ML20024D136

Testimony of R Sharpe & Cw Hendrix of in Charlotte,Nc Pp 1-66

ML20024D136
Person / Time
Site:	Catawba
Issue date:	05/12/1983
From:	Hendrix C, Sharpe R DUKE POWER CO.
To:
References
NUDOCS 8308030193
Download: ML20024D136 (66)

Text

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I UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

. ,_ NUCLEAR REGt LATORY COh:h.ISSION

. BEFORE-THE ATOMIC SAFETY AND LICENSING BOARD

. In Re: ',  :

DUKE POWER COMPANY, E A .  : DOCKET NUMBERS (Catawba Nuclear Station  : 50 413 Unita 1 and 2)  : 50 414 e

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MAY 12,1983 5:10 P. M.

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DEPOSITIONS OF:

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6 EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTfMG SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROLINA

3 1 The Depositions of Robert Sharpe and C. W .

2 H en d rix, Jr., are taken at the Of fic e s of Duke Power 3 C om pa ny, C ha rlo tt e, North C a r olin a, on this th e 12th 4 day of M a y, 1983, in the presence of M r. Jesse L.

5 R ile y and Robert G u ild , C oun s el on behalf of the

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. 6 Inte r v eno r, P a lm e tt o A llia n c e, Incorporated; Anne W.

7 C ot tin gh am , J. Michael McGarry, A lb e r t V. Carr, a n<i 8 Ronald W. Gibson, A ttorne ys on behalf of t h e A pplicant, 9 Duke Power C o m pa ny.

10 It is agreed that Lynn B. Gilliam, Notary 11 P ub li c in and for the State of North C a rolina, may 12 take said Deposition in m a c hin e shorthand and tran-13 scribe the same to typewriting.

14 MR. MC GA RRY: I have some introductory 15 comments if I could just make them by way of intro-l 16 d uc tio n; as in other D e p o s itio n s taken yesterday and 17 j today, I would lik e this De p o s i ti o n transcript Record 18 to r e fl e c t th at a Stipulation has been entered into 19 concerning the taking of this D epo s itio n by other than 20 s teno g r a phic means.

21 That is appended to M a ry Birch's D e po sitio n.

22 Als o the comments that A p plic a n t made c o n c e r nin g 23 N o ti c e and accommodation ' contained in M ary Bi r c h's

' 24 Deposition apply e qu ally to this D e po sition.

25 Another comment with respect to the avail-evatvN esmorR AssoCIATas. sTENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

4 1 a b ilit y of documents, the FSAR is available and hope-2 f u ll y any other do cu m e nt s that are germaine to this 3 D e p o s iti on are a v aila bl e in this room.

4 Two other points, originally a W e s tin ghou s e 5 Wit ne s s was scheduled to be deposed, but because of

. 6 P alm et t o's R equ e s ts , wh ate ve r the reasons un d e rlyin g 7 the R eque st might be, the W e s tin ghou s e Witne s s is n ot 8 present.

9 R athe r we have proVided two Duke Witn e s s e s.

10 H o p e f ully they will p ro vid e responsive answers. Let

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11 me am e nd that, of course they will p r o vid e responsivo 12 answars.

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13 H o p e f ully those answers will prove of value .

14 It is our po sition that the most knowledgeable people 15 with respect to C o nt entio n 44 reside at W e s tin ghou s e.

16 La s tly, the De po sition today will be taken 17 in introductory fashion by Mr. Guild; and with respec t 18 to the substance, by Mr. R il e y.

19 In the normal instance we w o uld oppose 20 that and be of the view that the Deposition should be 21 conducted by Mr. Guild.

22 We know Mr. R ile y, we know of his cross 23 e xa mina tio n skills, and we do not oppose M 'r . Riley 24 ta kin g the D e po sition in this one instance.

25 M R. GUILD: By way of intr odu c tion, my EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES, STENOTYPE REPORTING BERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROLINA

Sharpo, Hondrix - Diroct 5 g I name is Robert G uild.. a nd I represent Palmetto s

2 A lli a n c e , one of the Inte rvenor s in this case.

3 One of the Contentions that hss been 4 A d mit t e d and is the subject of this litigation under 5 c on sid e r a tio n by the Licensing B o a rd is numbered 44

. 6 and relates to reactor pressure and Emb rittle men t.

7 e ROBERT SHARPE and C. W. H E N D R IX , J R .,

9 having been fi r s t duly s wo rn 'to tell the truth, were 10 examined and t e s tifie d as f ollow s :

11 12 DIR EC T E X A MIN A TIO N

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13 BY MR. GUILD:

14 Q Are you M r. H e nd rix ?

15 M R. H E NDRIX : Yes.

16 Q And you, sir, are M r. Sharpe?

17 MR. SHARPE: Yes, sir.

( 18 MR. GUILD: And C oun s el will stip-1 I

19 ulate both of these gentlemen pa rti cip ate d 20 in R e s po n din g to Int e r r o gato ri e s previously 21 served by Pal m ett o A llia n c e with respect l

22 to this C o n t e n tio n ? '

23 ,V R . MCGARRY: T h at 's correct with f

( 24 respect to kr. H e nd rix.

25 MR. SHARPE: I r e a lly don't have any l

' EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTsNG SERylCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

Sharpo. Il o n d r i x -

Dircct 6

1 s A f fida vit s in there.

2 MR. MCGARRY: But Mr. Sharpe did 3

not have any A ffid a vit s wit h r e sp ec t to thi s.

4 MR. GUILD:

5 I s t a r. d corrected.

6 BY MR. G UILD:

7 Q Gentlemen, I refer you t o A p plic ant's 8

Answere to Inter ro ga t o rie s, it's a document dated

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9 December 31st, 1982, 10 On Page 9 of that document are some 11 quotes concerning Contention 44, if you would just 12

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take a moment and e xa min e that, please.

13 I b e li e v e both of you have seen that 14 Contention before?

15 MR. SHARPE: Yes.

16 Q

Since there are two Witne s s e s an s we rin g 17 1

the qu e s tion s as a matter of c la r it y, I would -a s k if 18 the qu e s tion is not posed to a s p e c i fi c Witne s s, if 19 you would identify you r s e lf before answering so that 20 the tape will reflect the identity of the person gi vin g 21 the answer.

22 A gain, I will ask, if eithe r I or M r. Riley 23 is asking th e qu e s tion and the qu e s tio n is not clear, 24 p

lease stop and ask for cla rifi c a tio n.

25 O th e rwi s e we will assume that the qu es ti on EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTN CAROUNA

Sharpo, Hendrix - Diroct 7

- 1 is understood, and that the answer i s responsive to k

2 that qu e s tio n.

3 Mr. Sharpe, would you please, sir, state 4 your present p o s itio n w ith the company and b ri e fly 5 give us a r e sume of your past expe rienc e wLth Duke

. 6 and of your professional training and background?

7 MR. SHARPE: My title is Nucle a r Engineer, 8 Lic en sin g, in the Nu clea r Production Department at 9 Duke Power. '

10 I have a B a ch elo r of Science Degree in 11 Nuclear Enginee ring f rom North C a r olin a State

12 U nive r s ity.

13 I have been w ith Duke since 1971. I am 14 responsible for lic e n s in g at C ata wb a, and I was also 15 involved in the p r e p a r a tion of the C at a wb a FSAR.

16 I wa s also involved for a numbe r of years 17 with the Electric Power Research In s titut e 's S ele c tin t 18 Pressure V e s s el Sub c o m mitte e.

19 Q A nd for what pe riod of time were you 20 involved with that s u bc o mmitt e e, Mr. Sha rp e; do you 21 r e c all ?

22 MR. SHAR PE: It seems li k e it was about ,

23 1975 to '78.

k 24 Q M r. H en d rix, would you do the same, your 25 p r e s e nt p o si tio n and a little r e sume of your background?

EVELYN SERGER ASSoctATES. .*TENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE CHARLOTTE. NOWTH CAROLINA

Sharpo, Hondrix - Diroet 8 1 M R. H E ND R IX : I am p r e e en tly a M aintenance 2 E n gin e e r, Nuclear P r o du ction D e pa rtm ent. I have 3 been with Duke Power since 1977, January of 1977.

4 I have a Bachelor's Degree in Physics from 5 Georgia Tech and my M a s t e r 's is in M e tallur gy. I

, 6 have been involved with various materials and p ro bl ems 7 at Duke Power C om p an y, and I have served on EPRI 8

C ommitte e s in the m at e rials a r ea s as well as H on o r 's 9 G roup and C om mit te e s and Sub committe e s as well as j 10 Atomic C o m mitte e s and Subco mmitt ee s.

11 Q Mr. H e nd rix, would you state s pe cifically l

l 12 the c o m mit t e e s or working groups that you have been s

13 a m e mb e r of that have dealt s pecific ally with 14 pressurized th e r m al shock or Embrittlement issues?

15 h. R . HENDRIX: In the E mbrittle m e nt area, 16 I have served a short p e riod of time on the Babcocks 17 and W il c o x Honor's Group Materials Su bc om mitte e, 18 w hi c h dealc with Reactor Vessel Su rv eilla nc e Program ;

19 E PRI Pressure Boundary Sub c ommitte e from 1978, and 20 I am still on that s ub c o mmitt e e which also deals with 21 Vessel M a t e rials S u r v eilla n c e problems or p r o g r am s .

22 Q M r. H en d r ix, could you reinte g e n e rally 23 how your present po citio n ' re late s to the s ubj e ct of 24 E mbrittlem e n t ?

25 MR. H E N D R IX : I am responsible for a EVELYN SEPGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERvlCE. CHARLOTTE. NO8me CAROUNA

Sharpo, H o n d rix -

Diroct 9

, 1

( general r e vi e w of s ome of the Materials Su r veilla nc e 2

Programs; s pecifically, Oconee, though that is not 3

my prima ry re s pon sibility.

4 Q How about M at e rials S u r v eill a n c e at any 5

other f a ciliti e s of the company ?

6

. MR. 'H E N D R IX :

I am involved in tho s e to 7

a much less degree at Catawba and M cG uir e.

8 MR. GUILD: G entlem en, if you would 9

be kind enou gh to' respond to q u e s ti on s now 10 that Mr.

R ile y has for you on the s u bj e c t 11 of his Contention, I would appreciate it.

12 13 CONTINUED DIR E C T EXA MINA TIO N 14 BY MR. RILEY:

15 Q M r. Hendrix, were you present at the time 16 of ultra s onic t e s tin g of the Oconee reactors ?

17 MR. HENDRIX: Was I p hy sic a lly p r.e s e n t ?

18 o p h y s i c a lly p re s ent, yes.

19 MR. H E ND R IX : No.

20 Q

Are you kn o wl ed ge a ble with the records 21 that were obtained in this te s tin g program?

22 MR. HENDRIX: In a g e ne r al s en s e, yes.

23 Q

How many of the Oconee reactors had been 24 t ested b y ultra so nic means ?

