ML20210Q248
| ML20210Q248 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Braidwood  |
| Issue date: | 05/09/1986 |
| From: | Atomic Safety and Licensing Board Panel |
| To: | |
| References | |
| CON-#286-179 OL, NUDOCS 8605140014 | |
| Download: ML20210Q248 (185) | |
Text
ORIGINAL oV UN11ED STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION IN THE MATTER OF:
DOCKET NO:
50-456 OL 50-457 OL COMMONWEALTH EDISON COMPANY (Braidwood Station, Units 1 and 2)
O LOCATION:
KANKAKEE, ILLINOIS PAGES:
1701 - 1884 DATE:
FRIDAY, MAY 9, 1986
/[ 0 ]
0\\
g ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS, INC.
i Official Re;vrters 444 North Capitol Street l
860314oolg gg oo 56 Washington, D.C. 20001 PDR ADOC PDR (202)347-3700 l
T NATIONWIDE COVERAGE
1701
- O l
i 1
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA i
2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION i
3 BEFORE THE ATOMIC SAFETY AND LICENSING BOARD 4
__________________X 5
In the Matter of:
6
7 (Braidwood Station, Units 1
=
8 and 2)
__________________x i
9 i
10 Kankakee City Hall Council Chambers I
11 385 East Oak Street Kankakee, Illinois 60901 12 7 i
Friday, May 9, 1986 13.
14 The pearing in the above-entitled matter reconvened 15 at 9:00 A. M.
16 BEFORE:
17 JUDGE HERBERT GROSSMAN, Chairman 18 Atomic Safety and Licensing Board U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission i
19 Washington, D. C.
20 JUDGE RICHARD F. COLE, Member, Atomic Safety and Licensing Board 21 U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Washington, D. C.
4 22 JUDGE A. DIXON CALLIHAN, Member, 23 Atomic Safety and Licensing Board U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission 24 Washington, D. C.
( )
25 APPEARANCES:
,l 1
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 1
(312) 232-0262
1702 l
1 O i
1 On behalf of the Applicant:
1 2
MICHAEL I. MILLER, ESQ.
ELENA Z. KEZELIS, ESQ.
3 Isham, Lincoln & Beale Three First National Plaza 4
Chicago, Illinois 60602 5
On behalf of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission Staff:
1 STUART TREBY, ESQ.
7 ELAINE I. CHAN, ESQ.
j GREGORY ALAN BERRY, ESQ.
1 8
U.
S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission 7335 Old Georgetown Road j
9 Bethesda, Maryland 20014 10 On behalf of the Intervenors:
i ROBERT GUILD, ESQ.
11 DOUGLAS CASSEL, ESQ.
TIMOTHY WRIGHT, ESQ.
12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24
( )
25 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1703 l
(^)
1 EXHIBIT INDEX Marked Received Intervenors' Exhibits Nos.
2 29 and 30 1704 Intervenors' Group Exhibit No. 31 1704 3
Intervenors' Exhibit No. 29 1705 Intervenors' Exhibit No. 30 1706 4
Intervenors' Group Exhibit No. 31 1714 Intervenors' Exhibit No. 32 1760 1760 5
Applicant's Exhibit No. 1 1823 1840 6
WITNESS INDEX PAGE 7
IRVING DE WALD 2
CROSS EXAMINATION 8
BY MR. BERRY:
1761 I
9 BOARD EXAMINATION BY JUDGE GROSSMAN 1790 10 BY JUDGE COLE 1796 BY JUDGE CALLIHAN 1805 11 REDIRECT EXAMINATION 12 BY MR. MILLER:
1819 13 1
14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24
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25 Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
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1 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
The seventh day of hearing 2
is now in session.
3 We will resume with Mr. Guild cross examining Mr.
l 4
DeWald.
l.
5 MR. GUILD:
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
6 Good morning, Mr. DeWald.
f i
7 THE WITNESS:
Good morning.
}
8 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I have distributed 9
three documents that I would like to premark for-10 identification.
j 11 The first should be Intervenors' Exhibit 29 --
JUDGE GROSSMAN:
That's correct.
{ }
- 12 13 MR. GUILD:
-- for identification, and that's i
14 a document that is entitled " Weld Procedure Meeting -
15 8-22-84."
16 The second document I would ask you to mark Exhibit
]
17 30 for identification.
It.is a memo, DeWald to Puckett, 18
Subject:
NRC Finding on Weld Rod Control, 7-6-84."
19 And a third document I ask be marked as a group 20 exhibit for identification.
It is Exhibit 31.
21 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
So marked.
22 (The documents were thereupon marked 23
- Intervenors' Exhibits Nos. 29 and 30 24 and Intervenors' Group Exhibit No. 31
( )
25 for identification as of May 9, 1986.)
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1 BY MR. GUILD:
2 Q
Mr. DeWald, do you have those documents before you, sir?
4 3
A Yes, I do.
4 Q
Let me ask you to identify them.
5 The first document, marked Exhibit 29, is that 6
meeting minutes reflecting the meeting held to discuss i
7 the Nonconformance Report 3099 disposition, the NCR that 8
we had marked and received in evidence as Exhibit 28?
9 A
I believe it is.
10 Q
And you prepared those meeting minutes?
11 A
I did.
l
{ }
12 Q
And those are an accurate reflection of what transpired 13 at that meeting, are they not?
14 A
I believe they are.
l 15 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I move the 16 admission in evidence of Intervenors' Exhibit 29.
i l
17 MR. MILLER:
No objection.
18 MR. BERRY:
No objection.
f 19 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Received.
20 (Intervenors' Exhibit No. 29 for i
21 identification was thereupon 22 received into evidence as 23 Intervenors' Exhibit No. 29.)
24 BY MR. GUILD:
( )
25 Q
Mr. DeWald, the second document from you to Mr. Puckett, f
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
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1 dated 7-6-84, marked Exhibit 30 for identification, is 2
this a memorandum you sent to Mr. Puckett?
3 A
It is.
4 Q
On the subject of NRC observations regarding 5
deficiencies in weld rod control?
6 A
It is.
7 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I move the 8
admission of Exhibit 30 in evidence.
9 MR. MILLER:
No objection.
10 MR. BERRY:
No objection.
11 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Received.
( }
12 (Intervenors' Exhibit No. 30 for 13 identification was thereupon 14 received into evidence as
\\
15 Intervenors' Exhibit No. 30.)
16 MR. GUILD:
The last document is a group 17 exhibit; and I apologize to the Board and parties.
It's 18 not in sequential order and contains one or more 19 duplicate documents, papers that are already in 20 evidence.
21 If it is not objectionable, I would propose to put 22 it in in the form that it's in just to save some time 23 this morning.
24 BY MR. GUILD:
(
25 Q
Mr. DeWald, if I can lead you through this, please.
l Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 The top document is a September 12, 1984, memo from 2
Mr. Vogt, V-O-G-T, to you, to Mr. DeWald,
Subject:
Weld 3
Filler Metal Withdrawal.
i 4
Mr. Vogt is the Corporate Level 3 Weld Engineer?
5 A
Yes.
6 Q
And did you receive this document from Mr. Vogt?
l 7
A I did.
8 Q
The second document is an August 17, 1984, memo from Mr.
9 Puckett to Mr. Saklak, with a copy to QC Manager at the 10 bottom,
Subject:
Rod Slips.
11 Can you identify this document?
(]}
12 A
Yes.
13 Q
The third document is dated 9-17-84, from I. F. DeWald 14 to file, W. O. Puckett,
Subject:
Letter dated August 22, 15 1984.
16 And did you prepare this document?
17 A
I did.
18 Q
Can you identify the handwritings that appear on the 19 face of the document?
20 A
I can't.
21 Q
You cannot or can?
22 A
I cannot.
23 Q
All right, sir.
24 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, this document was
( )
25 made available to us in this form in discovery, and I am Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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i 1
not aware of whose handwriting it is.
2 It is not mine or this party's.
3 BY MR. GUILD:
4 Q
Now, do I understand correctly, Mr. DeWald, that that --
5 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Excuse me.
i i
6 Mr. Miller would like to consult with you.
7 MR. MILLER:
May I have just one second?
8 MR. GUILD:
Yes.
9 MR. MILLER:
Why don't you continue.
' 10 I am having a little bit of research into the 11 document done, but --
]
[ }
12 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
To. verify that these 13 markings were on there --
14 MR. MILLER:
Yes, sir.
i 15 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
-- when they were handed 16 over?
j 17 Okay, that's fine.
18 MR. GUILD:
Just for the information of the 19 parties, it refers to, on the third page, numbered items 4
20 27, 31, 26, for example.
21 I am not certain, but one might surmise that those l
22 were exhibit numbers in Mr. Puckett's Department of a
l 23 Labor Administrative Law Judge proceeding.
24 I know there were numbered exhibits of similar a
( )
25 number in that case.
i Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
i Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312)- 232-0262
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BY MR. GUILD:
2 Q
The next document, Mr. DeWald, your 9-17-84 memo, 3
entitled " Personal and Confidential, Worley Puckett -
4 90-day Evaluation Meeting," is this your and Mr. Seese's 5
minutes of that meeting?
6 A
Yes, it is.
7 Q
And are those minutes accurate and complete to the best 8
of your knowledge?
9 A
They review -- summarize the items that were discussed.
10 0
Are they an accurate summary of those matters?
11 A
I believe they are.
{ }
12 Q
The next document bears the date August 27, 1984; 13 meeting; Shamblin, CECO PCD; meeting agenda:
14
" Discussions were held concerning W. O. Puckett and 15 concerns addressed from various persons."
16 Are these meeting minutes prepared by you, sir?
17 A
Yes, sir.
18 Q
And do they accurately reflect what transpired at that 19 meeting?
20 A
I believe they do.
21 Q
Can you identify the handwriting that appears in the 22 margin of this document?
j 23 A
No, sir.
24 Q
The next two-page document has been previously
()
25 identified.
It's an August 15, 1984, memo received in Sonntao Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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evidence previously.
l 2
Similarly, the second -- the next document, 3
8-17-84, memo, the stop work involving NCR 3099 also 4
previously identified and in evidence.
5-
_The next page, Mr. DeWald, a Read & Reply Memo to 6
you from Mr. Puckett dated 8-13-84.
7 Did you receive such a Read & Reply from Mr.
8 Puckett?
9 A
I probably did.
F j
10 Q
Do you recall receiving it?
l 11 A
I believe I did.
Q
Subject:
Recommendations to stop work."
{ }
12 13 The next document is a Read & Reply Memo, dated 14 8-10-84, to I. DeWald from W. O. Puckett, "
Subject:
15 Weld Procedure 4.3.14 Rev 9-17-80," with your reply 16 dated 8-11-84.
17 Can you identify that document?
18 A
Yes, sir.
19 Q
Did you receive Mr..Puckett's Read & Reply and prepare a 20 response?
21 A
Yes, I did.
r 22 Q
Can you identify the handwritings that appear on the 23 bottom of the document?
i 24 A
I believe that's mine.
j
( )
25 Q
So those are your handwriting?
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1 A
Yes.
2 Q
All right, sir.
3 The next page -- I apologize, a rather poor copy, 4
but let's see if we can make it out.
5 8-24-84 memorandum, Read & Reply, to you from Mr.
6 Puckett; correct?
7 A
Correct.
8 Q
"Subj ect, QC vault. "
9 Would you follow along Mr. DeWald and see if I can 10 read this for the record.
i 11 "Irv, to complete the review that I have been
' {)
12 requested to do I will require unlimited access to the 13 QA vault and permission to remove any of the documents I 14 might require for the review.
Signed W. O. Puckett."
i 15 Does that appear to be the text?
t 16 A
It appears to be.
17 Q
AndSyour reply, " Jim, let Puckett have access to vault i
18 as he needs it.
He may have to take out some documents.
I 19 These shall be counted and returned the same day.
Irv 20 DeWald, 8-24"; correct?
21 A
Correct.
22 Q
The next document, August 22, 1984, memorandum from i
23 Puckett to DeWald, with handwritten notes.
l I
24 Can you identify this document?
( )
25 A
Yes.
i Sonntao Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 i
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1 Q
All right, sir.
Now, is this the 8-22 memo that Mr. Puckett sent to 2
3 you, where, among other things, he stated that, in his 4
judgment, you were dangerously close to -- dangerously 5
approaching a complete breakdown in our QC program?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
And this 8-22 memo from Mr. Puckett is the subject of an I
8 earlier document that we just identified, which was your 9
evaluation of that memo; correct?
10 A
Which document are you talking to, sir?
11 Q
I am looking at an earlier document in the same package,
' /~T 12 a 9-17-84 memo to file, W. O. Puckett, from DeWald,
\\_)
13
Subject:
Letter dated August 22, 1984, W. O.
Puckett?
14 A
Yes.
15 Q
Your 9-17 memo is an evaluation of Mr. Puckett's August 16 22nd memo?
17 A
I believe it is.
3 18 0
Can you identify the handwriting that appears at the 19 bottom of this copy of the August 22, 1984, memo from 20 Mr. Puckett to you?
21 A
That's mine.
22 Q
You placed that on there after you received the memo 23 from Mr. Puckett?
24 A
Yes.
( )
25 Q
Finally, Mr. DeWald, the last sheet in the package here, Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
I 171?
i
! ()
1 Ran April 15, 1984, memo from Puckett to Saklak,
Subject:
2 Rod Slips, with a copy to the QC Manager.
3 Can you identify that document?
4 A
That Mr. Puckett's.
5 Q
And did you receive a copy of it?
6 A
I believe I did.
7 Q
All right.
Now, there are some handwritings on this 8
document.
9 Can you identify that?
10 A
That's not mine.
11 Q
Do you know whose it is?
I
{ }
12 A,
The one on the right-hand margin -- the one on the 13 left-hand margin I don't know who that is.
14 The right-hand margin is T. D. Vogt, where he 15 changed the date.
16 Q
I see.
j 17 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I would move the 18 admission in evidence of Exhibit 31, Group Exhibit 31.
19 MR. MILLER:
No objection.
20 MR. BERRY:
The Staff has no objection to the i
21 text.
22 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Pardon me?
4 23 MR. BERRY:
The Staff doesn't object to the i
24 admission of Group Exhibit 31, with the exception of
( )
25 those marginal notations that haven't been identified.
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262 4
1714 1
JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I take it, Mr. Guild, the 2
unidentified handwritings are not important, not 3
significant and probably are attorneys' markings in the 4
DOL case?
5 MR. GUILD:
That may be, Judge.
1 6
I am really offering them for the substance of the 7
documents themselves rather than the marginal notations.
8 It may prove at some later point, if we can 9
identify the handwritings, they may have some relevance, 10 but at the time I offer them only for the substance of 11 the document.
JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Okay.
We wi,ll admit the
( }
12 13 group documents, including the handwriting that has been 14 identified, but not including the other handwritings.
15 So that is received.
16 (Intervenors' Group Exhibit No. 31 for 17 identification was thereupon 18 received into evidence as 19 Intervenors' Group Exhibit No. 31.)
20 MR. GUILD:
Thank you.
21 BY MR. GUILD:
~
22 Q
Mr. DeWald, let's turn to Exhibit 29 in evidence.
23 Now, yesterday we closed with a discussion of the 24 Nonconformance Report 3099 that was originated by John
( )
25 A. Miner, Level 2 Inspector, on 8-17-84.
i l
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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i 1
As you stated moment ago, this 8-22-84 meeting was 2
held to discuss the disposition of that NCR; correct?
3 A
Correct.
4 Q
Now, Mr. Miner was the QC Inspector who originated the i
5 Nonconformance Report 3099.
6 But I think we have agreed, have we not, that it i
7 was Mr. Puckett who brought the problem to Mr. Miner's i
8 attention?
4 9
A It may have been.
f 10 Q
Well, you understood that to be the case, did you not, 11 when you had the meeting on 8-22-847
{ )
12 A
I believe so.
13 Q
All right, sir.,
I 14 I notice that Mr. Miner was not in attendance at l
15 the 8-22-84 meeting, was he?
l 16 A
No, sir.
17 Q
And that was because it was Mr. Puckett who had I
18 identified the nonconforming condition?
i 19 A
I believe so.
He was the -- our supposed Level 3.
4 20 Q
He was the Level 37 21 A
Yes.
i j
22 Q
And Mr. Miner originated the Nonconformance Report 23 because he reached the same conclusion that Mr. Puckett I
24 had, and that was that nonconforming condition existed
( )
25 as described in the NCR?
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1 A
I would agree.
2 Q
Who convened the meeting on 8-22-84?
i 3
A I am not sure who called the meeting.
I think -- it was j
4 Mr. Gieseker, I believe.
1 5
Q Mr. Gieseker of Commonwealth Edison Company?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
And it was a meeting of the various people who had had 8
responsibility for making judgments about the l
9 disposition of this nonconforming condition; correct?
10 A
I believe so.
11 Q
And that's why, in addition to your own people, you had j
- [ }
12 Commohwealth Edison Company representatives and 13 representatives of the architect engineer, Sargent i
14 Lundy?
15 A
I didn't have them.
They were all at the meeting when 4
I 16 we got there.
17 Q
All right.
Well, that was the purpose of their i
18 attendance as you understand it?
i 19 A
Yes.
s 20 Q
And that's because Comstock was working to Sargent &
l 21 Lundy's Specification --
22 A
Correct.
j 23 Q
-- L 27920?
24 A
Correct.
( )
25 Q
That's the design -- the architect engineer's Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 specifications to which Comstock performs its work?
2 A
Yes.
3 Q
And they, in essence, are ultimately responsible for 4
design engineering issues as they bear on Comstock's 5
scope of work?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
So all the relevant parties were then present at the 8
meeting and, as indicated in your meeting minutes under 9
Item B, quote, "It was agreed by all parties involved 10 that A-36 will be added to the PQR's on the next 11 revision of 4.3.3., PQR's H & O"?
12 A
Correct.
13 Q
And that's an accurate statement, is it not?
14 A
Yes.
15' Q
By all parties?
You mean all of the people who are 16 listed above as the attendees?
17 A
correct.
I 18 Q
The Sargent Lundy representatives, the Commonwealth 19 Commonwealth Edison Company representatives and the 20 representatives from Comstock, including Mr. Puckett?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 Q
And including yourself?
23 A
Yes, sir.
24 Q
All right, sir.
( )
25 Now, what is a PQR?
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A Procedure Qualification --
2 Q
Procedure Qualification Record?
3 A
-- Record, yes.
4 Q
And the PQR's are, in essence, attachments to the, in 5
this case, Welding Procedure 4.3.3, are they not?
6 A
Yes, they are.
7 Q
And they reflect the various specific welding techniques 8
that are within the scope of that welding procedure?
9 A
They include the techniques, yes, sir.
10 Q
Maybe I am using the wrong word.
I don't mean to.
i 11 But when I say " technique," a specific welding 12 technique employing a specific weld material on specific 13 base metals?
14 A
Yes.
4 15 0
And there are a variety of techniques, as I am using 16 that term, which may not be the pre'cise term of art --
17 but there are a variety of PQR's ass'ociated with 18 Procedure 4.3.3?
19 A
Yes.
20 Q
And the relevant -- those PQR's relevant to the issue
(
.s 21 that was being discussed and that reflected in NCR 3099 22 were PQR's H & O?
23 A
Yes.
24 Q
And it was agreed that A-36, a type of base material, O
25 was to se added to the next revie1en of thoee ewe PQR's Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1719 O
1 for Welding Procedure 4.3.3?
2 A
Yes, sir.
3 Q
Let's look at the next document.
This is a July 6, 4
1984, memorandum from you to Mr. Puckett.
5 The NRC had conducted an inspection where they had 6
identified weld rod slips reflecting the issuance of 7
Weld Rod E6013; but upon review of further 8
documentation, found that the rods actually used were 9
traceable to a heat number for E7018; isn't that 10 correct?
1 11 A
Correct.
/~)N 12 Q
Now, the Form 57 is a weld rod withdrawal slip; correct?
\\-
13 A
Correct.
1 14 Q
And do I understand correctly that when a welder is to 15 perform welding in the field, he or she obtains weld 16 filler material or weld rod, and the weld rod issued to 17 perform the specific welding activity is documented on a 18 Form 57 Weld Rod Withdrawal Form?
19 A
It presently is.
20 Q
I am sorry?
21 A
It presently is.
I 22 0
Okay.
And at the time that this memorandum was written, 23 a Weld Rod Withdrawal Form simply 3pecified an area 24 where the welding was to be performed as opposed to a
( )
25 specific component?
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1720 O
1 A
.Yes.
' :7 2
Q So the procedure has changed to be more precise in
/.
3 specifying the specific component on which the weld rod 4
is to be employed?
5 A
They identify the components.
6 Q'
On the weld rod withdrawal slip?
7 A
I believe so.
8 Q
When previous?.y, at the time Mr. Puckett started work,
[
9 there was a more general reference only to the area 10 where the weld, rod was to b,e' employed?
e 11 A
Yes.
~
[ }
12 Q'
And so one of the tasks that you assigned Mr: Puckett 13 was to research, through the quality documentation, the 14 actual weld rod that was employed in pa'rticular welding 15 on particular installations?-
16 A
Yes.
17 Q
And in order to do so, since the system did not specify 18 what installation the weld rod was to be used at that 19 time, you directed Mr. Puckett to look through time 20 sheets and installation reports by welder names to i
determine what component was welded?
21 22 f
A Yes.
23 0'
Lec's turn to Exhibit 31 then, please.
24 Now, let's look, if,you would, please, at the last
( )
25 sheet of this Exhibit 31, Group Exhibit 31.
<- ~
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1 This is a memo from Mr. Puckett to Mr. Saklak of 2
April 15, 1984, is it not?
3 A
Yes.
4 Q
All right.
Now, is it true that the substance of the 5
results, Items 1 through 5, that are listed in Mr.
6 Puckett's April 15, 1984, memo to Mr. Saklak are the 7
same as the substance of the items that are listed in 8
Mr. Vogt's memo to you of September 12, 1984?
9 A
They are the same substance, yes.
10 Q
All right, sir.
11 It was Mr. Puckett's work documented in the April 12
{)
15, 1984, memo that Mr. Vogt, the Comstock Level 3 Weld 13 Engineer, communicated to you in this formal memorandum 14 of September 12, 1984; is that correct?
15 A
It's the same form, yes.
16 Q
It's not the same form; it's the same substance, is it 17 not?
18 A
The same substance.
19 Q
Now, Mr. Puckett, on April 15, 1984, under Item No. 4 --
20 again, this is on the subject of review of weld rod 21 withdrawal slips -- states, "We have an obvious 22 procedure violation."
23 Mr. Vogt on September 12th appears to concur with 24 that by stating Item 4 of his memo, "An obvious
( )
25 procedure violation did occur"; correct?
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l A
Yes.
2 Q
Mr. Puckett went on to add from his April 15th memo, 3
" Procedure violation which could be alleviated in the 4
future by thorough indoctrination of the craft toolroom 5
weld rod issue clerk."
6 Mr. Vogt did not include that aspect of Mr.
7 Puckett's recommendation, did he?
8 A
Yes, he did.
5 9
Q And where did he do that?
4 10 A
" Corrective action to be taken:
Training on the
]
11 Procedure Requirements will be given to all affected
[ }
12 personnel detailing the control of heat numbers and 13 documentation practices for the filler metal issue 14 tabs."
15 Q
So he agreed that was an action that should be taken in 16 the future; is that correct?
17 A
He said it will be taken, yes.
18 Q
But my point is:
19 He did make the observation that Mr. Puckett did, 20 that that procedure violation could be alleviated in the 21 future by a thorough indoctrination of the craft 22 toolroom weld rod issue clerk?
23 A
I'might add, sir, he made the recommendation.
He did 24 not take any further steps in order to make sure the
( /
25 training had taken place.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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a 1723 O
1 Q
Who, Mr. Puckett didn't?
I 1
2 A
Yes, sir.
j l
3 Q
All right.
When was the Nonconformance Report 3275 1
4 originated to document the nonconforming condition in t
4 5
Comstock's weld rod withdrawal program?
e i
4 6
A I don't know the exact date, sir.
}
7 Q
Do you know whether it was before or after Mr. Puckett j
8 was terminated?
9 A
I am not sure of that.
i 10 Q
But such a Nonconformance Report 3275, as Mr. Vogt's 11 memo makes clear, was issued based on the above
[ }
12 comments, comments in his memorandum which are the 13 results of Mr. Puckett's findings, are they not?
14 A
I think they are a result of the NRC's findings, not Mr.
i i
15 Puckett's findings.
16 Q
Well, they, in fact, are the same findings listed on Mr.
f 17 Vogt's memo as are listed, in substance, on Mr.
18 Puckett's April 15, 1984, memorandum to Mr. Saklak, are 19 they not?
20 A
In substance of both memos, yes.
21 Q
All right, sir.
22 Now, the second page of the group exhibit, August i
23 17, 1984, memo, Puckett to Saklak, Mr. Puckett, in this 24 memorandum to Mr. Saklak, recommends that, and I quote,
( )
25 "At the very earliest convenient time that a more Sonntaa Reportina Serv' ice, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 i
(312) 232-0262
1724 O
1 thorough review be performed on all the rod slips so as 2
to have an in-house verification of any major problems 3
we may have."
