ML20247E096

Transcript of 890327 Evidentiary Hearing in Boston,Ma Re Offsite Emergency Planning.Pp 16,730-16,899

ML20247E096
Person / Time
Site:	Seabrook
Issue date:	03/27/1989
From:	Atomic Safety and Licensing Board Panel
To:
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CON-#289-8417 ASLBP, OL, NUDOCS 8903310296
Download: ML20247E096 (173)

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{{#Wiki_filter:__ yQ'::L ".'""':. r ~ ~ ~;1 - ~ " .m j ) )m l\\ w ----. w) ~ ~~~ ~ ~ O UNITED STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION ATOMIC SAFETY AND LICENSING BOARD In the Matter of: ) ) Docket Nos. PUBLIC SERVICE COMPANY OF ) 50-443-OL NEW HAMPSHIRE, et al., ) 50-444-OL )- OFF-SITE EMERGENCY (SEABROOK STATION, UNITS 1 AND 2) ) PLANNING EVIDENTIARY HEARING O 1 Pages: 16730 through 16899 Place: Boston, Massachusetts Date: March 27, 1989 Of gp6 "O \\ HERITAGE REPORTING CORPORATION O ny * ' opuntnearm 4 1229 L Street, N.W., Suke 600 JA Washington, D.C. 20005 13 (202) 628-4888 l 4 8903310296 890327 PD6' ADOCK 05000443 -________T___ PDC j

J d, 16730 4 UNITED STATES NUCLEAR REGUIATORY COMMISSION jq: , o. ATOMIC SAFETY AND LICENSING BOARD 8:c50T&I 1, In the Matter of: ) '3 ) Docket Nos. PUBLTC SERVICE COMPANY OF ) 50-443-OL NEN HAMPSHIE, :t al., ) 50-444-OL ) OFF-SITE EMERGENCY' (SEABROOK STATION, UN1f9 1 AND 2) ) PLANNING EVIDENTIARY HEARING

Monday, March 27, 1989 Auditorisam Thomas P. O'Neill, Jr.

Federa'i Building 10 Causeway Street Boston, Massachusetts The above-entitled matter came on for hearing, pursuant to notice, at 1:07 p.m. BEFORE: JUDGE IVAN W. SMITH, CHAIRMAN Atomic Safety and Licensing Board U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Washington, D.C. 20555 JUDGE KENNETH A. McCOLLOM, Member Atomic Safety and Licensing Board U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Washington, D.C. 20555 JUDGE RICHARD F. COLE, MEMBER Atomic Safety and Licensing Board U.S. Nuclear Regulatory C%nmission Washington, D.C. 20555 O ritae-R gereime Correlation (202) 628-4888 -)

~16731 l+ APPEARANCES: V-For the Acolicant: THOMAS G. DIGNAN, JR.,~ESQ. GEORGE H. LEWALD, ESQ. KATHRYN A. SELLECK, ESQ. JAY BRADFORD SMITH, ESQ. JEFFREY P. TROUT, ESQ. GEOFFREY C. COOK, ESQ. Ropes & Gray One Internat ional Place Boston, Massachusetts 02110-2624 For the NRC Staff: SHERWIN E. TURK, ESQ. ELAINE CHAN, ESQ. EDWIN J. REIS, ESQ. Office of General Counsel U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Washington, D.C. 20555 For the Federal Emeroency Manaaement Acencv: H. JOSEPH FLYNN, ESQ. ^ LINDA HUBER McPHETERS, ESQ. Federal Emergency Management Agency 500 C Street, S.W. Washington, D.C. 20472 For the Commonwealth ~of Massachusetts: JAMES M. SHANNON, ATTY. GEN. JOHN C. TRAFICONTE, ASST. ATTY. GEN. ALLAN h. FIERCE, ASST. ATTY. GEN. PAMELA TALBOT, ASST. ATTY. GEN. MATTHEW BROCK, ESQ. LESLIE B. GREER, ESQ. Commonwealth of Massachusetts One Ashburton Place, 19th Floor Boston, Massachusetts 02108 l l l l 'O rie e-a verei e cereer eie-(202) 628-4888 i L

16732-APPEARANCES: (Continued) For the State of New H==nshire GEOFFREY M. HUNTINGTON,.-ASST. ATTY. GEN. State of New Hampshire 25 Capitol Street Concord, New Hampshire 03301 For the Seacoast Anti-Pollution Leaoue: ROBERT A. BACKUS, ESQ. Backus, Meyer & Solomon -116 Lowell Street P.O. Box 516 Manchester, New Hampshire 03105 JANE: DOUGHTY, Direeto - Seacoast Anti-Pollution League 5 Market Street' Portsmouth, New Hampshire '03801 For the Town of Amesbury: BARBARA J. SAINT ANDRE, ESQ. .O Kopelman and Paige, P.C. %./ 77 Franklin Street Boston, Massachusetts WILLIAM LORD Town Hall Amesbury, Massachusetts 10913 For the City of Haverhill and Town of Merrimac: ASHOD N. AMIRIAN, ESQ. P. O. Box 38 Bradford, Massachusetts 01835 For the City of Newburvoort: BARBARA J. SAINT ANDRE, ESQ. JANE O'MALLEY, ESQ. Kopelman and Paige, P.C. 77 Franklin Street Boston, Massachusetts 02110 O rie 9-eerei 9 cereer eie-(202) 628-4888

L l16733 APPEARANCES: (Continued) - p. V For the Town'of Newburv: R. SCOTT HILL-MHILTON, ESQ. Lagoulis, Clark,~ Hill-Whilton & McGuire 79 State Street Newburyport, Massachusetts -01950 i ANGELO MACHIROS Town Hall Newburyport, Massachusetts 01950 For the Town of Salisbury: CHARLES P. GRAHAM, ESQ. Murphy and Graham 33 Low Street Newburyport, Massachusetts 01950 For the Town of West Newburv: JUDITH H. MIENER, ESQ. Second Floor. 79 State Street .NEwburyport, Massachusetts 01950 O O

eries, eru o c-raei-(202) 628-4888

16734/16735 IHREX ' !n VOIR ,g WITNESSES: DIRECT CROSS REDIRECT RECROSS. EXAM DIRE Richard A. Clark-by Mr. Dignan 16750 by Ms. O'Malley 16756 by Mr. Turk 16764 by Ms. O'Malley 16780 by Ms. Talbot 16840 by Mr. Turk 16849 by Mr. Dignan 16866 by Judge Cole 16871 by Judge McCollom 16873 by Ms. Talbot 16876 by Ms..O'Malley 16879 by Mr. Turk 16887 EXHIBITS: IDENTIFIED RECEIVED REJECTED DESCRIPTION Aeolicant's1 44 16749 16779 Amesbury (substitute) comprehensive emergency management plan O -rie se eru-, C-r ueo (202) 628-4888

1 4 16736 1 EE2CEER1HG1 i (])- i 2 JUDGE SMITH: Good afternoon. I 3 Is there any preliminary business?. 4 MS. DOUGHTY: Yes, Your Honor. The Soacoast 1 5 Anti-Pollution League has a motion to compel production of 6 documents that we filed with FEMA and I would like to 7 distribute copies. 8 (Docur.ent proffered to parties. ) 9 MS. TALBOT: Your Honor, I telefaxed a copy of a 10 letter proposing a schedule for the next five weeks of 11 hearings on Friday afternoon and it was a little bit after 12 5:00 so you may not have received it. 13 JUDGE SMITH: No chance, we never would have ,A' 14 received it. w) 15. MS. TALBOT: So I have copies out this afternoon. 16 JUDGE SMITH: This proposed schedule, I will 17 remind you that in the first instance schedules are supposed 18 to be a joint product of all of the parties. And we get 19 involved in it only when the parties fail to agree upon a 20 schedule. 21 MS. TALBOT: Thank you. 22 MS. O'MALLEY: Your Honor, my name is Jane 23 O'Malley. I'm here from Kopelman and Paige for the Town of i 24 Amesbury and the City of Newburyport. And the question I 25 have is, if we want to bring in rebuttal witnesses how would O

Merita, a gereia, c - r eio-(202) 628-4888

N" ' 16737 1 we; schedule that and.would.we have to have.prefiled ."'7 .2: te5timony? 3 JUDGE SMITH: In'the first place let's clarify g 4-your terms. Because of the very unusual way that this case '5 is unfolding the. testimony that you have already. offered 6- 'through your witnesses is rebuttal. 7 MS.-O'MALLEY: This would be further rebuttal to. 8 testimony that takes place during the course of the 9 proceedings. 10 JUDGE SMITH: It would be whatever rebuttal to 11 surrebuttal is, which I have never.got that far before. I 12 ' don't know, but it would be rebuttal to surrebuttal. And it 13' is not provided for, you have to demonstrate the need for 14 it.. But if you know you are going to do it,_you have to ~ {~ ) 15 provide it in writing just as your first testimony was. 16 MS. O' MALLEY : Thank you. 17 MR. FIERCE: Your Honor, this is Allan Fierce. I 18 had a conversation with Mr. Turk just a few minutes about 19 the issue that is still'pending regarding discovery.that the 20 Mass AG has requested of the NRC staff pertaining.to the 21 exercise contention MAG EX 19. I know Your Honor has been 22 following that issue fairly closely. We have had a Board 23 conference call about it. 24 As it stands right now our office is trying to 25 work closely with the NRC Staff in obtaining Mr. Perrotti to 1 . O rita,- eerei 9 correr eio- }' (202) 628-4888

16738 m

p1 j l' appear'either'.for deposition or for an appearance at these 1s):- ~ j 2 ' hearings.where.he could'be cross-examined by our office'at D, - 3 that time. 4 Mr. Perrotti is leaving the Agency, however, 5 Friday,-I think the end of this week. Mr. Turk is tryingfto. 6 process through the }UU. Staff, as he tells me, a request for 7 'a waiver of an NRC rule which would allow the Agency to pay. 8 Mr. Perrotti to come to these hearings essentially as an 9 expert witness, so that he could be paid for that effort. 10 It is not clear that that waiver will be granted. 11 Apparently the Agency has never granted a waiver to make a 12 former Staffer into a consultant within the first two years 13 after leaving the Agency. j{}" 14 I have only got a few more days before he'1 eaves 15 the Agency before I can catch him as an NRC Staff witness 16 and would be forced into a situation where I would have to 17 subpoena him as a third party. 18 All I know at this point is that he is retiring to I 19 Wisconsin. I have no address. I have no town. And I was 20 discussing with Mr. Turk the options. And I'm not coming to 21 you now with a motion, but I wanted the Board to be aware 22 that this is the situation. And what I was discussing with 23 Mr. Turk earlier was the notion that we ask the Board to 24 issue a subpoena. I don't have one prepared today that I 25 can hand up to you but I can bring it in tomorrow morning. O rica. =rew c-maci-(202) 628-4888

t 16739 1 LIf the; Board'could issue the subpoena tomorrow I would like EOL 2 to serve it on Mr.-Perrotti before he leaves the Agency. L 3 JUDGE SMITH: At the end of this week? -gy 4 HR. FIERCE: He is leaving on Friday I have been 5-told. 6 JUDGE SMITH: It just is not practical._ His 7 duties -.they just don't let you' walk out of the' Agency at-8 the NRC, you have to return your briefcases and things like 9 that.- He will be involved all this week I'm sure. 10 MR. FIERCE: I wouldn't intend to see him this 11 week, Your Honor. 12 JUDGE SMITH: You're going to get it, if it has 13 been agreed that he will come. 14 MR. FIERCE: I. haven't gotten that agreement yet. (} 15 JUDGE SMITH: Well, that's your first thing. Get 16 the agreement that the EDO will designate him as one of the 17 witnesses. 18 MR. FIERCE: Well, I wish I could get that 19 agreement from them voluntarily, Your Honor. I keep asking 20 for him to be produced. I get the assurance that they're 21 trying to get the waiver but I haven't got a promise that he 22 will be produced. 23 JUDGE SMITH: Well, he is always subject to a 24 third party subpoena. It is not going to be possible to 25 interrupt this week. O eriee. R -ue c-reei-(202) 628-4888 h __.--____._____-__m.

l -16740 1 MR. FIERCE: I don't want to do.that. What I k' 2 would want to do, Yo'ur Honor, would be to serve him this 3 week with'a subpoena indicating that he should come.to the 4 hearings at some date in the future that we can agree on. I 5 I'm willing to be very' reasonable on that. At his i 6 convenience, a date in the future after he leaves the 7 Agency. But I would like to get the service on him while I 8 know where he is. 9 JUDGE SMITH: Contrary to what those of you who '10 live in Boston might think, Wisconsin is a pretty civilized 11 _ place. They will find him, don't worry. He is not dropping 12 out of -- 13 MR. FIERCE: Mr. Turk tells me he does not know /~' 14 what address he will have when he retires to Wisconsin. ()i-15 JUDGE SMITH: We will trace him down wherever he 16 'may go. I just can't help you right now other than to 17 indicate that -- well, in the first place, Mr. Turk, does 18 the Staff assert that he is not a proper witness? 19 MR. TURK: No. 20 JUDGE SMITH: So the Staff is prepared and willing 21 to produce him to the extent that it is able to? 22 MR. TURK: Yes. Let me add to that, if he was 23 going to continue to be a Staff employee at the time of 24 these hearings, then I would make him part of the panel that 25 we would produce on that contention. O eritase Re,oreine cereer eion (202) 628-4888

1 16741 1 JUDGE SMITH: Well, I also know by other sources -f~ 2 that the Staff acted very promptly because two weeks ago an 3 . inquiry came to me as to whether it looked like he would 4 have to be an essential witness because they wanted to put ~ 5 him on as a consultant ar.d my advice was to plan for it. l 6 .The determination.hadn't'been made yet but they should plan 7 for it. So they atarted the paperwork quite promptly. And 8 you will get him. I have no feeling that there will be a 9 problem. 10 I'm also familiar with the contract and 11 regulations to which you refer and hefdoesn't really fit 12 into the category of the two year employee and that type of 13 thing because he is needed to present particular factual {~ ) 14 situations. 15 Whatever value it may be, Mr. Turk, from what I 16' read about and heard about his participation in the 17 exercise, we would regard him as a very important witness to 18 this proceeding. l 19 MR. TURK: Your Honor, if I can clarify what the f 20 problem is. It's not a regulation that prevents our } 21 producing him. It's not the Part 0 of 10 CFR, that's at 22 issue here, rather it's a manual chapter which prohibits j 23 contracts with NRC Staff employees for two years following 24 employment. 25 JUDGE SMITH: It's not a blanket prohibition. O Herie. e Regerein, correlation (202) 628-4888 l

y 16742 1 MR. TURK:, That's right, there is a waiver. i'q.g)p 2 permitted. And that's what we're trying to obtain. 3 In the course of that,'a memo has been prepared. 4 I have. approved it requesting his services. I have now been 5 advised that there might be a problem with-Title 18 of the. 6 U.S.' Code which are the' criminal provisions. So that's 7-being looked into right'now by OGC.; Assuming we pass that I; 8 don't think there will be any problem getting the waiver. 9 MR. FIERCE: Well, Your Honor, I gather you are '10 giving.me'an indication that you don't think a subpoena 11 would be necessary. I was willing to do that just as a stop-12 gap, as a-backstop in case he were to slip through the 13 -cracks. 14 JUDGE SMITH: If we were to issue a subpoena right. ({} 15 now, by the time it was served he would -- if he did not 16 wish to comply with the subpoena he certainly would be 17 justified in moving for a continuance, a motion to quash or 18 whatever.. 19 The approach is to work out these problems. They 20 are big problems for him. We will have to work it out. 21 MR. FIERCE: I'm trying to be as flexible as I 22 can -- 23 JUDGE SMITH: I see that you are. 24 MR. FIERCE: -- without letting him fall through 25 the cracks, that's all. Heritage Reporting Corporation ~* (202) 628-4888

^ ' " I 16743 1 JUDGE SMITH: I see that you are and you have 'j

e 2 moved timely on'-it, I can see that.-'Or at least'it appears D 3 to me that you have. I would see no reason why.we won't 1 4 have.him when we need him. 5 -The simplest thing ~would be for'him'to -- he'can't.. 6 know what the problems are. 'So we will get him. ] l 7 I'll go one step further. I was waiting until the j 8 actual problem arises. 9 I see Dr. Adler is present. Are you ready to 10 proceed? 11' MR. DIGNAN: Your Honor, we have a couple of 12 matters beforehand. First of all, what is being distributed 13 to the Board now and has been distributed to the parties is '14 a corrected-version of Applicants Rebuttal Testimony No. 9. 15 And while I would not normally take the time to do this, I 16 do want to point a couple of things out to the Board with-17 respect to this. 18 As the Board can probably imagine, when the 19 testimony was being drafted we of course could not 20 anticipate every ruling the Board might make in terms of 21 objections and motions in limine. As a result there was 22 originally material included in this testimony that would 23 have addressed certain of the matters that the Board have 24 ruled are out of the case as a result of rulings the Board 25 has made on motions in limine. O erie - rei-, c-macion (202) 628-4888 u o 1 L l i 16744 j j 1-When faced with that, what we decided to do, and 2~ 'you can find an example of it let us'~say on page 39, is to 3 strike over that testimony as opposed to excising it 4 . physically. And the reason for.doing.that'was to -- it is L 5' very neatly stricken over with.a typewriter, but the point-l L 6 .being we did not wish in a big piece of testimony like this 7 to change the. pagination. We assumed people would have been'. l 8 preparing cross-examination and one thing or another and we- '9- . thought the most efficient way to do it was to strike it 10 over, making it clear it's not offered or admitted and take 11 care of it that way. 12 I hope that the Board concurs with that approach. L I think any other approach would have set up with a 13 L(]); 14 situation where everything after this was.one page off and -15 there's a couple of other places where it has been done and 16 it would have changed the pagination of the testimony among l 17 other things. 18 Also, I see some merit.in-the -- if this is going i 19 up in appeal I frankly also see some merit -- l 20-JUDGE SMITH: As a~ proffer. 21 MR. DIGNAN: -- in the Appeal Board having before 22 it what would have been proffered in response to it which 23 may save us all some time later, also. l 24 JUDGE SMITH:

Yes, i

25 MR. DIGNAN: That's one point. There is another O serie 9 megerein, correlation (202) 628-4888 i 1 a. 16745 1

particular point I..wish to make to the Board and that'is, if LO"-

2 .the Board would turn to page 61. And what may appear to be 3 an insignificant change was made in the last_line of that 4' document and I wish to explain to the Board why it was done-l L 5 in order to assure no misunderstanding later. 6 In the last.line there the word "will" has been 7 inserted between the words " materials" and'" include," if.the-8 Board will read. So that the sentence now reads: "In 9 addition the public information. materials will include 10 simplified evacuation bus route maps." 11 Now the reason for that change is this; the bus 12 route maps are-like everything else, they are in a stage of. 13 development. And as the Board is aware we have prefiled 14 with the Board an Exhibit No. 40 which is the calendar of. [} 15 materials of prefiled -- of so-called pre-emergency i 16 information. ) 17 In addition there are attachments to Applicants 18 profiled No. 7 which is a post which also has bus route 19 maps. 20 The Board indicated, and quite rightly so, a 21 little shall I say dissatisfaction the other day when they 22 learned for the first time there were errors in certain 23 materials that the Applicants had filed from other parties 24 as opposed to us. 25 The point being that because the bus route maps O eriease e rein, c-raeiem (202) 628-4888 1 16746 1 have developed and changed,-when we offer Applicants Exhibit 2 40 and we' offer that attachment.to Applicants'No. 7, the 3 offer should be understood to be made.-- and I so stipulate '4 for th's record now in case by any chance it falls through 5 the cracks when the offer is actually made -- that those 6' offers are not for the truth of the matters contained but 7 rather to illustrate the type of materials involved. And I-8 do that to avoid being in the position where I have offered 9 a bus route map that we know is going to change (nr is in the 10-process'of being changed. 11 In addition I have been authorized to commit on 12 the record that before the plant goes above five percent 13 power, should that be allowed, new calendars with the up to 14-date maps will be distributed to the public at large. -[ } 15 I have reviewed'the changes that have been made. 16 They are minor. They are the kind of things where you 17 decide to turn right say one block earlier. They-are small, 18 at least to my untutored eye they are small. 19 But I did want to do that rather than run into 20 later anybody thinking we had offered something for the 21 truth of the matters contained which we know either already 22 has been changed or is going to be changed in the final 23 version. And that is the purpose of that change and I just 24 want to make clear to the Board that's why it was made. 25 The balance of the corrections which are on the l

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(202) 628-4888 l L 16747 'l correction sheet I.think are fairly self-explanatory and V,s 2 -either fall into the area of a simple error or a change in 3 l detail when a witness has had one last review of the usual 4 kind of corrections. 5 With that it was my understanding the next order 6 of business, Your Honor, would be to call Mr. Richard A. 7 Clark to the stand. Mr. Clark, if you recall,"we put a 8 subpoena out which the Board issued. I have the subpoena 9 return here for filing. 10 I will ask the Chairman's pleasure, is it that.we 11 file it straight to Washington or would you like us.to give 12 it to you? We have the subpoena with the original return on 13 it. 14: JUDGE. SMITH: Those are not normally -- {j 15 MR. DIGNAN: HWe don't. bother normally to return 16 them? 17 JUDGE SMITH: Well, they should be returned if 18 there is a question. 19 MR. DIGNAN: There is no question. 20 JUDGE SMITH: Is Mr. Clark present? 21 MR. DIGNAN: Yes, he is. 22 JUDGE SMITH: In response to the subpoena? 23 MR. DIGNAN: Yes. 24 JUDGE SMITH: That's fine. I wouldn't bother with 25 it. Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 I 7? 16748-16, 1 MR. DIGNAN: All ' right, '. fine. 2 And if itLwould be agreeable to the Board then, ID !3 would-begin by calling Mr. Clark for this brief examination.. 4- -Now, in connection therewith I have furnished to l: 5 the' reporter three' copies - and also for'the parties _and- .6 the Board -- of a document which I would like to substitute 7 for'what is now marked 44 for identification. ~ 8 The Board will recall'that on~our last session-9 there was examination with. respect to this Amesbury 10 Emergency. Plan and a portion thereof. I think it was Annex 11 M marked 44 for. identification. 12 As long as we are having Mr. Clark here to 13 ~ authenticate the entire' document and because there was some 14 question raised that'maybe the entire document should be

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15 offered as opposed to just'a piece of it. With the Board's 16 permission I have furnished the reporter three copies of the 17 entire document which is copied one sided. It is globally 18 number through page 248 and I would like permission to 19 substitute that as Applicants Exhibit 44 for identification 20 at this time. 21 JUDGE SMITH: Any objections? 22 (:No response) 23 JUDGE SMITH: So Applicants 44 for identification 24 is now -- 25 MR. DIGNAN: Is a document entitled "Amesbury O eriea,m =ererein, correraeiem (202) 628-4888 + j f ". 16749-1 ' prepared' June.13th, 1986" with the initials appearing "RAC,."