25 MR. HENDRIX: The ve s s els, the m s elve s.

EVELYN SERGER ASSOC 8ATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE NO

Sharpo. H endrix . Direct 10 1 a ll have been tested.

2 O When was the tin e each vescel was tested; 3 was it tested more than once ?

1 MR. H E N DRIX : I can't re ally give you a 5 s pe cific date that they were tested. Most r e c e n tly

. 6 all thre e units were tested in the years of '81 and '81 ,

7 but I can't gihe [o'u the s p ecific day or d a t e's t$ey 8 were te st e d.

9 That inf or m ation i s' available in the QA 10 O f fi c e , Quality Aesurance O ffic e.

11 Q Where was the t e s tin g done?

12 MR. HENDRIX: The t e s tin g was done by 13 Babcocks and W il c o x.

14 Q How many people were involved in the 15 t e s tin g program?

16 MR. H'E N D R IX : I r e ally am not aware.

17 g 1 would like to turn to the Int e r r o g at o rie s 18 that were Responded to on D ec embe r 31st; and Mr.

19 Sharpe, I am looking at Pages 67 and 68.

20 Am I correct in thinking that your 21 r e s p o n s ibilit y w o u ld be in the s a me area as M r.

22 Oue lle tt e 's --a m I pronouncing that c o r r e c tly ?

23 MR. C A R R': O u ell e tt e .

t 24 MR. SH A RPE: T h at 's right.

M Q To read that Inte r ro gato ry T en, it seys, svatvu s .... assocmus. sta~ones == omaa seavice, caaa'ons. nom ca.ou~a

Shnrpo, H o nd r ix - Direct 11 x

1 "At what temp erature will water in the ECCS bc 2 maintained ? Has any c o n s id e r a tio n been giv e n to 3

increasing this tempe ratur e ? Explain your R es pons e 4 in d e t ail. "

5 The A ns we r is that the water in the storag e 6

tank will be m ai~n t a in e d at a t e mp e ra tur e of 70 degre e sc 7

Is this the only source ef water fo r the Emsrgency 8 C oo lin g System ?

9 MR. SHARPE: T o' ' m y k n o wl e d g e it is.

10 Q A re you f amilia r with a gas pres su rize d 11 component that comes on at the highest pressure that 12 the EC CS w ould operate at?

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13 M R. SHARPE: I'm not sure if I understand 14 your qu e s ti on. Are you a llu di n g to the fluid tanks 15 in the UHI System ?

16 Q That's right.

17 MR. SHARPE: W e ll, those are not a 18 source the same as the fueling waters, s to ra ge water 19 tank.

M Q I know t he y a r en't, but are they a source 21 of water in the fluid storage tanks in an emergency 22 s itu atio n ?

23 MR. SHARPE: 'Yes.

t 24 Q

But what about the source of water for th e 25 High Pressure Inj e c tio n System ?

EVELYN SERGER ASSOC 4ATES. STENOTYPE PEPORTING SERV 8CE. CNARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpo, H en drix - Diroct 12 1 M R. SH AR PE: That comes from the r e f u e li ng k-2 water storage tank.

3 Q What about the Low Pressure Inj ec tio n 4 S ystem ?

, 5 MR. SHARPE: That comes f rom the r e fu eli ng N

. 6 water storage tank.

7 Q So there are two fuel sources?

8 M R. SH AR PE: W e ll, you have the ECCS 9 pum p s , and you have the p a s s i'v e tanks that would dum p 10 water into the c o o lin g system also.

11 Q bit they are physically s eparate ?

12 M R. SHARPE: Yes.

13 Q G oin g on to Page 68, Number 14 "D e s c ribe 14 in detail how the welds in U nit 2 are located away 15 from peak neutron exposure. Specify where and why so."

16 l

it was not possible to do 17 In R e s pon s e, "The core region s helves o f the 18 C atawba U nit '2 ' R 'e a c t o r Vessel are f abricated of 19 plate material and have longitudinal we ld s which are 20 angularly located as far away from the peak neutron 21 exposure as geometrically poasible."

22 l How many longitudinal welds are there?

l 23 MR. SH AR PE: k believe they are shown in 24 the FSAR.

U Q Do you r e c a ll what the angular eoacing is.

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERWCE. CMAN NORTM CAROUNA

Shcrpo, Hondrix - Direct 13 1 how many plates are i n vo l v e d ?

2 MR. SHAR PE: No, I don't.

3 Q A ll right, the reference on that is FSAR 4 Figure S.3.1-2. Would you mind referring to it in 5 response to the qu e s tio n ?

6

. MR. S H A R PE : Now repeat your qu e s tio n.

7 Q Yes, how many longitudinal welds are 8

there and how f ar separated are they angularly?

9 MR. SHARPE: L i k'e 90 degrees, 120 degree s, 10 18 0 degrees, that sort of thing. It looks like 120 11 degrees apart 1.n this fi g u r e .

12

. Q That would mean there are three longi-(

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13 tudinal welds?

14 MR. SH AR PE: Three longitudinal welds.

15 Q Now can you explain how it is possible to 16 locate that a s. f a r away from peak neutron exposure 17 as g e om e t ric ally possible?

18 Let me ask another qu e s tion fi r s t, I guess 19 this would be easier: In tracing the neutron ef flu en c e 20 around the circumference of the reactor, how many 21 time s does it peak?

22 MR. SH AR PE: I b eli e ve that was p ro vid ed 23 '

in the R e s pons e to the Discovery R eque st. It showed i

24 that the change in exposure versus t h e azi m u t h a l angle.

25 Q Now that was not in Response to C on te n tion EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 14

,. 1 44. If we take a.look at this, how many peaks would

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2 the r e be around th e circumf e r enc e ?

3 MR. GUILD: For the R eco r d, I m ig ht 4 note, that is an Attachment to the A ppilc ant 's 5 Response to CESG Discovery on this subject .

. 6 ,

THE WITNESS: I m ig ht note that this 7 was really a W e s tinghous e Response, and 8 that I am not that f a milia r with this.

9 And we were 's'ittin g . here t r yin g to 10 put this together to come up with' a 11 risponse for you, but I don't think we can 12 r eally address this as adequately as s.'-

13 W e s tin ghou s e could.

14 15 BY MR. RILEY:

16 Q A ll right, have you any basis for s ayin g, 17 and I realiz e what you have just said, the r a tio 18 between the peak cir cumf er ential ef flu e n c e and the 19 minimum cir cu mf e r e ntial e fflu en c e ?

20 MR. SHARPE: I r e ally wouldn't have a 21 response fo r that.

22 Q On Page 70, the Answer to C reads, "RT 23 SubNDT is then the highe r' of T SubNDT and T Sub C V. "

24 And it looks like a hyphen, " -60 degrees F."

25 Would that be a minus sign?

...u .macia associares. stenones aeroarino suavice. cuaawns. aoar* caaou-a

Sharpe, Hendrix - Diroet 15

< 1 MR. SH AR PE: Yes.

(

2 1.' R . HENDRIX: H en d rix, yes.

3 Q Thank you; Mr. Hendrix, are you f amiliar 4 with the d et e rminatio n of that ma gnitud e of 60 degree n 5 F; and if you are, would you please explain it?

. 6 M R. H E N D R IX : I am not f amilia r enough 7 with the d et e r mina tio n of the 60 degrees F numbe r to 8 r eally discuss.that.

W o u'I d it' be similarly true that y 'o u would

~

9 Q 10 not wish to discuss the va ria nc e in the 60 degree

~

11 numbe r ?

12 MR. HENDRIX: Not at all, I would not.

\

13 Q About four-fif th s of th e way down the same 14 page, and this may be m or e related to your concerns, 15 he r. Sharpe, it says, "For the m ain weld both drop 16 weight and Charpy V-notch Tests were p erf o rme d. "

17 W ould you define the main weld the 18 subject of the reactor?

19 MR. SH AR PE: This R e s po ns e is provided I

20 .

by W e s tin gh ou s e. I could not explain it any further.

l 21 the last sentence in the Responso C A ll right, 1

22 to 20 on Page 71 reads, "The transition tem p e ratur e l

l 23 approach conte mplate s t h e'h e a tu p and c o old o w n and 24 o p e r a tio n of reactor vessels will be controlled to 25 assure that the reactor vessel temperature is well EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERylCE. CMARLOTTE. NO8tTte *AROUNA

Sharpo, Hondrix - Direct 16 7 1 above the RT SubNDT du rin g these o p e ra t i o n s . "

(

2 Now this, I gather, M r. Sharpe, is in the 3 FSAR for C a ta wb a or some s imila r c o n t r o llin g 4 document?

5 MR. SHARPE: The controls being the heat-.

. 6 up and cooldown curves?

7 Q That's right, and the assurance that the 8 t e m p e ra tu r e is w e ll above?

9 MR. SHARPE: T h o's e curves are in the 10 FSAR.

~'

11 Q 11 right, quantitativply s p ea king, how muc h 12 is well ab ove ?

(

13 M R. SHARPE: I c ould n' t explain it any 14 further. W e s tin gh ou s e provided this Response.

15 Q Not wis hin g to be ar gumentative about it.

16 Duke will be o p e r atin g and Duke will be d e t e r minin g 17 what these t em p e r a tu r e s are.

~

18 A nd t e mpe ratu r e s are reportedly a 19 and I would lik e to get a sense d e s crip tion of v alu e, 20 of how much w ell above is.

21 MR. SHARPE: M a yb e I can explain how 22 the curves come about. W e s tin gho u s e pr o vid e s the 23 heatup and c o old own curves based on m at e rial e data 24 p r o vid e d in the FSAR.

25 T hi s had been p r o vid e d to us initially to gc '

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

Sharpa, Hsadrix -

Direct l

17 1

in the t e ch specs that are is sued to Duke with th e 2

o p e ra tin g li c e n s e through the life of the plant 3

s u r v eill a n c e capsule data to be used to update those 4

curves as necessary.

5 W e s tin g hou s e has the exp e rtis e in their 6

shop to do this, and I don't b e li e v e Duke r e ally has 7

the input into th os e curves.

8 Q

Do I anticipate those curves changing durin g 9

the li f e of the reactor ? '

10 MR. SH AR PE: I believe the curves that 11 are p r o vid e d in th e FSAR at this tim e in dic a t e that 12

( they a r e--m a yb e it wo uld be helpful to pull that 13 s e c tio n of the FSAR out.

14 Q Please do.

15 M R. SH ARPE: I am looking at the FSAR 16 Figure X 4 4 0. A 2 T hi s is the heatup and c oold own 17 curves, r e s p e c tively, for Catawba Units O n e. a_n'd Two 18 up to sixteen full- po we re d years; so s o me tim e prior 19 to exceeding sixteen f u ll- p o w e r e d years, we would 20 have to update the curves based on the s u r v e illa n c e 21 data that was a v aila ble at that tim e.

