ML20072H742
| ML20072H742 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Crane  |
| Issue date: | 08/18/1981 |
| From: | Faust C METROPOLITAN EDISON CO. |
| To: | |
| References | |
| TASK-*, TASK-01, TASK-04, TASK-06, TASK-1, TASK-4, TASK-6, TASK-GB MONY-810818, NUDOCS 8306290709 | |
| Download: ML20072H742 (127) | |
Text
f 350 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
- -x GENERAL PUBLIC UTILITIES CORPORATION, 2
F JERSEY CENTRAL POWER & LIGHT COMPANY, METROPOLITAN EDISON COMPANY and PENNSYLVANIA ELECTRIC COMPANY, a
Plaintiffs, 80 CIV. 1683 (R.O.)
-against-THE BABCOCK & WILCOX COMPANY and J.
RAY McDERMOTT & CO.,
INC.,
t Defendants.
- -x Deposition of METROPOLITAN EDISON COMP ANY,
by CRAIG C.
FAUST, taken by th e Defendants,
pursuant to agreement, at the offices of Davis Polk & Wardwell, Esqs., One Chase Manhattan Plaza, New Yo rk, New Yo rk, on Tuesday, August 18, 1981, at 10:15 o' clock in the forenoon, before Joseph R.
Danyo, a Stenotype Reporter and Notary Public within and for the State of New York.
8306290709 810818 PDR ADOCK 05000289 PDR T
Cd DOYLE REPORTING, INC.
CERTIFIED STENOTYPE REPCRTERS 369 LsxtNGToM AVENUE WALTER SHAPIRO C.S.R.
N e w Yoeit. N.Y.
10017 CHARLES SHAPIRO. C.S.R.
TatsPNoNa 212 - 867-8220 1.
I 1
2 (dD 2
Appe aran ce s :
3 KAYE, SCHOLER, FIE RM AN, HAYS & HANDLER, ESQS.
4 Attorneys for Plaintiffs 4 25 Park Avenue llh 5
By:
ANDREW MacDONALD, ESQ.
-and-7 RICHARD C.
S E LT ZE R, ESQ.,
of Counsel 8
9 DAVIS POLK & WARDWELL, ESQS.
10 Attorneys for Defendants One Chase Manhattan Plaza 11 New York, New York 12 Ry:
ROBERT B.
FISKE, ESQ.
(~N
-and-(_)
13 WILLIAM E.
WURTZ, ESQ.,
of Counsel 14 15 KILLIAN 6 GEPHART, ESQS.
16 Attorneys for the Witness Box 886 17 216-218 Pine Street Harrisburg, Pennsylvania 1710 8 18 By:
JANE G.
PENNY, ESQ.,
19 of Counsel
-and-20 LeBOEUF LAMB LEIBY & MacRAE, ESQS.
21 1333 New Hampshire Avenue, N.W.
k Washington, D.C.
20036 22 By:
KEVIN M.
WALSH, ESQ.,
23 of Counsel N
24 Also Presents b
25 ROBERT P.
CANNON
1 1
1 3
()
IT IS REREBY STIPULATED AND AGREED by 2
and between the attorneys for the respective 3
parties hereto that the sealing, filing and 4
llh
- P 5
6 deposition be, and the same hereby are, l
waived; that the transcript may be signed 7
8 before any Notary Public with the same force and effect as if signed before the Court.
9 10 IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED that all objections, except as to the form gg 12 f the question, are reserved to the time of
)
trial.
13 14 e *
- 15 16 CRAI G C.
FAUS T, having been 1
17 first duly sworn by the Notary Public 18 (Joseph R.
Danyo), was examined and testified 19 as follows:
20 EX AMINATION BY MR. FISKE :
21 Q
Please state your name and home address 22 for the record.
23 A
Craig C.
- Faust, R.D.
No.
1, 253", Palmyrc, C~N 24 Pennsylvania.
))
25 Q
Mr. Faust, how old are you?
1 Faust 4
[h q_)
2 A
Thirty-three.
3 Q
Eow are you employed?
4 A
I am employed by Metropolitan Edison Company as lll 5
a control room operator.
6 Q
Could you identify the lawyers that are 7
here in the room with you today?
8 A
I have two personal lawye rs, Jane Penny and 9
Kevin Walsh, and I also have, company lawyers for GPU, 10 Andy MacDonald and Mr. Seltzer.
11 Q
All four of those attorneys are here in 12 the room with you this morning?
(
13 A
Yes.
14 Q
Is it your understanding that Mr.
15 MacDonald and Mr. Seltzer are representing GPU?
16 A
Yes.
17 Q
And the othe'r two lawyers are representing 18 you as an individual?
19 A
Yes.
20 Q
Jane Penny and Kevin Walsh are not 21 representing GPU; is that your understanding?
22 A
That's my understanding, yes.
23 Q
And Mr. MacDonald and Mr. Seltzer are 24 not representing you personally; is that also your 7s L.
\\
25 unde rs t an ding?
1 Faust 5
/O k-2 M R.
MacDONALD:
Other than the fact that 3
he is employed by GPU.
4 A
My understanding is that they represent the llh 5
compen.y f or whi ch I wo rk.
6 C
And they do not represent you personally?
7 MR. MacDONALD:
Othe r than the fact that 8
he is employed.
9 Q
What is your understanding?
10 A
They represent the company that I work for.
11 That is the way I unde rstand it.
12 Q
What is your understanding as to whether
()
13 they are representing you in your individual capacity?
14 MR. MacDONALD:
He just told you --
15 Q
Other than as an employee of the company.
16 MR. MacDONALD:
And he is an employee of 17 the company.
18 Q
Is it your unde rstanding that they 19 represent you in any capacity other than as an 20 employec of Met Ed or GPU?
21 A
It is not my understanding that they represent 22 me other than for the company.
23 Q
When did you first meet Mr. Seltzer or r~T 24 Mr. MacDonald?
25 A
Last Wednesday, I believe it was.
g Faust 6
O
('
2 Q
That is the first time you ever met either 3
one of those two individuals; is that correct?
j 4
A Yes.
lh 5
Q Do you know the name of the law firm 6
that they are with?
7 A
I forgot the name of it.
8 MR. MacDONALD:
We can tell you.
It is 9
Kaye, Scholer, in case you have forgotten.
10 Q
When is the fi rs t time you eve r met any 11 attorney employed with the Kaye, Scholer law firm?
12 A
I really don't know.
I have met enough lawyers O)
(_
13 that I don't.know when I met them.
Wednesday, as far 14 as I know is the firs t time I met them.
15 Q
Wednesday is the first time you met 16 someone who you knew at the time was with the Kaye, 17 Schole r law firm s is that correct?
18 A
At the time, yes.
19 Q
Mr. Walsh is identified as being with the 20 firm of LeBosuf Lamb Leiby & MacRae.
21 Whe n is the first time you met Mr. Walsh?
22 A
I believe'I met Mr. Walsh last Wednesday, the 23 week of last Wednesday or Thursday.
I am not sure
/)
24 which day it was.
\\.J 25 Q
The same day you first met Mr. MacDonald
1 Faust 7
2 and Mr. seltzer?
s 3
A Th at is what I am not sure of.
4 Q
But it was the same day?
llk 5
A The same time last week.
6 Q
And before meeting Mr. Walsh, had you 7
mot any cther lawyer that is connected with the 8
LeBoeuf Lamb law firm, to your knowledge?
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
When is the fi rs t time you met anyone 11 whom you knew was with that firm?
12 A
I don' t recall the date.
(_)'
13 Q
Give us your b est memory on th at.
14 MR. MacDONALD:
If he has a recollection.
15 A
sometime last year, I believe it was.
16 Q
sometime in 1980?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
Who was the individual that you first met 19 from that firm?
20 A
I don't remember if it was Eugene Fidal.
I 21 don't know which one I met first, to tell you the 22 truth.
23 Q
which one between whom?
"N 24 MR. MacDONALD:
Are you asking for other (d
25 lawyers f rom LeBoeuf Lamb whom he has met with?
1 Fau3t 8
b)
(
2 MR. FISKE:
Yes.
A I don't know.
3 4
Q Do you remember the names of any lawyers llh 5
from that firm that you have met other than Mr. Walsh?
6 A
I remember them, but I don't remember their 7
names.
8 Q
As you sit here now, can you think of the 9
name of any lawyer in that firm that you have met 10 other than Mr. Walsh?
11 A
Eugene Fidel.
12 Q
He is the individual that you believe you
~
(G)'
13 met sometime in 1980; is that correct?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Can you tell us what time of year it was 16 in 19807 17 A
No, I can't.
18 Q
You don't remember whether it was the 19 winter or the spring or the f all or the summer?
20 A
1 don' t remember.
21 Q
As you sit here now, you can't do any 22 better than just saying it was sometime last year?
23 A
Yes.
24 MR. MacDONALD :
He gave the best of his b'
v 25 recollection.
Faust 9
1 t\\-
2 MR. FISKE:
We're trying to find out what 3
the best of his recollection is.
4 MR. MacDONALD:
He gave it to you twice.
lll 5
Q When is the fi rs t time you met Jane Penny?
6 A
Once again, I don't recall the exact time, date, 7
that I met Jane Penny.
8 Q
Was it at or about the same time that you 9
met Mr. Fidel?
10 A
I would say so, yes.
11 Q
Did you have any discussions at any time 12 with anyone employed by GPU on th e subject of whether p)
(_
13 or not you should retain counsel who represented only 14 you?
15 HR. MacDONALD:
You are talking about 16 other than attorneys?
17 Q
You can answer that yes or no, and then 18 we will find out who.
19 A
Restate the question.
20 (Ques tion read. )
21 MR. MacDONALD:
I instruct the witness to 22 answer only if he had conversations othe r than 23 with counsel.
I don't want the witness to (J"N 24 answer if he had a conversation with counsel.
25 If it was a conversation with someone other
Fount 10 1
2 than counsel, you are entitled to an answer.
3 MR. FIS KE :
Our position is if a lawyer 4
for GPU told Mr. Faust he should retain his own llh 5
counsel, in connection with that conversation, 6
he could not have been acting as Mr. Faust's 7
at t o rn ey.
8 MR. MacDONALD:
I respect your position, 9
but I still instruct the witness he is to answer 10 only if the conve rsation was not with counsel 11 either for GPU or anyone else.
12 MR. FISKE:
Le t's break it down into two
()
13 parts.
g4 BY MR. FISKE:
15 Q
Did you have a conversation with anyone 16
- EPloyed by GPU or Me t Ed othe r than someone that you 17 then knew was an attorne) on the subject of whether or 18 not you should retain individual counsel for you alone, 39 retain separate counsel for you alone?
A The point in time that I can remember, if you 20 want to call it discussions about retaining counsel, 21 O
22 our own independent counsel, was right around the l
23 time pe riod of the beginning of the Grand Jury rx 24 investigation.
)
%/
25 MR. FISKE:
The record should indicate
1 Faust 11 (k/
2 that Mr. Faust's answer was interrupted because 3
Mr. Walsh received a telephone call which he has 4
now completed.
l lh 5
Could you read Mr. Faust's answer back 6
as far as it got; and then maybe you can pick up 7
from there, Mr. Faust.
8 MR. MacDONALD:
If there is anything to 9
pick up from.
10 CRecord read.1 11 Q
Does that finish your answer?
12 A
That would have been an answer, yes, then-13 Q
so the answer is, you did have a conver-
~
}4 sation or conversations with someone at Met Ed other 15 than a lawyer about retaining your own separate counsel; I
16 is that correct?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
And those conve rs ation s, at least some of 19 them, occurred at or about the time of the Grand Jury 20 investigation that you referred to; is that right?
A Yes.
21 22 Q
Where was this Grand Jury sitting?
23 A
~h 24 Q
You referred in one of your earlier answers (G
25 to the fact that the conve rs ations about retaining "our
Faust 12 1
'3 (0
2 own independent counsel" occurred about the time of 3
the Grand Jury.
Who were you re ferring to whe n you 4
refe rred to "our"?
lh 5
MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form of 6
the question in that it relates back.
You are 7
just characterizing the witness' prior tes timony.
8 If you want to refresh him in what he 9
testified to, fine, but you are including it in 10 a question which I think is imp rop e r.
What he 11 said, he said.
It is on the record.
12 MR. FISKE:
I am j us t t rying to s e t 13 background for the question, which is:
14
-Q When you used the word "our" in the answer 15 that you gave a few minutes ago, who were you 16 re ferring to?
17 A
I was referring to the ope rators that were 18 involved.
19 Q
Who were they?
20 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking the ones 21 whom he had the conve rsations with?
22 Q
You'said "our" ref erred to the ope rators 23 involved.
What did you mean by
- involve d" ?
Involved O
24 in what?
V 25 A
The Grand Jury investigation was about le ak
1 Faust 13 1
2 rates or is about leak rates.
3 when I sai d "our, " I am refe rring to 4
the operators of the plant, Unit 2.
I llh 5
Q What specific individuals were you j
6 referring to?
7 A
That would have been all shifts.
I didn't speak 8
to all shifts at the same time.
j 9
Q How many operators are involved in the 10 description, " all shi f ts "?
11 A
That would have been the operating crews that 12 manned TMI prior to the accident.
O)
(_
13 Q
How many people does that involve?
14 A
I don't know the total numbe r.
I neve r counted 15 all of us there.
There was quite a few that were 16 i nvolve d with the Grand Jury.
17 Q
What is the numbe r that were involved with 18 the Grand Jury, as you put it?
19 A
That is what I am saying.
I neve r -- I don't 20 know the whole number of all of them that were 21 involved in it.
There were shift s upe rviso rs on down.
22 I don't know if they -- I also don' t know if they asked 23 Pe oPle who had been operators previously.
~'\\.
24 Q
Just as you sit here now, what is your (d
\\
25 understanding of the number of people from shift
1 Faust 14 2
supervisors on down that are involved with this Grand 3
Jury investigation?
4 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking for his llh 5
recollection, not his guesstimate or speculation?
6 MR. FISKE:
Yes, his best understanding.
7 MR. MacDONALD:
Give your understanding, 8
not your guesses.
9 A
I believe it was approximately 25 of us.
10 Q
Is it your understanding that that Grand 11 Jury investigation is still continuing?
12 A
Yes.
13 Q
With whom in that group of 25 did you have 14 co nve rs ati ons about retaining your own separate 15 councel?
16 MR. MacDONALD :
You are asking him if he 17 specifically recalls conve rs ations that he had 18 with any of those individuals?
19 MR. FIS KE :
I am just asking him with 20 which of 25 individuals did he have 21 conversations.
22 MR. MacDONALD:
Which he can recall 23 having conversations with.
(~}
24 MR. FISKE:
I am not asklng him to make
\\J 25 one up.
i Faust 15
\\_/
MR. MacDONALD:
We're just making sure 3
that he is not speculating on the record to 4
what he thinks he may have done.
5 MR. FISKE:
There is one thing that is 6
cle ar f rom the depositions that have been taken 7
in this case.
We' re only interes ted in wh at 8
the witne ss recalls, not what he speculates 9
or what he imagines or what he fabricates, or 10 anything else.
11 MR. MacDONALD:
Fine.
.12 MR. FISKE:
I am asking you now.
k-)
13 BY MR. FISKE:
14 Q
As you sit here now, I am asking you to 15 think back to the time of that Grand Jury 16 investigation's beginning, and take it up right to 17 the present time, five minutes before you walked in 18 here this morning.
And I want you to tell me, 19 thinking back over that pe riod o f time, with whom 20 in this group of 25 that you have just identified 21 have you had any conversation on th e s ubj e ct o f g
22 having your own separate counsel.
23 A
Specifically, four of them that I can
(~h) 24 remember talking about.
25 Q
Who were the four?
Fount 16 g
(j 2
A Bill Zewe, Fred Scheimann, Ed Frederick.
I am i
nt sure if I talked to -- I better make that three.
