ML20210L655
| ML20210L655 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Shoreham File:Long Island Lighting Company icon.png |
| Issue date: | 09/25/1986 |
| From: | Atomic Safety and Licensing Board Panel |
| To: | |
| References | |
| CON-#486-1101 OL-5, NUDOCS 8610020161 | |
| Download: ML20210L655 (122) | |
Text
ORIGINAL UlN11ED STATES O
NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION IN THE MATTER OF:
DOCKET NO:
SHOREHAM NUCLEAR POWER STATION 50-322-OL-5 EP/ EXERCISE o-LOCATION:
RIVERHEAD, NEW YORK PAGES:
16,838-A-16,960
+ DATE:
THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 25, 1986 7'4 d/
o I
ace-FEDERAL REPORitxS, INC.
O Ofi:ialRewtes 444 North Capitol Street g31e n,-:
- n'. ~";
Washington, D.C. 20001 r;tm J.y (202)347-3700 A: "
J NATIONWIDE COVERAGE
16,838-A Su W l
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
(~h 2
NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3
BEFORE THE ATOMIC SAFETY AND LICENSING BOARD 4
__________________________________x 5
In the Matter of:
6 LONG ISLAND LIGHTING COMPANY
- Docket No. 50-322-OL-5 (EP Exercise) 7 (Shoreham Nuclear Power Station, Unit 1.)
- (ASLBP No. 86-533-01-OL) 8
X 9
10 11 Riverhead Town Hall 200 Howell Avenue 12 Riverhead, New York D)
(-
13 Thursday, April 25, 1986 14 The Limited Appearance Statements in the above-15 captioned matter were resumed, beginning at 6:02 p.m.
16 BEFORE:
17 MORTON B.
MARGULIES, ESQ., Chairman Atomic Safety and Licensing Board 18 U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission Washington, D.C.
20555 19 DR. JERRY KLINE, Member 20 Atomic Safety and Licensing Board U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission 21 Washington, D.C.
20555 22 DR. FREDERICK SHON, Member Atomic Safety and Licensing Board 23 U. S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission
(^S Washington, D.C.
20555
(/
24 A c d.ca secon.n inc.
25
B Sim 1-1 3
LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT OF:
PAGE 2
(^
T.
B.
CONKLIN, III 16,840 v)
CAROL GRANTHAM 16,845 MAUREEN VOLBENNY 16,851 JAMES BRENNON 16,855 6
JIM MATTHEWS 16,859 HOPE SCHMIDT 16,861 8
LILLIAN JULIANO 16,865 LOU GRASSO 16,866 10 VINCENT GARY 16,876 11 ERITH LABROCK
.16,877 12 WAI CHINN (BY HELEN ROBINSON) 16,844 13 f
KATE McCORMACK 16,889 14 BETTY HOYE 16,893 15 BOB ALCORN 16,896 16 KAREN' GARRETT 16,900 17 l
DAVID WILLMOTT 16,904 18 LISA DALE 16,916 d
19 CHARLES COLOMBO 16,920
$j 20 JOHN HURLEY 16,924 JOE PAPARADO 16,936 i
22 ROGER SNEIDER 16,939 23 PETER McINTEE' 16,944 24 CHRIS PITTO 16,947 25
C Sim 1-2 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT OF:
PAGE 1.
KYLIE BOSTRIN 16.,948 16,951 ROBERT M.
CHINCHETTIE 1
MARK LIMBO 16,954 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 l
12
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12-1-gjw 16,838 Evaning 1
(6:02 p.m.)
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2 E-V-E-N-I-N-G S-E-S-S-I-0-N 3
JUDGE MARGULIES:
Good evening, ladies and 4
gentlemen.
The United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission 5
on June 6, 1986, instituted this proceeding to consider 6
evidence on the Federal Emergency Management Agency's 7
exercise of the Long Island Lighting Company Emergency 8
Plan for the Shoreham Nuclear Power Station as to whether, 9
it shows fundamental flaws in the LILCO Emergency Plan.
10 The exercise was conducted on February 13th, 1986.
11 The Board assigned to hear this matter is composed of Judge 12 Jerry R. Kline, sitting on my right; Judge Frederick J. Shon, O
13 sitting on my lef t, and I am Judge Morton B. Margulies, 14 Chairman.
15 Parties to the proceeding are the Long Island 16 Lighting Company, the Applicant.
The Nuclear Regulatory 17 Commission Staff, and the Interveners.
They are the parties 18 that are opposing the Application.
19 They consist of the State of New York, the County 20 of Suffolk, New York, and the Town of Southampton, 21 New York.
22 The issues to be litigated have not as yet been 23 ruled upon.
The matter is currently under consideration.
24 We are conducting a limited appearance session here Ase Feder'J Reporters, Inc.
25 today pursuant to Section 2.715-A of Part 10 of the Code of
'12-2-gjw.
16,839 1
Federal Regulations.
7.3 d
2.
It permits persons not a party to make a limited 3
appearance by making an oral or written statement of their 4
position.
5 The statements made by persons not a party to the 6
proceeding are not evidence.
The appearances can alerti the 7
Board and the parties to areas in which evidence may need to 8
be adduced.
In order to accommodate as many persons as 9
possible, it is customary to limit all presentations to 10 five minutes each.
If you run over rhe five minute period, 11 you are only depriving your neighbor of the right to speak, 12 so please stay within the five minute period.
f.
13 Written statements which are placed in the record 14 are not limited in scope.
We have had many, many people 15 testifying here today.
We have taken as many as possible, 16 and as you can see by this huge stack of limited appearance 17 written statements, a lot of people decided to proceed in 18 that manner.
19 We will now get started.
We had a lot of people 20 that signed up earlier in the day, and I will proceed with 21 the sign-up sheets that we had gotten early, and take them 22 in turn.
23 One other factor.
Our evening hours were set from O
24 six p.m. to eight p.m. because this room was not available Ace Federci Reporten, Inc.
25 beyond eight p.m.
The people that were going to use this
12-3-gjw 16,840 i
1 room from eight p.m. were good enough to use other 2
facilities in the building, so we will stay an additional 3
hour from six to nine p.m.
