary action, you know?
7 EPECIAL AGENT Now 2007, you 8
sald this was your first case of retaliation by a 9
supervisor?
I(b)(7)(C) 10 That's correct.
11 ESPECIAL AGENT TII(7(C And in 2009 you.
12 write this notification regarding who you felt was an 13 unqualified--
14 In 2010, yes.
15 EPECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)(C)
I'm sorry, 2010.
16 Just to keep the timetable right, between 2007 and 17 2010 were there any other issues that you felt led to 18 more retaliation against you?
(b)(7)(C) 19
- Yes, in 2009 I got a --
I 20 wouldn't say it was a horrible performance appraisal, 21 but unwarranted needs improvements.
And again, it 22 goes to the heart of why six of the eight members of 23 the group filed the chilled work environment 24 allegation is because we had a couple of times in I(b)(7)(C) 25 meetings with our then-supervisor who NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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26 1
he was telling us to do on -- on several occasions to 2
perform our work not in accordance with our procedural 3
requirements.
And I think you -- anybody listening to 4
this recording, yourself included, would say, well, 1(b)(7)(C) 5 you know i
is not the kind of guy that's 6
just going to sort of let that slide by, and I didn't.
7 And I I spoke up.
I don't remember what I said.
8 1 didn't use bad words or anything, but you --
you 9
know 10 EPECIAL AGENT I
-And who was that 11 supervisor?
12 A guy named m
13 (phonetic) 14 PECIAL AGENT Okay.
15 And I challenged him at the 16 meeting and I said it sounds like you're telling us 17 not to obey our procedures, which I
you know, 18 you're in O0.
I don't know how nuclear you are, but 19 you know, we live and die by following our group 20 instructions.
So --
21
[SPECIAL AGENTZC Okay.
22 (b)(7)(C)
So again, rather than address 23 that issue, then when they wrote up like my midyear 24 2009, they made it sound like I was Attila the Hun.
25 tSPECIAL AGEN Okay.
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27 i
jump a little bit.
We can go back if you like.
(b()C) 2
- 1Yes, sure.
3
[SPECIAL AGENT Let' s jump a 4
little bit to in August 2010 you received a
5 negative midyear appraisal.
r)[(7)(cC f
6 r
That's correct.
7
ýPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
You wrote the 8
notification in July of 2010?
I(b)(7)(C) 9 7(That's correct.
10 PECIAL AGENT In August 2010 11 you got your performance appraisal and you had needs 12 improvement --
I(b)(7)(C) 13 That's correct.
14 PECIAL AGENTIZ)(
on some of 15 the areas?
16 E!7a Many needs improvements, yes.
17 EPECIAL AGENT)7'(c)
Okay.
And you 18 feel that it was a
result of you writing this 19 notification and other things that had happened to 20 you?
21 17)(C)
Primarily that.
Not just 22 that, but I --
I believe that was the catalyst.
2.3 SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
24 Because it happened about six 25 weeks before and I don't know I
I don't know NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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C-1 28 1
this for a fact, but my belief isI(b)(7)(c) my 2
supervisor, got some blowback for -- for pulling this 3
stunt.
I mean, I don't know that, but that 's my 4
belief.
5 PECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
6 (b)(7)(C) iprobably got a little 7
blowback also, like what were you guys thinking, you 8
know?
9 PECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
10 Again, that's supposition on 11 my part.
12 PECIAL AGENT I)Now you said you 13 received many needs improvements.
14
~(b)(7)(C)
Y s 14 Yes.
15
[SPECIAL AGENTI b)(7)(c)
Your midyear 16 appraisal was 2010.
Was that the most needs 17 improvements you had even received?
(b)(7)(C)
Yes 18 Yes.
19
[PECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(c)
Okay.
And what 20 would reason would you give for receiving these needs 21 improvements?
22 I --
I don't know that I could 23 give a reason.
I mean, it's it's just so --
in my 24 mind it was just so outrageous.
I mean, clearly at.
25 this point you know and everybody that's listening to NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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29 I
this knows that there's no love lost between myself (b)(7)(C) 2 and [and myself an But in 3
terms of doing my job, I do my job very well and I do 4
speak out when I see something that is wrong.
I don't 5
go high and to the right.
I don't jump up and down.
6 1 don't throw a temper tantrum.
I point things out.
7
[SPECIAL AGENT Yes.
rb)(7)(c) 8 1So you can look back; and 9
you'll have copies of my last several years of 10 performance appraisals, but there's nothing in my 11 history that ever -- that would suggest or justify the 12 eight needs improvements I got at midyear.
It's 13 almost you you can't explain it.
There's no 1-4 performance basis for those marks.
15 And and let me just provide one 16 example; just one.
Is one of the things I was graded 17 down on was my work output.
- Now, let me set the 18 scene:
I'm in my supervisor's office.
He said you're 19 getting a needs improvement because you only did (b)(7)(C) 20 in the first six months of the year.
21
- Well, I knew I had done more and I said I've done more 22 than that.
And and the only thing(b)(7)(C) 23 could say was I ran a report.
And I said, well, your 24 report's wrong.
He said I ran a report.
And then I 25 said I keep a record of every[ )(7)(C) that I NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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do just for this kind of thing.
2
[PECIAL AGENT1(b)(7)(C I
Yes.
3 (b)(z)(C)
Because I -- I mean, anybody 4
I mean, frankly nobody believes that a report is 5
infallible.
I mean, let's get serious.
At least not 6
without some validation.
I said you can come by my 7
desk.
I can provide you a list of all thd ffi 8
(b)7)(C) that I did.
And and literally he said 9
nothing.
Every time I'd say something like that, he'd 10 say I ran a report.
11 Now what that told me is he was told to 12 run a report and they were looking for the lowest 13 number they could find.
And when they found a low 14 number, that was it, they were done.
He never came to 15 me ahead of time and said looks like your work 16 output's kind of low, or it's low compared to somebody 17 else.
This was just out of the blue.
18 iPECIAL AGENT b)(7)(c)
Yes.
(b)(7)(C) 19 And you'll get copies of --
20 you know, Edison has a policy where you have to keep 21 people advised of how they're doing, you know, that 22 you don't blind side them.
And the reason they didn't 23 do that is because there was no basis for that remark 24 or that comment.
I did I(b)(7)(C) 25 than what they said I did.
Okay?
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31 1
No.
2, I was doing other work during some 2
of that six months in 2010.
He gave me no credit for 3
that.
I was on al (b)(7)(c)I 4
had worked the previous outage that didn't end until 5
-- or at least my part of the outage didn't end until 6
earlyI(b)(7)(C) so I didn't even come back to the group 7
until like the second week ofIc I
So I
can 8
account for at least over a month of time away from 9
the group.
iC Then he runs this report and who knows 11 what the parameters were, but it was wrong.
And he 12 refused to entertain any other, you know counter-13 information.
So that tells me that the fix was in.
14 Okay?
You know, when somebody says I'm not even going 15 to go look at your records; and he could have 16 validated all my records.
It's not like I make this 17 stuff up.
18 PEC.AL AGEN TII)
Yes.
19 (b)(7)(C)
He could look on the database.
20 He can see what I did.
So, you know, and that was why 21 I generated the allegation because I
knew at that 22 point they were lying and they were lying on purpose.
23 It wasn't like cup's half full; cup's half empty.
24 It's like we know God damn well there is
-- pardon my 25 French --
this this data is wrong, but we want to NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-701.
32 1
screw this guy, so we're going with it.
And even when 2
confronted with information that's different, he --
literally,
-'m --
I'm -- he said nothing.
He wouldn't 4
say anything but I ran a report.
5 S
PECIAL AGENTr )(7)(C)
And this was 6
1 7
(That's correct.
8 FPECIAL AGENT1 (c)(7)(c)
And that's the 9
one that gave you your midyear?
I(b)(7)(C)I 10 1 That's correct.
11 tPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
And 12 again; I know I asked this earlier, but did he give 13 you any justification for giving you a
needs 14 improvement on any of the issues he gave --
(b)(7)(C) 15
- Yes, he --
I mean, he talked 16 about each one, but it's just it's it just 17 defies logic.
So the only thing I can say today is 18 I'd like you to speak with a number of other people i9 who will tell the way it is.
20
[SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
I And since we're 21 in the juncture, why don't you go ahead and give me 22 the names of the folks you'd like to speak with, if 23 you're ready to do that?
24 I have a list, but I'd like to 25 this is all your stuff, by the way.
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-7c, 33 I
[SPECIAL AGENT 11()(Z)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 2 Here's a list of some people, 3
but what I'd like to do at some point is I'd like to 4
explain who I think would be good for you to talk to.
SSPECIAL AGENTII b)
Okay.
b)(7)(C) 6 And I haven't spoken to all 7
these people and said, hey, would you talk --
if if a
somebody called you, would you -- you know, I haven't 9
groomed these people or anything.
10 PECIAL AGENT 1(b)(7)(c)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 11 But certainly I've got some 12 coworkers that I'd like you to talk to who will vouch 13 for myperformance and who I'm pretty confident will 14 say, you know, they're out to get me, you know, and --
15 you know, and because I mean I -- because, you know, 16 if I
had gotten one or two needs improvements at 17
- midyear, I
would have I
wouldn't have said 18 anything.
It would be like, you know, we we don't 19 like each other and I've -- I've got --
I I need to 20 give you a little more information about that.
But 21 there's no love lost between us.
But as a
22 supervisor/manager, you deal with people's 23 demonstrated performance.
Just because you don't like 24 somebody you don't retaliate.
25
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
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'IC, 34 (b)(7)(C) 1
- 1Now, the other --
the other 2
thing is this meeting that's about the unqualified (b)(7)(C) 3
- person, when I had my meetings. with
[
at 4
some point he called the Employee Concerns Program and 5
had one of your former employees, a guy named (b)(7)(C) 6 (phonetic),
come over and do a
little 7
investigation; and I'll give you a copy of that.
8 ESPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c) 7 Okay.
9 And I think it's a very 10 unprofessional document.
It's just full of hearsay 11 and there's really no -- not much by way of fact or 12 verification.
But I spent an hour talking to and 13 at first I said, like, what are you doing here?
You 14
- know, he's, well, I'm here to, you know, talk and 15 understand what's going on in this
- group, the 16 dynamics, yada, yada.
And I said I don't know if I
17 really want to talk about this.
You know, I treated 18 it as --
it wasn't a requirement that I speak with 19 him.
It was voluntary.
20
[SPECIAL AGENTII1)(7)(C)
Yes.
21 But then I said, oh, okay.
22 Yes, wait, I'll talk to the guy.
You never know.
So 23 I spent over an hour talking to the guy.
And what 24
[(J told me at our second meeting was that --
25 and I don't know if really said this; maybe he NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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35 1
did, but he said -
used to be in your --
2 PEC A Ti(b)(7)(C) 2PECIAL AGENT T
Allegations.
I(b)(7)(C)I 3
7
-- allegations, right.
He --
4 he -- he told me that. [
said I was uncooperative.
5 I spent an hour talking to the guy just like we're 6
talking today.
I didn't say any -- I didn't withhold 7
information.
I didn't -- you know, it was talk.
But 8
when you read that, what you're going to see is that 9
he calls me -- he calls me out as a troublemaker, to 10 other guys in our group as a troublemaker.
1I
[PECIAL AGENTI You're talking 12 about mdoes?
-- 3b)(7)(C)
Yes 13
!Yes.
14
[JSPECIAL AGENTI________________
15
- Yes, in the report.
And 16 there's no substantiation for it, you know?
He 17 listened to a couple of whiners in the side of the house, the (b)(7)(C) who, you know 19
-- you know, let's just say we --
we don't have a high 20 regard for one another professionally.
21
[SPECIAL AGENT 1 Okay.
22 BBut rather than, you know, 23 confirm or give anybody a chance to rebut, he just 24 wrote it up that way.
So, you know, and then that all 25 fed into, you know --
I --
I I
I think there's NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., NW.
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Ii 36 1 1 a link in there to the suspension, you know, my 2
belief.
[SPECIAL AGENTI(Z)(7)(C)
Okay.
And with 4
regard to your performance appraisal you made your 5
appraisal, you made your appraisal, did you know what 6
anybody else in the group got?
Anybody else had low 7
marks?
b )(7 }(C.}Y s
8 7
(CYes.
9
[PECIAL AGENT Ib)(7)(C)
They felt 10 shouldn't have received?
ii Yes.
Yes, one --
one person.
12 ESPECIAL AGENTZ1b)(7)(C)
Okay.
And who 13 was that person?
(b)(7)(C) 14 (phonetic).
.b)(7)(C) b 16
) And I think he's on the 17 witness list.
18 8PECIAL AGENT Yes.
Okay.
(b)(7)(c) 19 Now, the way decided to 20 deal with this situation, like several other people, i (b)(7)(C) 21 is heI 22 ISPECIAL AGENT c(b)(7)(c)
Is he
)(7)(C) 2(b)(7)(C) 24 1 He's I think he --
he 25 had a and I think that was his NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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37 (b)(7)(EN 1
2 ESPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
3 7
And the other thing I need to 4
point out is Is the fourth person who has (b)(7)(C) 5 I(b)(7)(C) 6 7
You
- know, one guy was a
(b)(7)(C)]
8 (phonetic).
He's he's been gone since (b)(7)(C) 9 And when he left he said I'm not i0 coming back.
11
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
I(b)(7)(c) 12
) Second guy was a fellow named 13 (phonetic) who would love to talk to you.
14 PECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
I(b)(7 c)(C) 15 He was one of the allegers for 16 the chilled work environment.
He also was retaliated
](b)(7)(C )I 17 against by 1 18 ISPECIAL AGENT[
Now was he a 19 (b)(7)(C) 19 20 (b)(7)(C)
No, he's an 17' 1who 2 1
)1b)(7)(C) 22
[SPECIAL AGENT1)(fc l Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 23 And he actually went to 24 (b)(7)(C)
- Yes, I think he prevailed 25 to some extent.
He's noz allowed to talk to me about NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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38 1
it, but he did remind me; he said I can talk to the 2
NRC all day long about it.
His case is very similar 3
to mine where he was told all year long he was --
his 4
performance was just fine and then by his (b)m(7)(C 5
supervisor and then the last day of I(b)(7)(C) 6 the -- the performance year, you know, eached l(b)()(C-)
[--
7 down and told to give him a needs improvement.
8 There are different levels of needs 9
improvement.
The needs improvement tha t
dgot 0
1(b)(7(C) 10 meant that he forfeited about an L J
onus.
So 11 there was a direct financial impact there.
And 12 eventually filed an allegation.
He eventually -- he 13 went to a
land I don't know exactly what 14 happened, but I think he somehow prevailed.
I don't 15 know to what degree, but he would --
he would love to 16 talk to you.
- l~b)(7)(C) 17 PECIAL AGENTI Okay.
So that's 18 so~
as the second guy.
So we got[)
19 who said I'm never coming back here (b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C) 20 (b)(7)(C) 21 22 after that retaliation on his performance appraisal.
23 The third guys who's name is also on the 24 list is (phonetic),
who was an 25 j(b)(7)(C)
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39 1
(b)(7)(C) 2 And after he went back (b)(7)(C)
(7)(C) 3 to become an And again, his (b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C) 5 these are the that.
and (b)(7;(C)
I (b)(7)(C) 6 have as long as and (b)(7)(C) 7 are still here I'm not --
I'm not coming 8
back.
