ML19254B050
| ML19254B050 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Crane  |
| Issue date: | 07/26/1979 |
| From: | Farst H, Shackleton O METROPOLITAN EDISON CO., NRC OFFICE OF INSPECTION & ENFORCEMENT (IE REGION III) |
| To: | |
| References | |
| TASK-TF, TASK-TMR NUDOCS 7909190231 | |
| Download: ML19254B050 (25) | |
Text
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i UNITED STATES OF AMERICA t
NUCLEAR REGULATORY CCMMISSION l
In the Matter of:
2' IE THI INVESTIGATION INTERVIEW 3!
of Harold E. Farst Auxiliary Operator A, Nuclear i
4!
Si 6i 73 8!
Trailer #203 9!
NRC Investigation Site TMI Nuclear Power Plant 10:
Middletown, Pennsylvania 11!
Juiv 12,1979 12!
(Date of Interview) 13t July 26, 1979 14!
(Date Transcript Typea) 332
'15i (Tape Nuccerts))
16!
17:
18!
19i 20!
21l NRC PERSONNEL:
22' Owen C. Shackleton Anthony N. Fasano 23l 24:
A ~
25i 140 7909190 23/
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1 SHACXLETON:
Time is now 1:06 p.m., Eastern Daylight Time, July 12, 1979.
2 This is the voice of Owen C. Shackleton.
This is an interview of Mr.
I 3;
Harold E. Farst. Mr. Farst is an Auxiliary Operator A, Nuclear, employed 4
at Metropolitan Edison Company assigned to the Three Mile Island Nuclear 5
Power Generation Station.
This interview is taking place in Trailer No.
6 203, which is parked just south of the South Security Gata at the Three 7{
Mile Island facility.
Present from the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission
' * ' ' '" ' " ^"
- "Y "'
8 gj Inspection Specialist in the Performance Appraisal Branch of Inspection and Enforcement for Reactor Construction Inspection.
I am an Investigator 0l l
assigned to Region V.
Just prior to beginning this interview on tape, I presented to Mr. Farst a two paged document from the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory I
Commission which explains the scope and purpose of this investigation.
It 13l also identifies the authority of the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission to conduct this investigation of the accident which took place at Three Mile 15i Island in March, on March 28, 1979.
This document further identified to Mr. Farst his rights to refuse to be interviewed and to have someone of his choice present during the course of the interview.
It also advises him 18!
that he does not have to furnish a signed statement if he does not wish to.
19t On the second page of this document are three questions and Mr. Farst 20i answered all three questions with a "yes" answer.
At this time, to make it 21!
a matter of record on this recording, I'm going to ask Mr. Farst these 22!
questions. Mr. Farst, did you understand the document that I am referring 2 21 to?
24!
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Ilj FARST:
Yes.
i 2!
3 SHACXLETON: And do we, the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Ccmmission, have your 41 permission to tape this interview?
l Si 6.
FARST:
Yes.
7!
SHACXLETON:
And would you like a copy of the tape?
g 9!
10i ll!
SHACXLETON:
Alright, sir.
That will be provided to you at the close of the interview.
131 And, at this time, Mr. Farst, to assist the investigative team and others who will be interested in reading your comments either in 14!
the transcript or listening to our recording, would you briefly give us your work experience?
17!
FARST:
Work experience.
I started with Met Ed in...
19i SHACXLETON: As it relates to the nuclear field, primarily.
201 21!
FARST:
From Crawford Station, I was in the-first group to come dcwn to 22!
THI, it was in, I believe, October of '79, and that, I've been with them 23 ever since.
That's the extent of my nuclear '60 training.
It was '69.
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3 lj SHACKLETON: Alright, sir.
Thank you and I'll turn the questioning over to 2
Mr. Fasano.
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FASANO:
Harold, what I'd like you to do is, if you would in your own g;
words, tell us when you became aware of the event, where you were, maybe 6l y u can describe what you were doing just prior to the event.