3 I am not sure if I talked with him.
4 lll 5
Q Without holding you to it, who is the 6
Person you just had in your mind as someone you might have talked to?
7 8
MR. MacDONALD:
He already told you he is speculating, and I instruct him not to 9
10 answer.
11 MR. FISKE:
This is a discovery 12 deposition, and we would like to take the
()
13 deposition of whoever it is tha*t Mr. Faust 14 had in minds and we'll find out if he talked 15 to him or not.
16 MR. MacDONALD:
No.
I think the 37 instruction will stand because you are only
}g asking him to speculate.
He told you what he 19 recalls or what he knows.
You already set that down as a ground rule.
That has been a 20 21 Practice when you have defended your own B&W O
22 employees.
23 Q
A moment ago when you were thinking O
24 after you had named four people with whom you had G
25 conversations, you named three, and then you said you
1 Faust 17
)
(}_/
l 2
weren't sure about the fourth one; is that correct?
3 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form of 4
the question.
He didn't name four.
There i
lll 5
were four that he thought.
He gave you the 6
n ame s of the three that he could recall, and he 7
couldn' t recall the other one.
8 There is no reason for pursuing who the 9
fourth individual is when he told you he didn't 10 have a recollection.
We're here to talk about 11 his recollection.
12 Q
A minute ago, did you have in your mind O)
(
13 the name of a fourth individual that you thought you 14 may have talked to on this subject?
15 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form and 16 instruct him not to answer.
He already told 17 you the answer to that question.
18 Q
To your knowledge, have Messrs. Zewe and i
19 Mr. Scheimann and Mr. Frederick also retained their l
20 own separate counsel?
21 A
Yes, to my knowledge.
22 Q
was the person that you had in mind a 23 moment ago by any chance Mr. Mehler?
2f MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
He 25 told you three times already that he had no
Faust 18 g
(
s 2
re colle ction.
3 I instruct him not to answer.
4 Q
Do you know Brian Mehler?
h 5
A Yes.
6 Q
Do you know whether Brian Mehler has 7
retained his own separate counsel in connection with 8
that Grand Jury investigation?
g A
As far as I know, Brian has.
10 Q
Did you have any conversations with Brian 11 Mehler at any time on that subject?
12 A
That is what I don't recall.
13 Q
Do you know the names of the counsel that 14 Mr. Zewe, Mr. Scheimann, Mr. Frederick, and Mr. Mehler 15 have retained to represent them individually?
16 A
What was the first part?
17 Q
Do you know the names of the counsel that 18 Mr. Zewe, let's take him first, has retained to 19 represent him personally?
l 20 A
As far as I know, it is the same counsel I have.
21 Q
That is the two lawye rs that are sitting 22 here today, Kevin Walsh and Jane Penny?
23 A
Plus thei r firm.
("N 24 Q
Do you know the names of the lawyers that
\\_/
25 represent Mr. Scheimann personally?
Faust 19 1
C
(_)h A
As far as I know, they would be the same 2
lawyers that represent me.
3 Q
And is that also true with Mr. Fre de ri ck ?
4 g
res.
6 E
A"d MI* M*hl*#2 A
Yes.
7 8
Q D
you know anyone employed by GPU who h as retained their own separate counsel in connection 9
10 with that Grand Jury investigation who has retained a firm other than the firms represented by Mr. Walsh gg and Ms. Penny?
12 A
The person I am thinking about would have been 13 Hal Hartman.
g4 Q
Do you know what firm Mr. Hartman 15 retained?
16 A
No, I do not.
37 18 Q
Do you know of anyone other than Mr.
gg Hartman who retained personal counsel other than Mr. Walsh's firm or Ms. Penny's firm?
20 A
No, I do not.
G 22 Q
Could you give us or tell us what 23 conversations you have had with Mr. Zewe on the
(~T 24 s ubj e ct of this Grand Jury investigation?
\\.j 25 MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking about
1 Faust 20 mU 2
retaining counsel?
Is that what you are 3
relating to now?
4 MR. FISKE:
No, I am asking a broader lhh 5
question.
6 MR. MacDONALD:
I think we're getting well 7
off the beaten track here.
I think what we 0
are here to discuss is the Three Mile Island 9
accident and not a Grand Jury investigation, 10 and not an investigation of hiring independent 11 counsel which Mr. Faust has a right to do.
12 We're wasting valuable time in a NJ 13 deposition going into a lot of irrelevant 14 mate rial that has no bearing on this case.
15 We're here to thik about the Three Mile 16 Island accident, not about who he may have 17 had conversations with in hiring outside 18 counsel.
That is just something that doesn't 19 relate to the accident.
20 MR. FISKE:
I can't think of anything 21 that would be more relevant to this accident 22 than a Grand Jury investigation as to whether l
23 criminal fraud was perpetrated in connection
[Y
\\
24 with the events leading up to the accident.
l 25 MR. MacDONALD:
Whatever the Grand Jury
Faust 23 g
,l
2 may be investigating, it has no relation as 3
we see it to the TMI-2 accident.
4 MR. FISKE:
That's what we are here to h
5 find out.
We're here to make an inquiry to 6
find out exactly the answer to that question.
7 That is precisely what I am trying to find out 8
from Mr. Faust.
9 MR. MacDONALD:
You can wait until the 10 Grand Jury comes out with their findings if 11 they do so.
12 MR. FISKE:
We're interested in the O)
(-
13 basic facts.
14 MR. MacDONALD:
You can ask the basic 15 facts as to what he understands about leak 16 rates or whatever else is involved.
As to 17 independent counse'l or discussions with the 18 Grand Jury, I instruct the witness not to answer.
19 BY MR. FISKE:
20 Q
I will ask you whether or not you have 21 had any conversations with Mr. Zewe about the Grand G
22 Jury investigation.
23 MR. MacDONALD:
I just instructed the
)
24 witness not to answer.
/
)
25 Q
Have you had any conversations with Mr.
i 4
Fcust 22 1
l
(~~)
(_/
2 Scheimann about the Grand Jury investigation?
Same instruction.
3 4
Q Has Mr. Scheimann told you what testimony llh 5
he gave to the Grand Jury in connection with this C
investigation?
7 MR. MacDONALD:
Same instruction, if he 8
ever gave any testimony to the Grand Jury.
g Q
Have you had any conversations with Mr.
10 Zewe, Mr. Scheimann, or Mr. Frederick concerning 11 whether or not false information was submitted to 12 the United States Government in connection with leek 13 rates?
14 MR. MacDONALD:
The instruction is still 15 nt to answer.
16 MR. FISKE:
You instruct him not to 17 answer that question?
18 MR. MacDONALD:
Yes.
Let me withdraw 19 that.
20 You can answer the question.
21 A
No.
O 22 Q
Did you testify before the Grand Jury?
23 A
Yes.
,e N 24 Q
Did you at any time in the course of the NA
~
25 Grand Jury questioning exercise any constitutional
y Fauot 23
/3 k-)
2 Privilege?
3 MR. MacDONALD:
Insdruct you not to
\\
4 answe r -- if he testified before the Grand Jury.
lll 5
It is not relevant to TMI-2.
If you want to ask 6
him what he knows about leak rates, it is not t
7 a' criminal case.
We're here to discuss civilly 8
what goes on.
9 MR. FISKE:
Is it your position what a 10 witness said under oath in a prior proceeding 11 is not relevant discovery?
12 MR. MacDONALD:
In relation to the
()
13 TMI-2 accident, you can ask him anything about 14 le ak rates, what he knows about it.
Other 15 than that, what he testified'to the Grand Jury, 16 my instruction is that F.e is not to answer.
17 MR. FISKE:
My question wasn't even l
18 asking him what he said.
I am asking him t
19 whether or not during the course of this Grand 20 Jury testimony he exercised any constitutional 21 Privilego.
-i 22 MR. Mcc DONALD:
Still the same instruction.
f
- 2 23 BY MR.LFISKE:
c'
("
24 Q
Will Y,ou follow that instruction?
N)T i
25 A
Yes;
(
4
,i.
. n
i 1
Fount 24
'M
\\
2 MR. MacDONALD:
It would be much easier 3
and much quickest to proceed as you suggest in 4
many of your oepositions to ask him the lll 5
questions about the leak rates, and you will 6
get the answers.
7 MR. FISKE:
I don't see why there is 8
this reluctance to have him testify as to what 9
he told a Grand Jury under oath.
10 MR. MacDONALD:
Ask him what he knows 11 about the leak rates, if that,is the thrust 12 of your questioning in that area.
()
13 MR. FISKE:
I can proceed in this 14 deposition in any way that is app ropria te 15 under the Federal Rules.
And it is clearly 16 appropriate in the course of discove ry to find 17 out what a witness has said on a prior 18 occasion under oath; and that is all I am 19 trying to do.
20 If you are instructing him not to answer, 21 at least for the moment 22 MR. MacDONALD:
For the moment, that is 23 the instruction.
)
s 24 MR. FISKE:
There is no -- at the moment L.)
25 I. will proceed to another question.
But this W -
Faust 25 g
/^N
(
)
\\/
2 is clearly an appropriate line of inquiry.
3 MR. MacDONALD:
He is instructed not to 4
answer.
lll 5
MR. FISKE:
I would like to make sure 6
that Mr. Walsh and Ms. Penny -- do you join in 7
that objection?
8 MR. WALSE:
Yes, I would certainly 9
object, if Mr. MacDonald did not, as to any 10 questions about an ongoing criminal investigation 11 before the Grand Jury.
There is a distinction 12 between an ongoing investigation and one that 13 has been completed.
14 BY MR. FISKE:
15 Q
Am I correct that Mr. Walsh and Ms. Penny 16 are representing you in connection with this Grand 17 Jury investigation that you just described?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
Do you have separate personal counsel in l
l 20 conne ction with any othe r matter relating to your l
l 21 duties at Three Mile Island Unit 2?
22 A
At this time, no.
23 Q
Did you at any time in the past?
C]/
/"
24 A
Just in regards to the Grand Jury investigation.
25 Q
My question is:
Do you now or have you
Fou3t 26
/s
()
2 in the past had separate personal counsel in e nnection with any othe r matter besides the Grand 3
4 Jury investigation?
h A
No.
5 6
Q Did you have a conversation with any 7
superior of yours at GPU on the subject of retaining 8
personal counsel in connection with this investigation?
9 MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking of any 10 nonlegal employee of GPU other than the three 11 individuals he has named?
12 MR. FISKE:
Any superior.
(
13 MR. MacDONALD:
You are meaning it to 14 include one of those three individuals if they 15 happened to be a superior of his?
16 MR. FISKE:
Yes.
17 A
Not that I recall, no.
18 Q
Mr. Zewe is not a superior of yours?
19 A
I already included him.
I understood you to 20 mean othe r than those that I just stated.
21 Q
In other words,.other than --
22 MR. S ELTZE R:
That is what I thought the 23 question was.
(^T 24 Q
Other than Mr. Zewe, you have had no
()
25 conversation with any supe rior of yours at Met Ed on
1 Faust 27 Ik/
2 the subject of your retaining separate counsel?
3 MR. MacDONALD: Other than Mr. Scheimann, 4
Mr. Frederick and Mr. Zeve?
llh 5
Q Are Mr. Zewe and Mr. Fre de ri ck and Mr.
6 Scheimann all s upe riors of yours?
7 A
No.
8 Q
Which one of thos e three -- whi ch o f 9
those three is a superior of yours?
10 A
At the time, Bill Zewe and Fred Scheimann.
11 Q
Then my question, and I think I know the 12 answer, but let's get it straight, other than Mr. Zewe 13 and Mr. Scheimann, have you had any conversations 14 with anyone who is a superior of yours at Met Ed or 15 GPU on the subject of your retaining separate counsel?
16 A
Not that I recall.
17 Q
Can you tell us what you s aid to Mr. Zewe 18 and what he said to you in the first conve rsation you 19 had with him on that subject?
20 MR. MacDONALD:
Instruct him not to answer.
21 This is even f arther afield than what we have 22 been in before.
It is just on the matter of 23 retaining independent counsel, and it is the
(~}
24 right of every witness to do it, and it does
'wd 25 not relate to the TMI-2 accident.
Faust 28 g
O 2
MR. FISKE:
We don't know that until we 3
hear the answer.
4 MR. MacDONALD:
I don't think that is 5
true.
I think he is entitled to retain 6
independent counsel.
7 MR. FISKE:
No suggestion is being made 8
here th at Mr. Faust doesn't have the right to 9
retain as many individual counsel as he desires.
10 My point is that we're entitled to 11 conversations he had with Mr. Zewe on the reason 12 why he did.
We're entitled to find out
(~~
13 whether that, as you suggest, has anything to 14 do with the Three Mile Island accident.
15 We won 't know until he answers the question.
16 If it doesn't, we'll move on to something else.
17 BY MR. FISKE:
18 Q
can you answer that?
19 (Discussion off the re cord ensued.)
20 MR. FISKE:
Read the question back.
21 (Re cord read. )
22 MR. Ma cDONALD:
I instruct the witness not l
23 to answer.
(-s) 24 Q
Did Mr. Zewe tell you that there was a l
l 25 Potential conflict of interest between your position l
l
1 Faust 29 O
i t
2 and that of Met Ed in connection with this Grand Jury 3
investigation?
4 MR. MacDONALD:
Same instruction.
lh 5
Don't answer.
6 Q
Did Mr. Zewe tell you that the testimony 7
that you might give in connection with this 0
investigation could be damagin? to Met Ed or GPU in 9
connection with the Three Mile Island accident?
10 MR. MacDONALD:
Same instruction.
11 Q
Have you had any conversations with Mr.
12 Zewe, Mr. Scheimann, or Mr. Frede ri ck ab out the
\\
(_/
13 ef fect which your testimony in the Grand Jury might 14 have on the pending civil litigation brought by GPU 15 against Babcock & Wilcox?
16 MR. MacDONALD:
Same instruction, if it 17 relates to what he testified to before the Grand 18 Jury or its effect for the same reasons as 19 stated before in the ongoing investigation.
20 Q
Have you had any conve rsations with Mr.
21 Zewe on whether the information that you have about 22 the leak rate situation could have a damaging effect 23 on GPU's case against Babcock & Wilcox?
24 MR. MacDONALD:
You can answer that, if 25 you recall.
Faust 30 g
\\~'
2 A
I don't believe I had a conversation with Bill 3
Zewe like that, that I remember.
4 Q
Or Mr. Scheimann?
llh 5
A Or Mr. Scheimann.
6 Q
Or fr. Frederick?
7 A
Or Mr. Frederick.
8 Q
Have you had any conversation with any one 9
of the three of them as to whether the information 10 that you have given the Grand Jury could have such 11 an effe ct?
12 MR. MacDONALD:
I instruct him not to 13 answer on the testimony before the Grand Jury.
14 Q
In addition to testifying before the Grand 15 Jury, have you given testimony on prior occasions in 16 other proceedings?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
Kaye you ever been a witness in a civil 19 deposition before?
Withdrawn.
i l
20 Have you ever been a witness in a 21 p rivat e civil action?
O 22 A
As far as I know, no.
i l
23 Q
Now, you recall, I assume, giving
(~}
24 testimony on a number of different occasions before
'\\_/
25 various investigative bodies concerning the events t
Faust 31 2
leading up to and including the accident at Three 3
Mile Island on March 28, 19797 4
MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form; 5
the assumption.
6 You can answer the question without that.
7 Q
Let's make it very simple.
Do you recall 8
ever giving any testimony anywhere to anybody on the 9
events leading up to and including the accident that 10 occurred at Three Mile Island on March 28, 19797 11 A
Yes.
12 Q
Do you recall being interviewed on March O J 13 29, 1979 together with Mr. Frederick by someone named 14 W.
G.
(Bubba} Marsh all?
15 A
Yes.
16 Q
Who is Mr. Marshall?
17 MR. MacDONALD :
Currently, or who he was 18 at the time?
19 Q
Who is he now?
20 A
I don' t know what Mr. Marshall's title is at 21 this time.