9 Now, yes, the fourth guy is 1J got like me, got eight needs ii improvements at midyear.
In some respects -- well, (b)(7)(Cb)(7)(C) 12 what happened to
-a ad a (b)(7)(C) 13 (b)(7)(C) 14 And he was in another group, but 15 for some reason they sent him over to to the (b)(7)(C) 16
.And we had a training class going 17 on at the time he came back, like about a week or two 18 after he showed up there was a training class and they 19 wouldn't put him in it.
So --
so they made him a 20 (b)(7)(C)
They wouldn't give him the (b(7(C)ne r
21 training.
nev er gave him any guidance.
22 He's kind of sitting there like I'm just spinning my 23 wheels and his --
you know, so he -- you know, he kind 24 of clicked off and at some point we we had a lot of 25 talk.
We --
we talked a lot about this and at some NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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40 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 point he just --
he just left.
- PECIAL AGENT Ob)(F)c) okay.
In 2010 before your midyear you said he never --
I'm talking about your supervisor, never (inaudible) said you were having problems in these areas?
h(b)(7)(c)
That's correct.
[SPECIAL AGENT T(b)(7)(c) Okay.
b)(7)(C)
INow he'll say -- he said it he said he'll say something like I think --
you know, once I said something to you about it, but you know, I don't really -- there was no sit down meeting or conversation.
And --
and let me say this:
You (b)(7)(C)
- know, doesn't know anything about procedures.
He doesn't know anything about anything.
And some of the people on that list have worked with him in the past.
And every time -- every person I run into on site where they
- say, hey, who's your I(b)(7)(c) supervisor, I say[ 7 I they literally 7
(b)(7)(C) rol... their eyes.
There's one reason c
has the job he has, and that is because ofr(K)
(b)(7)(C) is notorious for hiring people that will do nothing but kiss his butt.
They have no professional skills or qualifications, butlc) ust likes it that way.
I've already mentioned to you aboutb7c NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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'-~1 41 1
I(b)(7)C) lwho
[
jP7)(c) rotected 2
and continues to protect.
And how he's got 3
bBut one of those witnesses, if we're 4
lucky she may say; because she told me this this is 5
a she now, there was a guy who was, you know,Z 6
toadee up until eight or ten months ago.
And at 7
some point I guess, you know, the way this woman 8
explained it to me; and I didn't ask; I didn't solicit 9
this, she just we were --
it's like at the copy 10 machine, you know, she's telling me.
She said, well, 11 you know, at some pointb recognized -- and I'm 12 going to clean up the language, but she said at some 13 point,7 recogrized tha was a 1()7(C) 14 much bigger kiss-up than[
j(phonetic),
who was the 15 previous l
toadee.
And --
and she said onceI*C) 16 recognized that, the (G) was out and J
was 17 in. -
brought over working for him when 18 Ziwas in charge of work orders and stuff.
And then 19 whe (b)(7)(C)
I became the the (b)(7)(C) 20 manager, then, gosh, surprise, surprise, guess who got 21 the (b)(7)(C) 22 you know?
23 ISPECIAL AGENTb(C)
Okay.
24 loYou
- know, my guess is if you (b)(7)(C) 25 went to the hiring record for
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42 1
you'll find that he was -- they probably interviewed 2
no more than two people.
They probably interviewed 3
one person from off site and()(7)(C)
]and that was (b)(7)(C) 4 it.
[j has a record of abusing the job selection 5
process to put people he wants in in place.
And 6
unfortunately, the job selection process has got 7
enough loopholes and weaknesses that you can do that.
8
[SPECIAL AGENT 1(b)7)(c)
I Okay.
9 He' s -- he' s picked people for 10 jobs without even interviewing, so --
Ii
[SPECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)(c)
And who was the 12 woman you were talking about?
(b)(7)(C) 13ý (phonetic) 14 PECIAL AGENT1()(7)(C)
Okay.
15 And I --
I think I hav 16
((phonetic) on there also.
17
[PECIAL AGENTII Yes.
18 (b)(C)
I think she'll -- they'll both 19 talk about and
)
20 LPECIAL AGENTII(b)(7(C)
Okay.
21 In
- fact, in an unsolicited 22 comment about a month ago, I was talking toI(b)(7)(C) 23
-- or I was at the -- getting a drink of water 24 at the water fountain and literally the conversation 25 went something like this:
How you doing?
Oh,
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'C, 43 1
you know?
And then -- and that was the extent of the 2
conversation.
And then she said, like out of nowhere (b)(7)(C) 3 she said, is a liar, just like that.
4 I mean, you talk about two guys. that people across the 5
site dislike bordering on hate, it's those two guys.
6 Because what they've done to me they've done to 7
others.
They've thrown a lot of people under the bus.
8 SPECIAL AGENTJ b)(7)(¢)
what 9
was your year-end appraisal like for 2010?
10 It was about the same as 11 midyear.
Instead of eight needs improvem~nts, it was 12 six.
And again, you'll -- you'll get a copy of that.
13 IPECIAL AGENTIb7c)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 14
[
I'll give you a copy.
What 15 was interesting is when you read the performance 16 appraisal, you'll -- there are places where I'm able 17 to put in comments and then they put in their
-- their 18 comments.
But I pretty well nailed them shut on this 19 bogus your work output is low.
So what you'll see is 20 nothing about bad work output.
Everything is shifted 21 over to, oh, I lack integrity or, I mean, I don't 22 know.
It's it's just made up obnoxious stuff.
(b)(7)(C)I 23
ýPECIAL AGENT ffij And in the 24 performance appraisal, I'm assuming there's 25 justifications for why they gave you these marks?
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I C-44 1
1(b)(7)(c)
There there --
there are 2
some there are some words.
I wouldn't go so far as 3
to say justification.
4 VPECIAL AGENT I
- Well, in their 5
mind I guess it would be justification?
(b)(7)(C) 6 1ut for example, once I got 7
this midyear, I
you know, I just said to myself, 8
well, clearly it doesn't go any good to say anything 9
around here.
So I said I'll just I'm just not 10 going to write anymore notifications.
I'm not going 11 to raise any issues.
And that's fine.
I mean, you 12
- know, it's you know, I mean, truly these aren't 13 exactly life or death issues, you know?
14 So I just
-- and other things, like in the 15 midyear and --
and also in the end of year, you'll see 16 some comments that Ib)(7)(C)
Itook things that I've 17 said out of context and then he sort of blows it up 18 into like, you know, who knows what?
So I you 19 know, I recognized that was his tactic, so I just said 20 I'm going to -- just not going to say anything.
You 21
- know, I mean, that's I'm --
come to work.
I'm 22 going to do my job, you know?
I'm going to speak when 23 spoken to.
I'm not going to raise any issues, like I 24 say, or write any notifications.
25 And so, their new tactic by the end of the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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45 1
year was not that my work output was bad, but that I 2
had gone silent.
- Well, I didn't go silent.
I just didn't say anything unless I needed to.
But now I'm 4
getting beaten up for having gone silent.
r, I(b)(7)(c)
In w a a -
5 LSPECIAL AGENT
[
JIn what way?
6 (b)(7)(C) 7 Beats the heck out of me.
7 There's no justification in there.
There's no record 8
of counseling.
I mean, that's the other thing we have 9
to remember here:
Edison has a policy of keeping 10 employees informed of their performance status such ii that if someone is not doing well or needs 12 improvement, that they're coached on it early enough 13 where they can get it fixed.
You'll find no record of 14 any counseling in my case.
Okay?
There's no record 15 of anything.
I mean, there's nothing written.
16
- Now, I don't know how you can go and give 17 someone eight needs improvements without one shred of 18 written documentation, but they do that.
And they do 19 that (a) it's retaliation; and (b) they've been doing 20 it for so long they recognize no one is ever going to 21 hold them accountable for it.
Okay?
I mean, that's 22 how they operate pure and simple.
23 SPECIAL AGENT1(b)I)(c)
Okay.
And the 24 other individual, was it b)(7)(C)
(phonetic)?
25
- Yes, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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v
46 I
PEdAL AGENTI 2
(
7 Yes.
3 PECIAL AGENTI W
Who got eight 4
needs improvement along with you at midyear.
Do you 5
know what his final end of year appraisal was like?
I(b)(7)(C, 6
I doubt if he got one because 7
somewhere around Thanksgiving he he pulled the 8
plug.
9 PECIAL AGEN TIIb17(C Okay.
10 He's gone.
11 ISPECIAL AGENTI (b(7)(c)O He's gone?
122 C)
And I've tried to call him 13 several times since then and he hasn't called back, so 14 1 don't what's going on.
15 CPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c) 7 Okay.
16 But he had --
he had some kind 7
of(b)(7)c)
I don't know exactly what it
- was, 18 but he basically said, you know --
and again, that's 19 what -- you know, that's what these guys do is they --
20 they run people out they don't like and then they --
21 in their place they get, you know, kind of the -- the 22 the malleable --
you know, the people that are --
23 you know, i --
I mean, I can't blame them, that are 24 happy to have a
job.
They're not going to say 25 anything.
They're not going to say anything.
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A, 47 1
And the other thing, in --
in the package 2
I'm going to give you is I've included a few memos and 3
things from the first half of 2010 where, you know, 4
people said, hey, you did a great job and yada, 5
yada, yada.
6 CPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c)
Okay.
(b )(7
)
I) 7 1So I
- mean, it's so the 8
picture that I'm trying to paint here is that 9
especially has fostered a chilled work environment for 10 a long time.
It's in his genes.
It's how he works.
Ii.
I've known this guy for almost as long as --
- well, 12 almost --
probably 28-29 years.
13
[SPECIAL AGENT 1(
Now have you 14 ever worked directly for him without an immediate 15 supervisor or --
I(b)(7)(C) 16 No.
No.
But first, let me 17 give you another example of howL____(C) perates.
One 18 outage; I don't know, it was in like 2001 or 2002, we 19 had a -- one of the things that we do is we connect up 20 these instrument penetrations that go through the 21 reactor head.
And they're kind of a big deal.
I 22 mean, it's part of the reactor coolant system pressure 23 valve.
And it's not an easy evolution that's -- the 24
-- the penetration is complicated.
It's got a lot of 25 parts.
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48 1
and it's you know, you --
you have to --
you really 2
have to focus.
You got to follow the procedure.
If 3
you don't, you can make a mistake.
4 And sure enough one outage one of the guys made a mistake.
I didn't put some packing in where it 6
was supposed to go.
7 PECIAL AGENT[ (b)(7)(cYes.
(b)(7)(C) 8 So then, you know, usually 9
it's about two weeks.
It's like a week or 10 days 10 later where they get the reactor coolant system ii pressurized and they start raising pressure.
And sure 12 enough this penetration leaked.
So they had to, you
-3
- know, cool down the plants.
Then we had to do some 14 partial reactor disassembly and go figure out what the 15 problem was.
- Well, we it it didn't take too 16 long for people to figure out that there was some 17 missing packing in this one location.
18 So, where I'm going with this is that when 19 the outage was over -- the outage was over maybe about 20 10 days after this leak incident.
I mean, it was 21 embarrassing.
It shouldn't have happened.
This one 22 guy made a mistake.
He admitted it.
He said I got 23 too wrapped up in the -- what I was doing.
I wasn't 24 paying attention.
I didn't have the procedure.
You 25
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49 1
of did it.
It's open and shut.
I mean, it's cut and 2
dry.
Individual error on a part of a
worker.
3
- Actually, it was a supervisor.
Nice guy.
Good guy.
4 Fessed up right away.
Didn't try to hide anything, 5
you know?
6 Well, about a week or two after the outage I(b)(7)(C) 7 was over, I was in a meeting ini office with 8
another guy and we had two incidents that outage that 9
we had to do a -- like a post-outage investigation on.
10 In other words, you know, get the facts, figure out 11 what went wrong, what we didn't do right so we could 12 fix whatever we needed to fix; a procedure, training, i3 you know, who knows what?
And I was assigned one 14 evolution that had hadn't gone as well as we 15
- wanted, you know?
And this other guy was assigned 16 this RCS head leak investigation.
And wha t!
I 17 told this guy is
-- now, this is the guy he's briefing 18 to go perform an investigation to understand what the 19 problems were and what the causes were.
20 1PECIAL AGENT TII7C)
Yes.
21 (b)(7)(C)
He didn't say go identify the 22 causes.
What he told this guy is this is the cause.
23 Now go do your investigation and make this the cause.
I(b)(7x)(C 24 That's the way [
perates.
25 tS PECIAL AGENT TII(7(C Okay.
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50 1
1And I got some witnesses for 2
chat if you want, but I --
I think we're getting a 3
little beyond.
But what I'm trying to establish here 4
is that when people who read this you
- know, 5
sometimes and unfortunately in my incoherent 6
explanation of what's going on they're saying like, 7
what what what is this?
I'm saying you're 8
dealing with some people that do this all the time.
9
[SPECIAL AGENT1C)
Okay.
10 It is it they're wired 11 for this and they have no adult supervision.
In this (b(7(C) 12 situation you would have expected [
for 13 example, [
jboss, to sort of smooth this thing 14 over.
But instead of smoothing it over, he made it 15 worse.
You know, he ended up supporting all this 16 retaliation.
He offered me a job and then at some 17 point; I don't know where the communication occurred 18 or -- or what drove it, but they went from, hey, you 19 know the best thing here is to mov to another 20 work group to well let's let's let's pull a 21 bunch of obnoxious stuff together and suspend him for 22 a
week.
And just like they don't follow the 23 procedures on performance appraisals, because they 24 don't have to and the other thing is it jusz 25 wouldn't be warranted.
I mean, there was no basis to NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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51 I
counsel me at any time this year.
2
[SPECIAL AGENT[ b(7)C)
_7 Yes.
3 bC You know, they just make stuff 4
up and put it on your performance appraisal, just like 5
they did in
- 2007, just like they did in 2009.
They 6
didn't even follow the company rules for disciplinary 7
action.
Do you know I still don't know what it is 8
that it was alleged that I said aboud(b)(7)(C) -that 9
prompted this disparaging, you know,
- remarks, work 10 rule violation.
11
ýPECIAL AGENTb7O They have never 12 explained to you?
( b)(7 )(C )
_ 7N o
13 No.
No.
At not time did 14 anybody ever inform me that there was like a charge 15 pending against me or a belief that I had somehow 16 violated a -- a company rule.
17 LPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Yes.
18 At no time.
I was sitting at i9 my desk on a Friday afternoon and I get this call out 20 of the
- blue, you
- know, collect your personal 21 belongings and come up to personnel.
And I'll give 22 you a
copy of the company's disciplinary action 23
- policy, but clearly it says in there that you 24 interview all affected parties including the person 25 who's suspected of wrongdoing.
I I mean you NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., NW.
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IC, 2
3 4
5 6
7 8
9 10 1i 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 52
- know, I mean this is
-- you know, I hate to say this, but you know, I was in I was in theIb)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
Okay?
It's kind of a tough life.
You know, you treat people pretty rough because that's the nature of the business.
I(b)(7)(C) b)(7)(C)
Ibetter than we've been treated here by these guys.
I can't tell you how many times how many (b)(7)(C)
I but I
guarantee you every one of them had a chance to explain their side of the story.