4 A
Yes, sir.
5 Q
And was that recommendation for corrective action 6
followed up on?
7 A
I believe Mr. Vogt did.
He followed up on it and 8
finally Mr. Simile followed up on it.
9 Q
Short of Mr. Vogt and Mr. Simile following up on it, 10 didn't you, in fact, direct Mr. Puckett, during the last 11 week of his employment, to conduct a review of all of
( }
12 the rod issue slips consistent with his recommendat. ion?
13 A
I may have.
I am not sure.
14 Q
You may have; you are not sure?
15 A
I am not sure.
16 Q
What is the basis for your lack of certainty on that 17 question?
18 A
Quite a time span, sir.
19 0
You just don't remember that far back?
20 A
That's right.
21 Q
Now, the next document is a September 17, 1984, 22 memorandum to Mr. Puckett's file from you.
23 Mr. Puckett had already been terminated at the time 24 you wrote this September 17th memo, hadn't he?
( )
25 A
Yes, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
. 1
1725
()
1 Q
He had been terminated on the 27th of August, had he 2
not?
3 A
I believe that's the date.
4 Q
All right, sir.
5 So you were not writing this memo as a warning or 6
documentation of counselling to Mr. Puckett's files, 7
because Mr. Puckett was no longer a Comstock employee?
8 A
That's correct.
9 0
What was, then, the purpose of your writing this 10 September 17th memo to Mr. Puckett's file?-
11 A
These are my comments concerning Mr. Puckett's concerns
{ }
12 that he expressed.
13 Q
Let me direct your attention to the last page of the 14 exhibit we were discussing a moment ago.
15 This is the memo from Puckett to Saklak regarding 16 rod slips.
It bears a 'date of April 15, 1984.
17 Would you look down at the bottom.
In the 18 right-hand corner you will see a received date of August 19 17, 1984, L.K. Comstock.
20 Do you see that, Mr. DeWald, the last page now in 21 the packet of documents?
22 A
Yes, sir.
23 Q
Now, isn't it the case that the date on top, the April 24 15th date, is a misdate and it should be August 15,
( )
f5 1984?
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1726 DV 1
A I believe you are correct.
2 Q
So returning now again to your September 17, 1984, 3
memorandum to Mr. Puckett's file, this is a result of a 4
review and evaluation that was performed after you had 5
already made up your mind to fire Mr. Puckett and after 6
Mr. Puckett had, in fact, been terminated?
7 A
This is an after-the-fact memo, yes, sir.
i 8
Q And you see that you copied several people with this 9
memo.
It wasn't just to Mr. Puckett's file.
10 You sent copies to the Project Co,nstruction 3
11 Superintendent, Mr. Shamblin, who is the No. 1 man on
{ }
12 your, copy list; correct?
13 A
Correct.
14 Q
The QA man for Comstock -- for Edison, Mr. Quaka?
l 15 A
Yes, sir.
16 Q
Mr. Gieseker?
j 17 A
Correct.
18 Q
Mr. Tapella -- I am not leaving him out.-- Project 19 Construction Department, employee of Edison?
20 A
Correct.
21 Q
Your Production Manager, Mr. Rolan?
22 A
Correct.
23 Q
Your corporate QI. -- well, Mr. Marino in your 24 corporate office?
( )
25 A
Correct.
s Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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()
1 Q
Mr. Paserba in your corporate office?
2 A
Yes, sir.
3 Q
Mr. Trumble in your corporate office?
4 A
Yes, sir.
5 Q
Mr. Vogt, your Level 3 corporate, Seltmann and file?
6 A
Correct.
7 Q
The next page of the memo, entitled, " Personal and 8
confidential.
90-day Evaluation Meeting," states in 9
that memo that you reviewed the company policy on 90-day 10 evaluation?
11 A
Yes, sir.
[ }
12 0
What did you -- what did you review with Mr. Puckett on 13 that subject?
14 A
I reviewed with Mr. Puckett that -- the,,ompany policy 15 of 90-day evaluation period, of which an employee may be 16 terminated or an employee may quit, which is reviewed 17 with him prior to this when he first was hired; and in 18 this 90-day period, as it stipulates, the employee may 19 quit without any questions, the employer terminate the 20 individual without any questions; and I felt at this l
21 time Worley wasn't -- Mr. Puckett was not performing as
~
22 we thought he should and I was terminating him within 23 the 90-day period.
24 Q
Okay.
You say that you had discussed this 90-day
( )
25 evaluation policy with Mr. Puckett earlier.
Sonntac Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1728
/~')
V 1
When did you do that?
2 A
Shortly after he came on site.
3 It was my policy to sit down with everybody that 4
come on site and go over the 90-day evaluation period 5
with them.
6 Q
When did you do it for Mr. Puckett?
7 A
I don't know the exact date, sir.
8 Q
Did you do it in a written form?
Did you give him a 9
memo that told him there was a 90-day evaluation period?
10 A
No, sir.
It was my policy to sit down and go through 11 the company policies with each individual that came on
[ }
12 site.
13 Q
Well, I am asking you about Mr. Puckett now --
14 A
Now --
15 0
-- precisely.
16 Can you recall how you communicated your 90-day 17 evaluation policy to him?
18 Was it by written document of any sort?
19 A
It was verbally.
20 Q
Did you give Mr. Puckett a copy of the company's 90-day 21 evaluation policy?
22 A
Later on Mr. Puckett -- the corporate office later sends 23 each employee a copy of the company policies.
24 Q
Well, that may be, it may not be.
()
25 My question to you is:
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134
-(312) 232-0262
1729 1
Did you give Mr. Puckett a copy of the company's 2
written policy on the 90-day evaluation?
3 A
I personally did not.
4 Q
All right, sir.
5 Now, is that 90-day evaluation policy contained in 6
the company Policy Manual that is distributed to 7
employees?
8 A
I believe it is.
9 Q
And can you tell me in what document it appears?
10 A
I think it's in the statement.
11 Q
You mean your testimony?
{]}
12 A
Yes.
13 Q
Well, it may be.
14 But can you tell me, based on your recollection 15 today, in what document the company's 90-day termination 16 policy appears that is made available to company 17 employees?
18 A
It's a document that is sent out.
It's a folder.
It 19 covers all the benefits, all the vacation days, all 20 the -- also the bonus plan if you don't use up all of 21 your personal and sick time, health, retirement, your 22 90-day evaluation period and so on.
23 Q
Mr. DeWald, isn't it a fact that the 90-day termination 24 policy or probation policy, if you will, is contained in
( )
25 a management manual and not in any personnel directive Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1730 0
l 1
or document that is distributed to employees?
2 A
I am not sure -- positive that it's -- that that's a 3
fact.
I know it is in the supervisors' manual; and I 4
also said, I indicated, I set down with each individual 5
as they came aboard and went through that.
4 6
0 I heard you say that now; but my questions presently are 7
directed to a written policy that you state was 8
distributed to all~ employees by someone other than you 9
and I assume was distributed to Mr. Puckett.
10 I am looking at an attachment to your prefiled 11 direct testimony, Mr. DeWald, and it's Bates Stamp No
{ }
12 014651,- effective August, 1983.
In bold lettering at 13 the top it says, "Comstock Engineering, Inc., Section:
14 20, Company Policies, Full-Time Employees, Chapter: 60, 15 Termination.
Subj ect: 20, Termination Due" -- sorry.
16 That's the wrong page.
Pardon me.
I am reading the 17 wrong page.
18 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Take your time, Counsel.
v-19 You have a mass of documents there to sort out.
20 BY MR. GUILD:
21 Q
Looking at Bates No. 014625, it's from the same source, 22 Section: 20, Company Policies, Full-Time Employees, i
23 Chapter: 6, Hiring Policies,
Subject:
30, New Employees 24 Evaluation Period."
( )
25 Have you found that, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1731
[x 1
MR. MILLER:
It's in Attachment 2, Irv.
2 Can I be of help?
3 MR. GUILD:
Go ahead.
4 A
Yes, sir, I have found it.
5 BY MR. GUILD:
6 Q
Is that, in fact, the management manual provision that 7
describes the 90-day evaluation period, Mr. DeWald?
8 A
Yes, it is.
9 Q
Is that management manual distributed to all new 10 employees?
11 A
Not the management manual isn't, no, sir.
Q Did Mr. Puckett have 2 copy of the management manual U-
12 13 distributed to him?
14 A
No, sir.
15 Q
Now, I am looking at the last attachment to your 16 prefiled direct testimony, Mr. DeWald, and that is the 17 listing.of terminations at Comstock since you became QC 18 Manager, DeWald-7.
19 THE WITNESS:
That's the old sheet.
20 MR. MILLER:
Is that the only one you have 21 got?
22 THE WITNESS:
Yes.
23 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
The last document before 24 the --
()
25 MR. MILLER:
Go ahead.
Sonntaa Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1732 O
1 A
Yes, sir, I have it.
2 BY MR. GUILD:
3 Q
All right, sir.
4 Now, I believe your testimony was that you compiled 5
this document, did you not?
6 A
I did.
7 Q
And does this reflect all the terminations in which you 8
have been involved since August 1st of 19837 1
9 A
Yes.
10 Q
And when you say all that you have been involved in, can 11 you tell me whether or not that reflects all
{ }
12 terminations within the Comstock QC Department?
13 A
Up until the date that I made this out.
14 Q
I am sorry?
15 A
On the date that I made this out.
16 Q
All right.
It's not just all that you have been 17 involved in, it's all.that there have been at Comstock x
18 QC since August 1st up through the date when you 4
19 completed it?
20 A
Yes, that I have been involved with.
21 Q
That's what I am trying to identify.
22 Are there others that you have not been involved in 23 that are terminations from Comstock QC?
24 A
There have been some people that were sent back to
( / 25 BESTCO..These are the ones that I actually terminated Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1733 l
(
]
1 myself.
2 Q
Okay.
Well, BESTCO formally employs the Level 2 Quality 3
Control Inspectors and others who were employees of 4
Comstock before the union contract was entered into; 5
correct?
6 A
Yes.
i 7
Q Now, that was July 23, 1985; correct?
i 8
A Correct.
i 9
Q This then reflects all of the terminations at Comstock 10 QC, this document, Exhibit 7 -- all Comstock QC 11 terminations from the time you became QC Manager up
{ }
12 until at that point?
13 A
Up until the point of BESTCO take-over, yes, sir.
14 Q
So there may have been others since then where you j
15 formally did not terminate; it was BESTCO's 16 responsibility to take that action?
17 A
Correct.
18 0
Other than that, then, with that understanding, can you 19 identify, of this listing of all of the terminations 20 =
while you were QC Manager up until July, 1985, those 21 terminations that were based upon implementation of the 22 company's 90-day or 3-month evaluation period?
23 A
You are asking me are there any here that were 24 terminated within the 90 -- 90 days?
( )
25 Q
Termination with implementation of the 90-day evaluation 1
Sonntac Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134-(312) 232-0262
1734 O
1 period.
2 A
Yes, sir.
3 Q
Can you point that out to me, please?
4 A
Mr. Abernathy.
5 Q
Where does Mr. Abernathy appear?
6 A
I believe he is on Page 2.
7 Q
Mr. Abernathy was employed for three days?
8 A
Correct.
9 Q
He was terminated for falsification?
10 A
Yes, sir.
11 That falls under the 90-day. evaluation period.
{ )
12 Q
Eow about any others?
13 A
Mr. Clawson.
14 Q
Mr. Clawson was employed for four days?
15 A
Yes, sir.
16 Q
And he was fired for conduct unbecoming an employee, 17 excessive absenteeism and failure to report for work?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
How about others?
20 A
Mr. Maschke.
21 Q
He was employed for slightly less than a month; for
]
22 falsification -- and terminated for falsification of a 23 high school diploma?
24 A
Yes.
( )
25 Q
How about others?
l Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1735 O
1 A
I believe that is all.
2 Q
You left out Mr. Puckett now.
3 A
Okay, Mr. Puckett.
4 Q
Are there any employees that you evaluated at their 90th 5
day and terminated them on that date other than Mr.
6 Puckett?
7 A
No, sir.
8 Q
The others had independent cause for termination, such 4
9 as falsification of their records; correct?
10 A
Yes; but they all fell within the 90 days.
11 Q
They happened to be terminated before the 90 days was
{}
12 up?
13 A
Yes.
14 Q
But Mr. Puckett was the sole employee of Comstock in 15 which you implemented your policy prerogative of 1
16 terminating him, because at the end of his 90-day 17 probation period, you decided that you didnc want to ey 18 continue his employment?
19 A
Will you repeat your question?
20 0
I will try.
It was not stated very precisely.
21 You maintain that Comstock has a policy whereby 22 within 90 days you can terminate an employee at will; is 23 that correct?
24 A
That's correct.
( )
25 Q
And Mr. Puckett is the only employee for whom you Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262 s
1736 O
1 applied that policy, reached his 90th day or just prior 2
to his 90th day and you exercised your prerogatives
'3 under your policy to terminate his employment at will?
4 A
I did.
5 I see no difference between the first day and the 6
last day.
7 Q
All right, sir.
8 Now, in Exhibit 31 -- back to Exhibit 31 -- the 9
page documenting your 90-day evaluation meeting with Mr.
10 Puckett, you showed him his test problems it says here.
11 Does that reflect the practical exam and the
{ }
12 written general exam test?
13 A
I believe both those were discussed.
14 Q
And those are the only tests that you are referring to 1
15 here?
16 A
Yes.
17 Q
And did you state to him that those problems formed a 18 basis for your exercise of your termination at will 19 policy?
20 A
I didn't say they were the basis.
21 Q
Well, you described the test problems in the context of 22 performing your 90-day evaluation, did you not?
23 A
I described his performance and at the same time 24 indicated that the tests had problems, yes.
( )
25 0
Well, I don't see any indication on your notes, that you Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
.= -
1737 O
1 have previously described as accurately summarizing your 2
evaluation meeting, to'suggest that you talked about his 3
performance at all, other than Item B shows test I
4 problems.
1 I
5 Is there something I am missing on this document?
6 A
I didn't write it all in there.
7 Q
You didn't write that part in, the part about his 8
performance, except as to the test problems?
1 9
A Performance is part of the 90-day evaluation.
10 Q
Yes.
11 But you didn't note that in your minutes of the l
12
. [}
evaluation meeting,.did you?
i 13 A
No, I did not, j
14 Q
Mr. Puckett said, "It's a regrettable situation.
.I was 15 prepared for it."
16 Did he say that or words to that effect?
17 A
Yes, he did.
18 Q
And Mr. Puckett was prepared for it, because he saw that l
19 over a period of time, there was clear indication that 20 you determined to terminate him?
21 MR. MILLER:
I am going to object to the form
?
22 of the question.
l 23 I don't know how Mr. DeWald can testify as to what 24 Mr. Puckett was or was not prepared for.
All he can do
( )
25 is testify to what Mr. Puckett said to him.
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
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1 1738 l
1 BY MR. GUILD:
2 Q
Were there, in fact, clear facts available to Mr.
3 Puckett, based on your interchange with him prior to the 4
date you actually did his 90-day evaluation, to form the 5
basis for Mr. Puckett's statement that he was prepared 6
for it?
7 A
I don't really know.
8 0
You have no idea why Mr. Puckett would have said, "I was 9
prepared for it"?
l 10 A
He may have gotten that idea after the meeting, and-then 11 on the -- August the 22nd, I believe it was, and turned
(}
12 around August 22nd, aft.er we had discussed the problem, 13 and stated, "We have a complete breakdown."
14 That was the course of the meeting, in order to 15 straighten that particular item out.
i 36 Q
Well, the complete breakdown opinion that Mr. Puckett 17 expressed was founded not simply on the NCR 3099 issue, 18 was it?
19 A
It was on the stainless welding, also.
20 Q
Well, I am going to talk about that in a moment.
21 But, in fact, Mr. Puckett pointed out wide-ranging j
22 deficiencies he believe existed in a number of aspects 23 in the Comstock welding program, did he not?
24 A
That's what he believed.
()
25 Q
Yes.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
-. =
1739 1
Now, isn't it a fact that during the week prior to 2
your meeting with Mr. Puckett on August 27, 1984, you 3
had assigned him the virtually impossible task of 4
reviewing all of Comstock's weld filler withdrawal 5
slips -- I am not finished yet now -- all of the welder 6
qualification records and all of the Comstock welding 7
procedures?
8 Hadn't you assigned him those tasks?
9 A
That were his tasks assigned.
10 Q
You assigned him those tasks and to complete in a week, 11 did you not?
12 A
I don't recall >whether I told him he had exactly a week
'{ )
13 to do it in.
14 Q
Might have, though?
15 A
Pardon?
16 Q
Might have?
17 A
I don't recall.
18 Q
You just don't recall today?
19 A
I don't recall.
20 Q
And Mr. Puckett then stated, after you informed him that 21 you intended to terminate him, quote, "I don't have time, 22 to make a statement today."
23 He didn't say "he," he said "I,
" "it will be with 24 the NRC," or will give a statement to the NRC.
( )
25 This is not an exact quotation, is it, Mr, DeWald?
Sonntaa ReDortino Service, Ltd.
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1 A
It's fairly close.
2 0
It's fairly close, except you were using the third i
3 person, he, and Mr. Puckett would say I if he were being 1
4 quoted?
5 A
Correct.
6 Q
He told you he was going to make a statement to'the NRC; 7
correct?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
Did he state that it was his intent to resign after the 10 review and that he did not want to work for this 11 organization?
l 12 A
He did.
13 Q
Did he tell you why?
14 A
No, sir, he didn't.
15 Q
Did you know why he would arrive at that conclusion?
16 A
How would I know if he didn't tell me?
17 Q
Well, you dealt wich the man over a period of three I
18 months and dealt with him on a number of occasions and j
19 understood that he had wide-ranging concerns.about the 20 adequacy of Comstock's welding program, did you not?
l 21 A
I understood that from him, yes, sir.
22 Q
And you understood he. understood.that you were not being l
23 responsive to his concerns about those wide-ranging l
24 problems in the welding program?
( )
25 A
I feel I was responsive t,o his concerns..
4 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1741 1
0 You think he was satisfied with your responsiveness?
2 A
He may not have been; but that's what I hired him for, 3
to solely take care of the welding problems one by one, 4
and I was relying on his judgment.
5 Q
Isn't it possible that when he said he didn't want to 6
work for this organization and he intended to resign 1
7 after this evaluation, he did so out of frustration, 8
because, in his judgment, you were not being responsive 9
to the widespread problems he identified?
10 MR. MILLER:
I object.
11 Once again, Mr. DeWald is being asked to speculate
{ }
12 on what Mr. Puckett's state of mind might have been.
13 MR. GUILD:
I am asking Mr. DeWald simply to 14 address facts and circumstances that are within his 15 knowledge concerning Mr. Puckett's response to Mr.
16 DeWald's lack of attention to the problems he 17 identified.
l 18 MR. MILLER:
Your Honor, excuse me; but Mr.
19 DeWald has been examined now, really, for some hours on 20 what the facts were, and I certainly don't have any 21 objection to that; but when he is now asked to speculate 22 on what was in Mr. Puckett's mind -- Mr. Puckett is 23 c~dng to appear here as a witness and we will hear from 24 him directly.
( )
25 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Mr. DeWald is being asked to Sonntaa ReDortina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1742 l
1 give his judgment as to what was meant in conversation 2
with him in which he recorded certain things.
I don't 3
think that is outside the bounds.
4 There was a conversation, and if Mr. DeWald lacked 5
some understanding of what was meant, I am sure he would 6
have clarified that during that conversation.
7 So he must have some judgment as to what was 8
intended and he is being asked that; and I think the 9
Board is interested in what his judgment was, too, of i
l 10 the matters that he reported here.
i 11 So proceed.
( }
12 Is there a pending question?
13 MR. GUILD:
Yes, there is.
~
1 14 BY MR. GUILD:
15 Q
What is your judgment about what Mr. Puckett intended 16 when he made the statements you recorded in this 17 document?
18 A
That he was upset.
l 19 Q
That seemed apparent.
1 20 But how about as to the cause for his reaction and 21 his expression?
22 A
I think the cause is because I didn't specifically take 23 his word and I doubted his word and I was discharging 4
24 him.
( )
25 Q
All right, sir.
i Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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1 The next document, the same date, meeting with 2
Shamblin, Gieseker, DeWald, to discuss Mr. Puckett.
3 Now, this meeting that's memorialized in the 4
document that I am referriag to preceded the meeting in 5
which you terminated Mr. Puckett, did it not?
s 6
A It was before, yes.
7 Q
Right.
8 And it was where you reached the conclusion that 9
you were going to terminate Mr. Puckett?
10 A
Yes.
l 11 Q
All right.
Now, who called the meeting involving
{}
Shamblin, Gieseker and yourself?
12 13 A
I am not positive.
I thir.k it was Mr. Shamblin.
14 0
Mr. Shamblin, the Commonwealth Edison Project j
15 Construction Superintendent?
16 A
I believe so.
17 Q
And did you meet in his office?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
What did Mr. Shamblin have to say?
20 A
He was concerned about Mr. Puckett's performance, as I 21 was, also.
22 Q
Did Mr. Shamblin express the opinion that Mr. Puckett 23 should be terminated?
24 A
I don't recall his-exact statement.
( )
25 Q
I appreciate that.
It has been some time.
Sonntaa Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1744 1
But in substance, did Mr. Shamblin express the 2
opinion that Mr. Puckett should be terminated?
3 A
The whole total discussion was around that point.
4 I don't kno9 the exact discussion.
I have to rely 5
on what I wrote here; and the discussion after -- the 6
decision after discussing his performance was to 7
terminate him.
8 Q
Well, was Mr. Shamblin an active participant in that 9
discussion?
10 A
I think we all were all active participants.
11 Q
So Mr. Shamblin didn't sit there mute while you and Mr.
( }
12 Gieseker talked about it?
13 A
No, sir.
14 Q
Mr. Shamblin didn't sit there while you actively talked?
15 A
No.
16 Q
He actively participated in the discussion that arrived 17 at the conclusion -- we will try it again, Mr. DeWald.
1 18 Mr. Shamblin actively participated in the 19 discussions that led to the joint cenclusion that Mr.
20 Puckett should be terminated?
21 A
I believe the conclusion was mine, sir.
22 The discussion was a joint discussion, but the 23 conclusion to terminate Mr. Puckett was mine.
24 Q
Did Shamblin agree with.the position that you took, that
()
25 Puckett should be terminated?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1745 1
A I believe so.
2 Q
Did he express any reservations or doubts or contrary 3
view that Mr. Puckett should be kept on, should be 4
assigned another job, should be given another chance, 5
any of those things?
6 A
I don't believe we discussed that.
I don't think so.
7 Q
Did Shamblin express any reservations at all on the 8
question of terminating Mr. Puckett?
9 A
I don't recall.
10 0
Item D on your notes is, "W. O. Puckett situation to 11 also be addressed to R. Marino for ramifications prior 12 to dismissal."
[}
13 How do you mean by the term "ratifications"?
14 A
I also talk -- on the terminatioas, I call the corporate 15 office and discuss it with them to see whether or not I 16 am legally within the bounds of the termination.
17 Q
And did you conduct such a discussion with Mr. Marino?
18 A
Yes, I did.
t 19 0
What was the substance of that discussion?
20 A
They felt I was correct.
21 Q
Did you have that discussion before you had the meeting 22 with Mr. Puckett?
23 A
Yes, I did.
24 Q
And what did Marino have to say?
( )
25 A
I don't remember his specific words.
It was what if --
Sonntaq Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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(
1 what did I have, and after I explained what I had to 4
2 him -- I don't recall exactly what I said to him -- it 3
was agreed,to go ahead and terminate Mr. Puckett.
4 Q
Did you inform Mr. Puckett -- Mr. Marino -- excuse me --
5 that Mr. Puckett had written his' August 22nd memorandum
~
6 expressing the view that you were approaching a complete 7
breakdown at Comstock QC?
i 8
A I believe I did, sir.
9 Q
Was Mr. Marino familiar with that memorandum before you 10 talked to him?
11 A
No, sir.
9 Q-He hadn't seen it before?,,
{ }
12 13 A
I don't think so.,
14 Q
So you had to just tell him about it on the phone in 15 this conversation? '
16 A
I believe I did.
17 Q
The following document is the August 15, 1984, memo and 18 the August 17th Rolan stop work memo, both are 19 evidence -- both in evidence.
i l
20 There is an August 13, 1984, Read & Reply Memo and 21 then an August 10, 1984, Read & Reply Memo.
22 Let's start with August 10th, the second document.
23 Do you see that, Mr. DeWald?
24 A
I do.
( )
25 Q
All right, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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(:)
1 Now, Mr. Puckett wrote you this Read & Reply Memo 2
urging that -- recommending that work be discontinued 3
using a specific procedure; correct?
4 A
He did.
5 Q
Your reply to that memo doesn't seem to address the 6
merits of the observed nonconforming condition that Mr.
7 Puckett addresses.
8 Did you disagree with his observation that 9
Procedure 4.3.14 Rev. 9-17-80 is only qualified in the l
10 SG Position.
AWS Dl.1 75 Part B Paragraph 5.8.1.2 11 requires that it be qualified in all positions, 1G, 3G 12 and 5GP 13 A
I don't believe I disagreed with him.