22 Q
Is he still with GPU?
23 A
Yes.
()
24 MR. MacDONALD:
Have we e st ablishe d 25 that he was with GPU?
g Faust 32 i
\\-
2 Q
Is he with GPU today?
A The last time I was at the Island, he was.
3 4
Q And was he with GPU on March 29, 1979?
5 A
I don' t know at the time if it was GPU he was 6
labeled as being with, or Metropolitan Edison separate.
7 Q
What did you understand his position was?
8 A
At the time he was involved with surveillance.
9 Q
At TMI-27 10 A
Yes.
11 Q
Do you know what his exact title was?
. 12 A
No.
O()
13 Q
Had you met him before March 29, 1979?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Eow did it come about that you had this 16 interview with Mr. Marshall?
17 A
As far as I remembe.", Mr. Marshall was assigned 18 by who, I don't know, to cake down initial events 19 that we recollected at the time leading up to the 20 accident.
21 Q
I take it you met with Mr. Marshall?
g 22 A
Yes.
l l
23 Q
And Mr. Frederick was also there?
l I
(~)
24 A
Yes.
l
\\_/
l 25 Q
Was there anyone else there?
l l
1 Faust 33 3
~
2 A
No.
3 Q
Where did this meeting take place?
4 A
At the Observation Center at Three Mile Island.
h 5
Q where is that in relation to the --
6 A
Located across Highway 441 directly across from 7
the field.
8 Q
Were you in a room with Mr. Marshall and 9
Mr. Fre d e rick, a separate room?
10 A
Where we were at was -- the Observation Center 11 was being used -- we were on the stairway going up to 12 a platform that looks out over the Island.
A/
13 Q
How long did this interview t ak e pl a ce,
14 or how long did it take?
15 A
I don't remember.
16 Q
Did Mr. Marshall ask you questions and 17 you gave answers?
18 A
Mr. Marshall asked questions, but the extent of 19 it was just myself and Ed relating as best we could at 20 the time what took place.
It was more just Bubba 21 copying down what we were saying than him actually 22 asking us questions.
23 Q
You were talking and he was writing?
/'
24 A
Yes.
\\_j)'
i l
25 Q
Did you -- was the information that you
I Faust 34 0
2 gave to Mr. Marshall at that time accurate to the 3
best of your ability?
4 MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking about h
5 what he said to Mr. Marshall?
6 MR. FISKE:
Yes.
7 MR. MacDONALD:
Not necessarily what Mr.
8 Marshall wrote down.
9 Q
Was what you told Mr. Marshall the truth 10 as you best understood it at that time?
11 A
I am not sure what I told Mr. Marshall righ t 12 now any more, but when we were talking to him, we 13 were trying to tell him as best we remembered what 14 occurred, the sequence as we remembered it.
15 Q
What you told him on that day was what 16 you best remembe red at that time; is that correct?
17 MR. MacDONALD:
As to what specifically 18 he was asked?
19 A
Yes.
20 Q
I believe you indicated that Mr. Marshall 21 was making notes as you were talking?
22 A
Yes.
We had to wait for him to write down what 23 we were saying.
(~)
24 Q
A6d'after this interview with Mr.
LJ 25 Marshall was over, did he tell you that you would be
Faust 35 g
2 given an opportunity to see what he had written down?
3 A
We were reading what he was writing down at 4
the time.
llh 5
Q During the time that he was writing things 6
down did you make any corrections in anything that 7
he was writing?
8 MR. MacDONALD:
As to whethe r he read every 9
word?
10 MR. FISKE:
I am j us t asking if he made 11 any corrections to what he was writing.
12 MR. MacDONALD:
Did he see eve ry word n/
x, 13 to make eve ry correction in every word?
14 MR. FISKE:
I am just asking if he made 15 any corrections.
16 A
While -- when we were taking this deposition --
17 not a deposition, an interview, we had just come 18 off a whole shift that mo rnin g, and we were trying to i
19 get down the initial events that took place that we 20 recalled as best we remembered them.
Mr. Marshall 21 was writing them down, and the things we were 22 correcting, if we were correcting anything, was just 23 go back over and tell him it didn't occur at that 24 point.
He might have been writing it out of 25 sequence as we were talking.
We were trying to keep
1 Faust 36
[vh 2
it in order.
This was not supposed to be the final 3
interview.
It was just a preliminary thing to get 4
our thoughts down about the accident.
llk 5
Q What time of day was this?
6-A As best I can re call, I believe it was around, 7
I think it was 8:00 o' clock in the morning after 8
shift.
9 Q
Eight o' clock on March 29th?
10 A
Yes.
11 Q
Kow long was the shift that you had been 12 on?
13 A
An eight-hour shift.
14 Q
Did Mr. Marshall after this interview 15 was over prepare a typed memorandum setting f o rth 16 what you had said?
17 MR. MacDONALD:
What he wrote down?
18 A
I don't know if he did type it up.
19 Q
Did you ever see a typed version of Mr.
20 Marshall's notes?
21 A
Not that I recall, no.
22 Q
Have you ever seen Mr. Marshall's notes l
23 since March 29, 19797
/~h 24 A
I am not sure.
I may have.
I have seen enough L-]
25 documents that I am not sure if I saw it again or not.
Fcuot 37 j
1 (O
2 MR. FISKE:
Let us mark as B &W Exhibit 3
257 a document which reads, "The following 4
statement was dictate d to W.
G.
(Bubba) Marshall lll 5
by Ed Frederick and Craig Faust at approximately 6
0500, March 29, 1979.
A copy of the handwritten 7
transcript is attached."
We will mark as 8
Exhibit 257 both the typed statement and the 9
handwritten notes.
10 (Handwritten notes of statement 11 written by W. G. Marshall as dictated to him 12 by E.
Frederick and Craig Faust on March 29, 13 1979, together with typed version of the same, 14 marked B&W Exhibit 257 for identification, as 15 of this date.)
16 BY MR. FISKE:
17 Q
I show you what has been marked B&W 18 Exhibit 257 and ask you whether or not you have seen 19 that document before today.
20 A
I don' t recall if I did or not.
21 Q
Does that answer that you just gave apply 22 both to the typed portion of Exhibit 257 and also the 23 written, handwritten portion?
(}
24 A
The typed section I don't remember seeing.
The 25 written portion could have been what Bubba was writing
1 Faust 38 1
O N-]
2 down at that time.
I don't remembe r if this is the 3
specific one.
4 Q
My question is, just so you understand it, 4lh 5
any time after March 29, 1979, up to the present time 0
have you reviewed either those h andwritte n notes or 7
that typed s tatement, Exhibit 257?
8 A
That is what I don't remember.
9 Q
I would like you to read that typed 10 statement.
We will come back to that.
11 (Recess taken.)
12 MR. FISKE:
Mr. MacDonald has indicated 13 that Mr. Faust wants to make a correction to 14 a prior answer.
15 MR. MacDONALD:
I think it is a 16 clarification of that conversation that he 17 was speaking of earlier with Mr. Scheimann and 18 Mr. Frederick and Mr. Zewe, asking him a 19 question, was anyone else present at that 20 discussion.
21 MR. FISKE:
Would you like to make a 22 clarification with respect to an answer that you 23 gave about the interview that you had with Mr.
f~}
24 Marshall?
v 25 MR. !!acDONALD:
I'm sorry.
It was not i
1 Faust 39 O
2 the interview with Mr. Marshall.
It was 3
earlier when you were talking about Mr.
4 Scheimann and Mr. Frederick and Mr. Zewe, lll 5
conversations regarding independent counsel.
6 MR. FISKE:
Why don't you just let Mr.
l 7
Faust state whatever it is he wants to 8
correct or clarify in a prior answer.
9 BY MR. FISKE:
10 g
Do you have something you want to correct 11 or clarify to an answer you gave e a rlie r?
12 A
I was trying to sey that you were asking who s/
13 was in the group there, and I was saying it was Mr.
14 Wilson, counsel for GPU.
15 MR. MacDONALD:
Which he didn't 16 understand necessarily, the distinction that was 17 set out in the qudstion as set forth.
18 g
Just before the break, I gave you a copy 19 of what has been marked as Exhibit 257, and I would 20 like you to read the typed part of that exhibit which r
21 consists of about two and a half pages.
22 You can read the handwritten material, 23 if you want to.
My questions are only going to be I
24 with respect to the typed portion.
C) 25 The question is:
As you read this
i 1
Faust 40 1
i f3 s_/
2 exhibit today, is there anything in the written 3
statement which you recognize as not accurately 4
' reflecting what you or Mr. Frederick told Mr. Marshall lll 5
on March 29, 39797 6
MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking whether 7
he recalls saying these things to Mr. Marshall?
8 MR. FISKE:
No, I am asking whether, as 9
he reads this, he sees anything in there that 10 does not accurately reflect what he or Mr.
11 Frederick told Mr. Marshall.
12 MR. MacDONALD:
If he has a recollection
()
13 of what he told Mr. Marshall other than what 14 Mr. Marshall has typed up in B&W 257 15 A
What I am reading here, the typed portion of 16 this, doesn't seem to be the exact sequence of the 17 events that occurred.
18 Q
My question is whether or not this 19 doc ume nt, as you look at it, has anything in it that 20 you recognize as not accurately reflecting what you 21 told Mr. Marshall on that day.
22 MR. MacDONALD:
If he has a recollection 23 of what he told Mr. Marshall that day, which I g-~
24 don' t think you have established.
I don'.t 25 think that is a fact that has come out on the l
l
1 Faust 41 2
re cord, established that he had a conve rs ation 3
and related some things.
I don' t think wh at 4
is necessarily in this typed version you lll 5
established is what he told Mr. Marshall.
6 You are trying to tie it now to a 7
th re e-p a ge typed cocument.
8 Q
Based on whatever recollection you have 9
today of that conversation with Mr. Marshall, is there 10 anything in Exhibit 257 which you recognize now as 11 inaccurately reflecting what you told Mr. Marshall on 12 March 29th?
O(_,
13 MR. MacDON ALD:
1 object to the form.
14 I don't think you established he has a 15 re collection of him telling Mr. Marshall any of 16 those things.
17 Q
You can answer the question.
18 A
I am not sure of what I told Mr. Marshall.
That's 19 my problem right now.
What I am reading right now, 20 some of it doesn' t seem the way it should be.
21 Q
Wh at do you mean by it doesn't seem what 22 it should be?
23 MR. MacDONALD:
I instruct him not to
("N 24 answer unless he is talking about his
\\_)
25 recollection at the time.
That's what you were
l 1
Faust 42 I\\#
2 aiming at, not what it is today.
Your 3
question was directed to what his recollection 4
is.
llh 5
Q The question is as you read this statement 6
today, is there anything in there that you now 7
recognize based on whatever recollection you have 8
now of the conve rsation with Mr. Marshall that 9
inaccurately reflects what you said to him on that 10 day?
He just told you that he 12 doesn't remember what he told Mr. Marshall in
(_)
13 terms of a recollection, so'how is he going to 14 relate that to what you have in the document?
15 MR. FISKE:
He hasn't answered the 16 question whether he recalls or not.
17 MR. MacDONALD:
He told you in a prior 18 answer he does n' t remembe r.
He is not sure 19 what he told Mr. Marshall that day.
It is a 20 lack of recollection.
I think that you are just 21 asking the same question a gai n.
22 Q
Is pour mind a blank as to what you told 23 Mr. Marshall back on March 29th, 19797 f'}
24 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking what his xs 25 recollection is, if he has any about what he
1 Faust 43
(~h
(
2 told Mr. Marshall that day.
3 MR. FIS KE :
I think that is what my 4
question is designed to find out.
lh 5
A My mind is not a total blank to the fact that 6
I talked to Bubba Marshall.
What I don't recall is 7
exactly what I said to Bubba Marshall about it.
I 8
just remember trying to get basic events that 9
occurred down with Bubba Marshall.
It was later to 10 be used to try to build the whole story of what 11 occurred. That is why this typed document doesn't 12 look right to me right now.
I don't know if I K-13 reviewed it or not.
14 Q
When you say it does n' t look right to 15 you, what do you mean?
16 A
It just doesn't look right.
I have to sit down 17 and talk about each phrase.
Some of it I don't 18 remember. I wouldn't have been the man who actually 19 said it, for one thing, because I wasn't in the 20 position to talk ab out it.
I don't recall what 21 pressure was in the primary system.
G l
22 Q
This was an interview Mr. Marshall had 23 with you and Mr. Fre de rick ; is that correct?
r~s (V
4 24 A
Yes.
This is an interview, I assume this is 25 the interview, what I'm thinking about.
One that i
e
Faust 44
,O i 2
would look more like the inte rview I had with Marshall 3
would be the handwritten statements in the back.
)
4 Q
If it makes it any easier for you to lh 5
read the handwritten portion than the typed portion, 6
why don' t you do that?
7 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking him to 8
read it?
9 MR. FISKE:
Yes.
10 (Discussion off the record ensued 11 between the witness and his counsel.)
12 Q
Having read the handwritten portion of 13 this exhibit, do you have any basis for saying P.o d ay 14 that these notes do not accurately reflect what you 15 and Mr. Fre de rick told Mr. Marshall?
16 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
17 Again, I think he already testified three times 18 that he doesn't remember the conversation, the 19 s ubs tan ce of the conversation, othe r than having 20 it with Mr. Marshall.
Whether or not he is 21 looking at the typed version or the handwritten 22 version, he doesn't recall.
23 MR. FISKE:
One of the purposes of 24 having Mr. Faust read the handwritten portion 25 of this was to see whethe r or not it might
1 Faust 45 7_
i 2
refresh his recollection, and I would like to 3
h ave an answer to the ques ti on.
4 MR. MacDONALD:
The facts are the same.
llh 5
MR. FISKE:
Let's let him answer the 6
question.
7 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
8 I will let him answer.
9 MR. FISKE:
I think we're f amiliar with 10 your obj ection.
We heard it three times.
11 MR. MacDONALD:
Twice he said he doesn't 12 recall the conversation.
D)
(_,
13 BY MR. FISKE:
14 Q
The question to which Mr. MacDonald has 15 adequately preserved his objection is whether, having 16 read the handwritten portion of this exhibit, you 17 have any basis today for saying that these handwritten 18 notes do not accurately reflect what you and Mr.
19 Frederick told Mr. Marshall on March 29th.
l 20 MR. MacDONALD:
My obj ection stands at 21 this point.
22 MR. TISKE :
Yes, it does.
23 A
My answer is, I really don't recall exactly if
(~)3 24 this is what we told him or not, if this is the
\\m 25 actual document he wrote down.
If this represents
1 Faust 46 n
2 actually what he wrote down.
I coul dn' t re cognize 3
it any more at this point in time.
It is too long.
4 Q
So we can move on to something else, is lh 5
it your testimony that you simply don't recall one 6
way or the other whether these notes reflect 7
accurately what you told him, Mr. Marshall?
8 A
I don't recall.
9 MR. FISKE:
Could we mark this next 10 exhibit as B&W 258.
11 (Typed document, 12 pages, entitled 12 "TMI Staf f Inte rview, Craig Faust, 0400 hours0.00463 days <br />0.111 hours <br />6.613757e-4 weeks <br />1.522e-4 months <br />, 13 March 30, 1979, conducted by R.
Long and D.
14 Reppe rt, " was marked B&W Exhibit 258 for 15 identification, as of this date.)
16 Q
I show you a typed document consisting 17 of 12 pages marked Exhibit B&W 258, entitled "TMI 18 Staff Interview, Craig Faust, 0400 hours0.00463 days <br />0.111 hours <br />6.613757e-4 weeks <br />1.522e-4 months <br />, Ma rch 30, 19 1979, conducted by R.
Long and D.
Peppert."
20 Do you have that document in front of you?
21 A
Yes.
22 Q
Do you remember being interviewed by Mr.
23 Long and Mr. Reppert on March 30, 19797
(~)
24 A
I remember being interviewed by Mr. Long and V
i 25 somebody else.