SPECIAL(b)(7)(C)
Yes.
I was never given a chance to explain my side of the story, No.
- 1. And No.
2, the company policy demands it and they didn't do that.
FPECIAL AGENTI Did you ever raise that issue with anybody?
No.
No.
Who would I raise it to?
PECIAL AGENT Upper management.
I mean, I don't know who --
I(b)(7)(c)
I They don't care.
ISPECIAL AGENI I don't know what your NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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53 7(C)
Yes, I'm not trying to --
I'm 2
not trying to be cynical or facetious here, but there 3
is no one here you can talk to.
That's why you got 4
all these people filing allegations and and so 5
forth.
6
[SPECIAL AGEN Tfb)(f)i JAnd I know we' ve 7
touched on this, just mentioned a couple of times, the 8
next little category I want to get into is your 9
suspension.
10 (b)(7)(C)
Yes.
ii
ýPECIAL AGENT(b)(7)(c)
I That was back in 12 September 2010, is that correct?
13
(
That's correct, yes.
14
ýPECIAL AGENT r And you were 15 suspended for one week?
(bb)(7)(C) 17 PECIAL AGENT b(Without pay?
18 That's correct.
19 PECIAL AGENTT1(b)(7)(C)
Okay.
And you 20 said it was ithat suspended you?
21(b)(7)(C)
I don't know who officially (b)(7)(C) 22 suspended me.
He and again, this is 23 the wayI7)(C) works, he's sort of an instigator.
24 And then whenever the action takes place, he's not 25 around.
He was not at the suspension meeting.
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54 1
ISPECIAL AGENT I (b)(7)(c)
Who actually 2
gave you your suspension notification or letter?
(b)(7)(C) 4
[SPECIAL AGENTI Okay.
(b(7(C)
(b(7(C) 5
[
Now, [
was there 1.so.
7/)(C)(c 6
And then a guy name l
(phonetic) who was the (b)(7)(C) 7
-because in --
in this -- these 8
few weeks I don't know whether he 9
got. (b)(7)(C) but he left.
10
ýPECIAL AGENT I And when they 11 handed you your -- or gave you the confirmation that 12 you were being suspended at the time, exactly what 13 reason did they give you?
Was it the remarks comment 14 or --
i5 Well again, I I --
I was a I(b)(7)(C) 16 liczle upset.
What I recall saying 17 was it was based on a bad midyear this year and then 18 a bad midyear going back to 2007.
I didn't know 19 anything about this alleged work rule violation until 20 one day when the following week when I was off I 21 was talking to one of the guys at work called me 22 and he said, you know, we had a meeting, you know, at 23 our --
one of our daily meetings.
This is with all (b)(7)(C) 24 the said, well, you guys 25 are going to find out anyway, so I just need to tell NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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C1 55 1
you that one of --
one of you was suspended for a week 2
for a work rule violation.
- Well, again, not to --
3 clearly this was just another example of how people 4
don't follow company policy, but you don't announce 5
disciplinary action.
6
[SPECIAL AGENTI (b(7)(c)
Yes.
(b)(7)(C) 7 You
- know, now if the 8
individual against whom disciplinary action was taken 9
wants to tell everybody, then that's that person's 10 business.
- Well, you know, in a group of 20 people, I1 you
- know, everybody's looking around like,
- well, 12 everybody's here but so I wonder --
I wonder 13 who got I wonder who got suspended for week, you 14 know?
15
[PECIAL AGENT 11)(7)(C)
Yes.
16 (b)(7)(C)
Plus my cube is empty for a 17 week.
So anyway, one of the guys called me and said, 18 hey, did you know that they told us today that you got 19 suspended for a work rule violation?
And I said, no, 20 I didn't know that.
21 So when I came back, when I had my --
my 22 my comeback meeting the following Monday, I
23 that's when I asked about it.
I said what is this I(b)(7)(C) 24 about a work rule violation?
And
- said, 25
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I!56 1 about f f
ij)(C And 1 7-just --
I I mean, (b)(7)(C) 2 I was kind of taken aback.
And then 1 cI 3
said, well, I told you that at the meeting.
- Well, 4
maybe you did, but I didn't --
I don't --
I don't 5
remember it.
I'm not disputing that he didn't tell 6
me.
I'm just saying didn't --
I didn't hear it.
7
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
8
[
j And then --
but I will tell 9
you what I
said about u
as: just 10 basically the things I told you, but then also there 11 were appearance
- issues, and this is kind of 12 interesting.
If you look at --
if you were to see 13 (b)(7)(C) he's --
he's alb)(c) than me, 14 so he's 7Z He' s maybebC)
He's I(b)(7)(C)
(
b)(7)(c) 15 16 Now you tell me why he wants to promote -- he wants to 17 have a --
a --
a much younger very attractive woman 18 fill in for him?
I mean, you know, let's get serious 19 here.
20 What I will say about she's a very 21 nice person, butl (bX7)(C) at 22 times.
And that's one of the things I told I
23 said (b)(7)(C) ou know, 24 but I didn't say anything beyond PG.
I didn't use any mb(7(C) 25 bad words.
Trust me, I --
I spent [(Cas a NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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C7 57 1
(b)(7)(C) here.
I've been involved in tons of 2
disciplinary action and investigations.
First of all, 3
I wouldn't say anything that I
would consider 4
disparaging.
Everything I said was on the mark, on 5
the money, factual.
I didn't use any bad words.
Like 6
I say, it was PG-13 or below.
7
[SPECIAL AGENT Yes.
8
(
So again, they -- all I know 9
is[
took that in
-- he's twisted whatever it 10 is he thought I said and used that as part of the 11 basis for suspension.
Never asked me, hey, you said 12 trhis?
No, I didn't say that.
Whatever or --
13 7SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
So you were 14 given absolutely no warning at all before your 15 suspension?
b)(7)(C) 16 That is correct.
17 SPECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)(C)
I There was just 18 a phone call on a Friday say come up --
19 That is correct.
20
[SPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(c)
And is there any 2'.
documentation here, a suspension letter or anything 22 that said why you were suspended and --
[(b)(7)(c) 23 C
I have a copy.
Probably one 24 of the few things I didn't make a copy of, but let me 25 just see what it says.
Give me a minute.
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7c, 58 1
My reinstatement from suspension.
The 2
suspension began as a result of a repeated occurrence 3
of unprofessional behavior and inappropriate 4
derogatory comments regarding another employee who was 5
left in charge in your supervisor's absence.
I don't 6
really know what that is.
I mean, I'm not 7
[PECIAL AGENT
)(7)(C)
May I see that?
(b)(7)(C)
Ye,
8
- Yes, I --
9 PECIAL AGENTrb7C)
Okay.
10 I
don't know if they're 11 talking about some alleged derogatory comment I made 12 when I was describing t of c[
- and it was just 13 and I in this room.
I mean, not that that 14 changes anything I said, but I don't know if they're 15 talking about something that I said when I was talking 16 to j or something else.
I don't know.
17 PECIAL AGENTI Okay.
Was there 18 a
letter suspending you?
I know you got a
19 reinstatement letter.
Was there anything suspending 20 you?
21 1
I was not given anything when 22 I was suspended.
23 PECIAL AGENT Really?
Okay.
24 That's correct.
25 PECIAL AGENT And I see --
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1 4
5 6
7 8
9
!0 J11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 59 (b)(7)(C)
You got to remember, these guys do what they want.
ISPECIAL AGEN (b)(z)(c)
Were you placed on a performance improvement plan also?
l(b)(7)(c)
I Y s Yes.
tsPECIAL AGENTIE(b)(7)(C)
Okay.
This is back in I (b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
Yes.
[SPECIAL AGENT I Okay. Are you still on that or I(b)(7)(C)
- Yes, I am.
ISPECcAL AGENT rn And. who monitors this?
(b)(7)(C)
PECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)(c)
Okay.
And I would like to make just a couple of comments about that as well.
[SPECIAL AGENT TI(b)(7)()
I Sure.
(b)(7)(C)
Because that' s another example of what's going on here, is I was supposed to have three meetings withj ate October, late November, late December.
We had our first meeting in October.
it was so unremarkable I didn't make any notes.
i got lots of notes.
But it was sort of just kind of a nice pleasant conversation.
It was sort of like my NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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opinion; and -- and his I'm sure will differ, but it 2
was like let's kind of pull back from the brink here, 3
you know?
Let's just you know, my position was, 4
okay, you guys got all the power; I understand that.
5 I'm not going to go poke you guys.
You know, I'm just 6
going to be a good little boy and just try to let 7
bygones be bygones.
8 And then the November meeting didn't 9
happen.
Okay?
m ill say that it did.
He said, 10
- well, we had this some kind of one-on-one 11 discussion, but he never said that was -- this was 12 part of this and --
and it whatever that meeting 13 was, again totally unremarkable.
14 FPECIAL AGENT T
(b)(7(c)
Yes.
(b)(7)(C) 15 In my mind had no bearing on 16 this.
17 And then the end of December; I don't 18 remember the date, but I
i I
have some 19 handwritten notes; not with me here, but I -- where we 20 had a discussion and basically it boiled down to, 21 well, we're -- I think we're going to keep you on your 22 performance plan for another three months.
No 23 justification for it.
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effect that whatever the perceived problem was is 2
fixed.
And a: no time in in that three-month 3
period did he say, hey, you know, I'm not happy with 4
what you're doing.
I don't think you got the message.
5 And your behavior or your performance or whatever is 6
there's an issue.
It was -- and that was the first 7
time I heard this, well, you --
you've gone quiet.
8 And I said yes because you misinterpret quite a bit of 9
what I say, so clearly the best thing is just to not 10 speak unless it's, you know, absolutely necessary
-I because you're going to twist whatever I say.
'2 And so --
and so that's at the very end, 13 the end of December.
And then he says, well, we're 14 going to probably continue your performance plan, 15 which they've done, and that's fine.
You know, fine 16 meaning I can't do anything about it.
They -- they're 17 holding all the cards here.
You know, it's their --
18 it's their game.
They're dealing the cards.
I'm 19 just, you know, playing whatever hand I get dealt.
20
[SPECIAL AGENTc Ob)(7)(c) okay.
(b)(7)(C) 21 You know, thinking about the 22 four other guys that finally said screw it and left, 23 you know, and that's what I'm thinking about.
I hit 24 jb) in -- this fall, you know, if I make it that long.
25 And again, the --
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somebody saying, well, why are you doing this, it's 2
because they feel perfectly comfortable lying about 3
your performance and retaliating against you and 4
there's nobody there to restrain them.
5 Let me just say something about the 6
chilled work environment letter that the company 7
received from Region !V.
I think it was from the --
8 yes, it was from the region.
And that is, the company 9
has done absolutely nothing, zero, about the chilled 10 work environment in the(b)(7)(c) 11 bZC They haven't even pretended to do anything.
12
[SPECIAL AGENT 17)(C)
Okay.
13 And once once I got that 14 midyear, I mean, I I just said there's nothing else 15 I can do but file an allegation.
Now they can fire 16 me.
I may not do anything about it.
You know, I'm 17 I've worked longer than a lot of people.
I like 18 to work.
i'm pretty good at what I do.
But, you know 19
-you
- know, I got a --
I got an ejection seat here.
20 1 can push that button any time, so I understand that.
21 But to work in an environment, a nuclear environment 22 above all else, where people are allowed to do what 23 they've done to me and to others is it's 24 frankly, it's disturbing.
25 Does life go on?
Yes.
You know, this --
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2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
1C 12 13 14 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 this isn't the only show in town; I understand that.
But nobody; not the NRC, not the company, has done diddly-squat about our chilled work environment.
We oot the letter March 2.
Guess where three of us
()7(C) were on March 2, 2010?
- Yes, 2010.
We're in (b)(7)(C)
(phonetic)
- office, I(b)(7)(C) because we hadn't heard anything about the status of our chilled work environment allegation and the 180-day mandatory response period was basically over.
[PECIAL AGENT 1(b)(7)(cYes.
j(b)(7(c) 7 So we -- three of us came down to talk to and say we haven't heard anything.
What's going on?
And he said funny you guys showed up
- today, and he gave us a copy of the letter and he showed us where we were called out in the letter.
And he said we didn't --
we didn't identify anybody by name.
We figured the company knows who's who and they can always come talk to us if they want to know any more than what we've put in the letter.
SPECIAL AGENT So we didn't hear anything from the company side.
We figured somebody would come talk to us.
And then in the end of May, at the end of May of last year we had a group meeting of (b)(7)(C) 7 with the thenI(b)(7)(C)
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64 1
a(b)(7)(C) aguy named b)(7)(C)
(phonetic), an'(bZ)(7)()1 Jr h(7)(c
's(b)(7)(C) 2 j(phonezic),
who's the 1 3
And it was just sort of a polite meet and greet, how 4
you doing?
We did it right down here, in the AVS 5
multipurpose room.
6 And somewhere toward the end of the 7
meeting I said, you know, we are the subject of --
we 8
are one of the subjects called out in the chilled work 9
environment letter, sort of like you guys aren't going 10 to do anything or you want to know anything about it?
11 And the only thing that either of those two guys said
- ()7(C) 12 was said; and I am --
I didn't say 13 anything; which you can imagine what I thought, is he 14 said, you know -- this is like early March.
This is 15 almost three months after the letter arrived.
He 16 said, you know, we're still
-- we're trying to figure 17 out who's really called out in that letter.
I'm --
18 and, you know, what do you say to some stupid comment 19 like that?
20 We've identified ourselves.
The NRC has 21 identified ourselves.
Today I'm talking to you as a 22 member of this group.
How can you tell me you don't 23 know who is involved?
You certainly do now.
24
- PECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(c)
How many of the 25 six people that testified for this chill environment NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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inquiry are still in your group?
2
[j(b)(7)(C)
Several.
(b)(7)(C) 3 (phonetic).
I think I've got him on there.
4
[SPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(c)
Right.
(b)(7)(C) 5 6
[PECIAL AGENT O(b)(7)(c) okay.
7 Let's see.
That would be 8
myself.
Let's see, testified.
(b)(7)(C) 9 hbut he's dying to talk to 10 you.
And[J I estified.
11
[SPECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(C)
I've got him 12 already.
I(b)(7)(C) 13 Got him?
And I don't know, I
14 don't recall who else.
Oh,I(b)(7)(c) who 15 I believe is on there.
16
[SPECIAL AGENT 11b)(7)(C)
Yes.
17
)Okay So actually most of us 18 are a phone call away.
(~b)(7)(C) 19 PECIAL AGENT N
I Okay.
I(b)(7)(C) 20 Now the other thing, as I 21
- said, neither the company nor the NRC has done 22 anything is
-- let me clarify the NRC part of that, is 23 when gave us the letter on March 2, I don't know 24 if it was then or subsequently, we went to talk to him 25 and he said, you know, the NRC is going to do a follow NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-7c, 66 up and take a look at the corrective actions that the 2
company commits to as a result of receiving this 3
letter.
4 VPECIAL AGENT11(7)(c C Yes.
5 (And he said it's going to be 6
during the second quarter of 2010.
And I said we 7
would like to talk to whoever the inspector is who 8
comes to perform that.
And anyway, to make a long 9
story short, we were never called.