I understand 7
you were on the 7, the 11 to 7 shift that day.
Si FARST:
Right.
g 10i FASANO:
And if you would, I'd like to hear your version of what you saw and experienced.
131 14l FARST:
Well, I was on secondary readings that night and at least once a shift we had to go in the one compartment to check the breakers for the pressurizer heaters, and you're supposed to have someone to go along with 16,i you for safety reasons.
So, I was in the basement and I was gonna get Don 1,/ :
l Miller to go along with me because he was working at the polishing unit and ISt he was up on a ladder watching the resins through the site glass and Fred 191 Scheimann and Don Miller and I were both up thera watching this and as soon 20i as he had a break I was gonna get him to go along with me.
We were up 21 there a few minutes and all of a sudden we heard some valves slaming and 22!
i water hammering and everything else.
And, I knew then that something was 23!,
wrong, but I had no idea to what extent it was or anything else.
So, I got 24I off the ladder and made room for everyone to get down and...
So, the other 25i
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4 i
tj two people, well Fred ran to the control room, and I was just looking 2
around seeing if I cuuld survey what damage was done or if any was done, or 3
what I could do. And not being able to tell too much but seeing that 41 something was...
I had a gut feeling of what that, it wasn't just a trip, g;
it just a funny feeling, you know.
And not being too overly familiar with 6
the plant I was just waiting mostly where I could hear a call from the control room if they wanted something else available and not hearing anything 7
8f and the only I knew I could then was, we had trouble with the A feed pumo, the turning gear was not operating on it.
So, I tried calling the control 10l room to tell them that I was going to turn the feed pump by hand and not to try starting it.
And I couldn't get through to them.
So I ran up to the control room and told them, seeing that they were very busy, so I just told 131 them, you know, I'm gonna out down there at the feed pump.
And I was just 14 down there the rest of the morning just turning the feed pumps open.
15:
FASANO: And so, that was your extent.
You cor:inued to turn the shaft...
17i l
FARST:
Rignt.
18t 19f FASANO:
On the main...
20!
l 211 FARST: Main feed pump.
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23l FASANO:
Main feed pump.
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I 1y FARST: Yes.
2 i
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-FASANO:
Were you joined by anyone else at that time, or?
i 4i Si FARST: Yes.
Juanita Gingrich was down there with me.
t 6i 7[
FASANO: Okay.
Did she come from also from the control room to perform g
that function, do you know?
9I FARST:
10,i I'm not too sure where she came from, but she wasn't with me in the g
beginning.
i 12!
FASANO:
6 13l When you say you were all up on the ladder looking at the blocked line, this is a resin transfer line off the condensate polishers.
14I 4
15.
FARST:
Right.
17l' FASANO:
And do you knew hcw they were or what they were doing to, what was 18i the problem?
191 20!
FARST:
From what I understand, there was, the resins were hung up, I'm not 21!
exactly sure whether it was in vessel or the mixed tank, or what.
22l But they were standing there using air to try and aggitate them and break them loose 231 and by looking at the spool piece. the glass spool piece, you could see if 2 41 there's any resins moving at all.
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FASANO:
And they were not?
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FARST: They were moving a few now and then but not enough to really get 4j excited about.
l 51 i
6j FASANO:
Okay.
The, do you recall when you heard this banging and large 7
n ise, and I guess you all ran down the ladder.
81 FARST:
Right.
g 10; FASANO:
It's quite a... three of you sitting up there.
12 FARST:
Kind of crowded.
14:
FASANO:
Pretty high up in the air.
Did you take a look at the panel, the 151 condensate polisher panel at all?
17' FARST:
No, I didn't.
181 191 FASANO:
You say, did you look at, are you familiar enough to know where 20!
the booster pumps and the condensate pumps are located?
21!
22!
FARST:
Yes.
23 24!