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L-J. 2 being 248.pages so globally numbered in the upper right hand-3 corner. b 4 JUDGE SMITH: And how is'it different from the 5 superseded?' 6 MR. DIGNAN: The: superseded one was merely;a piece 7 .of.this. I believe it was Annex M, Your' Honor, and the 8 table of centents. 9 JUDGE SMITH: But the face page was the same? 10 MR. DIGNAN: Yes, the face page was the same, Your. 11 Honor, yes.. 12 JUDGE SMITH: Okay. 13 (The document referred 14 .to was marked'for 15 identification as 16 Applicants Exhibit 44 17 substitution.) 18 MR. DIGNAN: And with that I would call Mr. Clark 19 to the stand and ask that he be sworn, Your Honor.., 20 Whereupon, 21 RICHARD A. CLARK 22 having been first duly sworn, was called as a witness 23 herein, and was examined and testified as follows: 24 JUDGE SMITH: Mr. Dignan, will your Rebuttal 25 Testimony No. 9, will that be the form that's actually h Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 1 .CIARK -. DIRECT 16750 1-offered, are you fairly. confident'now? <c '2 -MR. DIGNAN: I am fairly confident, Your Honor, 3 unless.we pick up something between now and later.- In any. 4 ' event, as we have always done and as we.did here with this 5 final errata sheet, we will continue'to be sure and make 6 overy effort that in'no event does any. pagination change of 7 any kind. 8. JUDGE SMITH: And the electronic version will-be 9 the one that's actually -- 10 MR. DIGNAN: Yes, Your Honor, unless you tell us 11 ~otherwise we are not going to send an electronic version 12 until it has been admitted into evidence so that-it's 13 absolutely clear you have precisely the document that went 14 into' evidence. 15 DIRECT EXAMINATION 16 BY MR. DIGNAN: 17 Q Mr. Clark, would you be kind enough'to state your 18 full name an'd your business address for the record, please, 19 sir? 2 .A (Clark) My name is Richard A. Clark. My business 21 address if I'm here as'a Civil Defense Director would be 9 22 School Street, Amesbury. 23 Q And you hold an office in.the Town of Amesbury, 24 sir? 25 A (Clark) Yes, I do. 'O rie 9-eerei 9 corro= eio-(202) 628-4888 l l L ( l CLARK - DIRECT 16751 i. + L 1 Q What office is that? L 2 A (Clark) Director of Civil Defense. 3 Q Could you describe for the Board generally what 4 the duties of the Director of the Civil Defense of Amesbury i 5 is? l 6 A (Clark) The duties are to manage the Civil 7 Defense program as a whole. And also under state law, which 8 I serve under, I'm responsible for emergency planning for 9 the town. 10 Q Mr. Clark, I have caused to be placed before you a 11 document which has been marked in this proceeding as 12 Applicants Exhibit 44 for identification. And I r9present 13 to you that the copy that became 44 for identification is 14 copied one sided only, although I do understand the original [} 15 is a two sided copy. 16 And with that understanding can you tell us what 17 Exhibit 44 for identification is, sir? 18 A (Clark) This was a plan that was updated from 19 originally 1981 which would be the last plan that was 20 presented on behalf of the Civil Defense Agency for the Town 21 of Amesbury which at that time I was not the Civil Defense 22 Director. Maynard Pearson was. 23 This was a plan that the State of Massachusetts 24 Civil Defense Agency and myself sat down back in 1985 and 25 began to prepare in order to meet federal guidelines with O aerie 9 aeroreine cereer eien (202) 628-4888 1 i CLARK - DIRECT. 16752 1 the change in the Civil Defense program, once we went to 3 2 what they called a comprehensive emergency management setup. 3 And to the best of my knowledge, all 351 cities 4 and towns have one of these. So it was a requirement the 5 state made all the communities do. 6 Q Mr. Clark, do I understand that the version that 7 has been marked Exhibit 44 for identification, Applicants 8-Exhibit 44 for identification is a document which you 9 prepared or assisted in preparing? 10 A (Clark) I assisted in preparing. 11 Q And who assisted you with the preparation? 12 A (Clark) Mike Filben from the Commonwealth of 13 Massachusetts Civil Defense Agency and there were other 14 people involved. Also my Sector Director and the Area (}' 15 Director from Area 1 headquarters for the state.were also 16 involved. 17 Q In your activity in preparing this document were 18 you acting in your official capacity as Civil Defense 19 Director for the Town of Amesbury? 20-A (Clark) Yes, I was. 21 Q At the time it was done did it represent your best 22 judgment as to a plan for the Town of Amesbury? 23 A (Clark) As I stated before, this was more or less 24 a generic type of plan that was done for all the cities and 25 towns within the Commonwealth. I had a lot of input into it O norita R gorein, correlation (202) 628-4888 s i: Li CLARK - DIRECT 16753 l 1 as far as a. lot of the local items that are addressed in o 2 here. But a' lot of it also was done'through, I believe, 3 word processing by the state. 4 Q Could you look at Annex.M in particu_'t of the 5 ' document? M as in Mary. 6 JUDGE SMITH: Again, would you give the global 7 page numbering. 8 (Pause) 9 JUDGE SMITH: 190 of 248. Am I correct? 10 MR. DIGNAN: Yes. In particular I was-going to. 11 refer the witness to page 193 of 248 12 13 (:1 15 l 16 l 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 O rie 9-a rorei v coreor eie= (202) 628-4888 CLARK - DIRECT 16754 -1 Q Were you the one who selected those traffic 2 control points that are set forth on page 193 on 248? 3 A (Clark) .No, I was not. 4 Q Who did? 5 'A (Clark) To the best of my knowledge, those came 6 from the original'1981 plan that was done. 7~ 'Q-And did you concur in the utilization of these 8 particular traffic control points?. 9 A (Clark) At that point, yes, for what they were 10 using it for, being the major routes. 11 MR. DIGNAN: At this point, Your Hor.or, I would 12 like to offer in evidence Applicants' Exhibit 44 for 13 identification. I believe that any question as to 14 authenticity is now gone as much as we have the author on 15 the stand. 16 MS. O'MALLEY: Your Honor, I would object on 17 grounds of relevancy. There is no indication at all that 18 Mr. Clark was authorized to complete this document in the 19 way that he purports to have done so. There is no 20 indication that anyone else in the town even worked with him 21 on this document, or that any of the bodies who oversee Mr. 22 Clark authorized him to work on it. 23 This document is out of date, as I will be able to 24 demonstrate if I have a chance to cross-examine Mr. Clark. 25 It is basically a generic document, as Mr. Clark has O =it 9-

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(202) 628-4888 ) CLARK - DIRECT 16755 1 testified, that was drawn up by the state civil defense. 2 Mr. Clark has plugged in a few references to Amesbury. And 3 in fact it was intended for ordinary emergencies. It's 4 certainly not relevant to the proceedings here and the type 5 of emergency thac we are concerned with in this proceeding. 6 So for all of those reasons, I would ask that the 7 Board not accept it into evidence. 8 JUDGE SMITH: Do you wish to be heard? l 9 MR. DIGNAN: Only, Your Honor, that the witness 10 made clear that he prepared it in his role as civil defense 11 director acting under those powers, and I frankly don't 12 understand the objection in light of that testimony. 13 The counsel is, of course, free to try to cross-14 examine and demonstrate that the witness was in error when {} 15 he spoke, but I think he certainly is a public official that l 16 identified it as having been dor.s within the powers of his 17 office and pursuant to the powers of those offices. 18 JUDGE SMITH: If you represent, Ms. O'Malley, that 19 there was an impediment in his authority to this document, 20 and that's your representation as a counsel, we'll let you 21 examine him on voir dire before we receive it. But I have 22 read, as you might know, the Civil Defease Act of 23 Massachusetts and I have heard his clear testimony that he 24 is a civil defense director, and that he worked with it; 25 it's a generic one. And if you can refute that, if you O erita9e aerotein, corgoraeien (202) 628-4888 1 CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16756 j 1 1-represent to us you can refute it, you can examine him on 7-q. %J' i 1 2 voir dire. 1 3 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. 4 JUDGE SMITH: Now as far as the other relevancy 5 items, the Board will take those under advisement. 6 NE. O'MALLEY: Thank you. Actually, Your Honor, 7 could I also have permission to examine him as to some of 8 the specific aspects of the plan? 9 JUDGE SMITH: Yes, you will be able to do that. 10 But now you are examining-solely for the admissibility. 11 MS. O'MALLEY: Okay, thank you, Your Honor. 12 VOIR DIRE 13 BY MS. O' MALLEY : 14 Q Mr. Clark, you were appointed by the town manager; (} 15 isn't that correct? 16 A (Clark) Yes, that's correct. 17 Q You are a part-time employee of the Town of 18 Amesbury? 19 A (Clark) I am also a full-time fire fighter, but 20 part-time civil defense, yes. 21 Q Right, but in your capacity as a civil defense 22 director. 23 And the town manager acts according to the 24 direction of the Board of Selectmen; isn't that correct? 25 A (Clark) That's correct. O M rieae. Rogerein, Correlation (202) 628-4888 __-__--_-__-____O ~1 CLARK - VOIR. DIRE 16757 l 1 Q And the town charter of Amesbury, are.you familiar j-. V 2 with.the town charter? 3: A' (Clark) Pretty much.. 4 .Q .Okay. And your position of. civil defense director 5 is not specifically listed in the town charter, is it? 6 A. (Clark) That I'm not' aware of.- '7 -Q Okay. 8 A-(Clark). I know it was under the original by-lawa-. 9 for the town. I'm not sure if it's within that charter 10 . document though. 11 MS. O'MALLEY: Your Honor, may I approach the 12 witness?. 13 JUDGE SMITH: Oh, yes, all.right. 14 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. 15 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 16 Q If I represent to you this the Town of Amesbury -- 17 A Right, right. 18 JUDGE SMITH: You can sit beside him.if.it would 19 be easier, Ms. O'Malley. 20 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. 21 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 22 Q If I represent to you, Mr. Clark, that that is the 23 charter for the Town of Amesbury, could you -- 24 A (Clark) Yes, I can agree to it. 25 Q Can you agree to that? O-H rie e-gorei, corror tio-(202) 628-4888 i r r.- Eo CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16758 1 A ~(Clark)_ Yes. -O< 2 Q Okay. Let's-go to See, tion'412. 3 I'm sorry, it's Section 312..Immediately 4 preceding'Section 312 is a listing of all of the boards and m 5 officers in the Town of Amesbury and their various 6 authority. I would ask you to take a look at that section 7

and see if you find anywhere in-there the civil defense 8

' director's position. It would be preceding section-31.t. 9 JUDGE SMITH: _ Could this' be stipulated?- 10 MR. DIGNAN: Well, it can certainly be stipulated 11 that the words'" civil defense director" don't appear. There 12 was also a provision for all other officers as the town may 13 appoint. 14 I mean if the challenge here is to whether.it [} 15 exists in there, it doesn't. But I assume counsel -- are 16-you taking the position that this man has never been sworn 17 as civil defense director? 18 MS. O' MALLEY : _ No, I'm not. I'm just trying to 19 place him in the town as to what his authority is -- 20. MR. DIGNAN: Okay. 21 MS. O'HALLEY: -- in relation to other town 22 authorities. 23 MR. DIGNAN: He would be under "Other bodies", I 24 assume, in there, and I would so stipulate. 25 MS. O' MALLEY : Okay. O erie 9-rorei 9 career tie-(202) 628-4888 .1 i CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16759 -1 BY NE. O'MALLEY: o c)' '~ 2 Q Mould you mind reading.into the record what that 3 says'under "Other bodies"?- It's very brief. ~ 4 A, (Clark) Other boards, 3117 5 Q. 312, other officers. 6 A' -(Clark) It says, "The town manager shall appoint 7 and may remove, subject to civil service laws were-8 applicable, the~ town-clerk, town-treasurer-collector, and-9 a11' department heads, all officers and all subordinates and 10 employees for whom no other method of appointment is 11. provided in the charter." 12 Q- .Thank you. 13 Mr. Clark, you mentioned that you believe you'were. -{ ) also appointed under state law; is that correct? 14 15 -A (Clark) No, it's a requirement under Chapter 639 16 of each town to have a civil defense director. 17 Q That's correct. 18 A (Clark) Section 13. 19 Q Section 13, that's correct. 20 And you were appoint'ed by the town manager 21 pursuant to that section, because there is.a town manager in 22 the Town of Amesbury? 23 A (Clark) Since the inception of the charter, yes. 24 It used to be the Board of Selectmen. l-25 Q That's correct. h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 j i CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16760 1 1 And your authority under that section is to have i .,.,) f k_ 2-direct responsibility for the organization, administration 4 3 and operation of local organization for civil defense 4 subject'to the direction and control of the appointing a 5 authority; isn't that correct? 6 A (Clark) Correct. 7 Q So in fact when you say that you are in charge of 8 planning for the Town of Amesbury, it is subject to the 9 control of the town manager and t such control that the 10 Board.of Selectmen would have over the town manager. 11 A (Clark) That's correct. 12 Q Is that correct? 13 A (Clark) Right. 14' Q Now the Board of Selectmen and the town manager ) 15 have never approved this plan; isn't that correct? 16 A (Clark) No, it was never formally voted on. 17 Q And it's never been approved by either of those 18 bodies or boards; isn't that correct? 19 A (Clark) Correct. 20 JUDGE SMITH: Would you inquire if it has been 21 disavowed? 22 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 23 Q Mr. Clark, has it ever been before either the t.own 24 manager or the Board of Selectmen? Have you brought it to 25 them? () Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK -~ DIRECT 16761 1 A (Clark) Requesting'that this be accepted? - h-o 2 Yes. 3 Q Yes. 4-A (Clark) And it was brought before a. town meeting 5 also in 1986. 6 Q And it was never accepted -- 7 A' (Clark) Correct. 8 Q -- in 19867 9 A (Clark) Correct. 10 Q And it was never accepted by the Board of 11 Selectmen; isn't that correct? 12 A (Clark) Right. '13 Q So therefore it was in a sense disavowed, was'it 14 not, Mr. Clark? {) 15 A (Clark) Right, but I -- it was disavowed, yes, 16 okay. L 17 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. 18 Your Honor, I would again renew my motion that Mr. 19 Clark did not have the authority to -- 20 MR. DIGNAN: May I inquire further in light of l 21. that? 22 DIRECT EXAMINATION (Continued) 23 BY MR. DIGNAN: 24 Q Mr. Clark, is it fair to say that these 25 disavowals, if they be such that you have referred to, took l O rie 9-rorei 9 corror tie-(202) 628-4888 J g L CLARK - DIRECT 16762 1 place after the town took a position against the Seabrook.

• -O 2

. Nuclear Power Plant? 3 A (Clark). Okay. I think the-first thing that needs 4-to be straightened out here, because -- okay, there.was a 5 question originally as far as the date:of the document was- ~ 6 concerned. And, of course, seeing eight1or nine~ plans go by-me over ths.past two or three years and througl.the process, 8 the date that you see there, being June 13, 1986,- with my 9. initials on it, that_was put on this document atithe time 10 that the town's' original law firm, Shaines & McEachern, '11 requested this document for copy. 12 Before I turned the document over for copy, I 13 requested of the state Civil Defense Agency'to give me the {}. exact date that the plan was turned back over to the town 14 15 and their knowledge and rt'riew.down there. They gave me the 16 1986 date. 17 It's still hard in-my mind to try to exactly 18 remember exactly when this did come through. There is a lot 19 of references on the pages to 1985. But I have used this 20 document for judgment purposes and also to direct the 21 operations of the department. And I don't recall using it 22 in 1985 for Hurricane Gloria, which would have been the 23 first instance I would have been able to use the thing. 24 JUDGE SMITH: You did or did not use this? 25 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I did not use it. So I O rie 9-earei 9 core r ti - (202) 628-4888 CLARK ' DIRECT 16763 i 1 believe at that time.it was not available to me. Either'it ,_sU 2 was back for revisions or it was still in printing at the 3 time. It has been used since. I have used it and I used it 4 in 1987 during the flooding as far as damage assessment and 5 direction and control for the incident only because it's the 6 only updated piece of emergency management work we had 7 available to direct the operations at that time. 8 BY MR. DIGNAN: 9 Q Do I understand you to be testifying then that 10 this plan in fact has been utilized to some extent? 11 A (Clark) It's been utilized for my personal use as 12 far as being able to understand my requirements under law to 13 be able to run the program during an emergency. 14 Q Incidently, Mr. Clark, I understand only too well { 15 that certain public officials in certain towns are in a bit 16 of a bind here. And if I ask you a question that in any way 17 makes you feel you are giving me an answer that would 18 somehow violate your oath of office, I wish you would tell 19 me and I will try to rephrase the question. But my next 20 question is simply this. 21 If tomorrow there were an emergency in your town 22 and as civil defense director you were to undertake your 23 duties in light thereof, is this the plan you would look to? 24 A (Clark) That's the only thing I've got to use 25 right now. O aerie e-aererei 9 career eio= (202) 628-4888 i r CLARK - VOIR DIRE

16764

1' MR. DIGNAN:- I sLand by my offer..

2. .MR.. TURK: Your Honor,: I think - - '3-JUDGE SMITH: Mr.. Turk. 4 'MR. TURK: We have a few questions.al'ng the same o 5 line. ~6' MR. DIGNAN: -Are these on voir dire? 7 MR. TURK: In voir dire, Your Honor. 8' 'VOIR DIRE 9 BY MR. TURK: 10. Q Mr. Clark,'I'm Sherwin Turk with the NRC Staff. 11 Is there a state statute that requires the - 12 preparation of' emergency plans? 13 A (Clark) Yes, there is. l 14 Q. For towns in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts? ' 15 A (Clark) Right. 16 Q What is-that statue? 17 A (Clark) I can't tell you off the top of my head. 18 I believe it's :- - I want to say-Executive Order 144, but ; I'm. ~ 19 not sure. I took my class in '83 law, civil defense laws. 20 It's been awhile. 21 Q Mas this particular plan prepared pursuant to 22 either state statute or executive order? 23 A (Clark) It was a requirement that each town have 24 a plan. You know, it's part of their Chapter 699 laws that 25 the communities and political subdivisions ccnform to the -O rit e-earei=9 corror tie-(202) 628-4888 CLARK -'VOIR DIRE 16765- .1-state civi1~ defense program, and.the state civil' defense

0^

. 2. .' program requires'it. 3 31 MS. O'MALLEY: Your. Honor.. Excuse me,cYour Honor. 4' .'It may be too late to object, but I don't think Mr. Clark :is-5 an. attorney qualified-to answer what the legal < requirements' '6 are. 7 THE WITNESS:. (Clark) I'm not. 8 MS.'O'MALLEY: For the Town'of Amesbury. 9 MR. DIGNAN: If he is qualified to answer what was 10 in the town charter, Your Honor, he certainly is qualified! 11 to' answer these questions. r 12 JUDGE SMITH: We have consistently addressed this '13. program-as it arises. Sometimes the objections are made by:- 14 Interveners; sometimes by the Applicants, but it's. rarely. 15-. successful. 16 If, a part of his responsibility is to understand 17 the legal requirements of his job-and to execute then, then 18 he can testify'as to his perception and how he reacts to 19 state statutes or ordinances or charters or whatever it is. l 20 MS. O'MALLEY: Okay, I didn't realize he was 21 testifying only as to his perception. He seemed to be 22 speaking as an authority. 23 JUDGE SMITH: It's only the perception as it 24 relates to his official duties and his acts and his -- in f 25 anything outside his official duties or his role, his O rie e-

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(202) 628-4888 r CLARK - VO'IR DIRE' .16766 1 perception might be: incompetent, and your objection would bel th 2 sustained. But clearly.here it is within his role as civil '3 defense' director how he understand his role and the law that 4, governs.his activities. 5 So the objection _is overruled. 6 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you,.Your Honor. 7 BY MR.' TURK: 8' Q 'Let me see if I understand that. 9 Was this particular plan, Applicants' Exhibit-40, 10 . prepared pursuant to. state statutory authority or executive 11 order? l. 12 A (Clark) Yes. Like I say,'there is 351 of them. 13 Q This is one of those? 14-A (Clark) Right. h 15 MS. TALBOT: Your Honor, I would like to make an 16 _ objection. The witness has not said -- the witness has_only 17 said to his belief there are 351 such plans. Later.at voir 18 dire I planned on asking or having Jane ask,.you know, what 19 he bases that knowledge on. 20 JUDGE SMITH: We are not going to have a full 21 cross-examination of the witness for voir dire purposes. 22 But if you think it goes to the weight to be placed on it, 23 if in fact we accept it, we will let you inquire. 24 MS. TALBOT: Thank you. 25 JUDGE SMITH: Unless you have reason, unless you i O = r** 9-a eartias carear **aa l (202) 628-4888 { l CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16767. 1 have reason. ' Now this is ru) time for discovery, or no time () 2 for exploring. ~ 3 MS. TALBOT: Well, Your Honor, I think there is an 4 assumption'here that 351 of these~ plans are out-there,.and I ] 5 would just.like to know how-the witness knows that. 6 JUDGE SMITH: Yes, but suppose there is only 250.. 7 MS. TALBOT: What is there is only one? 8 THE WITNESS: (Clark) There is more than one. I 9 can assure you of that. 10 JUDGE SMITH: He knows it's a state requirement 11 for municipalities. He knows that there are 351 12 municipalities, the gist of his testimony so far. 13 MS. TALBOT: But he doesn't know that the 14 particular city or town has necessarily complied yet with 15 the law. That's my point. 16 JUDGE SMITH: Well, that's just not relevant. 17 MS. TALBOT: Okay. 18 BY MR. TURK: 19 Q Mr. Clark, have you received any instructions from 20 the town manager or the Board of Selectmen as to how you are 21 to perform your duties? l 22 A (Clark) I have recently, yes. It was done, I'd l l 23 have to say back early fall of last year. 24 Q 1988? l 25 A (Clark) Right. Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l. i CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16768 1 Q 'And can you describe generally what those j E 2 instructions were? 3 A (Clark) Well, it was more or less of an 4. understanding that was drawn up by the board to try to i 5-simplify things, because we had had some problems as far as j 6 holding drills, et cetera. And all it was'was direction as 7 far as my training was concerned for my civil defense staff 8 and volunteers that all training had to be priorly. approved 9 by the board and the manager. And as far as the reporting, 10 my reporting on a monthly basis to the board to keep them 11 informed of what was taking. place, you know, with the 12 program. .Just more cn: less like a watchful eye. 13 Q' That's with regard to training?. 14 A (Clark) Right. 15 Q If there was to be an emergency in the Town of; 16 Amesbury for any reason, whether it be chemical. spill or a-17 crash of a bomber carrying nuclear weapons, anything, do you 18 have any understanding of how you are to carry out your 19 duties? 20 A (Clark) As I say, the only guidance we've got is 21 this, or there is another document which the state put out,- 22 which is another comprehensive emergency management plan 23 which was a state plan, but it's.not -- it's more or less 24 directed as far as the state operations are concerned, and 25 it's not individualized for the Town of Amesbury. It's a Q Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 i p CLARK - VOIR' DIRE 16769-1 general knowledge type document. That's what I originally '2 had'to. work with before I had this one. 3 Q' Is'the town manager aware that you are in 4-possession of this particular plan, Applicants' Exhibit 44?- 5-A (Clark) He knows I'am in possession'of it,..yes. 6 Q Does he understand that in'the event of an 7 ' emergency you would turn to this plan? 8 A (Clark) Well, to be' perfectly honest with you,'I 9 can't say'that he does. 10-Q .You haven't had conversations about it? 11 A (Clark) No. Like'I say, it's just since this 12 thing was put~together in the first place, with.all the '13 ' hoopla and everything going on as far as, you know, the 11 4 plant was concerned and everything else, there wasn't any 15 -desire by anybody in the Town of Amesbury to do anything-as 16 far as emergency planning. And I mean this is where I-17 think it has to be clarified right now that people have to 18-understand my position here. 19 You know, when the state of emergency is declared 20-and the town is under emergency conditions and everything, 21 I'm the guy that's the middleman between the state and the 22. federal government and everything else as far as trying to 23 activate the town's program and trying to utilize resources i 24 and make everything work as a whole under my obligations 25 under law. Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16770 1 And, unfortunately, I have to go back and be able (~') \\' 2 to review something over to kind of help me along. Plus they 3 also.have to understand that during emergencies I am also 4 advised from a state level of what to do. And it's the 5 state that on more than one occasion has come in and asked 6 us to use portions of this plan, especially as far as 7 reporting is concerned. There is a section in here on 8 reporting damage assessment, et cetera. Those things were 9 copied out of this plan and used during 1987. I just -- I 10 mean I've got a job to do. I've got to do it. And 11 everybody agrees with what I do a lot of the time, but, you s 12 know. 13 Q What you are saying is state civil defense 14 officials have asked you to use portions of this Amesbury 15 plan? 16 A (Clark) Back during -- like I say, the only time 17 that I have utilized this thing to date, that I have 18 actually utilized it that I can recall is during the floods 19 during April of ' 87. And for those reasons, there was a lot 20 of things as far as public information was concerned. There 21 were things as far as taking precautions in the event that l 22 we had to, you know, move people from downstream if a dam 23 broke. Also, the thousands and thousands of dollars of 24 damage that were caused in the Town of Amesbury all had to 1 j 25 go through a certain type of reporting in order for the town (]) Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l .I CLARK .VOIR DIRE 16771 1 to be able to recoup' federal and state disaster assistance ~k 2 funds, which I am the. coordinating officer for. 3 And when I called the state and asked the state at 4-that point what do I use for-documents to record the damage, 5 they said take it out of the comprehensive emergency 6 management plan. 7 Q For Amesbury. 8 A (Clark) Right. They said you've got a copy of 9 this. 10 Q This' Exhibit No. 44, 11 A (Clark) Right. That's the only thing I had 12 available to me. 13 'Q Would you say that the town manager has pretty 14 much left it to your discretion as to how to respond to an-15 emergency? 16 A (Clark) The majority of all the managers have. I 17 mean they are all very interested, and like I say there is 18 good communications during emergencies. You know, I'm not 19 the boss by many means during an emergency. I act as a 20 liaison and a resource coordinator for the town. And I, 21 just like any other department head such as public works, 22 fire, police, or anything else, I serve as an advisor to the 23 manager during an emergency. 24 And, you know, he might not go along with 25 everything I tell him to, but I'm supposed to be the expert O 1* 9-roreias coreor tio= (202) 628-4888 \\ CLARK - VOIR' DIIG 16772 1 on it. They-sent me to school. i 2" Q 'And also let me ask you, has either the town 3 manager-or the Board of Selectmen ever prohibited you from 4 'using this plan, Applicants' Exhibit'447 5 A' (Clark) No. 6 JUDGE SMITH: When you just testified that the 7 Board of Selectmen disavowed.this plan, would.you explain 8 what form that disavowal took? 9 THE WITNESS: (Clark) The only -- the only 10 disavowing.of it was like I say. Originally the only time 11 that this was ever presented,.I presented this to the 12 manager and requested the manager's permission to distribute 1:3 the individual annexes of it-to be updated by.the different 14-department' heads so we could make the thing more suitable 15 than what's really here, and I don't say that this is 16 exactly suitable. 17 And, because of like I say, everything was going 18 on at the time. 19 JUDGE SMITH: Just wait. Be careful. l 20 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Okay. 21 JUDGE SMITH: I want to know what was told to you. 22 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Disavow, okay, I have never 23 been told that I cannot use the plan. I have never been l 24 ordered that I cannot use the plan or any sections thereof j 25 ~it. It was just never accepted formally by the town. O rit 9-eere*=9 corear **a= (202) 628-4888 1 (. CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16773 l' Namely, one request for a town meeting vote, and I was.the 30 2 one that got up and I recommended indefinite postponement on 3 the floor because of the problems I thought I was going.to-p 4 have. 5 JUDGE SMITH: Have you received any criticism of '6' the plan from town officials based on the substantive merit? 7 THE-WITNESS: (Clark) Nobody else has ever 8 reviewed it. . MR. DIGNAN: Unless there is more voir dire,.Your 10 Honor, I would offer -- 11 MR. TURK: I have one other question. 12 MR. DIGNAN: Excuse me, Mr. Turk. 13 BY MR.-TURK: 14-Q Do you understand that you or the Town of Amesbury. 15 is in violation of any state or federal requirement -- 16 MS. O'MALLEY: Objection. 17 BY MR. TURK: 18 Q -- by not having a formally approved emergency 19 plan? 20 MS. O'MALLEY: Objection, Your Honor. 21 JUDGE SMITH: Let's limit the question and the 22 answer to within his knowledge as the civil defense director 23 of his town, his understanding of the laws that he works .24 with. 25 MR. TURK: That's right. Your Honor. i O r** 9-ror**=9 corror tio= (202) 628-4888 e CLARK - VOIR' DIRE- /16774 i 'l THE. WITNESS:- (Clark) ~Okay. The only way I can l 2 respond to that isLI questioned, like Ifsay originally,.when. ) 3. this thing was' asked to be copied by'the town's attorneys at 4' the time,-that-I. called the state and I asked them. -Now 5 likeJI say,'I don't know they are legal experts either. But ~ 6 ~ where they have directed me in the past to use it or 7 whatever, they are the ones that said, as of today this is. 8 the only document that we have on file as an updated version-9 '. .of..Amesbury's plan. 10 So like.I say, the person I talked to down there 11 is in the planning division. He's no lawyer or anything .12-like'that so I mean. 13 BY MR. TURK: 14-Q' Have there ever been conversations to which you 15 are a party, or as to which you are. aware which would 16 indicate whether or not you are in compliance with the '17 federal and state authorities? 18 MS. O'MALLEY: Objection. 19 MR. TURK: Personal knowledge, Your Honor; not 20 legal. 21 THE WITNESS: (Clark) The only thing I know -- 22 JUDGE. SMITH: Well, wait a minute. Let's hear Ms. 23 O'Malley here. 24 Now we are not only screening on legal opinion, 25 but hearsay legal opinion. Q Heritage Reporting Corporation l (202) 628-4888 1 CLARK - VOIR DIRE. 16775 y 1 MR. TURK: Yes,~Your Honor. 2 MS. O'MALLEY: That's correct, Your Honor, and I'm 3-not sure_about the relevancy. Now we are talking about' 4 federal law as well, even though he's claiming only to be 5 operating under, or to be operating mainly as liaison with 6-the. state. '7 JUDGE SMITH: Would you state your question again? 8. MR. TURK:

Let me explain my purpose, Your Nonor.

o 9 I am not looking for an interpretation of federal 10 or state law.- I am looking to see if perhaps there had been 11 some conversations within town management as to whether or 12 not they are in compliance with. existing statutes whereby 13 perhaps there may have been a conversation, and I don't know 14 this, but perhaps there was a conversation where they say, 15 well, we are in compliance because this plan exists, so 16 there would be some reliance upon this plan even though it's 17 never been formally adopted. 18 JUDGE SMITH: He can question not hearsay legal 19 opinions unless he establishes something else that his 20 question doesn't seem to have as a predicate, but he can ask~ 21 questions about the reliance upon it, and.that's within -- l 22 MS. O'MALLEY: Mr. Clark's knowledge of reliance. 12 3 JUDGE SMITH: Right, his knowledge. 24 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Okay. To the best of my 25 ability right now is the only portion that I have been -Q Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 I CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16776 1 recently told, as far as this is concerned, is Annex M ,-'~; 't 2 HAZMAT, and the town has not complied with the federal law 3 as far as the Title III Super Fund law which was supposed to 4 be in October of last year. And like I say, that's the only 5 part I can comment on right now that I know that that 6 portion of it does not meet requirements. 7 And as far as the question of the other part of 8 it, like I say, it comes back to the state, and_what's the 9 state's assumption of is whether or not, you know, this 10 serves as a form of plan to go by for the town. 11 BY MR. TURK: 12-Q Let me interrupt. 13 Why do you say Annex M does not meet federal 14 requirements? 15 A (Clark) Because that's'the HAZMAT annex of the 16 plan which would incorporate these Title III Super Fund 17 portion of the federal law. 18 Q I see that there is an annex that deals with 19 hazardous material. 20 A (Clark) Yes. 21 Q What is not in compliance? Is there something 22 substantive in this annex that's been found to be remiss? 23 A (Clark) Oh, yes. 24 MS. O' MALLEY : Objection. Your Honor. 25 BY MR. TURK: O rie 9-eorei 9 corpor tioa (202) 628-4888 1 1 CLARK - VOIR DIRE 16777' 1 Q-And how have -- - ("Y 2 JUDGE SMITH: Wait a minute. When there is an 3 objection, give counsel a chance to -- 4 MS. O'MALLEY: I am having a little problem 5 understanding what the relevance of this is. 6 MR. TURK: I think there is defective reliance, 7 Your Honor, upon this plan. And my next question would be 8 how he knows whether or not this annex meets federal 9 requirements, and perhaps he will tell me that because town 10 officials have reviewed it and have determined that they 11 need to do more. I don't know. But there would be in that 12 sense a town reliance upon and reference to this plan as the 13 town plan. r 14 JUDGE SMITH: Overruled. Again, we are not asking .b' 15 for an abstract legal opinion. We are asking for his 16 perceptions gained through his work and reliance upon 17 perceived legal requirements. 18 MS. O' MALLEY : I guess, Your Honor, the problem 19 I'm having is that Mr. Clark is up here. He's admitted that 20 he's subject to the control of the Board of Selectmen and 21 the town manager. And he's admitted that they have never 22 accepted this plan, and that they in fact have disavowed 23 this plan. And I don't see where any kind of reliance 24 theory would get this plan any more -- put it under Mr. 25 Clark's authority at all. O r1* 9-rorei=9 corear eia= (202) 628-4888 I s p I CIARK - VOIR DIRE 16778 ' (G:.. 1- -JUDGE SMITH:. Overruled. 2.. MS. O'MALLEY: Thank y o, Your Honor. 3 JUDGE SMITH: You may answer. 4 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Ckay. '5 BY MR. TURK:' 6 Q Do you need me to restate the question? 7 A (Clark) No. I believe what it'is is what's 8. missing out of.this portion of the plan in order to make it 9-meet the requirements? 10 Q-I'm not so much interested in how you have to meet 11 Super Fund requirements. But I'm asking you how do you know [L 12 that this plan or this Annex M does not meet the Super Fund 13 requirceents. Why was that determination made? 14 A (Clark) Because I have been to the seminars and i 15 training sessions and everything. And the information for 16' the individual facilities and everything,'plus the trucking 17 routes and everything elsr, aren't in here. 18 Q Have you called that to the attention of town 19 officials? U 20 A (Clark) Yes, I have. 21 Q And what was the response? 22 A (Clark) Hasn't been any response at all. 23 MR. TURK: That's all I nAvt, 24 JUDGE SMITH: Any further voir dire? 25 (No response.) l, O

• • 9-a arti 9 care r ** -

(202) 628-4888 L l i 16779 'l ' JUDGE SMITH: Applicants' Exhibit 44 is received. ~ 2 MS.-O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. 3 (The document referred to, 4 having been previously marked 5 for identification as 6 Applicants' Exhibit No. 44 7 was received in evidence.) 8 MR. DIGNAN: Your Honor, that is all the direct 9 examination I had. As I understand it, Ms. O'Malley, you 10 have some cross examination on that. 11 MS. O'MALLEYi Yes, Your Honor. 12 MR. DIGNAN: And I would pass the witness at this-13 time,.Your Honor, with the Board's permission. 14 JUDGE SMITH: There is some difficulty with the 15 wiring. This would be a good time to take a short break, 16 and then we will come back. 17 (Whereupon, a recess was taken.) 18 19 20 21 l 22 23 24 25 O a se 9-rarti== career tio= (202) 628-4888 L_ m CLARK - CROSS 16780 'l JUDGE SMITH: You may proceed, Ms. O'Malley. 2 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. 3 CROSS-EXAMINATION 4 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 5 Q Mr. Clark,.just so I'm clear could.you explain to 6 me specifically how this plan came about? What you started 7 with and what you added to it? 8 A (Clark) It was brought on like I say by the 9 planning division of the State Civil Defense Agency at which 10 time two parties came up. One was Doug Forbes and the other i j 11 was Mike Filbin were on the planning division staff. 12 And like I say, it was a requirement for everybody 13 to sit down and do one of these. They came up as the 14 helpful knowledgeable people from the state level to help us (~g %) 15 sit down and put the thing together. 16 Like I stated before, you know, the majority of 17 this is generic. And individual portions in here that you 18 see in here are either things that came from the original 19 1981 plan or the specific items they asked me for 20 information for, you know. It's far from being done, you 21 know, another three or four pages here of things that need 22 to be corrected to it. So it's not perfect by any means. 23 Q So starting with the first page, the cover page, I 24 just want to be clear. You put your initials on there after 25 speaking to someone at the state? i Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 ~ _ l CLARK - CROSS 16781 1 A -(Clark) Right. r3' 2 Q But in fact 1986 is not the date that it was 3 ~ prepared? '4 A (Clark) It isn't. I believe it should be 1985. 5 I'm still not positive on this. I'm going by, you know,- 6 here is what they told me at the state level. 7 Q So the bulk of what's contained in here was 8 completed in 1985 and not 19867 9 A (Clark) I believe so. According to the dates and 10 stuff on a lot.of the Annexes I'm pretty sure. I have seen 11 so many plans it is hard to remember. i I } 12 Q Thank you. 13 If you could -- could you just turn to page five l 14 of 248 in the globally numbered version that you have so l O. 15 that everyone can follow along. l 16 That.page is titled " participants," is it not? l 17 A (Clark)

Right, l

18 Q And underneath the list of participants that have ) 19 participated in the development or review of this plan is 20 listed the Board of Selectmen; is that right? a 21 A (Clark) Correct. '1 22 Q In fact the Board of Selectmen do not participate; l 23 isn't that correct? 24 A (Clark) Correct. 25 Q And the police chief, the police chief didn't Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK --CROSS-16782 1 1 participate in'this,.did he? "O 2 A- .(Clark) .Like I stated once before,.the only 3 . person'that had any input on'this on a local level was-4 myself and that was for the original draft of the plan. 5 Q So in fact none of these people listed.on this 6-list except for the civil defense director had any' input? 7 .A (Clark) Right. Weren't allowed to do it. 8 Q And I also notice you don't list any names of'any 9 of those people; is that correct? 10 A (Clark) Right. 11 Q You do list names of state persons who were on-l 12 this page? 13-A (Clark) Right. 14 Q Thank you. 15 MS. O'MALLEY: I apologize to'the Board my numbers 16 are different than the numbers that everybody else has. 17 BY MS. O' MALLEY : 1 18 Q If you could turn to page 15 of 248. Now at the 19 top of there it looks like it calls for some official 20 letterhead? 21 A (Clark) Right. 22 Q But of course it's not; that's correct? 23 A (Clark) It's not there, right. 24 Q And again, the Chairman of the Board of Selectmen 25 is supposed to have signed on this, but of course there is Q Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 L CLARK - CROSS 16783-1 no. signature because he did not adopt it; is that correct? LO 2 lh -(Clark) Yes. 3 Q Turning to page 25. Does the Town of AmesburyL 4 have a planning department? 5 A (Clark) No. The planning department, like I say, 6 as it's written here should be the building inspector.. 7 That's the building inspector and the town engineer. 8 Like I say, this is generic. That's why there is -9 all these corrections in the front of it that I have set out 10 to do. 11 Q Thank you. 12 Turning to page 27, there's a section entitled' 13 " Direction and Control." And it says: "The ultimate 14 responsibility for all emergwncy management is vested in l 15 what was the Board of Selectmen," and now that's crossed out 16 with nothing else inserted? 17 A (Clark) That was a ristake. They're still vested 18 in the Board of Selectmen. I go into the manager, but 19 ultimately the Board of Selectmen are in charge of the civil 20 defense programs for the Town of Amesbury. 21 Q But in the plan that you've testified that you 22 would use tomorrow the Board of Selectmen have been crossed '23 out; isn't that correct? 24 A (Clark) Like I say, it's under revision, so it 25 was a mistake that was made. Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 1 CLARK - CROSS 16784 1 Q Looking at page'28.- I'm sorry, page 29 of 248. () 2 Under the heading "D, Emergency Operation'Conter," first. 3' what's typed in there is Newton Road but in fact there is no 4 Emergency. Operation Center at Newton Road; isn't that E5 correct? 6 A. (Clark) There isn't, no. 7. Q And somebody has written in " police station," I 8 assume that's you who has written " police station;" is that 9 correct? E10 A (Clark) Right.- That's for.the backup EOC. See 11 at the. time that this plan was produced-we didn't have our 12 EOC in the Senior Citizen's Building. It wasn't completed, 13 so it wasn't operational. 14 Q So right now that should be Senior Citizen's. 15. Center? 16 A (Clark) Right. 17 Q With the police station as the backup. 18 A (Clark) .See, when the plan was done we were still l 19 up in Newton Road. Me were in a trailer up there. So-20 that's why the Newton Road. It's a misprint on the. state's 21 part. 22 Q But then you cross out and put " police station? 23 A (Clark) Right. As the backup EOC, knowing that 24 my other facility would be cine. 25 Q But as of today the EOC is in fact in the Senior l O r** 9-ear **=9 care r **a= (202) 628-4888 CLARK --CROSS 1'6705_- 1 Citizen's Center? LO- 2. .A (Clark) Right. 3 -Q -Isn't that~ correct? 4 A (Clark) Co2; rect. 5 Q So this is really wrong at"this' point? I 6 A -(Clark) No. This is a misprint.. 7 Q I see what you're saying. 8 A. (Clark) The way it's read it says: "The police .9 station will be used as an alternate facility,~mainly.if the 10 other facility" -- if you read this thing -- I mean, even 11 the language they used here, they would have flunked English'- 12 by the way they wrong the thing. 13 Q ~Thank you. 14. Could you turn to page 30, please. Under Section 15 8'it'says: " Plan development and maintenance." 'And~it 16 -states in the plan: "That if the plan is to be effective its 17 contents must be known and. understood by those who are 18 responsible for its implementation." 19 And then it esys: "The civil defense director 20 will brief the appropriate officials concerning their role." 21 Have the selectmen ever.been briefed on the 22 contents of the plan? 23 A (Clark) No, they haven't. 24 Q Has the policy chief ever been briefed on the 1 25 contents of the plan? O

• • 9-rei 9 c re ei -

(202) 628-4888 L-__ 1 i I i p CLARK - CROSS 16786 1 A (Clark) Portions of it during certain ' k, ' 2 emergencies. 3 Q How about the town manager? i 4 A (Clark) Portions of it during certain 5 emergencies. _i l 6 Q' .But in the course of ordinary maintenance and 7 . development of the plan other than during an emergency? 8 A (Clark) No, no cooperation to do it. 9 Q The last paragraph on that page talks about test 10 exercises in order to provide experience for the' individuals 11 who have responsibility. Have there ever been any test 1L2 exercises under this plan? 13- .A (Clark) They were planned but they weren't 14 conducted. 1'k 15 Q Thank you. 1 j 16 I just have a question, on page 33 there's a copy 17 of a map. Where did these maps come from? Who inserted 18 them in here? 19 A (Clark) State civil defense. 20 Q Those are state civil defense maps? 21 A (Clark) I gave them the initial map to use. But f. 22 this is something they printed down there and added to the 23 plan. 24 Q Thank you. l 25 On page 14 it lists -- excuse me. I'm sorry, I l ! - ([ ) Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l \\ [_ l CLARK --CROSS 16787 4 E 1 apologize. Page 34 there's a list of emergency services and-2 the body or officer'who is supposed to.be coordinating them. 3 Under direction and control of civil defense is. 4 the civil de'fense director;'is'that correct?~ 5 'A' (Clark) Correct. 6 Q But in. fact you are under the direction and-7 control even in your civil defense duties.of the Board of 8-SelectmenLand the town-manager; isn't.that correct? 9 A' (Clark) Correct. That's why they're.on the top 10 line. 11 Q But thi's'certainly isn't a-list of who is in 4 12 charge by hierarchy, is it? 13. A (Clark) What do you mean, per individual? 14 Q .Well, even by department? For instance, you.are' 15 not in charge of the police chief, are you? 16 'A-(Clark) No. 17 Q-Thank you. 18 On page 37, Mr. Clark, you testified that the 19 Emergency Operation Center is designated as the base for all 20 emergency management activities in the town, that's what is 21 contained in the plan; is that your understanding? 22 A (Clark) Yes. 23 Q And the Emergency Operation Center is in fact in 24 the Senior Citizen's Center; isn't that correct? 25 A (Clark) Correct. h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l l' CLARK - CROSS 16788 1 Q Yet during hurricane Gloria there was no operation

(' ~)

u 2 conducted out of the Senior Citizen's -- 3 A (Clark) No, it was conducted at the Water 4 Treatment Plant'on Newton Road. I 5 Q Or the police station or town hall? '6 A (Clark) No. That's why it questions whether or 7 not this thing was around at that time. Like I say, that 8 was -- we were up at the Water Treatment Plant off of Newton i 9 Road in a trailer and then moved into a blocked building 10 that was below ground during hurricane Gloria. I remember 11 it well. 12 Q How about during the April 1987 floods? 13 A (Clark) We were in the new Emergency Operation 14 Center and the Senior Center. 15 Q You were there? 16 A (Clark) It was fully staffed for three days. 17 Wait a minute, let me correct myself. It was fully staffed a 18 by members of the civil defense agency. But we were 19 coordinating town response and recovery efforts from that 20 location because of the equipment and everything that is 21 down there. And we had contact with Public Works. We had 22 contact with fire. We had contact with the police. My 23 people were up at the Lake Gardner Dam. l 24 I know I was there for all three days. 25 Q But in fact the selectmen were in charge of Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS-16789 L 1 . coordinating? L.O 2 A (Clark) The' selectmen came.in and out. Not all g g 3 'of thezselectmen, one or two of the. selectmen came in and 4 out. And also,the1 manager was over there~also on occasion 5 during it.. i 6 .The EOC' concept in the Town of Amesbury has not '7 ,been completed, accepted and utilized to date, namely that' 8: you have every. individual department' head that would have 9 responsibilities'under that, plan to be there.. Only, once 10 again, due to all the lack of planning and everything else regarding the~whole issue here.' 12 Q-Could I ask you to look at page 44 please? '13 ,Now-one of the underlying themes of this plan is 14 to keep; government operating.with.as.little disruption as 15 possible during an emergency; isn't that correct,.Mr. Clark?- 16 A (Clark) Correct. 17. Q And yet the flow chart that shows on page 44 18 completely omits the Board of Selectment isn't that correct?- 19 A (Clark). It's not completed yet. 20 Q And it also demonstrates or it also puts the civil 21 defense director up above the police department and the fire 22 ' department; isn't that correct? 23 A (Clark) It puts me there because I am the 24 coordinating agent for the manager during emergencies. I 25 don't give orders to the other departments, but I coordinate h Heritage Pteporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16790 1 the emergency response efforts for the Town of Amesbury, b-~ 2 Under law and everything else I am the coordinator of 3 emergency services. I don't give orders to the. department-4 heads. I'm supposed to meet with them and decide jointly. 5 with them what actions to take. 6 So I'm like the go between, between the manager 7 and the other department heads. Namely, I'm the overall' .8 coordinator of emergency management for the town. 9 Q But this' chart is not complete because it doesn't 10 have the Selectmen on'it? 11 A (Clark) Right. This was based originally on the 12 day to day operations of the town. And we didn't finish 13 this. 14 Q There's no date on that chart, is there, Mr. (} 15 Clark?~ 16 A (Clark) No. Like I say, there's previous charts 17 like from 1981. But that's the last of them. They have 18 been updated since. My whole staff has changed. My whole 19 operations have changed. I mean, I went from six people, 20 I'm up to 50 people now. So I have one of the biggest 21 agencies around. So we have to change things as we go 22 along. . :23 Q But that particular chart in this particular plan 24 hasn't been updated, right? 25 A (Clark) No. () Heritage Reporting Corporation f (202) 628-4888 l l I F i ] CLARK - CROSS 16791 1 Q Page 53, please. .Now, this is a map that purports I( p 2 to'show the primary and/or alternate, or an alternate j 1 3 emergency operation center'for the Town of Amesbury. 1 4 A (Clark) Right. i 5 Q Is that correct? 6 A -(Clark) Correct. 7 Q And it shows the primary one out on Newton Road; 8 is that correct? I 9 A (Clark) Right. That was the original intent. We i 10 were going to build the EOC on Newton Road, but we didn't. 11 Q So this is inaccurate then. 12 A (Clark) Oh, yes. 13 Q Is that correct? 14 A (Clark) If you look here from the notes, it says _{ ) 15 change the map. 16 Q So somebody looking at this emergency plan looking 17 for the emergency operation center, if they looked at this 18 map they would be going in the wrong direction; is that 19 correct? 20 A (Clark) Yes. I mean if somebody from town has to 21 look at it, I mean they are pretty bad off. But they know 22 where it is. 23 Q Well, somebody who wasn't familiar with the town 24 had to look at it? 25 A (Clark) Right. () Heritage Reporting Corporation l (202) 628-4888 CLARK.-~ CROSS' -16792 ll : Q Thank you. b l 2 Could I direct _your attention, Mr. Clark, to page-3 57 ?. -] 1 4 .A' (Clark) Yes. 5 Q Under 2-B.it talks about assumptions. lNow there 6' are no formal mutual 1 aic agreements between Amesbury and 7. surrounding towns, are there,.for - - 8-A (Clark)' In regard to what? In regards to law-9 enforcement? .10 Q-In.regards to. law enforcement. That's what we i 11 have got here. 12 A (Clark) Juct through the radio system. The 13 normal day-to-day operations provide backup;-also backup. []} 14-from the state police. 15-Q But there;is no-formal agreement with other towns? .16 A (Clark) Not that I'm aware of. Nothing written 17 that I'm aware of. 18 Q And again, the police chief did not participate ~in, 19 drafting this plani is that correct? 20 A (Clark) Correct. l 21 Q Thank you. 22 Turning to the next page, 58, in the section 23 titled "As.signments and Responsibilities", subsection K, the 24 police chief's never been involved in any kind of a plan to -i 25 recruit and train volunteers to assist in law enforcement i O =rica. + eine c-reei-(202) 628-4888 i CLARK - CROSS 16793 1 activities under this plan, has'he, that'you are aware of? ,7~ \\_) 2 A (Clark) _ No, not under this plan. 3 Q Okay, thank you. 4' Turning to page 64. Now this police inventory is 5' something that.you added to the plan; is that correct? 6 A -(Clark) No, the police chief did this. 7 Q The police chief gave you the information; is that 8 correct? 9 A (Clark) Correct. 10 Q But you added it to the plan. 11 A (Clark) One of these things is done every single 12 year and sent down to state civil defense headquarters for; 13 record. 14 Q And so that's the way that you got it? (} 15 A (Clark) Right, correct. 16 Q It was not specifically created, this plan? 17 A (Clark) Right. I mean this is something we do 18 every yee.r anyway. 19 MS. O'MALLEY: Excuse me. 20 (Counsel confers with colleague.) 21 BY MS. O' MALLEY.: 1 22 Q Do you know what the date would be on this? There 1 23 is no date on it. Or would it be pre-1986, because -- 24 A (Clark) It would have to be '85 at the time that 25 we put everything together. Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 m,- L CLARK - CROSS 16794 1 Q So in fact'these numbers probably aren't correct, .g3 h 2 is that fairtto say?- 3 A (Clark) Let's see. 4 No, because the auxiliary police force is down to 5 about'12 men'now maximum. 6 Q And there are no special police in Amesbury any. 7 more are there? 8 A (Clark) Not that I'm aware of. Unless the ones. 9 that are -- I don't know if the custodians are now or not. 10 I'm not sure. 11 Q So we are talking about a significant reduction of 12 more than 30 people on this list. 13 A (Clark) But I believe there has been people added. (j 14 to the regular force on here too. 15 But no. Yes. 16 Q A significant reduction even with the addition -- 17 A (Clark) Correct, right. 18 Q -- of several people to the regular force; is that 19 correct? 20 A (Clark) Right. 21 Q And reserve police can't act alone; isn't that 22 correct, sir? 23 That under the policies of the town, the reserve 1 24 police are not supposed to act on their own. They are 25 supposed to have an officer with them. O . mien,. Regerein, cor, oration (202) 628-4888 I CLARK - CROSS 16795 1 A (Clark). No. ' Reserve, as it's listed here, is a- -7 2 civil service reserve officer; namely, these are people'that 3 fill shifts. They-are certified police officers, but they 4 are only reserve in status. 5 Q Okay, thank you. 6 But in fact there is a significant reduction on 7 the force from the total that you have. Probably in the 8 order of -- 9 A (Clark) I believe the reserve' force is down to 10 four now if I am correct. 11 Q We're talking about probably on the order of more 12 .than 30 people less than what you have listed here; is that. 13 fair to say? 14 A (Clark) Yes, I'd say it's very close to it; yes. {} 15 Q Thank you. 16 Just a point of reference. On the next page, I 17 think the copying is a little bit off. 18 A (Clark) Is it? 19 Q Yes, this is on page 66. We didn't get the whole 20 names of the facilities which makes my point a little more 21 difficult to make. 22 A (Clark) The beginning of the page, the left-hand f 23 margin is missing. 24 i l 25 l 1-Heritage Reporting Corporation l (202) 628-4888 l n 8 CLARK - CROSS-16796 k :g 1 1. -Q I guess my question is, do you'have a copy with I ( 2 theilist? I i L 3 .A (Clark) I have the. original. document 1right here. 4 .Q Okay. My question is whether the sewage treatment 5 plan.is on Mechanic Street or Merrimac Street. There seems-6' to be an error here. 7 A (Clark) There'sure is. It's noted in the front' 8 here, too.. 9 Q Okay. Perhaps our copy - you say it's noted in 10 the front. That's just a list of things you need to do. 11 A (Clark) Right, I didn't supply that. That -- 12 Q Is that correct? 13 A (Clark) The corrections and. additions that'needed - (~ 14 to be made to this. I didn't supply those. .They are right 15 here. I mean that's stuff that I've sat down and done. 16 They weren't in here. This was on a clipboard. 17 Q So that's just your own personal list of things to I 18 do on this plan? 19 A (Clark) Oh, yes. It's awesome. p 20-Q Okay. 21 A '(Clark) Okay, I mean this is part of my 1 22 responsibility, update the plan. 23 Q Turn to page 84. This lists bus and taxi 24 companies who are available to help -- 25 A (Clark) They aren't any more. Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l j 1 CLARK - CROSS '16797 -y ll- ~Q --itransport -- allow me, allow me'to finish'my" ) \\ [ .2 question,' sir. I L Okay. 3 A -(Clark) 4 Q Thank you. '5 In; fact, both.Cherbinia Bus Company and DFA Taxi 6 'have been outJof business for'some time, a couple of years i .7 'anyway; is that correct? 8 A (Clark) Cherbinis is still in business, but with 9 like two buses. 10 Q. Well, they -- 11 A (Clark) They are, more or less; considering their 12 original fleet, yes. 13 Q And for purposes, since they were going to provide 14 29 buses, for purposes of this they are really.not going to- ,{ } 15 be of much use to the town. 16 A (Clark) Correct. 17 Q And in fact, there is no inventory then under this 18 plan to transport people out of town. 19 A (Clark) Right. 20 Q Relying on these. 21 A (Clark) Originally though once when Cherginis l 22 went out of business, I had made a verbal agreement with 23 McGregor Smith Company at the time, with the former manager 1 24 that was up there, and we had kind of a verbal agreement 25 where the majority of the buses were parked in town and O eries, erue c-rati-(202) 628-4888 ______._____._________._____________._.m_ 1 e CLARK - CROSS' 167.98 l 1 1 everything like that in the event that something took place f 7_'L) 2 ~that they would be available. 3 Q But again for purposes of this plan, which hasn't 4 been updated -- 5 A (Clark) Right. 6 .O -- there basically is no transportation -- 7 A (Clark) Correct. 8 Q -- except for what.those people can provide in 9 private cars. 10 A (Clark) Correct. 11 Q Thank you. 12 Page 91, please. 13 Under line of succession, there is no director of 14 health in the Town of Amesbury, is there?' i ) 15 A (Clark) No. There is a health agent. j 16 Q But there is no title director of health. There l' 17 is no assistant director of health. 18 A (Clark) Right. 19 Q Thank you. 20 JUDGE SMITH: I think we are getting the gist of 21 your cross-examination. l 22 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. I think it is just very 23 important, Your Honor, because the Board has accepted this 24 plan, and I just want the Board to know exactly what the 25 serious problems are, and to understand that in fact this () Heritage Reporting Corporation I (202) 628-4888 l 1 i i CLARK - CROSS 16799 1 plan probably could not be used as it is in an emergency. gsg Q). 2 It would probably cause more confusion than help at the 3 point that it's at now, the point that'it's been submitted -4 to this Board. 5 JUDGE SMITH: My only comment was, we understand 6 'what you are developing here. I am not foreclosing -- 7 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. 8 JUDGE SMITH: -- cross examination, but we 9 understand the point. 10 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. I think 11 maybe because we are coming into sections that are 12 particularly important to the Applicant,-I would like to be 13 able to continue even though I know some of it is (} 14 monotonous. 15 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 16 Q Yes, just. turning to page 134. I would just ask 17 you to take a look through this section. In fact, this 18 section contains, except for Appendix I of this section, it 19 contains nothing that's relevant to Amesbury in particular. 20. It's sort of a generic section; is that correct, Mr. Clark? l 21 MR. DIGNAN: Is this the section entitled 22 " Radiological Preparedness"? l 23 MS. O' MALLEY : Yes, it is, sir. f I 24 MR. TURK: I'm not sure I understand the question. 25 If there is nothing in this annex? h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 -.____.._.__._________J l CLARK - CROSS-16800 1 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I'm not sure if I do g-- 2 either. 3 MS. O'MALLEY: Okay. 4 BY MS. O' MALLEY : l 5 Q The question is, Annex I,'except.for Appendix 1, 6 contains nothing that has anything to do with the Town of 7 Amesbury other than it would have to do with any other city 8 or town in Massachusetts; is that correct? 9 There is nothing in it that's peculiar to 10 Amesbury. It is in fact a very generic guide to this type l } 11 of an emergency as created by the state, I assume, who drew 12 up this original document. l l 13 MR. DIGNAN: I am going to object to the question 14-in the form. The form is to say it's generic, and then tack 15 on to it, and therefore it has nothing to do with Amesbury. 16 JUDGE SMITH: No, she made that more precise later 17 on. She says nothing particularly associated with Amesbury. 18 MR. DIGNAN: My only point is this, Your Honor. 19 Something can be generic. 20 JUDGE SMITH: Right. 21 MR. DIGNAN: The two words are floating around in 22 the question. It's only a form objection. 23 JUDGE SMITH: We understand. L 24 HR. DIGNAN: Something can be generic and have 25 everything to do with every town in the state. O s ritae. Regereine correlation (202) 628-4888 l l l. k CLARK - CROSS 16801 1-JUDGE SMITH: She save it. ~ She said -- she later .O 2 -added to the question, in~particular to Amesbury, and 3-specific to Amesbury is what you are getting at, Ms. 4 O'Malley..You-are talking ~about there is nothing specific 5 to Amesbury in this appendix.' 6 MS. O'MALLEY: -In the-annex, except for Appendix 7 1. I do see-some reference to the' fire station.in Appendix 8 1. 9 THE WITNESS: (Clark) No, you are correct. 10 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. 11 MR. DIGNAN: Counsel, could we agree your 12 reference was to Annex I? 13 MS..O'MALLEY: Yes. 14 MR. DIGNAN: I think you said Annex 1, and I would