22 Q What time do you expect the fir s t 23 s ur ve lli a n c e data would be ordered for Catawba U nit s 94 O ne and Two in te rm s of--

25 MR. SHARPE: In accordance with 10 C F R 5 0 EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROLINA

Sharpo, H e n d r ix - Diroct 18 1 A p p e n dix H, I b e li e v e the fi r s t s u r v e ill a n c e capsule 2 comes out at the fir s t r efu elin g.

3 Q Have you anything to add to M r. Sharpe's 4 response, M r. H e ndrix ?

5 M R. HENDRIX: No.

. 6 Q Mr. H e ndrix, does Oconee operate on the 7 same basis that M r. Sharpe just de s c ribe d as 8 proposed for C atawba ?

9 MR. H E N D R IX : You mean--

10 Q With respect to ob s e rvin g he atup and cool-11 down o p e r a tion s which are, I quote, "

. . . w e ll above 12 the RT SubNDT"?

13 MR. HENDRIX: I would say I don't have 14 d e t ail e d k no wled ge as t e- what the margin between 15 where you are o p e rat i n g at a s p e cific temperature and l 16 pressure point is with respect to RT NDT; and I am l

17 not sure that is a valid c o mpa ri s on.

18 But they certainly operate with heatup and l

1 19 c o old own curves which will ensure that you are above 20 RT NDT.

l 21 I should rephrase that to say there is a 22 m a r gin for the embrittled f a cto r.

23 Q C ould we expand on that just a little bit ?

x 24 What is, as of the mo s t recent test, the highest RT 25 NDT for Oconee reactor vessel material?

EvEtvN eERoEg associ4TEs. sTENCTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Shnren. H endrix - Dirnet 19 1

MR. HENDRIX: I couldn't s ay what the 2 exact num be r is. A g ain, that in f o r m atio n is a v aila bl e 3 as per our response to other que s tio n s in thct that 4

is located in the Licensing Library.

5 Q Could you hypothetic ally acc ept 168 degrees 6 Fah renheit ?

I MR. HENDRIX: I could; I have no kn o wl e d ge 8

that is the highe s t or the lowe st number.

9 Q In the I nt e r r o g a t o'r'l e s , I believe that is th e 10 highest nu m be r indicated in your Response. If we 11 take that hppothetically, does that mean that the 12 vessel w ou ld be depr e s t urized before g e tting into the 13 vicinity of this highest RT NDT?

14 MR. MCGARRY: Excuse me. M r.

15 R il e y; do you have a reference of the 168, 16 and we can s tipula t e to that.

17 MR. RILEY: We will probably be 18 c o min g across it a little bit later. It is 19 on Page Seven of the filing of February 28 O

by the A p pli c a nt,. and the highest t em pe ra tu re l

21 l

1 E iven is a c t u a ll y 196, bottom lin e of that 22 table.

23 And I w o u l'd li k e to be sure of the 24 l

1 significance of the heading of that table.

25 It reads, "The RT space Degrees EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHAMA37YE NORTH CAJacLeMA

Sharpo, H o n d r ix - Diroct 20 1

F ah r e nh eit. . . " I should say, "RT SubDT Degrees 2 F ah r e nh eit, 9/30/82," and to the right there is a 3 letter, s m all "a".

4 C ould you tell me if that means at or on 5

9/30/82?

6 MR. HENDRIX: No, that refers to th e 7

footnote at the bottom which t ell s you the basis for 8

that number.

9 Q These were valu e s 'on 9/30/82?

10 M R. H E N DR IX : With the calculational 11 te chniqu e s that are referred to in footnote "a".

12 Q A nd that is not the end of the life, RT ND7  ?

13 MR. H E ND R IX : No.

14 Q That is how many degrees below b o ili n g 15 point?

16 MR. H E N DR IX : What number?

17 Q .

One hundred nin ety- six ?

18 MR. HENDRIX: It is obviously 16.

19 Q Right; with respect to d e p r e s s u rizin g the 20 r e a c to r, wo uld you on that basis be able to say at 91

~

what temperature you would have what minimal reacto e

~~

pressure?

23 MR. H E ND R IX : I am not an operator, and 94

~

I s. m not f a milia r with the o p e ra tin g curves or the 95

~

way they operate the plant.

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHAPLOTTE. NORTM CAROLINA

Sharpo, Hondrix -

Diroct 21

, 1 Q That is a s a ti sf ac tory an s we r.

Que s tion 21 2

deals with the " fracture m e c ha ni c s approach" and ther e 3 is a discussion of " crack toughness."

4 Of course, this is g oin g to be hi r . H e nd rix ,

5 Would you compare for us the load exten sio n diag r am 6

, tin s el cast for a specimen which was crack free 7

versus a s pecimen that had cracks in it?

8 MR. HENDRIX: I'm not sure what aspect 9

you would like to look a t, a 'n'd I cannot say in d e tail 10 that I have ever done that.

11 I would as sume for a notched specimen that 12 you would expect to see a f ailu r e and a lower load

('

13 than an unnotched specimen of the same p r o pe rtie s.

14 Which I think has been stated previously.

15 Q Would it make a diff e r enc e as to whether 16 this test was pe rf o rme d above or below RT NDT?

17 M R. H E N D R IX : Yes.

18 Q What would

{he diff e r enc e be?

19 hi R . H EN D RIX: A bove RT NDT you would 20 expect a double f r a c tu r e; below you would expect a 21 brittle fracture.

22 W ould you care to d e fin e brittle f r ac tu r e Q

23 i n terms of the lo ad extension dia g ram that would go 24 with it ?

25 hi R . HENDRIX: B rit tle fracture is l

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCI ATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING S$W8CE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 22 1 cha ra cte rized by a f r a c tu r e without s i gnific an t 2 clongation.

3 Q A ll right, now let's tr an slate that into 4 etress. With respect to an unnotched sample below 5 RT NDT, what m a gnitude of load would develop for

. 6 the notched or. c racked s p e cimen ?

7 MR. HENDRIX: You have to re pe at that, 8 Ia m not--you have to repeat that. I' m not sure I und e r sto od.

9 10 Q A ll rig ht, the load sustained by an unnotche d 11 s pe cim e n b e lo w RT NDT will have a certain value, an d 12 th e r e will be some extension a s s ociated with it.

(

13 For a cr a c k e d s pe cime n, what f r a c tio n of 14 load will develop up to the point of f ailu r e, at the 15 point of f ailur e ?

16 MR. HENDRIX: I have no id e a.

17 Q Will it be s ub s t antially less than the load 18 that developed for the uncracked epecimen?

19 Id R . H E N D R IX : I don't know whether it 20 would be s u b s t a n ti ally less or not.

l

( 21 O Y ou are i s. mili a r with the concept of 22 modulus ?

23 h! R . HENDRIX: 'Yes.

24 What sort of extension had you in mind whe n O

25 you responded that there would be very little extensio n EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENQTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CARouNA

Shorpo, H o nd rix -

Direct 23 1

or no extension fo r the cracked specimen ?

2 M R. HENDRIX: I r e a ll y d id n ' t have a 3

num be r in mind. That is a q u a n t i t r.t i v e statement 4

rather than a qu alit a ti ve s ta t e me nt.

5 Q So you wouldn't be able to translate a 6

s pe cific s t a t e m e rit in terms of a tins el va lu e or 7 loading based on a k no wle d g e of modulu s ?

8 MR. HENDRIX: N o, I would not pe r s onally 9

be able to do th a t s. no. '

10 Q Now, at a temperature above RT NDT, 11 again considering specimens of the type just discusse<1, 12 would the cracked specimen develop as much extensfor 1

13 as the uncracked specimen ?

14 MR. HENDRIX: I really don't know the 15 answer to that eithe r.

16 Q But your answer is it would not sustain 17 as high a lo ad ?

18 M R. HENDRIX: No, I would not expect it 19 would. A g ain, that is s uppo sitio n.

20 1

Q Has the Fracture Toughness Pr o g r a m referre d 21 t o in It em 23 been completed ?

22 .

MR. H E ND R IX : M r. H e n d rix, I am not 23 fa mili a r with that program.

24 Q

A re you f amilia r with that p ro g r a m, k r.

25 S harpe?

i EVELYN BE RGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERysCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 24 1 MR. SH AR PE: M r. Sharpe; I b e li e v e this 2 was in the FSAR. T hi s was a discussion p r o vid e d by 3 W e s tin 2 house; and I b elie v e the f ollow-u p discuselons 4 and Suppicmental R e epons e to the Int e r ro gato rie s 5 indi c a te d the program had not been c omplet ed.

, 6 There were a numb e r of progress r epo rt e.

7 Q A re you in any po sition to state when you 8 think the project will be completed ?

9 MR. SH A R PE: M r'.' Sharpe, no.

10 Q Do you know the period in which Catawba 11 One Reactor V e s s el was fabricated?

12 MR. SH AR PE: I do not.

13 Q Do you, W r. H end rix ?

14 MR. HENDRIX: I don't know s p e cific ally, 15 no.

16 Q W ou ld your response be the same for 17 C atawba U n it Two R eacto r Vessel?

18 MR. SH AR PE: Yes.

19 (M r. H e nd rix nodded his head 20 af fir matively. )

21 Q Are you f amiliar with th e NRC R ule s in 22 te rm s of ASME Code that a p plie s to the several 23 reactor ve s s els at C at a wbh One and C atawba Two?

24 MR. SH A R PE: I am not p e r s o n ally f a m ilia :-

25 with those.

EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVtCE. CMARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpe, Mondrix - Direct 25 1 MR. H E N DR IX : O nly in a very general 2 sense.

3 O You are a w e. r e that a dif f e r e nt rule a pplie s 4 for Catawba One and C at awb a Two?

5 MR. HENDRIX: Not s p e cific ally; you mean

. 6 in terms of s o m e 's p e cific aspect of the design and 7 con s truction ?

8 Q W e ll, what I was s p e c ifi c a lly seeking was 9 the date on which c o n s truc tioh wa s started for each 10 of those, and I have to understand that n e it h e r one 11 of you k n o w s ?

12 MR. SHARPE: Right.

(' 13 MR. C ARR: Excuse me, if I can call 14 their attention to our December 31 15 R e s pons es, Response to 18, Page 69 and 70 ,

16 appear to be addressing that; and I don't i

17 know if that will help th e m or not.

18 MR. HENDRIX: It helps in the sense 19 that w e un de r s tand--I think that the 20 construction design of the ve s s els and of 21 the plants, there was a diff e r ent code that E applie d during those for each of th on e. '

23 However, 'a s to the s p e cific s, you 24 know, what the dif f e r e nc e s in the two code i 25 might have been, of course, I have no EVELYN SERGER ASSOctATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERV 8CE. CHARLOTTE. NOMTM CAROUNA

. , . , . , , , , . _ , , , , , - , . . , , , . , ~ _ . . . . - - - . . -

Sharpo, H en d r ix -

Direct 26 1

d et ailed knowledge of that at all.