4 Our next speaker is John Hensel.
Mary DeBrusky?
5 John Behan?
T.
B. Conklin, III?
6 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 7
OF 8
T. B.
CONKLIN, III 9
MR. CONKLIN:
I thank you, and I would like to 10 point out for everyone 's benefit, I signed up about ten-11 fif teen this morning, and an awful lot of people would 12 verbally like to express their opinions of the situation, O
13 and have just been unable to do so.
I think you have gotten 14 the message pretty clearly that we are resolved to ensure a
15 that Shoreham does not open, and that if you had lots more 16 time, we would be happy, I think to come back and talk to 17 you some more.
18 First of all, I have two purposes today.
- First, 19 I have been asked by the Village Board of Sag Harbor:, Long 20 Island, to read this resolution. dated the 23rd of 21 September 1986.
22 How, therefore, be it resolved that the Board of 23 Trustees of the Village of Sag Harbor reaffirms that the Ok/
24 July 6th 1976 resolution of the then Village Board against
- Asefederal Reporters, Inc.
25 the expansion of LILCO, and further resolves that present
16,841 12-4-gjw I
constituted Board of Trustees of the Board of Sag Harbor, 2
representing the citizenry of the village is adamantly 3
opposed to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission granting an 4
operating license to LILCO for the Shoreham nuclear power 5
plant.
6 Now I will speak as a long term resident of Long 7
Island in opposition to the opening of Shoreham.
I have 8
no particular technical data to add to the testimony, and 9
not an expert on the design of nuclear power plants, nor 10 am I an evacuation specialist.
Il Most of us, I think, cannot really address with credibility technical issues.
IIronically, though, it 12 13 appears from the information coming from Chernobyl that 14 the only constant in this nuclear age seems to be that '
15 man is a fallible creature, and this fallibility is the 16 critical element in nuclear safety.
17 Lacking technical expertise, though, I want to 18 convince you -- explain to you why almost everyone who has 19 spoken today has intimated, if not said directly, that 20 we are afraid of Shoreham, and it is because of LILCO's 21 track record.
22 LILCO's performance in my view and my life 23 experietice has elevated to a high form the art of human
(
error.
On Tuesday, as an example, as a modest example, 24 Asafederal Reporters. Inc.
25 this last Tuesday I witnessed LILCO at work on my own street
12-5-gjw 16,842 I
in Sag Harbor cleaning up after Hurricane Gloria, which
,/\\
V 2
happened a year ago.
3 During that storm, winds fell on some wires 4
outside of our house and the telephone pole -- or the light 5
pole rather collapsed, and what they did was they drove a 6
new pole adjacent to the old one, cut off the bottom of the 7
old pole that carried the service wires, and they sistered 8
it, cabled it to the new supporting pole.
9 A year later, and this is coincidentally, I didn't 10 program this for the hearing, but half a dozen LILCO men 11 and a couple of trucks pulled up and they considered the 12 situation and they decided that they would rather than O
13 remove the service cables and attach them to the new pole, 14 they just cut the cables of the -- tying the two poles 15 together.
And what happened was that Tarzan, like the 16 old light pole, swung free and fell, and would have hit 17 the ground had not my neighbor's car been right in the IC way.
It was a direct hit, and we -- on the street we lost 19 all the television and the telephone up until at least 20 today.
We hope we got the service back.
21 But the point is that LILCO can't run a conventional 22 power system much less a nuclear power plant.
23 (Applause.)
24 It is absolutely laughable to think that it can WJ Reporters, Inc.
25 use its own employees to evacuate tens of thousands of people
12-6-gjw 16,843 I
where it can't execute routine tasks without appearing to
'2) be trained by the Keystone Cops.
And I am really not 3
exaggerating.
4 This morning, you had Assembleman John Behen from 5
Montauk very passicnately say that the power had gone out 6
a couple of times in Riverhead Town this week.
The week 7
before, it was in the Riverhead hospital.
You have this 8
beautiful brand new hospital, but the power is never on.
9 The generators, there must be more generators 10 on the east end o'f Long Island than anywhere in the rest II of the world, and John said that the power goes out when 12 the wind blows twenty miles an hour, and he wasn't exaggeratinc O
13 either.
This company is a disaster, and Long Islanders 14 know that LILCO for twenty years has been attempting to 15 catch up to the f act that we we re in the 50 ' s and 60 ' s the 16 fastest growing county in the United States, and they haven't I7 been able to master the basic business of delivering power.
18 Now, unsuccessful in achieving this, it has had I9 the audacity to demand the building of Shoreham.
Frightfully, 20 it has been given the authority to build it, and now it is 21
-- has used its mysterious influence over the Federal 22 bureaucracy to bequeath on the citizenry the responsiblity 1
23 of paying for this plant.
24 And I would like to reaffirm at this point John a.c.ews n.pon.n. anc.
25 Behan's resolve to not let this travesty occur.
16,844
.12-7-gjw But in the interest of persuading you gentlemen 1
()
to speak against Shoreham with finality, I beg that you 2
agree with me that stockholders profits, individual greed, 3
management pride, and perpetuation of a corporate entity 4
would be shameful reasons for approving an impossible 5
evacuation plan which would thereby institutionalize nuclear 6
fear on Long Island.
7 A vote in favor of the plan would diminish the 8
quality 'of life for millions of people.
Illustrate a 9
repression of the will of the people, and trivialize the 10 precepts of candor and fair play in our political system.
11 This company cannot run its non-nuclear house, 12 O
aa it ou a de =o e-dere betwee= iuaicro"=
=a e e to m
give this incompetent utility the power of the atom.
14 (Applause.)
c 15 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Jean Mariner?
Jean Moreni?
16 Mark Grossman?
Ann Venudo? Laura Martin?
Martha Augustine?
17 Catherine Brauner?
Edward Dwyer?
Dr. Carol Grantham?
18 19 20 21 22 23 24
, Ass Feeses n conen, inc.
1 25
16,845 12-8-gjw 1
LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 2
OF 3
CAROL GRANTHAM 4
MS. GRANTHAM:
Members of the Licensing Board, 5
good evening.