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FASANO:
Did you look at those pumps and in particular, the booster pumps, and did you notice that they were running or not?
2:
3 FARST:
At the very beginning I couldn't, I don't know if it was at the very beginning or just a few minutes after I was down at the turbine I g
i 6j could hear the one pump, whether it was the booster pump or the condensate 7j pump, I couldn't tell from down there, but I could hear it.
I think it was gl a pump starting and stopping.
I don't think it was a valve closing.
It sounded actually like a pump was actually was getting a signal to start and 9,
then trip off, start and trip off.
101 11:
FASANO:
12!
About what time was this? You immediately ran down the ladder and then...
13) 14:
FARST:
Oh yes.
16i f
FASANO:
17!
Right about that time or was it...?
18l FARST:
No, I got off the ladder and I just looked around to see if anything 19f right away needed done or anything I could figure out or see what would 20!
relay you to get my bearings what was happening.
21i And everything that I could see I was capable...
22!
Well, there was nothing I could see that I could do at the present time.
The only thing I could think of was the turbine.
So, this was, I think, a few minutes after I started rotating the 24!
turbine.
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FASANO:
Did you hear the announcement, turbine trip, or?
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3 FARST:
I could hear voices over the speaker, but I couldn't understand 4
anything.
Si Gj FASANO:
Was there still loud noise in that area?
i 71 I
gj FARST: Yes.
9I
'Ol ay, y u went up to the control rocm.
About what time did you go up to the control room and tell them about the, that you'd be down by the feedwater pump?
r 131 FARST:
Guessing, I'd say was approximately say 5 minutes at the most into g
the accident.
15:
16:
FASANO: About 4:05 or so?
IS!
FARST:
Yeah.
19l 20l l
FASANO:
21l And you went to the control rocm?
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FARST:
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Right, cause I couldn't get them on the phone.
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1 FASANO:
Did you notice anybody up at the control room?
I mean, do you 2
know the people that were in there?
31 FARST:
I remember seeing Zewe and Ed Fredericks.
That's the only two I Sl know definitely were up there.
I don't remember seeing anybody else.
t 6i FASANO:
You past Scheimann then?
7, FARST: Well, I think he was vaguely remember seeing him out of the g
corner of my eye, but I couldn't tell you what he was doing or where he 10 But he wasn't in too much longer than I.
g was.
12' FASANO:
13 But you don't recall seeing him there at the panel or with the...
1 141 FARST:
He wasn't up at the panel, I'm sure he wasn't up at the panel.
I think he was on the phone or in the back or doing...
I can't really tell 17,'
you what he was doing.
But I remember vaguely he was in there.
18(
FASANO:
Did you pass anybody on the way up?
I 20l FARST:
No.
21i 22!
FASANO:
23l You left, I guess then the only man that was left down in that l
area was Miller.
24!
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FARST: Miller, right.
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3l FASANO:
He stayed behind, do you recall?
4; gj FARST:
I don't recall, I don't remember what happened to him.
l Gi 7j FASANO:
So you all separatad?
I 81 i
FARST:
Yes.
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101 FASANO:
You went up and suggested that you should turn the feedwater pump, y
right?
13l FARST: Well, I guess kind of suggested it.
I mainly wanted to tell them so they wouldn't try and start the, to start it wnen I was down there with a wrench on it.
So mainly for protection for the pump and for me.
17f FASANO:
Are you sure you put the wrench on A, or B?
19i FARST:
I think it was the B pump, if I recall.
It was the north, I mean the east pump.
21l 22' FASANO:
Bearings.
Okay.
23l That would be the furthest away frcm the...?
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The closest to the polisher.
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3 FASANO: The closest to the polisher.
Okay.
How did you know that needed i
4j to be rotated?
Si FARST:
Earlier in the evenning I was talking to Terry Daugherty, you know, 01 what things needed to be done or whats some of the happenings.