14 I asked, "What is-your, suggested sollution to the 15 problem.
There possibly could be a recall procedure to 16 the welders"; and, "this is your responsibility to. find 17 the problems, find the solutions and get them resolved.
18 What is the solution to your memo."
19 Q
And Mr. Puckett responded with his 8-13 Read & Reply 20 that is the preceding page of the exhibit; correct?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 Q
"I further agree that the procedures need to be 23 qualified.
I am still recommending stop work until this 24 can be accomplished.
Reference 1, all welding of
( ) 25 stainless steel; Reference 2, all welding of A-36 to Sonntaq Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
- g-
<j '
~
1748 V
c 1
A-446 u, sing E7018 electrodes?
j 2
A Yes, sir.
3 Q
And you did stop work?
^~' Z"^
~
4 A
.Yes,-I did._
~
5 Q
N o w,p were there verbal discussions between you and Mr.
6 Puckett aside from the written Read & Reply Memos?
7 A
There may have been.
I don't really recall.
8 Q
Did you try to dissuade Mr. Puckett from his position 9
that stop work was appropriate-as a remedy for the 10 procedural deficiencies he identified?
11 A
I don't know whether I dissuaded him o'r not.
I used a 12 basis judgment. on'the stop work I issued.
13 I did not have the time, as I addressed yesterday, 14 to sit down and go through the solutions to the problem.
f 15 Q
So you don't recall whether you tried to talk him out of 16 the stop work or not?
17 A
No, I don't.
I don't feel I did.
18 Q.
You don't feel that you did?
19 A
I don't believe,..I did.
20 Q
You don't recall having done that?
21 A
That's a fact.
22 Q
Now, the next page',lanother Read & Reply Memo, 8-24-84, 23 does this essentially / reflect a request by Mr. Puckett, 24
.7after you had given him the assignment in the last week 25
'of his employment, to research the documentation we
'Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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(312) 232-0262
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1.
previously discussed?
2 A
He came in and asked to -- he needed to get in, have 3
limited -- have access to the vault to research the Form 4
57's.
I said fine and I replied and told the vault 5
supervisor to let him have the access to get in and do 6
the research.
7 Q
But that was in accomplishing the task that you didn't 8
recall having given him and that was researching all the 9
weld rod withdrawal forms; correct?
10 A
I believe that was his recommendation to review all of 11 them.
The main --
( }
12 O
You told him to do it; right?
13 A
I said if that's what he needs to do, do it.
14 Q
You assigned your Level 3 Welding Quality Control 15 Inspector essentially the clerical task of going through 16 all of the Form 57's, did you not?
17 A
That's what he recommended, sir, and that's what I told 18 him:
If he had to do, do it.
19 Q
All right, sir.
20 That's, in essence, the same sort of task that you 21 assigned young Rick Martin, Mr. Martin, the QC Inspector 22 who had all of his certifications taken?
You had Mr.
23 Martin researching quality documentation in or near the 24 vault, did you not?
Not the same forms, necessarily,
( )
25 but that was Martin's job when he was decertified; Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1750 O
1 right?
2 A
I think the two situations are totally different.
3 Q
All right, sir.
4 But you did have Mr. Martin researching quality 5
documentation because he no longer was qualified to 6
perform inspection activity?
7 A
That had a basis on it.
He was also qualified and knew 8
the prints and the drawings and how to read them 9
Q So you had Mr. Martin performing clerical duties when he 10 wasn't certified; right?
11 A
It was somewhat of a clerical duty, yes, sir.
{}.12 Q
And you had your Level 3 Weld Inspector, Mr. Puckett, 13 performing clerical duties, researching all of the Form 14 57's?
15 A
I don't feel that was a clerical duty for that Level 3.
16 He knew what he was looking for.
17 Q
All right, sir.
18 Did you tell Mr. Puckett to do it himself?
19 A
I didn't tell him to do it himself, no.
20 Q
Did you provide him any other manpower to accomplish the 21 job?
22 A
I didn't personally go out and pull an individual aside 23 and say, "You work for Mr. Puckett."
24 Q
Did you assign any other people, whether you personally
( )
25 did it or not, through your intermediary supervision, to Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1751 (D
%)
1 assist Mr. Puckett in performing this task?
2 A
I am -- I am sure if he needed assistance, sir, he could 3
have went to one of the other supervisors and asked if 4
they had an extra inspector that he could use.
5 Q
Well, that --
6 A
I personally did not do it.
7 0
Well, did you take any personal action to provide Mr.
8 Puckett any clerical or other assistance in performing 9
this task?
10 A
No, I didn't.
11 Q
All right.
The next page is an August 22, 1984,
{ }
12 memorandum from Puckett to DeWald.
13 Do you have that before you, Mr. DeWald?
14 A
I have it before me, yes.
15 0
All right.
"Over the past few weeks I have been 16 performing a preliminary review of our weld procedures."
17 That's a correct statement, isn't it?
18 A
I believe that's what he was doing.
19 Q
All right.
"In addition to the ones I have already 20 recommended stop work on, i. e. all stainless and A-36 21 to A-446 using E7018, there are at least five others 22 that were incorrectly qualified."
23 Now, he had, in fact, recommesided stop work on the 24 stainless and the E-36 to A -- the A-36 to A-446?
( )
25 A
Correct.
l Sonntac Reportino Service, Ltd.
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1 Q
He identifies five others that are incorrectly 2
qualified, all procedures involving galvanized A. S. T.
3 M. A-446.
"The aforementioned procedures were qualified 4
using the criteria of AWS Dl.1 AWS Dl.1 criteria was 5
never intended to be used to weld materials less than 6
one-eight-inch thick.
Our heaviest gauge unistrut is 12 j
7 GA, which is.105 thick.
All our procedures that 8
involve A-446 should have been qualified using the 9
criteria of D.l.3, which has a completely different set 10 of test requirements and a completely different set of 11 the essential variables."
12 Now, isn't it a fact that after the AWS Dl.1 75
{
13 code was published that the American Welding Society 14 promulgated the AWS D.1.3 code?
15 A
It is.
16 Q
And isn't it a fact that the AWS D.1.3 code was 17 promulgated for the purpose of addressing welding on 18 thinner-gauge materials?
19 A
It is.
20 Q
And isn't it a fact that Comstock employs thinner-gauge 21 materials, as Mr. Puckett states in his memorandum, such 22 as galvanized metal used in cable pans?
23 A
We do.
24 Q
Now, he was making a general recommendation that.in his
( )
25 opinion, using the AWS D.l.3 code to qualify your Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
i 1753 O
1 procedures was a more appropriate code to employ, and do 2
you disagree with that position?
3 MR. MILLER:
I am going to object to the 4
characterization of Mr. Puckett's statement as the AWS 5
code being more appropriate.
'6 What he said was, it never should have been 7
qualified to AWS Dl.l.
8 That is very different from speaking about 9
appropriateness of codes.
10 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Overruled.
11 Continue.
12 MR. GUILD:
Would you answer the question, O
13 please?
14 THE WITNESS:
Would you repeat it?
15 MR. GUILD:
Yes.
16 BY MR. GUILD:
17 Q
Do you disagree with Mr. Puckett's position that the AWS 18 D.1.3 was a more appropriate code to use for this work?
j 19 A
I do not.
20 Q
"In addition to these procedures that you are not 21 qualified, there are so many inconsistencies in the
~
22 remaining procedures that we are using that I'm sure 23 their qualification would be considered indeterminate.
24 I am aware of the' impact it would have, but I strongly
.( )
25 recommend that all weldings be stopped and that and all Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois-60134 (312) 232-0262
1754 O
1 out" -- I am reading now.
I assume there is a word left 2
out or a misspelling -
"an all out effort be started to 3
do a complete review of our procedures, welders 4
qualification and welders filler material withdrawal 5
forms; and once the magnitude of our problems have been 6
determined, we can better address our noncompliances and 7
formulate a plan that will bring us back under the codes 8
and specifications we should be working to."
9 All right, sir.
10 Now, isn't it a fact that Mr. Puckett had many 11 recommendations that you revise your practices for 12 control of weld filler material?
13 A
We did.
14 Q
Mr. Puckett made recommendations to that effect, did he 15 not?
16 A
Instead of making the recommendations, sir, he should 17 have revised the procedure himself and had it submitted.
18 0
You fired him, didn't you, before he could do that?
19 A
He could have done that prior to his being terminated.
20 Q
While he was looking at all the Form 57's in the vault 21 during the last week of his employment?
22 A
When he looked at the Form 57's and he seen the 23 inconsistency, that's when he shou 3d have took that 24 appropriate action along with whatever he may have to
( )
25 do.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1755 O
i 1
Q Subsequently, you did, in fact, revise your weld filler 2
material control procedure, did you not?
3 A
Yes, sir.
4 Q
And you enhanced those control procedures over the 5
existing program at the time Mr. Puckett made his I
6 comment, did you not?
7 A
I believe, yes, sir.
8 Q
And you required tighter control of filler material, 9
traceability of filler material specific components, did 10 you not?
11 A
We do.
12 Q
And that is, in essence, what Mr. Puckett urg'ed you to O
13 do, didn't he?
14 A
It is.
15 Q
And you made a number of revisions to the welder 16 qualification procedures -- strike that.
17 You made a number of revisions to the welding 18 procedures to identify and correct various-19 inconsistencies and errors in those procedures, have you 20 not?
21 A
We have.
l 22 Those were not stop work type of inconsistencies.
23 Q
So, in your judgment, work could proceed even in the 24 face of those errors and inconsistencies in the
()
25 procedures?
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
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1756 O
1 A
That's a fact.
2 Q
Mr. Pt.ckett disagreed with you and took the position 3
that you shouldn't continue work until those errors and 4
inconsistencies have been corrected?
5 A
I believe that's his statemtnt.
6 Q
Mr. Puckett identified errors and inconsistencies and 7
omissions in the welder qualification records, did he 8
not?
9 A
He identified inconsistencies in the welder records, 10 yes, sir.
11 Q
And he urged a complete review of those welder
- {}
qualification records be performed to address those 12 13 inconsistencies, did he not?
14 A
That's what he recommended.
15 0
And have you since taken action to address and correct 16 errors and inconsistencies in welder qualification 4
17 records?
18 A
Yes, sir.
That was done during the document review.
19 Q
I am sorry.
During what?
20 A
The latest document review.
21 Q
During the ongoing quality focument review process?
22 A
Yes, sir.
23 Q
That's the document review process that identified 20 24 percent errors or inadequacies in the 150,000 quality
( )
25 documents at Comstock?
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1757 O
1 A
Yes, that's the one that identified the deficiencies.
I 2
am not sure of the percentage.
3 0
I believe'your counsel stipulated to the 20-percent 4
figure earlier.
5 Now, in the last paragraph, he makes sort of a personal -- what I perceive to be a personal plea to r
7 you, Mr. DeWald.
"Irv, I work for Comstock, too, and I 8
speak from a lot of experience.
With the procedures 9
being what they are and the morale" -- I take that 10 M-O-R-A-L to mean morale -
"of the QC inspectors being 11 what it is, we are dangerously approaching a complete 12 breakdown in our QC program."
13 All right.
Now, do you doubt that was Mr.
14 Puckett's opinion?
15 A
That very well was his opinion.
He wrote it, sir.
16 Q
Now, Mr. Puckett was not writing this memo to 17 Commonwealth Edison Company, was he?
18 A
No, he wasn't.
19 Q
He didn't write this memo to the Nuclear Regulatory 20 Commission, did he?
21 A
No, he didn't.
22 Q
He wasn't sending this to BPI or to an antinuclear 23 organization, was he?
24 A
I have no idea where he did send it.
He addressed it to O
25 me.
Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
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i 1758 O
1 Q
He addressed it to Irving DeWald, his boss, and he says, 2
Dear Irv." He didn't say Mr. DeWald,
he said Irv.
3 It's a personal note from Mr. Puckett to you trying 4
to recommend corrections and improvements to the 5
Comstock welding program, is it not?
6 A
The corrections and improvements that he recommended are 7
not stop work corrections.
8 Q
I understand your opinion to that effect.
l 9
But this is a personal note from Mr. Puckett to you 10 and it does recommend improvements in the Comstock 11 welding program?
[ }
12 A
I really don't take it as a personal note.
I take it as 13 a men:orandum to me; and, yes, he did recommend various 14 things.
15 Q
All right, sir.
16 And you fired him five days later?
17 A
I did.
18 KR. GUILD:
May I have a moment, Mr.
19 Chairman?
20 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
We might as well take a 21 ten-minute recess now unless that is going to interrupt 22 your --
23 MR. GUILD:
No.
That will be fine.
4 24 (WHEREUPON, a recess was had, after which
()
25 the hearing was resumed as follows:)
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
l 1759 1
JUDGE GROSSMAN:
We are back in session.
2 Proceed, Mr. Guild.
3 MR. GUILD:
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
4 BY MR. GUILD:
5 Q
Mr. DeWald, when Mr. Saklak was terminated, a review of 6
his personnel file was performed, identifying his past 7
evaluations, past instances where you had given him 8
written and oral warnings; is that correct?
9 A
I believe it was.
10 Q
Let me show you a copy of that document, please.
11 Mr. DeWald, showing you a document entitled, "L
12 Saklak Personnel File Review."
13 A
Yes, sir.
14 Q
And does this two-page document reflect the review of 15 Mr. Saklak 's pe rsonnel file?
16 A
Yes.
17 0
Was this review performed by you or by someone under 18 your direction?
19 A
I believe Mr. Seltmann performed the review.
20 Q
Is Mr. Seltmann Quality Assurance Manager for Comstock?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 0
Is this an accurate and complete summary of Mr. Saklak's 23 personnel file?
24 A
I think it is.
()
25 Q
All right, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1760 1
You reflect in his most recent annual evaluation, j
2 that prior to his April, 1985, terminat. ion, that, in 3
your' judgment, Mr. Saklak is beneficial to the Quality 4
Control Department at Comstock?
5 A
On 1-5-84, I --
6 0
1-5-85.
7 A
1-5-85, excuse me, I indicated I believe he is 8
beneficial to the QC Department.
9 Q
You characterized Mr. Saklak as aggressive, energetic 10 and quality minded, striving for a quality product?
11 A
Yes.
12 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I ask that this O
13 document be identified as Intervenors' Exhibit 32 and o
14 received in evidence.
15 (The document was thereupon marked 16 Intervenors' Exhibit No. 32 fot 17 identification on May 9, 1986.)
18 MR. MILLER:
No objection.
19 MR. BERRY:
No objection.
i i
20 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Received.
i 21 (Intervenors' Exhibit No. 32 for 1
22 identification was thereupon received in l
23 evidence as Intervenors' Exhibit No. 32.)
4 24 MR. GUILD:
And that concludes my examination
! ()
25 of Mr. DeWald.
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1761
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1 Thank you, sir.
2
, JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Mr. Berry, Staff's.
3 CROSS EXAMINATION 4
BY MR. BERRY:
5 Q
Mr. DeWald, I would like to direct your attention to 6
Answer 28 of your testimony, Page 40.
7 In that answer you describe the circumstances 8
leading up to the hiring of Mr. Puckett.
9 A
Was that Page 40, sir?
10 Q
Page 40.
It spills over onto 41 and 42.
11 A
Okay, sir.
12 O
Would you explain for the Board and for the parties a a
g3 13 little bit more of the background of the reasons why it 14 was necessary, why the decision was made to hire a Level 15 3 Welding Inspector?
16 A
At the time or just prior to Mr. Puckett's hiring I had 17 so many -- I was busy with other areas and other things 18 to try to control the whole job and keep in contact with 19 the whole job as far as quality goes, that I didn't have 20 the specific amount of time or the time allotted to me 21 to sit down and thoroughly go through the weld 22 procedures and keep the weld procedures abreast of the 23 possible changes and so forth with the specs, drawings 24 and things like that.
()
25 So during the employment drive that we were going Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1762 O
1 on at the time -- and it was discussed with Mr. Marino, 3
2 Mr. Paserba and I believe Commonwealth Edison -- that we 3
fill one of the vacant Level 2 inspector _ spots with a i
4 qualified Level 3 inspector, who could devote his time 5
to keeping the procedures correct and into the areas of 6
being within the requirements of the specs, be able to 7
quell problems in the field that may arise by the 8
inspectors, and also follow the whole welding program 9
per se; and this is the reason Mr. Puckett was hired.
10 Q
I note you state in your testimony that Mr. Vogt from 11 Comstock corporate offices visited the site and
' identified various incansistencies in your welding 13 procedures.
14 Mr. Vogt:
Is he a Level 3 inspector?,
i 15 A
He is our corporate Level 3, sir.
He was certified 16 through corporate, not per the site procedures.
I 17 believe he has an Associates Degree in Welding or 18 Metallurgy or something of this nature.
19 Q
You state further in your testimony,-Page 41, that 20 Comstock had a variety of resources available to you, 21 that you wanted an individual who could devote his 22 experience and attention to the welding program on a 23 full-time basis.
24 What would be the advantage of having a full-time
()
25 Welding Inspector?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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(312) 232-0262 j
1 1763 lO 1
A I felt a full-time Welding Inspector, since welding is a f
2 critical item, that I-needed an' individual that I could f
3 count on to give me good, solid recommendations, 4
resolutions and be able to revise procedures and so 5
forth in specifically the welding area.
6 Q
Did you consider the Level 3 welding position to be, 1
7 say, a key position in ~the organization?
j 8
A Yes, sir, I did.
l 9
Q Did you have in mind someone for this position whose 10 background, experience and expertise was similar to, 2
L l
11 say, Mr. Vogt?
t f
12 A
Similar, probably not with the educational degree and so i
~
13 forth, but somebody that had a very thorough knowledge 14 of AWS, could interpret the specifications.
j j
15 0
It is your testimony that it was this realization, a i
i 16 realization for a need for a. full-time Level 3 weld 17 inspector, was reached around May, early May, 1984, 18 shortly after the NRC inspection?
{
19 A
Yes, sir.
20 Q
I notice in your testimony there is a date May 12th, and j
21 that's the date-that Mr. Vogt identified -- well,.after 22-Mr. Vogt had identified the inconsistencies ~in the weld 1
23 procedures and you issued a memorandum, and your 24 testimony goes on to state that,"We realize that we f
( )
25 needed someone on-site with a thorough understanding of Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 i
.(312) 232-0262
_. - _ - _. -. -,,, -. -. - _. - - _, ~. -..,. -...
-.,m_--.-.--,.,..
-- -.., ~...,... _..
1764 O
1 AWS Dl.1," quote.
2 Does this date the time that you came to this I
3 realization, around,May 12th?
4 A
The approximate time, yes, sir.
5 Q
Three days later you interviewed Mr. Puckett for the 6
position; is that correct?
7 A
Excuse me?
l 8
Q Three days later, on May 15th, you interviewed Mr.
9 Puckett for this position?
l 10 A
Yes, I believe so.
11 Q
Well, after you came to the realization that you -- that
?
12 it would be desirable to have an on-site Level 3 weld 13 inspector, did you have the time period in mind by which 1
14 you wanted to have this position filled?
15 A
As soon as possible, 16 Q
Do you know or -- do you know or have an opinion as to 17 the prevalence of Level 3 weld inspectors?
Are they 18 numerous, are they easy to find or --
19 A
I don't feel they are easy to find, no, sir.
20 Q
Mr. Puckett's resume appeared to indicate that he had 21 qualifications and the ability to fill the position?
22 A
Yes, sir, he sure did.
23 0
Where did you interview Mr. Puckett?
24 A
Right on the site.
()
25 Q
Did you interview him by yourself?
i Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1765 1
%d 1
A Mr. Paserba and I interviewed him together.
We talked 4
2 with him, the --
3 Q
Did this --
4 A
Mr. Vogt talked with him then in'a separate room and Mr.
5 Marino then talked with him while, I believe, Mr.
6 Paserba and myself were both present.
7 0
How long did the interview last?
8 A
Pardon?
9 Q
How long did the interview last, your interview with Mr.
10 Puckett?
11 A
I am not quite sure of the exact time of it, sir.
12 0
Could you estimate?
j 13 A
I would say approximately 30 minutes.
14 0
30.inutes?
15 A
Yes.
16 Q
Do you know how long Mr. Marino interviewed Mr. Puckett?
17 A
Probably, at the most, maybe five minutes.
18 Q
Five minutes?
19 A
Again, this is an educated guess.
20 Q
And Mr. Vogt, he interviewed Mr. Puckett, also?
21 A
Ten or 15 minutes, I believe.
22 0
10 or 15 minutes.
23 So we have your interview, 30 minutes, Mr. Marino's 24 interview, 5 minutes, and Mr. Vogt's interview of
()
25 approximately 10 minutes.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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v 1
I understand these are all approximates; so it was 2
about 45 minutes tohC.?
3 A
I would think about that, sir.
4 Q
Did you interview Mr. Puckett subsequent to May 15th of 5
1984, before the decision was made to offer him the 6
position?
7 A
No, we didn't.
8 0
30 you just had -- just one series of interviews on this 9
single day?
10 A
Yes.
11 Q
You didn't interview anybody else for this position, did 12 you?
13 A
There was another individual that was there, Mr.
14 Worthington; and we also looked at his credentials for 15 the Level 3; but he was more in the ASMTC, and we felt 16 that he probably would suit our Assistant QC Manager 17 better than the Level 3 welding person.
18 Q
Mr. DeWald, before you were offered the position of the 19 QC Manager at Braidwood, did you have to go through an 20 interview?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 Q
Who interviewed you, if you recall?
23 A
Mr. Brown.
He interviewed me at Braidwood.
i 24 Q
Do you recall how long your interview lasted?
I
( )
25 A
Approximately 30 minutes.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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(
l 1
Q In your interview with Mr. Puckett, what did you talk 2
about?
3 A
I believe questions were discussed with.him as far as 4
the AWS, his past work, his past duties.
5 I also asked him about some of.the Naval schools i
j 6
which I was f amiliar with and knew the type and extent i
7 of training that the individual did have as.far as 8
welding and so forth that he indicated that he had been 4
9 through in the service.
10 Q
Directing your attention to Page 41 of your testimony, i
11 it's the first full paragraph in, and your testimony is, 12 quote, that "We realized that we needed someone on site-13 with a thorough understanding of AWS Dl.1-1975 and its 14 applications who could take charge effectively and 15 competently."
16 How did you assure yourself in your interview with 17 Mr. Puckett that he had a thorough understanding of the 18 AWS Dl.1-1975 code?
l 19 A
Through interviewing him and talking with him, he had
~
c j
20 the. correct answers.
21 Q
Could you relate to us, if you can, some of the i
22 questions that you put to Mr. Puckett?
23 A
Well, some of the questions that we put to Mr. Puckett i
24 was pertaining to welder qualifications, I think how you
()
25 revise the procedure, the PQR's, how do you do a PQR.
l Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
f Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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i ()
1 I am not totally positive on exactly what'was said.
2 it's been quite a while.
i 3
Q The Level 3 Welding Inspector position that you had in f
4 mind, the individual.that you had in mind to fill this i
5 position, did you expect-that person to be able to 6
interpret the AWS code?
l 7
A Yes, sir.
8 Q
And did you expect that that person would have a --
t 9
would have a pretty good familiarity with that code and 10 its application?
11 A
Yes, sir.
12 Q
Take, for example, the' question of whether it's proper
[}
13 to weld A-36 material to A-446' material when the A-446 14 material hasn't been qualified, is that a type of 15 situation which you would expect the person filling this j
16 Level 3 weld position to have some knowledge of or some i
17 familiarity with?
i 18 MR. MILLER:
I am going to have to object to i
19 the form of the question.
20 I don't believe the question is intelligible.
l 21 There is a --
22 MR. BERRY:
I will withdraw the question.
23 MR. MILLER:
I have to state my objection for 24 the record, at any rate.
(
25 BY MR. BERRY:
.i 4
Sonntag Reporting' Service, Ltd.
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Q Mr. DeWald, could you tell us -- well, did you ascertain 2
in your interview with Mr. Puckett that he had a-i j
3 thorough understanding -- strike that.
8 l
4 Did you ascertain in your interview with Mr.
]
5 Puckett that he was capable of interpreting the AWS code
)
6 and its application?
l 7
A Yes.
Through his past experience and talking with hiu,
)
8 we felt he did have that.
I 9
Q Do you recall if you put any hypothetical questions to 10 him?
11 A
I don't believe we did.
12 Q
So do I understand your testimony that you. relied solely
[}
13 on his background, experience, and his resume in 14 satisfying yourself that Mr. Puckett had a thorough i
15 understanding of the AWS D1.1-1975 code?
}
16 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Mr. Berry, I think he l
17 already gave you an answer to that and that was not the 4
18 answer he gave you.
l 19 So I don't think that you ought to pursue that.-
1 4
20 BY MR. BERRY:
21 Q
How soon after the interview was Mr. Puckett offered the 22 position?
23 A
I believe it was after the interview, after -- if my 24 memory is correct, it was after the. interview, after Mr.-
()
25
- Marino, I, Tom Paserba, Mr. Vogt, we talked it over and a
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 we said, "Yes, we feel this gentleman will be all right 2
for the job."
3 MR. MILLER:
I am sorry.
I didn't hear the 4
last part of your answer.
5 A
(Continuing.)