And I again want to repeat the thanks that 6
you have come to meet us in person as'we pled with the 7
Siting Board of the State of New York to do so, because 8
the Jamesport decisions were made.
9 I-will introduce myself.
I am Doctor Carol 10 Grantham.
My addess is 73-A Sound Avenue.
It is right on 11 the very edge of the ten mile evacuation for Shoreham, and 12 midway to Jamesport.
O 13 I wonder if it doesn't seem surprising to you 14 people that the depth of. passion and concern that you have 15 witnessed today -- I go back to 1971, when LILCO held a 16 meeting here in Riverhead, an information meeting, and I 17 attended.
18 And for two hours they gave us charts and graphs 19 and consultants and advisors and the whole array of LILCO 20 management, and said that nuclear power would be plentiful, 21 clean and too cheap to meter, and then gave us five minutes i
22 to ask questions.
23 At that point most of us had no strong feeling O
24 one way or the other.
But beginning the next year, some Acefederd Reporters, Inc.
25 serious questions arose, and I became the first citizen group,
'l
16,846 12-9-gjw and the only one in this down at that time, in Intervener in the Jamesport Plants.
2 I wrote the briefs for all those years.
I.have 3
4 a Doctorate, but I am not a lawyer.
Could not afford 5
lawyers.
Your Agency saw fit half way through those proceedings to then require a concomitant set of hearings 6
which streched our meager resources and our meager time 7
~
to the limit, so I must say that I regard some of the actions 8
of the NRC with a good deal of caution.
9 And throughout all that long period, one thing 30 emerged quite clear, and that is that Long Island is, indeed, 11 12 unique.
Now, my family goes back to Colonial times, and I have lived here most of my life.
It is unique and it is 13 geography, and -I won't go into that because enough has been 14 said about that today.
It is long and lineal, one hundred 15 and ten miles long, and no wider than twenty miles at any 16 17 point.
Furthermore, it is weather.
That means, by the 18 19 way, that it has a very limited access and egress.
You cannot get off this island.
I testified in 1975 that we 20 could not go north because of Long Island Sound.
We could 21 not go east because of the limited ferry, we could not so 22 south because of the Atlantic Ocean, and certainly you 23 24 couldn't go to the LIE, the famous parking lot.
As>*ederei moorwr.. inc.
25 Indeed, if you wanted to get off the island, I
16,847 12-10-gjw I
suggest that we go straight up.
U,.s 2
AUDIENCE:
Or straight' down.
3 MS. GRANTHAM:
Or straight down.
In any event, 4
one other point that did not come out, and I am not going 5
to deal today with a lot of the points, and there have been 6
many, and it is a long and tiring day, but the weather 7
question has not come up today, and I submit it, too, is 8
unique.
9 I have lived on the water all my life.
I live 10 on Long Island Sound.
You can have every single day of the 11 week a prevailing change, certainly in the summer months, 12 from the ' southwest.
No matter'what other way the wind has
, O 13 -
been in general, and then you Also get this wind pattern 14 from the northwest.
15 But we were. told in those Jamesport hearings that 16' you have to have at least six hours to plot a reliable 17 plume, and a pattern of evacuation.
I submit that is very, 18 very unusual to have that length of stretch in this island.
19 The weather is very urgent.
We are very, very special when 20 it comes to the wind drift patterns.
Nothing was said about 21 that today.-
22 I also want to tell you about the weather here.
23 Right now it is the fall of the year.
I live on the sound, 24 on the north shore, right north of this village.
We have Ass.pederes Reconen. Inc.
25 pick your own.
We have all kind of excursions coming out
12-ll-gjw 16,848 to this beautiful _ country.
We stay off of the roads.
O We just finished the summer traffic when the 2
f actor population goes up by three and four times.
There 3
4 again, it is almost virtually impossible to travel.
Within five years in this town, for the first time since this tcNn 5
was founded in the 17th Century, it was shut down for forty-6 eight hours.
We had drifts of fifteen and twenty feet high.
7 Nobody could move.
No police, no fire, no medicals, nothing.
8 How LILCO would face a situation like that, don't 9
ask me.
10 So, it all comes out that we are unique.
The 11 evacuation is very germane to this question, and I do hope 12
()-
you will give it your most serious consideration, and 13 furthermore, not only these unique features, but LILCO ja 15 itself.
LILCO has a reputation of no trust.
No credibility.
16 You cannot get them for a minor consumer complaint.
We had 17 this summer alone two weeks ago a little wind storm, five 18 19 hours2.199074e-4 days <br />0.00528 hours <br />3.141534e-5 weeks <br />7.2295e-6 months <br /> and no current.
This summer we had an electrical storm, seven hours and no current.
20 Last year we had Gloria.
You know how long I had 21 no current?
Abouti. ten days.
We go back to the winter, the 22 ice storms, this is endemiciwith this utility.
23 I go back to Murricane Carol.
It was two weeks 24
__. m we had no current.
We do, indeed, own generators.
We 25
16,849 12-12-gjw I
couldn't live without them.
_s 2
How in Heaven's name are you going to expect this 3
utility to run the technical complex operation of Shoreham, 4
a plant that was second hand when they got it, has been 5
retrofitted from that day.
It has had very little quality 6
assurance control through that long, long pattern.
7 All to say, gentlemen, that plant should never 8
have been sited there, it should never have been given a 9
low power license, and Heaven forbit it be given a full 10 power license.
11 So what do I come to the conclusion -- and I will 12 make it very brief.
There are so many vested interests 13 in this issue far beyond Long Islanders, unfortunately.
14 It is an option I know for nuclear power.
And it 15 has been made a test case, and I know that enters into it.
16 And how about LILCO?
My husband was in Wall Street.
We 17 sold a lot of LILCO stock.
I have four shares lef t, and I 18 keep it only for the reports.
19 It has its stockholders.
It has speculators.
The l
20 speculators in LILCO's stock are now reaching the eighty 21 percent mark.
It has the vested interest of suppliers, the 22-nuclear industry, the utility industry, and above all, you 23 people in the Federal agencies.
24 I, myself, are on this mailing list from the A.e.e d awon.n inc.
25 Federal Register.
This came two days ago, and this came last
12-13-gjw 16,850 1
Friday.