And he said 7
the turning gear motor was hanging up or it wasn't working at all.
8 And not being familiar with, not familiar with Unit 2 I figured that I would handle g
that and let someone else...
10l 11!
TANO:
It was like preplanning or? I mean why would you be talking about aa item like that?
131 14:
FARST:
Well, actually out of the whole week, I guess it was only the 15i second night, I was over there and not being over that much I wasn't really that familiar so I had to talk to him to find out what really was going on 17!
in the plant.
18!
What was workable and what wasn't and what to look for and what not to.
And it just happened to be one of the things that came up.
19!
201 FASANO:
Then in the event of a feedwater failure, then its normal to go 21; i
22l over there and jack that particular pump by the shaft.
23l i
FARST:
Right.
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12 FASANO:
lj Terry Oaugherty, he was on the secondary side?
2 3{
FARST:
No, he was in, he was a primary that night.
I just met him in the lunchroom earlier in the evening.
He...
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Si FASANO: Okay.
So, you went down and I guess tnat you and Gingrich...
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FARST:
Right.
91 FASANO:
Stayed at that particular... Were there any other people who came 10 down and helped?
12,'
FARST:
I don't believe there was until shift change, till about 7:00, 131 14l FASANO:
Anything...?
16:
FARST:
No, there was, I think Daugherty and a couple of them came by there I
18l and passed through to see how things were going or what was...
But no one really stayed there with us.
191 20\\
FASANO:
21l When you got down off the ladder did you notice, I guess from what 22l you say you really, well, did you happen to notice any water leaking out of l
23l any systems or any water around the condensate polisher panel, or?
Appar-l ently they found water in the air lines.
And, did you notice any water 24!
coming out of anything in that area?
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FARST:
The only thing that I remember is right after I got down to the 1
2 feed pump turbine I looked up toward the polisher.
And I think one of i
3i those...
I think it was a flow sensor, a flow in the line up there was leaking real bad.
It was a pretty good spray going on.
4!
Si FASANO:
On the panel?
6 I
71 FARST:
No, going between the feed pump.
It was the line going to the 81 booster pump.
10l FASANO: Okay.
12l l
FARST:
And when I looked at the panel this was right in my line and from 131 down there where I was it looked like its real, like quite a water flow, 14I but going up it was just more or less a big spray.
164 FASANO:
Okay. As you came down the ladder and turned to your left and 17' you're now looking out and to your left is the panel and straight ahead 18i would be the pipe you're looking at.
191 20!
FARST:
Kind of, yeah.
It was, you'd actually be in front of the panel so 21; you would look to the left.
e 22!
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FASANO:
Left or right?
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FARST: Well, it would be, it was between physically it is located between 2) the booster pump and the condensate pump in that area there.
3!
FASANO:
Okay.
Back behind that little desk that sits there?
4; Si FARST:
Right.
6 7j 8l FASANO: Okay.
That probably 'is the suction line to the booster pump.
g Apparently other people said they had seen a water leak there.
That was 10:
11!
FARST:
No, that was, I only remember that after it was down to feed pump.
13I FASANO:
Okay.
14' 15i FARST:
Then I could look, I could hear the pump starting, the A pump starting and stopping which I assume was a booster pump.
18i FASANO:
This would be about what time do you figure, 5, 4?
20,'
FARST:
I'd say roughly 5, 6 minutes afterwards because it was after I came 21!
back frem the control room.
22!
23l FASANO:
Okay.
So you ran to the control room, got there about 5 after, 24l and then on your way back down you went, immediately out of the control 25i room apparently...
bu e.
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1; FARST:
Right.
I was right in and right out.
25 3
FASANO:
Right back down, out, and you didn't see Daugherty coming through 4j there did you, or Laudermilch, or?
5l 6
FARST:
No.
I went up and down the back steps.
7l i
8l FASANO:
Okay. Went back down, and the back steps meaning you'd come out g
behind the polisher?