We all got together, Mr. Marino, Tom 6
Vogt, myself, Tom Paserba, and we discussed whether or 7
not we thought he would fit the bill; and it was the 8
conclusion, that, yes, he could fill the bill of what we i
9 were looking for.
10 BY MR. BERRY:
11 Q
That was the same day?
12 A
Yes.
{}
13 Q
Did you offer Mr. Puckett the position that same day on 14 May 15th?
i 15 A
Yes, the day of his interview.
16 Q
So you had offered him the position before you had 17 performed a background check?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
I will back up a minute.
1 20 In your interview with Mr. Puckett did you also l
21 assure yourself that he could take charge effectively 22 and competently of a weld -- competently of a welding 23 department?
24 A
Yes, I did, because he was an ex-chief petty officer in
()
25 the Navy.
I being an ex-chief petty officer in the Navy Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1771 l
I' 1
felt that he could do that' job and has similar 2
responsibilities in the Navy through his ex-background.
3 Q
Did you rely on anything else other than his past 4
experience in the Navy and your past experience in the 5
Navy?
6 A
Also, the way he had expressed himself while sitting 7
there during the interview.
8 Q
You knew at the time of the interview or did you know at 9
the time of your interview with Mr. Puckett that the NRC 10 had identified a number of deficiencies in the welding 11 area at the Zimmer plant?
12 A
.Yes, I did.
,, { }
13 Q
Did you inquire of Mr. Puckett as to his responsibilicy, 14 if any, for any of those deficiencies?
15 A
That may have come up.
I don't really recall.
He did 16 indicate he came from Zimmer and worked for, I believe a
17 it was, Henry J. Kaiser Company.
18 Q
What was the nature of the background verification that 19 you sent to the Kaiser Engineering Company regarding Mr.
20 Puckett?
21 A
It was a letter asking for his employment history, and 22 down at the bottom it says -- there is also a block, 23
" Eligible for re-hire, yes, no," and any comments.
24 There were no adverse comments that came back from
()
25 Henry J. Kaiser.
4 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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't
{
)
1 Q
Did you inquire of Kaiser Engineering Company as~to Mr.
t 2
Puckett's understanding or ability to interpret the AWS 3
Dl.1 code?
f 4
A No, sir.
5 Q
Did you speak with anyone from Kaiser Engineering 6
regarding Mr. Puckett?
]
7-A I am not sure whether we called or not.
We got the 8
written verification, so that could have been all we j
9 did.
i 10 Q
Mr. DeWald, you have testified regarding Mr. Puckett's 11 responsibilities as a Level 3 Welding' Inspector.
2 12 1
[}
I don't believe you have indicated what is the j
13 nature -- full nature -- of his authorities.
I will be
]
14 more specific.
i 15 Did Mr. Puckett have'the authority to assign other-16 inspectors to perform tasks?
j 17 A
He would have had to went to the other supervisor and 18 ask for the inspector to give him a hand or assign a 19 task.
i j
20 Q
So no one -- so there'was no one that reported directly l
21 to Mr. Puckett?
)
22 A
Not at that time.
He was free to do as he seen fit as J
23 far as resolving the problem.
There was no time limit 24 put on him.
- ()
25 MR. MILLER:
I am sorry.
Could I have the Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, 1111nois eu1Je (312) 232-0262
1773 i
O 1
last bit of the answer read back.
2 (The answer was thereupon read by 3
the Reporte r.)
4 BY MR. BERRY:
5 Q
Mr. DeWald, could you explain for us the difference in 6
responsibilities of a -- between a Level 3 inspector and 7
a Level 2 inspector?
8 A
The Level 3 can evaluate and do all the areas that a 9
Level 2 is capable of doing.
He can also certify lower 10 level people.
He can revise procedures, implement the 11 training or recommended the training.
He has the 12
[}
authority to do the same amount of things that I do 13 '
except for an actual stop work, although he is limited 14 to the welding aspects of the job.
15 Q
Is it fair to say that a Level 2 inspector is not 16 required to have the background knowledge or the 17 expertise in AWS code and its applications as much as 18 one would expect of a Level 3?
19 A
I would say yes.
20 Q
L.K. Comstock, L.K. Comstock.
21 Do you generally require the Level 2 inspector who 22 identifies a nonconforming condition -- do you also 23 expect him to propose the recommended solution?
24 A
No, sir.
()
25 Q
It's also not a Level 2 inspector's -- it's not within Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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1774 1
1 the scope of his responsibilities to develop corrective 2
actions to ensure that welding activities are in 3
compliance with code requirements or contractual 4
specifications, either, is it?
5 A
No, sir.
6 Q
How about the Level 3?
7 A
Yes, sir.
8 0
It would be within the scope of his responsibilities?
9 A
Yes, sir.
10 Q
At the time you hired Mr. Puckett, you also needed Level 11 2 inspectors, didn't you?
12 A
Correct.
Y
{)
13 Q
Did Mr. Puckett meet the requirements of a Level 2 14 inspector?
15 A
Yes, sir.'
16 0
In fact, he would have taken the position of a Level 2 17 inspector if you would have offered it to him, wouldn't I
18 he?
19 A
lou mean prior to my terminating him?
20 Q
No, at the time, on May 15th, when he came for his 21 interview.
22 A
I believe he possibly would.
23 0
It's a fact, is it not, that originally he applied for a i
24 Level 2 position?
( )
25 A
Yes, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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/~T tu) 1 Q
In hindsight, Mr. DeWald, don't you think you hired Mr.
2 Puckett for the wrong position?
3 A
Very possible, sir.
4 Q
Shouldn't you have hired him for a Level 2?
j 5
A Very possible.
6 Q
You made a mistake, didn't you?
7 A
Very possible, sir.
8 Q
And Mr. Paserba, he made a mistake, also, probably, 9
didn't he?
10 A
Very possible.
11 Q
And Mr. Marino?
12 A
Very possible.
13 Q
Don't you think this mistake could have been avoided if 14 you would have been more deliberate, more thorough in 15 the selection process?
16 MR. MILLER:
Your Honor, I am going to 17 object.
18 It seems to me this is beyond the scope of Direct 19 Examination and the question of whether a mistake was 20 made in hiring Mr. Puckett in the first place, I don't 21 know necessarily that it goes to the issues before the 22 Board.
I 23 JUDGE GROSSi4AN:
Well, I am not happy with 24 those questions phrased that way, either; but because
()
25 they are leading -- and I am not so sure whether they Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60154 (312) 232-0262
e 1776
}
1 are legitimately Cross Examination -- but if you would 2
try and phrase those questions so that they are not 3
' quite as leading --
4 MR. BERRY:
Your-Honor, this is Cross 5
Examination; but I will --
6 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Well, that is what I am
.i 7
going to suggest to you, Mr. Berry, that it should be 8
Cross Examination.
~
9 Okay?
10 MR. BERRY:
,Yes, sir.
11 BY MR. BERRY:
12 Q2 Mr. DeWald, does the identificati n of a nonconforming 13 condition require the issuance of an NCR -- strike that.
14 Does the identification of a nonconforming 15 condition require the issuance of a stop work order?
16 A
Not necessarily, sir.
17 Q
Did you give this any attention which stop work order 18 wouldn't be required?
19 A
If it's a procedural violation, such as we just went 20 through on our certifications, updating all those and 21 have to go back through, retrofit, we didn't issue no 22 stop work on those.
23 There are various NCR's that are written out in the 24 field, the work is halted, they are tagged, the
()
25 components are tagged so no future work can be done on Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1777 O
1 them; but there is not a total existing stop work issued 2
on those.
The total issue stop work would come into 3
play, I feel, when there is a complete breakdown of the 4
program or an activity that is being performed in the 5
field.
6 0
But you could -- the work could be stopped -- strike 7
that.
Let me start again.
8 The Welding Inspector could stop work on a 9
particular activity if he identified a nonconforming 10 condition, couldn't he?
11 A
The Welding Inspector in the field has the authority, if
{)
he. sees something detrimental, to go ahead and enact his 12 13 stop, tell the people there or the craft, people, stop 14 the work.
15 He is then to get ahold of a QC Manager, who in 16 turn, I would get ahold of Project Manager, Project 17 Engineer, and we go and investigate the program or the 18 situa' tion.
19 If, in fact, we felt -- or I felt at the time --
20 maybe possibly this is a widespread problem, I would 21 ther; enact a total stop work on that particular 22 activity, yes.
23 0
I will direct your attention to Intervenor Exhibit 10.
24 That is a Comstock memoranda dated May 21, 1984, from
( )
25 yourself or I. DeWald to J. Mennecke/T. Quaka, subject, Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1778 O
1 Worley O. Puckett.
2 MR. MILLER:
I can be of some assistance.
3 Excuse me.
4 Here you go, Irv.
5 (Indicating.)
l J
6 A
All right, sir.
7 BY MR. BERRY:
8 Q
I note that a copy of this memo was sent to Mr. Rolan?
l 9
A Yes, sir.
10 Q
What is Mr. Rolan's position?
11 A
He is the Project Manager.
12 0
That's on the construction side?
{)
13 A
Yes, sir.
14 Q
The memo -- the last sentence in the' memo reads, "Please 15 reply as soon as possible on your review approval."
16 This is in connection with the hiring off Mr.
17 Puckett?
18 A
Yes, sir.
19 Q
Do I understand that this memo is also asking Mr. Rolan 20 to indicate his approval of the decision to hire Mr.
21 Puckett?
22 A
No, sir, it's not for Mr. Rolan's approval.
He is on a 23 copy just for information purposes.
24 Q
Mr. DeWald, you testified or in your testimony you
()
25 indicate during the time that you were a Level 2 Welding Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 601J4 (312) 232-0262 J
1779
(
i 1
Inspector at Braidwood it was the practice to perform a 2
number of inspections and then at a subsequent date or
'3 later time document them?
4 A
Yes, sir.
5 0
Is that the current practice?
6 A
No, sir.
7 0
What is the current practice?
8 A
We document each component on a single inspection 9
report.
10 0
Mr. DeWald, during the period between the time you 11 failed your failed practical examination and your 12
)
successful one, did you sign any quality document, ICR's 13 or NCR's?
14 A
I may have reviewed ICR's and NCR's.
15 MR. BERRY:
One minute, your Honor.
16 BY MR. BERRY:
17 Q
Mr. DeWald, I am going to direct your attention to Page 18 31 of your testimony, Answer 23, the second paragraph, 19 the middle -- toward the middle of the paragraph, where 20 you state, " CECO requested, that I,"
Irv DeWald, " issue 21 a memo notifying all quality control personnel that a 22 meeting would be held at 8:00 A. M. on Monday, April 1, 23 1985.""
24 Do you see that?
()
25 A
That's Page 317 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1780 0
1 Q
Yes, Page 31.
2 A
Okay.
3 Q
Was such a meeting held on a Monday?
4 A
Yes, sir.
5 Q
Who attended that meeting?
6 A
All the QA/QC Department.
7 Q
Comstock QA/QC Department?
8 A
Yes, sir.
9 0
Was anyone else there?
10 A
CECO personnel, I think I remember Dan Shamblin there, I 11 think Ray Preston of Quality First was there.
12 Q
What was the purpose of this meeting?
{}
13 A
The purpose of the meeting was to indicate that there 14 had been a harassment / intimidation incident.
If the 15 inspectors felt there were any more of these incidents, 16 would they please bring them forth.
If they didn't care 17 to do it in that meeting, they could go to both first 18 and identify those, and that Comstock was taking 19 appropriate action, I believe; and I think they 20 indicated there was an investigation.
I am not sure.
21 Q
Mr. Saklak wasn't present at that meeting, was he?
22 A
No, sir.
23 Q
That was because he had been suspended?
24 A
Yes, sir.
()
25 Q
Was that mentioned at the meeting?
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1 A
I am not sure just how it was mentioned.
I believe it 2
was put in the fashion that Comstock was taking 3
appropriate action.
It was asked to implement their 4
Procedure 1.0.0.
5 Q
Is that what you told the inspectors?
The inspectors 6
were told that Comstock had been asked to implement 7
Procedure 1 -- Policy Statement 1.0.0?
8 A
I believe it was.
To the exact words, I am not sure of 9
the exact statements during the meeting; but I feel it 10
- was, 11 Q
Do you know if the inspectors interpreted that, that 12 statement, to mean that Mr. Saklak had been terminated 13 for harassment or intimidation?
14 A
It 's ve ry possible.
15 Q
But to your knowledge, no one said Mr. Saklak was 16 terminated for his involvement in the incident with Mr.
17 Snyder?
18 A
The inspectors didn't come and express their opinions to 19 me, no, sir.
20 Q
At the meeting did yourself or anyone from Commonwealth 21 Edison or did anyone explain that to the inspectors?
22 A
It was explained that harassment or intimidation would 23 not be tolerated by either Comstock or Commonwealth 24 Edison, I do recall that.
( )
25 Q
Mr. DeWald, I believe your testimony is that you learned Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
-em J
s n-e
---w se-
-"4
,4 1782
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of the Saklak/Snyder incident the following day, March 2
29th, at approximately 1:00 P. M.?
i 3
A Yes, sir.
4 Q
And this incident had taken place on March 28th around 5
4:35?
6 A
Yes, sir.
7 Q
And that this was the incident that ultimately led to 8
Mr. Saklak's termination?
9 A
It was.
]i 10 Q
And I believe your testimony is that this was a serious j
11 incident; it was not the proverbial last straw, it was a 12 more serious matter?
[}
13 A
Yes, I feel it was.
14 Q
Do you have a reason or opinion as to why it was not 15 until 1:00 o' clock the following day that you were 16 informed of this?
17 A
I really don't have or know exactly why, other than Mr.
18 Seese came in to ask me about -- I think it was in the 19 afternoon or just prior to at noon, "Did you know that 20 this incident took place?"
I did not know it and that's 21 when I found out about it.
~
22 Q
Mr. Seltmann knew about it, though?
23 A
Mr. Seltmann was involved prior -- well, that evening; 24 and I am not sure he knew at the time whether or not
( )
25 that statement had been said that night.
He was Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois- 0u144 (312) 232 0262
1783 O
1 involved prior to Mr. Saklak stating that threat to Mr.
2 Snyder, I believe.
3 Q
Yes.
Mr. Seltmann knew about that statement on March 4
28th?
5 A
I didn't find out about it until March the'29th in the 6
morning.
7 Q
That's what I am asking you.
8 Do you know why Mr. Seltmann didn't tell you about 9
that?
10 A
No, sir, I don't know why.
1 l
11 I asked him.
He said, "I guess I should have told 12 you," or something to that effect; but., again, I didn't 4
13 find out until after the fact.
14 Q
I believe your testimony is that after you found out --
15 after you learned of this incident, you talked to Mr.
16 Snyder, didn't you?
17 A
Yes, I did.
18 Q
And Mr. Nemeth?
19 A
Yes, sir.
20 Q
How long did you talk to them?
21 A
It was probably about 15 minutes, and then I got a phone 22 call that Mr. Shamblin wanted to see me in his office at 23 3 : 0 0 o ' cl oc k.
24 Q
We.l.1, you talked to Mr. Stewart also then?
( )
25 A
Yes, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1784
)
1 Q
And that was before or after you received the phone call 2
from Mr. Shamblin?
3 A
I don't recall whether I talked to Mr. Stewart after or 4
prior to.
5 Q
It's in your testimony on -- Page 31 of your testimony, 6
states that you learned of the incident at 1:00 o' clock 7
and at approximately 2:45 you were called by Mr.
8 Shamblin; and, as I understand your testimony -- you 9
correct me if I am wrong -- that you talked -- in the 10 meantime you talked to Mr. Snyder, Mr. Nemeth, you 11 talked to Mr. Stewart?
12>
A Okay.
13, Q
And then there was the telephone call?
o 14 A
Yes, sir.,
15 Q
Is that -- does that refresh your recollection as to the 16 sequence of these events?
17 A
Yes.
18 0
So it was approximately an hour and 45 minutes that 19 elapsed from the time you learned of the incident to the 20 time that there is a meeting with Commonwealth Edison?
21 A
Approximately, yes.
22 Q
Did you talk to Mr. Saklak within that time period?
23 A
I don't recall whether I talked to Mr. Saklak within 24 that time period.
I know I talked to him after, when I
( )
25 came back from the meeting.
1 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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()
l 1
Q Prior to receiving this phone call from Mr. Shamblin, 2
had you reached any opinion as to what action, if any, 3
you should take with respect to Mr. Saklak?
4 A
At that time I felt it was a very serious accusation.as 5
far as Mr. Snyder or any other QC inspector.
I wanted 6
to talk to Mr. Saklak before I made up my mind.
My mind.
7 was then on the verge -- on the thought of terminating 8
the individual prior to talking to Mr. Saklak.
9 Q
Mr. DeWald, I believe your testimony is that Mr. -- I am 4
10 going to, change subjects here, to Mr. Seeders -- when he-11 was transferred out of the Calibration' Department, that i
[}
he would be subject to the 90-day new employee policy?
12 13 A
When he went down on the transfer, it was explained to 14 him by Mr. Rolan and the Project Manager, upon 15 acceptance of the transfer, that he would be considered 16 under the 90-day probation period, the same as any new 17 employee, because even though it is called Comstock, it 18 is two different organizations.
19 Q
Was that condition -- was that a company policy or was 20 that Mr. Rolan, his own condition?
i 21 A
That may have been his own condition.
That is another I
22 portion of our company and I really have no control over 23 what Mr. Rolan does, sir.
24 Q
Mr. DeWald, do you believe you are a good manager?
( )
25 A
I think I am, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1786 O
1 Q
You have an open-door policy?
2 A
Yes, sir.
3 Q
Do you meet off -- how often do you meet with Comstock 4
inspectors as a group, if ever?
5 A
I meet with my supervisors once a week.
6 Q
Do you ever meet with the line inspectors?
7 A
I try to get out as much as possible when-they have 8
their weekly meeting with their supervisors.
Sometimes 9
it is not possible for me to get out at the particular 10 time they have it scheduled.
S 11 Q
Well, you have been a QC Manager at Braidwood for --
12 since September, 1,9837 13 A
September, 1983, yes, sir.
14 Q
How often during that time would you say you have met 15 with the QC inspectors as a group?
16 A
Up until approximately a year ago, until our group got 17 extremely big, I used to assemble every Friday if 18 possible, and we would have a get-togethar, a QC meeting 19 on Fridays.
20 As the group got bigger and in order to still keep 21 the communication between the inspector and myself, 22 relying on my supervisors again, they hold a weekly 23 meeting at a certain time or day, with their inspectors, 24 and this is on a weekly basis.
()
25 I then meet with my supervisors once a week.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, 1111nois bu144 (312) 232-0262
1787 1
Q Do you have a practice of praising or rewarding your 2
Comstock inspectors when they do a good job?
3 A
I have on occasion sent out memos, I think, of' 4
appreciation.
5 I have personally gone out and told the individual 6
a couple of times that he is doing a good job, that he 7
has done a good job.
8 I can't do it to every individual,155 people.
9 Q
I direct your attention to Answer 24, Page 33 of your 10 testimony, and this is where you identify a number of 11 corrective actions taken after Mr. Saklak's termination.
12
{)
It appears and I think you testified that you made 13 a recommendation that Comstock "should identify better 14 methods for communication between management and QC 15 i,
inspectors; as an example, the purpose of our daily 16 status reports should be more thoroughly explained."
17 You adopted that recommendation, didn't you?
18 A
Yes, we did.
19 Q
How has it worked out?
20 A
We explained the -- how we use the status reports and 21 what they are used for, how we derive the figures and so 22 forth, so that everybody understood why we had them, 23 what we used them for, s.tatus of a job, possibly 24 establishing end dates and so forth with them.
( )
25 I think it worked out well.
4 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 Q
Has anyone complained -- in your opinion -- strike that.
?
Why didn't you adopt this recommendation or take 3
action similar to this sooner?
4 A
We had explained it already.
We just reiterated the 5
subject.
6 Q
Another recommendation that Edison made was that you 7
should review the need for interpersonal skills training 8
for management and supervisors; correct?
9 A
Yes, sir.
10 Q
And you adopted that recommendation, also?
11 A
Yes, sir.
12 Q
How has that worked out?
{}
13 A
I think it was very beneficial to take it.
The 14 supervisors all felt, that took -it, that it was -- it 15 helped them in getting along, in trying to direct the 16 people in ti.e day-to-day work.
It also helped them in 17 communicating a little better.
18 I also felt it was a good ref resher for myself, as 19 I have had serious supervisory -- several supervisory 20 training sessions throughout the Navy and so forth, and 21 it did.
It enabled me, also, in bringing back some of 22 my own personal skills.
23 Q
Is this just a one-time course or --
24 A
It was a one-week half-day course, so that we wouldn't
()
25 tie up and have areas unsupervised; but it went for the Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, 1111nois culae (312) 232-0262
1789 O
1 whole week.
2 The construction group also put their supervisory 3
personnel in there and went through the same thing.
4 Q
Have you had any new members of your management or 5
supervisory team since the time this training session 6
was held?
7 A
Yes, sir, I believe there has been a couple added.
8 Q
Have they undergone a similar training?
9 A
No, sir.
10 Q
Do you think Mr. Saklak could have benefited from having 11 attended this training course?
12 A
I believe it would have helped Mr. Saklak.
13 MR. BERRY.:
Thank you, Mr. DeWald.
14 -
JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Mr. Berry, let me clarify a 15 statement that the Board made.
16 You are not an adverse party to either of the two 17 parties in here and, necessarily, some of your 18 examination will be to the effect of bolstering Direct 19 Examination, in other cases it will be critical of the 20 Direct Examination.
21 We expect that when you are attempting to elicit 22 answers that are supportive of Direct Examination and of 23 the party supplying the witness, that your questioning 24 will be a little more neutral, so that you do not
()
25 suggest answers favorable to the witness and the Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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1 parties.
2 On the other hand, when the questioning is critical 3
of the witness, you ought to be asking leading 4
questions, because you can expect that you are going to 5
get the answers you think you should get by asking 2
6 neutral questions.
7 So you do have to make some judgment as to whether 8
you are supplying the witness with favorable answers or j
9 whether you are attempting to elicit unfavorable 10 testimony when you do phrase your questions.
11 So I think that explains the Board's position on 12 i
that; and you can't just assume that because you are
{}
13 called cross examining, that you are always entitled to 14 ask whatever leading questions you wish to ask.
15 Okay.
I have one or two questions.
16 BOARD EXAMINATION 17 BY JUDGE GROSSMAN:
18 Q
Mr. DeWald, when you hired people for the QC position, 19 didn't you ordinarily hire them subject to background 20 checks?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 Q
Y'ou indicated that you had a shortage of Level 2 23 inspectors at the time you hired Mr. Puckett.
24 Did you also have a shortage at the time you
()
25 terminated him?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1791 1
A Yes, sir.
2 Q
Do you know whether Mr. Puckett would have accepted a 3
Level 2 position at the time he was terminated?
4 A
I had thought of offering that position, sir.
Mr.
5 Puckett was making $18.50 an hour; if I would have 6
offered him that position and dropped him to $12 an 7
hour, I felt Mr. Puckett would have been more 8
dissatisfied and created more dissension, so I did not 9
of fer the Level 2 position.
10 0
Sir, if you do not have a complete QA breakdown, but the 11 construction people are creating discrepant conditions
[}
_ by a particular procedure they are using, should you 12 13 allow the work to continue so that more discrepant 14 conditions are being created?
15 A
I am a little confused as to the magnitude of what you 16 are talking about as far as discrepant conditions.
17 If it's minor discrepant conditions that can be 18 repaired, such as a small welding defect, these 19 deficiencies would be picked up on an Inspection 20 Correction Report.
21 If they are major items which affects numerous or 22 plant-wide items or the whole total procedure, they are 23 not complying with the whole total procedure and we have 24 a series of major breakdowns throughout the thing, an
()
25 NCR would be written and stop work would be placed on Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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]
4 1
that.
2 0
What if there is an improper weld that is being 3
performed by your welders and a QC inspector sees that 4
and anticipates that that improper weld was going to be 5
performed on a number of future -- or that improper 6
procedure is going to be performed on future welds, 7
should he allow that condition to continue so that the 8
future welds are made improperly?
9 A
No, sir.
We would write a nonconformance report on 10 that, and through the disposition of the nonconformance 11 report we would then identify how or with the resolution 12 of this.
{}
13 Q
Yes, but I am asking now about a stop work order.
14 Should you allow the work to continue while the NCR 15 is being processed so that the improper welds are 16 continued, continually being produced?
17 A
In this particular situation, the procedure was 18 correctly qualified.
We had one position that was not 19 correctly qualified.
We knew exactly or could tell what 20 installations were put in by this particular procedure 21 and --
22 0
Well, I was asking you a question in general; but you 23 are referring now to the 2-G position?
24 A
Yes, sir.
( )
25 Q
Well, okay.
Let's assume that that is the case and that Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1793
' O 1
the welding and welding in the 2-G position was being 2
performed improperly.
3 Should the welding continue with an improper 4
welding procedure in a 2-G position?