Os 2
I get reams of this stuff, and I don' t object to it if you are doing your job, but I do say that vested 3
interests are very, very deep, profound and complicated, 4
and I' hope you will give it the decision that it deserves.
5 6
So, we come down to this.
Einstein said, you know, that this atom age raises questions far to profound 7
to be answered anywhere else but on the village square.
8 You saw an example of it today.
I hope some of 9
10 that registers in your decision, and Mr. Sczavenensez, 11 the new Russian Ambassador, said it was a human, tragic 12 error at Chernobyl.
~
<)
13 I do home, I repeat, I do hope that the people
- You, of Long Island are not expendable to these interests.
14 15 indeed, have an awesome decision to make.
We hope you 16 make it wisely.
17 Thank you.
(Applause.)
18 19 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Ronald R. Burnister?
Varonica 20 Garvey?
Walter Newcombe?
Susan McMann?
Donna Androvek?
21 Mary Julian?
Mary Kreig?
Margaret Bell?
Laura J. Mancey?
22 Kim Johnson?
Dale Mcdonald?
Christine Kathy?
Martha 23 McGarrett?
Richard McGarrett?
Mary Eller Wintersham?
24 AUDIENCE:
Wintersham.
W Reporters, Inc.
I 25 JUDGE MARGULIES:
No, she is not.
16,851 12-14-gjw 1
AUDIENCE:
This sounds like the reading of a v
2 casualty list.
3 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Pardon me?
4 AUDIENCE:
I said this sounds like the reading 5
of a casualty list.
6 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Mickey Pilkington?
Robert Glass?
7 Sara Abrahamson?
Jerry Sikaranza?
Donald Kingston?
8 Anthony Leanza?
George Raisgood?
Frank Donahue?
Maureen 9
Volbenny.
Will you please come forward.
10 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT II OF I2 MAUREEN VOLBENNY O
13 MS. VOLBENNY:
Gentlemen, I have come to ask you Id to not license the Shoreham nuclear power plant.
15 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Would you move closer to the 16 microphone.
Just take your time.
17 MS. VOLBENNY:
I have come to ask you to no't 18 license. the Shoreham nuclear power plant.
I have come to l9 ask you to ack responsibility, and do the job that you have 20 been paid to do.
21 I frankly suspect that Shoreham is not about 22 power for people on Long Island.
I suspect that Shoreham 23 is necessary for the research being done at the Brookhaven O-24 Laboratiroes, the weapons reseerrch, for which Isabel was Aso Feded Reponen, Inc.
25 built, for which the fusion director came from Princeton.
16,852 12-15-gjw 1
That may or may not be so, but the facts of 2
Shoreham are that it is dangerous.
That it is threatening 3
our' lives, my childrens life, cur futures and our homes.
4 Another fact is that we have been paying for 'it, 5
and that every power bill I have paid since I moved here 6
has gone five percent to pay for Shoreham, and now it is 7
half paid for.
It is time to stop it.
8 I hope and I pray that you will act responsibly.
9 But if you don't, I am here to say that we are not out 10 of options.
And if you license this power plant, you will 11 be demonstrating that our whole process of government is 12 a sham.
CE) l 13 (Applause.)
14 Laws have been changed because they impeded the I
15 process of Shoreham.
Regulations, safety precautions have 16 been trivialized because-they hindered Shoreham.
This P ant is a danger that we don't need, that we don' t want, l
17 18 that we cannot store the waste of, that only moves the 19 whole nuclear age one step further towards our own disaster, 20 and we are not going to be victims.
We are not victims here on Long Island.
We are 21 22 non-losers, and we will take the next step if we must.
I 23 will take my three children out of school.
I will not send O
them to schools that have no plans to safeguard them when and 24 WJ Reporters, Inc.
25 if there surely will be an accident there.
l L
16,853 12-16-gjw 1
I certainly will pay no ~ more taxes.
I will not f,,
V 2
pay power bills I feel LILCO owes me.
I will not buy 3
insurance that excludes any liability for a nuclear 4
accident, and then the Government which I am not allowed 5
legally to sue, can sue me, and I will then walk all the 6
way to the Supreme Court to oppose this plant, and I am 7
sure I won't walk along.
8 (Audience.)
9 So, gentlemen, I am praying that you make 10 the right decision, the only decision.
You are the one 11 without options.
Don' t license the plant.
Don't license 12 it to operate under any auspices, any time, ever.
O 13 We are the freest, most able people, the most 14 privileged people in the world today.
And if we cannot 15 stop the nuclear age here, we can't do it anywhere, ever.
16 We are the people who must do it.
We must do I
-l i
17 it now.
If not us, who?
If not now, when?
18 That is all.
Thank you.
19 (Applause.)
20
.End 12 21 22 23 24 Ase Federal Repo,ters, Inc.
25 l
16,854 Evaning Sossion
^
- Y Sim 13-1 2
(No response. )
bl.
3 Elizabeth L. Vilguard.
4 (No response. )
i 5
Jean D. Vielbig.
6 (No response. )
7 Orfer S. Zimmer.
8 (No response.)
9 Cathlene Parish.
10 (No response.)
11 Orleen Kilpatrick.
12 (No response. )
Charles Getz.
l ( (e')
13
~
14 (No response.)
Dr. Carl J. Nelson 15 (No response.)
16 i j 17 Joseph Carpenter.
, 2 18 (No response. )
i'h Janice R.
Hale.
j 19 af!
(No response. )
20 a
f Dorothy Clyde.
21 4
E E
(No response.)
22 Jack Clyde.
23
(
(No response.)
24
\\s)
Imagne Kamako
(,.
3;
16,855 Sim 13-2 (No response.)
Maria Zadon.
2
([)
(No response. )
3 Al Zadon.
4 (No response. )
5 Cheryl Grander Spagnolo 6,
(No response.)
Vera K.
Broshinski.
8
(:No response.)
Joseph Broshinski.
(' o response.)
N 11 Marci Nicknez from Shoreham.
12 (No response. )
.(
13
<k.)b Joseph Nicknez.
14
('o response.)
N 15 Jim Brennon.