And then somewhere 10 along the line after that I --
I don't remember if I
11 talked to or I
was talking toIC) 12 (phonetic) and I said where -- where's the team that's 13 supposed to follow up on this?
And he said and 14 then it
- was, oh, they've come and gone.
Okay.
15 And then I --
I --
I had spoken to --
and F(b-)(7) (rC)-
16 I'm pretty sure I
was I had spoken with 17 Eb bout --
yes, FZ' was the guy I spoke with 18 and
- said, hey, we I'd like to talk to the 19 inspector.
So that didn't happen.
And then I was 20 talking to[ Iin about September of last 21 year, thereabouts, and I said, you know we missed the 22 teams when they were here before and we heard they 23 were coming back again.
And I said we'd -- I'd like 24 to talk to the team when they come back again.
And 25 that didn't happen either.
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- PECIAL AGENTE()(7)(c)
Did they come 2
back again?
(b)(7)(C) 3 I think they did.
4 EPECIAL AGENTE (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 5 I think somebody came back.
6 i think there was some follow up to the original 7
follow-up inspection.
But all I can tell you is, you 8
- know, again one of the reasons some of these 9
allegations keep coming up is that this whole chilled 10 work environment thing, as far as we're concerned in 11 our group, has been a bust.
And what we don't like 12 about it is that we kind of laid ourselves out on the 13 line testifying.
14 SPECIAL AGENT Yes.
15 And there's too much 16 information --
I mean, clearly to get our name in the 17 March 2 letter the company knows that we testified.
18 they know who testified.
They may not know every 19 single person, but they know some of us.
They know 20 for sure that I did and a couple other of the guys 21 did.
They -- they have no doubt about that.
So they 22 know that.
23
[SPECIAL AGENT1E(b)(7)(C)
Okay.
24 1
And then I
previously 25 mentioned this unprofessional report tha c
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1-c, 68 did; and you'll have --
you can take a look at that, 2
but that you know, it's more of the same.
You 3
know, [L)(7)(C) nd(b)(7)(C) nandb7 are 4
troublemakers.
- Well, it doesn't say why we're 5
troublemakers, but the reason why that -- some of the 6
people over there think we're troublemakers is because 7
we raise issues when they come up.
8 We also tried for a couple of years to 9
join a union, which is a perfectly legal activity.
10
[PECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Yes.
11 But in their mind, their 12 meaning the people that called us troublemakers, 13 that's like horrible, you know?
So, you know, we have 14 and once --
and when you talk t for 15
- example, one of the things he'll tell you aboutl 16 is in a
meeting he was in is that 17 basically said, hey, anybody who disagrees with me, 18 that's disrespectful and that's disobedience.
That's 19 basically what he said.
So that's the kind of 20 personality you're dealing with her.
And i(b)(7)(c) 21 the same thing.
22
[SPECIAL AGENTI)(
Were there other 23 people for your group suspended for reasons that they 24 weren't really aware of?
I(b)(7)(C) 25 No.
No, the -- the -- the --
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the MO on these guys is they pick on one person at a 2
time.
In two-thousand --
in 2008 it was basically*
3 And then in 2009 they started on me, and 4
that's where we are today.
5
[SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
I Okay.
And 6
obviously you feel this suspension, at least in part, 7
was because of the allegation that you raised or the 8
concerns that you raised?
I(b)(7)(C) 9
- Yes, I believe the catalyst 10 was this unqualified supervisor issue, because that 11 brought this notification.
12
[SPECIAL AGENTI (b)(T)(
Yes.
13 I
- mean, a lot of people on 14 site read it.
This goes out everywhere and a lot of 15 people -- you can go online every day and you can get 16 a report and --
and view all the notifications that 17 were written in the previous 24 hours2.777778e-4 days <br />0.00667 hours <br />3.968254e-5 weeks <br />9.132e-6 months <br />.
This got a lot 18 of attention.
So, it let's just say everything I 19 said in here was wrong, just for the sake of argument; 20 which it isn't of course, but let's just say it was 21 wrong.
The fact that I wrote it and was seen by so 22 many people, that --
that's retaliation city in in (b)b)(7)(c
- 23) E andl rd 24 And then nowE7)(C) ies into this is 25 that in our meeting, in our two meetings I I
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IC-1 70 I(b)(7)(C) 2 have hired{
(i n this position?
He is a guy who 3
is universally despised across the site.
His 4
reputation is totally everywhere across the site.
To 5
retaliation, anybody says anything that he doesn't 6
like, he gets even with them.
So
({b)(7){c) 7 SPECIAL AGENT What was his 8
response?
I(b)(7)(C) 9 His response was,
- well, I
10 thought he was the best guy for the job.
Clearly, he 11 had no knowledge of Ib)(7)(C) had done no due 12 diligence, which in this case would have been he could 13 have asked anybody on site, who would have told him.c 14 LSPECIAL AGENTl(b)(7)(C)
Yes.
15 So how fits into 16 the retaliation mode is i have told that he 17 made a very bad decision, and is again the 18 kind of guy that I don't 19 think I put their names on a list, but I talked to a 20 couple people in operations, because I didn't know 21 real well.
He's always been in my mind kind of 22 a 1(b)(7)(C)
He kind of --
he kind of - -
23 1 won't say any more than that.
But and the two 24 operators I talked to both said the same thing:
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71 I
whatever it takes such that he looks good and if any 2
situation he'll make sure the blame goes elsewhere.
3 So his motivation in this whole thing is, well 4
has told me that I made a horrible mistake.
- Well, I
5 better -- I better put the onus back o and make 6
Ic) look like the bad guy.
7 PECIAL AGENT Z(b)(7)(C)
And what time 8
frame, if you recall, did you make that comment about, 9
you know, your supervisor Two -- you said two 10 more.
2
- bYes, that was more aboutm I
12 bu t I --
I -
13 PECIAL AGENTZ7 I'm sorry;)(
14Ib()c (b)(7)(C)
I(b)(7)(c) 15 E
But I made it to E
in 16 about the middle of August or 2010.
I've got a memo.
17 I wrote up a memo of -- of one of our meetings.
So 18 what you have, the -- the nexus here is you got this 19 very embarrassing, although very dead on notification 20 challenging why they would put a -- a non-qualified in 21 charge of a group, in operations of all groups, for 22 crying out loud.
That's in early July.
And then I --
23 1 got you know, confron tiing in mid-4(b)(7)(C)I 24 August.
I got th l
report about the same 25 time.
And then the end of August I get the bad NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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performance appraisal.
And theni (b)(7)(c) tells me 2
-- well, I've got documentation where he offered me a 3
job, which I accepted to get out of the group.
And 4
then two weeks later now I'm suspended based in part 5
on alleged comments that I made about this unqualified 6
person, never revealed to me, never any inkling that 7
anything was ever suspected of something that I said 8
or that I was being considered for any disciplinary 9
action.
And then the reasoning behind the 10 disciplinary action; it's just a hodgepodge of junk.
11 SPECIAL AGENT lbl(7Z(0)
Yes.
12 It's like, well, yes, you got 13 this bad performance appraisal from a rijr our 14 years ago, so we're going to roll that on there.
And 15 then we suspended you and if there's any 16 investigation, we're not going to share it with you.
17 i don't even know what they did, but no one ever 18 talked to me, which in my mind is just -- that to me 19 is evidence of retaliation.
This whole thing is 20 cooked up and bogus.
21
ýPECIAL AGENTT(b)(7)(C)
I Okay.
22 (b(7)(c)
Now again, I --
I think it's 23 quite clear that at times I have a fairly strong 24 personality, but I've never said or done anything that 25 warrants anything even in the same solar system as NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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73 this performance appraisal I got.
The disciplinary 2
- action, that is pure retaliation.
You cant' find 3
anything in my past, in my background that anybody can 4
point to that would justify that.
And again, why am 5
I fighting this or why am I going?
Well, once people 6
car. say anything they want about you, then you're 7
dead.
Because they've suspended me now.
Again, that 8
wasn't the reason I submitted the allegation.
I 9
submitted the allegation based on the performance 10 appraisal.
11
[SPECIAL AGENT 1(11(7)(C) 7 yes.
12 (bIC)
Once they can say anything
'3 they want about you; which and that wasn't the 14 first
- time, but once they can do that, they can do 15 anything.
They can fire you at will.
16 Now again, I'm a management employee and 17 a --
and a not right to work state.
I mean, they can 18 fire me any tame they want, but I mean, with any 19 reasonable justification.
And that's just so 20 again, the picture that I -- I want to leave everybody 21 with is that this is the behavior that they -- they've 22 exhibited for years.
What they did to me last summer 23 was nc different than what they've done in the past.
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these people retaliate, and that's what I'm trying to 2
do.
3
[SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c)
Yes.
4 5
When I -- when I leave San Onofre, my goal 6
is to leave when I want to leave and not be run out of 7
here on a rail by people -- frankly, I will say this 6
without any reservation is when I was the I(b)(7)(C) 9 i(b)(7)(c)
]I ddn't very many people.
I think I 10 I
think four people, five at the most, and --
11 and, you know, I had a (b)(7)C) with a 12 lot of throughout and I was the I(b)(7)(C) 13 The people that Ib)(
and they deserved to 14 beI were better than the guys I'm talking about 15
- here, and I'm not exaggerating.
These guys are 16
[(b)(7)(C) 17 And what I can tell you is putting down 18 what they put on my performance appraisal and 19
- again, the only thing I really want to talk about, 20 because I think it's it's a great example, is they 21 made up this figure that I only did whatever it
- was, 22 (b)(7)(C) in the first six months of the 23 year.
24 I.PECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Yes.
25 (b)(7)(C)
That in my mind is it's a
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-7c'.
75 1
material false statement.
They knew it was false when 2
they put it in there.
When I challenged them, the 3
only thing would say is I ran a report and 4
he refused to go look at data that would correct the 5
record.
6 SPECIAL AGENT 1 Do you have 7
documentation in here showing how much you worked 8
during that time frame?
(b)(7)(C) 9 1I I have some handwritten 10 notes.
I --
I I've got a copy in here somewhere 11 for you.
So the issue is here's a copy of my 12 performance --
probably put it on the stack --
[3 SPECIAL AGENT 1 Okay.
14 IIZG--
of stuff and then I'll need 15 to explain what you've got in here.
These are copies 16 of the monthly logs that I keep.
Log is kind of 17 stretching it a little bit, but when I complete a --
18 an activity, I
I log it in and I date it.
And 19 and you'll see that the numbers vary from month to 20 month.
It depends on - -
you know, some I(b)(7)(C) 21 take a long time to work on.
22 SPECIAL AGENT Yes.
23 Sometimes you're -- you're 24 kind of working from scratch on something.
I mean, I(b)(7)(C) 25 the
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revision.
Ocher times you're just changing a few 2
words.
This was this is a recap.
And without 3
going into detail now; and we can certainly about it 4
later, but these are theI (b)(7)(C) that I did 5
during the first six months of the year.
Now 6
recognize.he month of January was pretty much wiped 7
out.
I came back from the outage like around the 10th 8
of January.
I spent the first week or two going back 9
through my huge backlog of work, because guess what, 10 I was gone for six months and nobody did my work while 11 I was gone.
12 SPECIAL AGENT
[ Yes.
13 Plus they were assigning me 14 new work while I was gone.
So I sorted that out.
I 15 closed out a bunch of (b)(7)(C)
I And then 16 when you do a I c(b)(7)() lit let's say you work on 17 it for two or three days.
Then you put it out for 18 review.
Then you incorporate comments.
And then you 19 you know, it it there's usually a gestation 20 period of anywhere from (b)(7)(C) 21 7
So clearly, I'm not going to be 22 generating any newI(b)(7)(c) changes until February, 23 and I think that's pretty much what the record shows.
24 ISPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Yes.
25 (b)(7)(C)
But anyway, I didI(b)(7) l NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE.. N.W.
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77 S 7cO by the end of June, and I think my midyear 4
says j Now, that's that's you're off by --
3 that figures off by 50 percent, you know?
I didL"j (b)(7)(C) than they gave me credit for.
And 5
they could have verified these numbers.
You can go 6
online on the database and you can see that every one 7
of these worked on I did.
8 And again, I also mention that I was --
9 even in the first half of 2010 I was working outside i0 the group for a month.
11
[SPECIAL AGENT Yes.
12 At least a month, because I 13 was on a (b)(7)(C) for three weeks.
And I 14 enclosed a --
in the package I'm going to give you a 15 comment from the --
the team mentor, the expert in 16 1b Xc) who said I did a good job, you know?
So I 17 mean, that -- I just. included that to demonstrate that 18 I was gone for some period of time, three weeks.
And
-9 Then I didn't come back from the outage until like the (b)(7)(C) 20 So that first week was gone.
21 And then the other thing that he didn't 22 give me credit for is we had a new (b)(7)(C) 1n 23 our group and I volunteered to mentor him.
That guy 24 didn't you
- know, he didn't know how we did 25 business.
So I spent --
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78 1
an hour here, an hour there over several months.
So 2
that -- you know, I think I estimated maybe 20 percent 3
of my time for a couple of months I was helping him.
4 I didn't get any credit for that, you know?
5 So that's why I say the best example of 6
retaliation in that midyear report was the fact they 7
only gave me credit for doing (b)(7XC) 8 r~)7(C 1
(b(C()
[SPECIAL AGENT 1(b7)(C)
Yes.
10 1)(7)(C)
When I did (b)(7)(C) 11 Again, the other thing to keep in mind is I worked 12 almost -- probably three Saturdays out of four during 13 2010 I
worked.
- Now, what do you say about a
14 supervisor who you know, if I
if I was a
-5 supervisor of someone who was working every Saturday, 16 almost every Saturday and his output was low, at -- at 17 some point I'd say what in the hell is guy doing?
18 There was never --
like I say, there was never any 19 conversation.
There was never any, hey, you're 20 putting out two or three, four (b)7)(C) a 21 month, but somebody else is doing twice that, or, you 22 know --
they didn't say that, because they can't say 23 that because I was doing as much or more work than 24 anybody else in the group except for guess who? E7)c 5
(b)(7)(C)
I 25 W1 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE tSLAND AVE., NW.
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'-4 79 1
But the difference between my work is that 2
I sit down and I actually do theser)(7)(C)
I have 3 (7)(C)
I take very little the 4
people that give me change information, I get very 5
little information and I turn that into a finished 6
product.
7
[SPECIAL AGENTE(7)(C)
Yes.
8 All she can do is someone 9
gives her a piece of paper with words crossed out and 10 new words written in.
That's all she does.
That's 11 all she knows how to do.
And she was doing 12 predominantly what we call editorial corrections.
13 simple easy.
Ten minutes, you're in and out.
It's 14 done.
So she has high numbers.
15
[SPECIAL AGENT 1Zb)(7)(C)
Yes.
16 r')(7)(C)
But she's --
it's apples and (b)(7)(C) 17 oranges.
And in
- fact, nickname --
her 18 first name is[
jyou know, lik without the I(b)I 19 7
One of the other guys who's now gone, he used to 20 call her --
her nickname was because she has (b)(7)(C) 21 no So all she can do is 22 you
- know, she she can take a (b)(7)(C)t 23 somebody's kind of marked up and she can --
she can 24 process it.
But that's all she can do.
She doesn't 25 know if the information she's being given is right, if NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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80 it affects other b)(7)(C) besides the one she's got 2
or anything.