15 have made the same mistake.

16 'MS. O'MALLEY: Oh, I'm sorry. 17 MR. DIGNAN: But that is Annex I. I 18 MS. O'MALLEY: I apologize. Annex I. I am sorry. 19 BY HS. O'MALLEY: l-I 20 Q k' urn to page 170. 21 JUDGE COLE: Excuse me, I didn't understand that. 22 MS. O'MALLEY: I'm sorry. 23 JUDGE COLE: Specifically what page were you 24 referring to when you said Annex I? Don't you mean Appendix 25 1, page 1397 'O a rie 9-rare *=9 corear e* - l (202) 628-4888 p.. 1-b CLARK -CROSS 16802-L W -1 MS..O'MALLEY:' Okay. Q 2. MR. DIGNAN:- There is an' Appendix'1 to Annex ~I, 3-which she. referred to-the second time. I believe the first I 4 time cut there was a reference.to Annex I, however.. That's 5 what; concerns me. Excuse me. Annex 1.' Maybe I am in 6 ' error, but I thought.I-heard an initial reference to Annex 7 1, and I was sure counsel meant Annex I, and then she did 8 mean Appendix-1 to-Annex I. 9 MS. O' MALLEY: Yes, I think.you can see the 10 difference between page 134 and page 140. It's Annex I=and-11 Appendix 1 to Annex I. 12 JUDGE COLE: Okay, thank you. 13. MS.' O'MALLEY:.Thank you. 14 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 15 Q Going back to page 170, Mr. Clark, I notice that l 16 you're -- I assume, is this your writing? 17 A (Clark) It sure is. 18 Q -- where we see most of this writing in this? 19 I'll ask you each time if I'm referring to it. 20 But you have put in the names and phone numbers of 21 some people who apparently are Red Cross representatives; is 22 that correct? 23 A (Clark) Correct. 24 Q The question is, you really did not put any other 25 names into this document other than those Red Cross h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16803 1 representatives and the state officials that were in the yb-,. - 2 beginning of the document; is that correct? 3 A (Clark) Like I say, what I was in the process of 4 doing with this thing, you know, I backed off on it because 5 I wasn't getting any support on it. You know, why burn 6 myself out. I was starting to sit down, like I say, with 7 the corrections in the front that I'm referring to, plus 8 what you see penned in here, I was trying to make this plan 9 a workable plan that could be used by somebody.besides 10 myself. 11 I have-the capabilities to administer this plan, 12 because I know the answers to the plan of the stuff that, 13 you know, you have shown. You know, like the missing bus 14 company and a few things like-that. I personally can do it. {} 15 Q Right. 16 A (Clark) But like you stated before, could 17 somebody else do it? No, it would be very hard for them to 18 pick it up and use it. 19 Q So this is almost a personal plan that you could 20 follow, but it would almost impossible for anyone else to 21 use this plan; is that correct? 22 A (Clark) Right. But what I'm saying is it's my 23 staff, my senior staff people have been trained in a good 24 portion of this, and I - you know, you have to give my 25 senior staff people a lot of credit too. They are no O sericas. a.gorei-, Correlation (202) 628-4888 l L l CLARK - CROSS 16804 1 dummies. They are professionals, a'nd they know what they 73 (_) 2 are doing. And they know a lot of the answers to it too. 3 Q But a person could not look at this document -- 4 A (Clark) Oh, no, no. 5 Q -- and get a lot of.the answers; is that correct? 6 A (Clark) What I am saying is if somebody -- the 7 ' lines of succession in my department, if the assistant 8 director took over for me if I wasn't there, he's got 9 general knowledge. He's been almost a life-long resident of 10 the Town of Amesbury. He's been in the civil defense 11 program now for four years, you know, right alongside of me. 12 One of my. deputy director's been the same. They are very, 13 very familiar with the operations of the town and how they 14 work, and they, you know, like I say there is probably four (} 15 of us that could implement it if we had to. 16 Q Could we take a look at page 175? Under the 17 section entitled " Personnel", there is some discussion about 18 the employees of the school system serving as staff to 19 shelters. l 20 A (Clark) Right. We've used them in the past. l 21 Q Is there a formal agreement or authorization from i 22 the school department? 23 A (Clark) No, usually it's a very, very cooperative 24 understanding with the superintendent of schools that if, l 25 you know, I am in a bind and all of the sudden I've got to l Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 i l CLARK - CROSS 16805 1 open a shelter up, if school'has been dismissed and .,~ ' O) 2 everything like that, a lot of time the cafeteria workers 3 will come in, plus the clerical' staff from the schools will 4 stay also. 5 Q So it's essentially a voluntary thing -- 6 A (Clark) Right, right. 7 Q -- on the part of these people only because they 8 happen to be connected with the school somehow. 9 A (Clark) A good portion of the plan is volunteers. 10 Q Also, I note that there is a map in here of the 11 Amesbury Elementary School, but there is no map -- I'm 17 sorry, that's on page 174. But there is no map of any of 13 the other schools that are listed on -- 14 A (Clark) Right. This should be listed as the [} 15 primary shelter. That's what it's referred to as.- 16 Q -- page 177. 17 A (Clark) I believe that's what the drawing is for, 18 if you look at it. That's the first shelter we use in the 19 Town of Amesbury. 20 Q I see that it's listed on the top of the list, but 21 it's not identified as the primary shelter in this plan. 22 A (Clark) No, no. 23 Q Is it, sir? 24 A (Clark) No, not in sore. 25 Q Thank you, i l O erita,e

morrein, C - raeien (202) 628-4888

~ .f'.i ' CLARK - CROSS 16806 1 A (Clark).. All it does is, like I say, it refers to

(.,).

e f ' 2 it. u 3L Q Could'we turn to 184, please? 4 5 6 7 8 [ 9 10 11 12 13 ' - 0 2' 15 16 17 18. 19 20 21 l 22' 23 24 25 O a rie 9-r rei 9 corear ti - (202) 628-4888 m ______m._ (_ L. CLARK - CROSS 16807 l'- Q- . Under subsection 2 (b). there are some assumptions- [. .24 made and'one'is: "That'the public will receive'_and 3 understand official information related to. evacuation."~ 4 To,your knowledge, has there been-a dispersement 5 by.the town of'any information having'to do with evacuation 6 . connected with this, plan?. '7 A (Clark)- A long time ago. 8 Q When you say a long time ago, how long ago are you: 9 talking about? 10-A (Clark) I don't know, it was done by the former I-11 director and it was signed by -- 12. Q So it wouldn't have_been under this plan then,. 13 sir, would it? 14 A (Clark) No. { 15. Q Because it would have been prior to this plan? 16 A (Clark) Under a previous plan. 1*/ Q Under.a previous plan, but not under this plan? 18 A (Clark) Correct. I 19 Q .Thank you. 20 To your knowledge has the police chief ever seen 21 this section or reviewed it? 22 A (Clark) No, not to my knowledge. 23 Q Thank you. 24 Down at the last paragraph on page 184 it talks 25 about the primary means of transportation being private 'O ie e-ei, co e ei - (202) 628-4888 = CLARK - CROSS 16808 1-automobile, but individuals without access to an automobile 7-. .,V 2 will be transported by bus? 3 A (Clark) Correct. 4 Q But in fact as we have already demonstrated there-5 are no buses under this particular plan? 6 A (Clark) Under this particular plan. 7 Q Available to transport those people; isn't that 8 correct? 9 A (Clark) As it's written in here. 10 Q That's correct. Thank you. 11 I just want to draw your attention, sir, to page 12 386. And I would just ask you to read the first sentence 13 into the record? 14 A (Clark) Under A. general? {) t 15 Q Under A. general, yes? 16 A "The Board of Selectmen acting through the civil 17 defense director has the overall authority for the 18 evacuation effort." 19 Q Thank you. 20 MS. O'MALLEY: Excase me for just a minute. 21 (Counsel confers.) 22 MS. O'MALLEY: I'm sorry, excuse me. 23 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 24 Q I would just ask you to turn to page 187. Under 25 line of succession which is seven. Isn't it true that if Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l f CLARK - CROSS' 16809 1 .you go back to the sentence that I just asked you to read, ^'# 2 it is the Board of Selectmen who would have the overall 3 authority to the evacuation and then it would be the civil 4 defense ~ director acting pursuant to the authority? 5 A (Clark) I would have to go back over this section 6 and read the whole section to answer that. I'm not sure if 7 that's directing authority as far as the EOC, I'm not sure. 8_ I would have to go back. 9 Q Well,' sir, I would just ask you to look back to 10 page 186 to that first sentence. 11 A (Clark) Well, like I say, there's a lot of things 12 between there and there. It's hard to say. I would have to 13 read the whole thing and then give you an answer. 14 Q But you do agree that the Board of Selectmen ) i 15 acting -- l 16 A (Clark) You've got to understand something else 17 here, too, okay. And this could be a toughy. It depends on 18 the scenario, okay. During the daytime, for instance, what 19 if no members of the Board of Selectmen are available? Okay. I l 20 That's where we come back to. And there is, there's a lot i 21 of questions. You got to know how the operations of these 22 emergency departments work. 23 It depends on the size of the evacuation and 24 everything else of where we get down to the determination 25 within the Town of Amesbury of whether or not the selectmen () Heritage Reporting Corporation l (202) 628-4888 4 l CLARK - CROSS 16810 .j-q 1 are going to be in charge.of it. LJ: 2' I might not.have time. I've had two chemical 3 releases in the Town of-Amesbury over the past couple of 4 years at industrial plants that never required offsite-5. evacuation of the populous but we have come very close'to 6' the point. 7 I-mean, you don't sit.around dawdling with the 8-Board of Selectmen looking for permission of whether or not 9 to evacuate. It's the same thing as during the floods of 10 '87. I had to move two people quite quickly the night that 11 Toksby Pond Dam broke. And I didn't. wait for permission of 12 the Board of Selectmen to move them because otherwise they 13 would be doing the backstroke. 14 I would have to go over this and read'it. It's -{ } 15-too -- the question is too vague for me to answer, okay. 16 Q Sir, I would just ask you to go back to page 186 17 subsection 5, subsection A and read that sentence again? 18 A (Clark) Right. "The Board of Selectmen acting 19 through the civil defense director is the overall authority 20 for the evacuation effort." Acting through the civil 21 defense director. Like I say, it comes -- it is certain 22 times it could happen. 23 Q But the overall authority rests with the Board of 24 Selectmen; is that correct? 25 A (Clark) Correct. 'O emica e aegerein, correlation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS-16811 .1 Q .And the town manager as he carries out the policy? ,3 \\ -w) 2 A (Clark) Daily functions, right. 3 Q Thank you. 4 JUDGE SMITH: Ms. O'Malley, we have an expert here 5 to work on the amplifying system. We will wait'until your 6 cross-examination is. completed or take a break, whatever you 7 wish. Are you almost done? 8 MS. O'MALLEY: It's going to take me a Jittle bit - 9 longer, maybe we should take a break. 1 10 JUDGE SMITH: Let's take a short brenk. i 11 (Whereupon, a short break was taken.) 12 JUDGE SMITH: Are you ready, Ms. O'Malley? 13 MS. O'MALLEY: Yes, Your Honor. 14 BY MS. O'MALLEY: {} M. Clark, I would like to direct your attention-15 Q r 16 to page 189. This is a map that's entitled " Traffic control 17 points." 18 MR. DIGNAN: I'm sorry, counsel, which page was 19 iti 20 MS. O' MALLEY : It's page 189 of 248. i 21 MR. DIGNAN: Thank you very much. 22 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 23 Q Now, I believe you testified that these traffic i 24 control points were plotted off of an earlier plan; is that 25 correct? O Herieae-Regerei e correratio-l (202) 628-4808 l (CLARK - CROSS. 16812 1 A (Clark) I'm not exactly sure on this one here.. i 2 This is, like I say, this is the common more or:less 3 direction of travel to move traffic out either.by 495 or 95. 4 Q-So this isn' t a = detailed evacuation plan, this is - 5 just sort of the direction people would head in if they were 6 going to leave town? 7 A (Clark) Basically. I mean, _it's not enough 8 traffic control points as far as I'm concerned, but it's the. 9 main two-traffic control points. 10 Q And you don't know where they came from or who 11' plotted them on this map? 12 A (Clark) I can't recall. I'm not sure if I was 13-involved in it or not, you know, with discussion with Mike 14 Filbin or not, I'm not sure. I think, like I say it was (^)T 15 probably an assumption on my part along with him being more 16 or less, these are the main two intersections as far as 17 moving traffic, either 95 or 495. 18 MR.. TURK: I'm sorry, I didn't hear what the 19 intersections were? 20 MS. O'MALLEY: That's my next question. 21 BY MS. O'MALLEY: l 22 Q I think if we look at page -- 23 MR. TURK: I'm sorry, I just wanted t'o hear his 24 last answer. 25 MS. O' 11 ALLEY : Oh, I'm sorry, I thought you wanted i O Mariease = reim, c-r ei-(202) 628-4888 L-_--_-______-______________-_____ i CLARK - CROSS 16813 ) f 1 to know the intersections. ~ 2 THE WITNESS: (Clark) That these as plotted would 1 '3 be the main two intersections directing traffic to'either 4 Route 495 or Route 95. j 5 BY MS. O' MALLEY : 6 0 on page 193 it does list them. You would agree,. 7 Mr. Clark, this map is somewhat fuzzy as far as figuring out 8 exactly what they are referring to? 9 A. (Clark) Right. I'm not sure exactly if they knew 10 what they were drawing on here either because they look like 11 they're a little off centered on the map also. l 12 Q I'm going to get to that. 13 So the first one, number one, according to page 14 193 purports to be Route 110 and 495? (} 15 A (Clark) Oh, okay. 16 Q But in fact it is a little ways off from that 17 intersection; isn't that correct? 18 A (Clark) Correct. 19 Q And also number two purports to be Elm Street and 20 Route 1107 21 A (Clark) Right. 22 Q But in fact Elm Street and 110 are actually down 23 to the right, I guess you would say the right east? 24 A (Clark) Right. 25 Q The southeast of the actual marking on here? l O rie se eerei=9 correr eie= (202) 623-4888 l 1 i CLARK - CROSS '16814 1 A: (Clark) No. '2 Q Is~that correct? 3 A~ (Clark) Where the number is there that's correct'. -4L 'Where Elm Street is X' ed with Route 110 and then directing ' 5' the traffic; to 95, that was 'the intent of it.- 6 The first;one,. reference.numberJone - 'like I;say',- 7 Jthere's mistakes in here. I have to go.back in here.and 8 look if that is something I picked up or not. Butlthat 9 should.say Route 110 and 150.. 10 Q. So the.first one is actually Route 110 and. Route ~ 11 1507. 12 A (Clark) Yes. They'put 495 to address -- 495 just 13 tol pick.the: interstate up. To explicitly show the 14: interstate being used, interstate 495 which-runs north and (]) 15 south. So it says 110 and 495.- That's what is supposed to 16 be addressed on there. L 17 What I believe they have listed here -- I got to 18 look at the map to tell you. What actually is here listed 1 19 on the map should say, this location is Route 110 and Route 20 150 which is the intersection of Haverhill Road and Hillside 21 Avenue. 22 Q Because in fact Route 110 and 495 don't actually 23 intersect? 24 A (Clark) No, this is a short strip of Route 150. 25 I mean, you can get to 495 either way. You can send traffic l O emite e Re,orein, corporation (202) 628-4888 l-(4 CLARK - CROSS '16815 E 1 .up through Merrimac St.:?*a through 150 and pick up the ? 2 cloverleaf for 495. '3 Q I have a better map that I would like you'to take L 4 a look at as to plot number two. L =5 A (Clark) Okay. 6 (Document proffered to witness.) 7 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 8 Q Does this larger map appear to you to be a map.of 9 Amesbury, Mr. Clark? 10 A (Clark) Yes, it is., 11 Q Can you find number one on here -- I'm sorry, 12. number two which you have stated is correct and on the map 13 that everybody has? l( ) 14 A (Clark) Number two would be intersection of -- 15 okay. This is the intersection right here. 16 Q Could you just circle that. 17 What you've indicated, you have circled and~could 18 ycn just mark it with your initials? 19 A (Clark) I'll mark it. 20 Q And when you compare it to where number two is on 21 the map that we have in our Exhibit No. 44 do you agree that 22 it is not in exactly the same place? '23 A (Clark) It's just hard to read because so much of 1 24 the map has been just, you know, cut out because of the ( i l-25 neaber two being put there -- block being put there. O: it,. eerein, cerror tion (202) 628-4888 / CLARK - CROSS 16816-L 1 It is slightly off.- There is the cloverleaf to 95 2 on this map. There's the cloverleaf to 95'here. 3 Q And the intersection that'you have marked on the 4 larger map-is closer to the cloverleaf on 95 than on the 5' smaller.mapp isn't that correct? .6 A (Clark) Right. It's just the maps aren't the-7- same. 8-MS. O'MALLEY: I would just like to have this L 9 larger map put into evidence with' Exhibit 44, perhaps as 10 Exhibit 44 (a). I don't know if Mr. Dignan has any 11 objections to that. 12 JUDGE SMITH: Do you object to that, Mr. Dignan? ~ 13 MR. DIGNAN: I have no objection. Are there 14 copies? {} 15 MS. O' MALLEY: I don't have copies, but I will be 16 happy to take it and make copies for the record. .17 JUDGE SMITH: I wonder.if it really is necessary, 18 because you're going to have to go to a certain amount of 19 inconvenience to get enough copies for everybody. 20 What is it you wanted to establish with the more 21 accurate map? l 22 MS. O' MALLEY : Well, I think actually Mr. Clark is 23 seeing more of it now. But the number two was also 24 inaccurate to some extent on the map that's in Exhibit 44. 25 JUDGE SMITH: I suspect that when review of this O

Heriea,

=run, c - r eien l (202) 628-4888 l i i l CLARK - CROSS 16817 1 record comes about it will be what he saye about it more g-4 L.) \\ 2-than the comparison of the maps that will be more important, j 3 If you really think'it's necessary we will 4 accommodate you. 5 MS. O'MALLEY: The only reason I came up here is 6 because Mr. Clark was having a little difficulty, but I 7 think he now sees it, perhaps he can testify to it. 8 JUDGE SMITH: - Yes, I think that would be easier. 9 MR. TURK: Your Honor, I might point out that we 10 do have the traffic management plan in evidence already. 11 And perhaps simply referring to -- 12 THE WITNESS: (Clark) No, there was a serious 13 mistake'made on this and the more I look at it now -- my 14 eyes aren't the greatest. The print on here is kind of {} 15 blurred in places, j 16 But number two is sitting on the Elm Street 17 overpass at 495. That's the problem with this number two. 18 I didn't notice it right off. 19' BY MS. O'MALLEY: L 20 Q And there would be no need for traffic control 21 points on an overpass; is that correct? 22 A (Clark) Because there's no ramps there.