10l FARST:
Right.
12!
FASANO:
13; Just behind the polisher?
14' FARST:
Right.
16i FfSANO:
Okay, pretty much underneath where you were in the ladder up on the pipe?
18!
19:
FARST:
Yeah. Just due south, yeah.
21; FASANO: Okay.
You didn't pass anybody on the way up and down there, did you?
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FARST:
No.
I wasn't traveling that awful long.
2l FASANO:
So, you went back down about 10 after.
You saw this leak?
3 4{
Sj FARST:
Not longer than 10 after.
Gi 7j FASANO: Okay.
i 8
FARST:
g It was right about the time I got my bearings and looked at things an seen
.e wa er leak.
10 ui FASANO: What time were you relieved, then?
13)
FARST:
It was after the normal shift came, after 7:00 after the shift came l
in.
15i 16i FASANO:
Did you go back up to the control room?
lSt FARST:
Yes.
i 19' 20i FASANO:
About what time do you figure that was?
i 22!
FARST:
I guess somewhere between maybe quarter after and 7:30.
23 24!
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1l FA$ANO: Okay.
Do you remember hearing the vacuum alarm.
I guess they have an alarm that's on your condenser vacuum pump which if you have any 2l 3l radioactivity will give an alarm.
Do you recall hearing that?
l 4!
FARST:
I don't recall hearing that, no.
5 Si FASANO:
Do you recall thc announcemen:: of the site emergency?
7 81 FARST:
Yes, I do.
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101 FASANO: Were you still down stairs at that time?
11;,
12!
l FARST:
Right.
14:
FASANO: And, I guess you decided to stay downstairs?
16; FARST:
Right.
lSi FASANO:
Did you contact anybody when you heard that alarm or heard that 191 announcement, excuse me?
20t 21!
FARST:
I think by that time or right afterward, being a site emergency I'm 22l l
not sure then or right afterwards where some people did come by whether it 231 was Daugherty or I don't know who.
And, you know, they were running, I 241 don't know what exactly, I guess they were keeping... Daugherty was keeping 25.
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1 an eye on the level in the hotwell.
So, he was pretty close to me so I gj could run over real quick between turns and, you know, find out what was 3
happening.
He was keeping me mor or less posted.
And being he said a site 4
emergency, being an operator, I just knew better than to try and leave.
I gj just wanted to stick around.
So, that's the reason I stayed there.
6i FASANO:
Then about 7:30 you wer. up to the control room.
7 Si FARST:
Right.
g 10.i FASANO:
And from there where did you go?
12l FARST:
g There they just told us to stay there until they decided what to do with us.
15i FASANO: Who was in the control room at 7:30?
17' FARST:
Atout 200 people.
19!
FASANO:
I don't think you can fit 200 in there.
21:
FARST:
They were mostly standing room only.
There was very, an awful lot 22!
of people in there.
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How were they, how did you appear to be performing, at least the 1.
2, operators?
-3I
_FARST: 'The aparators were...
I rememoer I think at the time Mike Ross gj came in.
I remember him making a statement that no one's even supposed to 5
talk to the contral room operator or the superintendent unless they got
.q permission from I den't know who, but everyone to stay out of the road and let them function.
81 9f FASANO:
How long were you in there? Do you have any idea?
It was 7:30 you go there.
Stayed about an hour, two hours?
12' l
FARST:
I think it was getting vetry close to dinner time if I remember 13; rie;ht.
i 15i FASANO:
So you were in there from somawhere around 7:30 til noon?
_17' FARST:
I would say at least 11:00.
'.S t Lo t FASANC:
Did you have to put' on a mask? Were you there when they started usir:6.. ?
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FARST:
No, we weren't there chen.
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l FASANO: The, do you recall who was in the control room, I mean the operators.
1!
2 Were they the same ones or were there new operators there?
3l 4
FARST:
I think the old ones and the new ones were there.