I guess it was Reppert.
Faust 47
\\"-
2 MR. MacDONALD:
Just your testimony as to 3
what you recall, not what you guess.
4 A
I remember being interviewed by Mr. Long and llk 5
somebody else.
I don't remember who the other man was.
6 Q
Where did that interview take place?
7 A
I have talked to Mr. Long more than one place.
8 I am not sure which place this took place, the 9
interview,would have been taking place at this point.
10 It was on the Island.
11 Q
Do you recall being interviewed by Mr.
12 Long on more than one occasion?
13 A
Yes.
14 Q
Who is Mr.
R.
Long?
15 A
I believe he was with GPU.
16 Q
Had you met him before the firs t time that 17 he interviewed you following the accident?
18 A
Not that I recall, no.
19 Q
Do you know what his position was then i
20 with GPU7 21 A
I still don' t know his position.
22 Q
How did it come about that you had this 23 interview?
b(~N 24 MR. MacDONALD:
You are speaking now 25 about the inte rview with Mr. Long, not
1 Faust 48 i\\_
2 necessarily what is reflected in B&W 258.
3 You are speaking generally now of the interview 4
he recalls with Mr. Long?
llh 5
MR. FISKE:
Let's start with the first 6
one.
7 Q
How did you first meet Mr. Long?
O A
In the interview.
9 Q
How did it come about that you had that 10 meeting with Mr. Long?
11 A
I don' t remember who told me, but I was sent
.12 by my supervisory personnel.
I believe it was I
O V
13 would be taking a guess.
I don't remember who sent 14 me there, but I was directed to go to the interview 15 with Mr. Long.
16 Q
one of your supe rvisors told you that you 17 were supposed to go have an interview with Mr. Long?
18 A
That's right.
19 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
20 (Discussion off the record ensued 21 between the witness and his counsel.)
22 Q
on how many separate occasions were you 23 interviewed by Mr. Long?
)
24 A
I don' t re call.
25 Q-Do you recall now that there was more than
1 Faust 49 O) 2 one?
3 A
Yes.
4 Q
Do you recall whether there was more than llh 5
one at which Mr. Long was accompanied by someone else?
6 A
From what I can recall, there was more than one 7
whe n I talked to Mr. Long normally.
8 Q
What do you mean by "normally"?
9 A
At interviews that I had attended, there were 10 normally more than one person there.
11 Q
Interviews with Mr. Long?
12 A
Mr. Long, yes.
I don't recall being at an
(')
\\/
13 interview with Mr. Long himself only.
14 Q
Did Mr. Long in any of these interviews 15 ask you questions and then have you provide answers?
16 A
No.
17 Q
Did he ask you at any of these interviews 18 to provide information to him about what had happened 19 during the accident?
20 A
Yes.
21 Q
And at the time you talked to Mr. Long, 22 did you make an effort to give him information that 23 was as accurate as you understood it to be at the
[
24 time?
k j
25 A
Yes, I attempted to do that.
Faust 50 g
(v 2
Q Directing your attention now to Exhibit 3
258 and specifically to Page 12 at the bottom, do 4
you see a signature at the bottom of Page 127 h
5 A
Yes.
6 Q
Do you recognize that signature?
7 A
It looks like my signature.
8 Q
Can you tell us now how it came about 9
that your signature appears on the last page of this 10 document?
11 MR. MacDONALD:
I would like him to have 12 an opportunity to read the document before he O\\M 13 answers any further questions.
14 Q
Have you finished reading this document?
.s 15 A
Yes.
16 Q
I think the pending question is:
Can you 17 tell us how it came about that your signature is on 18 the last page?
19 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking if he 20 recalls signing the document?
21 A
I am not sure why my signature would be on the
(
22 last page of it.
23 Q
Is your answer you don't know why?
[ ')
24 A
I don't know.
v i
25 Q
You don't know why your signature is on l
s
{
g l
1
?
T4.uat 53 e
the las't page of the doc.2 ment?
2 IIE. MacDONALD:
That iu' what he just told you.
4 Q
t fter you had the interview with Mr. Long, G
5 did y u re elve a typed set of questions ar.d answers 6
which purported to be questions and answers that.we're 7
nta ned in de int e niew ?
8 MR. MacDONALD:
'I think h'e testified that
)
g he had more than one 10 Q
After any one of the inte rviews with Mr.
g L ng, did you receive a typed question-and-caswer 12 13 14 MR. NacDONALD:
You a re asking for'his 15 recollection?
16 MR. FISKE:
Yes, I am asking for his 17 recollection.
18 A
I believe I did.
I receited_ copies of the 19 interviews that I had been at.
I don't remember 15 20 this specific one was one of them.
I assume it was.
21 MR. MacDONALD:
He is not askirig for your 22 speculation.
l 23 Q
As you sit here today, you do renceber.
O) 24 that after at least one interview with Mr. Long you
\\w 25 received a typed question-and-answer statement; is t
3-
l 1
Faust 52
/~'
(_)N 2
that correct?
3 MR. MacDONALD:
I object.
I don't think 4
that was his testimony.
llh 5
Q Is that your testimony?
6 A
I don't specifically recall which ones I 7
received.
I received typed questions and answers 8
from testimony that I had given.
That is what I g
recall.
10 Q
And do you recall on those occasions when 11 you received typed questions and answers that you
.12 reviewed them?
O I
l A'
13 A
I recall reviewing question-and-answer 14 statements of interviews that I received.
15 g
Do you recall on certain of those 1G occasions when you reviewed question-and-answer 17 statements, after you reviewed them, you signed them?
18 A
I don't remember if I signed them all.
19 Q
Do you remember if you signed any?
20 A
I signed some of them, yes.
21 Q
Were the question-and-answer statements 22 that you recall reviewing and signing question-and-23 answer statements of interviews conducted by Met Ed i
[~)
24 or GPU?
U 25 MR. MacDONALD:
Were they exclusively
g Faust 53 rm 2
those or did they include those?
3 Q
Let's start wtih the fi rs t.
4 MR. MacDONALD:
Could you, please.
lll 5
g LContinuingl The document 258, which has 6
your signature on it, is a typed que stion-and-answer 7
statement of an interview cor. ducted of you by Mr.
8 R.
Long.
9 In addition to that document, do you 10 recall signing any other question-and-answer 11 statements of inte rviews conducted of you by Met Ed 12 or GPU?
)
13 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form of 14 the question, because he previously testified 15 he doesn't recall signing that document 16 necessarily.
He told you he recalls signing 17 some documents that he received transcripts of.
18 MR. FISKE:
The record is very clear.
19 MR. MacDONALD:
That is fine.
20 MR. FISKE ' I am referring to an exhibit, 21 258, which states, "Staf f Inte rview of Craig i
22 Faust conducted by R.
Long," who has been l
23 identified as an employee of GPU, and l
(~T 24 it has Mr. Faust's signature on it.
Exhibit
\\_)
25 25 8 is a question-and-answer statement signed 1
I 1
Faust 54
/~N 2
by Mr. Faust of a staff interview conducted 3
by R.
Long, who has been identified as an 4
employee of GPU.
llh 5
BY MR. FISKE:
6 Q
I am asking you in addition to this 7
document, 258, do you recall signing any other 8
que s tion-and-answer statements of interviews 9
conducted 'f you by anyone at Met Ed or GPU?
o 10 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
11 I don't think you asked him whether or not he 12 signed this one.
You asked him whether or 13 not that is his signature.
14 MR. FISKE:
Your obj ection is noted.
15 Q
will you answer the question?
16 A
I answer the question the same way I was 17 saying.
I just remember signing some of the 18 documents I received to review in general.
I don't 19 specifically recall which ones I signed.
20 Q
Just so we can understand, do you 21 recall now signing any question-and-answe r statement 22 of any interview that was conducted of you by somebody 23 other th an someone at GPU or Met Ed?
n
(
)
24 A
What I can't do is separate which ones I have l
\\/
l 25 signed.
I have signed documents of interviews.
I
1 Faust 55 2
don't remember which ones I have signed.
3 g
Do you recall giving testimony in 4
question-and-answer form to representatives of the lll 5
President's Commission, investigating the Three Mile 6
Island accident?
7 A
I remember giving -- I remember talking with 8
the President's Commission, yes.
9 Q
And do you recall that that testisony 10 was under oath?
11 A
Yes.
.12 g
And was there a court reporter there s-13 taking it down the same way we have a court reporter
,14 here taking this down?
15 A
Yes.
16 g
And after you finished that testimony, 17 at some point, did you receive a copy of that 18 testimony to review?
19 MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking in 20 each instance?
There may have been more than 21 one instance he testified before the President's 22 commission.
23 g
now many times did you testify in any
()
24 kind of a proceeding involving the President's 25 Commission?
l l
1 Faust 56 l
2 A
I believe it was four times, but I am not sure 3
of that.
4 Q
You mean four separate days?
lll 5
A It would have been separate days.
6 Q
Do you recall a time when representatives 7
of the President's Commission came to Three Mile j
8 Island?
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
And did you give testimony to them up 11 there at Three Mile Island?
12 A
Yes.
O 13 Q
Was that on successive days?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Af ter that, after they left, sometime 16 after that, did you receive a transcript containing 17 questions and answers relating to that testimony?
18 A
I received three parts of a transcript.
I 19 re ceive d.three loose-leaf binders, if you want, that 20 had President's Commission depositions in it on me.
21 Q
were you asked to review those transcripts 22 and make any corrections you wanted to make?
23 A
Yes.
r-(_)T 24 Q
Did you make such a review of the 25 transcript?
1 Faust 57
^h (G
2 A
Yes.
3 Q
When you were through, did you make 4
whatever corrections you wanted to make?
lll 5
A Yes.
6 Q
Did you include those corrections on an 7
errata sheet?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
And you signed that transcript at that 10 Points is that correct?
11 A
Yes.
12 Q
When you gave that testimony to the O
\\/*
13 representatives of the President's Commission at 14 Three Mile Island under oath, did you tell them the 15 truth?
16 A
I told them to the best of my ability what I 17 recall.
18 Q
And when you reviewed' the transcript after 19 the testimony was over, did you make an effort to 20 correct anything in that transcript that you felt 21 was inaccurate?
O 22 A
I attempted to make corrections, if I thought 23 it needed it, as best I could recall the incident 24 occurring.
25 Q
So that you were satisfied at the time
1 Faust 58 t"'t 2
you signed it that to the best of your recollection 3
at that time the transcript was accurate?
4 MR. MacDONALD:
You mean including all llh 5
of the questions and assumptions or whatever 6
that may have been built in the questions that 7
were in the transcript?
8 Q
Can you answer the question?
9 A
At the time I was giving testimony to the 10 President's Commission, I attempted to --
11 Q
Tell the truth?
12 A
Give the best recollection I could the way the 13 questions might have been phrased to me.
Some of 14 that testimony was in a form where they would ask me 15 almost like what was going on.
I would not only be 16 saying -- they would ask in the form of not only for 17 me as I might have known the fact, but what I had 18 known, what my perception of the accident was.
19 Q
But whatever the question was, you l
20 answered it truthfully?
21 A
I tried, yes.
De finitely to answer it 22 truthfully.
23 Q
And when you went through the transcript
/~T 24 after you received it and reviewed it, did you see any V
25 answer in there that you felt was untruthful?
1 Faust 59 O
2 A
Not that I can recall, no.
3 Q
In addition to giving testimony to the 4
President's Commission when they came to Three Mile lll 5
Island, did you ever go to Washington and appear 6
before the full President's Commission?
7 A
Yes.
8 Q
And you testified there under oath as well?
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
And did you answer the questions that you 11 were asked during that proceeding truthfully?
12 A
To the best of my recollection, yes.
13 Q
Did you ever see a transcript of that 14 testimony afterwards?
15 A
I don't recall that one.
I don't remember 16 reading it.
17 Q
Af te rwa rds ?
18 A
Afterwards.
19 Q
Did you also give testimony before any 20 committees of Congress?
21 A
Yes.
O l
22 Q
Can you tell us which committees of 23 Congress you testified before?
()
24 A
I believe it was Senator Udall's committee.
25 g
were you under oath when you gave that
Faust 60 0
2 testimony?
3 A
I don't remember if I was or not.
4 Q
Whethe r you were under oath or not, did lll 5
you answer the questions truthfully?
6 A
To the best I recall at the time I tried to 7
answer what I knew at that point.
8 Q
Truthfully?
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
Did you testify before Senator Hart's 11 committee?
12 A
Yes.
I testified before Hart, yes, 13 Q
Again, when you were asked, were you 14 under oath at that time?
15 A
I lost track of when I was under oath or not.
16 I believe I was.
I don't remember.
17 Q
Whether you were under oath or not, did 18 you answer the questions truthfully?
19 A
I always tried to answer the questions 20 truthfully, yes.
21 Q
Every time you have been questioned by 22 anyone about this incident, you have attempted to 23 answer the questions truthfully, to the best of your
,m i
24 ability?
25 A
Yes.
1 Faust 61 7O 2
Q whether you were under oath or not?
3 A
Yes.
4 Q
Did you also testify before h
5 representatives of the Special Inquiry Group for the 6
Nuclear Regulatory Commission, the so-called Rogovin 7
Commission?
O A
I testified to the NRC, yes, the Rogovin 9
Commission.
10 Q
.Do you recall --
11 A
I was testifying before a commission.
Let's put 12 it that way.
OO 13 Q
Do you recall testifying before the 14 Commission when there was a court reporter taking down 15 questions and answers?
16 A
I don't recall if there was or not.
17 Q
Do you remember ever seeing a transcript 18 of testimony that you gave before the Rogovin 19 Commission?
20 A
I don't remember at this point seeing it.
21 g
no you remember being interviewed also 22 by various representatives of the NRC at various times?
23 A
Yes.
24 Q
And did you ever -- did you tell the 25 truth to those individuals to the best of your
g Faust 61-A 2
ability?
3 A
I tried to, yes.
As much as I could remember.
I 4
Q Did you ever see a transcript of any of i
lh 5
those interviews?
6 A
I have seen transcripts of NRC interviews, yes.
7 Just separating them out is the problem.
8 (Whereupon, at 22:40 o' clock p.m.,
a 9
luncheon recess was taken.)
10 11
. 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 EI 22 23 p
24 K.
25
1 62
/')
2 AFTERNOON SESSION i
(
3 3:45 P.M.
4 CRAIG C.
- FAUST, Resumed.
5 EXAMINATION (CONTINUED) 6 BY MR. FISKE l
7 Q
You realize you are still under oath?
8 A
Yes.
9 CResume o f Mr. Faus t's education and 10 work experience was marked B&W Exhibit 259 for 11 identification, as of this date.)
12 Q
I show you what has been marked Exhibit V
13 259 i'or identification and ask you if you recognize 14 that as a: copy of a resume which you submitte d to 15 the President's Commission.
16 MR. MacDONALD:
The whole four pages or 17 the first two?
18 A
I remember these two pages is what I made up.
19 I don' t remember the last parts of it.
20 Q
The first two page.
Is it correct you 21 prepared the first two pages?
22 A
Yes.
23 Q
For the President's Commission?
b 24 A
Yes.
G 25 Q
And that was accurate when you prepared
i Faust 63 I
o 2
it?
A To the best of my recollection, yes.
3 4
Q Did you graduate from high school?
lll 5
A Yes.
6 Q
That is indicated here as Shamokin Area 7
Kigh School in Pennsylvania?
8 A
Sh amokin.
9 Q
That was in 19657 10 A
Yes.
11 Q
And the resume indicates that you attended 12 Shippensburg State Col,lege in Shippensburg, D\\
(_)
13 Pennsylvani a from September 1965 to March 1966.
Is 14 that accurate?
15 A
Yes, to the best of my recollection.
16 Q
Why did you leave Shippensburg State 17 College?
18 A
Because at the end of the second semester I 19 received a notice that I should take time and 20 reconside r how serious I was in my education at the 21 time.