Right, 23 there's no ramps there.

l 24 JUDGE SMITH: What page is that? 25 MR. DIGNAN: Now I'm confused. So where should it () Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16818 1-have been? qy 2 THE WITNESS: -(Clark) It should have been at the D 3 inters'sction of Macy Street and Clarks Road and Elm.' Street. 4 MR. DIGNAN: Are-any of those 110? 5 THE' WITNESS: (Clark) Yes,- Macy Street is 110. 6 MR. DIGNAN: So it's the Elm Street and Route 110 7 intersection that we're talking about? 8 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Right. 9 MR. DIGNAN: The one that is listed on page -- 10 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Right. Instead of' Elm 11 Street and 110 they just put it on the map on the wrong 12 place. 13 MR. DIGNAN: Okay, fine. And the other one is 14 Route 110 and 495? 15 THE WITNESS: (Clark) It's.really Route 110'.and 16 1TO. 17 MR. DIGNAN: And that's what you described earlier 18 as being near 495? 19 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Right. 20 MR. DIGNAN: You could go either way? 21 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Right. 22 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 23 Q So in fact both of those were plotted incorrectly 24 on the map or inaccurate on the map? 25 A (Clark) One was plotted incorrectly and the other O erita. R - rein, C-r tion (202) 620-4888 CLARK - CROSS-16819 1 one is described incorrectly. ~g y b) 2 Q Thank you. l 3 Could I ask you to turn to page 191, Mr. Clark. j I 4 Now, this is appendix 3 to annex M entitled " Alternate 1 l 5 transportation system." Is this something that.you added to l 1 6 the generic plan, the basic plan that you got from the 7 state? 8 A (Clark) Let me think for a second. 9 (Pause) 10 THE WITNESS: (Clark) There was a lot of 11 different factors involved comit.g up with these numbers. 12 BY MS. O' MALLEY : 13-Q Excuse me, but this is something that you.in your 14 update added -- this was not something that came from the () 15 state; is that correct, this annex with the numbers and 16 everything filled in? 17 A (Clark) The main portion of it, you know. 18 Q The form of it? 19 A (Clark) Appendix -- the alternate transportation, 20 but listings, yes. The listing with A.F. Cherbinis on them 21 and everything came from me. I j 22 Q Let me start on the first sentence: "It's l l 23 estimated that 156 residents of Amesbury have access to 24 private automobiles." Is that a statement that -- 25 A (Clark) That's a statement -- that's something Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 i CLARK - CROSS 16820 1 1 the state came up with using records from the tax office as j 7, 't) 2 far as payments on excise taxes. 1 3 Q So they found that only 156 automobiles will be 4 used by residents of Amesbury in evacuating the town? 3 A (Clark) No. i 6 Q But that's what it says there, I mean, whatever we H 7 all might think is the reality. 8 So the other numbers of the estimates of evacuees 9 in the third column underneath here came from you or from 10 your records? l 11 A (Clark) I'm just trying to remember how we came 12 up with the numbers. There is varying factors used in 13 coming up with these numbers. 14 What this represents supposedly is, this is the (~} 15 estimates of the amount of people. What you see listed here l 16 is also the shelter facilities that are listed for the Town 17 of Amesbury. Okay. All these things concern the shelters 18 and they are listed under the shelter plan as being 19 reception centers for the community. 20 What is detailed here is estimates of the amount 21 of people that would go to those individual facilities and 22 be provided bus transportation who didn't have alternate 23 means of transportation. g l 24 Q This would be bus transportation to the shelters 25 or from the shelters? () Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) c28-4888 l l i CLARK - CROSS 16821-1 A (Clark) No, from the shelters, namely, when this f\\ i-2 was drawn up it wasn't the greatest' idea or anything like i 3 that. I agree with it, you know, as far as'it being very, 4 very poor in judgment, but this is what was put in there at 5 the time, j l 6 In the event that there had'to be evacuation for 7 some reason or another and not necessarily pertaining to any 8 one particular incident in here, it could be hurricane, it 9 could be a tornado. It doesn't particularly mean a 10 hazardous material incident or anything like that. This was 11 a basis for moving people. That they would go to shelters 12 if they didn't have transportation, and from the shelters be 13 transported out by bus, mainly. That was the transportation 14 coordination point. {} 15 Q So the only bus transportation that's provided in 16 this annex which is entitled " evacuation" -- 17 A (Clark) Right. 18 Q -- is for those people who have managed to get to 19 a shelter and then they would be placed on a bus to be bused 20 out of town? 21 A (Clark) That's what this says. Like I say -- 22 Q That's what this was based on. 23 A (Clark) Right. 24 Q Whether you agree with it at this point is 25 something else. O neritae. Revereine correlation (202) 628-4888 l t. CLARK - CROSS 16822 1. And then it lists the number of buses that are-1 ~ 2 allocated, butLof course there's Cherbinis buses so they 3' would not be showing up_there because Cherbinis is out of 4 business; is that correct? 5 A (Clark) Right. 6 Q I just note that on the next page, page 192 there 7 has been no update to this even though -- I just note that 8 and ask if you; agree that there has been'no update in this-9 document? 10 A (Clark)- I agree. 11 Q Thank you. 12' A-(Clark) I wasn't allowed to do.it. 13 Q' Could I ask you to turn to page 208 please. 14 This purports to be a list of hazardous materials .(} 15 . site locations; is that correct, Mr. Clark? 16 A (Clark) That's correct. 17 Q But on the previous page 207 there's a map that 18 purports to show the location of all of those sites; is that i 19 correct? 20 MR. TURK: All those sites? 21 MS. O' MALLEY : All the sites listed. 22 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 23 Q All of the sites or six of the sites listed, I 24 should say, I'm sorry. 25 A (Clark) Right. They were supposed to be O eritave Revereine Cerroretion (202) 628-4888 CLARK -: CROSS-16823 1. identified on that. map. 2 Q' But in fact'the, map numbers'are missing'from the 3 list, so it's impossible to tell which sites' belor.g to which. -4 companies; is that correct? 5 _A (Clark) Basically, yes. 6 Q Thank you. 7 Also Seabrook Nuclear Plant is not'shown on this; 8 is that correct?- 9- A (Clark) No, the map is not picking-it up. j 10 JUDGE SMITH: Which one is Greg Systems? >11 THE WITNESS: (Clark). It's not Greg.it's Craig, 12 C-R-A-I-G. 13 JUDGE SMITH:- Craig. 14 THE WITNESS: (Clark) It should be number'--' boy, 15 another map I can't read. It should be number.five or l 16 number six. 17 BY MS. O' MALLEY : 18 Q In fact this is not really a complete list of all 19 the -- 20 A (Clark) No. And once again, too, that's -- let's 21 see. Five and six aren't supposed to be together like that 22 either. It's in the general vicinity of five and six. 23 There shouldn't be two numbers there. 24 Also, since then one of these businesses is out of 25 business and no longer there, even though it's still O rie 9-a ra=**=9 corear **a= (202) 628-4888 __1___ _ _ - _ _ _ _ - _ F-CLARK - CROSS 16824' 1 considered a hazardous waste site because of some of the /~N - 2 things up there. But they're not in. business. 3 Q Juid is it possible there are other businesses in 4 the town that are not listed on here that could.possibly be 5 - considered hazardous materials? For instance, Atlantic Oil? 6 A (Clark) Oh, yes, there's a lot'of places. 7 Q EMC? 8 A-(Clark) Yes. But they're not there. 9 JUDGE SMITH: As I said, I thought we were getting i. 10 the gist of it and we're still with it. 11 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. It won't-be .l 12 too much longer I don't'think, Your Honor.- I'll try to go 13 as'quickly as possible.. L () l 15 l l 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 L 24 25 Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 1 l-r 1 CLARK -' CROSS 16825 1 -BY MS. O'MALLEY: 2- . Q' .I'd ask you to turn to page 212, Mr. Clark. 3 'Once again,.like one of the earlier sections, I 4 would ask you'to look through' Annex 0. There is nothing in' l 5: ' Annex 0 that pertains specifically to Amesbury; is there, I l 6 -Mr. Clark?. 7 MR. DIGNAN:- Now once again, do you mean doesn't 8 pertain or that it is a generic plan that would be 9 applicable to any town?. '10 MS. O'MALLEY: Well -- ' 11 MR. DIGNAN: I object to the form as it's 12 presently etated. 13- 'JJDGE SMITH: May.we have it'back again? 14 MS. O'MALLEY: I was asking Mr. Clark if there is 15-anything in Annex 0 that pertains specifically to Amesbury. 16 I will add to that question if Your Honor thinks it's 17 necessary. 18 JUDGE SMITH: Was this the same thing? 19 MR. DIGNAN: It's the same problem yes. 20 MS. O'MALLEY: It's the same. 21 JUDGE SMITH: I thought she did pretty well there. 22 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. 23 MR. DIGNAN: Well, Your Honor, if something is 24 generically applicable to every town, then it pertains to 25 the Town of Amesbury and every other thing. That's my O Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16826 i 1-problem with the form -- 2, JUDGE SMITH: You'are ignoring the word j. l L. 3 " specific".. 4 MR. DIGNAN: Did I miss the word " specific"? 5 MS. O'MALLEY: Yes. 6 MR. DIGNAN: I guess I did. If the word 7 " specific" is in the question --- 8 ~ JUDGE SMITH: I don't know, it was the second time-9 around. 10 MS. O'MALLEY:- It was the first time, I believe, 11' Your Honor, as well. 12 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I'd have to say no, you 13 .know. 14 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 15 O There is nothing that specifically pertains to the 16 Town of Amesbury. 17 A (Clark) No. I don't believe there is. 18 Q-Thank you, Mr. Clark. 19 I would ask you to turn to page 220, Mr. Clark. 20 Down at the bottom where it says " organization and 21 assignments, task assignments", number one, it talks about 22 the Board of Selectmen or mayor. 23 Now there is no mayor in the Town in Amesbury, is 24 there? 25 A (Clark) No, no. Q Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 a i CLARK - CROSS 16827'- 1 Q Thank you. l O' 1 2 And on page 249 under " Administration and 3 Logistics", there are some blanks there; is that correct, l 4 under A, records and receipts? 5 MR. DIGNAN: 249? 6 MS. O'MALLEY: Oh, I apologize. 222. I'm sorry. 7 BY MS. O ' MALLEY ' ' 8 Q There are references there to some appendix, but 9 there are blanks in referring to where we might find them; 10 is that correct? 11 A (Clark) Yes, there is here in this one. I don't 12 know -- 13 Q That's the one we are operating under for this 14 proceeding. 15 A (Clark) Right. Okay. 16 Q Thank you. 17 Turning to page 228, Mr. Clark. Again at the top, 18 there is no mayor in the Town of Amesbury. 19 A (Clark) That's correct, there is no mayor. 20 Q And turning to page 235, Mr. Clark, once again l 21 there is no mayor and no Board of Aldermen -- 22 A (Clark) That's correct. f 23 Q -- in the Town of Amesbury, and there is no 24 listing on this particular page for the Board of Selectmen 25 or the town manager who in fact are the -- O a r** 9-eerei=9 corror tio-l (202) 628-4888 j m [ ~ g_ CLARK - CROSS ~16828 i-e 1 A (Clark)'.That's correct.. I t].-

2.

-Q -- executive bodies. !? 3 Also, under No. 2,-Preparedness, subsection (e) 4 talks about providing a police staffing. plan for confinement' 5 inJaccess of control areas. L' 6 Again, there has been no review of this by.the 7. police department or development of such a plan,.has there, 8 Mr. Clark? 9-A' (Clark) Now hold on. Got to be careful here. 10 There is a possibility'that the police chief has a 11' plan of his own under this. I'm not sure. 12 Q But this -- 13 A '(Clark) I don't know. I can't address that here. + 14 There's a possibility that he has one of his own. 15 Q But as far as you know,-he has not done anything 16 under this plan, specifically pertaining to this plan. 17 A (Clark) Correct, correct.. But under the heading 18 " Preparedness", okay, one of the four.-- no, I mean 19 seriously. You've got to be careful-here. I don't want to 20 address something that might not be there. 21 There is a lot of individual plans per departments 22 that are in place for different things. The Police 23 Department's got two or three contingency plans. The Fire 24 Department's got contingency plans. Public works has 25 contingency plans. I don't know per department what they O Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 mj CLARK - CROSS 15829 l.. /1 have in place, so I cannot -- E 'k / 2-Q Sir, the Mitigation Task Force that's described in 3 subsection (b) above has never met, have they, in the form 4 that's -- 5 A (Clark) No, not under -- 6' Q Not under this plan. 7 A (Clark) Not under civil servants. 8 Q-Okay. And so far as you know, there has been no 9 plan developed by the police staffing under this particular 10 formula with the Mitigating Task Force under this plan? 11 A (Clark) Under "this". plan. .1:2 Q' Is that correct? 13 A (Clark) Under "this" plan, right. f-14 Q Thank you. (~3 ) l 15 A (Clark) Specifically, under this plan I know that 16 there isn't one. 17 Q Okay, thank you. 18 JUDGE SMITH: Again, are you talking about the 19 civil disturbance plan or the entire plan itself? 20 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I'm only referring to this 21 portion. 22 JUDGE SMITII: Annex R. 23 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Right. That I am not aware 24 of anything that the police chief has that's been added,to 25 this plan under civil servants. I don't know if -- C Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 i.! CLARK - CROSS 16830 1. ' JUDGE. SMITH: Annex R. 2 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Correct, Annex R. 3 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 4' Q Again on page 237, Mr. Clark, there is a-reference 5 to an appendix that is not filled in for' purposes of this 6 plant is that right? 7 A (Clark) Correct. 8 Q Correct. 9 A (Clark) Correct. 10 Q Thank you. 11 And.on page 238, there.is under "Line of 12 . Succession",,there is a reference to the alderman,. and there 13. is no alderman -- 14 A (Clark) You are correct again. L 15 Q -- in the Town of Amesbury; is that correct? 16 MS. O'MALLEY: Could I-just have a moment,-Your-(' ) 17-Honor? I 18 Thank you. 19 (Counsel confers with colleague.) 20 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 21 Q Mr. Clark, you would agree, wouldn't you, that 22 there are numerous flaws in this plan, numerous places where i 23 it needs to be corrected or updated? 24 A (Clark) Right. I do agree to that. 25 Q And you agree that most people outside of your own 'O =

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CLARK - CROSS 16831 .1-individual ~1ittle staff would find it very difficult to . e. 2 -implement this plan; is that. correct, based on'the review-3 that.we have just made of this plan? l -4 A' (Clark) That's another tough one to answer.. 5 I.would have to say only.with the civil defense-6 portion of it; namely, not involving the rest of'the 7 department heads unless all those individuals were briefed 8 and met at the.EOC and everything and worked together on.it.. 9 I mean they could be used'for. general guidance, but not 10 complete accuracy. 11 Q So it's-fair to say that this is not an emergency 12 . plan for the Town of Amesbury if there is an. emergency ~ 13 tomorrow and nobody's adopted it, nobody has been briefed on-14 it, and anybody besides yourself and your staff would have 15 to use it? 16 .A' (Clark) I want to be fair answering this. -And 17 once again like I say, it's the position I'm in that when 18 something takes place, this is all I've got to work with. 19 So basically it's not completely correct, I'll admit to that 20 right now for the record. There is a lot of corrections 21 that need to be made. A lot of them are being addressed so 22. it can be used a little bit better. But being the closest 23 thing to a workable plan we have, I feel I can use portions 24 of it, and I have. 25 Q You can use it, sir; is that correct? 'O = rit e-rei 9 care r ti - (202) 628-4888 \\ 4 CLARK - CROSS.- 16832 1 -A (Clark)- I'could use.it'in conjunction'with some) .o. 2J of the'other department heads, if necessary. l 3 Q But in. fact as you testified before, none of the i 4 other department heads have reviewed this plan - - .5 A '(Clark) Right. 6 Q. -- or been involved in~the formulation of this 7-plan. 8 A

(Clark)

Correct. 9 Q And the Board of Selectmen'has not accepted this 10 plan. 11 A (Clark) Correct. 12 Q-Is'that correct? 13 And even without this plan you would.st;ill have 14 'your-extensive training; is that correct, in the civil 15' defense capacity? 16 A (Clark) Yes, but you still have to have'some 17 guidance too. I mean, I can't remember this thing word for 18 word. And'you know, when incidents have taken place, I have 19 to go back. You know, if I call up the Area 1 headquarters l 20 at the state level and say, you know, such and so is 21 happening, they will just say refer to Annex so and so and .22 get your guidance from there. And then if you have'any 23 questions, you know. 24 I've been in the nosition. It's very hard to 25 explain. I've been put in the position that I have had to Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 [~ r .m[ CLARK - QtOSS 16833 7 T: 1L ~use this. I have had~no alternative, and it has created us, " 'O 2-no problems with_the things I have used it for. I can't '3 guarantee that'everything in here would ever work.- Nobody 4' can guarantee that any plan will ever work. But this is all: p 5 I have got to go by. This is a' basis for running the 6 emergency management program. I rely upon the other F 7 department heads, their expertise in running their 8 operations'on.a daily basis and during emergencies, to plug 9 in their portion of it. 10 Like I say, I don't run the police department,. 11 fire department or public works. It's their. responsibility. 12 When I get'to.the point that I need help, I call up and say, 13 . Police Chief,.I need so and so. Fire Chief, I need so and 14 so to make' things work; and it's their responsibility from {y 15 there. 16 My general guidance con.es from this plan. _My 17 general guidance to run the civil defense program during an 18 emergency. 19 Q So you are the official in the Town of Amesbury 20 that uses this plan, that formulated this plan and that 21 relies on this plan; is that correct? 22 A (Clark) Yes. 23 Q And to your knowledge, no other officials in the 24 Town of Amesbury use, rely or accepted this plan? 25 A (Clark) Right. O it e =ee ei, co e eti - (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16834 1 Q Thank you, Mr. Clark. ,,~] t 2 JUDGE SMITH: You had indicated that three other 3 members of your organization are conversant with the plan, 4 too;;is that correct? 5 THE WITNESS: -(Clark) We've been doing an 6 overv$$ w and study of this thing over the past five or six 7 months during staff meetings to make a lot of the 8 corrections and updates. But like I say, generally as far 9 as if they were put in the position to take my place and 10 .they were directed or moved in any certain section of this 11 thing, I would say that they.would be able to complete'75 or 12 more percent of the individual tasks and know what to put in 13 place.here if it was, you know, needed. 14 MS. O'MALLEY: Your Honor, if I-may, I would like 15 to renew my objection on the grounds of relevance. I just t 16 think that given all the problems with this plan and given 17 Mr. Clark's own admission that most of the officials other 18 than himself in the Town of Amesbury really have no I 19 connection to this plan whatsoever, it just seems to me that 20 there would be prejudice that would result from its j 21 admission that would not be outweighed by any probative 22 value it could have for the Board. 23 JUDGE SMITH: What prejudice would that be? 1 24 MS. O'MALLEY: Well, it just seems to me that the i 25 Board would have before it something called an Amesbury Plan O rie e-ei 9 co or *1 - l (292) 628-4888 p CLARK '- CROSS 16835 1 thatJin fact is Mr.. Clark's plan'. And I would just find . ;h 2 .that any use the Board might have for it would'be so minimal ~ 3 that it would be better not to have it on the-record at'all. ~ 4 JUDGE SMITH: Do you. agree, Mr. Dignan? 5 .MR.-DIGNAN: No, I don't, Your Honor. As they say 6 at the. bridge table, I would like to review the bidding onL 7 this one. 8 Mr. Lewald, you will recall, when cross-examining 9 Chief Cronin, utilized Annex M of this plan in part of~the 10-cross-examination; attempted to offer it; and counsel for 11 the town. objected and objected on the grounds.of 12 ' authenticity.-=Also, it was after I indicated that,'okay,'if. 13 .we are going to go the hard way on authenticity,' I will-L. 14 subpoena'in the civil defense. director, whose initials I saw 15. On the front of the plan..And it was then stated to me, and-16 by the way, it-ought to be the whole plan, not just the 17. Appendix M, or Annex M. 18 We have done that. We have authenticated-it. 19 That was the pArpose for putting it in was to get across 20 this information. Now, however, I think if there was -- I 21 thought that Annex M was the relevant stuff because, among 22 other things, we wanted to show that we had, and I made no 23 secret of this, that we have those same traffic control 24 points, among others, in our plan, and we thought that was 25 pretty relevant, because it does represent, as the witness Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 ._u CLARK - CROSS 16836 .l. . stated,.the best thinking at.the time when planning.was O 2. stopped. 3 However, given the extensive examination which has 4 now taken place, it is clear to.me that this plan might be 5-muchlmore relevant than I ever believed. Apparently,.if the 6 balloon'goes up in Amesbury for anything, this is what the 7 official charged with the duty'of protecting the citizens in 8 the first instance would use. 9 And that being the casa, to the extent -- and I ~ 10 admit, as the witness.has admitted, there are a lot of 11 things he would like to see done with this, and obviously 12 he's been striving to get them done against some opposition 13 or other. And I think to have this in~and compare it with 14 what we have provided for in the SPMC is most relevant, [} 15 especially-when the town is taking the position that this 16 plan that we have come up with is really crummy. 17 Well, it may be that they can convince the Board 18 of that, but I would note, for example, this plan has 19 sections on protective actions. So do we. Both include 20 plans on sheltering. Both include evaluation plans and 21 evacuation routes. The witness has testified that the two 22 traffic control points laid out in there, granted the map 23 may be a little out of it, are in his judgment the two most 24 important traffic control points in the town. He said there 25 needed to be others. We include them and we do have others. O ie em =mrereine cerror eien (202) 628-4888 s .r CLARK - CROSS 16837 [ ~