The old shift Si was still on yet and the new ones, the 7:00 shift, I think was in getting, g
just getting ready to take over and getting the full line of information.
7!
FASANO:
g Earlier in the evening before 4:00, you say you had taken readings.
in the, on the secondary side. Were you helping anyone in particular or g
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101 lli FARST: Juanita and I were on together because she's naturally more familiar with where you take your readings from than I was.
So she showed me where 131 the readings were taken and in turn my experience in Unit 1, I had to explain a lot to her that she didn't know.
And so between the two of us we were going through and then we took a break for lunch I guess about 3:00 or lo,,t quarter after.
And then Zewe came in and told that he wants to take her on 17!
the walk around, that she was still in training.
And after that I was on 18f my own for just a few minutes.
19t 20i FASANO:
Did you do any adding g, affc age), into the, I guess they had the 21; hydrogen system in generator i A;,/ they had problem with a leak there 22l and I know, I think that some of them, aux 6perr. tors, were putting hydrogen 23i in there.
Do you recall doing that?
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21 FARST: Yes, I do now, yeah.
2:
3l FASANO: He did? Who did you do that with?
4i FARST:
I think it was Dale Ollemill and I.
g; Si FASANO:
7 So you then, were with Dale for some time and Juanita some time?
8 FARS_T:
Right.
g 10i FASANO: You talked to Daugherty during lunch.
Okay.
And then at 3:00 11!
Zewe had a walk through.
131 FARST:
He'd come into the lunchroom and told Juanita he'd like to...
1 45 l
15 FASANO:
Private training?
17f FARST:
See her about 4: 00 or so.
181 19i FASANO:
Okay, so from 3 to a you were pretty much on your own.
20) i 21l FARST:
Right.
22' 23l
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FASANO: And that's when I guess you went down to the condensate polishers.
2 41 25!
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22 FARST:
Right.
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FASANO: About 37 4!
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FARST:
I left roughly say 3:30 from the lunchroom and checked a few things 6
on the way down.
I was, I think I was at the polishing unit for maybe 10 7l minutes before all tnis happened.
i 8i FASANO:
g Did you notice how they were trying to unplug the, I think it was 10l vessel No. 7?
11!
FARST:
I just know from what they said they were trying.
They were using air and blowing in there to aggitate it try to break the blue slip.
As far as the valving or how it was accomplished...
15; FASANO:
Did they have the air on at that time do you know?
1Nl FARST:
I couldn't really tell you, I don't know.
18t 19f FASANO:
Do you know where the air valve is on that particular system?
21l FARST:
Not right off I don't.
23 FASANO:
You never really done any work on that condensate polisher, it 24{
sounds like.
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23 gj FARST:
Right.
I'm not familiar at all with that.
2l t
FASANO:
You just happened to be there.
31 4!
FARST:
Just an innocent bystander.
5 6i FASANO: Okay. Well, at this time, if you'd like to give any words of
.tl advice to anyone else who happens to be in a situation like you where or do 81 you have any advice as to what one should do or how one should, or how did g
it go as far as you are concerned.
I mean you mentioned the control room was crowded and a few things. Are these any concerns that might lend somebody some thought, say if they have to face the same situation.
13 FARST:
Actually from what I've seen how the people handled it, the shift that was on and that time of the day and everything else, I really don't see myself how they could have done that much different or any better under those circumstances and what they kr.ew at the time.
I'm not ashamed what my crew did and anything else.
I'm rather pleased with their performance.
19f FASANO:
Owen, do you have any questions.
20!
21!
SHACKLETON:
No, I have no questions.
Do you want to bring the interview 22',
to a close then, Tony.
23 241 25i f
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i
24-FASANO:
I think so.
3 2!
l SHACKLETON: We'll bring the interview of Mr. Farst to a close at this 3
i 4!
time.
The time is now 1:33 p.m.
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