22 Q
Who did that notice come from-23 A
The dean, I imagine.
It was a f or:
(~)
24 It was probably sent out to more than just
\\_/
25 Q
In any event, you received it?
Faust 64 g
2 A
Yes.
3 Q
Did you testify before the President 's 4
Commission that you had failed out of Shippensburg h
5 State College?
6 3
y,,,
7 Q
Was that correct?
0 A
That was along the lines of the letter, as best 9
I recall it.
10 Q
The resume indicates that in November 11 1966 you had joined the United States Navy; is that 12 correct?
13 A
Yes.
14 Q
And you stayed in the Navy until November 15 1973; is that correct?
16 A
Ye8-17 Q
About seven years?
18 A
Approximately.
i 19 Q
As I read this resume, and tell me if I 20 am incorrect, from February 1967 to June of 1967, you 21 attended machinist's mate Class A school.
22 A
That is what I have down here, yes.
23 Q
Where was that?
O 24 A
That was located up in Great Lakes.
'd 25 Q
Was that part of any particular program in
1 Faust 65 O('h 2
the Navy ?
3 A
I was slanted to be a machinist's mate in the 4
Navy, and that was part of a school for machinist's lll 5
mates.
6 Q
was that school specifically oriented 7
towards nuclear reactors?
8 A
It was general -- that school was slanted 9
towards general theory on pump and valves operations.
10 I am not sure what all else it went into.
11 Q
Pump and valves on any kind of Navy
.12 equipment?
(~
13 A
It was geared towards Navy equipment, yes.
14 Q
Not uniquely to nuclear reactors?
15 A
No.
16 Q
You
- .a the list that appears right under 17
" Machinist's Mate Class'A. School" on this resume 18 starting with propulsion shaft components, 19 continuing on, basic propulsion and engineering, right 20 on to the next page?
21 A
Yes.
22 Q
Is that list in whole or in part a list 23 of the s ub j e cts that you studied in machinist's mate bl 24 school?
V 25 MR. MacDONALD:
That is a compound
Faust 66 y
()
2 question.
If you get a yes answer, it will be 3
ambiguous.
4 Q
Are any of the items that appear on the Ih 5
resume after machinist's mate's Class A School 6
courses which you took in that school?
7 A
The items I have listed there are just areas 0
that I have had.
It is not complete because I 9
couldn' t remember them all of dif ferent courses that I 10 had in the Navy through my Navy experience.
11 Q
In other words, 12 A
These are in addition ~to machinist's mate A 13 school.
14 Q
So the list that appears beginning at the 15 bottom of Page 1 of this resume continuing on to 16 Page 2 is a list of all of the courses that you had 17 at any time during your Navy career that you could 18 remember at the time you prepared the resume?
19 A
The courses that I could remembe r, yes, that I 20 attended.
21 Q
The resume indicates that from June 1967 22 to January 1968 you were at the U.
S. Naval Nuclear 23 Power School.
Do you see that?
/]
24 A
Yrr D
25 Q
where was that?
1 Faust 67 2
A That would be two places that it took place.
3 The first part of it was down in Bainbridge, Maryland.
4 The second would have been up at Prototype in h
5 Schenectady, New York.
6 Q
The first part in Bainbridge was from 7
June '67 to January '68 and then the second part, the 8
p rototype partc was from Februa ry
'6 8 to Augus t '68?
9 A
Am I in the right spot?
10 Q
The bottom of Page 1,
military school.
11 A
From 1967 to 3968, June to January?
12 Q
Yes.
13 A
That would have been down in Bainbridge,
14 Ma ry l and.
15 Q
Then what did you do from February '68 16 to August '687 17 A
I was stationed at the Prototype in IO Schenectady, New York.
19 Q
What was that Prototype /
20 A
That was a prototype on the S-3-G core that the 21 Navy used.
22 9
was that an actual operating nuclear 23 reactor?
)
O 24 A
Yes.
V 25 Q
was it a pressurized water reactor?
g Faust 68 10
\\~J A
Yes.
2 Q
What did you do during this six months 3
4 that you were working on that prototype?
In other lll w ras, what did that part of the traininy consist of?
5 A
Actual performance of operating the reactor 6
from the point of view of a machinist's mate.
7 8
Q What were the responsibilities of a 9
machinist's mate in connection wtih the operation of 10 that reactor?
A Operate the steam propulsion plant associated gg 12 with the reactor.
O(_/
13 Q
Wpen y u refer to the steam propulsion 14 Plant associated with the reactor, what specifically 15 are you referring to?
16 A
You want a breakdown of what was the components 17 in it?
18 Q
Yes, what components you were actively 19 working.
20 A
I was working with condensor, the main turbine,
21 water break, I believe they called it at the time, 22 high-pressure air compressors, all the pumps that 23 are associated with the primary and secondary side of f~\\
\\b 24 the plant, as far as would be normal maintenance.
25 Let me correct that.
Normal surveillance on the
1 Faust 69 Otj 2
pumps from my perspective as a machinist's mate.
3 Q
what did surveillance on the pumps from 4
your perspective as a machinist's mate mean?
llh 5
A It could be checking oil levels on the pumps 6
to vibration on the pumps as they operated to visual 7
inspections through windows in the compartment to 8
running operating temperatures on it, starting and 9
stopping the pumps, operating the pumps.
10 Q
And did the pumps th at you had 11 surveillance responsibility for on the primary side of 12 the system include pumps that circulated water O*
13 through the reactor coolant system?
14 A
It included pumps in that.
As far as the 15 reactor coolant pumps themselves, it was mainly a 16 visual inspection of the pumps.
17 Q
In the courses that you had in the 18 machinist's mate class A school, did you take courses 19 with respect to preparing you for your responsibilities 20 as a machinist's mate?
21 A
I took courses that prepared me, yes, for my 22 responsibilities, and I also took cross courses, 23 courses that covered other areas like electronics that
/~T 24 ET's would have and the electricians.
It was sort U
25 of a blending to make me aware of their
1 Faust 70 mO 2
responsibilities as f ar as components in the plant.
3 Q
Did the courses that you took, any of the 4
courses that you took in machinist's mate school deal h
5 with reactor coolant pumps?
6 A
Yes.
7 0
In other words, did you learn anything 8
about reactor coolant pumps in th e s c hool?
9 A
Yes, part of the primary package that we were 10 studying.
11 Q
Did you learn in this school anything 12 concerning maintenance and prote ction of those O
13 pumps?
14 A
I don't recall everything I learned about them.
15 Q
But did you learn anything?
16 A
Yes, I did learn stuff.
That was part of our 17 job, to qualify on the plant.
18 Q
Did you learn anything in that school about 19 the effect of vibration on pumps?
20 A
It was something we studied, yes, effect of 21 vibration on pumps.
22 Q
In the course of that school, did you learn l
l 23 what the causes might be that might cause pumps to i
24 vibrate?
25 A
we learned cause of vibration.
i J
t Faust 71 k_))
f~
2 Q
Did you learn various things that might 3
cause a pump to vibrate?
4 A
Various things, yes.
lh 5
Q Various things to look for if a pump 6
was vibrating?
7 A
If a pump was vibrating and also things th at 0
could cause a pump to vibrate, yes.
9 Q
What did you learn in that school that 10 were some of the things that might cause a reactor 11 coolant pump to vibrate?
12 A
Shaft out of balance on th e pump.
You are O
13 asking me to place things I am not sure of where all 14 I picked them up at.
I don't know if I picked them 15 up at the prototype or by picking them up sometime 16 later in my Navy training.
But I have come across 17 these things through my training experience.
Things 18 like temperatures on the bearings which could possibly 19 cause a shift in the radial bearings on the pump or 20 thrus t bearings.
Pressure on the pump suction that 21 could cause cavitating in the eye of the pump.
9 22 structural mounts to the pump that could shift that 1
23 could cause vibration.
O l
\\sj 24 I think I already mentioned the alignment 25 of the pump shaft or I should throw in there motor l
l
1 Faust 72
('m
(_
i 2
housing itself if something were to affect that 3
maybe through wear that might cause excessive 4
movement or a f ailure of something in a pump.
lll 5
Q Taking your last answer in terms of your 6
entire experience while you were in the Navy, and at 7
any time while you were in the Navy, did you learn 8
that a cause of vibration in a reactor coolant pump 9
in a pressurized water reactor could be saturation in 10 the reactor coolant system?
11 A
Not in thos e terms.
12 Q
What do you mean, not in those te rms ?
O 13 A
What I learned was if the suction pressure, a nd 14 this is to any pump, dropped below the saturation 15 pressure at the eye of the pump, which is called net 16 Positive suction head, that could cause vibration in the 17 Pump.
18 Q
Did you ever see anything while you were 19 in the Navy called a net positive suction head curve?
20 A
Yes.
21 Q
Giving various pressure and temperature 22 ratios?
23 A
Yes.
24 Q
Did you learn that if the temperature 25 pressure ratio was below that curve, then you would
Faust 73 y
~J.
2 have a condition where you could cause vibration in 3
the pumps?
4 A
Yes, giving various pressure or temperature lll 5
considerations for the curve of the specific pump, 6
yes.
7 Q
Did your duties the entire time you were 8
in the Navy, were they all as a machinist's mate?
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
Do the responsibilities that you have 11 described up to now for a machinist's mate describe 12 basically what you did the entire time you were in
\\
13 the Navy?
14 A
I operated the steam plant, yes, aboard a 15 submarine in the Navy.
16 Q
Basically the kind of work you did in the 17 Navy, the kind of responsibility you had, stayed the 18 s ame for the whole period?
19 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
20 I don' t think that is what he said.
21 A
All the responsibilities that go to operating 22 a steam plant in the Navy is what I was being trainsd 23 for.
That is not to say that I wasn't also trained
(-)
24 along which was usually a combination of electrician s i
1 25 and the electronics te chni ci ans, as far as into areas
]
1 Faust 74 (3
U 2
of their responsibilities in the Navy.
That is what I am trying to say.
We split specifically in areas 3
4 of our special areas, but we had gene ral training jlh 5
into each other's areas.
6 Q
one of the courses listed on this brochure, 7
this resume, is on Page 2,
called steam components.
8 Do you see that?
g A
Yes.
10
-Q can you tell us what that course was about?
11 A
To the best I can remember, it involved different 12 types of regulating valves in the steam plants, gauges O'\\ l 13 that are associated with it, how they function, the 14 inte rnals of them, because we were studying also to 15 he able to fix these components as well as operate 16 them.
17 Q
At anywhere'in the course of your Navy 18 experience or education, were you trained on the 19 actual operation of the nuclear reactor itself?
20 A
I was trained on the operation of the reactor 21 but not from the point of view as an RO.
His 22 training was more intense than mine, but I would be 23 in a lot of the training sessions that went on with
()
24 the RO.
It was general training.
This is aboard the 25 ship I am thinking about spe ci fi cally, now.
Faust 75 g
O 2
Q Let's just take it step by step.
You were 3
in the machinist's mate s chool f rom February 1967 to 4
June 1967, and then you went to the prototype at
(
llh 5
Schenectady from February '68 to June '68; is that 6
correct?
We're through the point where you finished 7
the prototype at Schenectady.
8 A
I went to the machinist's mate Class A school 9
first and then -- I don't remembe r the title of it 10 up at Great Lakes.
There was anothe r portion of 11 that A training up there that was gi ven speci fically 12 to people designated to go into the nuclear Navy.
13 I can't reme mbe r the n ame o f i t.
14 From there I went to Bainbridge, Maryland.
15 And af te r that I went to S chen ectady, New Yo rk.
16 Q
Then af te r that, the resume indicates from 17 August to November 196 8 you were at Naval Submarine 18 School.
16 A
Yes.
20 Q
What was the program t submarine school?
21 A
Submarine school was geared towards the 22 operations of conventional
--I shouldn' t even say 23 conventional -- it was geared towards the operations f)/
24 involved with the boat ove rall, not just the power x-25 plant or the reactor itself, but it was geared to
1 Faust 76 2
the whole boat.
3 Q
s rt of a basic course taken by anyone 4
that was going to work on the submarine ?
lll 5
A That was going to go on the s ubm ari ne, yes.
6 Q
Then from Janua ry 1969 to Novembe r 197 3 7
you were on the George Washington Carver?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
And that was a nuclear submarine?
10 A
Yes.
11 Q
This broader training that you referred 12 to a moment ago, that was received while you were on p.
\\
13 the s ubmarine ?
14 A
We cros s-traine d at the prototype as well as 15 on the submarine.
on the submarine there was less 16 separation of us because we trained as a shift as 17 far as training occurring after shift or after 18 mai nte nan ce, whenever we had a re quiremen t to upgrade 19 our training.
20 Q
During thm course of your training in the 21 Navy, then, did you learn the basic principles behind O
22 the operation of a press urized water reactor?
23 A
Yes.
i
(~N 24 Q
Did the reactor at the prototype in b
25 Schenectady have a pressurizer?
l l
1 Faust 77
{
2 A
Yes.
3 Q
Did it have a relief valve at the top of 4
the pressurizer?
]lh 5
A I don't recall.
I don' t believe it did.
At the 6
top of the pressurizer itself.
I recall it had code 7
reliefs.
They weren't called code reliefs.
I am not 8
sure what we called them.
9 Q
Did they have safety valves?
10 A
No.
That is' not the same thing as a relief 11 valve.
12 Q
Did they have safety valves?
(
\\
13 A
On the' ste am ge ne rator, yes.
14 MR. SELTZER:
I think he is asking about M
on the p r e s s u ri z e r.
16 A
There would have been a relief valve.
It wasn't 17 a safety valve.
18 Q
Did it perform what you consider to be a 19 safety function?
20 A
The relief valve performs against ove r-p re s s ur e 21 conditions, yes.
22 Q
Did'you understand that there was a l
l 23 valve on top of the pressurizer at the prototype
[v T
24 which was designed to relieve pressure if pressure 1
l l
25 reached a certain limit?
1 Faust 78 OO 2
A Yes.
Q Now, did the reactor, nuclear reactor, that 3
i l
4 you worked with ir. the Navy have a primary system, h
5 Primary reactor coolant system full of water?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
What was the temperature that that water 8
was maintained ac under normal operations?
MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking about 9
10 the protetype right now?
gg MR. FISKE:
Yes.
12 A
I believe the average was maintained at 480
)
's 13 degrees Fahrenheit plus or minus a five degree band.
14 There was a ten degree band on it, I believe.
15 Q
What was the pressure at normal during 16 n rmal operations on the primary side?
17 A
Run on 2100.
I don' t remembe r at this time 18 any more.
l 19 Q
Eow about on the secondary side?
Do you 20 remember the pressure.and temperature?
MR. MacDONALD:
Unde r-normal operating 21 9
.~
22 conditions?
f a
MR. FISKE ] Yes.
^
23
-~
O A
N
/
24
'- I do not.
..e
.r-
, [, ' '
~
Q During your I ri d in S chenectady > was 25
,,a
,. s
,(, Ar' c
~
- 3 "l
?
3
- [
l
~
- i iI
Faust 79 y
O 2
there any training that you were given with respect 3
to transients?
4 A
Yes.
lll 5
Q Just so we unde rstand the term, do you 6
understand " transient" to mean essentially any 7
off-normal condition in the operation of a reactor?
8 A
Anything outside of steady state.
It could be 9
classified as a transient, yes.
10 Q
Were,you given any training while you were 11 in the Navy on dif ferent kinds of transients?
. 12 A
Yes.
n
13 Q
Of those transi&nts on which you were 14 trained, did any of them involve loss of pressure 15 in the primarv system?
16 A
I don' t recall.
I was operating more from the 17 engine room during a transient than in the control 18 room.
19 Q
was there further training that you 20 would have had to have been through while you were 21 in the Navy if you wanted to become a reactor 22 operator in the Navy?
23 A
Yes.
! ()
24 Q
At any time while you were in the Navy 25 did you have any interest in be coming a reactor
6 1
Faust 80 (v
2 operator?