L I think all of this is relevant to demonstrating O

F 2 at the close of this record that our plan has taken into -3' account the things that are important in this town, and 4 .indeed, without attempting to start.an argument ~over it, 5- .I'llfprobably be~asking you to say, we have in fact made-the 6 corrections that ought.to be made, because our people have 7 gone forward with the planning process,.and I think it's 8 extremely relevant that we have the local plan.that as.of 9 the time it~was represented the best thinking of the people 10 responsible for it in this town. 11 Moreover, I think certain of the other testimony 12-that has come forth from this. witness, which again I did not 13 elicit, is highly relevant to this proceeding, even if the 14 Board should decide to exclude the plan. Among other (~)g r 15 . things, I-found it very edifying to. find out.how you do deal 16 with the situation of the selectmen being out of town. We 17- ' spent a lot of time on that problem, and I guess I now know 18 the answer, and a competent civil defense director takes 19 over and if he's out of town, his deputy takes over after 20 him. 21 And so I think this has been most edifying. I 22 can't think of anything more relevant, and I press the, or I 23 object to what I guess is a motion to reconsider your L 24 ruling, and I say that the motion to reconsider should be 25 denied. - O ===1* 9- = =**-9 c r (202) 628-48s8 CLARK - CROSS 16838 1 MS. O'MALLEY: If I may just address.that briefly,. 3 'Q 2 Your Honor. 3 Mr. Dignan's whole argument presumee that this is 4 the Town of Amesbury's plan. That is exactly what this 5 whole afternoon has been -- 6 JUDGE' SMITH: Well, you.are focusing too much on 7 the label. Now we have heard your examination of this 8 witness over a long time, and your examination was perfectly 9 appropriate and relevant, and you have established, I think, 10 what this document is not; and we have listened to you and 11 we have understood it. 12 But this document is also something, and we 13 understand what that is. And your arguments go to not the 14 relevancy of the document, whether, it should be in or out {,) 15 of evidence, but to what findings can be made upon it. And 1 l 16 you will have your opportunity. We will call upon you to 17 make proposed findings based upon whatever you think have to 18 be made. But we've heard, we understand what the 19 limitations are, and we understand, I think, what seems to 20 be a rather simple matter. l 21 So your objection is overruled. I mean, your 22 renewed objection is overruled. We will not change our 23 earlier ruling. 24 Now we have another aspect of it as to which we 25 have some concern. Mr. Clark alluded several times to, \\ O eritaee aegereine co veraeien (202) 628-4888 1 j l CLARK - CROSS 16839 1 there was some impediment to the matter being accepted, the j j-s l \\~/' 2 . matter being talked about, and I know what that impediment ( 3 is. I have been following this case for a long time. But i 1 4 the evidentiary record of this case does not demonstrate-5 what that impediment was. Judge McCollom, for example, new l 6 to the case, was wondering just what it is. What is it that j 1 7 he's alluding to.? 8 Now in the event any party wishes to have that 9 testimony be available for findings as to that aspect of the 10 case, the refusal to plan aspect, you had better do 11 something about it,-because it's not apparent from his 12 testimony. 13 MR. DIGNAN: Well. I assume that counsel, having 14 finished her examination, I gather there may be more cross } 15 over there. 16 JUDGE SMITH: Yes, Ms. Talbot wants to -- 17 MR. DIGNAN: I will have an opportunity for 18 redirect, and I plan to get into some of the matters that 19 were gone into on that cross. 20 JUDGE SMITH: All right. 21 MR. DIGNAN: And as usual, Your Honor has got the 22 one that's at the top of the list. I 23 JUDGE SMITH: Ms. Talbot pointed out that l l 24 Commonwealth has interest in this testimony somewhat L 25 separate from the Town of Amesbury, and that it was not l Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l l~ r I.. L CLARK -' CROSS' 16840 p 1 practical to consolidate the -- it.would save. time if she ) ~ l2 - ,just asked her questions on her own,.and'we believe that 3 that~would be the case. 4. So, Jhs. Talbot, would you please examine?- 5 MS. TALBOT:.Thank you, Your Honor. I only have '6 l - about six' questions. T7.. CROSS-EXAMINATION 3-8 BY MS. TALBOT: 9 Q Mr. Clark, my name.is Pamela Talbot. I am 10 Assistant Attorney General for the Commonwealth of 11 Massachusetts. 12 Mithcut walking all the way through the plan 13 again, would you agree that this' plan calls for [} participation and planning-with American Red Cross in terms ~14 15 of emergency. response? '16 A (Clark) Yes, this portion in here, yes.- 17 Q' Right. And who is responsible for the actual 18 planning with Red Cross? 19 A (Clark) I am. 20 Q You are. Okay. 21' What American Red Cross chapter would be relied on-22 in responding to an emergency in Amesbury where a large 23 portion or where the entire town had to be evacuated? 24 A (Clark) It would come under the jurisdiction of 25 the Newburyport chapter. - O-ie e-ei-9 co e ei - (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16841-1 Q Newburyport chapter. k Lj ' 2 Can you just, for me, explain to'me how that q 3-chapter fits into any other regional chapter? 4 A (Clark) Okay. To the best of my knowledge, it 5 consolidates the Town of Amesbury, Newburyport and I 6 Salisbury. And I'm not an expert on Red Cross, I mean this l 7 past experience I was involved for awhile with Red Cross. 8 Q Red Cross is ordinarily responsible for staffing 9 shelters; is that correct? 10 A (Clark) Correct, under law there. 11 Q Right. 12 I notice on page 177 there is a list of shelters 13 which could presumably house several thousand people. I 14 know that if the Town of Amesbury were to be evacuated, they {]) 15 may not necessarily go to those shelters. They may in fact 16 go'to a host community or some town outside of Amesbury. 17 But for a town of Amesbury's size would that be about the 18 number of people that a civil defense director would plan to i 19 shelter? l 20 A (Clark) In fact, as far as this was concerned, if 21 I remember correctly, the state numbers were low, and I 22 asked to have them increased. 23 So, yes, I'm very comfortable with that. 24 Q In your experience, could American Red Cross l 25 provide adequate staff -- l .O nemitase

Regorein, cerroration (202) 628-4888 2

l-CLARK - CROSS 16842 L ,,). 1. MR. DIGNAN: Excuse me. Objection. The question tV 2 went, and I agree I - you asked the numbers, whether the 3 numbers were the ones he would go, the numbers that are 4 on -- 5 MS. TALBOT: No, Mr. Dignan, I asked him to refer 6 to page 177 which gave a list. 7 MR. DIGNAN: Right. Which has capacities; not 8. numbers of people evacuated. 9 MS. TALBOT: Fine. That's fine. 10 MR. DIGNAN: Well, was the question did he want 11 those capacities, or was he saying that this is the number 12 of people that would actually evacuate? 13 MS. TALBOT: My question goes to neither of those 14 points. I didn't -- () 15 MR. DIGNAN: Neither of those. 16 MS. TALBOT: -- mean to mislead you. That's 17 correct. 18 MR. DIGNAN: Fine. I withdraw my objection. 19 MS. TALBOT: I simply wanted to get on the record 20 that for a town the size of Amesbury, you know, about that 21 many shelters would be needed to house the people. 22 MR. DIGNAN: Then you are saying -- you are asking 23 him if he thinks in his opinion this is the number of people 24 who would have to be sheltered. 25 MS. TALBOT: Yes. () Heritage Reporting Corporation j (202) 628-4888 _______ ___-_____ _ _ __ a CLARK - CROSS 16843 1 HR. DIGNAN:- Not just what is the capacity to ~ 2 shelter. l 3 MS. TALBOT:. Yes. Thank you for making that more 4 clear for me. 5 MR. DIGNAN: Did the witness understand that that 6 was what he'was being asked as opposed to what the capacity, 7 of the shelters were? 8 THE WITNESS:- (Clark) Okay. I thought she was 9 questioning the numbers as far as capacity was concerned. 10 MR. DIGNAN: That's what I thought, too. 11 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Are you talking -- I'm 12 sorry. 13 MS. TALBOT: No, I should be the one who is sorry. 14 THE WITNESS: (Clark) You are referring to the [ 15 pages. 16 MS. TALBOT: But I'm not. 17 THE WITNESS: (Clark) What I'm doing is I'm 18 trying to read ahead here too to try to, you know, be able 19 to address this as best as I can. 20 MS. TALBOT: Let me just start fresh. Okay, I'll 21 try not to confuse anyone. 22 BY MS. TALBOT: 23 Q On page 177, we have a list of shelters which can 24 presumably house several thousand people. 25 A True. O erieae. Regerei-, Correlation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16844 1 Q Any problem with that from anyone? . () t 2-A (Clark / No, that's. correct.. 3 Q Okay, 2'11.just. leave it at that. .4 In your experience, could American Red Cross-5 provide adequate staff for a number of shelters like those 6 listed on page 177? In other words, for shelters which 7 would have a capacity for several.thousand people. 8 A (Clark) I would have to say~it would be 9 questionable. 10 Q Questionable. 11 Can you tell me a little why you would say 12 questionable? 13 A (Clark) Only because of pr.st. experience we have 14 had with the availability of personnel from Red Cross, {} 15 especially if it's like an area-wide type emergency 16' involving more than just the Town of Antesbury. 17 Q Oh, I see. 18 A (Clark) That there has been a. shortage of j 19 volunteers. But as far as I -- I have never gone to the i 20 point that I have had to house all of these, okay, so this 21 is an assumption. 22 Q Right. 23 A (Clark) And it trould be an assumption on my part 24 to think I could do it, you know. This is where the 25-cafeteria workers, the custodians and everything else come 1 O riene. Reporeine Cerveration (202) 628-4888 l' L t y . CLARK - CROSD 16845 1 ~into. play'with the schools. That's-why we had to do that 2 portion of it, or be-dependent upon some of the school' L 3 employees to help-out with that. .4 Q. Oh, so oftentimes-in an~ evacuation is it correctc 5. to assume that school employees would augment, Red Cross-6- staff that would staff shelters? ? '7 A (Clark). Basically..Because knowing the building-8 and everything else. I mean we have.used them. 9 Q I see. I 10 A -(Clark): And like'I've only used them for.a 11 hurricane. That's the only thing.I have ever.used them for.- 12 And, yes' the school staff did stay to assist.. They ran the-13 office, they ran -- you.know, maintenance people stayed. i{ } 14: Q I see. 15 Am I correct in assuming that-that's one of the 16. reasons that'a civil defense director would yo with a school 17 for shelter rather than some institutional some industrial 18-facility or -- 19 A '(Clark) No. Mostly because of the way it's set 20; up and everything, for feeding purposes, for housing as far- '21 as sleeping is concerned, exercise. It's just a lot better 22 setup. School desks. 23 Q I see. 24 A (Clark) I mean initially auditoriums that are -- 25 Q Easier to move the desks. l< 'O terie e-ei, c r ei - (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16846 1 .A (Clark) Oh, yes, it's just -- plus the other 7% 2 thing.too, they are under the control of the town also. 3' They'are owned by the town,-so liability-wise-and there is 4 all kinds of factors involved. 5 Q So the fact that there may be additional personnel 6. is like a fringe benefit. 7 A (Clark)

Yes, I' d have to say that.

8 Q Have you ever planned with Red Cross to do an 9 area-wide evacuation as you called it? .10 A (Clark) No. 11 Q No. 12 If an area-wide evacuation were to occur today or 13 tomorrow, in your opinion could the Red Cross that's 14 available in your area or your part of the state adequately -{ 15 staff shelters? 16 A (Clark) Not from the Newburyport chapter. 17 Q Okay. 18 A (Clark) But that's not saying that they cannot 19 man from the other lower chapters. 20 0 Do you have any knowledge -- 21 A (Clark) As we have been taught. 22 Q Pardon me? 23 A (Clark) As we have been taught through our 24 training and -- I mean, we go to seminars all the time. We 25 have people from the Red Cross come in and speak, the head l () Heritage Reporting Corporation l (202) 628-4888 . _ =, _ - - - - - - - g 3-

i. t -

no ~ CLARK CROSS-16647 i 1 honcho for Boston, et' cetera. And they come in and say,lweJ jh z can do this, we can do this,.we can'do this.-. I have1never' 3 .seen theLday'yet'thatlit's happened that they have done it. 1 i 4 .But1I've been -- you know,fI have seen,similar incidents 5 take place with some of the members of our: mutual aid group ~ 6' through the NorthLShore Council'that certain items 1have been 7-requested such as blanketa, cots,--et' cetera, and they have l. i; 8 come from different places.- 9 I mean we are in one of the poorer areas up here j 10 as far as Red Cross coordination is concerned. 1 11 MR. DIGNAN: Oh, really. Thank you. That's all. l- . 12 MS. TALBOT: Thank you. ] i 13 -JUDGE' SMITH: I have one question-right now. j 14-When you used the EOC during the flood in the j {) 151 spring of '87, it was at the senior citizen's center?. l 16 THE WITNESS: (Clark) That's correct. 17 JUDGE SMITH: Pow did all those people know to go 18 there? I mean how did the selectmen know to.go there? This l -19 is not written down any place? 20 THE WITNESS: (Clark) No, I guess it's kind of ] 21 understood. I've only had one -- 22 . JUDGE SMITH: Just word of mouth. j 23 THE WITNESS: (Clark) They dump some money into 24 it. I think they know it's there. I mean there was money ) 25 provided through town meeting articles and everything to ) l l Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 ) l l 1 Ng y CLARK - CROSS 16848 1 create this place. ,} ' As a civil defense director,:as'far ? 2 JUDGE' SMITH: 3 as you know, it is not written down any place that the'EOC 4 is a senior citizen's -- 5 TfDC WITNESS: (Clark) It's posted on the outside 6 of the building. 7 JUDGE SMITH: 'That's it. 8 THE WITNESS: (Clark) No, no, I'd have to say 9 it's-included in some of the plans that are at the fire 10 station as far as how to notify our people, becsuse the fire 11 department is responsible for activating us when they have 12 to have us go, or whatever. I would say the majority of the -13 police department, it's common fact. 14 (The Board confers.) {) 15 JUDGE SMITH: Mr. Dignan. I 16 MR.'DIGNAN: Your Honor, I think Mr. Turk is next 17 in' order, because he has not had a first round on the 18 merits. 19 JUDGE SMITH: That's correct. 20 Mr. Turk. 21 MR. TURK: Your Honor, before Mr. Clark appeared, 22 I had not planned to do any examination of him, but in light l 23 of counsel's examination for Town of Amesbury, I do have 24 some follow-questions I want to ask. 25 l O rie 9-eerei 9 corpor tio-(202) 628-4888 l CLARK - CROSS 16049 1 CROSS-EXAMINATION 2 BY MR.' TURK: L 3 Q Mr. Clark, you had indicated that the Board of 4 Selectmen and others in the town have not participated.in 5 approving or developing this plan. And said in your own 6 words that they are not allowed to'do it. 7 Could you expand upon that? '8 A (Clark) Well, it's -- I've got to see how I'm. 9 going to word this so it comes out right. I 10-There was a town meeting vote which was taken in 11 November of 1985 that-restricted the Town of Amesbury civil 12 defense' director, department heads or anybody, Board of 13 Selectmen,. manager,,from participating in development of-14 specific plan to benefit the. power plant. ). 15 And just to go inte-depth on this, I objected 16~ during thatLtown meeting to voting that in. I was a firm 17 believer in continuing on planning, and I made it perfectly 18 clear on the town meeting floor that night that it would 19 jeopardize overall planning for'other related emergencies in 20 the Town of Amesbury in the time to come, and I was 21 absolutely 100 percent correct.. 22' And what has taken place is there is -- I am 23 required to direct my requests as far as training or 24 anything through the town manager, who is my overall 25 supervisor. And the town manager in that case is the person O rie 9-earei 9 corear eia= (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16850 1 that goes before the Board of Selectmen for approval. ~h,- ~ 2 On numerous occasions, not handwritten or typed or 3 anything like that, but on verbal requests I spend a lot of 4 ' time bringing things to the manager. And after I go to a 5 meeting, come back, say this was what was discussed today. 6 And every time I brought something and it was the continuous 7 reply: I don't think we ought to get into that. It's going 8 to cause a problem. 9 And it's been a hot potato issue up there. It's, 10 in all honesty, seriousness and everything else about this 11 whole thing, it's depressed everybody as far as trying to do 12 anything as far as planning is concerned, because nobody -- 13 nobody wants the headache involved with it. And, you know, ('i 14 I've gotten to the point a couple of times too that I am (s/ L 15 about sick and tired of it too, plain and simple. And I 16 can't get the cooperation I need, because everybody is 17 afraid that we are going to cause a problem of using 18 something such as this for the power plant or whatever, and 19 it's just -- it's screwed the whole concept completely up. 20 Q What do you mean by " causing a problem"? I 21 A (Clark) That if something like this was put l 22 together and could be used, that, you know, under individual 23 town responses to any given incident, that that could be 24 related towards also being able to respond during an 25 incident at the plant. This was one of the reasons some of l Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l 1 l 1' CLARK - CROSS 16851 1 my drills that I requested to hold for training for my staff \\~s 2 were cancelled, because certain people felt that it would 3 conflict.with the vote at the town meeting and that they 4 could be used as evidence or whatever, for the, benefit of S the plant. 6 Q In other'words, there was a perception then that 7 by participating in planning, that might work to the benefit 8 of licensing the Seabrook plant? 9 A (Clark) Correct. 10 Q And that's why people have asked you not to -- 11 A (Clark) Basically that's why there has been no 12-cooperation to do anything. 13 0 You indicated that the selectmen of the town have 1 14' not been briefed on the plant is *5at correct? } 15 A (Clark) No, not this plan. 11 6 Q They have not been. 17 A (Clark) No. 18 Q So when they rejected the plan at the town 19 meeting, it wasn't on the merits of it? But rather, on the 20 concept of developing a plan. 21 A (Clark) The plan -- this is something that 22 bothered me from this morning when we said that the 23 selectmen objected to it. I think the body as a whole, the ( l 24 members of the board were objecting to implementing it and 25 accepting it at a town meeting at that point. But it never , () Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 -CLARK - CROSS 16852 _ ent beyond that._ You_know, I don't_know. I did the f-1 w 2' majority of the speaking that night and.I was the one that-13~ ' ruled"for indefinite postponement becausefupon-4' ' recommendations of'the manager and the board that.they_just' 5 ' felt -- I mean, and I worked for.them at the time. They 6 .just felt it wasn't the thing to do, and I was the'one that 7 got up there and spoke on'it, and I recommended indefinite 8 postponement of it, and that was the end.of it that night. 9 So I was my own worst enemy that night. 10 Q Is it correct then that the Board of Selectmen 11 have not rejected _the_ plan because of any deficiencies in 1:2 it? 13 A (Clark) They have never read it. It's never been 14 presented to them for reading. {} 15 Q In the event of an emergency at Seabrook, assuming -16 the plant is licensed, are you part.of an overall state '17 civil defense effort? 18 A (Clark) Under civil defense law, I'm not sure 19 what section again. I'd have to go back and look at'it.

20 The state civil defense director has the authority under the 21

. law to disperse equipment or whatever from different 22 agencies in order to go assist. There is a -- there is a 23 separate order that's done as far as the fire districts are 1 24 concerned. There is lots of things that have been added 25 over the years, different executive orders that govern Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l L i L CLARK - CROSS !16853-Y l' l coordination of;: resources during emergencies. Onefof them 12 being the' fire district.. That's something that was set up. 3 .in 1950 and it's still used'today. 4 Q ltf there was to be an emergency at'Seabrook '5 station, would part,of your emergency response, or could 6 .part of your emergency response be directed by the-state 7 civil defense authorities, or by the Governor?. 8 A (Clark) I can't answer that. I' don't know..With L 9 what's going on right now, I haven't the faintest idea. 10 Q Well, no, my question is a little bit different.- 11 A (Clark) Yes. 12 Q If there was to be an emergency which encompassed 13 more thkn simply the Town of Amesbury, and if.the state 14 civil defense department was to be involved in an emergency 15' response, would your efforts be subject to their direction? 16-A (Clark) Yes, they would. 17 Q 'And they in turn would be subject to direction by 18 the Governor?_ 19 MS. TALBOT: Objection. The witness doesn't' know, 20 he can't speak on behalf of the state. 21 BY MR. TURK: 22 Q Do you have an understanding as to whether or not 23 that's ' the scheme of things? 24 A (Clark) All I can do is go back and refer to the 25 law. It's explicit. 'O. -it, eren, c-goraean (202) 628-4888 1

• v4 z';,

9 c. CLARK - CROSS 16854 1 -- JUDGE. SMITH:- Well,.come on.' We have already had LO 2. the Civil Defense Act into the case.. We have ruled on it.- 3 .In fact,.a'part of our summary disposition ruling on that 4 was the observation that the' Governor may take over the 5 civil defense activities irt the time: of an emergency. It's. 6 clearly there in.the statute. 'You can probe his 7-understanding of how he would act in an emergency if they 8 tried to do it. That would be all right. 9 I think we can take, from the. balance of this. 10 case,-official notice, we have already taken, not official 11 notice, but summary disposition evidentiary notice of the 12 Civil Defense Act.in this case. 13 MR. TURK: Thank you. 14 BY MR. TURK: 15 Q . Mr. Clark, you have referred to some revisions to l' 16 .this plan which I notice you keep clipped to the front of 17 your notebook containing the plant is that correct? 18 A (Clark).These are suggestions and notesifor 19-revision; namely, individual items per a paragraph, per a 20 ~page, per annex. And'these aren't done yet. These are only 21 up to -- I think that's the point I got tired of doing it. 22 considering-what I was getting out of it for help. I am 23 only up to Annex L. 24 Q Do other members of Amesbury civil defense 25 department have copies of those proposed revisions? h seritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 ';q g? i r4; ' s CLARK - CROSS 16855

1_

A-(Clark) Nope. IOc: 2-Q -You have the only set? 3 uk-(Clark) Right. This was something that was 4 planned and we haven't got around to ck) it as'part of a 0 5 staff meeting. 6 Q So the-others in-your department are aware of 7 those revisions, but they don't have a set of them. 8 A (Clark) This-plan sits on my desk.. This'is the 9 master copy for the agency. 10 Q And it would'be available for_use by others in' 11 your department in an emergency? 12 A (Clark) Yes, it is. That's what it's there for. 13 ~0 Including these revisions, proposed revisions? 14 A (Clark) Yes, that's-why I left them in there. 15 Q Did you say that you prepare annual revisions to 16 the plan? It's more ongoing? 17 A' (Clark) It's an' understanding in-here that you - 18 are supposed to, and I was on a very rigorous program back 19 two or three years ago that -- I mean I was always checking 20 to see how many people were in the elderly housing complexes 21 and how many were handicapped, mobility-impaired. And a lot 22 of that stuff is made available to me through other 23 departments. They have it on record so that in the event of 24 an emergency we could access those lists quite readily. 25 They give us the information. _ O erita e =erereine Corgeratio-(202) 628-4888 l o CLARK:- CROSS 16856 1 Q You indicated that there is one bus company.that's ,-()~ 2 gone out of business, the~Cherbini Company. 3 A (Clark) It was Cherbinis. It was misprinted in 4 here, misspelled. 5~ Q What's the correct spelling? 6 A (Clark) Cherbinis. It should be instead of an 7 apostrophe at the end, it should just be -- if the 8 apostrophe was missing, I think it would be correct at that 9 point. l O l l l O serie. = reine coer ei-(202) 628-4888 e }l CLARK - CROSS 16857 1 Q-Just for the-record I believe it's. 2- ,C-H-E-R-B-I-N-I-S? 3 - A (Clark)' I believe.so', yes. 4 Q-And after they went out of business you indicated 5' that you reached a verbal' agreement with some other bus 6 company for vehicles -- 7 A .(Clark). Right. 8 Q -- to use in an emergency? 9 A -(Clark) At the time the manager up there'-- he's 10 the fire chief at Merrimac now, he was the manager up there-11 at the time. That was one of my concerns that in the event 12 that.something happened such as a fire in a nursing home.or-13-something like that-that I wouldn't have something.available (][' 14 to me.- And he assured me that, you know, just a matter of a 15 phone call or whatever that they-would be made available to. 16 us. There is no written agreement. 17 Q What was the name of his company? 18 A (Clark) McGregor Smith. They presently do the 19 school contract for the Town of Amesbury. 20 Q Why did you only reach a verbal agreement with 21 him? Why didn't you get it nailed down in writing? 22 A (Clark) Just once again, you know, the same thing 23 of trying to get things done and not getting the 24 cooperation. 25 Q Did someone ask you not to get it in writing? O erie, me,-ein, Co, oration (202) 628-4888 L_______________________________________ -CIARK CROSS 16858~ 1 A-(Clark) No. I just didn't pursue it. I didn't J 2 feel -- I have been pursuing things for three.or four years-3' now and it's like running around in circles and bashing your ~4 head against the wall, to be completely honest. And after 5 awhile you get'a little bit tired of it. So,-I mean,.you 6 know, I operate a lot on good faith. And like I say, I've L 7 got some excellent-. department heads up there that I work 8 with, professional people that-in the event that-we needed a 9 resource -- I mean,.there's some people up in the' Town of 10 Amesbury that make good judgment and they can make good 11 judgment quick and we have done it in the past. 12 And there's always at least one of us around 13 between, you know, the police sergeant and everybody else who will say, hey, this is happening, this is what we need, 14 15 make the phone call you got it. 16 JUDGE SMITH: May I interrupt here for a moment. 17 It usually doesn't matter, but in this instance it does 18 matter, verbal means any communication or idea expressed in 19 language not just oral or written but-both. 20 MR. TURK: I was using it in the other sense of 21 it, oral. 22 JUDGE SMITH: Oral. You meant oral? 23 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Oral, I'm sorry. 24 BY MT. TURK: -25 Q In sum then, we-it your feeling that if you had O serica,e me,orein, corgorneinn (202) 628-4888 t CLARK - CROSS 16859 L 1 .tried to get this agreement-for other buses'in' writing that ) 2, you would be opposed by someone within the town and for that1 l ) 3 . reason you didn't-bother? 4 A' (Clark) Well, back then a lot of this'was. going, q 5 at that time, you know, the plant was out asking forL 6 additional resources to fulfill-and make their plan which I 7' couldn't be involved with..And,-you know, I.didn't want 8 anything that looked like there was collusion on my part to-i. 9 work with the plant so I would lose my job, because I.was 10' under direct orders from the town meeting not to.. 11 ~It'hasLput me in a very,'very bad position. 12 Q You felt that there was a ban.on planning -- 13 MS. TALBOT: Your Honor, I object. I feel'like 14 he's, you know, feeding the witness very prejudicial'-- if }} 15 the witnese wants to say that he will. 16 JUDGE SMITH: Well, he has a right -- the witness ~ 17 -- Mr.-Turk has broad responsibilities in this case and he 18 doesn't have privity with this witness. He can examine him 19 as on cross-examination. 20 BY MR. TURK: 21 Q What I'm asking, Mr. Clark, is whether you felt 22 that the ban on participating and planning would have 23 encompassed your getting written agreements for additional L 24 bus. resources? 25 A (Clark) No, I didn't feel that was, you know, a h Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16860 1 point that -- I think if I had pursued it, yes. I would .O 2 have been able to -- I believe if I had pursued it I 3 probably could have gotten a written agreement for the Town 4. of Amesbury, namely, for my plans. But like I say, at the 5 time that was one of the many companies that was being p 6 approached and everything. I mean, it was relayed to me. I 7 mean, I was up talking with them and he has told me. I 8 mean, I heard a lot of things and, you know, I had to make a 9 decision on my own part what to stay away from, to stay in 10 perspective to the town meeting vote, because I was being 11 watched all the time. 12 Q I'm not quite sure I understand what your 13 apprehension was. As you expressed it you were afraid of 14 losing your job -- (} 15 A (Clark) I like being the civil defense director. 16 I enjoy this job and I wouldn't be here now, considering 17 what I've been through over the past five years if I didn't 18 like the job. But I had to be very careful. And I had to 19 stay, like I say, I'm under orders. The selectmen are under 20 orders from town meeting. The town meeting votes not to i 21 participate in any form of planning. The town manager 22 directs down to his department heads, we have to follow 23 orders. We have to use judgment on our part sometimes of 24 what can be construed. And that was one of the things I l 25 felt could be construed as planning so I didn't do it. O a ritase gereine correraeien (202) 628-4888 CLARK - CROSS 16861 1 Q I just want to be sure I understand it with 7-,x l N_] 2 respect to traffic control positions. You believe that the 3 two important intersections, the mair intersections that 4 _ required TCPs are the intersections of Route 110 and 150? 5 A (Clark) Correct. l 6 Q And Route 110 and Elm Street? 7 A (Clark) Correct. 8 Q Those are the two principal ones? 9 A (Clark) Right. 10 Q Regardless of how they appear in the Amesbury 11 scheme? 12 A (Clark) Right. That's the heaviest amount of 13 traffic. If we ever implemented, it would go through those 14 points. {]) 15 Q Also at one point during the examination earlier 16 today you indicated that no one else in the Town of Amesbury 17 uses this plan and I just want to clarify it. You meant 18 outside of civil defense personnel; is that right? 19 A (Clark) You just rejogged my thinking again here, 20 I have to be careful. 21 No other department personally uses the plan. 22 Nobody has ever come over with the EOC like the public works 23 directors and says, Dick, what do I do? And I go, look in 24 the plan.. They never have. 25 But during the flood of ' 87 certain documents to l O eritese aerores 9 corporeeto= (202) 628-4888 1 CLARK - CROSS 16862

gem, 1-fill.out,in here'in order to recover cost damages and

. g' 2'- . averything, that information and paperwork was taken out. of 3 this. plan and copied and distributed to the public works 4, departments for work records. 5 Q Who took it out of the plan? 6 A (Clark) I did. 7 Q And you gave.it to the.other departments? 8 A (Clark) I made copies of it and provided it.to 9 the other departments. i 10 Q And the other departments then use these forms?- 11 A' (Clark) Right, in order to keep track of how many 12 h6urs, how many overtime hours, how many equipment hours, 13 material costs. But-then again, I mean this is a -- that's 14 a generic form that's in here, too. Well, I'm not going to (} l 15 say 351 cities and towns use -- 16 MS. O' MALLEY : Excuse me, Your Honor. J l 17 THE WITNESS: (Clark) -- for fear of being told ] i 18 that I don't know what I'm talking about. 19 MS. O'MALLEY: Could Mr. Clark state the page that 20 he is referring to. j 21 THE WITNESS: (Clark) It would be in Annex J. It 22 would be 148 and 149 which are both the same. 150, 151, l 23 152, 153 and 154 -- one more, 155 and some individual ones 24 that weren't in here, weren't part of this plan that we made 25 up ourselves because we didn't like these. O erita,e a gorein, corporation (202) 628-4888 _-_-_----_________J e I CIARK - CROSS '16863 '1 BY MR.. TURK:. -2' Q Alco you were' examined a 1ittle bit-today about ~ 3 'the American' Red Cross. Do I understand'your' testimony. 4 . correctly to be'that the American Red Cross officials-have