16 L !
LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT g
17 I
OF 18 g
JAMES BRENNON j
19 j
MR. BRENNON:
My name is James Brennon.
I am j
20 here both as a member of the Port Jefferson Station Teachers g
21 l
Association and as a resident of Rocky Point.
22 I would like to first to read a letter from 23 my Union President, Robert Carr, addressed to the panel.
{ (~)
Gentlemen, the Port Jefferson Station Teachers
16,856 Sim-13-3 1
-Association is a representative of the teachers of the 2
Comsog School District.
As such the Port Jefferson Station
~
3 Teachers Association has tha exclusive right to negotiate 4
working conditions and job related duties for the teachers 5
in the Comsog School District.
It is obvious that the Long Isiand Lighting 6
7 Company has no authority to speak for the Port Jefferson 8
Station Teachers Association or its members.
Any assumptions a
which the Long Island Lighting Company may have made 10 concerning the duties of teachers in the Comsog School ji District during a radiological emergency at the Shoreham Nuclear Power Station are without'the knowledge or consent 12 i
of the P, ort Jefferson Station Teachers Association.
13 c0 34 Furthermore, the Long Island Lighting Company has never consulted with this organization in any manner _
15 concerning a radiological emergency evacuation plan.
We 16
-s resent any attempt to present our association as a partici-f.
17 18 pant in a plan without our prior consultation and agreement.
I would like now to address you as a resident g
jg
.t l
f Rocky Point and as a father of two school-aged children.
20 a
d in the Rock Point School District.
21 3:
When the news of Chernoyb1 started hitting the 22 Papers and I started reading about radiation five times 23 its normal level being found in Finland and milk and vege-24 (O
tables being monitored for radiation throughout all of j
3
16,857 Europe and I read about little Polish children taking Iodine
.fim 13-4 1
tablets and I read about the raindeer herds of Lapland being i
Potentially dessimated, I began to think that maybe this 3
10-mile evacuation zone was more of a joke than I thought it w"**
5 (Applause.)
6 But then I thought further and realized that if in fact some government organization, the NRC or whatever, did demand that a wider evacuation zone, let's say to Chicago, 9
Illinois be inplanted, that would present no problem for LILCo.
They would simply have one of their mock drills and 11 we could see. Ira Frylicka on television smuggly telling us 12 that in fact an evacuation of everyone east-of the Mississippi
-m 13
(-
had taken place ---
14 (Laughter.)
15
--- it had taken place in two hours, there were.
16 i !
no delays and no accidents and 14 million people who were I
17
- l7 sightly irradiated had been housed in the Houston Astrodome.
lI 18 (Laughter.)
j 19 l
(Applause.)
j 20 As absurd as that scenario is, it isn't too much g
21 more absurd than the scenario we saw take place on February 22 13th of last year.
For my own information I have been polling for the 24
{ {( )
past, or calling up various school districts to get a rough i
25
16,858 Sim 13-5 estimate of how many school children would be in school in the event of a nuclear accident at Shoreham within the 2
\\
10-mile radius.
A rather. conservative, cautious estimate is about 4
30,000 children.
To point out the absurdity of the FEMA exericse I want to point out that LILCO provided for those 6~
30,000 children by sending two school buses to the Shoreham Wading River High School. I doubt that 30,000 children could fit into two school buses even if they stood.
9 (Laughter.)
10 As I said, I live in Rocky Point and I work cn 11 the very edge of the 10-mile evacuation zone.
It has 12 occured to me on many occasions that if in fact an accident 13
.(f did happen during school hours that my children would be 14 sent home.
That is five miles away from Shoreham.
15 My family is like many families on Long Island 16 within the 10-mile zone in that both my cnildren's parents g
17 I
work.
My wife and myself work.
So therefore they would 18 g
be going home to an empty bedc:2.
j 19 l
I would have tc
.e 3 a 10-mile area to drive 20 g
five miles into the radiological area in order to pick up a
{
21 l
my children.
- However, they would not allow that.
They 22 j
claim that they would stop you from going back in.
23 I will tell you this.
I am a very peaceful man 24 kO and in fact maybe peaceful to a fault, but I would tear 25
16,859 the face off any LILCO worker who tried to stop me.
g 3_g (Applause.)
2
~{w It seems clear to me, that is the idea of two 3
school buses representing the evacuation of 30,000 school 4
children, I think it pretty much demonstrates the stupidity 5
of this FEMA scenario.
It smakes of tokenism and it is a 6
mere formality just to fulfill some regulation.
It has 7
no basis in reality at all.
8 I sincerely think that only fools or people who 9
are hell bent on promoting nuclear power rather than 10 regulating nuclear power could possibly think this was a 11 serious and realistic drill.
12 (Applause.)
.u'N 13
([w)
JUDGE MARGULIES:
Jim Matthews.
14 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 15 OF 16 JIM MATTHEWS 17 8
MR. MATTHEWS:
Good evening.
18 g
C It is quite obvious that Long Island cannot be, j
19 e
evacuated.
Anybody that tries to go to a beach on a hot X:
20 Saturday in July or anybody that wants to take a trip to the g
21 mall on a Saturday knows that to be true.
22 Eighty-five percent of the population on Long 23 Island says so and the other 15 percent are lying.
24 (Laughter.)
,r
(/
25
16,860 Sim 13-7 Even Donald Regan says Long Island cannot be 3
evacuated.
Governor Cuomo-feels that way, the County
("h 2
\\_f Legislature feels that way and anyone who has any sense 3
and who is aware and who is honest and who is rational feels 4
L ng Island cannot be evacuated.
5 Last summer a pickle truck overturned on the LIE and had some soybean oil that spilt.
The main artery of the Long Island Expressway was closed for a whole day.
Citizens were able to bury their dead, interviews g
were missed and jobs lost, sales weren't made, groceries and supplies weren'.t delivered.
This occurred at a time during the middle of the day, not even at rush hour.
Then why, may I ask, are we here at this time?
(_( ')
What must the citizens of Long Island do to stop this 14 elephant, this white elephant and threat to our safety from 15 getting a license?
16 Are we really living in a democracy?
Seventy-five 17 l t to 85 percent of all of the citizens on Long Island don't li 18
'E want Shoreham.