5 A
What we would have done is -- should have done is an NCR 6
be written and we brought the welder back in and 7
qualified to the 2-G positions, or any welders that is 8
qualified to the stainless position, not allow any 2-G 9
welding at all, not totally shut the whole stainless 10 program down, if you have an installation where you want 11 to.put two vertical welds on, that would be the total 12 amount of welds, there is no reason to shut those down 13 other than we had to requalify for the 2-G position.
14 Q
But in that particular example, then, you should at 15 least stop work on the 2-G position welds, should you 16 not?
17 A
Yes, sir.
18 Q
With regard to improper welds in joining two pieces of l
19 thin material, let's assume the welds are done 20 improperly for thin material, should not that --
21 shouldn't the welding stop in joining the sheet material 22 rather than continue. jrope rly?
23 A
On thin material, if I use the AWS, and the original 24 specification, like the 1975, that was in the original
( )
25 contract, I am required to initiate a PQR for the metals Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1794 1
not listed in D-175, although sheet metal is not listed 2
in there, I can use that D-175 pre-qualify -- not 3
pre-qualify -- but qualify that particular joint and 4
initiate NCR to cover all the other prior welds of that.
5 The other should stop until I have a PQR that would 6
cover that.
7 Q
Mr. DeWald, presumably, if a further procedure is 8
specified for thin material, doesn't that presume that 9
the present procedure is some way inadequate in joining l
10 thin material?
11 MR. MILLER:
Judge Grossman, just as a matter 12 of clarification, is it the Comstock welding procedure 13 or the welding code that is the subject of your
~
14 question?
15 I don't mean to interfere at all with the Board's 16 examination; but I believe that the thin material has 17 come up in connection with Mr. Guild's question at 18 least, with a version of the AWS code and not 19 necessarily the procedure.
But I --
20 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I am not sure I understand 21 the objection to the question.
22 MR. MILLER:
I am really not objecting; but 23 I'm --
24 BY JUDGE GROSSMAN:
()
25 Q
My understanding of what Mr. DeWald indicated was that Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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there was a procedure in force at a certain time --
2 A
Yes, sir.
3 0
-- that was later changed to accommodate thinner 4
material; isn't that correct, sir?
5 A
Yes, sir, D-13.
6 0
Which may not have been in effect when your original 7
welding inspections were adopted --
8 A
Yes, sir.
9 0
-- is that correct?
10 A
Yes, sir.
11 Q
Now, presumably when the later procedure was adopted 12
[}
with regard to thinner materials, it was adopted because j
13 of an inadequacy or what was presumed to be an 14 inadequacy in the e'xisting procedure; isn't that 15 correct?
16 A
Now you are talking about the AWS codes?
17 Q
Yes.
18 A
That's what it was adopted for in the front part of the 19 AWS manual -- I am not sure which -- and with the S & L 20 specifica tions, it allows the contractor to continue 21 with the old specification as long as wt applied by the 22 older specification in qualifying such welds.
23 0
Well, what then would be the purpose of having the new I
24 specification if the field specification was fully
()
25 adequate to handle the entire range of welds?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 A
I think the AWS, the American Welding Society, came out e
with a more clarifying specification for sheet metal, as i
3 it wasn't totally really addressed in AWS Dl.1-1975.
4 Q
Well, didn't the new specification then distinguish in 5
some way e different procedure for welding than the 6
general specification?
7 A
Yes, sir.
It gives different welder qualification.
It l
8 also givec different tests and so forth that you do on i
9 sheet metal.
10 Q
Presumably, that was an improvement, was it not, over l
11 the original specifications?
[]}
12 A
I would say it is improvement; although we were still
~
13 and pe rf orming satisfactory D1.1-1975 's.
14 Q
Was there anything wrong with a QC inspector, that you 15 use the improved specification for the thinner material 16 than the overall original specification that covered all 17 thicknesses?
18 A
There is nothing wrong with him recommending it, no.
19 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I have no further questions.
20 JUDGE COLE:
Just a couple of questions.
21 BOARD EXAMINATION 22 BY JUDGE COLE:
23 Q
Do you have a copy of yesterday's transcript, sir?
24 A
No, sir.
(
25 MR. MILLER:
I will make it availaole.
It's Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, 1111nois 6U134 (312) 232-0262
1797
(
1 right here?
2 A
Okay.
3 JUDGE COLE:
There is just a small point I i
4 want to get straightened out, sir.
4 5
BY JUDGE COLE:
6 Q
Transcript Page 1650, at that transcript page there is a 7
question asked you on Line 17 and your answer appears on 8
line 21.
9 Could you look at that answer and could you read 10 that, sir?
11 MR. MILLER:
Do you want him to just read it I {}
to himself, Judge Cole?
12 13 JUDGE COLE:
Just to himself, yes.
14 BY JUDGE COLE:
15 0
I rec:11 you giving that answer yesterday, sir; but I 16 think the punctuation is a little bit different in your 17 response.
You say, "I don't believe his credentials, 18 no, sir," period.
19 That's not what you meant, sir, is it?
20 A
No, it isn't.
I never doubted his credentials or 21 indicated that he falsified them.
22 0
What you meant to say there is, "I don't believe he 23 falsified his credentials"; is that correct?
24 A
Yes, sir.
()
25 Q
That was my understanding of your answer.
It' just came Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1798 O
1 out wrong in the transcript.
2 Sir, on Page 17 of your testimony, in the last part 3
o'f your answer to Question 11, you state,that, " CECO 4
contracted with BESTCO to supply QC inspectors."
5 I would like to ack you some questions about 6
BESTCO, sir.
7 What, if any, relationship exists between Comstock 8
and BESTCO?
9 A
We have communications back and forth.
There is no
- 10 contractual agreements.
Is that what you --
11 Q
They are independent of each other?
(}
12 A
Yes, sir.
13 0
In your testimony you indicate that you are employed b:.
14 Comstock --
15 A
Yes.
16 Q
-- is that correct, sir?
17 A
Yes, sir.
18 Q
You have approximately 155 people in the quality control 19 group that you supervise?
20 A
Yes, sir.
21 Q
And for whom do they work?-
22 A
They -- we supervise these quality control programs for 23 Comstock, in that we supervise the area of inspections, 24 the quality control manual itself, implementing that.
().25 BESTCO has the terminations, the personnel Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60144 (312) 232-0262
i 1799
().
1 problems, the union problems, things of this nature.
2 Our responsibility ends when it's outside of the 3
quality control area.
i 4
Q So BESTCO does the hiring ani firing and the paying of 5
both quality control people that work for you?
6 A
Yes, sir.
They control the quality assurance engineers, i
j 7
the document review personnel, the QC inspectors and the i
8 document control clerks.
9 Q
So you have responsibility for the work that these 10 people do, but you do not have any authorization to hire J
11 them and fire them?
~
12 A
No, sir.
They send us -- as far as hiring, they will
{}
i 13 send us an individual that is supposed to meet our 14 qualifications per our QC procedure for certification; 15 and if we feel we have problems with the individual, we i
16 will get with BESTCO, talk over the proolems, along with 1
17 the Union Steward; and we do not terminate them.
We 18 send them back to BESTCO for their termination or 19 disposition.
20 Q
You have BESTCO personnel -- other than the -people that 21 work for you, you have BESTCO people on the site?
l 22 A
Yes, sir.
I believe there are BESTCO people working for 23 Gust K. Newberg.
24 Q
So you have BESTCO supervisory people on the site that
( )
25 have the hiring and firing power?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1800 (1) 1 A
Yes, sir.
There is a BESTCO manager.
2 Q
And where are they physically located with respect to 3
your office?
They have an office in the quality control 4
section or are they some place else on the site?
5 A
No, sir.
They have a trailer on the site for their 6
office.
7 Q
All right, sir.
8 You say they provide quality control / quality 9
assurance people for other contractors on site, also?
10 A
Yes, sir.
11 Q
Do they have all the quality assurance / quality control 12
)
on the site?
13 A
I don't believe they have them all.
Pittsburgh Testing 14 Laboratory, I think, is independent of BESTCO.
l 15 Q
This arrangement appears to be considerably different l
16 than the arrangement that you had prior to July of 1985, 17 when CECO contracted with BESTCO.
18 Is it fair to say that, sir?
19 A
Yes, sir.
20 Q
Have you found this to be a problem with respect to your 21 authority over your people?
22 A
No, sir.
It seems to work out quite well.
23 Q
Do you have any idea why in July, 1985, that CECO did, 24 in fact, contract with BESTCO?
( )
25 A
Yes, sir, I have an idea.
Sonntag Ee:)orting Service, Ltd.
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O 1
Q Could you tell me why, sir?
2 A
This was just prior to their contracting.
July 23,rd, 1
Comstock and Local Union 306 were in the negotiation 4
stage and neither party could get, should you say, the 5
happy medium and sign a contract.
6 And there were threats of walkouts, threats of 7
strikes.
The inspectors were unruly at the time.
They 8
would at times go to supervisors to see if they would 9
flare-up; but all of this led to like a stalemate in the 10 negotiations; and the way things were, I feel CECO felt 11 the best way to go was cancel Comstock's contract, with 12
{}
supplying the QC inspectors and some of the QC 13 personnel, and bringing in an independent contractor, 14 such as BESTCO, which would deal with the hiring, the 15 firing, the union, as they already had a union contract 16 with them at the time; and it seems to have worked out
~
17 fairly well.
18 Q
All right, sir.
Thank you.
19 Looking again on Page 17 of your testimony, in the 20 last part of the last part of your answer to Question 21 11, you indicate that Comstock " ordered an immediate 22 layof f of all personnel, except managers, supervisors 23 and secretaries"; and "The personnel who were laid off 24 were re-hired by BESTCO the next day."
()
25 Does that mean, sir, that the manager and Sonntag Reporting' Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1802 O
1 supervisors and secretaries in the _ Control Department at 2
Comstock still worked for Comstock or are these 3
supervisors and secretaries working for BESTCO?
4 A
No, sir.
They work for Comstock.
5 0
So the -- so all four of your supervisors you have, they 6
are Comstock employees?
7 A
All supervisors are Comstock employees, as well as the 8
secretary.
9 Q
But you indicated that you had divided into more groups, 10 so you required more supervisors?
11 A
Yes, sir.
(]}
12 0
, So what would you do?
13 Normally, you would either interview applicants for 14 the job or select from your group of QC inspectors 15 people that you would consider to be suitable for 16 supervisory work and then interview them and then in
]
17 effect get them from BESTCO, hire them at Comstock.
18 Is that how you would do that, sir?
Isn't-that how 19 you have done that?
20 A
No, sir.
21 Q
How do you do that?
22 A
If we ever hire a supervisor, we go outside of BESTCO.
23 Prior to BESTCO taking over, we had promoted a 24 couple of our Level 2 inspectors, who have been on the
( )
25 site for a while, we promoted them to supervisors.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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Q So now you just go outside?
2 A
Yes, sir.
3 0
Is this a source of dissatisfaction for the Quality 4
Control Inspectors who might be looking forward to a 5
promotion?
6 A
It could possibly be, yes.
7 Q
All right.
I believe you already answered the question 8
that I asked about:
Do you think that this arrangement 9
has an impact on the authority that you have over the 10 Quality Control Inspectcrs in doing their job.
11 Do you think it had an impact, positive or 12
{}
negative?
13 A
I think it's had a positive impact.
Only to deal with 14 supervising the QA/QC area and the people as far as 15 conversations and the quality control work, we no longer 16 have to deal with the hiring and firing, the personnel 17
-- I can't recall the word I want -to say; but the 18 correction with personal problems or --
19 Q
I understand what you are getting at, sir.
20 A
But it has really enhanced our program.
21 Q
I guess I am still a little troubled.
22 Does BESTCO have supervisory people that are 23 working directly with'.the QC inspectors similar to the j
24 way the -- you had supervisors before?
/-
25 A
Of the good skill people, we have what are called Lead l
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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Inspectors that is over a group,.and a Lead Inspector is 2
like a foreman and he is a BESTCO foreman.
3 JUDGE COLE:
That's all.
4 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
By the way, let's establish 5
ground rules for the Board questioning.
6 We would certainly entertain objections to Board Of 'ourse, we are not going to vote on 7
questioning.
c 8
that; but the Judge who is questioning will take that 9
into account in deciding whether to overrule the 10 objection.
So if there are any, feel free to object to 11 any of the judges questioning at the time.
12 MR. MILLER:
Yes, sir.
Judge Grossman, I
{'}
13 really didn't pose an objection as,such.
14 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I wasn't even referring to 15 anything.
I don't even recall that anyone objected to 16 anything; but I just want to point out that we consider 17 that appropriate, if you feel that there is anything 18 objectionable.
19 JUDGE CALLIHAN:
I would like to continue, 20 Mr. DeWald, on my colleagues' questions, just to get a 21 better picture of the organization in the -- can you 22 hear me?
23 THE WITNESS:
yes, sir.
24 JUDGE CALLIHAN:
Can you hear me?
( )
25 MR. GUILD:
It's fine.
1 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 BOARD EXAMINATION:
2 BY JUDGE CALLIHAN:
3 Q
To put it bluntly:
What does Comstock do at the 4
Braidwood site?
5 We have learned what you do and what your people 6
~~
do.
7 What else does Comstock do?
8 A
Comstock does all of the electrical installations for 9
the plant for everything except the Unit 2 containment 10 as far as cable tray conduit installation, of which Gust 11 K. Newberg is responsible for.
12 Q
So your ggroup -- and I will have to use personal
)
13 pronouns here for generic purposes.
Please understand
-(
14 why I use them.
15 Your group then has the responsibility of keeping 16 tabs on Comstock's production activities?
17 A
Yes, sir.
18 Q
And you do that through the assignment to BESTCO, who i
19 are the people who actually do-the work out in the 20 field; true?
21 A
We do that by assigning BESTCO people to the various 22 areas of inspection, yes, sir.
23 Q
Therefore, for these various functions, all electrical, i
24 Comstock is a subcontractor of Commonwealth Edison?
( )
25 A
Sargent & Lundy.
i Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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O 1
Q True?
2 A
Sargent & Lundy.
3 Q
Of Sargent & Lundy.
4 Sargent & Lundy is somewhere in the pipeline 5
between Comstock and Commonwealth Edison?
6 A
They are the prime contractor, yes, sir.
7 Q
Now, where does Pittsburgh Testing Laboratory fit into 8
this picture?
9 Is it a direct contractor with Sargent & Lundy, 10 also?
11 A
It's a direct contractor, I bel'ieve, to CECO.
They do a 12 series of overview inspections on the inspections an 13 performed by Comstock inspectors.
14 Q
Then, of course, just to attempt to round this out a 15 bit, there are contractors that do piping and contract 16 and plumbing and that sort of thing?
17 A
Yes, sir.
18 Q
And those contractors also have their own quality 19 control / quality assurance arm which looks after or looks 20 into the work of those particular contractors?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 0
I have two things, and I will probably jump from here to 23 there, but I am sure you can handle it.
I will try to 24 be identifying in my subject.
I am sure you are capable
( )
25 of picking it up.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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l Some time in March, I guess, the 29th of March, and q
2 I guess it's 1985, the date of which there has been 3
considerable discussion, there was made known to 4
somebody some dissatisfactions along a number of Quality 5
Control Inspectors, and that number is 24 or 26 or 6
something like that.
7 Now, have I identified my follow-up?
Are you with 8
me so far?
9 A
Those are the individuals that went to the NRC.
10 Q
Yes, the 24 individuals.
11 How many peers did they have at the time?
This was 12 24 out of how many inspectors, I guess, within Comstock?
13 We will start there, at any rate.
14 At that time how many inspectors did Comstock have 15 of that group, from that group came the 24?
16 A
At least -- I think what you are asking me is how many 17 of Comstock's QC inspector was out of that 247 18 Q
From what size group did the 24 come?
19 A
I am not sure of the actual count.
I think it was 20 around --
21 Q
Put it in round numbers, 100, 2007 22 A
It would maybe be around, I would say, 80, 90, maybe 23 less.
24 Q
Close to 100.
( )
25 Do you have any information as to why this Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312). 232-0262
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1 particular group of 24 made a complaint or made their 2
contact with NRC, I guess it was?
3 A
This was directly af ter the Rick Snyder -- Rick Saklak 4
and Richard Snyder incident.
It was, I believe -- if I 5
am not mistaken, six of them went over earlier; then I 6
am not sure whether the four went over the following day 7
or the remainder went over the following day, but it was 8
over the incident with Mr. Saklak.
9 I think what they felt probably was, "This is a 10 chance where we know we are going to have to get rid of 11 Mr. Saklak."
He was not a very well-liked person.
12 O
Were these individuals that had had direct contact with
{)
13 Mr. Saklak or vice versa or were these individuals who 14 worked under Mr. Saklak's supervision, if that's a 15 proper term?
16 A
I believe, yes, there were quite a few of them that 17 worked under Mr. Saklak.
18 Q
So there is at least one indication, one would say, of a 19 pattern identifying these 24 people?
20 A
I would say yes.
21 Q
When did this occur in time with reference to -- well, 22 let me ask a leading question first.
23 Is there a bargaining unit among these inspectors, 24 of which, in turn, there are the 24 representatives?
( )
25 A
Yes, there are.
I think there was a couple or maybe Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Ueneva,'2) 1111nois ou144 (31 232-0262
1809 O
1 three that was in the bargaining unit.
2 Q
Is there a bargaining unit today?
3 A
No, air, not with Comstock.
4 Q
Well, parenthetically, does BESTCO have a bargaining 5
unit to which belong the group of which the 24 is the 6
representation?
7 A
I do not know.
That I can't answer you.
8 Q
Well, to go back then to the March 29th date.
9 Where does that date fit into the established 10 number of men working on the unit?
11 A
If vote was ratified in April of 1985, when the incident 12 had happened, we had yet to haye the vote ratified, I 13 believe March, April, yes; and things were not going 14 quite well.
The inspectors were very discontented that 15 the vote had not yet been ratified, as the vote had been 16 taken in November of the following year of 1984; and it 17 had been appealed by Comstock and by an individual 18 within the voting body who did not really want the 19 union; and it took until, like I say, until the voting 20 body or the vote was ratified.
21 All through this period the union was still having j
22 their meetings and little get-togethers and so forth 23 throughout the area of the plant.
When they would see 1
24 us come up, they would break it up and go in other
( )
25 directions, and I believe that was part of the reason, Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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i 1
also.
2 Q
Is it a fair statement that March 29, 1985, fell within 3
a conformity period of the bargaining unit?
4 A
I believe they had already had their bargaining people 5
set up, but the vote wasn't ratified yet.
]
6 Q
So it was in the transition stage?
7 A
It was in the transition.
8 Q
One question I should have asked before, and I apologize 9
for asking it coming back to Comstock.
10 Is Comstock a nationwide outfit or does it have 11 activities or do its business at places other than 12 Braidwood?
' hey are nationwide.
13 A
No, sir.
T 14 0
Where is headquarters?
15 A
Danbury, Connecticut.
16 Q
I wonder if you would kindly, briefly, and, perhaps, 17 hurriedly, nonetheless firmly, lead me through the steps 18 of an examination necessary to the certification of a 19 QA/QC inspector, and let's say Level 3, just to be 20 definitive, and we will narrow it further and ask you to 21 do this for what I think you call a practical side as 22 contrasted to the written..
23 Could you just hit the high spots of what the 24 candidate is expected to look at and do an evaluation,
( )
25 please?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd. ---
Geneva, 1111nois eulae (312) 232-0262
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A Okay.
The Level 3 inspector is supposed to -- or 2
according to our procedure, takes the same training that 3
the Level 2 inspector does.
He takes the one-hour 4
lecture, which is like a familiarization of the 5
drawings, the plant and so forth, the getting him 6
acclimated somewhat of into the area where he is going.
7 The next, the eight-hour lecture that he gets, this 8
is a lecture / demonstration type as to familiarize him 9
with the possible inspection methods that are used per 10 our procedures that may have been different at a plant 11 that he came from, and the area of the plants, he is 12 taken.out, walked around and so forth.
13 He then goes through a 40-hour on-the-job training 1
14 with other Level 2 inspectors doing actual field 15 inspections.
16 Once he gets the 40-hour training in, he then --
17 the Level 2 giving the training sends in an evaluation, 18 says he feels this individual is ready to take and be 19 tested.
He is then given the general inspection 20 proficiency test which is applicable to that particular 21 area of inspection.
It's a 40 question test taken out 22 of a test bank of 80 questions and these questions are 23 selected at random so that the same question is not i
24 given to different individuals.over a period of time or i
l
( )
25 the same test is not made up.
'1 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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i 1
Once he passes the general proficiency tests =and 2
the minimum score is a score of 80, he then is given a 3
practical exam.
j 4
This practical exam has to have accept / reject. items 5
in it which are known and the individual has to find 6
these.
He must get a score of 100 percent on the 7
accept / reject practical exam.
i 8
Once he complies with all of these, then he is 9
given the certification, whether it be a Level 2'or a 10 Level 3.
11 Q
These entities which are hardware and at which he looks, 12 are those. parts of the installation or are these.
4 13 something made up in a shop especially for the 14 examination?
l 15 A
It could be mock-ups that we have in the training room 16 or it could be the actual installation out in the field.
l 17 In the majority of cases it is much easier if we 18 have one out in-the field.
19 Q
Is a prerequisite for certification of an inspector, no j-20 matter, capability of a' welder, that is it necessary 21 that before a -- an inspector can be zade an inspector, 22 he must have -- he must be a level something welder?
23 A
No, sir.
t j
24 Q
Is it desirable?
( )
25 A
It would be desirable, yes, sir.
t j
Sonntag Reporting Service,- Ltd.
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1 Q
But it's not a recommendation?
2 A
Right.
3 Q
I have one transcript item I would like to touch on.
4 This touches on Intervenors' Exhibit 8, if you have a 5
copy, and I don't have -- I think I can ask what I want 6
from it.
Let me just identify it and you can pick it up 7
from there.
8 It's a communication to -- well, maybe I am wrong 9
in my n umbe r.
Let me tell you what it is.
10 At some time in the formulation of your endeavor to 11 get, quote, " caught up," unquote, on a backlog of 12 documents, there was prepared a list of actions, one of 13 which -- and the one I want to speak to -- was an 14 agreement, a plan or an obligation to keep somebody over 15 in the production line advised of how you were doing, 16 how you had dug into the backlog of reports.
17 Now have I made myself clear?
18 A
I think it was that I was to report to Mr. Shamblin at 19 3:00 P. M.
20 Q
Was this addressed to Mr. Shamblin?
21 A
I think Mr. Shamblin put the letter out you are speaking 22 of.
23 Q
It was something that you had to do every Monday?
24 A
Yes.
I believe that came from Mr. Shamblin.
( )
25 Q
At the time that this was discussed on yesterday or the Sonntag Reporting Se rvice, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312)
'232-0262
l 1814
(. ) -
1 day bef ore probably, at transcript Page 11 -- I am' sorry 2
-- 1331, the counsel for the Applicant made the point 3
that the, quote " reporting" is the word used in the 4
document.
This is a word I am objecting to, was to be 5
considered in the context of the document.
6 You may have noticed that I changed that word in my 7
description to " advised or informed."
8 There was agreement with the Applicant's counsel 9
request; yet, a couple of pages later on 1333, the 10 subject comes up again, with the connotation,- at any 11 rate, that the word " report" in quotation marks, is an 12 organizatonal matter.
13 Now, have I given you enough background so you 14 understand what I am referring to?
15 A
I understand the document that you are referring to, 16 yes.
17 Q
All right.
Now, can you tell us what the word, quote, 18
" report," unquote, in that document, that Monday 19 obligation, "every Monday" obligation means?
20 A
This is my interpretation of the report.
He had the 21 meeting scheduled where every Monday at 3:00 P. M. we 22 was to go in and report the statuses of the areas that 23 were in question at the time.
24 Q
Sir, you don't disagree with my change of the word
( )
25
" report" to say " inform or advise"?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60144 (312) 232-0262
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1 A
No, sir.
2 Q
To whomever this was addressed, Commonwealth, I assume, J
3 in no way dates your responsibilities or your salary or i
4 your days off; true?
5 A
This reporting?
2 6
Q Yes.-
j 7
A No, sir.
8 Q
So it's not an organizatonal report?
9 A
No, sir.
10 Q
It's just pure exchange of information?
11 A
Between the Licensee -- letting the Licensee know where 12 we are,at and at the same time anybody else that is in 13 the meeting.
14 0
That is the clarification that I wanted to make in the' 15 transcript.
16 A
And if we were having any problems, things like that, 17 needed aid from somebody else or whatever.
18 Q
While we are on that subject, is it true that at times 19 you were several tens.of thousands of reports behind in 1
a 20 their preparation and certification?
21 Is that related?
22 A
I believe 6,000 is what the document says.
23 Q
What is the impact on production of that rather gross --
24 in my uneducated opinion ---that rather gross, quote, j
( )
25 "being behind," unquote?
Things stop, the wheels stop Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1 j
1816 t
()
u i
1 turning or torches turned off?
2 A
One of the main impacts that you would have with'that 3
amount of inspections being behind, there is no way that 4
you can actually trend, as far as inspection correction 5
reports or NCR's, because it's old work that was done, I j
6 should~say, a long time ago.
l 7
The reason we try to stay timely and with 8
construction, if a trend develops, we know and can track 9
that and can identify the trend right away instead of 10 from a latter period of time where if you are back in l
11 the latter period of time, you really-just can't 12 identify the trend because you are not up to date with 4
13
-- or up to date with the construction practices at that i
i 14 time.