A I***
3 4
Q Did you ever take that additional training?
lll 5
A If I w uld have stayed in the Navy, I would have.
6 I didn't, though.
7 Q
While you were in the Navy you didn't take 8
it; is that correct?
g A
Right.
10 Q
What was the reason that you left the 11 Navy in 1973?
12 A
My enlistment was up.
I wante d to -- I didn't 7-13 like going to s e a th at mu ch.
I wanted to be with my 14 family.
15 Q
Af te r you:.ldf t the Navy, did you then 16 become employed by Metropolitan Edison?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
Did you apply for a position at any 19 other company other than Met Ed?
20 A
Yes.
21 Q
Where7 9
22 A
I sent quite a few resumes out.
I don't 23 remember where all of them went any more.
I think
[)
24 I kent something like 15 resumes out.
v 25 Q
Did you apply to any other utilities?
Faust 81 g
/O V
2 A
Yes.
T*: s t is where I was applying, mainly.
3 Q
When did you go to work at Met Ed?
4 A
About five days after I got out of the Navy.
lk 5
Q That is November 19737 6
A It would have been December 5, 1973.
7 Q
What position did you apply for at Met Ed?
8 A
I applied for control room operator.
9 Q
What were you hired as?
10 A
Auxiliary A operator.
11 Q
Was there a nucle ar reactor in operation 12 at Three Mile Island at that time?
13 A
No.
14 Q
Were you hired as an auxiliary A operator 15 for Unit 17 16 A
I was hired as an a6xiliary A operator for 17 Unit 2.
I ended up operating on Unit 1 as an 18 auxiliary A operator.
19 Q
What was the status of Unit 2 at the time 20 you went there in December 19737 21 A
under construction.
22 Q
You did become a licensed control room 23 operator at some point, did you not?
O 24 A
Yes.
V 25 Q
When was that?
g Faust 82 2
A I believe I received my license in October 1977.
3 Q
Your resume indicates auxiliary operator 4
NUC De cember 5, 1973 to, I believe, that is lll 5
October 20, 1975.
Do you see that?
6 A
Auxiliary operator NUC -- where are you 7
Pointing at?
8 Q
Fourth line down under "Present position."
9 MR. MacDONALD:
Do you have a copy of i
10 this resume that has the last di git after l
11 October 197-7 12 MR. FISKE:
I am sure we can get one, (ss'4 13 but if you look up one line, you will see it 14 must be October 20, 1975.
15 A
Yes.
I see where you are at.
16 Q
Then it says " control room operator, 17 Unit 1,
October 1975 to January 1976."
18 Did you have some ch ange in status during 19 that pe riod between the 1973 to 1975 period and the i
'1975 to 1976 period?
20 21 A
Yes.
22 Q
What was that?
23 A
I went from t2 sining control room operator
()
24 in Unit 1 back to auxiliary A operator in Unit 1, 25 and during that period of time I was operating on
1 Faust 83 D
(U 2
Unit 1 and Unit 2, and I became more Unit 2, and I bid 3
up for operator on Unit 2 as a CRO.
4 Q
When you first went to Met Ed, did you lll 5
have to go into some form of training program?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
Was that training program geared to a 8
particular unit?
{
l 9
A That training program at that time was geared l
1 10 to Unit 1.
11 Q
So was there a time when you shifted 12 from training for Unit J to training for Unit 27 13 A
As an A07 14 Q
Yes..
15 A
No.
It wasn't a shi f t like you are saying.
16 I think you understand it to be as if it was 17 i
something that was cut.
Qne day I am training in 18 Unit 1 and the next day I am training in Unit 2.
I 19 was hired as an dperator on Unit 2.
I trained on 20 Unit 1,
and I believe the company's position at the 21 time was not to split operators, auxiliary operators O
22 A as either to Unit 1 or to Unit 2.
I am not 23 positive of what the company's opinion on this'was, 24 but I am talking from the point of view as an 25 auxiliary A operator.
We were coming to understand
1 Faust 84 O
2 that we would be station operators, not unit, not to 3
a specific unit at that time, and our training came 4
in the form of Unit 1,
and Unit 2 was still under llh 5
con s tru cti on.
It wasn't even together yet, we were 6
sent over there to do jobs, and we would learn 7
systems while we were over there.
I shouldn't say 8
"over there."
we learned systems.
We trained on 9
systems at that time.
We were auxiliary A operators 10 qualified to operate the way I understand it on both 11 units.
'12 Q
In order to be a licensed operator,.
O 13 control room operator on a particular unit, you have 14 to receive a license for that unit; isn't that correct?
15 A
Yes.
16 Q
So that in order to be licensed on Unit 1 17 and Unit 2, you would have to be separately licensed 18 for each ones is that correct?
19 A
Control room operators at the time were not 20 given the option to license on both units at the time.
21 Either I have been Unit 1 -- I would not have been 22 both.
I would not have gone between Unit 1 and Unit 2 23 each day or every other day; I wouldn' t have switched, n.
(_)
24 Q
simply unde r the regulations as you 25 understood them of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission,
Faust 85 g
2 if you had a license as a control room operator on 3
Unit 1,
that would not entitle you to operate Unit 2; 4
isn't that correct?
llh 5
A As a licensed CRO, yes.
6 g
Did you ever become a licensed control 7
room operator at Unit 17 8
A No.
9 Q
Was there any reason why you did not?
10 A
Yes, there was a reason.
11 Q
,What was the reason?
12 A
The reason bordered on a difference of opinion O
13 betwe.en my supervisor and myself as to the course 14 my training was taking at the time.
I therefore 15 thought it was best to drop back as an AO and go up 16 again for a license at some later time, preferably 17 at Unit 2.
18 Q
At what point in time did this dispute 19 occur?
20 A
Approximately three months into my training.
21 Q
That would be sometime in what year?
22 A
Just prior to my dropping back as an AO.
l 23 where I went up from CRO, it would have been around 24 Decemb er 197 3.
Not December, but 1976; January of 25 1976.
1 Faust 86 f3 C
2 Q
Who was your supervisor at that time?
3 A
When I dropped back?
4 Q
Yes.
llh 5
A At that time it was Joe chwastyk.
6 Q
He was the supe rvisor with whom you had 7
the dispute?
8 A
Disagreement.
9 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
10 He didn't characterize it as a dispute.
11 Q
How would you characte rize it?
12 A
It was a disagreement in my training.
n\\ /
13 Q
But he was the supervisor with whom you 14 had that disagreement?
15 A
Yes.
16 Q
What was the nat ure of the disagreement?
17 A
You want a whole story like here?.Because it 18 wasn't just a cut-and-dry phrase.
19 Q
I would like it as simply as you can give 20 it.
21 A
Joe chwastyk had been in the hospital for an 22 operation about the first month and a half of my a
23 training.
I was left on my own to follow a training
[>)
24 package that I had gotten from our Training Department x
l 25 at that time to study for my licens e.
1 Faust 87
/3 V
2 When he came back, he sort of took hold 3
of my training the way I describe it and directed me 4
away from the way I had been studying into the way he h
5 wanted me, or the way he thought I should have been.
6 The best I never discussed it with him.
It became 7
difficult to train under him from that aspect, so I 8
dropped back.
9 Q
When you say " dropped back," you mean 10 dropped back to an auxiliary A operator?
11 A
Yes.
12 Q
Eow close were you in point of time in O
13 terms of the training that you had completed to 14 becoming a licensed control room operator on Unit 1?
15 A
By the routine time that is set down, you have 16 nine months to qualify.
I had another six months to 17 go approximately at that time.
18 Q
And you eventually qualified on Unit'2, 19 yo u s ai d, in October 19777 20 A
Yes.
21 Q
Under the regulations of the Nuclear 22 Regulato ry. Commission, is it correct af te r becoming a 23 licensed control room operator, you have to take l
G V
24 certain requalification training?
25 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
You
1 Faust 88 C')
2 are talking about what he understands, not what 3
the regulations necessarily set forth.
4 MR. FISKE:
I am asking what he lll 5
understands.
I think that was the form of the 6
question.
7 A
The first part of the question was?
8 Q
Do you understand that after becoming a 9
licensed control room ope rator, you have to go 10 through certain requalification training periodically 11 and take a requalification examination?
12 A
Yes.
13 Q
And have you done that since 1977?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Do you receive a requalification license 16 or is your license issued periodically?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
Kas yours been?
19 A
Yes.
20 Q
Is that every two years?
l 21 A
Yes.
O 22 Q
Are you aware tn.at any operators employed 23 by Metrcpolitan Edison have been discharged because
(
24 they che ated on their requalification exam?
25 MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking about
Fcuot 89 g
2 at any point in time?
MR. FISKE:
Yes.
3 4
A Yes.
5 Q
D you know the ' names of those operators?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
Can you tell us who they are?
m,W As W d DP g
Q Do you know of any other operators that O
have been discharged by Metropolitan Edison for 1
cheating on their requalification exams?
je 2
A No.
-O s-MR. MacDO AtD I sust make a ree est, inasmuch as I have been informed those names 4
.5 have never been released to the press, that this 16 part of the record be deemed confidential.
17 MR. FISKE:
I think we are operating l8 under an agreement that all of the depositions tg are subject to --
MR. MacDON ALD :
I don't know what the 10 gg agreement is, but I want to make sure this a
portion of the record is deemed confidential
,y, g3 to counsel only.
MR. FISKE:
That is fine.
g h)
-Q What position did 6 hold with t
%w.s
-e s
Faust 90 g
1
()
Met Ed when he was discharged?
2 3
MR. MacDONALD:
Can you tell us when this 4
occurred?
..f' 5
MR. FISKE:
At the time he was discharged.
6 MR. MacDONALD:
When was the time he 7
was discharged?
8 Q
when did the incident that you just told 9
us ab out take place?
When were these individuals fired 10 by Met Ed?
11 A
I don' t know the date.
I believe two weeks ago,
~~
.12 about.
-( ) ' b3 Q
When was it that they took the 14 requalification exam upon which they cheated?
15 A
I don't remember the date of the exam they took.
16 That was a Unit 1 exam.
17 Q
To the best of your present recollection, 18 was it within the last year?
, 19 A
Yes.
20 Q
Were either of these individuals licensed 21 on Unit 27 w wk rh Net ~ -Q 1
[
A
=
s&s m A Q
Does that mean.that M did not?
23 24 A
As far as I know, he didn't.
0 25 Q
Are you aware of any. other operators at e
l 1
1 Faust 91 f)
(_/
2 Met Ed who have cheated on any examination given in 3
connection with the licensing program.
4 A
Not that I am aware of, no.
lll 5
Q You have continued to be employed by 6
Met Ed since the accident in March of '79; is that 7
correct?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
As a control room operator?
19 A
Yes.
11 Q
What have your responsibilities been 12 sin ce the accident?
13 A
My responsibilities since the accident have 14 been to maintain surveillance on the core itself, the 15 condition of the core, as far as the parameters 16 available to me, operate within the guidelines that 17 have been given to me by B&W and Metropolitan Edison.
18 Q
You mean in te rms of maintaining 19 surveillance?
20 A
Maintaining surveillance and whatever 21 procedures have developed since that time due to the l
22 conditions of the plant as they exist now to go 23 under those guidelines.
We're involved with all the 24 problems that have originated since the accident due v
25 to the contamination or radiation that we have in
1 Faust 92 OO 2
the water that we're dealing with.
We now have a big 3
emphasis on that.
We're presently involved with a 4
system called the SDS system, the Submerged lh 5
Demine ralizatio n System.
When I last was there, that 6
was in its initlal testing phase, to allow us to 7
p ro cess the reactor building water which we have 8
been reprocessing through it reprocessed wate r, that 9
water that has gone through our upper Core 2. system, 10 which is another system we're responsible for 11 operating.
'12 Q
In othe r words, you have been working on O
13 maintaining surveillance of the plant and assisting 14 in the clean-up?
Is that a fair way to summarize it?
15 A
Yes.
16 Q
Are you familiar with the fact that 17 certain committees or groups were formed at 18 Metropolitan Edison /GPU after the accident to i
19 investigate various aspects of the accident?
20 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
21 You can ask him if he is aware of the 22 groups.
I am not sure of the fact.
23 MR. FISKE:
Is that an issue?
O)
(
24 MR. MacDONALD:
Just proper procedure to 25 ask a question.
1 Faust 93 O(_)
2 (Re cord read.)
MR. EacDONALD:
The objection still 3
stands.
4 llh 5
Q Are y u familiar with the fact that counsel for GPU in answer to an interrogatory has 6
submitted a list of committees and groups which were 7
8 formed following the ac cident to investigate various 1
9 aspects of it?
10 A
I am not aware of that, no.
11 Q
Are you aware of th e fact that such 12 groups or committees were formed?
O A
I am aware.
V 13 14 MR. MacDONALD:
Same objection.
A (continuing)
I am aware that groups were 15 f rmed, yes.
16 17 Q
Did you yourself participate in the work 18 of any of those groups?
A I participated with various groups.
I don't 19 know which ones.
20 21 Q
I am talking of groups within Met Ed or O
22 GPU that were formed af ter the accident to 23 investigate it?
Were you a member of any such 1
f-c maittee or group?
24 v
A I didn't classify myself as a member.
I was 25
i 1
Faust 94 Ob 2
participating with the groups to investigate the 3
causes of the accident, yes.
4 Q
Let's put it this way.
Were there llh 5
occasions af te r the accident when people from Met Ed 6
or GPU asked you to provide information to them with 7
respect to what happened on the day of the accident?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
At any time, did anybody tell you it was 10 part of your responsibility to go out and 11 interrogate other people to find out what happened on 12 the day of the accident?
O L/
13 A
No.
14 Q
Did you ever review any drafts of reports 15 prepared by any group or committee investigating the 16 accioent for Met Ed or GPU?
17 A
I have reviewed information associated with the 18 ac cide nt from different g ro up s.
Once again, I don't 19 remember which ones specifically are which.
20 Q
You don't remember if it was a draft of i
21 a report or just some information that was put 22 together?
l 23 A
Yes.
l 24 (Recess taken.)
l 25 (A document was marked B&W Exhibit 260 i
l 1
Faus t 95 3(O 2
for identification, as of this date.)
3 Q
I show you a document marked as Exhibit 4
B&W 260 and ask you whether you are f amiliar with lh 5
something called the FSAR.
6 MR. MacDONALD:
Has he ever heard of it 7
before?
8 Q
Have you ever heard w2 an FSAR?
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
What is an FSAR?
11 A
It is a document describing -- it sort of 12 describes everything about the plant as f ar as th e 13 license goes, I would imagine.
14 Q
Is it your understanding that the FS AR is 15 a document filed by the utility with the Nuclear 16 Regulatory Commission in order to set forth certain 17 information which is necessary in order to obtain an 18 operating license?
19 A
Yes.
20 Q
Have you ever read any part of the FSAR 21 for TMI Unit 27 22 A
Yes.
23 Q
what portions of it have you read?
I
/m
(
)
24 A
I have read mainly those portions that apply to 25 ne as an operator.
l
Faust 96 1
O)
\\
2 Q
Which portions are those?
3 A
I don't know the specific names of the individual 4
sections, but they would be the sections with lll 5
re fe ren ce to systems in the plant.
They refer to 6
tech specs on the plant.
They refer to theory on the 7
plant.
8 Q
Was it part of the training program at 9
Metropolitan Edison that people being trained to 10 become licensed CRO's would be required to read 11 certain portions of the FSAR?
. 12 A
I don' t remember it put that way.
13 Q
Did you just read these portions on your 14 own, or was it because it was part of the formal 15 training program?
16 A
I don't remember without looking at it what 17 information was in the FSAR or wasn't in there that we 18 studied from.
I don't recall being told to read the 19 FSAR.
Even as far as it occurred.
20 Q
It was not part of the training program 21 at Met Ed for a specific portion of the FSAR to be O
22 required reading for control room operators?
l 23 MR. MacDONALD:
He said he doesn't recall.
f 24 MR. FISKE:
I am asking.