The State doesn't want Shoreham.
The County Ij 19 l
doesn't Shoreham.
20 g
4 Recently in Austria there was a nuclear power l
21
- h plant that went up for referendum in a vote and it was 22 narrowly defeated.
That plant sits idle.
It is not being 23 used today.
In Austria democracy prevailed.
Why not here?
24
' {
7-It sounds so cynister.
I
._,m
p r
.,v,-,
m.,-y
-e
Sim 13-8 16,861 (Applause.)
3 As naieve as I may be, I don't want to give up hope.
I hope that your ears have not been deaf to the message
\\
(
we are trying to bring to you today.
Shoreham should not 4
be licensed, and not only because of safety, but because of 5
conscience and because it is the preservation of our democracy 6
and the importance of allowing the majority of those people 1
7 who don't want Shoreham to have a voice.
8 Thank you.
(Applause.)
JUDGE MARGULIES:
Hope Schmidt.
11 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 12 l
l OF
-/-
13 kg HOPE SCHMIDT 14 t
JUDGE MARGULIES:. Before you start, didn't you
~
15 speak this morning?
16 I
MS. SCHMIDT:
Yes.
This morning I just read i
17 t
the Rocky Point School resolution for Rocky Point Schools 18 because Mr. Carisetta, our Superintendent, was here and (2
19 lj you called his name and he had to leave.
ll 20 l
JUDGE MARGULIES:
This is your individual statement J
y 21 I
MS.
SCHMIDT:
Yes, my individual statement.
22 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Yes, please go ahead.
23 MS. SCHMIDT:
I just want to say one thing.
All l
24
( (~ )
the names you were calling out, they were here this morning 25
16,862 Sim 13-9 obviously and this afternoon, but one whole page-was' missing 1
2 out of that little steno book and we couldn't find it.
We S
J knew some of our names were on that page and we couldn't find 3
4 it.
So, you know, that steno book doesn't seem to work too 5
well, and a lot of those names were called out tonight.
Maybe you could consider coming again.
Those 6
were a lot of names and a lot of people didn't get to speak.
7 f
(APP ause.)
l 8
I am here tonight to speak about some very vulner-9 10 able people who were left out and not contacted nor moved ti during the FEMA drill.
I am speaking of the handicapped and the homebound in our community.
12 As a lay minister in my church I have visited with 13
. --('
the handicapped and the shut-ins on a regular basis.
In i4 1
Rock Point we have a large amount of shut-ins who will have 15 to wait for someone to come and rescue them during a real l
16 37 emergency.
One of the women I visit, her name is Pauling.
18 I
She lives alone and she has been confined to her little 19 apartment for some time.
She stares out her windows and a -
20 d
she praises God that at least she can still see his wonders 21 i
through her windows.
22 l
She lives near the beach, the very beach that the f
23 1
Shoreham plant resides at.
24
'l __
ks
Gentlemen, please do not let this unthinkable 25 l
l
16,863 Sim 13-10 1
evil happen to her or to our community.
If you don't side m
2 with reason and goodness, these people not only will be 3
confined to wheel chairs and their homes, but also further 4
imprisoned by the knowledge that they are not going to be 5
evacuated.
On February 13th FEMA. held their test with no 6
7 traffic and no real life situations.
On Febraury 13th 8
my baby and I, we went to a LILCO office to voice our "No" 9
to the test.
It took me twice~as long becuase of traffic to and my reliable car' broke down.
This is life.
This is 11 reality.
12 (Applause. )
My reality is my husband and my four children.
13 I have a child in every school on three different bus runs.
g Why don't you tell me I guess in writing becuase you can't 15 respond how I will choose which school to go to in an 16 emergency and which child I will pick up first.
Maybe the j7 oldest, John, he has been with me 14 years, or maybe my 18 5
youngest in first grade.
She is so little and she would j
19 be the most frightened, maybe I will choose her.
She will 20 d
be frightened when her teacher leaves to go home to her 21 I
E family.
22 Tell me how will I choose which of my children 23 P ckup because it is up to me.
I will be the one picking t
i 24
.O them up.
I would never allow a LILCO worker to drive my 25 l
'16,864 Sim 13-11 1
child in a bus anywhere.
',3 2
(Applause.)
k/
3 How could you even consider approving a drill that 4
left out a.whole segment of our population, the home-bound, 5
a fluctuating population of 11,000 people in the 10-mile 6
radius, and our school children also.
7 By the way, in the LILCO evacuation plan it is 4
a written that LILCO has finalized their plans with all the 9
schools concerning evacuation.
We looked it up at the to library and it says it in black and white.
11 This is a lie. It's a lie.
12 (Applause.)
13 You probably think I am a hysterical mom or a
-~
14 person consumed with fear.
I am neither of the two.
If 15 you ever allow this plant to be licensed, I will leave ni Long Island.
I will do anything to protect my loved ones.
I guess in closing I can't help but wonder if
'j 17 a
ng this Board will have the guts to tell the truth.
!~
j 19 (Applause. )
J We here on Long Island have come to think of the 20
- d NRC as LILCO's-lap dogs.
It is not nice, but it is true, 21 ir doing whatever LILCO wants.
22 l
We want to think differently of you.
- Please, 23 l
give us reason to believe in you, that this Board has 24 l (.
integrity and that you are fair people concerned with our l
,/
25 i
i I
l
, _ ~.
4n 16,865 Sim 13-12 1
safety.
Please throw this paper test in the waste basket 2
where all worthless paper belongs.
-(s)
~s 3
Thank you.
4 (Applause.)
i 5
I~hlso submit bus drivers' statements from the 6
10-mile radius, individual statements from individual 7
. bus drivers and teachers' statements.
They are all here.
8 (Applause.)
9 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Lillian Juliano.
10 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 11 OF LILLIAN JULIANO 12 13 MS. JULIANO:
Gentlemen, I'am Lillian Juliano. I 14 reside in Rocky Point.
l 15 As you can see, I am confined to a wheel chair and I have no way of ever getting out of it.
My husband works 16
) ;
in New York City.
There is no way in which I could be j7 evacuated from my home.