2 MR. GUILD: C oun s el, I might state 3

that the Answer to Interrogatory 25 referen e 4

the FSAR, S e c tion 5 . 3 .1. 5 ,

on C atawba 5

c om plia nc e with ASME specs.

6

'M R. RILEY: Also fo r the R e co rd, 7

there is a discussion of related ma tt e r s in 8

the SER 5 . 3 .1, Pages 513 to 522, but 9

n eit h e r in the A p p'll c a n t ' s Responses nor 10 the SER is the date of initiating f abric ation 11 given.

12

( It is sin ply that one was before '71, 13 and the.other was before '72 14 15 BY MR. RILEY:

16 Q

Did you find a s t a rtin g date in the FSAR?

17 MR. SHARPE: No, that gave the same 18 inf o rma tion you were just referring t o,

! the code dates 19 that apply to each of the vessels.

> 20 O A ll right, the questions I will ad dr e s a now 21 a re in reference tc your R e s pon s e d a te d .F e brua ry 28.

22 g a y,. on Page 63, the R e s po ns e--th a t is d e a lin g with 23 o v e r c o o lin g transients; and the A pplicant 's R e s pons e 24 1 3, aThere has been no o ve r c o o lin g transient at 25 O

conec of th e sort c onte mplate d in Contention 44."

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES, sTENOTYPE REPORTING SERylCE CHARLOTTE. hC8FTH CAROUNA

e*

Sharpo. Hendrix -

Direct

??

And I would lik e to have you let tr e Set b

, 1 2

better understanding of what "of the cort" means.

3 MR. HENDRIX: I can't answer that questi on 4 Q If y o u ' r e.. n o t able to a n s w e r=, can you tell '

5 us of any sort of o v e r c o olin g transients that h a 'v e 6

occurred at Oconee ?

7 M R. HENDRIX: No.

8 Q To your knowledge no o v e r:c o o l in g transient 9 have occurred? '

10 MR. HENDRIX: No, I c a n' t? tell you t h e. t 11 there have been.

12 Q Did Duke En gine e r s or other p e r o onn el

('

13 make the calculations for end of lif.o RT NDT, or wer e 14 these calculations mad e by someone e l s' o ? i 15 MR. H E N D R IX : Which s p e cific c a. l c u la t i o n s 16 are we referring to? '

17 Q At the hottom of Page'63, c alculation s of 18 58 degrees increase for Unit I a.nd a 94 d e g r.e e 19 i ncrease for U nit 2?

20  ?

NR. HENDRIX: Yec, ~

that is provideo by 21 W e s ting ho u s e.

That is in the FSAR.

22 Q M r. Hendrix, going with the discuealon 23 s tarted at the bottom of'P' age d4 and ending o n' 65' 24 a nd also g e n e r ally there have been r efe r enc e s t'o the 25 i n flu e n c e of nickel, copper, and phorphorus on the EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHAR 1CTTE. NCfrTM CAROUNA '

V

- Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 28 1

increase of RT NDT with neutron e fflu enc e.

\.

2 '

Are you f amilia r with the basis, eithe r

3 e xp e rim en tally or in conclusion, relating to the

- -' 4 copper content?

! 5 M R. HENDRIX: Only in a very general

. 6 ,,,,,,

7 Q A re you,able to tell us that you have some 8

~

f amilia rity with experimental work at which low 9

i copper seals were exposed to'ncutron e fflue n c e and 10 the- R T NDT f ollowe d ?

t /

11 -

MR. HENDRIX: No, I don't have those I2 k'in d s of d e t ail s .

( '

3 O On Page 66 at the bottom of the page--

14 this is for y o u, M r . Sharpe--the Ite m 1, "F ab ri c a tio n 1.5 y ;'i d Examin a tio n, the location is the QA V ault at 16 C h e'r o k e e . "

17 I wondered if th at would s till be the case I8 with the clocing down of Cherokee?

I9 M R. S H A R PE : I don't know whether that is l

' oo ~

the case or not. I b e li e v e we c .o p i e d some of those 21

, records, and I am not sure where they are; but we l ,

j 99

~~ .

have th e m now.

, 23 M R. RILEY: I g athe r, A: r . Carr--

24 -

L1 R . CARR: We brought them up I

25 here in case you wanted to come to the s

s t EvtLYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPOWNQ SERysCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA L_ ; _ - -

Sharpe, Hendrix -

Diract 29 1

\

Document Room and in s p e ht them.

2 I'm not sure where they are in 3

C ha rlo tt e, 4

but they are available if you 5

would like to look at them.

MR. RILEY: Thank you.

6 MR. CARR:

7 Is that ri g ht. M r.

H e nd rix ?

8 MR. HENDRIX: Yes, it is; I don't 9

know exac tly where the y ar e, but we could 10 certainly fin d th e m.

11 ~

12 BY MR. RILEY:

(

13 Q On Page 67, top item, Table 2-14 MR. CARR: Excuse 15 me; Roger t e ll s 16 me it is already in the Room, the infor-m a tio n is there.

17 MR. RILEY: Thank you very much.

18 19 B Y MR. RILEY:

20 Q On Page 67, 21 l o c a ti on ,

item 2 unde r th e common "QA DPC Unit 1 ECl273 U nit 2 22 d o cu m e n ta tion a

ct issued by B and W."

23 24 C This is from M'cGuire Units One and Two.

25 ould you explain to me the a s so cia tio n of B and W?

MR. SHARPE:

Babcocks and Wilcox C o m p a r. y EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPCarTING

. SERVICE CMARLOTTE N RTM CAROUNA

Sharpe, H e n d rix -

Direct 30 E

I 1 does our ult ra s onic in s p e c ti o n of the vencels.

2 Q Can you tell us hi r . Sharpe, or Mr. Carr, 3 if the progress reports referred to on Page 68 Ite m 1 4 23 on, "F ra ctu re Toughners Program," are available 1

5 here in Charlotte for ins pection ?

6 MR. CARR: I don't know, I don't 7 t hin k so; I don't know, g MR. SH AR PE: I don't know.

9 10 BY M R. RILEY:

11 Q A re these progress reports available s ome-12 where in th e Duke organization ? Is this s o me thin g 13 that you just know about by re po rt ?

14 MR. SH AR PE: I d on 't know.

15 Q A ll right, going to the bottom of that 16 page--

17 MR. CARR: May this be a clarificatio r.

~

18 by Counsel?

I am informed that those 19 reports have been done by W e e tin ghou s e, 20 but we are uncertain as to whe the r we have 21 them here.

22 I don't think we do.

23 '

24 BY MR. RILEY:

25 Q At the b ctt o m of th e page there is a sentenc e EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERvlCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpe, Hendrix - Dir ec t 31 1 that reads, "As A pplic a n t s indic ate d in their Decembe e 3&

2 R e rpons e s, they are unabic to answer the que stion 3 c onc e rnin g ' f e r ritic c o m p o s itio n' because they cannot 4 ascertain it s m e a nin g. "

5 Do you hold with that Response, M r.

. 6 H e n d rix ?

7 . MR. HENDRIX: Yes, I am a f r aid I do.

8 Q Are you f amiliar with the use of the term 9 f e r ritic in the Safety E v a l u a t'i'o n s Report?

10 MR. H EN D R IX : No.

11 Q L 'e t me refer you then to Page 513 where 12 there are two references. T hi s will be about 12 lin e s

(' 13 down in the middle of the Response, 1 in parentheses.

14 MR. SH A RPE: Yes.

15 Q Then going on to five, "f e r ritic steels."

16 MR. H E N D R IX : I understand how that is 17 used, yes.

18 Q Would it be possible then to respond to 19 Que s tion Number 25 about wh at f e r ritic c ompo sition 20 is used at C at awba ?

21 hR. HENDRIX: Do you mean then the 22 c om p o s i tio n of the f e r ritic materials used?

23 Q Ycs.

24 MR. HENDRIX: Can I respond? Let me 25 read this.

EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

Sharpe, Hendrix - Direct 32 1 Q C e r tainly, s p e cific ally what is the 2 c ompo sitio n of the f e r ritic materials used at Catawba  ?

3 M R. H E N D R IX : Right, let me say I can't 4 p e r s o n a lly respond to that. I b e li e v e that inf o r ma tio.1 5 is in the FSAR.

6 MR.

SHARPE: ~Y e e , that le in Table 5.3.3 -2 7

for C a ta wb a. U nit 1 Reactor V e s s el. The c o r re s p on di .s g 8

inf o r m a tio n for Unit Two is in T able 5.3.3-3.

9 Q M ay I take a look 'ht it to see th e degree 10 of completenes s ? T ha nk .y ou.

11 MR. SHARPE: Eack up a page.

12 Q Yes, thank you. That is r e sp o n s i v e ; thank

\'

13 you. On Page 69 in Line 3 of your Table Al of 14 A pp e n dix A, and this le Appendix A to what?

15 MR. HENDRIX: If you look at the s p e cific 16 capsule for the numbers that are li s t ed in Table One, 17 there is an A p p e ndix A and T a ble Al will p r o vid e that 18 in f o rm a tio n; so that Appendix is for each of those 19 capsule reports.

20 They are a standard f o r m a t.

21 Q In the capsule would you list the types of 22 material that are pr es ent; for example, reactor plate, 23 reactor weld m a t e rial, boiting m a t e rial, that sort of i 24 thing?

l 25 MR. H E N D R IX : You are not talking s p e cifi c EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROLINA

Sharpo, H endrix - Direct 33 1 m a t e r ia l, just in general what types of mate rial are 2 the r e ?

3 Q W e ll, s p e cific ally, in th e ca p sule s that 4 will be applied at Catawba.

5 MR. HENDRIX: I again have no d e taile d 6 inf o r ma tion of that. That should be in c lu d e d in th e 7 FSAR.

8 Q Can you tell us for Oconee?

9 MR. HENDRIX: For Oconee, I can't tell 10 you s p e cific ally. That is a large v o lu m e of infor-11 m atio n; however, it is included in the capsuic reports 12 and there are general do cume nt s that de sc ribe the

(

13 o ve rall Oconee S u r v e ill a n c e Program; and all that 14 in fo rma tion is available in those documents.

15 Q C ould you tell us the physical f o rm in whic h 16 the weld mate rial is include d ? In other words, are 17 w el din g rode used in the exposure?

l 18 h. R . H E N DR IX : No.

l

( 19 Q A re welds produced?

20 Welds are produced; I thini MR. HENDRIX:

21 the best answer to that is to look in d e t ail at those 22 reports because they will tell you e x a c tly what the 23 shape of the s pe cimen is and where they were observe d 24 and all the d c t a il s that you would require.