So, I'll throw that on there.
3 ISPECIAL AGENT I
And these are 4
mind also, or can i have that?
I(b)(7)(C) 5
-1'ii have to make --
let me 6
make you a copy of this, because I'm not 100 percent 7
certain I have a copy myself.
8 SPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C)
Okay,.
9 7
So if you don't mind, let me 10 you guys have a machine out here we can --
1I
[SPECIAL AGENT Yes.
12 just make you a copy, 13
[SPECIAL AGENT Right.
(b)(7)(C) 14
(
Can we --
why don't we take a 15 break?
16 EPECIAL AGENT Z(b)(7)(C)
Okay.
i(b)(7)(C) 17 I'd like to use the restroom.
18 And I --
let me know how much more you want to go, but 19 I
I do want to take about --
just when we resume, 20 I want to take about 15 or 20 minutes and kind of try 21 to tie up this rambling.
22 SPECIAL AGENT (
Okay.
I just 23 have one more thing before we take a break.
According 24 to the information I received through the (inaudible) 25 package, was there a job you thought you applied for?
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Oh, if one of the things I 2
i wanted to point out; if we're talking about the 3
same thing, was I'm getting -- this first half of 2010 4
my supervisor's telling me I'm, you know, one level 5
above pond scum.
But during that period another 6
suoervisor; actually it was a manager, from another 7
group came in and offered me a job.
S
- Well, how does that happen?
I mean, if 9
I'm that bad; eight needs improvements, I mean, that's 10 like you might as well no: even show up for work if 11 you're going to get that kind of evaluation.
But yet 12 someone else comes and offers me a job, which I --
I 13 mean, I --
I didn't claim I was the smartest guy that 14 ever walked down the street.
I am a I)(7(c) 15 I'm --
you know, I'm not but no shit, the guy 16 offered a job.
17 ISPECIALU AGENT EIG()(C)Okay.
- Well, 18 let's go ahead and take a break and then we'll discuss 19 that a little when we come back.
20 The time is approximately 3:29 p.m.
21 (Whereupon, at 3:35 p.m. off the record 22 until 10:10 a.m.)
23 IPECIAL AGENT TIIb)(7)(c)
Back on the 24 record withIl(b7)(C)
It's approximately 3:35 p.m.
25 Okay.
before we went off the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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82 1
record I
asked you about a certain job that you 2
applied for and the claim is that it went to a less-3 qualified person.
Was that an accurate statement or 4
is that inaccurate?
5 (b)(7)(C)
Oh, yes.
You know, I I
6 I lust don't remember what that was about 7
[SPECIAL AGENTE1(7)(C)
Okay.
1(b)(7)(C) 8 frankly.
I'm --
9
[ISPECIAL AGENT)(
Okay.
10 When you had mentioned earlier 11 about a job, i thought you were talking about this 12 manager that in --
in the spring of 2010 offered me a 13 job, I mean, at SONGS.
14 CPECIAL AGENT 1b)(7)(C)
Okay.
So --
16 ESPECIAL AGENTb)Z(
So you would not 17 be with or don't recall what --
18 No, I
I think what you're 19 talking about is is sort of kind of another way of 20 talking about this issue with the unqualified person.
21
[SPECIAL AGENTZ1b)7)C Okay.
So it 22 wasn't a separate issue?
it was the same issue?
23 (b)(7)(C)
That's correct.
24 SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 25 Let's --
let's call that the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE.. N.W.
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same issue.
2
[SPECIAL AGENTZc Okay.
Now this 3
job that you were offered by a manager, did you --
4 what reason would -- you didn't take it obviously, so 5
was there --
6 1There is a reason.
I'll 7
and I'm happy to explain it.
I~b)())())C) 8
[SPECIAL AGEN TII Okay.
9
[
j--
! had mentioned that 10 because of the chilled work environment that we've 11 experienced for a number of years working for 1 12 we've made several attempts to unionize and -- quick 13 and dirty.
We had a vote in early 2009, and that was 14 when this was when it was just theI)(7)(C) 15 b(b)()(C) because we were still part of (b)(7)(C) 16 and the vote didn't pass.
It was 4 to 4.
So tie 17 vote, it it
-- you don't get to join.
You can vote 18 again after a year, you
- know, if you think the 19 conditions have changed.
And we of course knew that 20 they had changed and so we were trying to shoot for 21 like a June 2010 union vote.
22 So in I don't. remember exactly when, 23 but in like March or April this manager out of the 24 blue walked into my cube one day and said, hey, I need 25 some help.
I'd like you to come work for me.
And I NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-7c, 84 1
guess I've worked here so long that I've --
I've 2
gotten so jaded and suspicious of anything managers do 3
- anymore, I
I --
I wasn't sure if he was serious, 4
No.
- 1. And or how sincere he really was.
I --
I 5
was thinking that this was somehow some ploy to get me 6
out of the group because it's one less person to vote 7
for the union.
So that's why I didn't accept it.
8 ESPECIAL AGENT~c I()7C Okay.
9 (b)(7)(C)
And yes, it was a very stupid 10 decision on my part.
1 ESPECIAL AGENT 1(b)(7)(¢)
Okay.
I(b)(7)(C)
And I regret having made that 13 decision.
14 ESPECIAL AGENT((
And just out of 15 curiosity what job offer was it?
What department was 16 it in?
17 It was back in I 18 It was like being like a 19 (b)(7)(¢)
with the --
the group of people that 20
{(b7)C) 21 IPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(c, Okay.
Ib)(7)(C)I 22 And before we joined 23 (b)(7)(C)
-used to 24 be part of that group.
25
[SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c)
Okay.
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85 1
And they were just right 2
upstairs.
1(b)(7)(C)
()7 3S
[PECIAL AGENT II All r 4
And you said that you wanted to get a chance 5
to tie some of that in and explain to me about some of 6
the stuff that you want me to take, or some of these 7
documents you want to provide.
8 (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
I --
I guess, unless 9
you have anymore, you know, specific questions, what 10 I'd like to do is I want to relate one more situation 11 that -- that I think bears on this whole retaliation 12
- claim, and then I'd like to kind of summarize my 13 perspective of this issue.
14 SPECIAL AGENT Sure.
(b)(7)(C) 15 And then I'd like to --
I'll 16 go through the material that I --
you know, briefly.
17 I'm not going to go page by page, but I'll tell you 18 what I'm giving you.
19
[SPECIAL AGENT TI(b)(7)()I Okay.
20 Which I hope supports what I'm 21 saying.
22 EPECIAL AGEN TIIb(7(C Okay.
23 Earlier I said the -- the ways 24 these guys operate is they --
they pick on one person 25 at a time.
And they started picking on me in 2009.
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Before that they picked on a guy namedi(b)(7)(C) 2 They gave him an unwarranted performance appraisal.
3 He was told all year long during 2008 that his 4
performance was just fine; you
- know, meets 5
expectations.
And then on the last day of the 6
performance plan year --
I I don't remember what 7
that was.
That would have been like January I
8 don't know the exact date, but like the 15th of 9
January, 2009.
Then he was informed that he was going 10 to get a
needs improvement on his performance 11 appraisal.
12 And our process was slightly different; 13 not greatly different, but different enough where if 14 you got a needs improvement, you didn't -- you weren't 15 going to qualify for your --
your bonus.
We get a 16 bonus every year.
It's it used to be just what 17 I'll call a site-wide bonus.
It wasn't based on 18 individual performance.
It was based on how the site 19 did financially.
And then they came up with some pot 20 of money and they divided that pot of money by the 21 number of employees, and that's what you got.
22 SPECIAL AGENT TIbI)(C)
Okay.
23 Different levels get a --
a 24 different percentage, but that's basically how it 25 worked.
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%*w*2
-7 C B7 (b)(7)(C) 1 So
- anyway, I
- again, no 2
counseling, no nothing.
And basically he got that 3
needs improvement based on a --
a recommendation he 4
made tcl Con a procedure where -- where)was 5
a subject matter expert.
ywanted it done a certain 6
way anF77said, look, you ought to do it this way.
7 Let me do it this way.
Anyway, to make a long story 8
shortJF-ung in there for another --
he tried to 9
fight it and he talked to the division manager, the 10 division director.
You know, he ran it up and down 11 the flag pole.
12 I
got involved in this from day one 13 because the day he found out he got a
needs 14 improvement he called me at home, because and I 15 used to work --
we we were together for about a 16 y a ve n b,(7)(C) 1 w s thel (b)(7)(C)
He 16 year over in ll i was th m
He Ii I7 w s he (b)(7)(c)
(b)(7 cawas the came over in a -- kind of a
19 (b)(7)(C)
We go back further than that.
We both 20 have some (b)(7)(C) 21 7
So we've 22 known each other a long time.
We're not like great.
23 friends.
We don't socialize, but we -- certainly at 24 work and some other things, you know, we've -- we've 25 known each other.
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88 1
And he called me whenever that day was, 2
January 15 of 2009, because he --
he just wanted to 3
talk to somebody that knows the Edison HR policies and 4
practices and just management in general.
And -- and 5
I told him this was, you know, totally wrong, totally 6
against company policy what had happened to him.
7 There's no documentation, no justification, no written 8
evidence, no verbal, nothing.
9 And anyway, he went -- couple of months he 10 tried to fight it and eventually, you
- know, the 11 company refused to do anything.
And so, at some point 12 he said I've had it, you know, I'm not taking this 13 anymore.
I mean, he -- he was one of the people that 14 testified for the chilled work environment in August (b)(7)(C) 15 of '09.
1He finally like I 16 say, he -- I)(7)(C) 17 (b)(7)(c) s Yb)(7)(c)
You know, he didn't --
he didn't 19 you can't say that he was forced out or, you know, was 20 beaten up or anything.
He just --
he just said I've 21 had it with this place and I'm out of here.
I'm not 22 going to be treated like that.
I'm not going to be 23 retaliated against in that fashion.
24 In California, I guess there are some 25 provisions that if you are in a
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--7C, 2
3 4
5 6
7 8
9 10 11
-2 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 89 environment, if you're told to do things illegally, which in our world is you're told to do things against procedure, there's a
provision in the the California I guess Unemployment
- Code, or whatever, that you can claim unemployment.
And soI1c) did.
So (b)(7)(C)
[PECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)(C)
Yes.
(b)'(7)(C)
And I'm I'm going to try to get through this.
I I'm --
I know I take a long time to spit this stuff out.
So he (b)(7)(C)
He started (b)(7)(C)
I And then he got a letter, because the company --
the company pays I think the first six months of an employee's unemployment and then it rolls over to some state fund.
And he got a letter from the employment whatever saying your unemployment status is being challenged by Southern California Edison because I
)(C You know, you didn't --
you weren't forced out; you, you know, yada, yada.
So --
so he had a hearing.
He had to go to an the foreign administrative law judge that hears these kinds of cases.
And I went with him.
I was a witness.
Andl.'
was the witness for the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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'7c 90 1
company.
And I'm thinking, oh, great, you know, this 2
is going to make my life even better, more better than 3
it is already.
4 And I guess the the point I want to I1(b)(7)(C)
I 5
make is, No.
the judge found in
[J
- favor, 6
basically the chilled work environment, the being told 7
not to follow your procedures.
But before the judge 8
came to that conclusion, was allowed a -- a little 9
while to testify, you know, like 10 minutes.
And he 10 explained why he left and the working conditions under i1 which, you know, he labored.
12 And then talked and I'm just going 13 to say he lied like a rug.
He fabricated information.
14 He -- these are my notes.
I'm not going to give you 15 a copy unless you guys think it's but but 16 basically he said that, you know, the group was bigger 17 than it was, that everybody was happy, that you know, 18 was a happy worker and that he just of his 19 own accord and just merrily went on his way and, you 20 know?
21 And then the administrative law judge 22 asked me, because I
I was kind of, you
- know, 23 champing at the bit a little bit, because it's hard --
24 it's hard to present all the material you'd like to 25 present and present it in a coherent fashion.
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you've suffered here for the last couple hours, you 2
know -- you know?
And basically the only --
the --
at 3
that point, you know, you could tell the judge was 4
done, you know?
She's --
i don't know how many cases 5
she has to hear every day, but you know, she's got 6
like, you know, like 30 minutes a case or something.
7
[SPECIAL AGENTI7)
Right.
I~
)7(C) 8 17 7)You could tell she wanted to 9
wind this thing up.
And -- and the only thing --
and 10 she gave me a like a minute to talk and and I 11 said to myself,
- well, the only thing I can say; and 12 this was what I said, is I said I disagree with 13 absolutely everything the company has said here today 14 and that everything the company has said has been a 15 fabrication.
And was the only witness for the 16 company.
That's who you're dealing with.
And we were 17 all under oath.
18 We went to a hearing with the National 19 Labor Relations Board in Los Angeles in April ofi 20 April of 2009.
And we had a dispute, difference of 21 opinion on --
no, it was April two-thousand -- losing 22 my mind.
Well, the pertinent facts are that we went 23 to the National Labor --
a hearing in Los Angeles with 24 a National Labor Relations Board hearing officer.
And 25 it had to so with --
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thing.
And there was a disagreement between the 2
company and us as to who ought to be able to vote.
3 And guess who the two people who testified were?
4
- Well, testified for the company and I
5 testified for the --
the union thing.
And I --
I'm --
6 I -- I don't know if I included a copy, but I do have 7
a record.
7 made a --
I made a memorandum after the 8
meeting of everything that said under oath at 9
that hearing as well that was false.
So, that's who 10 you're dealing with here.
11
- PECIAL AGENT T
I Okay.
12 (7)(C)
You know, that's it's 23 anyway, mind boggling.
14 Okay.
Let me --
let's see if we can bring 15 this to closure for anybody that's able to suffer 16 through everything I've said so far, like why doesn't 17 that guy shut up?
18 My charge of allegation against the 19 company is
-- it's retaliation, period.
Nothing more; 20 nothing less.
21 SPECIAL AGENT I
Yes.
'(b)(7)(C) 22
[
I've received a
failing 23 performance appraisal that is not based on fact.
It's 24 flat out a lie.
Again, the best example I can give is 25 my work output.
This isn't you know, this is not NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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93 1
a matter of interpretation or having a different 2
perspective.
Like I said earlier, this isn't like 3
cup's half full, cup's half empty.
They are lying 4
about my performance.
They're lying.
They know it's 5
a lie. Again, it's not a half-full-half-empty-kind of 6
thing.
It's a flat out lie.
It's it's it's 7
the retaliation is for my performance appraisal and 8
then subsequently the suspension.
It's in retaliation 9
for my raising performance issues.
You know, you guys 20 may call them something different; a
protected 11 activity, safety issues, but it's something that's 12 wrong and it needs to be fixed, you know?
13 And I raise these issues --
I don't raise 14 them like a wild man or jump up and down or, you know, 15 use colorful language like I did a couple times here 16 today.
It's like, hey, Code of Federal Regulations 17 says this.
We're --
you know, it says X and we're 18 doing Y.
Well, the company policy for operations is 19 that we set the standard.
We're the role model for 20 the site and yet you're trying to temporarily promote 21 a totally unqualified person to be a supervisor in the 22 1(b)(7)(C)
Ithe f rigging (b)(7)(C) 1 23 You know, those are the kind of things that I raise.
24
- Yes, I've learned my lesson.