15 Q
Let's pick out one, any one of this several thousand i
16 reports.
I have no idea what it might apply, but I am i
17 sure you do.
i 18 Does it mean that operation that. report concerns is 19 in abeyance until the report is written or issued or 4
i 20 whatnot?
l 21 A
I think what you are asking me is if it's not inspected, 22 is this still in abeyance or hanging out?
7 23 It would be until such time as it was inspected.
l I
24 It would be counted as an incompleted item.
( )
25 Did I answer your question?
i i
F
-Sonntag Reporting-Service, Ltd.
I Geneva, Illinois 0U1J4 j
(312) 232-0262
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1 1
Q Could it have an effect on scheduling.or the absence of 2
the operation, issuance of the report, have an effect on 3
scheduling?
4 A
Very possible, depending on either, also on the 5
operation of something.
6 Q
A reasonable expectation is that, in the end, 7
Commonwealth Edison has some need to know how your 8
report program is going along?
j 9
A Yes, sir.
10 Q
And that was the intent of the Monday meetings?
11 A
Yes, sir.
12 Q
Thank you.
There was some discussion about 1,166 welds 13 in some period of time.
14 As I understand it, 1,166 appears on a report?
15 A
Yes, sir.
16 Q
And if I remember, this occurrence was some time in 197 17 something,1979 I have?
18 A
Yes.
19 Q
Further, the matter surfaced in some manner or other in 20 1984; true?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 O
In that period were there changes in the attributes, the 23 listing of the attributes -- the selection of the 24 attributes, in the intensity of the inspection, that
()
25 made the later -- made inspections at the later date, Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1818 1
1984, more severe than they might have been in 1979?
2 A
I would say no.
3 Today the inspection attributes have been clarified i
4 and broken up, to where there are more attributes but 5
they are specifically outlined and give more 6
clarification for the inspector.
7 Q
These 1,100 odd items to which there have been a 8
reference -- and I come back to this time interval, 9
1979-1984, if that would be correct -- was there any 10 repair, to pick a prosaic word, of any of those items 11 between those two dates?
s 12 Were these reinspections, for example, or as I i
13 think the lingo of the trade has it, "over inspections,"
i 14 or were these all first go-around?
15 A
These were the first go-around inspections on this 16 particular document.
17 Q
I think you said that you really didn't know when the 18 1,166 inspections were done?
19 A
That's correct.
20 0
They may have been done over a period of time; right?
21 A
Yes, sir.
22 JUDGE CALLIHAN:
Thank you very much.
23
,THE WITNESS:
You are welcome.
j 24 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Before we go on to Redirect
( )
25
. ithin the scope, of course, of the Cross and the w
I-Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois -bu1J4
]
(312) 232-0262
1819 1
Board's questioning, let's have a discussion off the l
2 record as to what the timing is here.
3 (There followed a discussion outside 4
the record.)
5 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
We will take a ten-minute 1
6 break.
7 (Whereupon a recess was had, after which 8
the hearing resumed as follows:)
9 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Okay.
We are back in 10 session.
11 Mr. Miller, you may proceed with your redirect.
12 MR. MILLER:
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13 REDIRECT EXAMINATION e
14 BY MR. MILLER:
15 Q
Mr. DeWald, I believe in response to a question by Judge 16 Callihan as to the status of Sargent & Lundy, if my 17 notes are correct, I think you described them as the 18 prime contractor at the Braidwood site.
19 What is the function of Sargent & Lundy at the 20 Braidwood site, sir?
21 A
They are the architectural engineers that designed the 22 plant.
23 Q
Do they have any responsibilities outside of their 24 design and engineering functions that you know of?
( )
25 A
They give final approval on procedures.
They are the Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
-wr m,y 9-w
..We-
1820 O
1 ones that revise the drawings and so forth.
2 Q
Thank you, sir.
3 I think -- again, just to direct your attention to 4
the subject matter -- Judge Cole asked some questions 5
concerning supervisors that might be hired by Comstock 6
now that BESTCO is the employer of the QC Inspectors.
7 Do you remember those questions?
8 A
Yes.
9 Q
First of all, have there been any supervisory positions 10 open up in Comstock since BESTCO took over?
11 A
Yes, I believe there has been.
r" 12 O
What prohibition, if any>, is there on a QC Inspector V) 13 employed by BESTCO from applying for a supervisor's job?
14 A
Really, there is none, except that we just gpt them from 15 possibly our other sites and so forth.
1 16 Q
When you say possibly get them from other sites, you 17 aean your supervisors?
18 A
Yes.
19 0
There has been a number of questions by Mr. Guild and by 20 the Board concerning codes and specifications and 21 procedures.
22 Would you describe for the Board and the parties 23 what function the AWS Code serves in connection with 24 Comstock's scope of work?
( )
25 A
AWS is the specification that Sargent & Lundy adopted to Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1 1821 1
perform the welds within the plant as far as the 2
electrical installations.
3 0
I think you defined the code by referring to a 4
specification.
l 5
Is there a difference between the code and the 6
specification?
7 A
The specification that I am talking about would be 8
Sargent & Lundy, which is our contract, which is L-2790.
9 The code is AWS.
10 Q
How do those two documents relate, if they do?
11 A
The L-2790 may take exception to some of the 12 requirements in the code.
13 Q
Is there any reference in the Sargent & Lundy 14 specification to the AWS Code?
15 A
Yes, there is.
16 Q
How is that reference expressed?
17 A
(No response.)
18 Q
What does the specification say about the AWS Code?
19 A
It says we are to apply our AWS Dl.1-1975 code.
20 Q
Now, how do the Comstock procedures fit in this pattern 21 of code, specification and so forth?
i 22 A
The base materials, the qualification of welders, the 23 qualification of weld joints, it involves their symbols 24 and so forth.
( ) 25 Q
Symbols of what, sir?
Sonntac Reportina Service, Ltd.
4 Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
i 1822 I
1 A
Weld symbols.
2 O
Yes, sir.
3-But which document are you referring to?
4 A
The AWS Code.
5 Q
So procedures that Comstock employs at Braidwood refer 6
back to or are based on the AWS Code; correct?
7 A
Based on the AWS Code and in the exceptions that Sargent 8
& Lundy may have taken to the code and placed it in 9
10 Q
So as far as Comstock is concerned, it is the Sargent &
11 Lundy specification --
g 12 A
Yes.
p\\-)
13 0
-- that guides their work?
14 A
Yes, sir.
15 MR GUILD:
Objection, Mr. Chairman; leading.
16 At this time I am trying to be patient, given that 17 the time is short and I want to expedite the 18 examination; but Mr. Miller really is at a point now of 19 placing the answer in the witness's mouth.
20 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Okay.
I think there isn't a 21 pending question right now and so I think the situation 22 has been clarified.
23 BY MR. MILLER:
24 Q
Now, what version of the AWS Code is set forth in
( )
25 Sargent & Lundy specifications?
i 1
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
l Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1823 O
I 1
A The Dl.1-1975.
2 Q
And to your knowledge, when was the AWS D 1.3 Code 3
adopted?
4 A
In 1978.
5 Q
Mr. DeWald, which codes does the current version of the 6
Sargent & Lundy specification reference?
7 A
AWS Dl.1-1975.
i 8
Q Any others?
l 9
A It references D 11.13 and gives the contractor the 10 option of using D 13 if they so see fit.
11 Q
Mr. DeWald, I show you a document that is dated May 12, 12 1984.
It's from you to Mr. Mennecke and Mr. Quaka.
13 (Indicating.)
14 First of all, did you prepare that document on or J
15 about the date it bears?
l 16 A
Yes, I did.
l 3
17 MR. MILLER:
I would like, your Honors, to 18 have that marked as Applicant's Exhibit 1 for 19 identification.
20 (The document was thereupon marked 21 Applicant's Exhibit No. 1 for 22 identification as of May 9, 1986.)
4 l
23 BY MR. MILLER:
24 Q
Now, Mr. DeWald, can you tell me how you came to' prepare O
25 this document 2 l
l Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 I
(312) 232-0262
1824 j
O 1
A Mr. Vogt, the Comstock Engineering Weld Engineer, came 2
in, reviewed our procedures, reviewed the contract 3
specifications, and he himself then identified these 4
particular deficiencies or inconsistencies between the 5
code and the S & L Specification 2790.
6 Q
Now, calling your attention to the -- well, how did you 7
come to write this memorandum after Mr. Vogt's review of 8
the documents you just described?
9 A
I believe there was an NRC inspection that caused us to 10 really take and have to sit down and look at the welding 11 program.
{ )
12 Q
All right.
Did the NRC inspection cause Mr. Vogt to 13 make this review?
14 A
We asked for the review, after the NRC inspection, from 15 Mr. Vogt.
16 Q
Now, at the bottom of Page 1 of that Exhibit 1 is a 17 reference to AWS D.l.3.
18 Do you see that?
19 A
Yes, sir.
20 Q
Do you know when AWS D.l.3 was -- well, the document 21 indicates, does it not, when W D Sl.3 was added to the 22 specification; correct?
23 A
Correct.
24 Q
Mr. DeWald, at this point in time, what consideration,
( )
25 if any, was given to qualifying welding procedures to Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1825
(
1 AWS D.l.3 at the Braidwood site?
2 A
It was thought about; but as far as using D.l.3, we were 3
still in compliance if we used Dl.1, although using 4
D.1.3 we would have to requalify the welders, requalify 5
procedures and so forth, and we were still acceptable 6
under the Dl.1 program, so we elected not to go with 7
D.1.3.
i 8
Q Mr. DeWald, you talked about the qualification of 9
welders and the qualification of procedures.
10 Could you briefly describe what the qualification I
j 11 of a procedure involved under the welding code?
12 A
Every procedure that you qualify, it is not -- that is 2
13 not prequalified within AWS, you have to do welding 14 samples, we have to take these coupons, they have to be i
15 tested and so forth, and that's where the PQR's come i
16 from.
17 Q
All right, sir.
i i
18 I think you mentioned in your previous answer that i
19 some procedures are prequalified?
t 20 A
Yes, various joints are prequalified in AWS.
21 Q
What is the consequence of a joint being prequalified?
22 A
That means you don't have to requalify the joint on 23 site; that you can use that particular joint without 24 doing a qualification test on it.
( )
25 Q
What reference, if any, to your knowledge, in the AWS 4
i Sonntaq Reporting Service, Ltd.
1 Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1826 4
1 Code Dl.1-1975 version is there to the prequalification 2
of types of materials?
3 A
I don't believe there is one for types of --
4 4
prequalification for types of materials.
5 There are groups listed in the AWS that list
]
6 compatible materials within that group that have the 7
same weldability about them.
8 0
What is the significance of having more than one 9
material specified in this group that you have said is 10 compatible?
11 A
I believe it's the tensile strengths and the makeup of
[ }
12 the base metals on the materials listed.
13 Q
In terms of the qualification of procedures, though --
14 that's really where I was directing my question -- what 15 is the significance of these groupings of materials?
16 A
If we qualify a procedure, say, A-500, to weld A-36 17 would be compatible, the only thing you would have to do 18 is just add it to the PQC because they are both in the 19 same grouping.
20 Q
All right, sir.
21 This document, Applicant's Exhibit 1, appears to be 22 dated May 12, 1984.
23 Do you know whether or not this document was given 24 to Mr. Puckett when he was on the Braidwood site?
( )
25 A
Yes.
These are the known concerns that I made him aware Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
~~
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1827 O
1 of, so that he had an idea of where to start and what we 2
had already addressed and ide'ntified.
3 0
When did you give a copy of this document to Mr.
4 Puckett?
5 A
The exact date I don't recall.
It was some time after 6
he arrived, shortly.
7 Q
Well, was it -- I don't know whether we have established 8
the date on which he arrived.
9 Do you recall what date he reported to work?
i 10 A
I think it was the 29th, I believe, of May.
4 11 Q
How soon thereafter was he given a copy of Applicant's 12 Exhibit 1?
13 A
I don't recall the time frame as to when -- as to when I 14 gave it to him.
15 Q
I believe you testified with respect to the conversation 16 you had with Mr. Puckett when you interviewed him.
17 What, if anything, did you tell him about his 18 duties when he reported for work the first day or 19 shortly thereafter?
20 A
I indicated to him that he was going to have to get 21 himself certified, and he was to do that at his leisure 22 time.
23 I think I indicated to him also that we have known
~
l 24 inconsistencies in the weld program, which I had
( )
25 previously addressed in this memo to Mr. Mennecke and Sonntao ReDortino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1828 O
1 Mr. Quaka, and these would also give him a basis to 2
work.
3 I also indicated that there would be procedures 4
that needed to be revised, possible PQC's that needed to 5
be done, things of this nature.
6 Q
To your knowledge, Mr. DeWald, did Mr. Puckett begin to 7
review procedures shortly after he arrived at the site?
8 A
Yes, I believe he did.
9 0
What is the basis for that belief, sir?
10 A
I had received Status 2 Comments on Procedure 433.
I 11 believe it was Rev C on nttachment O.
12 Q
All right, sir.
13 You are going to have to tell us what Status 2 14 Comments are.
15 A
A Status 2 Comment is once we send the procedure in for 16 formal approval, of which S & L has to approve all 17 procedures, and if they find an inconsistency or they 18 don't like the verbiage or they feel it needs to be 19 rewritten, they will send us a Status 2 Comment back i
20 with the procedure and will indicate what needs to be i
21 done to it in order to get the procedure finally 22 approved.
23 Then these Status 2 Comments are incorporated into 24 the next revision of the procedure.
( )
25 '
Q What role, if any, does Sargent & Lundy have after the Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1829 O
1 comments are incorporated into the next revision of the 2
procedure?
3 A
If the comments are incorporated as Sargent & Lundy had 4
requested, then the procedure is finally approved and 5
issued back to us.
6 Q
Now, do you recall any specifics as to the nature of Mr.
7 Puckett's review of the welding procedures after Status 8
2 Comments came back?
9 A
Attachment O, it came back with Status 2 Comments.
I 10 don't recall,just exactly the exact verbiage of the 11 Status 2 Comments, but it pertained to Attachment O.
}
We had originally indicated we wanted to qualify it 12 13 to a flare bevel groove weld, the symbol was wrong and 14 it also did not indicate that we had effective throat of 15 an eighth of an inch, I believe.
The --
4 16 MR. GUILD:
I couldn't understand the 17 witness's answer.
18 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Could you speak up.
19 Why doesn't the Reporter read that.
20 (The answer was thereupon read by the i
21 Reporter.)
22 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Continue with your answer, 23 if it isn't complete.
24 A
(Continuing.)
The item that needed to be -- to correct
( )
25 this, I had given this to Mr. Puckett and indicated that Sonntaa ReDorting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1830 1
we needed to take the old weld samples that we used to 2
do the initial one for the flare bevel groove weld back 3
to PTL and have them check for the effective throat of 4
one-eighth of an inch for a one-eighth-inch fillet weld 5
and resubmit this into the Status 2 Comments of 433.
6 This was done on, I believe, 7-5 or something like 7
the date around there by Mr. Puckett.
8 BY MR. MILLER:
9 Q
That's July 5th?
10 A
Yes.
11 Q
All right, sir.
{ }
12 Now, I would like.to show you a document that has 13 been previously received in evidence as Intervenors' 14 Exhibit 28.
That's the Nonconformance Report 3099.
15 (Indicating. )
16 There is a reference to Attachment O on that 17 document as well.
18 To your knowledge, Mr. DeWald, is the Attachment O 19 that is referenced on Intervenors' Exhibit 28 the same 20 Attachment O to which you referred in your last answer?
l 21 A
Yes, sir.
22 Q
Now, going back to July 5, 1984, thereabouts, what is 23 your understanding of Mr. Puckett's responsibilities at 24 the time that he received those Status 2 Comments from
( )
25 Sargent & Lundy?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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i 1
A To take the comments on the
-e according to the Status 2 i
\\
2 Comments, correct the PQR for Attachment O and then get i
3 the procedure formulated so they could be resubmitted 4
for approval.
5 Q
And to your knowledge, did Mr. Puckett take those 6
subsequent steps?
7 A
The PQR was qualified and that is as far as the subject 8
steps got.
9 Q
What was left to do?
10 A
There was various other inconsistencies that S & L had 1
11 wanted put.into the procedure for the Status 2 Comments.
J 1,2 Q
Uhat is the effect on the availability of the procedure 13 for use while a Status 2 Comment is pending?
14 A
We still had interim approval on it, although the Status i
15 2 Comments are to be incorporated, and, I believe, sent 16 back within 30 days.
17 This had been done -- should have been -- excuse 18 me -- and should have been submitted so that we got 19 final approval on it.
20 Q
Mr. DeWald, did any of the Status 2 Comments identify, 21 to your recollection, any problems with the materials 22 that were specified in the Attachment 0?
i 23 A
I don't believe it did.
24 Q
Mr. DeWald, I think there was a question raised by Mr.
( )
25 Guild as to whether or not the manual that is sent to Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1832 i
1 Comstock employees has a reference to the 90-day 2
termination provision.
3 Do you recall that lire of examination?
4 A
Yes.
5 Q
Would you take a look at Attachment 1 to your testimony
)
6 and point out for the Board and the parties where it 7
does -- where that provision is referenced?
8 A
I believe it's Bates Stamp 00014752.
9 Q
Yes, sir.
10 A
And it's at the upper left-hand corner of the page.
)
11 Q
Under the heading, " Evaluation Period"?
l 12 A
Yes, sir.
13 Q
Now, Mr. DeWald, what is your understanding of 14 Comstock's rights to terminate employees after.the 15 90-day period?
16 A
After the 90-day period you have to document it, you 17 have to initiate warnings, written warnings.
l j
18 You just can't terminate an individual without all 19 the proof of cause, I guess.
20 Q
Is job performance one of the reasons for termination at 21 any time?
22 A
Yes.
23 Q
Mr. DeWald, now I will turn to the questions, the line 24 of examination, that dealt with your practical
( )
25 examination and Mr. Puckett's practical examinations.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262'
i 1833 i
O 1
First of all, Mr. DeWald, what are your functions 2
as a Level 3 Inspector?
3 A
I recertify people, I review ICR's, NCR's, approve
]
4 procedures.
5 Q
How was that differenti.teC from Mr. Puckett's or -
6 Level 3 Weld Inspector's functions?
7 A
He would revise procedures, although I would be the i
8 ultimate in approving the procedure; he would initiate 9
the PQR's; make sure they are done correctly; take care 3
10 of QC Inspector weld problems in the field; possible 11 interpretation problems, things like this.
{ }
12 Q
Now, why -- do you hold Level 3 certifications in other i
13 areas,besides welding?
14 A
Yes, sir.
15 Q
And how many?
16 A
I think it's nine.
j 17 Q
Do you perform the same functions in those areas of 18 certification as you described for welding?
19 A
Yes, sir.
I do the -- approve the procedures, I review 20 ICR's for those areas, NCR's for those areas, I provide 21 interpretation and any other problems that might arise, l
22 try to resolve those or come up with a resolution or a 23 solution to the problem.
24 Q
All right.
Now, there were questions and answers
( )
25 regarding the practical examination.
f Sonntac Reportino Service, Ltd.
~3 Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
.. ~
t j
1834
}
()
1 Can you describe for us why a rejectable condition 2
in the practical condition is deemed necessary?
3 A
It was an NRC inspection that, I think, we had a finding i
4 on that in our pracs there were no acceptable-rejectable f
5 criteria when the practical was given.
i 6
I am not sure as to the exact verbiage, but I 7
believe the basis was that an inspector should be able 8
to detect a complete acceptable and also one that has 9
acceptable portions and rejectable portions within the 10 scope of the test.
11 0
Sir, how many times did Mr. Puckett take his practical examination?
[ }
12 1
13 A.
I am not sure whether three or four.
o 14 Q.
And did he fail it each time?
i 15 A
Yes.
16 0
Was there an examination that involved a lack of a
]
17 rejectable condition?
18 A
Yes, there was.
19 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I am sorry.
I didn't hear
.i 20 that last question.
21 MR. MILLER:
The question was whether there 22 was any examination of Mr. Puckett that did not involve 23 a rejectable condition on the exam.
}
24 I
JUDGE GROSSMAN:
All right.
( )
25 BY MR. MILLER:
1 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1835 O
1 Q
Of the ones that involved a rejectable condition, did 2
Mr. Puckett pass or fail any of -- pass any of those?
3 A
He failed the one.
He indicated there were no welders' 4
stamps adjacent to the welds, of which the Level 2 that 5
~ evaluated it and reviewed it indicated that there were 6
welders stamps present adjacent to each weld.
- Also, 7
that he only identified one detail, when there were two 8
details involved in this hanger.
9 Q
When you refer to a detail, what do you mean, sir?
10 A
The connection detail from the hanger to the structure.
11 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Excuse me.
12 Did we get testimony consistent with yesterday's 13 testimony as to whether Mr. Puckett had passed one 14 practical that had no unacceptable welds?
15 MR. MILLER:
Yes.
Mr. DeWald is -- I think 16 the Chair has it correctly.
17 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
That's the danger we run 18 from repeating areas.
19 BY MR. MILLER:
20 Q
Do you recall that -- the Mr. Chairman has suggested 21 that your testimony yesterday was that Mr. Puckett, in j
22 fact, passed a practical with no rejectable conditions; 23 is that correct?
24 A
Yes, yes.
()
25 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Fine.
Let's leave it at Sonntaa ReDortina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1836 O
1 that.
2 BY MR. MILLER:
3 Q
Now, there was a line of examination regardi'ng the 4
circumstances under which Nonconformance Reports are 5
issued.
6 Do you recall that?
7 I am now switebt 19 subjects on you.
l 8
A Yes.
l, 9
Q I believe you testified that when a nonconforming 10 condition was identified, a Nonconformance Report was 11 lasued in accordance with Comstock procedures; correct?
(~N 12 A
Correct.
O 13 Q
Now, my question first is:
14 Under what circumstances is a stop work ordered in 15 connection with the issuance of an NCR?
16 A
(No response.)
17 0
Let me be a little bit more specific, Mr. DeWald.
18 You were shown yesterday an Intervenors' Exhibit 19 22, received in evidence, a memorandum over your 20 signature, dated May 2, 1984.
21 MR. WRIGHT:
Is there an exhibit number on 22 that.
23 MR. MILLER:
Yes, it's your Exhibit 22.
24 MR. WRIGHT:
Thank you.
( )
25 BY MR. MILLER:
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1837 1
Q My question, Mr. DeWald, is whether that memorandum sets 2
forth the only circumstances under which a stop work can 3
be initiated.
4 A
Oh, no, sir.
5 Q
Have you, in response to Judge Grossman's questions, 6
fully described the circumstances under which stop work 7
orders are issued by quality control personnel,
,8 including yourself?
i 9
A I think I did.
10 Q
Mr. DeWald, do you know whether or not this memorandum 11 was given to Mr. Puckett?
12 A
It was posted on the bulletin board, and when it came 13 out, I read it to all the people in the QC group.
14 0
It came out before or after Mr. Puckett was employed?
15 A
Just prior to.
16 Q
While we are on Exhibit 22, Mr. DeWald, the sheet that 17 follows the May 2, 1984, memorandum is a memorandum 18 dated March 9, 1984.
19 Just take a minute to look at that.
20 A
Yes, sir.
It's a resignation of Thomas F. Smith, i
21 Q
Who was Mr. Smith?
l 22 A
He was a Level 2 QC Inspector.
23 Q
And did you prepare that memorandum on or about the date 24 it bears?
( )
25 A
I believe I did.
Sonntaq Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1838 O
1 Q
There is a reference to some concerns that Mr. Smith 2
had.
3 Do you recall what those -- the nature of those 4
concerns were?
5 A
I believe there were concerns such as cracks in the 6
building, in the concrete, weld rod control, I think 7
housekeeping.
There were a few more.
I don't know 8
exactly all of them.
9 Q
And under what circumstances did Mr. Smith leave 1
10 Comstock's employ in March of 1984?
11 A
He resigned.
12 Q
Did he tell you why?
13 A
He said he had another job and he resigned, and I asked 14 him if he had any concerns or address -- anything that 15 he wanted to address that he felt might be a 16 nonconforming item.
17 He then filled a list of items and gave them to me, 18 and this is a letter pertaining to those, that list of 19 concerns.
20 0
Of what disposition or what did you do with the list of 21 concerns that Mr. Smith gave you?
22 A
Well, these concerns were investigated by various 23 people.
I think Com Ed investigated some of them, our 24 QA Department investigated some of them.
( )
25 I am not sure who else was involved in the Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1839 l
1 investigation.
2 Q
All right, sir.
J 3
I would like to -- just for the Board and the 4
parties, I am now going to start back essentially with d
5 the sequence that Mr. Guild conducted his examination.
6 Mr. DeWald --
7 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
By the way, just to point i
8 out, you never offered Exhibit Al.
9 MR. MILLER:
Thank you very, very much.
10 At this point in time I would like to offer-11 Applicant's Exhibit No. 1.
[]}
12 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, a point of 13 clarification.
14 There is a handwritten page.
It's of poor 15 legibility and attached to the typewritten document.
i 16 MR. MILLER:
I really ought to inquire of the i
17 witness.