25 A
I don' t recall at any time at Met Ed or B&W we
1 Faust 97 O
2 were referenced de finitely to the PS AR's and sections 3
out of them.
I don't remember doing that.
I don't 4
remember a statement or reading it as a requirement lll 5
specifically that I would use the FSAR's themselves 6
alone to study from.
7 Q
Do you recall reading the section in the 8
FSAR having to do with training?
9 A
I' don't recall reading it, no.
' 10 Q
I show you Exhibit 260, which I will 11 represent to you is an excerpt from the TMI-2 FSAR 12 g_
deali,ng with the Metropolitan Edison training program, U
13 and ask you whether or not you have ever read that.
14 A
Do you want me to read this?
15 Q
If you need to, read the whole thing in 16 order to tell us whether you ever read it before; you 17 are free to do that.
If you can skim through it and 18 ansvar the question, that might save us a little time.
19 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking him if he 20 h as read this particular document as it relates 21 to the diffe rent dates of the amendments that 22 seem to be indicated on the bottom right, which 23 I assume to be put in at the same time, or are 24 you just asking if he read a portion --
25 Q
Have you read any portion of the TXI-2
l Faust 98 1
A 2
FSAR dealing with training?
A I have read information dealing with training.
3 4
I just can't recall if it was exactly in this ~ form h
fr m the FSAR.
5 6
Q Let me direct your attention to Page 2.
7 Actually, 1 32-2.
The full paragraph under. Initial 8
Nonsupervisory Staf f RO Licens e.
This is on the 9
second page.
Do you see that paragraph?
10 A
Yes.
11 Q
That refers to reactor operator license
.12 candidates for Unit 2.
Do you see that?
13 A
Yes.
14 Q
Is that what you were prior to obtaining 15 y ur license in October 19777 16 A
Yes.
17 Q
If you go to the next sentence, it says, 18 "They have received a minimum of 26 weeks' formal 19 training in fundamental nuclear theory, health 20 physics and selected secondary and primary systems."
l 21 Do you see that sentence?
22 A
Yes.
23 Q
Prior to becoming a reactor operater 24 license candidate for Unit 2, did you receive at 25 least 26 weeks of that kind of formal training at
1 Faust 99
-~s 2
TMI?
3 MR. MacDONALD:
Let me ask that he be 4
permitted to read the section here that we are lll 5
dealing with.
He hasn't said that he doesn't 6
recall the document, but if you want to go 7
through it, let me at least say just it you 8
are dealing with the section that he is fully 9
aware of the section.
10 MR. FISKE:
It isn't a predicate for any, 11 of my questions that Mr. Faust have read this.
12 On the othe r hand, if it would help him O).
(_
13 in any way to stop now and read section 14 13.211.2, I will be happy to have him do that.
15 MR. MacDONALD:
I think it would be 16 be ne fi cial since you are directing his attention 17 to it to have him read it.
18 MR. FISKE:
I would like to review with 19 him the extent to which he has received the l
20 training specified by Met Ed to the NRC. I am i
21 trying to find out.
That is the purpose of my 22 question.
23 BY MR. FISKE:
()
24 Q
Eave you now read all that you would like 25 to read of Section 13.211.27
1 Faust 300 (O.
\\l 2
A Yes.
3 g
I think my first question was prior to i
4 becoming a reactor operator license candidate for i
lll 5
Unit 2, did you receive a minimum of 26 weeks' formal 6
training in fundamental nucle ar the ory, health 7
physics, and selected primary and secondary system?
8 MR. MacDONALD:
You are not asking him to 9
interpret that sentence.
You are asking whether 10 or not he received 26 weeks in training that 11 included those particular topics or subjects' 12 in the 26 weeks?
C)N
(_
13 Q
Did you participate in a formal training 14 program that lasted at least 26 weeks, which you 15 understood at the time included fundamental nuclear 16 theory, health physics, and selected primary and 17 secondary systems?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
Was there a name for that course at Met 20 Ed, colloquial phrase for it?
21 A
Control room operator's training for license.
22 Q
was this sort of a basic training course?
23 MR. MacDONALD:
What sort of?
I object
(~}
24 to the form.
LJ 25 A
What this looks like was the initial layout,
Fount 101 1
0 2
this section I have read.
The initial layout of our 3
training when I went up for a license in Unit 2.
I 4
went from an A to a CRO.
~
lh 5
Q You came into Met Ed as an auxiliary 6
operator As co rre ct?
7 A
Yes.
8 Q
At some point afte r you arrived there, did 9
you go through this 26-week course?
10 A
At some point after I arrived there, yes.
When 11 I went up for CRO in Unit 2, I went through this 12 course.
13 Q
The one we have just been talking about?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Was that an approximately six months' 16 program?
17 MR. SELTZER:
Six months from what?
18 Q
Six months long.
19 A
I don 't remembe r -- you are saying approximately.
20 I don't remember how long it was really.
It extended 1
21 longer than that, I believe.
22 Q
During what period did you go through 23 that course?
What time period?
24 A
Prior to my license.
25 Q
Let's do this.
Maybe we can save some time.
Faust 102 g
OV In this same paragraph it says, "These reactor 2
Perator license candidates will participate in 3
4 approximately 200 hours0.00231 days <br />0.0556 hours <br />3.306878e-4 weeks <br />7.61e-5 months <br /> of the classroom phase of the h
5 Unit 1 operator requalification and retraining.
6 Program described in 13.2111-C."
7 Do you see that?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
Did you participate in approximately 200 10 hours1.157407e-4 days <br />0.00278 hours <br />1.653439e-5 weeks <br />3.805e-6 months <br /> of the classroom phase of that program?
11 MR. MacDONALD:
In 13.2.11-C?
12 MR. FISKE:
Yes, the one I re fe re n ce d.
A I don't remember it beihg broken down as 13, 14 specifically Unit 1 requalification prggram.
I just 15 looked at it as the requalification program for what 16 I was studying for.
17 Q
Did you at any time prior to receiving 18 your license participate in a program which you 19 understood at the time was a Unit 1 operator 20 requalification and retraining program?
21 A
I Participated in a lot of requalification in 22 Unit 1 prior to my license, definitely.
23 Q
And this was, you understood it at the 24 time to be a requalification and retraining program 25 for Unit I?
1 Faust 103 OV 2
MR. Ma cDONAL D :
Objection.
He just 3
told you what he understood it to be.
4 Q
Did you understand it to be --
llh 5
MR. MacDONALD:
We will be here for weeks.
i l
6 MR. FISKE:
If so, it is because you are i
7 cons uming so much time with these objections.
8 MR. MacDONALD:
Not many.
I think he 9
answered the question.
10 Q
Did you understand at the time you were 11 participating in that program that it was a
.12 requalification and retraining program for Unit 1?
n\\/
13 MR. MacDONALD:
He just told you yes.
14 If you want to ask again, go ahead.
15 A
Yes.
That is what I thought I said.
I 16 participated in Unit 1 requalification, yes.
17 Q
Did you participate in 200 hours0.00231 days <br />0.0556 hours <br />3.306878e-4 weeks <br />7.61e-5 months <br /> of that 18 kind of requalification training?
19 A
I think it was longer.
I never stopped and 20 counted the hours.
Let's put it that way.
21 A
But your recollection is that it was at 22 least 200 hours0.00231 days <br />0.0556 hours <br />3.306878e-4 weeks <br />7.61e-5 months <br />?
23 A
We spent a lot of time in Unit 1, yes.
()
24 Q
And this requalification-retraining program 25 that we have just been discussing was being conducted
l Faust 104 1
OV 2
by Met Ed?
3 A
It was pe rformed --
4 MR. MacDONALD:
Exclusively?
llh 5
MR. FISKE:
I am asking whether it was 6
being conducted by Met Ed.
7 MR. MacDONALD:
I just asked whether you 8
meant exclusively or among others.
9 Q
Let's put it in terms of exclusively.
10 A
I don't know if it was exclusively conducted 11 by Met Ed.
12 Q
You don' t -- do you recall now anybody O
13 giving you any instruction as pa rt of that program 14 that we have just been talking about who was not an 15 employee of Met Ed.
16 A
I don't recall, really.
17 Q
The program we talked about a minute ago, 18 a minimum of 26 weeks' formal training in fundamental 19 theory, health physics, and selected primary and 20 secondary sys tems, that you described, do you recall 21 anybody giving you any instructions as part of that 22 program who was not an employee of Met Ed?
23 A
I think I need to say --
()
24 Q
It is the second sentence of that.
It is I
25 a very simple question.
It is relating to the program i
1 Faust 105
(~'h L_)
2 we have been talking about, 26 weeks' formal training i
3 that you received before you became a reactor 4
operator license candidate for Unit 2.
llh 5
A I think I am having a problem not being able 6
to determine wh at instruction by just plain looking 7
at 26 weeks or 200 hours0.00231 days <br />0.0556 hours <br />3.306878e-4 weeks <br />7.61e-5 months <br /> or eight weeks in Lynchburg 8
or after Lynchburg.
I can't separate it out now as 9
to what was where at what point in time.
It is not 10 that clear to me.
11 Q
All I am asking you about, and I will 12 try to take you through this paragraph by paragraph, 13 so we can sort this out, I am just trying to take 14 these one at a time.
15 The first sentence in this -- the second 16 sentence in this section filed by Met Ed with the 17 Nuclear Regulatory Commission in order to obtain its 18 operating license says that reactor operator license 19 can di dat es for Unit 2 have received a minimum of 26 20 weeks' formal training in fundamental nuclear theory, 21 health physics and selected primary and secondary 9
22 systems.
23 I am asking you whether, as part of g-
's.
(g) 24 that formal training in those subjects, you received 25 any instruction from anyone other than at Met Ed?
7 '
b4 i.
\\ \\,
/).-
.. s l
l>
I e
Tsust 106 g
7 f,
'~
~
~
obf,ect to tt[o ferm.
I 2
MR. Ma cDONM D :
I c
3 I
think he. gave you the answer.
Because l
yo u ',d o,n ' t' l
<a
/
4 i
18.ke tne
.), _ -
answer doesn',t mean that you keep h
5 askir.g the question,three times.
I thi nk h e._
6 haa given you his understanding of;the' s
7 dif ficulty ;to p1'acewhc instructed when and 8
where.
Et. gave you his $nderstanding of the r,
9 instructica :of the 26 weeks and 200 hours0.00231 days <br />0.0556 hours <br />3.306878e-4 weeks <br />7.61e-5 months <br />.
IIe 10 gave you the -answer thard,eu j ust rephrased 11 and, asked again.
MR. FI6 ICE:
It is n00/ at all clear lh k
12 s
o o
s
.i,
.r c.
13 -
terms of what instructicu-Mr. Faus t -i r-
~
3 1
~ >
~
14 testifying to. he. 4ceived unde r e acit of t htksi s.
15 programs, an'd that is 'all I cds,tryin'g to do.
16 I' am trying t o fi n'd ~t h a t out.
/
17 M R,. MacDONALD:
I thlnk he j ust te s ti.fied t
to what h4s reco11ecti6b was.
If'you want 18 as e
19 to cak the question-orie more, time, go ahead.
20 BY M R. -FISKE':
21 Q
Let's go ti the third sentence ~ or the 22 fourth sen tence:
"The se/reacto r, ope rator l' cens6 ' '
~s
+
l l
- 23
' candidates have al'1'operag,d at TMI Unit 3 as f-,1 24 auxiliary oper4 tors in. excess of one year."
iw.,)
n.
r i
25 Did you participate as an auxiliary
~'~
i fs
- {
- l..
~/
)
~
/
~
t'
.l#
~'
A t
1 Faust 307
,~
2 operator at TMI Unit 3 for a year before you became 2
a candidate for Unit 27 Y
4 A
Yes.
llh 5
Q Going through the rest of this section, 6
I would like to take them one at a time.
7 Do you see Paragraph A, training reactor 8
operation conducted at Penn State University.
"This 9
one-week program will include various core physics f
10 and detector experiments and ten reactor start-ups 3
11 for each candidate."
~3 12 Did you participate in that program?
%-]
13 A
Yes, I participated in the program at Penn 14 State that sounds just about what that s'ai d.
15 Q
Then the next, B,
says, " Practical 16 ebservation experience.
One month of practical 17 on-shift observation expe rience in the control room 18 of TMI Unit 1 has been scheduled for reactor 19 operator license candidates which will be conducted 20 approximately 19 months prior to fuel loading."
21 Did you participate in that one-month l:
22 program?
l 23 MR. MacDONALD:
I object.
That is not f~N
(_)
24 all the paragraph says -- just so the record 1
25 in clear.
You are taking portions out of that.
1 Faust 108 O
2 MR. FISKE:
I am asking about that one 3
sentence.
One month of practical on-shift 4
observation experience.
lll 5
Q Did you have that one month?
6 A
I had a month in Unit 1 control room.
I will 7
rephrase that.
I don't know how long it was that 8
I was in Unit 3 control room.
I spent time in Unit 1 9
control room observing.
10 Q
The next paragraph is P.W.R.
simulator 11 training. "The Babcock & Wilcox simulator facility 12 in Lynchburg, Virginia, will be used to provide (v~h 13 eight weeks of simulator instruction to each reactor 14 operator license candidate."
And then there is a l
15 description of what the breakdown is.
16 Did you participate in an eight-week 17 program at Babcock & Wilcox before obtaining your l
18 license?
l 19 A
Yes.
20 Q
Paragraph D, Unit 2, NSSS, secondary, 21 and balance of plant systems.
It describes a 22 systems course that addresses NSSS, s e con da ry, and 23 b alan ce of plant systems started in 1975.
The course A(_)
24 consisted of approximately 160 hours0.00185 days <br />0.0444 hours <br />2.645503e-4 weeks <br />6.088e-5 months <br /> of classroom 25 training in Unit 2 systems.
I Faust 109
/~N k_)
l 2
Did you participate in that program?
3 A
I remember being in a training course on 4
Unit 2 systems, yes.
I 5
Q of approximately 160 hours0.00185 days <br />0.0444 hours <br />2.645503e-4 weeks <br />6.088e-5 months <br />, about four 6
weeks?
7 A
I don ' t remembe r how long it was.
It was a long 8
time period.
9 Q
And then Paragraph E, Nuclear Theory 10 Review, described as a sixty-hour nuclear theory 11 review course conducted as a refresher course to 12 suppleme nt the initial 26-week training program O
13 previously mentioned.
14 Did you participate in that program?
15 A
Yes.
I was in the program on reactor theory 16 review, yes.
17 Q
Then in Paragraph F, advanced systems, 18 procedure, and nuclear theory training.
From 12 19 months prior to fuel loading reactor operator 20 license candidates will devote approximately one 21 week out of every six weeks to formalized 22 training.
This training will include such topics 23 as eme rge ncy procedures, abnormal procedures, O)
(_
24 radiation control c.nd safety, technical i
25 specifications, nuclear theory review, 1
3 Faust 130 b
%J 2
adminis trative pro ce du res, fuel loading procedures 3
and precautions, and continued systems training.
4 Did you receive that formalized training?
llh 5
A Prior to licensing, yes.
We were training on 6
all that is listed there.
7 Q
So you did receive that kind of training 8
approximately one week out of every six from twelve 9
months prior to fuel loading; is that correct?
10 A
As far as I can remember, yes.
11 Q
When was the fuel loading in Unit 27
'12 A
I believe it was in around the end of
'77, the 13 beginning of
'78.
14 Q
I would like to go back over this.
15 Having gone through these different 16 programs as they are described in the Met Ed FSAR, 17 can you tell us now starting at the time that you came 18 with Met Ed in 1973 in what sequence you went 19 through these different training programs?
20 MR. MacDONALD:
These and only these?
21 MR. FISKE:
I am asking about these.
22 If there are others that Met Ed conducted, I 23 would like to know about them.
t"
(_
24 MR. MacDONALD:
You are assuming that 25 these aren't running simultaneously.