5-indicated that.if they have to' augment ltheir own personnel 6

resources from other chapters they,would do that and would '7: be'able to do that? 8' A (Clark).Through seminars:I have been at, yes. .9 They understand what we have been' told.when we have-like 10 civil defense. directors meetings and training on an area-11 wide basis. 12 Q So American Red Cross officials have told you.that 13-if necessary they could augment -- . Clark).Right. Supplies - you know, supplies, ( ? -14 A-g 15 . resources'and personnel. 16 Q Are you familiar with any American Red Cross i 17 operations outside of your own town or local area? Let me 18 get to the point. Do you know whether in fact.American Red-19 Cross has in fact done just that in other emergencies around 20 the country where a local chapter needs additional resources 21 they augment from cr'eide? [. 22 A (Clark) Dow 1 south, you know, I have seen it 23 happen. 24 Q Sc, you have no recson to doubt their 25 representation that that's what they would do if necessary? O ienee Reporein. Corge aeien (202) 628-4888 f CLARK - CROSS 16864 1 A (Clark) No, I've got some doubt. I have,seme f~;) 3 R 2 doubt. As far-as-the Commonwealth of Massachusetts'is L 3 concerned, okay. I've had particular experiences with'the 4 Red Cross. I had the night of the fire at the Johnson 5 Matthew plant in Seabrook which I wound up helping 6 coordinate the effort up there that night along.with Norm j i 7 Brown the Civil Defense Director from the Town of Seabrook. 8 We moved people to the dog track. I wound up manning that 9 placs all night long because X chapter could not provide or 10 didn't provide people. 11 I've got a serious problem with the Red Cross in 12 our area as'far as available personnel. But that does not 13 say that I'm an expert if they are able to provide them, /~T 14 they could get them from other places. I have no knowledge U 15 of that, that's not my expertise. 16 Q You just had some trouble on that one occasion? 17 A (Clark) More than one occasion. Same reason like 18 I stated during the hurricanes or whatever, that I have to 19 augment the personnel to run the shelters. 20 Q Do you know in those occasions if the American Red 21 Cross Chapter determined whether or not it was necessary for 22 them to augment? 23 A (Clark) They determined, they just weren't l-24 available people. 25 Q They determined they needed to augment? L O rie 9-eerei 9 co ror eie-(202) 628-4888 \\ 1 l l l 1 n -- g. CLARK" CROSS: - 16865- -1 A1 (Clark). Most of the~ incidents I have been' In 2 involved in, not regarding the Seabrook. incident that night 3 _that1I, you know, addressed, was their. area-wide emergency. Ofs 4 Hurricane-Gloria ripped everything right'up through the 5. Commonwealth of Massachusetts on,the eastern seaboard:andLup lt 6 through the Connecticut river valley.1 7 So,-you know, the resources were taxed quite-E 8' heavily during that. 'And what'it was was.as need basis Ih, 9 whichever community required the personnel because of 10 injuries, homeless or whatever or displaced people.- That 11 makes a priority dispatch. 12 Q So in that instance there was a prioritization in 13 process that"may have affected how many -- ]} 14 A (Clark) Not that directly^ satisfied me.. L 15 Q But that's what you believe-American Red _ Cross was. L i 16 doing? 17 A (Clark) _Right. Under their rules. 18 Q-Prioritizing? 19 A (Clark) And their response plan. Their decieion. 20 Q They were prioritizing their distribution of l 21 personnel? 22 A (Clark) Correct. a' 23 MR. TURK: I have nothing further, Your Honor. 24 25 h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 1^ i.,. CLARK - REDIRECT -16866 1 REDIRECT EXAMINATION iil 2 BY MR. DIGNAN: 3 Q Mr. Clark, I have been advised that you are, amongj 4' .other things,.the Chairman of the' North Shore Civil Defense 5 Director's Association; is that correct? 6 A '(Clark) I am the vice President of.the North h ~ L 7-Shore Civil Defense Council. 8 Q What is that organization? ( 9 A (Clark) .It's a mutual aid group.that consists of ' 10 approximately- -- I have to question my assistant 9 11-communication officer'real quick. 30? Approximately 30 ~ 12 communities. It keeps growing. We have expanded so-much in 13 the past couple of years it's unbelievable. 14 Q And are the members of the organization civil 15 ' defense directors.like yourself? - 16 A (Clark) ~No. What it is it's a coordinating' group 17 for mutual aid equipment: lightinc units; command.posti-18 personnel. Anybody that's a member of civil defense in any j, 1 19 coemunity that belongs to the association is part of the [ v: [ 20 group. 21 Q And you are the vice president of this 22 organization? 23 A-(Clark) Correct. 24 Q Elected from its membership at large? 25 A (Clark) Right. There just hasn't been an h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 c---________-___ T%@f f ", l y,Y [ T CLARK - REDIRECT- '16867- .1 . election involved, this hasn't in four years.- I must be. -2: doing a-good job. .{ g. -3; (Laughter) 4 - BY MR. DIGNAN: J 5 Q Maybe you'll'get promoted? E 6 ,A. '(Clark) I don't want to be promoted, I've got 7 'enough headaches now. Under examination by Mr.. Turk he discussed with 8 Q J 9 you briefly some'of the impediments to going forward with 10 some of the2 activities you wanted to in planning. t-11 Again, because I am sensitive to the position you 12 are in, if this question -- for any reason to answer this l 4 i 13., question.would cause you'to believe you were violating.any. _l l L. 14 law or. oath you have taken just tell me and I'll rephrase it '7'15 or withdraw. But I got the distinct impression from ) i 16 listening to your testimony that it was your view that k 17' setting aside radiological emergencies completely,-that what l 18 has occurred in Amesbury has resulted in the safety of the 19 citizenry at large being less in an emergency situation than 20' otherwise might be or should be the case were you allowed to I 21 plan. Is that a fair statement? 22 A (Clark)' That would be my personal feeling. I 23 Q Yes, your personal judgment? 24 A (Clark) My personal judgment, right. 25 Q And is it also your professional judgment? O emitasm Re,orein, Co,oratio-(202) 628-4888 7-g d 1 CLARK - REDIRECT 16868 '1. A-(Clark) I.would have to say,.yes. ,77 j .~ 2 MR. DIGNAN:- That's all I have,.Your Honor. 3 Oh, I had one other. question.- I 4 BY MR.-DIGNAN: 5- .Q-Have you ever - -and again the same restriction to-6 my questions -- in.the course;of your dealing with what has 7 been referred.to as impediments, has it ever been suggested 8 to_you that.one reason you were not'to go forward with .9: planning. activities was to protect the position of the Town. 10 of Amesbury in litigation before the Nuclear' Regulatory 11 Comraission? 12 A (Clark) I would have to go back and think about 13, -how the' article was worded and what was passed down from the 14' manager to.the department heads and I can't recall 15 specifically what -- we were all notified directly after the '16 November 1985 town meeting, all the individual department 17 heads, that we were not to cooperate by order of town 18 meeting in any form or plan or anything like that. 19 I've seen so much mail pass by my. face in the past 20 couple of years. It's hard for me to recall if it was ever 21 directly put to me that way. 22 MR. DIGNAN: That's all I have, Your Honor. 23 JUDGE SMITH: Well, how does your question differ 24 from the similar question by Mr. Turk? 25 MR. DIGNAN: If there was a similar question I O eries e agerein, Corgeratien (202) 628-4888 CLARK - REDIRECT 16869-1 apologize, I did not hear it if there was.

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JUDGE SMITH: As I understand it, you were 3 informed that you were to stop planning in any way that 4 would assist the licensdag of Seabrook. Did you understand 5 that the licensing of Seabrook was involved? 6 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Oh, definitely. I mean, 7 that was the gist of the article for town meeting. 8 ' JUDGE SMITH: That was actually stated in the 9 article? 10 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Yes. 11 MR. DIGNAN: I'm sorry, Your Honor. Your Honor, I 12 didn't respond. The difference between that line of Mr. 13 Turk's and my own was, I was not seeking -- I understood 14 fully he had testified that assistance in licensing was to e. (' } 15 avoided. But the way I. phrased my question at least went 16 to, I was interested in finding out whether it was directly 17 said to him that the positions before this agency, i.e., I 18 before this Board would be jeopardized by such planning as 19 opposed to general assistance in the licensing effort. That 20 was the distinction I meant to draw in my own mind. 21 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Wait a minute, run that one 22 by me again. ( 23 JUDGE SMITH: Well, that's all right. i 24 MR. DIGNAN: Because you said you didn't know. i 25 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I was hoping I didn't say, () Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 i '16870 ,l yes,*to that one. 2 MR. DIGNAN: No, you didn't. i 3 THE WITNESS: (Clark)' Good. 4 JUDGE SMITH: Well, what did you say just now? 5 What was your concern about saying, yes, to'that one? 6 THE WITNESS: (Clark) My concern was whether or i 7 not_anything had been put to me, you know, either through a 8 meeting _with -- I didn't really understand exactly whathe 9 mesnt. I would just as soon leave it. 10 JUDGE SMITH: Just you did not understand? 11: THE WITNESS: (Clark) Correct. -12 JUDGE SMITH: But.I want to pursue another point. 13 I understand that you said that you wore in a' difficult-14 position in Amesbury. But now you' re under ' oath in a 15 federal proceeding duly constituted by statute. You have as 16 much obligation to be fully forthcoming in the interest of 17 the public health and safety in this proceeding, in my view, 18 as any other responsibility in your life. 19 Do you agree with me?- 20 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Yes, I do. 21 ' JUDGE SMITH: Now is there anything that you 22 haven't stated that you want to state? 23 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Well, the only thing it 24 gets back to is like, you know, in his line of questioning 25 before, if anything has ever been specifically addressed O rie 9-rarei 9 career tie-(202) 628-4888 '168711 1 that would go back towards the plant. And I testified to O 2 before,.as far as some of the requests for training that we: j .1 3 have done'either with radio drills or combination drills 4 with the North Shore Civil Defense Council that the Board-of 5 ' Selectmen' halted on at the last minute or whatever because 6 they felt that there was a possibility there would be a 7 conflict used towards showing the town's ability to respond. 8 JUDGE SMITH: With respect to the licensing of. 9 Seabrook? 10 .THE WITNESS: .(Clark) Basically, yes. 11 JUDGE' SMITH: That's the conflict you referred,to? 12 'THE. WITNESS: (Clark) Right. 13 JUDGE COLE: Mr. Clark, just one or.two questions.' -14 EXAMINATION BY JUDGE COLE 15 JUDGE. COLE: It appears obvious to me that the 16 restriction on planning has had an effect on your ability to 17 perform your duties as a civil defense director; do you 1 18 agree with that, sir? 19 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I haven't been completely 20L caught with-my pants down yet or anything like that during 21 an incident. But, yes, it has -- it's jeopardized somewhat 22 as far as a lot of things we should do. 23 JUDGE COLE: Considering the very nature of civil l-l. 24 defense work, preparation for an emergency or a disaster so 25 that you are ready when something happens to protect the O rie 9-eereias coreor tia= (202) 628-4888 n 16872 1 ~public' health'and safety. And considering.the' fact that ~ '0 1 2 ' planning.is a good part of that,'let me first say,.do you 3 agree with that,.~ sir, that planning is a good part of your-4 job? 5 THE WITNESS: (Clark) .Oh, definitely. 6 Definitely. 7 JUDGE COLE: -With this restriction on. planning, 8 sir, is it your' opinion that it will become increasingly 9 more difficult for you to do your: job in~ protecting the. 10 public health and safety? 11 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I have concerns for it' 12 every day. 13 ~ JUDGE COLE:- All right, sir,ithank you~. But.I 1 14 don'.t.know whether you answered my question. 15 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I worry about it each and 16 every day that the restrictions, yes, some day. Let's hope 17' not, the. day might come'that because we didn't, that there 18 .could be problems. 19 JUDGE COLE: If you continue on in the present 20~ mode of operation, will it become increasingly more 21 difficult for you to perform your duties? -22 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Oh, I would have to say, .23. yes, definitely. 24 JUDGE COLE: All right, sir, thank you. 25 O

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p 16873 g. ' [Y 1 EXAMINATION BY. JUDGE McCOLLOM. l p V. 2 JUDGE McCOLLOM: Mr. Clark,.sometime back in the 3 hearing you made a statement about the number of people in 4' .your' organization and I think you said something like, you I '5 had six or seven and now you have 30, 1Nhat.were you

6

' speaking of, what kind'of an organization are you speaking 7 of when you called.those' numbers out? What do they do? 8 THE WITNESS: (Clark) .The six and seven-I was-9 speaking about is my immediate staff which involves the 10 assistant director; two deputy directors;' communications-11 officer; public information officer; and assistant 12-communications officer. 13 JUDGE McCOLLOM: Now, are they part-time, too, 14 like you? \\ 15' THE WITNESS: (Clark) I am.the only paid employee 16 for civil defense in the Town of Amesbury. The rest of them 17 are completely volunteers, receive no money whatsoever. 18 JUDGE McCOLLOM: So they have other tasks, jobs? 19 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Correct.

2 0.

JUDGE McCOLLOM: But they are people that are in 21 your organization? 22 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Correct. 23 JUDGE McCOLLOM: Now, tell me about the 30? 24 THE WITNESS: (Clark) The rest of them involve -- 25-we have a very, very unique group in Amesbury that. I Heritage Reporting Corporation \\s / (202) 628-4888

7 16874 1 have-oneLof the largest' civil defense groups on the North 3Q~ q 2 ' Shore. I also.have quite a bit of equipment. We run two 3 emergency lighting units. We run a mobile command post. Of 4 course we'have one of the best' emergency operation centers 5 in the area or at least'we feel'we do. A lot of other 6 people agree with us. 7 In order to be able to provide -- we provide 8-mutual aid-also. 9 JUDGE ~McCOL7.OM: Those 30. people -- .j 10 THE WITNESS: (Clark)-.Those people make up:three 11 squads which have sergeants.and corporals that run them and 12

other people are.part of the squads but we also -- I mean, I 13 have a normal staff.

Now, namely, if-I push the button 14 tonight and regr9st my people to respond, I am guaranteed 15 and I feel -- I mean, we prove it every time we get called 16 out at least 20 people are going to show up. 17 JUDGE McCOLLOM: Now that brings me to an i 18 emergency. You have an organization and you have had f.- L 19 training - you have trained the people and you have 20 something which we have gone through in great detail this l~ 21 afternoon which helps in this situation, but obviously it l 22 isn't the kind of plan that you, I think, wished you had. .23 Just don't worry about whether it's Seabrook, but 24 do you feel like that if you had an emergency now that you 5 are prepared to assist in that -- in the handling of the 2 O rie 9-9 rei-9 corre et - (202) 628-4888

16875 1 emergency to improve significantly or some or what over if (~)' 2 you did not have this plan? If you did not have your civil 3 service organization? 4 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Depending upon the incident ' i I 5 -- I mean, we are lucky in the Town of Amesbury. We've got, 6 like I stated before, we've got a great fire department, 1 7 great police department, great public works department, and 8 we have the ability to work together when an emergency takes 9 place. The department heads are very cooperative amongst 10 themselves. 11 And because of the enhancement of the civil 12 defense program over the past four years, like I stated 13 before, we started out with six guys and I can remember when 14 the old horn went off I would be happy if two guys would 15 show up to drive the one truck we've got. Now it's much 16 different. 17 JUDGE McCOLLOM: Now I would like to take it one 18 step further. I understand what you've been saying about 19 the town meeting and the directions from the Board and from 20 the manager. And I understand how apparently this got into 21 this situation. 22 If we were to have a licensed plant of Seabrook, 23 and if there were an emergency, do you think that your team 24 and your various departments would respond in a similar l 25 manner? t Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

CLARK - RECROSS 16876. .c 11 THE WITNESS!- (Clark)' I can't answer that on a 2 per person basis. My people, okay, I put my people through 3 a situation at Seabrook at that Johnson Matthew fire, 15 of 4 them, and they didn't turn around and run, okay.

Granted, 5

'you know, it was a little while before we knew it.was over 6 there and we took protective actions to protect'them. 7 But I could state right now, I can depend on my 8 people, but I can't guarantee anything as far as the other 9 departments are concerned. I mean,.I know how I would 10 respond. 11 JUDGE McCOLLOM: Thank you. 12' MS..TALBOT: Your Honor, could I ask one more 13 question -- one or two? 14 JUDGE SMITH: All right. 15 RECROSS-EXAMINATION 16 BY MS. TALBOT: 17 Q Mr. Clark, you're a member of Local Emergency 18 Planning Committee / is that right, in your' town? 19 A (Clark) For Title III? 20 Q Right? 21 A (Clark) I'm supposed to be the chairman. 22 Q The chairman? 23 A (Clark) Right. 24 0 Have you ever felt impeded in any way or 25 threatened or has anyone ever made it known to you whether O rie 9-a roreias corror eioa (202) 628-4888

I ( CLARK - RECROSS 16877 L (~% 1 verbal, oral,' psychological or otherwise that you would ~ 2 somehow be prevented from planning for SARA Title III? l 3 A (Clark) I had a cover letter and everything all 4 made up in regards to it that was taken over for approval to 5 be sent out to the other people that I wanted on the. l 6 committee. And I had contact with a lot of the other 7 representatives that were going to serve on it from the 8 industry, hospital, news media. I made all the preparations 9 under law, under my obligations, and then asked to move 10 forward with it. 11 No, not at this time. 12 Q Who is responsible for completing your local 13 emergency response plan with you for SARA? I'm sorry, go /^ 14 ahead. ( 15 A (Clark) All the department heads: police; fire; 16 public works; representative from the Board of Selectmen; 17 there's a requirement for your State Senator; your State 18 Representative; somebody from EMS; somebody from the 19 hospital; from the Department of Public Health. 20 Q I unde rstand that, okay. I'm wondering why there 21 are other towns L.Tt were able to comply with, you know, the 22 deadlines for SARA but somehow, you know, you feel like you 23 weren't able to go ahead? 24 A (Clark) Like I say, just what I've been told. 25 There's a lot of this that, you know, there's a lot of this h Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

CLARK - RECROSS .16878 1 that isn't in writing. I mean, it has been stated. It was Q- .2 in my annual report to the. Board of Selectmen.. 3 Q-But isn't the responsibility for SARA planning on~ 4 you as the chairman for the local emergency.-- 5 A (Clark) I was appointed by the state because the 6 ' town refused to submit back and form a committee on their-7 own. 8 Q So isn't the responsibility on you as the 9 chairman? 10 MR. DIGNAN: I object to this line to this 11 witness : -- 12-MS. TALBOT: No, - Mr. Dignan, no. Mr. Dignan, I'm 13 merely trying to show the Board -- .m 14 JUDGE SMITH: I'm sure that this can be clarified.

(/

15 in a moment. If the Town of Amesbury wants this witness to 16 . aggressively plan under SARA or any other program I would 17 expect.that they must know there is confusion now and they 18 could do it without delay and we don't have to worry about 19 this. 20 As you see, the Board doesn't have much patience 21 for the situation we're hearing now. 22 MS. TALBOT: I'm through, Your Honor. Thank you. 23 MS. O' MALLEY : Your Honor, may I just ask a couple 24 of questions of the witness? 25 JUDGE SMITH: Yes. Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

CLARK - RECROSS 16879' R A MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Your Honor. \\. 2 RECROSS-EXAMINATION 3 BY MS. O'HALLEY: 4 -Q Mr. Clark, the:1985. town meeting vote and'the i 5-Board of Selectmen directive that followed from that vote ~ 6 prohibited you from' planning having'to do with Seabrook; is .7 that correct? i 8 A (Clark) Correct. 9 Q. It did not prohibit you from other planning;-isn't 10 that correct? 11 A (Clark). Right. As the vote read at town meeting. l 12 Q And it's your interpretation that there may have 13 been limits placed on some of your planning - yottr. 1 14, interpretation of the Board of Selectmen's -- 0-15 JUDGE SMITH:- Well, let's clarify it right now. 16 Let's clarify it right now. Mr. Lord is sitting there and j 17 he knows this. Is he allowed without restraint to engage.in ] i 18 emergency planning? Are you authorized to represent your 19 city? I know one time you were. l 20 MR. LORD: Yes, I am. 21 MR. DIGNAN: Mr. Lord is no longer a member of the l 22 Board of Selectmen; is that correct? 23 MR. LORD: I am not longer a member of the Board. I 24 JUDGE SMITH: He's a special employee authorized 25 by the town to come to this hearing, as I understand it, and . l] Heritage Peporting Corporation (20' ) 628-4888 2 i i I_ I 1

I: l CLARK - RECROSS 16880 1 1 represent their position. O-2 MR. LORD: -Yes. Under general laws there's a j 3. provision called "Special municipal employee" and I was 4 . appointed to that title for.these purposes. 5 The town meeting vote Novertsr 18,. 1985 6 specifically stated Seabrook.. It didn't say planning in L, I 7 general. l 8 The-one single case that I think I can point to 9 about planning is the SARA Title III because it's the only. 10 ,one that had to take part. The town manager knowing the 11 pressure that was being put on Mr. Clark from the state and. 12 higher' levels and all.to complete the job plus just the work 13 load he knew Richard would be facing came to me and asked me 14 if I would serve on the committee as the selectmen's 0, 15 representative and I said I would. And I have yet to be 16 notified of any meetings that would take place. And 17 therefore, I haven't done anything in it. 18 But I know, you know, my concurrence was that I 19 would be willing to work on the SARA III committee. 20 Obviously I would be aware that this was not a conflicting 21 issue with the town meeting vote or the Board of Selectmen's 22 position. 23 24 25 y Q Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 623-4888 i y 2

.c CLARK - RECROSS 16881 1: THE WITNESS:- (Clark)'.And to go further on that: O 2 .just'so;everybody understands, yes,:I know that you are, 3 .because you were still on the-board at'the' time and Michael 4~ had.gade mention of'the fact that you offered to do it. But 5 then'again it comes back.to that'I; requested only;for my own .6. benefit;something from the board, because of.-- and it's 7 going'to come up now, Bill, I'm sorry. 8 MR. LORD:' I don't know what you mean. 9. LTHE WITNESS: (Clark) That you questioned'the 10 evacuation portion of doing that planning, and I told'the' ~11 manager that I would be no part of a Mickey Mouse plan for 12 Title III unless I'was'able to do it the way it was intended 13 to be done. And'I have got no direction from the Board of 14 ~ Selectmen since, and that's why the plans aren'.t done. 15 MR. LORD: Nell, I can't speak for the Board ofL 16 Selectmen as it sits today. I>have not been a member j. -17 since -- l. j 18 THE WITNESS: (Clark) But you were on the board 19; at the time that I requested a direction from the board. l l 20 MR. LORD: I was on the board, and I volunteered 21 to be on the committee with you,-Richard. 22 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Correct. 23 MS. O'MALLEY: Just one more question, Your Honor. 24 BY MS. O'MALLEY: 25 Q Mr. Clark, has your budget gone up every year for Q Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

'1 CLARK - RECROSS 16882 1-the last'few years? 2. .A (Clark).' Substantially. 3-MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you. l 4 JUDGE SMITH: I'm still not ' satisfied. Now,. you j 5~ two people sitting. at that table 'are aut;horized to represent 6 the Town of Amesbury in this proceeding..And you are 7 eliciting questions which would invite the Boarci to believe 8 that this witness simply hasn't understood the situation. 9 -He has indeed been free to do whatever he wanted to do in. 10 planning except for -- in strict compliance with the action-11 of.the town meeting. 12 Is that.your representation to us? 13 MR. LORD: I'm a little confused about your .14 _ question.. If you could repeat it.