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7r 94 1
anymore.
I told)(7)(C) ithe last time I talked 2
to him, I said, I'm never writing another notification here again that I'd absolutely don't have to write.
4 Because as aI (b7)(C)
(b)(7)(C) 6 J
That's just purely administrative.
You 7
know, I'm not on some, you know, Don Quixote jousting 8
at windmills thing.
At this point I'm just concerned 9
about the retaliatory nature of my chain of command.
10 Okay?
That's all that this is.
11 Again, the key points about my allegation 12 are these:
I received an unwarranted midyear 13 performance appraisal in August 2010.
The unwarranted 14 appraisal was then coupled with a
fabricated 15 allegation to suspend me for a week without pay in 16 September 2010.
They never advised me I was being 17 considered for disciplinary action.
I was never 18 interviewed.
You know, they went back four years to 19 find a midyear performance appraisal to justify part 20 of the suspension that was written by anIb)(7)(c) 21 that's been protected by and is still 22 protected today by And I can give you a very 23 good witness on that if if that comes up.
I will 24 hold off on that for now.
25 Again, the reasons for these retaliatory NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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v
95 acts were issues that I raised concerning poor program 2
and management performance.
These actions on my part to raise these issues were appropriate and reasonably 4
expected of nuclear workers, and I'm handing you the 5
copy of this.
Because management was unable or 6
unwilling to address these issues, they retaliated and 7
discriminated against me by the unwarranted 8
performance appraisal and disciplinary action.
This 9
was by and large an effort by management to shift 10 focus and blame away from them and onto me.
The 11 actions taken against me by the company are consistent 12 with its past behavior of trying to silence workers 13 who raise issues.
In particular, the performance
- 4 appraisal process is used an -- as an unofficial tool 15 to silence workers because it is difficult if not 16 impossible to rebut and SCE maintains little or no 17 oversight of the process to ensure appraisals are 18 valid.
19 I want to --
I --
I want to take about 10 20 minutes and just hit a couple of key points here.
It 21 was the company, not me that raised this midyear 2007 22 issue and they raised it when they suspended me in 23 September of 2010.
Some of the points in that 24 document; and I'll give you a copy, is he models --
25 and --
and my --
my then-supervisor is talking about NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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96 1
me.
He models negative behavior by disrupting 2
meetings.
What this really means is that when 3
information or guidance is given in meetings that is 4
counter to SCE policy, I speak up.
And I do.
The 5
meeting in question involved several supervisors who 6
were discussing promotion actions that were counter to 7
SCE policy.. That's how they maintain the good old boy 8
network here, by the way.
One supervisor basically 9
stated that he would handpick his successor and make 10 sure that the successor was primed to take over once 11 he the supervisor had retired.
I vigorously 12 objected.
I didn't use any bad words.
I just said, 13 you know, Ehis is not right.
7t is not in accordance 14 with Edison personnel policy.
15 The SONGS (b)(7)(c) because we 16 were in thel (b)(7)(C) at the time, has a 17 long track record of using the good old boys network i8 to promote people.
So what my then-superviso c
I 19 and 2re doing in the performance appraisal; this 20 is the midyear 2007, is getting even for my speaking 21 up.
And one of the women whose names you checked was 22 the negative recipient of this policy, meaning that, 23 you know, she was going to not get a job because they 24 wanted to handpick somebody else.
25
[SPECIAL AGENT (7)(C
)
And who was NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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97 1
that?
Which one was that?
(b)(7)(C) 3 PPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C) okay.
4 I(b)(7)(c)
Other comments in the --
the 5
midyear 2007 performance appraisal talk about not 6
getting along with peers and bosses.
The only people 7
1 have problems with are those who do not do their 8
jobs.
For example, I (b)(7)(C) was absent much of 9
the time during 2007.
He came to work late often and 10 fundamentally was of no value as a supervisor.
The 11 joke in the group was that during his numerous 12 absences people would ask where he was.
The answer (b)(7)(C) 13
- was, hey, I don't have the ll watch.
And again, 14 there's that behavior continues today.
15 I
I I'm going to --
I want to say 16 one other thing about that midyear, although I I --
17 I -- there is rebuttal enclosed with that chat --
that 18 talks about most of that stuff.
19 That midyear 2007 performance appraisal 20 states that I used --
that I refused to plan work 21 orders.
That's not correct.
Basically what happened 22 is that when my supervisor asked me to be a planner, 23 a work order planner, I said that I needed training.
24 This is quality affecting work.
I had not been 25 trained as a -- a planner.
So all I said is you owe NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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me some training and he never --
he just turned around 2
and walked away.
And then he made somebody else do it 3
who was --
is unequally untrained as I was.
And the 4
reason tha7 guy did it is because he was new the group 5
and felt that he couldn't insist that he receive 6
training.
Now, that guy is not part of this whole 7
chilled work environment thing, but he retired in a
disgust about eight or ten months ago.
- Again, same 9
stuff.
10
[SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7c)(C Okay.
11
)(C)
So my summary is that the 12 midyear 2000 performance appraisal is a material false 2.3 statement and it was generated to get even, period.
14 Let me just say a
few make a
few (b)(7)(C)
I i5 comments abouI He began his -- he 16 he didn't join our group until late7c) 17
()(7)( ()b)(7)(C)
A began his tenure in 12 his group on very shaky ground.
He has a
bad 19 reputation across the site.
Last week I ran into a 20 manager whom I've known for overl(b)(7)(C)
-ho used to kwithl(b)(7)(c) 7 and this manager --
I used to be 21 work wt 22 When I told 22 this manager that my supervisor was (b)(7)(C) the 24 manager made a very disapprovinq face.
You know, like 25 C
rolled yes and like screwed upi Iface and, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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99 1
you know you know.
And I asked you you 2
- know, how was it that action was not taken with 3
[(j to correct his behavior as a supervisor 4
when they worked together.
This was like maybe in the 5
two to three-year ago range.
6 EPECIAL AGENTIIb)(7)(c)
Okay.
7 And I was then told that 8
actions were in their incipient phase to address 9
[
J performance, butIa(b)(7)(c) was able to 10 transfer out of the group before anythihg could be 21 done.
12 During the first couple of months of (bb(7)(c))
13 1time in our group; this -- which would 14 be, you know, I(b)(7)(C) he was 15 off -- often off doing other things.
Because he was 16 our supervisor he was supposed to review or work and i(b)(7)(C)I 17 approve our I_____________________
But he 18 didn't review our I7 as he is required to do.
19 Many of the group members complained because their 20 work was not getting out, you know, getting done.
21 Those of us who were qualified to approve 22 (b)(7)(C) in this stead did so for awhile; and I was 23 one of those people, but eventually we realized this 24 not only held up our own work you know,
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C-100 1
and he's giving me, you know, a lousy performance 2
appraisal.
So it was but --
but eventually we 3
realized this not only held up our own work, but this 4
situation was becoming rather codependent, so we I(b)(7)(C) 5 stopped.
still has trouble keeping up 6
withI(b)(7 )(C)
I mean, to this day.
1(b)(7,(C)
E h
has never counseled me about 8
anything of significance leading up to the midyear 9
performance appraisal.
Certainly there was no 10 communication about my work output.
During the first 11 half of 2010 I worked far more weekends than anyone 12 else in the group.
You know,
- again, how does the 13 company reconcile all the supplemental time that I
14 worked?
And I was getting paid for this.
It wasn't 15 like : was doing this out of the kindness of my heart.
16 I
- mean, I
- was, you
- know, getting paid for those 17 Saturdays that I worked.
18 LPECIAL AGENTII Yes.
(b)(7)(C) 19 (So company's paying me money.
20 Now any kind of half-assed competent supervisor at 21 some point, if if he had a concern about my work 22
- outPut, would say why am i spending the company's 23 hard-earned money if is basically coming in 24 here and not getting work done?
And the answer is I
25 was getting work done.
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1 2
3 4
5 6
7 8
9 10 11 12
-.3 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 101 And one issue of great importance here that I think bears noting is that (b)(7)(C) 7 has refused to (b)(7)(C) so he does not. know what it takes to get a (b(7)(C)
He's never done a I(b)(7)(C)
I've challenged him two or three times.
I said you --
you don't understand what we do, what it takes to get a (b)(7)(C)
So, and he says, oh, well, I did a I(b)(7)(¢)
(b)(7)(C)
I Well, you know, that's like, I don't know, you're in the military today and, you know, you find out your boss has never fired a gun.
He says, oh, no, no, no.
No, you know, back in the Revolutionary War I shot a flintlock, you know?
- Well, hey, pal, you
- know, it doesn't work that way anymore.
He does not understand the difference (b)(7)(C) between a simple (b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
I To him and I mentioned this earlier with respect to I(b)(7)(C)
I
([JCh o does primarily editorial correction kind of stuff, an editorial correction to him, is the same as something where you take five days to get a
[b(j) straightened out.
And again, I --
I just have to come back and emphasize that this you know, this baloney in NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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102 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the midyear about how I only did Ib)(7)(C) is it's
-- you know, it's ridiculous.
They knew it was a lie.
They didn't try to validate anything.
They never talked to me about my work output.
They never established a standard for the group.
They never published any information that would say, well, you know, so-and-so does so many a month and somebody else does something else.
You know, this whole thing is just pure fabrication, which means it's retaliation.
ESPECIAL AGENT Let me just ask you a question while I'm thinking about it on these reports that you put out in February --
I mean, in 2010.
These were the whole year or just February?
I No, this
__ this is between February and June.
IPECIAL AGENT February and June?
Okay.
E1 7 o)
So --
so this list
-- yes, end of June.
I did -- these are the b)(7)(C) that I did.
[SPECIAL AGENT Now your supervisor said he pulled a report, kept telling you I pulled a report, I pulled a report.
He said --
his exact words NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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- verbatim, "I ran a report."
2 IPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C)
Ran a report?
3 Is there a report that would show how much you did 4
other than you keeping --
going to the machine and 5
Dulling up individually?
(b)(7)(C) 6 I don't know.
I mean, I'm --
7 i don't I
not that --
there are ways to query 8
the database, but I don't know how to do that.
9
[SPECIAL AGENT
]
Okay.
10 (inaudible) give me a sheet that says on February to 11 June this is what --
l(b)(7)(C) 12 You could ask them.
13 IISPECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(C) 14 Maybe --
maybe --
perhaps you 15 should ask them.
1E 1*PECIAL AGENT I'jj j
Well, yes.
No, 17 I'm just want to know if you 18
")7)(C), No.
No.
19 PECIAL AGENTI Okay.
(b)(7)(C)I 20 llAnd
-- and that information is 21 not --
as as --
again, as I say, it's not provided 22 to us.
I mean, we -- we don't really need it, but one 23 would think that if someone legitimately wasn't 24 producing that they would provide some information and 25 say what's going on, or what --
you have a problem?
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104 1
Are you just lazy, or what's -- what's the deal here?
2 None of none of that communication occurred.
3
[SPECIAL AGENT okay.
4 And
- again, there are no 5
established standard for (b)(7)(C) las far as 6
how many is reasonable that someone would do in -- in 7
some period of time.
There's no report that's posted 8
where you can say, well, geez, did -- gosh, he's 9
doing about 10 a month and and I'm doing eight.
10 And then, you know, doing like six or --
you 2.1 know, there's no way to, you know --
so again, that --
12 that just means to me that this whole -- this whole 13 thing was a -- a witch hunt from day one.
That's all 14 I'm saying.
15 ESPECIAL AGEN TII(b)T)
C Okay.
((b)(7)(C) 16 f
iOkay.
So there's no record of 17 counseling me for my alleged poor behavior as required 18 by company policy.
And again, no counseling was done 19 because none was warranted.
Again, same thing on the 20 suspension.
Company policy requires that the 21 individual who is suspected of wrongdoing be 22 interviewed.
That didn't happen.
23 ESPECIAL AGENT Is there a
24 company policy in this stack that you're talking 25 about, or is that something that I'll need to request?
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105 1
- bNo, I know you --
I think I --
2 i
I --
I'm pretty confident I have it in here.
3 (SPECIAL AGENT You sent in a
4 couple of
- things, or we got a
couple of things 5
regarding temporary supervisor responsibilities.
6 1(b)(7)(c) 7 Yes.
- Now, that's I
I 7
included that because that is the standard that 8
applies to I(b)(7)(C) employees.
9 ISPECIAL AGENT E )(7)(C)
Okay.
Now what 10 I
have to say is that at the time I wrote this 11 notification we were no longer in thel (b)(7)(c) 12
[
j So the company will say, well, so what?
13 But we have what we call an "Excellence Guidebook;"
14 and I don't know if I included that information, but 15 there is a
statement in the company "Excellence 16 Guidebook" that sayd(b)(7)(c) sets the tone and sets 17 the standard for the rest of the site.
And and 18 this was one of the issues that I raised, and it's in 19 my memorandum that I wrote in in my mee:ings with 20 ll h
hat said how is it that b)(z)(c) is okay 21 with upgrading a person with zero qualifications?
And 22 basically his answer was, well, we're pretty tight on 23 shift, but the other part of eh, not so much.
24 And that's when I told him, I said, well, I hope you 25 get a chance to defend that position in front of the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-4ýC 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 106 Nuclear Oversight Board or the NRC or INPO some time.
And again, I
and I'd like people to read the rebuttal that I made in my 2007 midyear performance appraisal.
And also in the 2010, read the
-- what I out in there versus what the company wrote.
While SCE would like to say that the common theme in my performance appraisals is me; that that I'm the --
I'm a bad guy and, you know, I'm poorly adjusted to life and, you know, just a totally piece of what, you know, the real common denominator are the people behind these performance appraisals, and that's mainlyEI I
And what I'm about to say may sound kind of corny, bur I --
i think it bears here.
I say it's
- funny, you
- know, I
managed to I 1
(b)(7)(C) which I did, and I(b)(7)C) 7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
So, you know, they don't I I'm not saying I was anything too much out of the ordinary, but they don't give those jobs to, you know, just anybody.
You know, I attended several what I'll NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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107 call (b)(7)(C) 3 i qualified as a (b)(7)(C) at 4
another plant, at the AIW Plant in Idaho Falls, Idaho 5
and I successfully performed a number of different 6
(b)(7)(C) oh, 7
get this:
Including I was the head of the 8
(b)(z)(C) at one time.
Okay?
9 So all I'm saying is I know what teamwork 10 is.
I know what respect is.
I know what leadership 11 is.
I know what obedience and -- and management and 12
-- and all these things are about.
The real problem
- (b)(7)(C) 1 (b)(7)(C)
I J 6( ) C 13 here is thel and I and 14 r
of the world that retaliate.
They don't like 15 you because you know what you're doing.
You -- they 16 don't like you because you point out things that 17 doesn't necessarily make them look bad, but it makes 18 them then have to do something.
And then every once 19 in awhile they do something really stupid like this 20 upgrade thing.
So in their world the only way they 21 can deal with that is to retaliate against the 22 individual who raises the issue.
Because the only way 23 their whole --
their whole mission in life is to 24 survive and they only way they can survive is to make 25 other people look bad and make sure that if there's NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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108 i
any blame that it goes to someone else.
So when 2
someone raises an issue, they have to make that person 3
look bad and that's how they go down the retaliation 4
path.
