ML20023D616
| ML20023D616 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Indian Point, Dresden  |
| Issue date: | 12/22/1982 |
| From: | NRC COMMISSION (OCM) |
| To: | |
| Shared Package | |
| ML100541179 | List: |
| References | |
| REF-10CFR9.7 NUDOCS 8305240570 | |
| Download: ML20023D616 (15) | |
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1 1
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2
NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION
()
a 4
5 DISCUSSION /POSSIBLE VOTE ON ACTIONS 6
IN REGARD TO INDIAN POINT 7
8 9
CLOSED MEETING - EXEMPTION NO. >& f 10 11 Nuclear Regulatory Commission Room 1130 12 1717 H Street, N. W.
Washington, D. C.
13
'~N Wednesday, December 22, 1982 14 The Commission convened in closed session at 15 4:47 p.m.
16 COMMISSIONERS PRESENTS 17 NUNZIO PALLADINO, Chairman of the Commission 18 VICTOR GILINSKY, Co2missionar JOHN AHEARNE, Commissioner 19 THOMAS ROBERTS, Commissioner JAMES ASSELSTINE, Commissioner-20 STAFF AND PRESENTERS SEATED AT COMMISSION TABLE:
21 S. CHILK M.
HALSCH 22 J.
ZERBE 23 AUDIENCE SPEAKERS
(~
24 B.
GRIMES J. FOUCHARD 25 ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
2 1
EEQCEERIEEE 2
CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
The meeting will please 3
come to order.
4 We are reconvening to discuss the proposed 5
decision writeup based on the Commission's tentative 6
decision and I thought we would go through and see what 7
comments we have on the revised order.
8 I suggest we might walk through page by page 9
and see what comments people have.
10 On the first page I know of nonee 11 On page 2 I know of none.
12 On page 3 I know of none.
13 Nor on page 4.-
~
14 There is a suggestion on the bottom of page 5, 15 and I have forgotten who suggested this.
16 COMMISSIONER AHEARNEt Tom.
17 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN04 Tom.
In the paragraph 18 that has the letter "A" in front of it, the sentence 19 tha t begins, I think it is the second sentence, " FEMA 20 has expressed concern regarding the availability of 21 commercial bus drivers in an emergency."
It is proposed 22 that we add "because it does not believe it has good 23 information on whether the bus drivers will respond."
24 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS:
That is the proposal.
25 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
I would have no problem ALDERSoN REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554 2346
3 1
with that.
2 I know of no suggested changes on page 6 nor 3
page 7.
4 COMMISSIONER AHEARNEs Tom had a suggestion.
5 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS 4 I had a suggestion to 6
delete the paragraph "C".
7 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE4 Which I disagree with.
8 COMMISSIOh'ER ROBERTS:
You disagree with it?
9 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
Yes.
10 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO Yes.
I don't see any 11 problem with that.
12 Now on page 8 I believe these again are your 13 changes, Tom.
14 C.0MMISSIONER ROBERTS Yes.
C' AIRMAN PALLADINO Why don't you go through H
15 16 them and make sure I have them correctly.
17 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS The first full sentence 18 of the first paragraph.
" FEMA and the State of New Yor.t 19 are working'on~ the concern that there may be a bus 20 driver problem in Westchester County."
21 CHAIRMAN P ALL ADINO4 I thought you were 22 changing it.
23 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
He is.
k.-
CHAIRMAN PALLADIN0s I am sorry, read it again.
24 25 COMMISSIONEP ROBERTSs I am going to read the ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345 _
4 1
full sentence as proposed.
"Second, FEMA and the State 2
of New York are working on the concern that there may be
('_N) 3 a bus driver problem in Westchester County."
4 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Okay, fine.
Thank you.
5 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS:
Then I would propose 6
the deletion of the next sentence because that is 7
covered on page 5.
~
8 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
That you just added in.
9 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS:
Yes.
10 COHNISSIONER AHEARNE:
I have no problem with 11 that.
12 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN0s. I would have no problem 13 with th a t.
ks y
14 Anything else anyone wishes to comment on?
15 (No response.)
16 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Now on page 9,
- Tom, 17 either you or Commissioner Ahearne had a comment.
18 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
Going back on page 7 I 19 had one.
At the bottom of page 7 it is not Unit 1.
20 Unit 1 is the decommissioned plant.
21 (Laughter.)
22 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Unit 3.