Again, I' m just --

15 JUDGE SMITH: You are inviting questions now wh'ich 16 would invite the Board to believe that this witness hasn't 17 really understood the situation; that he has in fact been 18 unshackled in doing emergency planning with the exception of 19 strict compliance with the limited restrictions put upon him 20 by the action of the town meeting. 21 Now, I want to know if that's your representation 22 to the Board, this Board sitting here, that that is the 23 case. 24 Are you leading the Board in the direction of l 25 accuracy and truth by this questioning now, or are you l O rie 9-rei 9 care ei - (202) 628-4888

CLARK'- RECROSS 16883 1 jerking us.around?- r 2 MR. LORD:.Your Honor, I have been; involved in 3 this a long time. And I think you know well that I am not 4 in here to jerk anyone around, and,that I take the .) 5 responsibility very seriously. 6 JUDGE SMITH: Well, we are having a hard time '7 figuring out now just how the Town of Amesbury stands. 8 MR. LORD: The Town.of Amesbury came here:today 9 because Mr. Dignan has subpoenaed Mr. Clark and his plan,. 10 the plan that I didn't see until last Saturday.- 11 JUDGE SMITH: Why is~that?- 12 MR. LORD: Why? 13 JUDGE SMITH: Yes. 14 MR. LORD: Because as Mr. Clark testified, he had 15-never' offered this to the Board.of Selectmen.. There was 16 mention of a town meeting article. 17 JUDGE SMITH: Did you have any curiosity about it? 18 MR. LORD: I didn't know it existed. 19 JUDGE SMITH: You didn't know it existed. 20 MR. LORD: I did not know that this plan existed. 21 JUDGE SMITH: And you have been following this 22 hearing all this time. 23 MR. LORD: As Mr. Clark stated, he worked on this 24 with the state, made certain revisions on his own in working 25 with the state. And I think he made it very clear that he O rie e-e

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I l I CLARK - RECROSS 16884-1 -did not -- i C:) 1 2' MR. DIGNAN: You did not produce that document to 3 Ropes & Gray. The Town of Amesbury's lawyers produced that 4 document to Ropes & Gray. That's how we got it. -5 JUDGE SMITH: It may very well be, Mr. Dignan, 6 that you have misunderstood Amesbury all this time. 7 MR. DIGNAN: Oh, yes, well. 8 MR. LORD: I don't think so, Your Honor. The 9' witness ~has -- 10 MR. DIGNAN: It's always possible, Your Honor. I 11 often' misunderstand things. 12 JUDGE SMITH: That they just never -- 13 MR. DIGNAN: But I doubt it. ~ 14-MR. TURK: Your Honor, Mr. Clark may have (~)'g 15 something he wishes to enlighten us with about this matter. 16 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I tell you, I'm really 17 getting frustrated here, and I'm really starting to -- 18 JUDGE SMITH: You are here under subpoena. You 19 are required to answer these questions. 20 THE WITNESS: (Clark) I understand that. 21 JUDGE SMITH: If you have heat from that, we can't 22 protect you except that you are, in my view, under legal 23 obligation, subject to perjury, to tell the truth, and under 24 the Board's direction, to be completely forthcoming. 25 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Well, maybe it's come to O rie 9-earei 9 corre eio-(262) 628-4888

CLARK' RECROSS 16885' 1- -the point'now that I'm' finally going to get my chance to~say '2' something.that I haven't-said all along, and I'll suffer the 3 consequences for it. 4 You were aware.of this plan because it was brought L 5-up and discussed during the committee hearing when we had 6-the committee for the Seabrook plans, because my opposition .7 - to.the town meeting-vote in November of ' 85 was - that you 8 would screw this up for me, and'I specifically said that the lg 9 night of the vote of that committee when it was a five to -10 one vote'to recommend to the Board of Selectmen not to go 11 for the Seabrook planning. -12 MR. DIGNAN: May the record reflect the witness-13 was pointing to Mr.' Lord during those' remarks. 14 JUDGE SMITH:. I don't know how far we want to 15 pursue this this evening. 16 MR. LORD: It's up to you. 17 JUDGE SMITH: But I think that we have here from 18 the Town of Amesbury, as far as I can see, a less than 19 forthright complete position. 20 MR. LORD: I take objection with that word. 21 JUDGE SMITH: All right. Would you like to 22 testify in this case? 23 MR. LORD: I think that in discussion with counsel 24 we will be looking at offering rebuttal testimony. 25 JUDGE SMITH: Okay. Anything further this evening Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

CLARK - REDIRECT-16886' 1; with this witness? o, ~ 2 MR. TURK: I have just some brief follow up to 3 Judge McCollom's questioning, Your Honor;.very brief. i 4 MR. DIGNAN: I have ons question. 5' FURTHER REDIRECT EXAMINATION 6 BY MR. DIGNAN: 7 -Q Mr. Clark, I'am sure you can answer.this and I-8 just.wantit to.be in the record. 9 The Amesbury town meeting, by the way, is not an 10 .open town meeting. It's a representative town meeting. 11- 'A (Clark)- Correct. 12 Q Is.that correct? 13 A (Clark)- Correct. .14 Q Meaning that the meeting consists of members who. -15' are elected from the electorate at large and come to'moet as 16 the town meeting. 17 A (Clark) They are elected by precinct, correct. 18 Q And the distinction between that and a town such 19 as I'm in is an open town meeting is where any voter can go 20 and vote. 21 A (Clark) Correct. 22 Q So the vote of the town we're talking about is the 23 vote of those elected town meeting members, the majority 24 thereof; is that correct? 25 A (Clark) Correct. >O it e- =*i 9 c et - (202) 628-4888

CLARK - RECROSS 16887 1 JUDGE SMITH: Anything further? i 2 MR.-TURK: Yes, Your Honor. 3-JUDGE SMITH: :Mr. Turk, yes. 4~ RECROSS EXAMINATION '5 BY MR. TURK: 6 Q Just for clarification, Mr. Clark, Judge McCollom 7 ~had asked'you'a series of. questions about your current 8 . staffing, and I believe it was his.. impression that you have 9

30. persons now.

I may have misheard you, but-I thought I. 10 heard you say earlier that_you have 50.

11 A

(Clark) ~Well, like I say, I didn't get to 12 finishing the question for him. That we are in the process 13 now of revising our staff listing. We have what we consider full-time volunteers that are available.all the time, and we 14 15 ' have people that. are. reserves that are there I'd say 75 16 percent of the time. We run a very different organization 17 than a lot of other departments do; that we provide this 18 mutual aid response with these units. I mean, we go to 19 Haverhill fires. We go all over the place as part of the 20 county group. 21 But as far as the EOC portion of it's concerned, a 22 lot of times when we activate it requires'a-lot of our 23 additional personne1'such as amateur radio operators, and 24 these people. With the exception of one or two that are on 25 the general staff such as my communications people, they are Q 5eritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 7

i CLARK - RECROSS 16888 1 only there on a part-time basis. They come in on a monthly-l 2 basis to do the radio drills with the state and wi'th the 3 county group. They come in for training sessions, and they 4 come in when the EOC is activated for-any long duration 5 period or specific town events such as Amesbury Days and 6 things like that. So I mean they are not there for every 7 response. I 8 But if you sat down and you looked at the roster 1 9 of how many people are officially signed up, it'would be 10 close to being 50 people. 11 Q Okay. Also you indicated that you have one of the 12 largest civil defense organizations on the North Shore. 13 Does that. include the Towns of Salisbury, Newbury, ys 14 - Newburyport, West Newbury? Are those towns in the North (. 15 Shore, or how could you define North Shore? 16 A (Clark) No, I was -- I was pertaining to my 17 individual organization, the Town of Amesbury. 18 Q Right. What's the North Shore? What towns are 19 considered to be included in that? 20 A (Clark) Well, it's hard to really say what -- I 21 mean it's like Cape Ann. It's the communities that belong 22 to this organization. I mean we go as far out as Burlington 23 to the west. We've gone as far south as Quincy to the 24 south. I'm the northern community, and then it runs right 25 down the coast. Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l l

p i:- r CLARK'- RECROSS 16889 1~ Q And what's the organization called? 5 2 A (Clark)'. North Shore Civil Defense Council. 3-Q- And does that North Shore Civil Defense Council i 4 include the Town,of West'Newbury? 5 A (Clark) .Yes, it.does. 6 Q The Town of Newbury? 7 A- -(Clark) Their civil defense is on the mailing. 8 . list, yes. 9 Q Newburyport? 10 A~ (Clark) Yes. 11 Q Amesbury, of course. 12-A- (Clark) Yes. 13 .Q ~ Salisbury? 14 A (Clark). Yes. 15 Q Merrimac? 16 A (Clark) No. 17 Q Not Merrimac? 18 A (Clark) No. 19 Q And you mentioned that you provided mutual aid. 20 Do all of these towns provide mutual aid to each 21 other within the council? 22. A (Clark) No, because they don't have -- not L 23 everybody has got equipment. They will provide personnel, ':2 4 but the majority of the organizations such as Newburyport 25 and Amesbury -- I mean, Newburyport, West Newbury, Newbury -Q Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

fl CLARK - RECROSS -16890 o 1 are.very, very small in staff. I mean they rely a lot upon O 2 our - you know, resources from the departments; namely, 3 pulling people in from the fire, police and everything else 4 to man their EOCs. 5 Q If those towns needed mutual aid then, your 6 resources and -- 7 A (Clark) Oh, definitely. 8 Q -- assistance would be available? 9 A (Clari) Yes, we've gone before; yes. 10 Q Also, when we were talking a little b!t about this 11 SARA Planning Committee, and you indicated that you had 12 proposed some steps forward and you were ready to move 13 forward and someone said, no, not at thic time; who was it 14 that said not at this time? 15 A (Clark) The town manager. 16 Q Did he indicate why? 17 A (Clark) He just felt that it wasn't appropriate 18 at the time considering what was taking place as far as the, 19 you know, Seabrook issues. 20 0 So you were prevented from going forward because 21 of the sense in the community that -- by the town 22 manager -- 23 A (Clark) Right. 24 0 -- that it might assist the licensing of Seabrook? 25 A (Clark) That had to be June of -- June of '88, I Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888

CLARK - RECROSS 16891 1-believe. June of -- I've got copies of letters in my /% 2 office. 3 Q And the reason was because moving forward with 4 your SARA planning efforts might be seen to help the ~ 5 licensing of Seabrook? 6 A Just the overall Amesbury issue. 7 JUDGE SMITH: Amesbury issue? 8 THE WITNESS:. (Clark) Right. Namely, everybody 9 worried about conflicts with the plan. 10 JUDGE SMITH: With what? 11 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Conflicts with plant 12 planning. 13 JUDGE SMITH: Plant planning? 14 THE WITNESS: (Clark) As far as the Seabrook 15 plans were concerned, or anything that could be construed 16 as. 17 BY MR. TURK: 18 Q In other words, just to nail it down, moving 19. forward with your SARA planning efforts might somehow help 20 license Seabrook. And for th.st reason, your efforts were 21 deferred. 22 A (Clark) I believe that's correct, yes. 23 MS. O'MALLEY: Just a couple of questions, Your 24 Honor. 25 O r** 9-a rer**== cere r tio= (202) 628-4888

f n' e CLARK - RECROSS. -16892 1-FUR"'HER RECROSS EXAMINATION O' 2' BY MS. O' MALLEY : 3 Q .That's your impression as to what'the town manager 4 meant? 5 A (Clark) Well, like'I say, there.is nothing -- a 6 lot of this isn't on paper. I mean a lot of this is. 7. comments from individual people and everything within town 8 government. 9 Q And it's the conclusions you have drawn from those 10 comments; is that'right, sir? 11 A (Clark) I mean a lot of references made by 12 members of the board, by the manager, you know, as to what-13 can be construed'and what might be construed, and what- .14 portions of it might be. 15 Q So it's not there is an absolute prohibition on L 16 planning for emergencies. 'It's just that -- 17 A (Clark) No, there isn't, no. Wo. still do - 18 planning within civil defense as far as -- I've got an 19 updated radio plan that I just did a couple of weeks.ago in 20 order to run the communications for the town. 21 Q And your budget has continued to increase over the 22 last several years; isn't that correct, sir? 23 A (Clark) It went up substantially once, 24 substantially twice, and got level funded this yerr. I 25 MR. TURK: If counsel will permit me, I hadn't Beritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4988 i L_______--.-__-_-_-____.-_

2 P" CLARK - RECROSS - 16893-(-. 1. 'quite' finished. 2 MS. O'MALLEY: Oh, I apologize. I-didn't realize 3 that you hadn'tl finished.' ~4-RECROSS EXAMINATION -(Continued) .5 BY MR. TURK 6 Q ~ One last question I had was,.you had mentioned-7 that -- I believe you said Mr. Lord had objected to the '8 evacuation planning portion of your SARA committee efforts. 9 could you explain what you mean by' evacuation 10 planning? 11 A (Clark) LAs part of the Title III plans as they-12 are supposed.'to be drawn up, there is what they call l l-13 facility profiles, et cetera, that; lay _out what's in the W 14 places, how big 'an area around each one of the facilities. p IV 15-would have to be set up for evacuation purposes, usually '16 like 2,000 immediate feet,'and it goes out and increases, 17 depending-upon the substances. And there must be plans made (; 18 within that that if'any of those facilities are anywhere l 19 near public schools, nursing homes, hospitals, people that j. 20 are mobility-impaired, anything that would require L 21 transportation or protective action or anything like that 22 would have to be addressed. 23 And, you know, I addressed -- I mean Bill and I, 24 Bill and I speak, and we spoke many times when things were 25 going on and he was still chairman of the board. And, you ,Q' Heritage Reporting Corporation (202) 628-4888 l 1 1

/t CLARK - RECROSS 16894 r l' .know, we had some serious reservations about'certain. things c 2 lup there,.and Bill was quite adamant about certain things 3 happening as far'as the plans were concerned, and he was 4 always offering suggestions ~of differant ways of doing. 5 things, and I just didn't agree'with him because I don't 6 feel he was an expert in it,'and.we've,_you know, 'we've had' 7 our differences and everything like that..But this is such 8 a broad issue as far as what has taken place over the past 9 couple of years, the things that-have been'said.. 10 JUDGE SMITH: I think you may have gone beyond the 11 question. In fact, I'm not real sure that you were as 12 responsive as you might have been to the question. 13 Are you sati1fied with the response? 14 MR. TURK:

Well, I. asked about evacuation Jgg

-15 planning, and Mr. Clark indicated that it had to do with 16-transportation -- 17 THE WITNESS: (Clark) It was that portion of it. 18 The true evacuation planning portion of the Title III plans; 19 namely, in the event that you had a chemical emergency. 20 JUDGE SMITH: How about those? 21 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Right. 22 JUDGE SMITH: What about those plans? What is 23 there about those plans in responso to Mr. Turk's question 24 that you wanted to say? 25 THE WITNESS: (Clark) That that was the questioned O

Herita,

= rein, c-rati-(202) 628-4888 1 L__-_-____

u CLARK - RECROSS 16895

()-.

1 portion'of the plans as far as addressing _the evacuation i 2 issue. 3 < JUDGE SMITH: Right. How does that relate to Mr. 4-Lord? 5 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Mr.-Lord was one of'the l 6 persons that' questioned it. 7 JUDGE SMITH: Questioned? 8 BY MR. TURK: 9 Q When you say " questioned",.you mean he objected to 10 doing evacuation planning? 11 A (Clark) Right. He was worried abcut that portion -12 of it. 13 JUDGE SMITH: Why? 14 BY MR. TURK: 15 Q Because he didn't want to engage in evacuation 16 planning? 17 A (Clark) I would -- 18 Q Or because there was,some part of that plan that 19 he thought could be improved somehow? Do you know? 20 A (Clark) No, I would -- you know, I would have to 21 assume that it was along with the, you know, problem'with 22 the plant plans as far as providing anything as far as the 23 power plant. I don't know. 24 Q In other words, you interpreted his problem as 25 being that he didn't want to do anything that might promote O rie 9-rorei-9 career eio-(202) 628-4888 l

. =. -._ p ' CLARK - RECROSS 16896: licensing or help licensing of Seabrook. l' - ' o. 2. A. (Clark) That's -- I mean that's my -- yes, that's-3; how-I feel,-that's what was the problem. 4 . JUDGE SMITH:. That's an inference that'you made, 5 but is'.there anything that'Mr.. Lord stated or'said? '6 TEX'MITNESS: (Clark) No. Like I say, we've had 7 numerous, numerous, numerous conversations, and, you know, l' 8 we've been.on both sides of the. issues, we've been together 9-on - is sues '. 10 JUDGE SMITH: Me are just interested in this one 11 particular narrow aspect. 12-THE WITNESS: (Clark). I know, but for me to -- 13 JUDGE SMITH: The record is confusing. 14 THE WITNESS: (Clark) For me to recall, I would' 15 have'to say,_no, nothing general that'I can recall. 16 JUDGE SMITH: All right. 17 MS. O'MALLEY: I think I just have one quest. ion. 18 Oh, I'm sorry. 19 MR. TURK: I am done. Thank you. 20 MS. O'MALLEY: I think I just have one question, 21 Your Honor. '22 FURTHER RECROSS EXAMINATION '23 BY MS. O' MALLEY : 24 Q Mr. Clark, you mentioned that there is a mutual 25 aid agreement between the civil defense directors of several O rie e-earei, career eio-(202) 628-4888

l L. q .9 CLARK - RECROSS 16897 '1 l' North Shore cities and town; is that correct? l I ) l 2 A (Clark) Yes,.there is. 1 3 Q And it's a sharingfof personnel and equipment ] I 4-that's generally agreed upon; is that correct? . k5 A. (Clamx) hant to repeat the last part?, 6 Q I'm sorry. 7 It> involves.the. sharing of personnel and equipment 8 in the case of an emergency. 9 A (Clark) Correct. 10 Q Is that sort of the gist of it? 11 A (Clark) Correct. 12 Q But in fact if there were a regional emergency 13 that. involved all of those cities and town, that aid would {. 14 really not be -- 15 A (Clark) Definitely limited. 16 Q -- able to be put in place. It's very-17 limited -- 18 A (Clark) Definitely limited, yes. 19 Q -- to'an emergency that would occur in a 20 particular town or two towns. 21 A (Clark) Right. You would have to utilize your 22 own equipment for your own benefit. I mean first come - 23 first serve is about what it amounts to. 24 MS. O'MALLEY: Thank you, Mr. Clark. 25 JUDGE SMITH: Mr. Clark, you are excused. And O - (202) 628-4888 .rie e-eerei, cereer ti -

r..f.

CLARK - RECROSS 16898' 1 .thank you very much'for coming, sir. -Q. 2-THE WITNESS: (Clark) Thank you. 3' JUDGE SMITH: ' Did you get paid for your subpoena?. '4 THE WITNESS: (Clark) Yes,' I'did. 5-JUDGE SMITH: One never knows. 6 (The witness was thereapon excused.) 7 JUDGE SMITH: Anything further this evening? 8 HR. TURK: Your Honor, ' one brief thing about-9- scheduling. 10 Ne received ~today a copy of the Mass AG's letter 11 of March 24th. We have not discussed this previously, as 12 the Board may know. I am'not certain that it's a realistic 13 projection of where we are. going to be going in the next few 14 weeks, and I' don't know whether we need to -- maybe counsel

J 15 can discuss this-tonight and come back to you.

16 ' JUDGE' SMITH: That's right. Ms. Talbot was 17 unaware of the Board's requirement that you'come to the 18 . Board with scheduling matters only when' consultation among 19 the parties fails to produce a schedula, and she's aware of I' 20 that now. 21 I think what might be in order is a formal meeting 22 to better plan the rest of the hearing, because you don't 23 seem to be having much communication on it. 24 Could I suggest that maybe after we adjourn that 25 you remain here tonight for a little bit and discuss meeting _O it e-ee ei, cere ei - (202) 628-4888 a

g y 1 CLARK'- RECROSS 16899 1 scheduling?. O' f. ~ 2 MS. TALBOT: Sure. 3 JUDGE SMITH:. All'right, is there anything further 4' this evening? 5 - What will be do' tomorrow then? Will Dr. Adler be .6 the lead-off witness? .j i 7 MR..DIGNAN: Does Dr. Adler come before or:after l B Chief Beeve rs? ;I just want to know who is leading. It 9 makes'no d.fference to us. 10 @t. FIERCE: If'you.were to tell me that you were ~ 11 going to take longer for Dr. Adler than for Chief Beevers, I 12 suppose I might opt that Chief Beevers go first. Why don't 13 we.just talk.about it, Tom, instead of doing this on the 14 record. 15 JVDGE SMITH:. Yes. But it's either one.. 16 MR. DIGNAN: It's up to you. We just want to know ~ ~ 17 which one of us is supposed to be -- 18 JUDGE SMITH: Okay. Anything further tonight 19 involving scheduling or witness sequence? 20 All right, we are adjourned until nine a.m. 21 tomorrow. 22 (whereupon, at 4:50 p.m., the hearing was 23 recessed, to reconvene at 9:00 a.m., Tuesday, March 28, 24 1989.) 25 !O rie e-e ei== c ei - (202) 628-4888 m___m__m__ ___._.__._m_ .m-__.m._ .__m_

n

i i

5.. CERTIFICATE ! - O. This-i's to certify that.the attached proceedings before the-- United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission in the matter of: Name:' Public. Service Company of New Hampshire, et al. (Seabrook Station, Units 1 and 2) Docket No: 50-443-OL-50 444-OL (Off-site Emergency Planning) Place: Boston, Massachusetts Date: M a r c h '2 7, 1989 were held as herein appears, and that this is the original transcript thereof for the file of the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission taken stenographically by me and, thereafter reduced to typewriting by me or under the direction of the court reporting company, and that the transcript is a true and accurate record of the foregoing proceedings. k /s/ (Signature typed) :. Donna L. Cook Official Reporter Heritage Reporting Corporation O HERITAGE REPORTING CORPORATION (202)628-4888

[ gh:n

1 March 27, 1980 x) l UNITED STATES OF AMERICA L

NUCLEAR REGULATORY. COMMISSION ATOMIC SAFETY-LICENSING DOARD 'In the Matter of Docket Nos.'50-433-OL PUBLIC SERVICE COMPANY OF 50-444-OL' NEW HAMPSHIRE, et al. Off-site Emergency Planning Issues. (Seabrook' Station, Units 1 and 2) TOWN OF AMESBURY'S PLAN FOR CROSS EXAMINATION OF RICHARD CLARK The Town plans to inquire into the following matters in its cross examination of Richard Clark. rw 1. -Authority / Scope of Duties d - Whether Mr. Clark had the authority to draft and' adopt any emergency plan on behalf of the Town. - Whether anyone other than Mr. Clark has accepted, authorized or adopted the plan. - Whether, in 1985, Clark was under obligation not to create sny plan for Seabrook. 2. Creation'of the Plan - Whether any Town officials other than Mr. Clark were involved in the creation of the plan. - How Mr. Clark created the plan. - His information sources. l

( .l ' - l' !,l < 1 Whether any other Town employees or officials ,q. k/' participated in or authorized the creation of the-plan. 3. The-specific deficiencies of the Plan. 1 1 - Lack-of accuracy. . Lack of specificity. .i Lack of applicability to Amesbury. - Inconsistency.both internal.and with existing facts-and L -law. (. F Respectfully submitted. Townof Amesbury. By its attorney, /$]&n1(WiMJD B2[rparaJ'. Saint Andre / J(rye M. O'Malley l Kopelman and Paige, P.C., Town Counsel 77 Franklin Street Boston, MA 02110 (617)451-0750 L l m 2 _ _ _ _}}