25 Taking a lo o k at T able 70, Q Thank you. anil EVELYN BERGER 455CCp4TES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERvtCE. CHARLOTTE. DeORTH CAROUNA

Sharpe. Hendrix - Direct 34 I this is for you, te r . H end rix, you have a degree in g

2 physics and a degree in m etallu r gy, and you have. bee n 3 lo o kin g at numerieni data for much of your academic 4

and professional life.

5 What do you think of the t hi r d c o lu rrn w he r e 6

every initial RT NDT is 20 degrees?

7 hi R . H E N D R IX : I r e ally have no comment.

8 Those numbers were p r o vid e d by the vendor based on 9

t e s tin g.

10 Q Did you ever qu e s tio n their c r e dibilit y ?

11 h; R . H E N D RIX : No.

12 Q A re you f amiliar with the phenomena of

(

I3 variance in m e a s u r in g physical attribut es ?

14 Id R . H E N D RIX : In general.

15 Q Does this strike you as being a r e rn a r k a b le 16 e xc e p tio n to what we u s u ally see?

17 h2 R . H E N D R IX : A g ain, look I

would hEve [to 18 at exactly where those numbers came from; and I am 19 certainly not the best person to address where these t

20 numbe r o came f r om . sinc e they were arrived at 21 considerably before my employment with Duke Power.

22 l Q These represent ten diff e r ent w e ld s . If 23 we take a look at the fourth c o lu m n we see a range i

24 of values f rom one hundred eighty to one hundred 25 ninety-six.

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE, CHARLOTTE. NORT1 CAROUNA

, - - - . n, . , ,

Sharpe, Hen ~drix - Direct 35 1 VTould you care to make a ctatement on 2 whether that r e p r e r e nts a la r g e degree of variance or 3 not ?

4 MR. H ENDRIX : No, I wouldn ' t care to 5 c om men t.

. 6 Q Can you explain the large degree of va rianc e 7 in that fourth c o lu m n as a m et allur gi s t ?

8 MR. HENDRIX: I think those numb e r s were 9 arrived at u sin g R EG-Guid e 199, and where one picks 10 up variances there, I r e a lly haven't looked at 11 in any d e t ail.

/

12 Q We we r e .t old in some of your R e sp on s e s

( ~

13 that the rate of change in RT NDT depends upon the 14 copper content, phosphorus c ontent, and nickel conten t.

15 M ay we c o rr ec tly conclude from looking at 16 this data there was great varia a b ili t y in the copper, l

a n d / o r' ni c k e l content in t h e v a r 'i o u s 'd a t a, P l 17 phosphorus, 18 MR. HENDRIX: A gain, I cannot comment.

l 19 It would be more useful to look at the ch e mis t r y of 20 th e s e m ate rial s th at I referenced from the capsule 21 report.

22 A gain, the che mis trie s are th e re.

23 Q In the table, there is a sentence thct reads ,

24 "It has been shown that the RT NDT value s calculated 25 for R e gulato ry Guide 1.99 are co n s e r va tiv e. "

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpe, H e n d r ix - Direct 36 1 Will you explain why they are c o n s e r v ative; 2 how this c on s e rvatism is assured,  ?.' r . Sharpe?

3 MR. SHARPE: I have r e vi ew ed the r e s ult s 4 of our capsule reports, and in a general sense; and 5 I have compared those to the R E G-Guid e va lu e s , to

. 6 the actual; and in general the REG-Guide numbers are 7 c on s e rvative.

8 O A ll right, in this context can c on s e rv a tiv e 9 be expressed in degrees F ah r e nh eit ?

10 MR. SHARPE: No.

11 Q In what language can c on s e rvativ e be 12 expressed?

(

13 MR. SH AR PE: It can be expressed in 14 degrees F ah r e nh eit, most c e rtainly.

15 Q W ould you pleas e express it in degrees 16 F ah r enheit ?

17 MR. SH AR PE: It varies.

18 Q Yes, but can you give us a range?

19 gg, ggAgpE: No, I can't s pe cific ally give 20 you a range; that data is in tho s e r e po rt s, s p ecific all y 21 in a table.

22 A nd it is s p e cific ally compared.

23 Yes, but h'. r . H 'e n d r i x ,

Q what I'm a s kin g for 24 is your professional judgment as to whether or not 25 these dif f e r e nc e s in degrees Fahrenheit are conservat] ve EVELYN BE AG tR ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

f Sharpe, Hendrix - Direct 37 1 or not.

2 What I' m a s king you to help rn e with is 3 how~many degrees m a r gin is a c o n s e r va tive m ar gin ?

4 MR. HENDRIX: The p r o ble m I'm having as 5 far as I'm concerned, any actual num be r that falla

. 6 under the predicted numb e r is c o n s e' r v a t i v e ; so I can 7 speculate on what the range of diff er ence s were from 8 rn y memory.

9 A gain, I just d o n ' t ' 't hi n k that is useful 10 when we a c t u a lly have the ~ info rmation available to 11 look a t.

12 O But you wouldn't need that rn a t e r ia l in

(- 13 f r ont of you, would you, in order for you to say what 14 you consider the threshold level for c o n s er vatis m, 15 aow many de gree s ?

16 M R. HENDRIX: I would consider that if 17 :he actual number was equal to or less than the 18 a r e dic te d nu m be r, then anything less than the predicte d 19 .s c on s e r vative.

20 The p rediction was then c ons e rvative in 21 t erms of shif t.

22 Q In other words, it could be as s m a ll as 23  : ero degrees Fahrenheit?

(

\ 24 MR. HENDRIX: It could be as s m a ll as 25  ::ero degrees F a h r e nhe it.

EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

Sharnn. M e n d ri v - Direct 3R

,- 1 Q On Page 71 there is anoth er lis tin g of 2

s o u r c e s.. I believe these are the same ones that we 3

were looking at before and are a v a ila bl e at Duke?

4 MR. HENDRIX: Yes.

5 Q A re you f amiliar with th e E PRI R eport on

. 6 R ea ctor A n n e a li n g'?

7 M R. H E ND RIX : Yes, I' v e scanned,that 8 report, not in d e tail.

9 Q Right, are there any physical provisions 10 in the C a t awba --le t's make that Oconee fir s t--O c one e 11 instructions that would p e r mit the use of the method-12 ology as discussed in the EPRI R e por t, any of the 13 a nne alin g te c hnique s which they discus s ?

14 MR. HENDRIX: I couldn't address that 15 qu e s tion, no.

16 Q Sharpe, Mr. with respect to Catawba, have 17 you info rmation about wh ethe r or not the Catawba 18 c on s t ru ction is such that it would f acilita t e the use 19 of one of those techniques.

20 MR. SHARPE: To the best of my knowled g e ,

21 th e r e is nothing th at would p r e clud e that. However, 22 th e r e is no indication th e r e would be RT NDT s hif t s 23 based on the present forecast.

24 M R. H E N D R IX : I don't know of anything 25 that would oreclude a n n e ali n g to Oconee veccels. To EVELYN SERGER AESOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLDTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

Sharpe, H e n d rix - Direct 39 1 m ak e a d e t e r min a tio n you would have to look in d e t a il, s

2 Q If I understand you c o r r e c tly, kr. Sharpe, 3 you are saying that the forecast of 40 a c tu al op e r atin g 4 years lifo for RT NDT at Oconee is such that you 5 anticipate no need to anneal in accord with P a rt 50?

. 6 MR. S H' A R P E : I was referring to C a ta wb a.

7 Q I' m sorry, I meant C a tawb a.

8 MR. SH AR PE: I b elie ve that is correct.

9 could you repeat the qu e s tio n 7 I wae keying on Oconiee.

10 (Wh e r eu p o n, the fo rme r qu e s ti o n

~

11 was read by the Court R e po rter as 12 f ollow s : "Qu e s tion: If I under stand f

('

13 you c o r r e c tly, IV r . Sharpe, you are 14 s a yin g th a t th e forecast of 40 actual l

15 op e r atin g years life for RT NDT at l

l 16 Oconee is such that you anticipate no 17 need to anneal in accord with P a rt 5 0 ? ")

18 l

i 19 BY MR. RILEY:

j 20 Q If I understand you c o r r e c tly then, Mr.

l l

21 Sharpe, your reason for not considering a nn e ali n g at 22 C atawba is your forecast for a lif e time RT NDT; is 23 th at it would fall within Part 50?

24 MR. S H A R PE: I think we are s a yin g there

! M was nothing that would preclude a n n e a lin g . At this EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHADLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpe, Hendrix - Direct 40 I time we do not a n tic ip a t e that it would be necessary f

.s 2 to anneal the C a t a wb a vessel du rin g the lif etime base d )

3 on th e expected shif t in RT NDT.

4 Q M r. S h a r p'e. , has the s hif t, w e ll, let's put 5 that dif f e r ently: At the time that Oconee was built

. 6 was there concern with RT NDT increasing over a 7 period of time ?

9 M R. SHARPE: A gain, I wa s not involved 9 at that time so I r e a ll y , I would assume that there 10 was, but I don't know that for sure.

11 Q W ould you not expect that tin s el form 12 would have addressed the m a tt e r at that time if it i.

13 were re c o gniz ed ?

14 MR. SHARPE: I r e a ll y c a n't c om me nt.

15 Q To y o ur k n o wl e d g e did anybody in Duke 16 E ngin e e rin g or M etalur gical Staff know what the l 17 RT NDT, know of the time they were f ab ric ated ?

l 18 MR. SH AR PE: I b e lie v e that information 19 is in the Oconee FSAR.

20 Q That RT NDT was the d e t e r mi nin g f a c t o r--

21 M R. SH AR PE: I d on't think it was a 22 t e r mi n o lo g y that was used at that tim e. It was the i

23- subNDT.

l 24 Q Right, would you e xplain the dif f er enc e ?

l 25 MR. SH AR PE: I could not.

l EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERV 1CE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA l

Sharpe, H en d rix - Direct 41 1 MR. HENDRIX: The best place is in the 2 W eldin g R e s ea rc h B u ll e ti n 175, which is r e ally the 3 basis for that argument; and that is the clearest 4 place to get the discussions, the diff e r enc e between 5 those two nu mb e r s .

. 6 Q M r. Sharpe, do you know if any forecast 7 was made based on RT SubNDT which was o bt ain e d 8 for Oconee and its end of operating life valu e ?

9 MR. SHARPE: Yes, there was a curve that 10 shows the end of life, that shows the SubNDT value.

11 Q How does that compare, the present f o r e.

12 cast for end of lif e ?

L' 13 MR. SHARPE: I cannot comment on that, 14 l'm not r e ally p e r s o nally f a enilia r with the r ela ti o n -

l 15 ship between NDT and SubNDT, to my knowledge.

16 Q Just s t a yi n g with the SubNDT, has current l

17 in f o rm a tio n or recent inf o r mation, s a y 19 8 2, say when

! 18 the coupone last te s tin g was that were pe rf ormed--

19 Some of those are pretty recent, aren't

! 20 they?