23 MR. HALSCH:
Mr. Chairman, staff had a few
- /
\\
24 last minute comments on page e.
Bryan Grimes did and we 25 might ask him what his suggestions are.
These are pages ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., W ASHINGToN. D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
5 1
8 and 9.
2 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
All right.
(3 3
HR. GRIMES:
On page 8, in the discussion in 4
the first f ull parag raph, the meteorological aspect, I 5
would suggest that the argument not be based on 6
meteorology.
One of the typical meteorologies at Indian e
7 Point under low wind speed conditions is for the plume 8
to go down the river and then reverse and come back up 9
the river.
10 CHAIRHAN PALLADINO:
On what part of the page?
11 MR. CRIEES:
That is the middle of the first 12 full paragraph on page 8.
13 COMEISSIONER GILINSKY4 Terrific.
It stays 14 out of both counties.
15 (Laughter.)
16 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
It really dumps on 17 those fishermen.
18
( L a'u gh t er. )
19 MR. GRIMES:
If it misses a little bit it may 20 be in both.
21 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN0s So what are you proposing?
22 MR. GRIMES:
I would suggest that perhaps the 23 sentence starting " Compensatory measures" be changed to I
simply say that " Compensating measures are proposed L
24 25 which would be adequate in many accident scenarios."
I ALDERSoN REPORTING COMPANY,INC.
400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W _ WASHINGTON, D.C._200_24 (202) 554-2345_ _
6 1
Then just skip to "Moreover."
2' CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
You say ".
would be
(
3 adequate in" ---
4 MR. GRIMES in many accident 5
scenarios."
6 CH AIRMAN P ALLADIN04 And then what do you want 7
to do?
8 MR. GRIMES Then strike the next sentence.
9 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Did you keep " involving 10 evacuation from oftsite"?
11 MR. GRIdES:
No, I struck that at the end of 12 the sentence.
13 CH AIRM AN P ALLADINO:
Now what do you do?
C 14 MR. GRIMES:
Strike the se ntence "This is 15 highly unlikely."
16 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
This is based on that 17 there are the school buses available?
18 MR. GRIMES This is based on that in many 19 scenarios you may indeed have time tc mobilize the guard l
20 while the situation is progressing on an anticipatory 21 basis, and those where you choose to evaluate may indeed 22 have time to do that.
23 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
Well, let's see, you I
24 are going from "probably would be adequate" to "would be 25 adequate."
I ALDERSoN REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON. D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
7 1
MR. GRIMES:
In many scenarios, not those ---
2 COMMISSIONER AHEARNEa I understand tha t.
It O
's j 3
is when you have lost a probability, you are now making 4
a statement which sounds like that NRC is making a j
5 judgment that I would have thought was FEMA 's.
6 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN04 Do you want to keep the 7
word "probably" in?
8 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
Yes, I would.
9 CHAIRNAN PALLADINO:
Do you find any problem 10 with that?
11 MR. GRIMES:
No.
12 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
" Compensating measures 13 are proposed which would probably be adequate in many
(~h 14 accident scenarios."
15 Now did you do anything more?-
16 MB. GRIMES:
No.
17 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
You go then to "Moreover"?
18 MR. GRIMES:
Yes, and-there are changes on 19 tha t page.
I would just point out in the first full 20 paragraph on page 9, the second sentence states "The 21 problems are beyond the power of licensees to control."
22 That is a little I believe somewhat overstated in that 23 the licensees working with the State did effect changes
/\\
24 in legislation, for example, to cure off-site problems.
25 I didn't have time to prepare a specific fix to that.
l l
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
8 1
COMMISSIONER AHEARNEs Well, they can't 2
control them.
()
3 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS:
They can influence them.
4 MR. GR1.1ESa They can influence, but I would 5
agree they can't control.
6 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE The word says " control."
7 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS:
Mr. Chairman, I thought 8
my office had contacted your office and John.
The 9
second full paragraph it restates the last sentence.
10 "We do not believe that the two deficiencies noted by 11 FEM A warrant immediate shutdown."
It was my understand 12 there was agreement on that.
13 COMMISSIONER AHEARNEt Yes.
k-14 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS 4 Well, we missed that.
15 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
I had an alternative.
16 COMMISSIONER ROBERTS Oh, I am sorry.
17 COMMISSIONER AHEARNEs He was about to go to 18 that, but we went back to 7.
19
/'
COMMISSIONER ROBERTS:
Okay.