5
- Again, concerning my comments about Z
)(C) 6 jyou know, my comments concerning her were 7
accurate and business-related.
I used no 8
inappropriate language.
There is a
policy on 9
workplace appearance, not met on occasion by her.
And i0 for any number of really far more important reasons, 1i it was inappropriate to try to put her in charge of 12 our group.
And again, these mainly have to do with 13 qualification, skill and knowledge.
These reasons, 14 and including her appearance, are all business-related 15 reasons.
And again, where's the investigation?
16 There's -- there's more here and I --
I 17 would hope that somebody would read what I've written 18 here.
(b)(7)(c) 19 1 talk about t
a little bit and 20 how he got --
he was retaliated against.
And again, 21 what -- what's really striking about this chilled work 22 environment and retaliatory environment that we have 23 here is that the people that wanted to join the union 24 in our group, it's almost all supervisors.
It's 25 myself, it's I?(?7)(C) who's a I(b)(7)(C)
NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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109 1 it'Is (b)(7)(C)
Im (b)(7)(C) not sure if he was kind of on the fence.
But 3
like three of the four people that voted for the union 4
were supervisors.
So I mean, what does that tell you?
I 6
mean, here at the time --
the first time we voted, I
7 wass (bl(7),C, And i'm a J(b)(7)(c) spent my 8
whole life in I mean, from the day I 9
(b)(7)(C)
II've been a some 10 sort or a of some sort or another.
I mean, I
11 don't have anything against
- unions, but I'm not 12 exactly the model poster child for someone who wants 13 to join a union.
14 PECIAL AGENT Yes.
- (*7)(C) 15
)
But we want to join the union 16 because we need some protection.
And that's again why 17 the company still hasn't got its handle around the 18 safety conscious work environment or the chilled work 19 environment, because they refuse to acknowledge that 20 people
- ike this live in their organization and they 21 force us to go to you guys and maybe other people to 22 try to get some help.
And again, I'm --
I'm --
I'm 23 not trying to presuppose that you'll see things the 24 way I do, but that's why we do what we do.
25 Okay.
I'm going to shut up.
What I'd NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-1(,
110 1
like to do next is answer any remaining questions you 2
may have and -- and explain this package of material 3
that I want to give you.
4
[SPECIAL AGENT 111)c()C Okay.
And is 5
that mine also?
I(b)(7)(C) 6 No, this is mine.
7 (SPECIAL AGENTII Is there a copy 8
of that there?
9
~~(b)(7)(C) 7 Ys 97 C
Yes.
10 IPECIAL AGENTE)(7) C Okay.
[~~(b)(7)(C) i Y s 11 7
Yes.
12
[SPECIAL AGENTZ1(b,(c)
C Okay.
13 And let me --
if you don't 14
- mind, if we could go off record one more time so I 15 can --
16
[SPECIAL AGENT TI(b)(I)(c) Sure.
We'll go 17 off record again.
Time is approximately 4:13 p.m.
18 (Whereupon, at 4:13 p.m. off the record 19 until 4:16 p.m.)
20 LSPECIAL AGENTff)T.
We're back on 21 record.
Its' approximately 4:16 p.m.
22 i I've pretty much covered what 23 I would need to cover as far as the allegation that 24 you filed and the retaliatory actions that were taken 25 against you.
And the main ones being of course your NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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i.1 1
midyear performance appraisal in 2010, which kind of 2
drove you to do these allegations and also you were 3
suspended wizhout pay in 2010.
4 i(b)(7)(c)
Correct.
5PECIAL AGENT
[
And I think 6
you've gone over why you felt you were suspended and 7
why you felt you got a bad appraisal.
So I think 8
we've got that captured.
((b)(7)(C) 10
[SPECIAL AGENT 1()7()Now you have 11 some material.
And also, I wanted to make sure that 12 we had the names that
(
(bb)(7)(c) 14 1You 15 want me to write who they are, like coworker or --
16 Es PECIAL AGENT L7)(C) Yes.
- Well, 17 you're going to put them on this list whenever we're 18 done here.
19 (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
20
[SPECIAL AGENT 1(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
Z..L I
23
[PECIAL AGENT ()(7)(c)
Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 24 25 Ob)(7)(C) 25 O()7(C 1kay.
is there anybody else on this list NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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you feel with regards to these allegations that could 2
provide light or shed more light on this?
l~)(7)(C) 3 With respect to the allegation 4
itself, my coworkers would be the -- would -- should 5
be able to attest much of what I'm saying.
6
[SPECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)(C)_
I Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 7 In whole or in part.
Some of 8
the other people there that I've listed --
9 PECIAL AGENT c
He's (b)(7)(c)
Right.
And I can provide his 11 phone number.
12 IPECIAL AGENT
[
j And he's a
13 coworker also, correct?
14 (7)(C)
Coworker and he's present at 15 work.
SECIAL(b)(7)(C)
I Coworker?
((b)(7)(C)
)
17 coworker.
18 SPECIAL AGENb II And he' 19 also?
2(b)(7)(C)
H-[(b)(7)(C)
S(b)(7)(C) he's 2
- o.
- And I've tried to call him a couple 22 of times, but he hasn't responded.
So -- but I would 23 appreciate if you would make an effort to 24 (SPECIAL AGENT[I What I'll do 25 is NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-7r, 113 1
=
-- communicate with him.
2 1PECIAL AGENTc (b)(-7
-- people that work here, I'll go through their work number and 4
contact.
And
- hat's I spoke to you before, you 5
- know, we got a way of doing that.
The people that 6
lare --
and in[((7)(c)
- Ijcase, I may send you 7
an email.
If you can respond with their phone numbers 8
and I'll --
9
(
Okay.
10
[SPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C)--
you know, 11 I'll certainly try to call them.
I'll get in touch
-12 with them somehow.
((b)(7)(C) s.
13 I1 Yes 14 PECIAL AGENT Ir and the other two individuals, they're not 16 coworkers with you, are they?
17
](b)(7)(c) is a coworker.
18 (PECIAL AGENT Oh, he is?
19
-Okay.
19 OkaI(b)(7)(C) 20I 21
[(b)(7)(C) also.
22 cSPECIAL AGENTII Now will he be 23 out also?
(b)(7)(C) 24 1
-1
- Yes, he would be out.
He 25 won't be back for a few weeks yet or --
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I-,
114 1
[sPECIAL AGENTn(b)(7)(C)
Okay.
2
-]--
longer perhaps.
3 IS PECIAL AGENT 1(b)(7)(C)I e7)(C) is at work.
6
[SPECIAL AGENý*bc And which is (b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C) 7 He isa He 8 b)(7)(C) 9 (SPECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(C)
Okay.
10
)
But he is at SONGS.
11
- PECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)(C)
And bothE 12 and Z
are both still there?
13 (C)
That's correct.
( b ) ( 7 ) ( C )
O k y W r 14 LSPECIAL AGENT Okay.
Were 15 either one coworkers with you?
16 7()No, but we've known each other 17 for a long time and we interact from time to time.
18
@SPECIAL AGENT IIb)7)C Okay.
19 1
Professionally, yes.
20
[PECIAL AGENT I(b)(7)()
I All right.
21 Okay.
Now let me add a name 22 or two just because again, I --
I --
I think it's 23 this kind of case is it's not quite -- there's 24 there's no smoking gun necessarily.
There's not a 25 dead body with, you know, three bullet holes.
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of this is it's a case that's built on the sum to 2
talk of a lot of parts.
3 So I'd like you to talk toI )(7)(C) 4 (phonetic).
He's at work.
He's not in our group, but 5
he's a coworker, and he can attest tol 6
behavior.
And I'd like you to call 17 7
(phonetic).
He's a coworker.
8 Now I
haven't talked to these people 9
first.
I mean, I haven't prepped them or anything.
10 I'll go with whatever they say.
I1 LSPECIAL AGENTN7m(c)
Okay.
And let 12 me --
I mean, there were --
well, I'm going to write 13 the name of the manager who 7 was speaking to a couple 14 of months back who when I
said I
you
- know, (b)()(C)(b)Q) 1i was my supervisor (C) kind of screwed up face and roliedlc) eyes kind of.
I --
I --
I --
17 I think it's important that you hear from me or from 18 other people what i've said about these guys.
19
[SPECIAL AGENTm1b(7()---Oay.
20 And -- and I think that bears 21 on this case.
It it goes to the credibility of 22 what I've said and -- and it goes to answering these 23 questions,
- well, are these people capable of 24 retaliating?
Is this is this their MO kind of 25 thing?
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i'll call her a coworker.
She's --
I 2
don't work with her, but she's here at work.
That's 3
what I mean.
4
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
5 (And there are a host of 6
others.
7 Well, what I'm giving you here are copies 8
of portions of this monthly log that I keep on -- on 9
my --
my work output.
10
[SPECIAL AGENT llbc(7)(c)
Yes.
17 And this is the --
the January 12 through June 2010 summary of my work output in terms 13 ofl(b)(7)(C) 14
[SPECIAL AGENT
)(c)
Okay.
15
[1 This other thing down here are 16 these are nuclear notifications,
- NNs, nuclear 17 notifications.
That's actually the bean count that 18 gets used for a lot of our work output things.
In 19 other words, when I issue a Z7)(c)
]there might be 20
- one, two, three or five notifications that are 21 tha (b)(7)(C) 21 outstanding against tha 22 SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
l(b)(7)(C) 23 So I'll just
-- and again, one 24 of the clever things that they did is by focusing in 25 the midyear on numbers of I that I wrote, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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.1 117 1
they -- they avoided how many notifications I worked 2
on and closed out.
Because again, I -- I'd mention 3
that i didn't come back to the group until around the 4
10th of January of 2010 and the first couple of weeks 5
all I did was go through my huge backlog of work and 6
clean out old notifications.
In fact, here, January 7
2010, for example, when I use an asterisk here, what a
that means is I didn't actually I(b)(7)(C) 9 but I
did some research so I
could close the 10 notification without (b)(7)(C)
So I 1I spent some time going through my backlog to try to 12 help clean up some of this stuff.
And then at the 13 same time I'm -- I'm starting toI(b)(7)(C) but 14 you know, there's a gestation period of let's say two (b)(7)(C) 15 weeks on the So that's why you don't start 16 seeing any from me until -- until 17 February.
So then it starts kind of picking up.
- And, 18 you know, then by March I'm kind of --
I'm getting 19 back in stride.
April I'm in stride.
May is low 20 because I was on the root cause team for three weeks, 21 you know?
22
- Well, that's yours.
And then here's a 23 copy of my 2010 performance appraisal.
So this would 24 include the midyear and the final.
25
@PECIAL AGENT N
Okay.
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i 2
3 4
R
-7 8
9 10
- 11 12 13 14 i5 16 17 18 i 9 20 21 22 23 24 25 118 r
7)(C)
[And this is yours.
This is
[b)(7)(0)
Stack it all there.
This is a copy of the employee discipline policy.
And I --
I could --
see page 24.
Goes on a fact finding summary
- form, you
- know, the investigation.
Have all witnesses and relevant parties including the affected individual been interviewed and statements taken?
((b)(7.)(C
[PECIAL AGENTII Good.
Okay.
[Ij Didn't happen.
[S PECIAL AGENTZ11(1 )C Got you.
[b)(7)(C)
Again, one of the things I'm trying to get everyone to understand is the -- the --
the negative chills, unprofessional environment that we work in.
And this week, last week, this week, we're all supposed to take a survey that kind of has to do with safety conscious work environment, kind of quality of life, you know, kind of issues.
And what I thought was appropriate to include would be copies of a survey that one of my coworkers did in my group.
Okay.
So this was done in survey 3/11, you know, March of --
SPECIAL AGENTII Right, 2011.
()(7)(C) 2011.
And I'm not going to read it for you, but you know, you'll start to sense NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE.. N.W.
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119 1
someone else sees things just like I do.
2
[PECIAL AGENTE)
Okay.
3J(b)(7)(C)
And then this is a copy of 4
excerpts of my summary.
5 This is a
copy of the package I
was 6
reading
- from, you
- know, toward the end of our 7
discussion here today.
8
[PECIAL AGENTZ1(b)(7)(c)
Okay.
9 I filed a -- besides filing an 10 allegation with the NRC, when I did that the NRC sent 11 me a letter and said you might want to consider filing 12 that allegation also with the Department of Labor, 13 depending on how this turns out.
AG N
(b)(7)(c) 14
[SPECIAL AGENT I
Yes.
J(b)(7)(C) 15 So, I
I I submitted an 16 allegation to the Department of Labor and then, you 17 know, the investigator said, well, tell me what this 1i is all about.
So this is the package where I tried to 19 tell him what it was all about.
So it's it's about 20 an eight-page sort of my written explanation of what 21 the problem is, why I believe there's -- you know, an 22 allegation is warranted and the basis for it.
23 ESPECIAL AGENTI Okay.
(b)(7)(C) 24
[
And --
and that's what I was 25 reading from here a little while ago, portions of NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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120 i
which --
and then I included a few examples of some 2
nice things people said about me during the period 3
under discussion here.
4 ISPECIAL AGENTI (b)(7)(C)
Okay.
5 Like this one is dated 6
November I of this year, but it pertains to April of 7
this year.
8
[SPECIAL AGENT[bc Okay.
9 (b)7)(c) 7 When I was on theI (b7)(c) i0 team, for example.
So most of this stuff is pretty 11 current.
You know, it it takes place at about the 12 same time, you know, that this midyear fiasco was 13 going on.
14
[SPECIAL AGENT I
Okay.
(b)(7)(C)
Or -- or it covers portions of 16 that period.
And there's a bunch of those.
And --
17 and some were a little earlier, like -- well, anyway.
18 You know, I figured I'd get a couple of these from 19 early 2008, you know, just because they-- the company 20 decided to go back to 2007 to retaliate.
So I
21 figured, well, okay.
And again, all this information 22 is here to counterbalance this this midyear 23 performance appraisal, I mean, in addition to whatever 24 you get from people that you talk to.
25 There's an article from a local paper here NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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121 1
about the chilled work environment, and I forget when 2
it was from September of this year.
We had a
3 public meeting about the safety conscious work 4
environment and just again just again to keep S
beating this drum that this problem still exists.
6 It's not being addressed.
7
~~[SPECIAL AGEN TIIb(7(C Okay.
8 1Then here's something from one 9
of our corporate officers about the importance of 10 countering and not allowing retaliation.
11 I've included a statement from one of my 12 coworkers about the upgrade situation.
13 Occasionally the company likes to say, 14
- well, uses profanity.
i don't use profanity as a rule.
Occasionally I use a vulgariy.
In my mind 16 there's a little bit of a difference, although maybe 17 not much.
But I included a statement again just to 18 show you how retaliatory they are as they'll get on me 19 for using the word 'shit, " which you know, is is 20 I'm not saying it's it's appropriate that I ever 21 use a word like that; I understand that, but here's a 22 case in a group meeting, you know, mixed mixed 23 company, several supervisors there where a guy in our 24 group uses the word "shit" and "son-of-a-bitch" and 25 everybody just laughs, like what's the big deal?
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and I'm -- you know, it's just a --
so I have a couple 2
of statements on that.
3 And -- and this one's of interest because 4
the guy that wrote this, I said, hey, you know, you 5
were in there with, you know, 20 other people when 6
this other guy used. "shit" and "son-of-a-bitch" and 7
how about writing a statement for me?