I 18 BY MR. MILLER:
19 Q
Mr. DeWald, can you tell me what the last page of 20 Applicant's Exhibit 1 is?
21 A
I don't recall what this page is.
22 Q
Is it in your handwriting, sir?
23 A
It's my handwriting.
24 I don't recall what it was -- I don't recall what
( )
25 it was about.
Sonntaq Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1840
!(2) i 1
MR. MILLER:
I would be happy to excise the 2
last page if there is an objection on that basis.
ll 3
MR. GUILD:
That would certainly cure any 4
problem I have.
s 5
I have no objectio'n to the document, aside from the 6
last page.
J 7
MR. MILLER:
Easily done.
r I
[
8 MR. BERRY:
No objection aside from the last I
j 9
page.
l 10 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
The document, other than the 1
i 11 last page, will be received in evidence and the last 12 page will be removed before being given to the Reporter.
j 13 MR. MILLER:
I have done that, i
i 14 (Applicant's Exhibit No.1 for j
15 identification was thereupon 1
j 16 received into evidence as 17 Applicant's Exhibit No. 1.)
i 18 BY MR. MILLER:
i 19 Q
Mr. DeWald, when you arrived on site in October of --
20 August of 1983, how did you determine the state of any
)
21 inspection backlog that existed at that point in time?
22 A
When I got on site, Mr. Corcoran had a series of charts 23 that he was using, and=I asked him, "How do I read these 24 and how would they give me the known items that I needed f
( ) 25 to have inspections performed on or how far behind was l
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
. Geneva, Illinois 60134 i
l-(312) 232-0262 1
1841 emb 1
I"; and he proceeded to explain them and confused me 2
quite a bit.
3 I decided then, by looking throughout the 4
department, that there were several installation reports 5
or numerous laying throughout the department.
I then 6
decided to take a hand count and find out exactly where 7
I was.
8 Q
Now, what are installation reports, sir?
9 A
Those are the reports that construction has turned in 10 and indicate that the item has been completely 11 installed.
(~T 12 0
I think you said they were laying around in the --
V 13 A
Yes.
I pulled them from the field office, I took them 14 from various desks and drawers, and I collected them all 15 up and I took a hand count of them.
I then sorted 16 through them to ensure I did not have any duplicates of l
17 it and then proceeded with the actual hand count.
18 0
I think you indicated in a previous answer that you 19 asked Mr. Corcoran what the purpose of the charts were.
20 What was Mr. Corcoran's position after you became 21 QC Manager in August of 1983?
22 A
He was the QC Engineer.
23 0
What were his responsibilities as QC Engineer?
24 A
He was revising the procedures.
(
25 Q
How long did he continue in that position?
Sonntac Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1842 O
1 A
I think he was only there maybe two months and he 2
resigned.
3 Q
All right, sir.
4 When Mr. Corcoran resigned, did he -- what, if 5
anything, did he say to you about any concerns that he 6
might have had about quality?
]
7 A
He didn't give me any quality concerns.
He just said, 8
" Good luck and I am glad I am leaving."
9 Q
Pardon me?
10 A
He said, " Good luck and I am glad I am leaving."
11 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I am sorry.
I didn't hear
()
12 that.
l 13 THE 17ITNESS:
He said, " Good luck and I am 14 glad I am leaving."
15 He never expressed any quality concerns.
16 BY MR. MILLER:
17 Q
Did he resign from Comstock or did he go to another 18 location with Comstock?
19 A
He resigned from Comstock.
]
20 0
I think you described, in answer earlier to Judge 21 Callihan, why -- your understanding of why backlog is a 22 matter of concern.
23 Has any member of the NRC Staff ever expressed, in 24 your presence, a concern regarding backlog?
( )
25 A
Yes.
Their concern was similar to the one that I Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
d I
1843 i
l0 1
mentioned, that if you are not current with your 2
inspections and there is a trend, that you wouldn't t
3 readily identify or establish that particular. trend l
t 4
which would point you to the direction of the deficient I
5 area or something.
I j
6 Q
Now, which NRC Staff member made that comment in your j
7 presence regarding the Comstock backlog, if any?
8 A
I don't recall the member's name.
It was, I think, in j
9 early 1983, but I don't recall who said it.
10 Q
Well, in early '83 --
~!
11 A
Excuse me.
In late '83.
12 Q
All right.
Now, calling your attention to the document 13 that has been received in evidence as Intervenors' 14 Exhibit 2 for identification, there is a reference to an i
15 NRC inspector Cordell Williams and an exit meeting that 16 took place at Braidwood on November 4, 1983.
17 A
Yes, sir.
i 18 Q
And then you were examined by Mr. Guild regarding the 1
5 19 five, I think, numbered paragraphs in that document.
l i
20 My question to you, Mr. DeWald ist 1
i 21 Were those the only topics that were discussed in 22 the exit meeting that is referred to in Intervenors' i
I 23 Exhibit 27 24 A
I believe there was a presentation put on of how I had O
25 p1anned to decrease the sack 1og and how to get the l
l Sonntaa ReDortina Service, Ltd.
j Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1844 O
1 backlog completed.
2 0
And who made that presentation, sir?
l
~
3 A
I made the presentation.
4 Q
At the exit meeting?
i 5
A Yes, sir.
6 0
What, if anything, did the NRC Staff indicate in terms 7
of your presentation?
8 A
They seemed to be pleased that I could probably do the 9
job the way our -- get the job accomplished the way I 10 had it outlined.
11 Q
I would like to turn briefly to Intervenors' Exhibit 5,
({}
12 which discusses a suspension of the Document Review 13 Program.
1 14 I believe you testified yesterday, Mr. DeWald, that 15 the Document Review Program was ongoing when you assumed 16 your position as QC Manager in August of 1983; correct?
17 A
Correct.
1 18 Q
All right.
Now, at that point in time, what procedure, if any, governed the Document Review Program?
19 20 A
Procedure 4.13.1 there for the corrections and a sort of 21 a working structure.
22 O
It was a written document, a work instruction?
23 A
Yes; but it wasn't approved.
24 0
By whom would such a work instruction have to be
( ) 25 improved -- approved?
l l
I Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1845
/NU 1
I am sorry.
2 A
Presently work instructions are employed by QA Manager, 3
QC Manager, Project Manager and Commonwealth Edison 4
representatives.
5 Q
All right, sir.
6 Now, Intervenors' Exhibit 6 indicates that as of 7
March 2, 1984, the Document Review Program was ongoing; 8
correct?
9 This is really preliminary.
10 A
Would you repeat the question?
11 Q
Yes, sir.
> (]}
12 As of March 2, 1984, was the Document Review 13 Program ongoing?
14 A
J am not sure that -- I am not sure of the date of that l
15 memo, when they had revoked it.
16 Q
All right, sir.
17 You are referring to Intervenors' Exhibit 5; i
18 correct?
19 A
Yes.
20 That's -- March 19th is when I reported that it had 21 been cancelled or administrative hold put on it.s 22 Q
And for what reason was the administrative hold put on 23 the Document Review Program?
24 A
We didn't have a formally-approved procedure for it.
25 The people we had doing'it weren't totally Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1846 O
1 trained --
2 Q
All right, sir.
3 A
-- and there were some inconsistencies in it, I believe.
4 Q
How were these deficiencies in the Document Review 5
Program resolved?
6 A
We initiated a Procedure 4.'13.1.1.
We provided -- we 7
obtained, I think, initially four Doc. Reviewers, 8
trained these Doc. Reviewers and later on attained five 4
9 more Doc. Reviewers, trained these Doc. Reviewers in all 10 the aspects of the inspection attributes or 11 documentation that they would be looking at.
I
(])
12 Q
Mr. DeWald, were there Cny developments at any power 13 plant other than Braidwood which were involved in the 14 Document Review Program that Comstock was undertaking 15 under your supervision?
16 A
Perry Nuclear Power Plant -- you mean under my 17 supervision?
18 Q
No, sir.
19 I misstated the question.
Let me try again.
20 Were there any developments at any other nuclear 21 power plant which affected the Document Review Program 22 at Braidwood?
]
23 A
I don't believe it affected the one at Braidwood, but it I
i 24 would have indirectly affected it.
( )
25 We were also doing the same sort of review at i
3 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1847 1
Perry, and the NRC had addressed concerns pertaining to 2
the way that the Doc. Review was done there.
3 This also caused us to possibly have concern on the 4
way the initial document review had been going on at 4
5 Braidwood.
6 Q
And the initial document review at Braidwood had been 7
going on since what date?
8 A
I am not' sure exactly when it started, but it was 9
ongoing when I got there, and it was supposed to be 10 done, I believe, in September of '83.
11 Q
Exhibit 7, Intervenors' Exhibit 7, is a letter from
(]}
12 Commonwealth Edison to the Nucleat Regulatory 13 Commission, and I would like to call your specific 14 attention co Page 3 of knclosure 2 to Exhibit 7, 15 specifically the sentence in the third full paragraph on 16 that page that reads, "To maintain this confidence, 17 Project Construction plans to monitor the progress and 18 close out of L.K. Comstock open items (NCR, ICR), and 19 corrective actions."'
20 Now, my question to you, Mr. DeWald, is:
21 Who from Project Construction, if anyone, monitored 22 the progress of the resolution of the backlog and the 23 document -- the inspection backlog and the Document 24 Review Program?
25 A
I believe it was Mr. Tapella from CECO PCD.
Sonntac Reportino Service, Ltd.
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1 MR. MILLER:
You are going to have to speak 4
2 up, while you and the Reporter are quite close, but 3
everybody else is way away from you, Mr. DeWald.
4 BY MR. MILLER:
5 Q
I believe it was yesterday during your examination by 6
Mr. Guild that you said -- and perhaps the chairman 7
asked a question or two as well -- but you said that you 8
had confidence in March of 1984 that you had adequate 9
inspectors to complete the job, but that in hindsight, 10 you probably could have used a few more.
11 Do you recall that line of examination?
(])
12 A
Yes.
13 Q
That's a paraphrase, I believe.
14 But in March of 1984, when Commonwealth Edison i
15 Company sent this communication to the NRC, what was 16 your projected date by which the inspection backlog 17 would be completed?
18 A
I think it was June or September of 1984.
19 0
Well, when, in fact, was the inspection backlog reduced 20 to current status?
t 21 A
If I recall, I think it was September.
22 Q
And'in March of 1984 do you now recall what date you 23 were projecting?
3 24 A
Excuse me?
(
25 Q
I am sorry.
I am not being clear in my question, so I i
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1849 io i
1 apologize.
J 2
When you prepared -- in March of 1984, when this f
3 letter was sent to the NRC, do you recall the date that j
4 the backlog was projected to be current?
I 5
MR. GUILD:
Objection.
6 He asked him the question and he answered it
)
j 7
previously.
I j
8 A
I think it was June or September.
l 5
9 JUDGE CALLIHAN:
You have got an objection 10 over here, Chief.
You have got an objection.
11 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I am sorry.
i j {]}
12 MR. MILLER:
The witness has answered.
He 13 answered the same way he did the first time and I am 14 just going to go on.
1 15 BY MR. MILLER:
16 Q
Now, I think also in this Attachment 2 to Intervenors' I
i 17 Exhibit 7, the March 23rd letter, Mr. Guild called your 18 attention-to the sentence on Page 3 of that attachment l
19 which references the qualifications of the personnel who 1
20 were going to be in supervisory or aanagement positions.
21 Do you recall that?
22 A
Yes, sir.
l 23 Q
And I believe he asked you specifically, about Mr.
i l
24 Saklak, as to whether or not you believed that he fit
( )
25 that description, and I believe you answered in the 3
J Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
l Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1850 10 v
1 affirmative?
2 A
That's correct.
3 Q
Now, to your knowledge, Mr. DeWald, has Mr. Saklak 4
always shown that he is thoroughly familiar with 5
specification, drawing and procedural requirements as 6
represented in this attachment?
7 A
Yes, sir, I think he did.
8 Q
There was also a reference -- there was interrogation of 9
you by Mr. Guild regarding Mr. Saklak -- Mr. Snyder, the 10 event on March -- that took place on March 28, 1985.
l 11 Do you have an opinion, Mr. DeWald, as to whether
(])
12 or not Mr. Saklak's conduct in that instance indicated 13 that he was thoroughly familiar with procedures and so 14 on?
15 A
I think he was thoroughly familiar with existing 16 procedure, although he thought that since a procedure 17 was in the process of being revised, although it was 18 permissible to do so, although he was wrong --
19 Q
When you say he was " wrong," sir, what do you mean?
20 A
He was wrong in surmising that since the procedure 21 had -- was under revision, that it would be all right to 22 go ahead and close out the ICR, of which he was 23 premature in his thoughts.
24 I do believe he knew 4.9.1 very well.
(
25 Q
4.9.1 is a Comstock procedure?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
. _ - - _ _ _ ~ - _ _
i j
1851
- O i
l 1
A Yes, sir.
It's a calibration procedure.
}
2 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Are you saying, in other i
j 3
words, he was wrong in assuming that he could apply a i
4 procedure that had not yet been -- the revision that had j
5 not yet been adopted?
j 6
THE WITNESS:
Yes, sir.
3 7
BY MR. MILLER:
8 Q
Now, I would like to next -- well, I would like to go to i
l 9
two exhibits that Mr. Guild examined you on.
l 10 One is Intervenors' Exhibit 12, which is a q
i f
11 memorandum from you to Mr. Rolan, dated June 5, 1984, Q
12 and then another is Intervenors' Exhibit 8, which is a 13 letter from Mr. Shamblin to you and Mr. Rolan and it's 14 dated June 9, 1984.
l 15 Now, let me go in chronological order of these 1
i 16 exhibits, if I may.
1 t
l 17 First of all, Mr. DeWald -- oh, I see what happened j
18 to my other Exhibit 8.
It's stapled in there.
Excuse i
19 me.
20 The last page of Intervenors' Exhibit 12 is the 21 chart that has numbers of inspections and so on.
22 Could you describe for us how the averages for 23 inspections were derived that are set forth on that page j
24 of the exhibit?
! O 25 A
The averages were derived from taxing,ast inspections i
sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1852 Iv 1
over a period of time in that particular discipline and 2
then averaging out how many we felt -- or it averaged
,3 out -- if we averaged it out on a 8-hour day, a 40-hour 1
4 week.
5 When we come up with that figure, I also added or 6
took away from the figure to apply to instances of which 7
the inspection may take a considerable amount more time 8
and to allow for research because the building is 9
getting a little more cluttered, and I then applied that 10 number, which on the first line is 5; and if I have 16 11 inspectors working in that particular area on a 40-hour
(])
12 week and they get 5 inspections per day, I will come up 13 with 400 inspections a week, which would give me a 14 projected output and give me an estimated completion r
15 date.
That's how I used it and come up with the 16 schedule.
17 Q
Mr. DeWald, I think yesterday you testified that you had 18 discussed this with Mr. Seese and the two of you 19 developed these averages.
20 Did you discuss it with anyone else at Comstock?
21 A
Yes.
We -- I also bounced the -- or let Mr. Saklak look 22 at it and asked him if -- did he think that these were 23 reasonable numbers.
If he didn't, we would make the 24 change.
i
(
25 And in a few instances, he said, "You can't do Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 l
(312) 232-0262
i -
1853
,i J!O i
1 these.
We will have to take and cut the numbers down";
t j
2 and that's what we did, so we could still give ourself a i
j 3
projected end date of these, i
j 4
Q Now, did you personally communicate these averages to l
5 any Comstock Quality Control Inspector?
6 A
We had discussed them in various meetings; but 7
personally going out and sitting down with each 8
individual, no, I didn't do that.
9 Q
What was the nature of your discussions at the meetings 10 with Comstock quality control -- I take it that -- well,-
j 11 let me back up.
Q 12 Strike the question..
l 13 I take it from your preceding answer that, even i
14 though you didn't have a one-on-one discussion, you may 15 have had other types of discussions with the Comstock QC 16 Inspectors regarding these averages; is that. correct?
t 17 A
At this particular time we had a weekly QC meeting.
The I
18 whole group would get up -- I think I was down to around i
19 100 total people, and it's kind of cramped up in the j
20 upper room, and we would go over various things such as 21 this and we explained the numbers and so on.
22 Q
Well, could you describe, as best you can in words, what j
23 you told the inspectors about these averages?
l 24 A
These were just to come up with the estimated completion 25 dates, and this is what we figured that an individual.
i i
sonntaa ReDortinQ Service, Ltd.
l Geneva, Illinois 60134 l
(312) 232-0262
1854 O
1 might be able to do in an eight-hour period.
2 It doesn't mean that he has to do that in an 3
eight-hour period, due to the fact that he may have some 4
extra research or some extra follow-through to do, which 5
would limit him on the number that was done.
6 Q
Do you recall whether there were any comments by any of 7
the QC Inspectors when you presented these averages and 8
made the statements that you have just testified?
i 9
A I don't recall.
10 Q
Now, I would like to turn to Intervenors' Exhibit 8 for 11 identification.
(])
12 There is a reference in the first line of this 13 letter to you from Mr. Shamblin to a series of 14 discussions and meetings that had been held.
l 15 Was Mr. Tapella involved in any of these meetings?
16 A
I am not sure.
He may have been.
Carl Mennecke may 17 have been.
18 0
Now, what was it, in your judgment, Mr. DeWald, that 19 caused Commonwealth Edison Company, in the person of Mr.
20 Shamblin, to write this letter at this point in time?
21 A
I believe this was the -- when I went over -- after I 22 looked at Mr. Saklak's matrix that he gave me, went over 23 and asked for some kind of priority on various items:
24 Which ones did he want first, second, third and fourth.
( )
25 Q
All right, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 2,32-0262 4
1 1855 qb 1
Now, there are a list of individuals who are shown 2
as receiving copies of this letter.
3 Do you recall whether any one of those individuals 4
was present at the me~eting between --. hat you attended 5
with Mr. Shamblin?
6 A
I believe the people on CC probably were at that 7
meeting, because it has three Comstock management people 8
there.
9 Q
And those are Mr. Anderson, Mr. Paserba and Mr. Marino; 10 is that corr,ect?
11 A
Yes yes.
( )
12 Q
Mr. DeWald, on the first page of this letter, the very 13 last sentence, there is a reference to regional and 14 corporate Quality Assurance / Quality Control Management 15 coming on site.
15 Do you' recall that, in fact, individuals from 17 corporate regional and corpora'te Quality Assurance and 18 Quality Control Management were at the Braidwood site in 19 that time period?
20 A
I think Mr. Marino was there, I think Mr. Paserba was 21 there and I believe Mr. Anderson was there.
N 22 0
And I think we have.had the testimony as to the titles 23 of Mr. Paserba and Mr. Marino.
24 But what is Mr. Anderson's title -- what was it at
(
.25 that point in time?
Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1856 O
1 A
I think he is the Central Region Vice-President for 2
Comstock Company.
3 0
Would you just -- I think you have identified previously 4
Mr. Quaka and Mr. Mennecke.
5 Just for the record, who is the M. J. Wallace that 6
is identified as receiving a copy?
7 A
I think he is the Byron and Braidwood Project 8
Coordinator at the time.
9 Q
And Mr. E.
E. Fitzpatrick?
10 A
I think he is or was -- I am not positive of his title; 11 but at the time I think he was the Assistant QA Manager
(])
12 for Com Ed.
13 Q
And Mr. Groth?
14 A
I am not sure what Mr. Groth's title was, but he worked 15 with PC.
16 Q
There were 13 different action items that were set forth 17 in the Attachment B to Intervenors' Exhibit 8.
18 I would like to go through them with you and have 19 you describe what steps you, in your capacity as Quality 20 Control Manager, took to implement the action items.
21 Let's start with No. 1.
Why don't you read it over 22 to yourself.
23 Mr. DeWald, what was the purpose of this action 24 item?
25 A
There were installation reports in the QC Department
- n Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
~
1857 1
that were not totally complete, and Engineering and QC 2
and Production were to go through these and sort out 3
these and give them back to Production to make sure that 4
they were complete before the required QC inspection.
5 Q
All right.
Action Item No. 2 is also a review of the 6
current inspection backlog.
7 Would you tell me what the purpose of this action 8
item was?
9 A
This was to take the installation reports and review 10 them to see if, in fact, they had been previously 11 inspected,.and this would stop having a going out and
(])
12 reinspecting something that had previously been 13 inspected.
14 Q
All right, sir.
15 Let's drop down -- and were these two steps, those 16 reviews of the current inspection backlog as set forth 17 in numbered Items 1 and 2, in fact, done by quality 18 control individuals under your direction?
19 A
Yes.
20 Q
Let's drop down to Item No. 5, which is the next item 21 for which Comstock QC has responsibility.
22 That's to explore measures whereby Comstock 23 production and engineering personnel can perform 24 functions currently being performed by quality control.
(
25 A
This is, basically, in the one area of junction boxes, I Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
i 1858 O
1 believe, where many times on the drawings it did not 2
give an elevation or an exact coordinates, and this is 3
where LKC engineering or production would possibly get 4
with S & L and find out the exact coordinates for the 5
drawings or the piece of equipment or junction box or 6
whatever the case might be.
7 Q
And was that, in fact, done?
8 A
Yes, it was.
9 Q
All right.
I believe the next item is Item No. 8, which 10 is the cross training of Quality Control Field i
11 Inspection Personnel.
(])
12 Now, first of all, did this action item occur j-13 before or after the revision to the compensation system 1
l 14 for Comstock Quality Control Inspectors that you have 15 testified to today?
16 A
Will you repeat that?
i i
17 Q
Well, did this take place before or after the $12 an 18 hour2.083333e-4 days <br />0.005 hours <br />2.97619e-5 weeks <br />6.849e-6 months <br /> and 50 cents for certification?
i 19 A
This took place after.
The $12 an hour certification 20 was in April.
21 Q
And were your inspectors eager or reluctant to have this J
22 cross training?
23 A
They were eager.
24 Q
And so was this recommendation implemented as far as you
(
25 were able to?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1859 O
1 A
Yes.
2 Q
Item No. 9, QC supervisors should review the actual work 3
practices of field inspection personnel with the goal of 4
increasing inspector productivity and resulting 5
inspection output.
6 That was an action item for you?
7 A
Yes.
8 0
Would you tell us what you did to implement this action 9
item?
10 A
The supervisors were to be more visible in the field in 11 case there were problems that were encountered out in
(])
12 the field.
13 At the same time,,in order to simplify matters for the inspector, I ordered numerous sets of prints so each 14 15 inspector would have his own set of prints during weld 16 inspection and he would be able to carry those with him 17 at all times.
18 We also brought a series of the IE Drawings, which 19 is the Electrical Installation Drawings, and the IO or 20 CO, which is the hanger tabulation drawings, plus the 21 detail drawings up into the QC Department, so they did 22 not have to go from station to station or wait around 23 and'look to see or to hunt down the exact drawing that 24 they needed to use.
(
25 Q
When you say " station to station," what stations are you Sonntaq Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1860 oO 1
referring to, sir?
2 A
Well, you have various stations.
Station 1 is 3
downstairs in the Construction Department.
You might 4
have Station 2, say, for instance, maybe out at 451 in 5
the elevation of the plant.
There were various stations 6
all over the plant.
7 If the inspector had the prints for the drawings he 8
needed, he didn't have to utilize his time charging up 9
and down the stairs or throughout the plant looking for 10 that particular revision or that particular drawing.
11 Q
These stations are stations where drawings are kept?
Q 12 R
Yes.
13 Q
Now, at this meeting that you held with Mr. Shamblin and 14 the others that,is referenced in the Intervenors' 15 Exhibit 8, what, if anything, was said about trying to 16 hurry the inspectors up or asking them to cut corners in 17 their inspections?
18 A
There was no indication for any inspector to cut corners 19 or bypass any quality.
It's just that they wanted the 20 inspections to be completed.
21 Q
Now, I think the last action item on here is -- by the 22 way, Mr. DeWald, is that your handwriting that appears 23 on these -- I am not sure -- I guess it's Page 2 of this 24 Attachment B?
(
25 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I won't presume Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1861
()
I what Mr. DeWald's answer might be; but it's my writina.
2 The yellow little sticky things that don't seem 3
to -- that seem to follow me everywhere did not get 4
taken off in the Xeroxing process.
5 MR. MILLER:
I appreciate the clarification.
6 I hope the Board will -- I guess I should have 7
brought that to the Board's attention when the exhibit 8
was offered; but perhaps we could have those parts, at 9
least, not regarded as part of the evidentiary record.
10 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
It's obvious to the Board 11 that Mr. DeWald's handwriting is a lot better than Mr.
(])
12 Guild's.
13 (Laughter.)
14 MR. MILLER:
Fair enough.
15 BY MR. MILLER:
16 Q
The last item that is an action item for Comstock QC --
17 and Mr. Guild's sticker kind of obliterated the first 18 two words.
19 Do you know what that action item is?
20 A
I believe it should read segregate.
I am not sure of 21 the second word.
I think the first word is segregate 22 inspections required in the DG room, diesel generator 23 room, for possible special efforts to close out.
24 What we done there is separated the inspections
( )
25 that pertained just to the diesel generator room so that Sonntaa Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1862 1
we knew exactly where we were and what we had to do.
2 Q
What was the reason expressed for the special effort 3
with respect to the diesel generator room?