/
20 CHAIRMAN PALLADINOS I had either do that or 21 delete the sentence, either one, but I buy your 22 correction.
23 MR. GRIMES:
No further corrections.
t t-24 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO All right.
25 I had a suggestion with regard to the last ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, i
400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
9 1
sentence in the last full paragraph.
I would suggest 2
replacing the sentence, "At this time the Com'ission a
(O
_j 3
will revisit the question of whether Unit III snould 4
remain shut down and Units I and II should be shut down 5
by a paragraph.
6 (Copies of the paragraph to be substituted 7
vere distributed by the Chairman to the others at the 8
table.)
9 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
I want to replace it and 10 say "The status of emergency planning will be revisited 11 by the Commission upon receipt of FEMA's evaluation of 12 the March 1983 exercise for Indian Point.
In the 13 interim FEMA is asked to present to the Commission 14 monthly reports on the status of Rockland County 15 planning and training on the plans being developed, the 16 status of resolution of the bus driver issue in 17 Westchester County and any other emergency preparedness 18 issues that arise as work goes forward."
19 MR. EALSCH:
Now this is in lieu of the last 20 paragraph?
l 21 CHAIRMAN P ALL ADIN 0 s That would be in lieu of 22 the sen tence ---
23 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
The last sentence.
I 24 MR. MALSCH:
Oh, just the last sentence?
i l
25 CH AIRM AN PALLADINO:
Yes.
The one that says ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
10 1
"At this time the Commission.
I would also 2
cross out "It is so ordered."
'( )
3 Any other comments on this order?
4 (No response.)
5 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN04-Now I think we also have 6
individual comments, all of which I haven't absorbed, 7
and I gave you mine.
8 I guess we should confirm that we accept the 9
order as modified.
10 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN0s Aye.
11 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
Aye.
12 COMMISSIONER ROBERTSa Aye.
13 COMMISSIONER GILINSKYs No.
~
14 COMMISSIONER ASSELSTINE No.
15 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Are we done with our 16 closed meeting?
17 MR. MALSCH:
Yes.
Now the only question I 18 have is whether you want to see it before it goes eut, 19 or whether you just want us to make the cha nges and give 20 them to the Secretary for signature?
21 CHAIRMAN PALLADINOs When would we see them?
22 MR. MALSCH:
I am not sure, 15 or.20 minutes.
23 It is a matter of running it through the typewriter L
24 again.
25 COMMISSIONER AHEABNE:
Fifteen or 20 minutes ALDERSoN REPORTING COMPANY,INC.
400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
r J
11 1
is fine with me.
What is the schedule now on the open 2
meeting?
()
3 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN04 I wanted to ask Joe a 4
little bit on that.
I haven't thought this all through 5
and maybe I should ask for a suggestion from Joe first.
6 ER. FOUCHARD:
Please go ahead.
7 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN04 Well, I was going to 8
propose that we open the meetin'g.
I really am looking 9
a t page 7.
"The Commission has decided tha t no shutdown 10 or enforcement action is needed at this time with regard 11 to Indian Point.
Several considerations led us to this 12 conclusion.
First, substantial progress has been made 13 since last July and additional progress will be made in 14 the coming months.
FEMA ha s concluded that the remedial 15 action that has been accomplished and those scheduled in 16 the next few months constitute off-site plans that will 17 be feasible and capable of implementation.
Moreover, it 18 is very unlikely that a severe accident would occur in a 19 few months.
The Commission concludes that operation of 20 Unit II (Unit III) is not planned to go on line unts1 21 March or April of 1983 and during the interim period 22 will pose no andue risk to public health and safety."
l 23 The question is where do I stop reading?
l 24 (Laughter.)
l 25 COMMISSIONEB ASSELSTINEs It is a long three ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345_ _
12 1
pages.
2 MR. FOUCHARDs You have me at a disadvantage.
()
3 I don't have a copy of the order.
4 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO Well, I was going to 5
suggest stopping in the middle of page 8.
I was 6
thinking of beginning with the middle of page 7 and 7
going to the middle of page 8.
8 While he is looking at that, Marty, should we 9
confirm our decision in the public meeting?
10 MR. MALSCH4 I think that is up to rou.
You 11 have already voted on the decision so the vote has been 12 taken.
You can repeat it for the public to make clear 13 who stands where.
C_~ '
14 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
I should indicate that it 15 was by a three to two decision.