21 MR. MCGARRY: I would lik e the R ecc> r d, l ,

22 to r e fle c t there have been quit e a few l 23 answers to the eff ect of I don't know; and 24 our p o s itio n has been if we had the l

l D W e s tin g ho u s e and B and W individuals here, EwELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES, STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharpe, Hendrix - Direct 42 1

they w o uld have been much more responsive .

2 Eut we find ourselves today doing.the 3

best we can.

4 MR. RILEY: We appreciate that. We 5

have not persisted in any other areas in 6

which this has been the case.

7 MR. GUILD: Palmetto A llia n c e 8

requested C ou n s el to take the telephone 9

D e p o s ition, and th e' A pplicant d e c lin e d to 10 do that R eque s t; and the re f o r e due to the II expense of tra n s po r tin g the W e s tin ghou s e 19~

Wit ne s s to Charlotte or C olumbia, we have i

13 been un ab le to take their D e p o s itio n.

I4 MR. SHARPE: Mr. R ile y, I b e li e v e 15 in R e s pon s e to Interrogatory 34 Lists the 16 dates of the r e s pe c tiv e Oconee S u r v e illan c e 17 C ap sule Reports. -

18 19' BY MR. RILEY:

" Q A nd it is 1981?

21 MR. SH AR PE: Yes.

29-Q And that w ould be for Oconee III ?

23 MR. SHARPE: 1981 for Oconee II, both of N 24 them; yes.

95 O Eased on those reports, cannot the NDT EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE, CMARLOTTE, NORTM CAROUNA

Sharne. H e nd rix - Direct at I v alu e b e _ d e t e r min e d rather than RT NDT7 2 Iv. R . HENDRIX: For some materials, yes.

3 Q F or the materials used?

4 MR. HENDRIX: For the m ate rial s that are 5 in those capsules, y es .

. 6 Q Right?

7 M R. HENDRIX: Let me take a step back, 8

I am not sure of that. It depends on how the initial l

9 l TNDT values were d ete rmined. If they were drop 10 weight tear tests, it would not be a one to one 11 c o mp a ri so n.

12 You could get a numbe r which may be t

13 s imila r, but maybe wouldn't be the s a m e. A gain, I 14 don't have d e t aile d knowledge of how the initial 15 toughness num be r s on the vessel materials and weld 16 numbers were obtained, so I r eally don't know how w o 17 could compare.

18 Q Do you know if the drop weight was used 19 for qu alif yin g some of the materials in C atawba U nit s  ?

20 MR. HENDRIX: I r e ally don't have s pe cific 21 inf o rm a tio n, I would have to look and see what was 29 -

l L

used.

23 Q The i n fo r m a tio n was given in the SER, as 94 a matter of fact, fiv e exceptions are provided with respect to types of t e s tin g done on reactor materials, I

EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE, CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA l

Sharpe, Hendrix -

Direct 44 I which means that.at least as I would int e rp r e t it, 2

that the NRC feele able to convert numbers given by 3 one test procedure to another?

4 k R. HENDRIX: Yes.

5 Q And if we accept that pr emis e--

. 6 MR. H E N D RIX : I said that that w ould not 7

be a one to one c ompa ris on, but you could get a 8 c o m p a ri s o n; yes.

9 Q For the materials in those capsules?

10 MR. HENDRIX: For the materials in those 11 capsules.

12 Q If we accept that for the mate rials in thos e s

13 capsulee, how does the current forecast for end of 14 li f e rather than TNDT compare with that initial fore-15 cast?

l 16 MR. H E N D R IX : A gain, I go back; the best 17 way to look at that is to get those reports and do 18 that c om p a ri s on.

19 I can't do that, m y s elf, now.

20 Q Of your own personal knowledge, you don't 21 have a r e c o 11c e ti o n of those two sets of values and l

22 how they compar e ?

23 l MR. HENDRIX: No.

x 24 Q Do you, Mr. Sharpe?

25 MR. SHARPE: No, I can't.

l evetyn sencen associates. srsworves naronrina senvics.cMantorTs. wonrw cAnouna l

l

Sharpe, Hendrix - Direct 45

, 1 O I am now pi c kin g up A p plic an t 's R e s po ns e s 2 dated March 25, 1983. I am looking at Eesponse to 3 It e m Two on Page T hi rt y -Ei g ht, and M r. H e nd rix, 4 your initials f ollow this Response.

5 The fir s t sentence reads, "The reason that

. 6 the RT SubNDT v a'l u e s exp e ri en c e d at Oconee have 7 deviated, if they have f rom the o ri gi na l predicted 8 values, is set forth in the doc um en ts listed b elow. "

9 And I wondered whk you phrased th e 10 centence as you did, "if they had."

11 MR. HENDRIX: Because I di dn't 'g o through 12 and do a d e t a il e d, p o i n t by point comparison of each

(' 13 to d e t e r m in e whether or not there we re deviations; 14 and I wa s n' t sure whether there had been.

15 Again, I could go back to my answer that IG the best way to lo ok at those things is to look at the 17 cetual reports and do the comparisons for yo u r s elf.

18 It is there in -

single table.

19 Okay, thank you.

Q 20 MR. GUILD: C oun s el, we are talking 21 about a s im ple answer that appears on a 22 single page of documentr.

23 We can e a'v e ou r s elve s a lot of troubl e s 24 and have a clear answer to a narrow 25 qu e s tio n if M r. Q u e 11e tt e or Mr. Sharpe ca n EVELYN BERGER ASSOCRATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROLINA

Sharps. H e n d rix - Direct 46

, I help me out with where the documents are, ic 2 I will go fetch them.

3 MR. M CG A RR Y: We can r efle c t that 4

we have now c a r ried in from the Document 5

R oom all of the m a t e rial e that have been 6

produced so far on Contention 44; and they 7

are a v a ila bl e here to us today.

8 M R. RILEY: I would li k e to inquire 9 of D u ke 's Counsel considering the v o lu m e 10 of this ma t e rial, which is a p p roxim ately 11 two inches, might it not be more expeditious 12 if I will go through it, and if there is s

13 s om e thin g that will prove useful, , to brin g 14 it up at a later date rather than take it up 15 at this point?

16 hi R . MCG A RR Y: C e r t ai nly, let me 17 state our po s itio n. Our p o s ition is this 18 material has been a v aila ble in this room 19 and discovery closes on this s u bj e c t on 20 May 20; and that is next F riday.

21 MR. RILEY: I think your point is 22 w e ll taken.

23 24 BY MR. RILEY:

25 Q What in the NRC do cume nt, it s el f, there, EVELYN SERGER ASSOctATES STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CNARLOTTE MONTH CAROUNA

.3

Sharon, H e n d r ix - Diract 47 1 responds to our Discovery dated December 18, and I s

2 am not holding you responsible for what the NRC says ,

3 but there is a sentence here that involves you, and 4 perhaps you can e nli ght e n me on it.

5 On Page 86 of this pa r ticula r file, and you

. 6 are welcome to l o'o k at this sentence, " Final design 7 d e tail s " this is in the context of considering over-8 c o o li n g and ove r pr e s surization events, " Final design 9 d e t a il s will be r efle c t ed in p'l a n t technical s p e c ifi-10 c ation s. "

11 Can you t e ll us what the status of that is, 12 M r. Sharpe?

i 13 MR. SHARPE: No, I think you have to ask 14 the NRC Staff about that.

15 Q Is it true that the design details on d e alin g j

16 with o ve rc ooling and o ve rp r e s s uriz ation were not 17 c om ple te as of D e c e mb e r 18 last year; and if it is.

18 are they complete now ?

19 MR. SHARPE: We have addressed Cask A -4 0 ,

20 P r e s o uriz ed T h e r m al Shock, in the Catawba FSAR. I 21 r eally couldn't comment on it beyond that.

l 22 Q As far as you know, the r e are no outstandi dg l

23 requests from staff wit h respect to your responses?

24 SHARPE:

MR. Correct.

l M Q On Page 87 is an In te r r o g ato ry that Duke EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTY*E REPORTING SERvtCE, CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

Sharos, Hendrix - Direct 48 I was also pr e s ented with, "What is warm pr e s tr e s sing  ?

2 Will this process be used on the C at awb a rea ctor s ? "

3 As I r e c all, the R e s pons e was warm 4

prestressing was a ph e no m en on, not a process; and 5 M r. Hendrix is in agreement with that statement?

6 MR. H E ND R IX : Yes.

7 Q However, the NRC treats it as if it were 8

a process; and will you t e ll us what the NRC had in 9

mind. M r. H e nd rix, in m akin g its Response which I 10 hand to you ?

11 MR. HENDRIX: I certainly cannot address 12

,- the phenomena of warm prestressing. That is much

(

' 13 b ett e r addressed by the person f rom W e s tin ghou s e 14 who would have come.

15 O Would you now take the po sitio n that in the 16 minds of some people warm prestressing is a process 17 as w e ll as a pheno m enon ?

18 MR. HENDRIX: I really can't discusa th at 19 in any d e t ail. I guess no comment on that.

20 Q One sentence there which I c an' t understan d, 21 and perhaps you can help me, " Warm prestressing wa s 22 not used for e va lu a tin g the reactor vessel integrity 23 of C ata wb a U nit s One and Two."

'. 24 MR. H E ND RIX : A ,a t in, Ted Meyer f rom 2 who w ould have been here, W e s tinghous e , is the pers an EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

~ . _

Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 49 I to answer that que stion. He is co mpletely ca pable of

(

2 d oin g that. '

3 Q The same page, in Response to Interrogato ry 4 N in e about training for han dlin g o v e r c o olin g and over- -

5 p r e s s uriza tion transients, "Im p r o v e m e n t s in training

. 6 and o p e ra tin g procedures concerning ov e r c o olin g and 7 o v e r -p r e s s u r i z a t i o n are under development by the 8 S ta f f. "

9 Have you any f a milia rity with this, kr.

10 Sharpe or Mr. H endrix ?

11 MR. HENDRIX: W e ll, I think we could say 12 that improve m ent s in training and operating procedure a

's 13 were an outgrowth of TMI, w hi c h we have addressed.

14 The o p e r a tin g procedures in re spon se to 15 NUREG ; 737 Item I C l, I b e li e v e we certainly 16 provided copies of those procedures to the Inte r ve no r s .

l 17 Q Would you agree. Mr. H e n drix, to an NRC 18 R es po ns e which reads, "Lon gitudinal welds are not 19 p r e f e r able to cir c um f e r e ntial welds in maintaining 20 the reactor vessel inte grity. The stress int e n sity 21 factors f rom the longitudinal RN crack under 22 pressurized thermal shock c onditio n, whi c h would be 23 greater than the stress i n' t e n s i t y factor from a

' 24 circumf erential oriented crack."

25 The law that a p p li e s stress intensity factor EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

Sharon. H e nd r ix - Direct SC 1 is less likely a brittle f actor ?