4 A
That is one of the first rooms that we will be turning 5
over.
6 Q
Turning over from whom to whom, sir?
7 A
It will be turned over to CECO from Comstock.
8 Q
Was there a specific request from Commonwealth Edison 9
Company that that room be given priority?
10 A
Through this effort; and we are still working on it to 11 get it out.
(])
12 Q
All right.
Now I would like to move ahead to Exhibit 13 18.
I will get that for you.
14 This is the memorandum from -- it started with a 15 memorandum from Mr. Asmussen to his, I guess, 16 supervisor, Mr. Worthington.
17 Do you recall that document and the examination on 18 it?
]
19 A
Yes, sir.
i l
20 Q
All right.
Now, first of all, Mr. DeWald, the second 1
21 page of tpe exhibit -- and it's the second page of your 22 memorandd a to Mr. Mennecke -- indicates that copies were 23 distributhd to a number of different people, does it i
O 2:5 I
A Yes, it does.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1 1863 O
1 Q
And one of those is Mr. Asmussen?
2 A
Yes.
3 Q
Why did you send a copy of this memorandum to Mr.
4 Asmussen?
1 5
A Because he is the one that brought up the concern, to 6
afford him what I had done.
7 Q
Now, the last paragraph on Page 1 of the mem'orandum, in 8
effect, says that if there is a question as to the 9
validity of inspection, that the work should be 10 reinspected.
11 Do you have any knowledge, Mr. DeWald, as to I
(])
12 whether or not Mr. Asmussen, in fact, reinspected 13 anything?
14 A
No, I don't.
15 Q
Would he be required to obtain permission or any other 16 authorization to conduct such reinspection?
17 A
Not at this point, because of the fact that I said if he 18 didn't feel they were good, valid inspections, to 19 reinspect them.
20 Q
All right.
Mr. DeWald, yesterday when you were examined i
21 about that set of documents, you indicated that the i
22 rejectable welds were identified during a Unit Concept J
23 Inspection.
24 Would you describe for the Board and the parties
}
25 what the nature of a Unit Concept Inspection is?
i l
Sonhtaq Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1864 1
A A Unit Concept Inspection encompasses one portion or one 2
print which relates to the building, and they take -- it 3
would be a sample inspection of the conduit that is 4
installed, the cable pan hangers that is installed, the 5
conduit hangers installed, the cable that is installed, 6
the equipment that is installed; and it's not only 7
related to Comstock.
It's also to the other contractors 8
of equipment that they may have installed in the room, 9
such as your HVAC systems, the piping systems and so 10 forth.
11 Q
Mr. DeWald, are the results of the Unit Concept
(])
12 Inspection then tr.ansmitted to the contractor?
13 A
Yes, they are.
14 Q
And how can you tell that the last page of Exhibit 18, 15 which is a weld inspection checklist, comes from the
'l 1
16 results of a Unit Concept Inspection?
17 A
Well, it's in the statement made by the inspector.
I 18 think it reads, QC-US-27-EO3, which is the portion of 19 the Unit conception Inspection Report No. 27.
20 0
Can you tell, just by looking at this document, whether 21 or not there were any other hangers within Comstock's 22 scope of work that were inspected in that Unit Concept 23 Inspection?
24 A
Not by this particular document.
k-)/
r 25 Q
Okay.
Now, I would like to move on to Exhibit 20.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1865 O
1 Mr. DeWald, I think you stated that this 2
Nonconformance Report was generated during the initial 3
Quality Control Inspector Re-Inspection Program.
4 My question to you is:
5 What disposition, if any, is going to be made of 6
the deficiencies that are set forth in the attachments 7
to the NCR?
8 A
They will all be repaired.
9 Q
Now, this document was introduced during the course of 10 an examination by Mr. Guild with respect to QC Inspector 11 Rick Martin and his practice of photocopying inspection
(])
12 reports with the check marks already in them.
13 Do you recall that examination?
14 A
Yes, sir.
15 0
All right.
Now, I take it -- well, let me ask the 16 question directly.
17 In the deficiencies that are identified with 18 respect to Mr. Martin in Intervenors' Exhibit 20, do you 19 know whether or not any of those involve inspection 20 checklists that were Xeroxed with the acceptable box 21 already checked?
22 A
I am not sure.
They may have.
23 0
was there a separate method of tracking the deficiencies 24 that arose as a result of Mr. Martin's photocopying of 25 these inspection reports?
Sonntaa ReDortina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1866 O
1 A
The files were searched for all copies of the report of 2
the inspection of Mr. Martin's photocopied checklist and 3
we then done a reinspection of those checklists.
4 Q
That was in addition to any reinspection that.may occur 5
as a result of the disposition of NCR 1827?
6 A
Yes.
7 Q
Now, I believe you testified yesterday that prior to --
8 it was probably in your direct testimony -- that prior 9
to being here at Braidwood as QC Manager, you were 10 employed as a Level 2 Inspector; correct?
11 A
Yes, sir.
( )
12 Q
And what were the approximate dates?
l 13 A
November the 2nd, 1980, to, I think it was, October 12, 14 1981.
15 Q
And during that time period, what responsibility, if 16 any, did you have for training Mr. Martin?
17 A
I trained him to the procedures and the details and some 18 of the weld symbols or the welding criteria as far as 19 433 and 483.
20 0
All right, sir.
21 433 is which Comstock procedure?
22 A
It's a welding procedure.
~
23 Q
And 483?
24 A
A weld inspection procedure.
25 Q
First of all, Mr. DeWald, during the time that you were Sonntag1 Reporting Service, Ltd.
l Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
i 1867 (2) 1 QC Inspector, what use, if any, did you make of 2
photocopied inspection reports that already had the 3
acceptable column marked with checks?
4 A
I didn't use them.
5 Q
At the time that you were at Braidwood as a Level 2 6
Quality Control Inspector, did you observe any other 7
inspector making use of that practice?
8 A
Not in the early days I didn't, no.
9 Q
Did you ever discuss with Mr. Martin, while you were a i
10 Level 2 Quality Control Inspector -- that is, prior to 11 October of 1981 -- the use of photocopied inspection
(])
12 reports with the acceptable boxes already checked?
13 A
No, I didn't.
14 Q
Did you discuss it with anybody else?
15 A
No, I didn't.
16 Q
Now, how was Mr. Martin's use of these photocopied 17 inspection checklists discovered?
18 A
During the GO Office Audit.
I think it's September the 19 25th or October the 5th.
20 0
Of which year, sir?
21 A
Of '83.
22 0
This was shortly after you arrived on the site?
23 A
Yes, sir.
24 Q
And do you recall the names of the individuals who
(
25 discovered this practice of Mr. Martin?
Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1868 O
1 A
I don't know the auditor'c name.
2 0
Were there other individuals involved in discussing this 3
matter with you?
4 A
There were other individuals involved that discussed it 5
with Mr. Martin.
6 Q
In your presence?
7 A
Yes, in my presence.
8 0
Who were they?
9 A
Mr. Shusky, I believe Mr. Summerfield, and I think there 10 was a few other people from Commonwealth Edison QA in 11 there and asked Mr. Martin about his photocopied check
(])
12 marks as to what he had done.
13 Q
What was Mr. Martin's response?
14 A
He at the time had asked -- or he thought of the idea of 15 doing his photocopied check marks in order to expedite 16 him getting his paper work completed, and he had asked 17 Mr. Kast if it was all right.
18 Evidently, Mr. Kast, his supervisor, as Mr. Martin 19 has indicated, indicated that it was correct, although 20 later on I told him that it was incorrect; and through 21 the audit is why I decertified Mr. Martin.
22 0
What affect, if any, did the direction that Mr. Martin 4
23 received from Mr. Kast have on the disciplinary action 24 that you took with respect to Mr. Martin?
25 A
Well, I felt that Mr. Martin had got some wrong Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1869 1
direction from Mr. Kast, although he should have known 2
better as far as photocopying and check marks and so 3
forth, and that's part of the reason that he was not 4
fired.
5 Q
Were there any other Comstock Level 2 Quality Control 6
Inspectors who were determined to have used inspection 7
reports with the check marks in the approval column 8
alr.eady filled in?
9 A
Yes, sir.
I believe there was one additional, Steve
, 10 LeBue.
11 Q
What was Mr. LeBue's area of certification?
(])
12 A
Welding.
13 Q
And what action, if any, did you take with respect to 14 Mr. LeBue?
15 A
We researched the files again on Mr. LeBue and received 16 a reinspection on his work.
17 Q
Was Mr. LeBue disciplined?
18 A
Mr. LeBue had been previously fired, I believe, prior to 19 my getting back to the site.
20 Q
Other than Mr. LeBue, Mr. Martin, was there any other QC 21 Inspector that had used these photocopied inspection 22 reports?
23 A
I think that was the only two.
24 Q
Were you ever informed that Mr. Seeders used such a 25 report?
Sonntac Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1870
(
1 MR. GUILD:
Objection, Mr. Chairman.
2 The witness doesn't have knowledge to answer the 3
question directly.
It's really beyond the pale for Mr.
4 Miller to supply the answer to the witness, which he is 5
attempting to do.
6 MR. MILLER:
Your Honor, I think if I am put 7
to it, I could attempt to refresh the witness's 8
recollection from deposition testimony of other Comstock 9
managerial and production personnel with respect to 10 this, but I am really trying, to get through this.
11 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Well, I don't see how that'
()
12 would refresh his recollection; but you have already 13 suggested it to him and we will just continue.
14 I don't see how anybody else's testimony would 15 refresh this witness's recollection.
16 MR. MILLER:
Well, your Honor, I --
17 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Nevertheless, I --
18 MR. MILLER:
I am sorry.
I beg your pardon.
19 I didn't mean to interrupt.
20 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Nevertheless, the question 21 has been asked directly whether Mr. Seeders had been 22 doing it, and let's have a response.
23 A
Yes, he did.
I didn't remember.
24 BY MR. MILLER:
( )
25 Q
All right, sir.
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1871 4
O 1
At this point in time, what were Mr. Seeders' 2
certifications?
3 A
Calibration.
4 Q
What action, if any, was taken with respect to Mr.
i j
5 Seeders' use of these photocopied inspection reports?
6 A
At the time there was really -- there was an audit going i
7 on, also, when I had noticed these previous and --
8 MR. GUILD:
I am sorry.
I just can't hear 9
the witness's answer, Mr. Chairman.
j 10 A
(Continuing.)
This was in early -- excuse me -- late 11
'83, around November.
(])
12 I don't recall.
I had three audi.ts that were 13 either beir.g conducted, a follow-up and we had -- I know i
l 14 one was a follow-up and it had to deal with the l
15 calibration records.
I don't recall exactly what that 16 was; but, anyway, I tried to get in contact with Mr.
i 17 Seeders.
He took three days off, and during this 18 three-day period prior to November or the --
l 19 Thanksgiving, we tried to get in contact with him; and, 1
l 20 finally, I asked that if Mr. Seeders calls on a Friday, j
21 I think it was November 25th, that I would like to talk f
22 to him.
23 When I talked to him, I asked, "Could you come in l
24 and go through your records and make sure all of your
(
25 audit findings and so forth were cleaned up, because I Sonntaa ReDortina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 i
(312) 232-0262
1872 O
1 had a follow-up and another audit coming in."
2 And he declined on coming in, so I asked him, when 3
he came back, "Would you pleace get a doctor's excuse 4
for the days that you took sick and personal time at the 5
end of his vacation" --
6 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, objection.
7 The last answer can't conceivably be responsive to 8
the question which was asked, which was asked over my 9
objection.
10 MR. MILLER:
I agree.
I think that the 11 witness is straying a little bit from my questioning and
(])
12 I was going to interrupt just about now, anyway.
13 BY MR. MILLER:
14 Q
Mr. DeWald, my precise --
15 MR. MILLER:
And I don't think you objected to 16 my last question.
17 BY MR. MILLER:
, 18 Q
My precise question was:
19 As a result of using these photocopied inspection 20 checklists, was there any disciplinary action taken 21 against Mr. Seeders?
22 A
No.
23 Q
Now, did you have any conversation at all with Mr.
24 Seeders regarding his use of the photocopied inspection
(
25 checklist?
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1873 r-(
l A
Yes.
He indicated he didn't do it anymore or he wasn't 2
doing it anymore.
3 0
Sir, did you institute any written warning to Mr.
4 Seeders as a result of his using the photocopied 5
checklist?
6 A
I don't believe I did.
7 Q
Okay.
Now, just to finish up with Mr. Martin, you were 8
examined about his job after his certifications were 9
withdrawn.
10 I am going to pose it to you in a hypothetical.
11 If Mr. Martin had not been employed, at what
.(])
12 level -- what type of an individual or an indi,vidual 13 with what qualifications would have been required to do 14 the research work that you described yesterday in 15 response to Mr. Guild's question?
16 A
I would use an inspector, because he had to know the 17 drawings, how to read the drawings and how to determine I
18 the inspection reports.
19 Q
All right, sir.
20 Now I would like to turn to the circumstances under 21 which Mr. Saklak was terminated.
22 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Excuse me for a second.
23 Is that a Level 1 Inspector you are referring to?
24 THE WITNESS:
Mr. Martin, he is a Level 2.
25 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
No.
Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1874 0
1 I meant whom you would employ for that type of work 2
that Mr. Martin was doing at that time.
3 THE WITNESS:
Mr. Martin was doing it.
4 I would probably use a Level 1, because that's --
5 according to ANSI, one of their responsibilities or 6
capabilities is recording on data and so forth.
7 MR. MILLER:
Before I get into Mr. Saklak's 8
termination, just one final question with respect to Mr.
9 Seeders.
10 BY MR. MILLER:
11 0
I think in the answer that you were giving you said that
[]}
12 Mr. Seeders was cleaning.up some records in anticipation 13 of an audit; is that correct?
f 14 A
He had cleaned up or corrected and went through some of 15 these records from a previous audit, and we had a 16 follow-up coming in.
17 All I wanted him to do was come in that Saturday to 18 double check to make sure he had it all done.
19 Q
Now, turning to Mr. Saklak's termination, Mr. DeWald, I 20 think you testified that you had one conversation with 21 Mr. Saklak after he left the site; correct?
22 A
(No response.)
23 0
You testified that you called him?
24 A
I didn't call him, no, sir.
( )
25 I had a conversation with him prior to leaving the 4
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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1 site.
Mr. Paserba called him.
2 Q
All right.
Now, as best you can, would you state for i
3 the record what you said to Mr. Saklak and what he said 4
to you in that conversation?
j 5
MR. GUILD:
Excuse me, Mr. Chairman.
6 The record is muddled now.
The witness just said j
j 7
he had no such conversation.
8 MR. MILLER:
I think that I -- well, all i
9 right.
I may have contributed to that.
i 10 Let me start over again.
11 BY MR. MILLER:
()
12 Q
Mr. DeWald,>after -- the sequence is as follows:
il 13 On March 28th, on Thursday, Mr. Saklak makes this i
14 threat to Mr. Martin.
i 15 On March 29th, a Friday, Mr. DeWald, was Mr. Saklak 16 on site?
Was he at the Braidwood site on Friday?
17 A
On Friday, the 29th, he was there.
l 18 Q
All right.
Now, during the course of that day, did you 19 have a conversation with Mr. Saklak regarding the Snyder 20 incident the day before?
21 A
Yes, I talked to him that day.
22 Q
Okay.
Now, then, tell us, as best you can recall, what 23 you said to Mr. Saklak and what he said to you.
I j
24 A
I told him, " Sac, you know, what you did is not right
( )
25 and we can't tolerate it and that you should have known Sonntaa Reportina Service, Ltd.
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"what you have done I can't tolerate and the 2
company won't tolerate and, therefore, I think you are 3
totally in the wrong."
4 And he indicated in maybe a gesture or coming back 5
to me that he indicated -- or understood that he, too, 6
was in the wrong.
7 Q
Do you know whether Mr. Saklak -- well, did you say 8
anything in this conversation to Mr. Saklak regarding 9
his work on Saturday?
10 A
Yes.
I told him he was not to come in on Saturday.
11 Q
During the course of that Friday, did you have occasion
[]}
12 to observe Mr. Sak4ak' talking to Mr. Snyder?
l 13 A
No.
I had heard --
14 MR. GUILD:
Objection.
15 MR. MILLER:
No, don't.
j 16 You have answered the question and I will go on.
17 BY MR. MILLER:
18 Q
Now, you testified under examination by Mr. Guild with 19 respect to the Commonwealth Edison position with respect 20 to Mr. Saklak; that is, they didn't want him to hold a 21 position as Quality Control Supervisor at Braidwood; 22 correct?
23 A
Yes, sir.
24 Q
Did they have -- did Commonwealth Edison, to your
( )
25 understanding, have any further views on the employment i
Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
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(312) 232-0262 i
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of Mr. Saklak?
2 MR. GUILD:
Objection; hearsay.
3 How can Mr. DeWald establish what views 4
Commonwealth Edison had?
5 MR. MILLER:
Well, excuse me, Judge 6
Grossman --
7 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Do you mean did they 8
communicate to?
9 MR. MILLER:
Yes, precisely.
10 I agree.
He couldn't know unless somebody told 11 him.
. ()
12 A
Yes, sir.
They barred him from Edison sites.
13 BY MR. MILLER:
14 Q
When you say they barred him, who is the "they," sir?
15 A
Edison.
16 Q
And what do you understand barring him -- that is, Mr.
17 Saklak -- from the Edison sites to mean?
18 A
Working on safety-related items at a facility.
19 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Excuse me.
20 Did Edison tell you that he was barred from the 21 site?
22 THE WITNESS:
I heard they was going to bar 23 him from their sites for safety-related work.
24 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I'm sorry.
25 Could you repeat that, Mr. Reporter?
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i 1
(The record was thereupon read by the
]
2 Reporter.)
3 MR. GUILD:
I have a running objection, Mr.
4 Chairman; hearsay.
5 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Yes.
I will strike that 6
part.
We will strike the question and answer there --
t 7
we will strike the answer.
8 MR. MILLER:
May I just inquire, before 9
you --
10 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Well, the question, as I g
11 understood -- you should have reposed it to your l
( }
12 witness -- was whether Ceco had communicated anything 4
13 further to Mr. DeWald with regard to Mr. Saklak; and, 14 apparently, his answer amounts to no, that he had heard 15 something else; but I don't want to presume.
16 So why don't you repose that question whichever way 17 you can do it properly?
)
18 MR. MILLER:
First of all, let me establish l
19 or try to establish something as a preliminary matter, 1
20 because maybe I am going to be foreclosed on this i
21 witness from this line of examination, anyway.
1 22 BY MR. MILLER:
23 Q
By whom were you told about Commonwealth Edison 24 Company's position regarding the employment of Mr.
l
( )
25 Saklak?
i Sonntag Reporting Service, I".d.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 j
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(312) 232-0262
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1 A
I think it was in a meeting that was held, I believe, on 2
the 29th at 3:00 P. M.
3 0
Were there representatives of Commonwealth Edison 4
Company who told you that?
5 A
It was brought out in that meeting that that was one of 6
the stipulations.
7 Q
And what was your understanding --
8 MR. GUILD:
The same objection, Mr. Chairman.
l 9
"It was brought out" does not establish a source 10 for the testimony that he is going to relate that he j
l 11 came to know or heard or --
Q 12 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
I-take it that this j
13 testimony is not going to be for the purpose of proving 14 that CECO did bar him from the site?.
15 MR. MILLER:
Your Honor, I think I will just 1
l 16 drop it at this point, because there are going to be i
)
17 witnesses who are fully competent to testify as to what 18 the Commonwealth Edison Company position was.
19 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Okay, that's fine.
20 BY MR. MILLER:
21 Q
Moving on and keeping on the same gerieral subject, do 22 you know, Mr. DeWald, whether anyone from Commonwealth l
23 Edison Company made any recommendation to Comstock with 24 respect to Mr. Saklak's employment?
l 25 A
I don't recall.
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1 Q
Now, I think, in response to some questions by Judge 2
Cole, you described the situation with respect to 3
BESTCO; that is, they employ the QC inspectors now and 4
Comstock management, supervision, still directs their 4
5 quality activities; correct?
I 6
A Correct.
7 Q
Could you describe for us what role, if any -- well, let 1
l 8
me back up.
9 To your knowledge, are the Comstock -- I am 10 sorry -- are the BESTCO employees who are performing 11 quality control work for Comstock now members of a 4
(]}
12 union?
13 A
Yes.
1 14 Q
What role, if any, does the Union play in the assignment i
15 of work or other personnel matters?
i 16 A
They have no role that they play in the assignment of 17 the work.
l 18-Q Do they have any responsibilities with respect to any j
19 other matters involving the personnel on site?
20 A
The Union -- or the Union steward, if there is a 21 problem, he deals with the. problem directly, but with 1
l 22 each side as it's required.
23 Q
What sorts of problems are you referring to, sir?
3 24 A
If they have personal problems, or a lot of times if
(
25 they have a complaint, they will go to the steward and i
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1 he will deal with the complaint or -- he manages the 2
majority of all complaints.
3 0
Who is the Union steward at present?
4 A
Mr. Bossong, B-O-S-S-O-N-G.
5 Q
Since BESTCO has taken over, have there been any 6
complaints, that you are aware of, regarding some of the 7
items that Mr. Guild discussed with you yesterday, 8
pressure to produce numbers of inspections rather than 9
produce proper inspections, so-called quantity over 10 quality?
11 A
No, sir, I don't believe.
(]}
12 Q
Have there been any claims that were characterized to 13 you of Comstock management or supervision harassing or 14 intimidating these BESTCO employees who are acting as 15 Comstock -- were inspecting Comstock's scope of work?
16 A
I believe there have been a couple.
17 I don't recall the exa'ct people, but I think there 18 was one incident, maybe two.
19 Q
Do you recall the nature of the incident?
20 A
I think it was a lead and -- a supervisor and a lead 21 were kind of indicating about one of the new hires as 22 not being too sharp and they were complaining about i
23 that; and everybody set down at the table and it was 24 ironed out.
(
25 And there was one other, the response to get Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
Geneva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
1 1882 0
1 overtime.
Mr. Bossong would go around and see if he 2
could collect up names for people who would be available l
3 to work on Saturdays, and he asked one particular 4
inspector if he would work Saturday and I guess he told 5
him no and give him a wisecrack and Mr. Bossong's 6
response was, "I will slap the mustache off your face."
7 This we reported to BESTCO and also informed Mr.
8 Shamblin.
9 Q
Do you know the name of the inspector threatened by Mr.
10 Bossong?
11 A
Mr. Lechner.
(])
12 Q
Could you describe what the nature of Mr. Bossong's 13 request to Mr. Lechner was, as you understand it?
14 A
I really can't.
15 Well, as I understand it, he was trying to get 16 people to work overtime on Saturday.
17 Q
And --
18 MR. GUILD:
Mr. Chairman, I guess,1f counsel 19 is not going to establish what the basis is for the 20 witness's understanding -- he has gone on for s,ome time 21 relating what is obviously not a firsthand knowledge -
22 then I would object to the continuing line,of questioningwithoutestablishingsomesobrceof 23 24 information.
~25 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Sustained.
/
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1883 i
1 BY MR. MILLER:
2 Q
Just for the record, can you tell us:
3 How did you hear about Mr. Bossong's threat to Mr.
4 Lechner?
5 A
It was overheard by the supervisor who documented-it and 6
forwarded it to me on a memo.
7 Q
And which supervisor, sir?
8 A
Mr. Tuite.
9 MR. MILLER:
Your Honor, I will tell you that 10 I still have, I would guess, between 45 minutes and an 11 hour1.273148e-4 days <br />0.00306 hours <br />1.818783e-5 weeks <br />4.1855e-6 months <br />.
( }
12 I still have to expect, with respect to Mr. Seeders 13 and with respect to th'e -- among other things, the April i
14 5th memorandum, I am prepared to go forward, although I 15 think it would probably be wise to take a short break, 16 but I know there are schedules to be met.
17 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
Well, I think, then, we will 18 just recess until the next session to complete that, i
19 I don't like to make a practice of having a gap 20 between direct and redirect.
21 With regard to -- ind that goes for all the i
22 parties.
23 With regard to their being a break between direct 24 and cross, I don't think that's important, significant.
( )
25 So I guess we will just recess now and we will Sonntaa Reportino Service, Ltd.
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recon'rene,after the two-weeks gap; I guess during the 1
I 2
week of!the:27th.
3 We are recessed..
4
,MR. GUILD:
Excuse me, Mr. Chairman.
I am 5
sorry. ' _.
6 Before you recess, I believe there was a pending 7
objection to the last question, which was regarding this 8
source cf'this informations and I would ask that the s
9 witness's testimony, that is obviously.not founded on 10' firsthand knowledge, be stricken.
~ 11 JUDGE GROSSMAN:
My understanding was that 12 counsel was withdrawing.the question and answer and so 13 it is stricken. ~
14 MR. MILLER:
We will get it from Mr. Bossong.
15 Okay.
That ends it here.
16 (WHEREUPON, the hearing of the above-17 entitled matter was recessed to May 18 27, 1986.)
l 19 20
-21 22 23.
24 O
25 Sonntag Reporting Service, Ltd.
Gerceva, Illinois 60134 (312) 232-0262
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