16 COMMISSIONER GILINSKYa Well, I guess I would 17 vant to say a word about it.
18 COMMISSIONER AHEARNE:
I think the subsequent 19 comments -- (Inaudible).
20 MR. FOUCHARD:
I would assume that you would 21 summarize, and what you propose to do looks fine to me, 22 summarize the majority view and then if you have any 23 personal coaments of your own, make them, and then ask
/(-
24 your colleagues if they hav e any.
I 25 I have copies of Mr. Ahearne's and Mr.
I' ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINlA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554 2345
t 13 1
Gilinsky's.
I don't have any of the others and I could 2
use them.
em s
( )
3 CHAIRMAN PALLADIN04 Here are mine.
4 MR. FOUCHARD:
All right, sir.
5 (Commissioner Asselstine's Assistant handed 6
Commissioner Asselstine's comments to Mr. Fouchard.)
7 MR. FOUCHARD:
I have got yours nov.
8 That is the way I would suggest you go.
You 9
are going to have some time, Mr. Chairman.
It is going 10 to take me just a f ew minutes to get them organized here.
11 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
If we stop at the middle 12 of page 8 are we leaving anything off?
13 MR. FOUCHARD:
Well, you have talked about 14 Westchester.
Let's see, I think y0u probably have to go 15 on and cover the second one, too.
You have probably got 16 to go to the ---
17 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
I have got to go to the 18 end.
19 MR. F3UCHARD:
Pretty close.
I think you do.
20 You are just talking about Westchester in what you had 21 proposed and you have to cover Rockland.
22 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
I have got to go to the 23 middle of page 9.
s.
24 MR. FOUCHARD:
If you want to adjourn for five l
l 25 minutes, or something, it will take me that long, and l
ALDERSoN REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
=
14 1
you will have time to collect your respective thoughts.
2 CHAIRHAN PA1LADINO:
Well, it is agreeable m
(_
3 that I basically read from page 7 on.
4 CONHISSIONER ASSELSTINE It is okay with me.
i 5
(Laugher.)
6 COHNISSIONER AHEARNE Joe, that is fine, 7
although, as Victor, I will want to say a few additional 8
words.
9 COHHISSIONER ASSELSTINEa Yes, and me.
10 CHAIRHAN PALLADINO:
For myself I believe the 11 major additional point I have to make is that I believe 12 that planning and training must be completed before a 13 useful exercise can be held, and since the principal
-s 14 issue in this regard is the state of development of the 1s Rockland County plan, Rock!.and County should complete 16 its plan before the March 1983 exercises.
Then I would 17 let each person make some comments.
But I would 18 announce that it was by a three to two decision.
19 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Well, why don't we recess 4
20 this meeting and open and convene in, what, 10 minutes.
21 HR. FOUCHARD Yes, that is plenty of time.
22 Iwo things I would request.
23 First, before you commence the meeting just 24 let me just let the CBS crew get 30 seconds worth of 25 time with the Commission, and two, they would like to ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 554-2345
.~.
t 15 1
use one light, and since it is going to be a very short 2
meeting I don't see any difficulty.
3 CHAIRMAN PALLADINO:
Now are they going to 4
vant press statements af terwards?
Will you handle the 5
press statements.
6 3R. FOUCHARDa I will.
7 COMMISSIONER ASSELSTINE:
Do'you want a copy 8
of our statements?
9 HB. FOUCHARD:
I have all of the statements.
10 I will tell them we will reconvene in about 10 minutes.
11 CHAIRHAN PALLADINO:
5:15.
12
'(Whereupon, at 5:05 p.m.,
the closed meeting 13 adjourned.)
m i
'~
14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 d
24 25.
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC, 400 VIRGINIA AVE., S.W., WASHINGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 564-2345
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~.
NUCLEAR REGULAT.E CDf95SSICN 1
Ydis 11 CC Ca.Mif7 that th& 4t:3Ched prCCaed1Cg3 'Cef0Ps the m
COMMISSION MEETING in the :::agtar cf.,
CLOSED MEETING - EXEMPTION NO. 10 - Disucssion/Possible Vote on Actions in Regard to Indian Point 0334 Cf FPCCeeding:
December 22, 1982 UCCksC llu!!LberI Flace of ?PCCeedisg:
Washington, D.
C.
44ro held as herei: appear:s, and cha't. this is the crisisal 0: susc:-i;:j tharacf for the file of the CC=::11ssica.
t i
Mary C.
Simons
.O.n Offi'=ial EspCriar (~7.ec)
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