(

2 MR. HENDRIX: I r e ally cannot respond to 3 th at .

4 Q If these qu e s ti o n s are outside your - d omain 5 of technical o p e r atio ns , why please so indicate. If

. 6 you have a temperature dif f e r e ntial between the inside 7 dia m e te r and the outside diamet er of 250 degrees, 8 meaning that the inside is hotter than the outside by 9 250 degrees, would you be able to tell me what the 10 stresses at belt lin e would be at the inside diameter 11 and at the o u t' a i d e diam ete r; and where the neutral 12 plane would be located ?

\ '

13 h: R . HENDRIX: I would not.

14 O The same answer would be tru e for stresse s 15 perpendicular to the plane of the b elt lin e ?

16 h1 R . H EN DRIX : Yes.

17 Can you t ell me what the c o e f ficie nt of Q

18 the r m al expansion is as a function of temperature for 19 th e m a t e r ial s in the reactor for the range of life 20 to 600 degrees F ahr enheit ?

21 HENDRIX: I cannot p e r s o n ally tell h1 R .

U you th at now.

23 Do you have any tabular mate rial that woulc, Q

24 l

enabic you to say?

25 H E N DRIX : I feel certain that I could M R.

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATE S. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA

- - - - . - , - , _ - , . ,n, ,v---y.- . , , e .-:_r-_, %w, re_. m--y_-

Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 51 1 find that m a te rial; yes, sir.

2 Q Y ou c ou ld find that?

3 MR. HENDRIX: Yes.

4 Q With respect to variances and thermal 5 c o e f fici ent p ro pe rty, do you think that th e lit e r atur e

. 6 you would have a v:.i l a b l e to you would give i n f o r rn a t i o n 7

l as to the variance c o e f fi c i e n t of expansion; for examp le, t ,

8 for plate to plate over the o p e r a tin g te mpe ratur e 9 range?

10 M R. H E N DR IX : I thin k the information tha t i

11 I would have r e a dily available wo uld not speak to the 12 variance.

3 .,,

s' . .

13 If one wanted to do a m or e d e t aile d look, l

14 you could probably come up with that.

15 Q Are you f am ill'a r with the eff ect of fluence l

16 l on th e r m al coefficients ?

1 17 MR. HENDRIX: N o.

18 Q You would disregard this as ir r ele va nt or 19 is it p os i b ly an im p o r t a nt qu e s tion ?

20 MR. HENDRIX: I cannot respond; I hav.e 21 absolutely no inf o r mation on the effect of e fflue nc e 22 on thermal shock e xpa n s io n coefficients.

l 23 Q Did the reactor vessel that was used on

' 24 C atawba One o rigina te outside of, and I can't pronoun ce 25 it, De R otte rdame Drodgdak M att s c ha p pu N.v.--

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORTM CARON

Sharpo, Hendrix - Direct 52 1 good try.

2 K'. R . hiCGARRY: Better than I could

-3 do.

4 hi R . SHARPE: I b e li e v e we have 5 identified in the FSAR and Responses who

. 6 made the ve s s els, if that is what you are 7 asking.

8 9 BY hi R . RILEY:

10 Q S p e cific ally did it originate in a c ombu s tion 11 engineering di vi s io n in Indiana? It p r o vi d e d a number 12 of vessels to the R o tt e rd am e organization at one ti m e ,

i 13 I want to know if this is one of th e m.

14 hR. SHARPE: I don't have any s p e cific 15 knowledge of that.

16 Q Do you think there is a ny t hin g in the FSAR 17 about it ?

18 hi R . SHARPE: I think the FSAR or the 19 In te r r o g a t o r y Responses i n di c a t e who the vessel 20 manuf actu rer was.

21 I b eliev e there was a line of que s tions on 22 that.

23 Q W e ll, that is the Rotterdame concernE but t 24 y.m asking for the history of the vessel because 1 25 know of a number of engineering vessels by R o t t e r d a n- e.

EVELYN 8 ERGE R ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERylCE. CHARLOTTE, NORTH CAROUNA

Sharpe. H en d rix - Direct 53

- 1 MR. SHARPE: I am not f a m ili a r with that.

2 Q Can you tell us a little s o me thin g, Mr.

3 H endrix, about warm prestresses in a s e mi-qu a ntita ti ve 4 way; namely, done at temperatures above RT NDT; an d 5 is it diff e re nt as the temperature in c r e m e n t above

. 6 RT NDT increases?

7 MR. H E N D R IX : Warm prestressing is, g again, is a complex te ch nic al p h e no m en a, and though L 9 have a rudimentary understan' ding of it, I b e li e v e 10 anything I would say would only serve to fu r t h e r 11 confuse if you are s li g h tly c onfu s ed now.

12 I could not explain in any detail warm i,'

13 p re s tr es sin g. T o 'go to get those d et ails you would 14 have to go to those personnel who are w e ll versed 15 in prestressing.

. 16 ,

They are available.

17 Q What are the terms of art used in limiting 18 reactor vessel materials ? Would you define that 19 te rm ?

20 MR. HENDRIX: Limiting reactor vessel l 21 m at e rials means looking at those materials, and you 22 have to look at a number of parameters, th e level of '

23 e fflu e nc e, the copper, nickel, phosphorus, va riou s

!' 24 other pa ra m et e r s that would make this mat e rial 25 limite d with respect to e m b rittle m e nt over the life of EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE, CNARLOTTE. NORTN CAROUNA o

Sharpo, H e n d rix - Direct 54 1 the plant.

2 Q L e t 's see if I understand that: If you have 3 several types of material in a reactor, you have plate s 4 and welds and pe rhaps some other m at e rial s in there; 5 and the copper contents diff e r, and e f flue nt levels

. 6 diff e r, the limit ed material would be the one th at 7 w ould show the highest rise in the RT NDT, or would 8 s h'o w the highest terminal RT NDT proj ected for the 9 life of the plant, would show 't h e highest t e rmin al 10 RT NDT?

11 MR. H E N DRIX : That would be e s s entially 12

, correct. I think the third factor one has to develop i

~

13 is the stress of it, a stress analysis test of the 14 y e , , ,1, 15 Q A nd a fla n g e would be a diff e rent story 16 than a b elt lin e, for exa mple ?

17 Id a . HENDRIX: I as sume it is. -

18 Q I am simply thinking of how large it is.

19 Now I want to ask que s tion s about A p plic an t's Responr es 90

, --you m ad e a distinction between a fl a w and a crack l

21 in Response to Interrogatory One.

(

22

( W ould you t ell us in more lo gical terms l 2a,.

what the dif f e renc e is ?

04 L R. H END RIX: N o, I really c ou ld n ' t say.

25 l Q Am I to conclude there is no diff e r e n c e EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STEP OTYPE REPORTING SERV 1CE, CNARLOTTE. NORTM CAROUNA L

Eharpo, Hendrix - Direct i 55

=;,.- ,

1 between a flaw and a crack?

2 M R. H E MD RIX : N o, a flaw is - a~ broad 3 range of defects. It could include a crack, a roundo :1 4 o c c lu s io n, a lap, any kind of flaw. ,

5 Q A ll ri gh t, you' h ave read the reports on the

. 6 ultr a s o nic te sting' pe rf ormed on the three Oconee unit o?

7 MR. HENDRIX: .In detail, no; I-have looke d 8 at the r e s ult s, at t. summary' of the r e sult s . That 9 isn't really my job to lo ok" a t tho s e in any d e t a i l ._

• 10 Q You wouldn't be able to comme nt then i f.

11 I said that ult ra s o nic t e s tin g 'o n one of th e u n it s 12 showed a crack a quarter of an inch deep? .

13 MR. H E N DR IX: Not s p e c ifi c ally, I c e r t a i'a t y' 14 would not except to refer you to th o s e do cum e nts 15 that are on file in the QA V au lt, which show there 16 were no u n a c c e p t a ble indications found in any, and I 17 assumo you are talking about Oconee, in any of the 18 recent in s pe ction s within the -l'ast year, year and a-ha.lf.

19 Q The SER states that procedures used in 20 weldin g a reactor as such, as to have a reasonable 21 e xp e c tatio n of not f o rmin g any ' mic ro-cragks.

22 Are you f amiliar wit h th at ?

23 MR. HENDRIX: No, I am not f amilia r with 24 that s ta te me nt.

M Q T hi s is part of the r e gulation s pertaining EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES, STENOTYPE REPORTING SFRVICE, CHARLOTTE. MORTM CAROL'N4 .

s

- Shtrpe, H e n d rix - D,troet 56

-- w --

, n I to a wciding reactor v e s s e l .' It ap plie s to placing th e i,

s 2 claddin g and effects un the s u b - c la ddin g, and these 3- procedures are' all aimed at a v oi di n g formation of

~

.4 cracks and micro-cracks.

-r 5 I b elie ve . y ou will find in your reports on

. 6 the ultr a s o nic te sting of the Oconee reactors, the 7 ultr a s onic ally d e s i gned . presence of cracks in welds R '

8.

In at l e a. c t one of the Oconee reactors.

~

9 What I want t o a s k' ' y o u is how did you get 3

10 from a condition of no' crack to crack, if at all time a 11 you have been involved the mill 'd uc tility r e f e r enc e 12 te mp e r a tur e --

'\~ 13 M R. H E N D R IX : I cannot respond to that 14 e x c .e p t to s ay a gain we v[ould have to go back and loon

.)

15 at s p e cifi c a lly what in di c a tion s you are talking a'b o u t 16 and r ei:c r at e that t h~ e r e were no unacceptable indicati o nt 17 in th e Oconee vessels.

' 18 There were ao ind ic atio n s that were referr ed 19 to a, s cracks. /. s I, r e m e m b e r the dis cu s sion s p e cifica lly 20 a g ain, I am not aware o'f what you are s p e c ific a lly 21 r ef e r rin g to; but the discussions as I remember them 22 r efer r ed to the 1"n d i e r. t i o n s as likely f a brica tion flaws ,'

23 not service induced fla w s .

l: '

E8 Q Are you f amiliar with Mr. Foes' isntwer 25 to the last of th e .CESG Interrogatories, the la st in I

I l Evrtvu atmosR associAras. snworver RcrosmNG srRVICE. CHARLOTTE. NORM CAROUhA I

r Sharpo, Hondrix - Diroet 57 1 num b e r, the very last one?

(

2 MR. HENDRIX: The very last one, I just 3 ecanned these, not in detail. I mean I h av e read it.

4 Q Now, of your own knowle d g e, are you 5 f a milia r with the high pressure inj ec tion, long nozzle

. 6 cracking of Oconee?

7 MR. HENDRIX: I am f a milie r with it in 8 a general sense.

9 Q Can you t ell us w h'a t d e t a il ed k n o wle d g e you 10 have of it, the s p e c ific s of your knowl ed ge ?

11 MR. HENDRIX: I would have to resurrect 12 from memory the work that was done on that r

(

13 p'a r t i c ul a r f ailu r e, cnd I would rathe r not do t h a't '.