}
Faust 111 OV 2
MR. FISKE:
That is wh at I am trying to 3
find out.
4 A
That is what I am finding hard to remember llh 5
ri gh t now.
I can't remember exactly how it all fit 6
in together in sequence.
That is my problem with 7
answering the question.
8 Q
Let's first just get a general 9
understanding of what your total education and 10 training was prior to the time you became a licensed 11 operator.
You see that the last sentence in the 12 pa ragr ap h, at the full paragraph in the middle of 13 Page 2 in which Met Ed states that in order to be 14 eligible for a reactor operator license, reactor 15 operator candidates will participate in the 16 following additional training programs.
17 Do you see that?
18 A
Where are you at?
19 Q
The last sentence.
20 Do you see that?
21 And then there is a list of A, B,
C, D,
22 E,
F, six different training programs which we have 23 just gone over very quickly.
O)
(_
24 My ques tion is :
Did you go through those 25 six programs in addition to the minimum of 26 weeks.'
g Faust J12
/
2 formal training in fundamental nuclear theory, 3
health physics and selected primary and secondary 4
systems referred to in the second sentence of that 5
Paragraph?
6 MR. MacDONALD:
He gave you the answer.
7 A
I don't recall how they split them up.
8 Q
You don't know whether you did or didn't?
g A
I don' t recall how they split them up.
I went 10 through an awful lot of training.
11 Q
At the time you were going through this
.12 training, did you have any understanding of what the O'\\
13 FSAR required in terms of your training?
14 MR. SELTZER:
Before he answers.
15 (Discussion ensued off the re cord 16 between counsel.)
17 (Re cord read.)
18 MR. MacDONALD:
I don't know that Mr.
19 Faust ever testified that he reviewed the 20 training section of the FSAR, and I don't know 21 whether or not we ever established that this 22 Portion of the FSAR was in effect at the time 23 you are asking about.
[ ')
24 (Record read.)
%/
25 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking whether
1 l
Faust 113 g
O 2
he reviewed a document within the train ng se tion of the FSAR?
3 MR. FISKE:
No, I am asking precisely 4
h what I asked him.
5 6
(Record read.1 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form 7
8 of the question.
MR. FISE:
Fine.
9 10 BY MR. FISKE:
gg Q
Can you answer the question now that we 12 have four objections to the question?
13 A
Id n' t think I can recall what I was thinking 34 about my requirements at that time.
15 g
As you sit here today, you can't tell us 16 that when you went through this training program you 17 had any understanding at all as to what the FSAR 18 filed by Met Ed required?
19 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
He just gave you his understanding.
He 20 couldn't recall.
21 MR. FISKE:
I want to be clear what Mr.
22 23 Faust means when he says he can' t recall.
24 Q
I want to know whether it is your 25 testimony as you sit here now that vihile you were
Faust JJ4 g
0 2
going through this approximat91y four years of 3
training before you obtained your license, you had 4
any understanding at all at any point during that llh 5
period as to what was required of Met Ed in te rms 6
of your training.
7 A
I never looked at it that way.
8 Q
1s it fair to say that from December 9
1973 when you first came to Met Ed until October 1977 10 when you obtained your license, you were in a 11 process of continual training including both 12 classroom training and on-the-job training?
13 A
It is f air to say that there was a lot of 14 training going on, yes.
I was operating the plant, 15 too, as an AO.
16 Q
Didn't you consider at the time you were 17 operating a plant as an AO that that was part of your 18 training process to become a CRO?
19 A
Everything is training and experience that you 20 do.
Even if you are repeating old things; it is still 21 a training expe rience.
22 Q
I think you testified that you went to l
23 Lyn chb urg, Virginia for an eight-week period to l
O)
\\_
24 receive instruction by Babcock & Wilcox during this I
25 period from December 1973 to October 1977; is that
Faust 115
[v 2
correct?
MR. MacDONALD:
Is it correct that he 3
4 testified to it or are you asking it again?
llh 5
Q Is it correct that you went there for 6
an eight-week period?
7 A
What was the first date?
8 Q
The whole time from the time you came to 9
Met Ed until the time you got your license, which is 10 approximately four years?
11 A
Yes.
12 Q
Du, ring that four-year period you spent O
13 eight weeks in a course at B&W, did you not?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Then you went a second time to B&W for 16 a one-week course, did you not?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
Apart from that nine weeks, any training 19 that you received during the four-year period from the 20 time you came to Met Ed and the time that you received 21 your license other than the training conducted at Penn 22 State for one week was conducted by Met Ed; isn't that 23 correct?
l f~)\\
(
24 MR. MacDONALD:
I object to the form.
l 25 That is not a true statement, from what Mr.
)
Faust 116 3
x_)
2 Faust has previously testified.
3 g
You were at asw for a total of nine 4
weeks during this four-year period, according to I
5 your testimony.
You also testified that you went to i
6 Penn State for a one-week trainer reactor program 7
during that period.
8 Except for those ten weeks, any training 9
that you received during this four-year period was 10 received by you at Three Mile Island from Met Ed; 11 isn' t that correct?
12 MR. MacDONALD:
No other vendors came 13 up to site or participated in the training 14 program?
15 MR. FISKE:
That is what I am asking.
16 A
I can' t say that because there were vendors 17 that came into the Island to give us instruction.
18 I don' t know exactly particularly who the vendors 19 represented at the time.
They may have come in on 20 a particular component like maybe the Powdex 21 system at Unit 1,
that I can remember a vendor 22 coming in on that.
We had a man in on the turbine 23 for Unit 2.
We have had people on other components 1
(~h j
(_)
24 in the plant, too, but I can't recall who they 25 represented at the time.
1 Faust 317 2
Q can you recall the period of time during 3
which any of those people were there?
A vendor would 4
come in to talk about a particular problem, is that ll 5
c orre ct, relating to his equipment?
6 A
Not necessarily.
He came in to give 7
instruction on the components, that particular 8
component.
9 Q
The operation of that particular 10 component?
11 A
Yes.
We have had lectures from people who I 12 can' t recall if they were Met Ed now.
I was never 13 asked that question during my training.
I don't 14 know if it was a Met Ed man or somebody else.
15 Q
All of this instruction that you are 16 talking about went on at Three Mile Island; isn't 17 that correct?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
You stayed there and these people came 20 in and gave you this instruction that you told us 21 abot&?
22 A.;
Yes.
23 Q
what I would like to do, going back to
(
24 the beginning of this, when you first came to Met Ed 25 in December 1973, what*is the first thing you did?
l
l Faust 138 g
G 2
MR. MacDONALD:
Related to his job?
3 Q
in terms of these various training 4
programs that you described.
lh 5
A I was on my own a few weeks there when I 6
first c am e.
The ones I took on myself to become 7
f amiliar with the plant.
We then entered a formal 8
training program -- I don't remember how it was g
slanted now.
The way I understood it to be was the 10 CRO training program.
It was given -- you had to 11 modify it after we had taken it that time.
My group 12 th at went through it was the last to go through it as O,'
13 it had been up to that time.
14 Q
This was at Unit 17 15 A
Yes.
It was a program that was given to all 16 operators to be operators that came on the Island, 17 not necessarily CRO's, but it was geared for CRO's.
18 Q
How long did that program last?
19 A
I don't remember how long it lasted.
It lasted --
20 Q
About six months?
21 A
I couldn't say right now.
I don't remember how 22 long it lasted.
23 Q
was that dealing with subjects such as
(
24 fundamental nuclear theory, health physics, primary and 25 secondary systems?
l l
1 1
Faust 119
,~
k_
2 A
Along those lines, yes.
3 Q
That was conducted by Met Ed, isn't that 4
correct?
I 5
MR. MacDONALD:
Exclusively now?
6 MR. FISKE:
Yes.
7 A
I don't think I can answer that now.
8 Q
You don't 9
A I don't recall if it was exclusively conducted 10 by Met Ed now, because I wasn' t aware of the 11 positions of all the people that were there at that 12 time.
13 Q
As you sit here now, do you remember 14 anybody that gave you instruction in that program that 15 was not part of Metropolitan Ed organization?
16 A
I don't think I can answer that.
I believe we 17 had vendors in there on it.
18 Q
Do you recall any?
19 A
That is what I am trying to say.
I can't 20 separate them.
21 Q
This was at Three Mile Island, right?
22 A
Yes.
23 Q
In this course, did you go to class?
f'N
(_)
24 A
It was -- some of it was in class and some of 25 it was geared to going into the plant a16ng with
Faust 120 tO (i
2 being in class.
3 Q
Rut part of it was class?
4 A
Ye s, prob ably.
Part of it was class, is a fair 5
way to say it.
l 6
Q where were the classes held?
7 MR. MacDONALD:
Where on the Island?
8 MR. FISKE:
Yes.
9 A
They were held over by the Unit 1 cooling 10 towers.
There was a set of trailers that were set 11 up there in.that area, in fact, where the Training
(-
'12 Department has just moved now that was designated as V) 13 our room for training.
14 Q
And was there written course material 15 for you to read in connection with this classroom 16 training?
17 A
There was written material, yes, to read.
18 Q
Did you have homework assignments?
19 MR. MacDONALD:
You are talking about 20 out-o f-cl a s s assignments?
gg 21 MR. FISKE:
That is my definition of 22 homework, yes.
23 A
Homework out-of-class assignments, yes, we had O
'\\ /
24 them; but it wasn't as if they were things that we 25 were required as I think of it, as taking it with us
1 Faust 121
()
U 2
from the Island.
3 Q
Was there work that you had to do 4
overnight in order to hand in the next day?
lll 5
A If there was work to be done, we were to be 6
given time to do it on the company's time.
If it was 7
done outside the company's time, it was on the 8
particular individual's initiative to do it.
It was 9
not a requirement for the man to have to take the 10 work home with him, because we're union, cnd we would 11 h a ve to be paid for work towards trai ning for the 12 company.
(:)
13 Q
If the company asked you to do any 14 homework after your regular eight-hour day, then you 15 would have had to have been paid for that?
16 A
If the company asked.
That's not to say that 17 people haven't studied on their own after hours.
18 Q
Was there a library at Three Mile Island 19 with reference material in case you wanted to look 20 things up beyond the material that had been handed out?
21 A
Not a formal library, no, that I knew that 22 existed on the Island at that time.
23 Q
Was there anyplace you could to if you O)
(_
24 wanted to obtain more i'nformation on the subjects that 25 were the subjects of the classroom training?
1 Faust 122 pV 2
A If we wanted to look up further information on 3
something we were training on that we didn't have 4
right in the classroom at that point, we would go out k
5 in the plant and look in tech manuals or the 6
reference material by the FSAR itself.
That would be 7
a place we would dig for information.
We would also, 8
if it was really tying us down that much, we would go 9
through to a vendor himself if we could ge t hold 10 of him to get in fo rm ation.
That would have been our 11 options to try to get him and to an extent that is 12 b(~N the way we went if we were trying to look up 13 info rmation on things.
14 Q
You mentioned FSAR reference material.
15 Was the FSAR filed someplace where you would have 16 access to it?
17 A
Yes.
18 Q
Where?
19 A
Filed in the control room.
At the time I can 20 remember, it was Unit 1.
I don' t remember if the re 21 was a copy down in the training trailer,.but what I 22 don't remember if it was being at that time updated, 23 so if I referenced to the FSAR, I usually went to the
,. ~.
\\
24 control room and dug it out.
25 g
Did you have access to any material that
Faust 323 g
,~
s 2
was referred to in the FSAR as reference material 3
or as back-up material?
4 A
I don't recall if I did use that, go any 1
h 5
further than that if I was looking up an answer in 6
the FSAR as f ar as a reference from the FSAR.
I 7
don't recall myself doing that, no.
8 Q
Do you know today whether that material 9
was available?
10 A
I don't know today if it was at that time 11 available.
'12 Q
After this first program that you just O
13 described, sever.a1 months' program after you started 14 wi th Me t Ed, what was the next step in your training 15 at Met Ed?
16 A
I went on shift, and my initial time on shift 17 was to operate with other.
When I was sent out on the 18 job, I would go out with an experienced operator to 19 perform functions in the plant.
l 20 Q
And you would work under this operator 21 learning from him basically?
22 A
Depending on the tasks, yes.
23 Q
And that was a Met Ed operator?
24 A
Yes.
25 Q
It wasn't a vendor?
1 Faust 324
[\\
2 A
Once again, it depends.
It could have been a 3
vendor, too.
Th.e most I will say at that phase, it 4
was an operator, but we were in start-up on Unit 1,
h 5
and we had some of the vendors there, too, on their 6
eq ui pme nt in start-up or at least it was part of the 7
start-up crew.
8 once again I didn't make a distinction 9
necessarily at the time.
Most of it I would.say was 10 the operators in Unit 3.
11 Q
Did you work under a particular operator
'12 at that time?
O 13 A
bo.
If I went out on a job and I didn't think 14 I could do it from material I had available to me,
15 like once again, changing out a Powdex, I 16 operated with a man to do that i ni ti ally.
If it was 17 going out to check a pump out for normal operation, 18 we would tour the plant looking for problems that 19 might be existing in components, I would go out on 20 my own on some o f that.
21 Q
How long did that part of the training 22 continue?
23 A
I don' t know if it was a formal period of time OV 24 on that.
25
,Q For about how long did you do that?
3
I g
Faust 125 OO 2
A I guess it was sort of continuous.
If I had 3
a problem that I didn't think I knew the answer, I 4
would refer to a more senior operator.
llh 5
Q continuous to what point?
6 A
I don't know how lor.g you could call that out.
7 Even today if I had a problem, I would be using that 8
form.
9 Q
You -- I am talking of a period of time, 10 I assume, where you came to work in the morning, you 11 reported to the. control room and worked under the 12 sopervision of a licensed operator.
13 MR. MacDONALD:
You are asking if he did 14 that?
15 Q
Was there a period Of time where you did 16 th at?
17 A
People I was working with at that point were 18 the auxiliary operators.
We operated --
you were 19 under the supervision of a CRO and he gave us 20 direction to go out and do something.
21 Q
You were working in the plant?
22 A
Yes.
I would go out in the plant and perform the l
23 function if I thought I could.
If I had questions
(~$
(,)
24 about it, I would call an operator.
I didn't l
25 necessarily just pick one.
I would pick anybody that l
g Faust 126 OV 2
was available or one particular man that I thought 3
w uld have more information on it at that time.
There 4
were other times where I was sent out to a man -- I lll 5
don' t remember who they were.
Who he was.
Not just 6
he.
I was sent out with a vendor, and I would be 7
working to get the piece of equipment on the line or 8
bring it up to operate as it should have been during 9
start-up.
10 Q
There was this period of time when you got 11 up in the morning and you went to work and you reported 12 to the plant and then you went out and worked as you just 13 described with the auxiliary ope rators.
You di dn ' t go 14 to class?
15 A
Yes.
16 17 (Time noted:
4:35 o' clock p.m.)
18 IO Craig C.
Faust 20 21 Subscribed and sworn to before me 22 this day of 1981.
l 23 l
l
(")
q_)
24 l
Notary Public 25
1 127
/^
2 CERTIFIEATE 3
STATE OF NEW YORK
)
- Ss.:
4 COUNTY OF NEW YORK )
(
5 6
I, JOSEPH R.
DANYO a
7 Notary Public within and for the State of New York, 8
do hereby certify that the foregoing deposition 9
of CRAIG C.
FAUST was taken before 10 Tuesday, August 38, 1981 me on 11 That the said witness was duly sworn 12 before the commencement of his testimony and V
13 that the within transcript is a true record of said 14 testimony; 15 That I am not connected by blood or 16 marriage with any of the parties herein nor 17 interested directly or indirectly in the matter in 18 controversy, nor am I in the employ of any of the 19 counsel.
20 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set 21 my hand this day of
/ da t/
1981 22 Y&
O
- oseph R.
J anyo