He would not be allowed in and 18 0
I could not get out without professional care.
l g
jg_
a I am not alone in this.
There are, I am told, 20 d
11,000 home-bcund in a very small area and a great many of 21 Ir them are worse off than I am.
22 How this could ever go through is unbelievable 23 to me.
There are so many elderly in the area and so many 24 l (
People who have worked so hard, and here they are going 25
---..n
,_,_.e
,-.-,.,-,,,n,
.-..--ww
-w,.
,--n..-.,,,
w---.
16,866' Sim 13-13 I
to be faced with no way of ever getting any help and of 2-having to sit there and see themselves deserted completely.
3 My husband, as I have told him, don't even try 4-to come back for me, and now he can't come back for me.
They 5
wouldn't even allow him in.
I will be completely destroyed.
6 This I know, i
i 7
I can't imagine what the mothers of young children 8
are going through.
I think that this would be'something i
g that I would have to worry about.
My own phildren feel 10 they would want to get back to me because that is their 11 way.
12 As I say, I am only one of 11,000 in this area.
13 As you all know, we can't even get out to church on
.A l'J Sunday morning for the lines of traffic.
I just can't 34 l
imagine what we would do.
15 16 I can only feel that it has got to be stopped, s
17 and we beg your mercy to do it.
18 (Applause.)
I
.a JUDGE MARGULIES:
Helen Robinson.
j 19 a
MS. ROBINSON:
I-spoke this morning.
20 a
d JUDGE MARGULIES:
Lou Grasso.
21 I E E
LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 22 l
23 LOU GRASSO 24
(
MR. GRASSO:
Gentlemen, first, I would like to 25 l
l
16,867 Sim 13-14 thank you for being here this evening.
I know you have had 1
(';/
a long day and it promises to be even longer.
2
(-
3 But at least the people have had an opportunity 4
to express to you their concerns.
In that regard, there
~5 are a lot of people who are not here.
6 First, I would like to identify myself, and I am speaking now in my capacity as Editor of Suffolk Life.
7 8
My name is Lou Grasso, and I am the Managing Editor.
9 We have here from.an awful lot of people who were 10 not able to attend letters to the NRC expressing their 11 viewpoint and their opposition to the plant.
I 12 Throughout this pile of letters there are people 13 who are elderly and young families and they are all pleading l
)
14 for your attention, pleading for an honest answer to the 15 problems we face and pleading for your honest look at the 16 situation that exists with the lack of a possible evacuation
' !j 17 plan.
'18 Everybody has said it, and it is true.
It can't y
j 19 be exaggerated.
J:
I would like to leave these with you so that l
20 d
21 you may have them as a matter of the record.
One other
\\i 22 resident of Suffolk County, one of our readers went a little 23 bit further.
He sent us a copy of a paper evacuation f
24 plan.
It is kind of like the one that we had last 25 February.
It is a very simply one to do.
All you do is l
l l
l
1 6,.8 6 8 Y " "E "
^
- Y Sim 13-15 2
that you make.
v 3
(Laughter.)
4 And if you go three times, the road is flooded and 5
you have to detour.
6 (Laughter.)
7 If you go five times it says heavy traffic and 8
you lose three turns.
9 (Laughter.)
to You may make it to a safe finish line, but that is 11 in doubt.
12 I would like to leave that with you also.
I mean 13 she took a lot of imagination in preparing that, and since Q, f g
..)
14 the NRC, and perhaps not you gentlemen particularly, but 15 at least the NRC seems to have a desire to play paper games 16 in evacuation drills, that might come in handy.
3 5
17 (Laughter.)
t 18 Now I would like to talk to you in terms of g
19 myself as a resident of the county and also I guess still a
'l as a journalist.
20 a
d Throughout the long, long controversey over 21 3r Shoreham there have been frequent charges that the NRC 22 i
and LILCO are working in partnership towards putting the 23 plant on line, that instead of living up to its responsi--
24
.O
(_s.-
sibility to protect the safety of the public it has becomo 25
16,869 Sim 13-16 involved in collusion with the utilities to force the growth of nuclear power to ensure its own bureaucratic 1if**
3 There have been denials of course, denials that 4
are difficult to disprove because of the. closed-door 5
meetings that have been frequently held between NRC and utility officials during which the strategy for expedited h arings and to develop arguments to overcome arguments 9
are discussed.
9 From time to time memos and other documentation 10 of these meetings come to light giving an insight into the cozy relationship that exists between our supposed guardians of safety and the utilities that threaten that 13 b.,
safety.
14 In my mind, gentlemen, at least, and I think 15 in a lot of minds when this is explored there is no doubt 16
! I that there is collusion between officials within the g
17 I
NRC and LILCO, and prove of that collusion can be found li 18 e
in the briefs prepared by the NRC and LILCO in rebuttal r
j 19 l
to the contentions raised by the intervenors, M
g g
I direct your attention to the footnote that 21 l l appears on page 11 of the NRC staff brief.
That footnote 22 declares:
"This Board and the Appeal Board ruled against i
23 LILCO on the legal authority issue, Long Island Lighting 24 p/
{/
Company, Shoreham Nuclear Power Station, Unit 1.
The
(_
25 l
l
16,870 Sim 13-17 Compiission presently has pending before it LILCO's appeal 1
2 on a preemption argument ~in response to the legal authority i
3 contentions and has remanded to the Licensing Board for further proceedings the realism and immateriality arguments."
4 5
Then look at page 18 in a LILCO brief.
You will find these words.
"This Board and the Appeal Board ultimate] y 6
7 ruled against LILCO on these issues.
Long Island Lighting 8
Company, Shoreham Nuclear Power Station, Unit 1.
The 4
Commission has pending before it LILCO's appeal on a g
-preemption argument in response to the legal authority 10 contentions and has remanded for further proceedings the it realism and immaterial arguments."
12 Gentlemen, duplication.
That raises a question.
13 How on earth -- can't simply be clairvoyance.
I mean it 14 got to be that somebody is really on the same wavelength 15 here in preparing the briefs, on on the NRC staff's side 16 and the other one on the LILCO side.
j 37 (Applause.)