And he didn't 8
want to do it.
You know, why don't you think he 9
wanted to do it?
Obviously it's a
rhetorical 10 question.
Because he's afraid of retaliation.
I 11 choose to remain anonymous on this subject and he 12 wouldn't sign it.
That's what we're dealing with 13 here.
14 This the memo where I
requested the (b)(7)(C) 15 meeting wit to discuss the upgrade.
16 situation, a copy of that.
17 Here's a copy of the memo that I wrote 18 after my second meeting withib I
19 is apparently the guy that -- not only did he offer me 20 a job, but then at some point he decided that some --
21 you know, to push for disciplinary action.
You know, 22 there's nothing nothing was said and and this 23 kind of backs up what we talked about and --
you know, 24 and this also --
- again, it it goes to show that, J(b)(7)(c) 25 you know, I confronted j confront meaning I said, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-1c, 123 you know, what were you thinking when you hired*
2 and -- and
[
I mean, you know, what -- you 3
know?
So then at that point I think he realized that 4
his mission in life was to undermine me so that he 5
wouldn't look bad.
6 Here's a copy of an email that indicates 7
that I was scheduled for training so I could get this 8
new job, and this is early September of 2010.
So I 9
was scheduled for training and that's also the -- the 10 job offer.
11 Email frorr7Ic Looks to me like 12 it's time to decide if you want training and to work 13 as a cause evaluator, and I replied sure.
Thanks.
14 And then --
and then --
then I got --
they set me up 15 for training.
16 All right.
And I've got some examples.
17 This is like kind of group threat kind of stuff that I(b)(7)(C) 18 you get from There's another one.
19 This is a copy of a memo that I wrote in 20 December of 2008.
One of the investigators from the 21 employee concerns program asked me if I
thought 22 retaliation existed at San Onofre.
I mean, of all 23 people.
I -- so I've included some information about 24 why retaliation exists.
And I've redacted some of the 25 names, but I can tell you who they are if anybody's NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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-- Tel 124 1
interested.
2 Here's a
copy of the performance 3
management procedure that talks about providing 4
continual ongoing feedback to employees with respect 5
to their performance, that it's not acceptable to just 6
out of the blue give them eight needs improvements --
7 S~PECIAL AGENT(7c Okay.
I(b)(7)(C) 8 without any documentation 9
or anything.
10 Here's a copy of the policy that --
on 11 conduct that address dress code.
Again, I I know 12 it sounds kind of minor, but that was a very important 13 issue with the upgrade situation leading to my -- the 14 retaliation and suspension about, you know,
- clean, 15 neat, professional appearance, you know, and not --
16 not looking like you're -- you know, you're cruising 17 the bars on Friday night, you know?
18
[SPECIAL AGENTI1b)(7)(C)
Okay.
19 That's kind of the stuff I 20 said.
Now, people may not like that, but that's the 21 fact.
I mean, that's the truth.
You know, I didn't 22 you know, sorry if the truth hurts, but --
23 Okay.
These are copies of responses from 24 the NRC substantiating some of the allegations that I 25 submitted to the NRC.
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CS PECIAL AGENTI(b)(7)()
I Okay.
I(b)(7)(C)I 2
So I mean, the company knows, 3
you know, you got the chilled work environment, you 4
got some of this stuff.
I
- mean, they know I'm 5
submitting allegations.
I mean, walking over here I 6
passed my --
my --
c and another --
you know, 7
another manager saw me walk in here with my briefcase.
8 I mean, you know, they -- they know what's going on 9
and I'm not -- I'm not trying to hide it.
I mean, I'm 10 not trying to advertise it, but you know, they know ii what's going on.
I mean, I --
I've had a a number
-.2 of conversations with, you know, a(b)(7)nC) and 13 several withI(b)(7C)
I And --
and I would just 14 highlight it, you know, where they say your concerns 15 are substantiated.
6
[SPECIAL AGENTIIc Yes.
Okay.
17 So they know we're out there 18 raising issues about safety stuff.
19 Here's a copy of the March 2 chilled work 20 environment letter.
21 Here's a copy of 10 CFR 50, Appendix B, 22 which is always one of my favorite things that --
23 because a number of the -- several of the issues that 24 have been raised in my performance appraisals, 25 especially the 2007 where I said you owe me training, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W, (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 www.nealrgross.com
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126 1
- well, I didn't
-ust make that up.
I didn't you (b)(7)(C) 2
- know, it's
-not just It's 10 CFR 50, 3
Appendix B talks about, you know, you have to provide 4
training for personnel performing activities affecting 5
quality.
6 You know, so it's so again, you know, 7
I spent I(b)(7)(C) 7 here, you 8
know, working with the NRC, I(b)(7)(C) 9 those kinds of things.
I I(b)(7)(C) 10 during that time. Then I spent ()7C I(b)(7)(C) 11
[i So I'm not saying I'm right all 12 the time, but when I say I think the Code of Federal 13 Regulations there's a
there is a code that 14 applies here or this is what it expects you to do, 15 then I feel like I'm perfectly --
it's okay that I say 16 that.
i'm nor saying I'm right, but I'm saying it 17 looks like there's something that's not right here.
18 And then I've included copies of some of 19 the notifications that I wrote in 2010.
And some of 20 these I may not be the author, but I -- I participated b(b)(7)(C)1 21 ~
wrting hm.
S if you see like
[
22
- name, well I helped I
I may not have even 23 included that.
24 But I
I I
talk here about 25 equipment safety concern notifications, how they're NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE iSLAND AVE., N.W.
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127 1
not being reviewed properly.
And this isn't
-- these 2
aren't all the notifications i've written.
This is 3
kind of, you know, some good examples, you know?
I(b)(7)(C) 4 ESPECIAL AGENT Okay.
5
[JThis one I didn't write.
The 6
guy who wrote it is one of the witnesses I've checked 7
- there, (b)()C) where you
- know, they like to 8
threaten people.
And i've included a couple of 9
notifications in there earlier where -- you know, the 10 group thing and stuff.
Well, this is another group (b)(7)(C) 11 threat where I was --
it's when we were a 12 part of the I the I(b)(7)(C) 13 where they were having a meeting and the 14 (b)(7)(c)
Iwere I don't know what they were being 15 told, but they didn't like it and they said, you know, 16 this isn't right or whatever.
You're being b)(7)(C) 17 unreasonable.
II basically said, well, you 18 know -- basically he said, well, we can get --
we can 19 get contract planners to replace you guys.
So this 2C guy wrote a notification to -- to surface that.
21
[SPECIAL AGENTZ (b)(7)(c)
I Okay.
22(b)(7)(C)
I o t e fact th d(b)(7)(C)I 22 Sothe fatthatI 23 pulled -- tried to pull this stunt with an unqualified 24 person is is part of his MO.
I mean, you see it 25 here.
You see it there, you know?
- Plus, you know, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE.. N.W.
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128 1
again my belief that he probably got some negative 2
blowback.
I'm not saying he got disciplinary action, 3
but he an F(79got some unwanred attention as a result 4
of that, clearly.
5
[SPECIAL AGENT
(
I Okay.
[(b)(7)(C) 6 So then when you tie that in 7
with (b)(7)(c) for example, who innocently, as a 8
subject matter expert on this particularI(b)(7)(c)'
9 that he was trying to get changed, recommended to 10 1
- hey, we --
we want to do it this way, not your 1i way, you know, ended up with a needs improvement
-2 and forfeited his bonus.
So, you know, I mean, these 13 are the kinds of people we're dealing with.
14 And last and mercifully not the least, 15 when I filed my claim with the Department of Labor, 16 the Department of Labor notified Edison that I had 17 submitted an allegation or a. claim.
18 SPECIAL AGENT (b)(7)(c)
Yes.
(b)(7)(C) 19 And so Edison prepared this 20 nice little package telling the Department of Labor 21 what a worthless dirt bag I was.
So here's all kinds 22 of stuff that says I'm a -- got two heads, got hair on 23 che palms of both hands, you know, the whole thing, 24 you know?
25 I --
I put a little flag on --
this is my NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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rebuttal to the 2007 performance appraisal.
i waited 2
until the end of the year, but this goes to the 3
midyear 2007.
So this is what I say.
You know, 4
what's important to remember is that four years later, 5
or three-and-a-half years later the fact that I had 6
rebutted this had no effect on anything.
They just 7
went and said,
- well, your midyear 2007 said bad 8
things.
9
[SPECIAL AGENT 11b1(7)(c)
Yes.
10 Didn't acknowledge what I had I
said or acknowledge that there was a
a huge 12 difference of opinion with respected to what was 13 written here.
'(b)(7)(C) 14 This i.s a copy of
[
- report, 15 which frankly I think is very unprofessional.
It was 16 written as a direct result of the the upgrade 17 situation.
But there's a
lot of there's 18 information in here that's --
it's basically hearsay.
19 It's not substantiated.
It's I'm called --
I'm the 20 one poor or non-performer in the organization that's 21 dragging down the overall performance and success of 22 the organization.
Me, all by myself.
There's no --
23 there's no basis for it.
24 The decline or currently poor condition of 25 morale in the organization can be attributed to three NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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130 1
individuals and their efforts to unionize.
There's no 2
basis for that statement.
3 The one thing he got right, because I told 4
him this, is one interviewee; and that's me of course, 5
believes that his supervisor and the (b)(7)(C) 6 ~ ) 7 ( )s t a'(b
)(7 )(c) l n(b
)(7 )(C )a r
6so that' s I an=I~O are 7
incompetent and should be terminated.
And and 8
that's absolutely correct.
I mean,
- again, I'm not 9
saying I'm right, but that's exactly what I feel.
10
[SPECIAL AGENTl(b(7)(c)
Okay.
()(7)(C) 1 You know, I've been out in the 12 work force forI (b(7)(C)
I've been aI(b)(7)C)
-3 (b)()()
And that's my 14 position.
So doesn't mean I don't work for them or 15 i don't follow their direction, but that's what I 16 feel.
17 Now says there's no information 18 offered during the interviews which indicate that 19 anyone had suffered retaliation as a
result of 20 engaging in a protected activity. well, he didn't ask 21 anybody.
He says no one was offered.
All I can say 22 is I hope I did better work for the NRC than he's 23 doing for us.
24 What else?
I think that's pretty much it.
25 If I wake up in the middle of the night and say, oh, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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I should have provided a copy of something, then I'll 2
I'll contact you.
3 IPECIAL AGENTbc)
You've got all 4
my contact information.
I don't think I 5
1 (b)(7)(C)
-7 If you don't mid, let me just 6
write it down again and 7
[SPECIAL AGENTr7(c)
Here you go.
8 b)(7)(C)
Perfect.
Thank you.
9
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
1 20 appreciate you bringing me especially the policies and 12 the guidance.
It saved me the trouble of having to go 12 and ury to find that.
Appreciate that.
](b)(7)(C)
I3 Well, let me -- I'm not going 14 to say much more.
I talked to[
about that 15 upgrade thing.
16 CPECIAL AGENT I Yes.
1 (b)(7(c)n I felt the Commission's 18 view of
.hat particular incident was kind of --
I 19 don't know, I thought they kind of --
I expected a 20 stronger response, but I mean, it's not up to me to 21 dictate how people respond.
He related to me that in 22 talking to --
i guess he talked to human relations 23 people or somebody like that and they said, you know, 24 for up to 30 days anybody can upgrade anybody they 25 want to supervisor.
And I just thought that was a NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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132 1
very you're talking about saw SCE and I'm 2
thinking, well, that's nice, but then why do we have 3
all these programs and procedures and why does every 4
job we do here require one more specific 5
qualifications that are documented and in the database 6
that you're supposed to verify before you do the job?
7 (PECIAL AGENT TI Yes.
I~(b)(7)(C) 8 I
And why why does 9
jave a formal procedure to do that?
And
!0 why did we spend two years getting out of this white 11 finding having to do with a
failed battery 12 surveillance that basically was as a
result of 13 unsatisfactory supervisory and management oversight?
14 T mean, that's what really got me about the upgrade 15 thing is we're supposed to be a plant in recovery.
26 We're recovering from, you know, this battery failed 17 surveillance issue where as it turned out, you know, 18 I guess the determination was made that this one 19 safety-related battery was out of service for four 20 years because of some loose connectors that weren't 21 torqued.
22 You know, we go to meetings all the time 23 about how we have to get better, yada,
- yada, yada.
24 And what do we get at the working level?
You get a 25 bumbling supervisor walking around at ten minutes to NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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3 4
5 6
7 8
9 i0 12
'4 15 16 17 19 20 21 23 24 25 133 4:00 on a Friday afternoon saying he's going to upgrade basically a --
a 1(b)(7)(c) to be the supervisor of a group that prepares (b)(7)(C)
I I mean, that's the way I look at it.
I mean, I don't know how others will look at it, but that was my motivation in
- writing, you
- know, that notification and kind of trying well, blow the whistle on it.
[SPECIAL AGENTl(bl(7)(c)
I Yes.
E(b)(7)(C)
IAgain, whether I was right or wrong I was doing what I thought was appropriate and I was doing what I felt was right for the site and was in accordance with what I'll call excellent operating standards.
You know, everything that happened after that in my mind is retaliation for having done that (b)(7)(C) because it made and look very, very bad.
And then once got involved, he just made it worse.
So, other than that, I would like to thank you for your patience, because you have exhibited great patience today, and we'll see what happens.
[SPECIAL AGENT Okay.
I'm going to close out the record here.
I'm sure you've asked these few questions before, but during this process, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
(202) 2344433 WASHINGTON, D.C.
20005-3701 www.neatrgross.com
-in, 134 1
(b)(7)(C) have I or any other NRC employee threatened 2
you or promised you anything in return for your 3
testimony here today?
(b)(7)(C) 4 No, you have not.
11)()C) 5 PECIAL AGENT Okay.
Have you 6
given this statement freely and voluntarily?
(b)(7)(C) 7
- Yes, I have.
8 PECIAL AGENT Okay.
We're 9
about to close out the record.
Anything we haven't 10 covered you feel needs more exploration or anything 11 else you'd like to add to the record?
(b)(7)(C) 12 1
No, I --
all I can say is I've 13 I've tried to explain the basis for my allegation 14 and why I feel the way I do.
And you've given me an 15 opportunity to do that and I appreciate it.
16
[SPECIAL AGENTI I
Okay.
Well,7 17 this interview is concluded at approximately 18 4:50 p.m. on March 24, 2011.
19 (Whereupon, the interview was concluded at 20 4.50 p.m.)
21 22 23 24 25 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
(202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 www.nealrgross.com
CERTIFICATE This is to certify that the attached proceedings before the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission in the matter of:
Name of Proceeding: Interview of (b)(7)(C)
Docket Number:
4-2011-024 Location:
San Clemente, California were held as herein appears, and that this is the original transcript thereof for the file of the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission taken by me and, thereafter reduced to typewriting by me or under the direction of the court reporting company, and that the transcript is a true and accurate record of the foregoing proceedings as recorded on tape(s) provided by the NRC.
(b)(7)(C)
(b)(7)(C)
OtticiaL Transcriber Neal R. Gross & Co.,
Inc.
24 0 1 S-J<
F~m2Ol1~ NEAd R. GROSS__,
COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
(202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 www.nealrgross.com