14 A gain, I think that would be, I am not surie 15 I can r e s s u r rect it in accurate d e t a il. I do remember 16 the incident.

l 17 Q Can you give us a reference to a full l 18 account?

I 19 M R. H E N D R IX : I would have to go and l

l 20 look. A ls o, I b e lie ve I should say this: That f ailu rl l

21 was reported to th e NRC in some d e t ail, so that 22 inf o rma tio n is a vailabl e.

23 I am not eure what other inf o r ma ti on in l

24 a va ila ble, but I do know there was a fi n a l report 5 on that pa r tic ula r f ailu r e.

EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERytCE. CMACOTTE, NORTH CAROUNA

58

, 1 MR. RILEY: Perhaps C oun c el could

(

2 tell us whether those d o c u rn e n t s are a v a il-3 able here in Charlotte.

4 MR. CARR: I have no idea, it is the 5 fi r s t I've heard of i t, if I understood what

, 6 I heard.

7 You aee, I have a little bit of 8 dif ficulty unde r s tanding how it is relevant 9 to t }51 s C o nt ention.'-

10 MR. RILEY: W e ll, our view is th at 11 if the state of the art was not such at that 12 time that Oconee was f a b ricate d as to 13 anticipate and prevent c e rtai n types of 14 defects, it is a reasonable qu e stion as to 15 whether or not the state of art is' now such 16 as to simila rly anticipate and prevent such 17 defects.

• 18 MR. CARR: Without ge ttin g into an 19 o ve rly technical debate, what is the 20 C o n te nti on b e tw e en--did you say high 21 pressure, inj e c tion nozzle and a reactor 22 belt lin e ?

23 MR. HENDRIX: Belt line flaw is what s 24 we were dis cu s sin g.

25 MR. RILEY: They both in volve d EVELYN SERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE, CHARLOTTE, NORTH CAROUNA

Sharpe, H end rix - Direct 59 1 weldin g of eimilarly c l a. d ma te rial s ,

k 2

3 BY MR. RILEY:

4 Q M r. Markey raised some qu e s tio n s regardiz;g 5

pressurized the rm al shock in.his letter of February 1 5,

. 6 and this is 1983; and the NRC, which received this 7 le tt e r, has made a R e s p on s e, and in the dis c u s sion 8

on Oconee, one of Duke Power Company was involved 9

in providing design and o p e r a'ti n g data and r e vi e wi n g 10 th e accuracy of Enalytical models; and it is apparent

~

11 that the situation was c o mple x.

12

, It was used in the Contention of Risk 13 Analysis and m o d e li n g to forecast le ve ls of risk at 14 s p e cifi c levels of risk; and I w o uld lik e to know if 15 e ith e r of you is f amiliar with that work?

16 MR. HENDRIX: No.

17 MR. SHARPE: I am n ot.

18 Q Y ou have not reen the document?

19 MR. HENDRIX: Not to my knowledge.

20 M R. SH ARPE: No.

21 Q Have you heard before of this p r o g ra m, 22 PTS Risk Pr ogram ?

23 MR. HENDRIX: I am not directly involved

(

\ 24 with the PTS.

25 C Right, but have you heard before of th e j ev ua nacea anociates. sr ~onra aeroanao umnes.caam:ons. aom caamaa

Sharpo o H e n d r i .x - Diroct 60 1 p ro gram ?

2 hi R . H EN DR IX: S p e c ific a ll y the PTS Rick 3 Program, not to m y knowle dg e; no.

4 Q How about you?

5 h1 R . SH A R PE: No.

. 6 Q Who in th e company would be d e alin g with 7

that p ro bl e m and s u p pl yin g this inf or m a tion to the 8 NRC Staff ?

9 M R. SH ARPE: On Oconee?

10 Q Y e s, Oconee One.

11 hiR . S H A R PE : A c tu ally s u p plyin g i nf o r m ati on 12 or transmitting it to the NRC?

13 Q Supplying and t r an s mittin g are both 14 involved.

15 MR. SH ARPE: I would a s s um e a lot of 16 that in f o r m a ti on would come from Babcocks and 17 W il c o :c, but I don't have any s p e c ific kn owle d g e.

18 Q W e ll, th e language of this letter is. I 19 b e li e v e this is over C h a rlie T alm ad e n e s ' signature, 20 that Duke p r o vid ed inf o r ma ti on.

21 h'. R . HENDRIX: We are just not aware of 22 w h o di d o r would have.

23 h! R . GUILD: For the Record, this i.

24 a hiarch 24, 1983, letter from the Chairmar 25 of the C ommis sion ta R e p r e s enta tiv e Liarkey ,

EVELYN BERGER ASSOCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTsPeG SE RvlCE. CHARLOTTE. NORTH CAROUNA

61

- , 1 and one of the e nclo su re s to the le tt e r is

(

2 a staff, NRC Staff discussion of the 3 subject of PTS, which makes the reference 4 to Duke and the Oconee U nit as one of thre a 5 subject plants; and Duke Power as one of

. 6 the s u b'm i t t e r s of data to the S t a fi 'f o r 7 Response to R ep r e s e nt a tive Markey, and 8 perhaps that might clarify enough or 9 examination of t h e ' 'd o c u m e n t might help the 10 Witn e s s e s r e s po nd.

11 MR. H E N D RIX : I think I know the 12 program that you are talking about, but I 13 r e ally cannot say w ho a c tu ally c u p p li e d the 14 d at a .

15 It would be a number of people becaus e 16 the data involved would have been from 17 several diff er ent areas, come f r o rn B and W.

18 c ome .fr o m Duke, 19 A g ain, I think I know the p r o g r an you 20 are t alkin g about, but I am not p o s itive .

MR. SHARPE:

21 Design and op e r ating 22 data, the design inf o r ma tio n w o ul d lik ely 23 come f r em B a b e'o c k s and Wilc o x and the

/

N 24 o p e r a tin g data would come from D u ke .

25 h. R . G T* I LD : C ou n s el, perhaps for EVELYN BERGER AS$CCIATES. STENOTYPE REPORTING SERVICE. CMARLOTTE. NorTM CA40pMA

r 62 f

1 additional clarification perhaps the Wit ne s s es

(

2 can id e n tify who would lik e ly know the 3 a n e. w e r and who would be r e s pon sible for 4 that report or that inf o r ma tion.

5 MR. CARR: I thout ht I heard them

. 6 say they did not know.

7 MR. SHARPE: I as sume if it came 8 from Duke to NRC it would be in our 9 corporate fil e s . '

10 We keep everything in our file s that 11 we send to NRC.

12 MR. GUILD: Is th e r e somebody who 13 would be m ore r e s po n s ible who would know 14 the answer to the qu e s tion ?

15 M R. SHARPE: If we had sent this 16 in f o rma tio n s p e cific ally or--

17 MR. GUILD: Or where we could find 18 it.

l 19 MR. CARR: A gai n, not to be dif ficul':,

20 I thought I heard Mr. Sharpe and M r.

21 H e n d r ix say they did not know; and I don't 22 know.

23 It i s: ten minut e s past 7:00 at night, 24 '

and I can't .;; c make e phone c all to find M out who har it.

evetvu eenaan associares. sramones aerontma samvice. c==totTs. acara ca=ousa

63 f.

1 MR. GUILD: Mr. H e nd rix, do you

(-

2 know who might have that inf o rm ation or 3 have it a'v ai l a b l e ?

4 MR. H EN DRIX : I don't know now who 5 did, but-I know who to go a s k. -

. 6 MR. GUILD: Who can you ask?

7 MR. HENDRIX: I would start with 8 the Head of Licensing and it would be under 9 his r e s p o n s ibilit y 's'o m e w h e r e .

10 MR. GUILD: Fin e. G entle m e n, thank

~

11 you very much; that is a ll the qu e s tion s 12 I have.

r'

\ 13 FURTHER THE DEPONENTS SAITH NOT .

14 15 16 17 l

18 19 l

20 21 22 23

(\

24 s

EVELYN SEMGER ASSOCIA?ES. STENOTYPg REPCENdQ GR AVNE. CHAMMrs. NOTfM CAROLit4A yy _------_mr. _ -

r 64 7

1 I, R ob er t Sharpe, hereby c e rtif y that I have

(

2 read and understand the f o r e g o i r. g transcript and e

b e li e v e it to be a true, ac cu rate and complete 4 traneeript of my t e s tim o ny.

5

. 6 7

R ob e rt Sharpe 8

9 This D 'e p o s i t i o n was s i g n'e d in my presence by 10 Robert Sharpe,on the. day of June, 1983

~

11 12 f

13 Notary Public 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23

(. 24 1

l l

. - c - --

, ...< . .. . ..............~ m m .. - . . ~ .m. ~ 7

f 65 1 I, C. W. H e n d r ix, Jr.. hereby c e r ti f y that I 2 have read and understand the f o r e g oin g tr an s c ript and 3 b e li e v e it to be a true, accurate and complete 4 transcript of my t e s tim o n y.

5

. 6 7

C. W. H en d rix, J r.

8 9 This Deposition was s i g n'e d in my presence by 10 C. W. H e nd rix, Jr., on the day.af June, 1983.

11 12

(-

s..

13 Not a r y P u b li c 14 15 16 17

~

18 l

19 20 21 22 i 23 l'

"4 N)

I tbtLiN SERGE 8B ASSOC:dTES. STEh0TTPE REPORTING SERvdCd. CH4mLOTTE frAtTH CAROLINA 1

a

-r* -e- -- , -. w w , - - , - . y , -

66 1 C E R T I F I C A T E 2 STATE OF NORTH C A R O LIN A 3 COUNTY OF MECKLENBURG 4 I, Lynn B. G illi a m , do hereby c e rtify 5 that the proceedings were by me reduced to machine

. 6 s horthand in the presence of the Witn e s s e s, af te rward s 7 t r an s c rib e d upon a typ e write r under my dir e c tion; and 8 that the f o r e g oin g is a true and correct transcript 9

of the p ro c e e din g s .

10 I further c e rtif y that these proceeding c 11 were taken at the time and place in the foregoing 12 caption s p e cified.

A 13 I further c ertif y that I am not a 14 r ela tiv e , C o un e el or Attorney for eithe r Party or 15 o t h e r wi s e interested in the outcome of this action.

16 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have here-17 unto set my hand at C h a rlott e, N o r th C a r olina, on 18 thie the day of June, 1983.

l 19 20 21 l

22 LYNN B. GILLI A M l 23 Court R e porter l 24 l

25 My C o m mi c s io n ex pi r e s May 12, 1958.

LV CLYN FIMEM ASSOCoATF1. ST(NOfYPd REPORTIN3 SERVICE. CHARLOTTE. NOR.M CAPOLNA e