18 Then go beyond that.
Then turn to page 12 and lg jg a
.b 13 in the NRC staff brief and page 21 of the LILCO brief 20 a
l,d and you will find virtually the exact wording in the conten-21 i
t ti ns in summary form in both briefs.
22 I haven't totally listed those here because of the 23 limited time that I have, but if you look at these arguments 24
- ()
i(/
y u can see, and they are all highlighted for anyone to 25 i
i 4
,. -, ~,.
m-
,~,
-m-. -
~~s
,-,_-._..,.,--.c,.y
.ce--...,-
16,871 1
Clearly see.
The similarities exist.
They are there.
~s 2
Go to page 27 in the NRC staff brief.
In the b
3 last-paragraph on that page you will find these words:
4 "Intervenors have simply set out a few isolated discrepancies ~
5 found by FEMA at the exercise in an attempt to challenge LERO's dose assessment capabilities.
Intervenors have not 6
7 asserted that the LERO pars estabished during the exercise 8
were wrong given the scenario data.
In fact, FEMA 9
specifically found that the LILCO onsite and offsite to organizations demonstrated good judgment in making correct 11 PAG determinations, and that the LERO pars were consistent with the EPA PAGs for child thyroid dose which was the 12 13 appropriate dose pathway for this exercise scenario."
i
- (~C_NJ 14 Now turn to page 67 if the LILCO brief.
In the first paragraph you will find these words.
"What inter-15 venors have done is~ string together a few isolated minor 16 a
and easily corrected discrepancies in an attempt to.
h 17 challenge LERO dose assessment capabilities.
Nowhere have 18 intervenors claimed that the LERO pars established during j
ig i
the exercise were wrong given the scenario data.
In fact, i
20 s
J FEMA found that the onsite and offsite organizations 21 demonstrated good judgment in making correct PAG determina-22 i
tions and that the LERO pars were consistent with the 23 l
EPA PAGs for child thyroid dose which was the appropriate l
24 dose pathway for this exercise scenario."
25 t
l
16,872 Sim 13-19 You will notice that a word is omitted or added 1
2 here and there, but for the most part the wording is
' g-)3
'u.
3 identical.
4 These are not the only examples, but the limited 5
time I have to prevents detailing more.
We will do that 6
in print in next week's edition of Suffolk Life.
7 (Applause.)
8 Why do these duplications exist?
How is it that
,9 the NRC staff and LILCO are using the very same words to to argue against the contentions raised by our County i
11 and State governments?
12 I know you are here to listen and not to talk,-
l 13 but I firmly believe'that you own the people of the
('Os 14 County an explanation, or at the very least'a promise that 4
you will demand a full investigation into the collusion 15 between the NRC staff and LILCO in the preparation of 16 s
these briefs.
17 Gentlemen, we are facing a stacked deck.
We have 18 j
19 problems with FEMA.
I mean here we have a man who says
- a l
that the reasonable assurance of safety cannot be 20 a
assured and they say, well, gee, you can't say that.
He 21 i
I resigns an'd they erase it.
22 And now we have got the NRC staff and LILCO 23 Preparing the same brief.
I don't underdstand it.
Perhaps 24 (O
you do.
25
16,873~
2
- Sim 13-20 1
Would-you like to offer some sort of an explanation ?
2
. JUDGE MARGULIES:
We take that as a rhetorical 3
- question, j
4 MR. GRASSO:
Would you like to promise.whether 5
or not you would ask for an investigation into the a
i 6
matter?
i-t 4
.7 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Would you please continue with 8
your statement.
j g
(Disturbances from the audience.)
1 10 MR. GRASS:
You know, it is bad enough that the 4
11 ratepayers' money is being used by LILCO to force this
{
12 unwanted plant down our throats to threaten our future 13 safety.
It is quite another thing to have our taxpayers' f
(-)
i W' money which finances the operation of the NRC being used j
14 against us in a very obvious partnership between those 15 i
who would be protecting our futures and those who are 16 a
f 17 threatening them.
( Applause. )
l is
,.I.
In your partial initial decision dated April 17th, j
19 d
1985 this Licensing Board stated:
"The regulatory standard 20 a
f 3
remains the same, that there be reasonable assurance that li 21 i
adequate protective measures can and will be taken in a t
22 radiological emergency."
23 Y u said the health and safety of the public 24
(,_(,)
must be protected.
You have already heard Frank Petrone 25
16,874 1
today,who was the Regional Director at the time that Sim 13-21 7N.
2 LILCO's paper drill was held in February, and he testified G) 3 at the end of that drill that we cannot g'ive reasonable
~
4 assurance that the public's health an'd safety can be 5
Protected.
4 Now that statement alone should have been the end 6
of the LILCO evacuation plan fiasco.
7 (APP ause.)
l 8
But FEMA officials demanded that that statement 9
be eliminated.
Frank refused and was forced to resign, to and the FEMA officials used their erasers.
It was taken jj out of the FEMA report, but you can't take it out of the 12 public record.
i3 (IO
~-
( Applause. )
g Y u were right the first time, gentlemen, when 15 y u said in your first decision that LILCO's plan cannot 16 and will not be implemented as proposed and fails to 37 comply with the regulatory standards, and the Appeals 18 I
Board upheld that decision.
g gg al j Unfortunately, the members of the Nuclear 20 a
d Regulatory -- the Commissioners of the Nuclear Regulatory 21 i
Commission apparently have giving you marching orders to come back to the public and to hold more hearings.
23 By God I hope, and I think the people of Suffolk
(-)
County hope and look to you to be men of integrity because 25 l
.e-
~~ -
16,875 Sim 13-22 1
a decision can't'be anything else.
The LILCO plan is 2
crumbling.
Relocation centers, radio stations, bus drivers, fgQ 3
school districts, everybody is walking away from what is 4
a very poor plan that threatens the life of the people of 5
Suffolk County.
I' (APP ause.)
l 6
7 You said it once, and I say it now, these people 8
deserve to be protected, and I ask you to do.that.
9 Thank you.
10 (Applause.)
a 11 12
(,
I 14 i
15 1
f 16 ig 17 t
i m
,4
- i 21
!i 22 i
23 i
24 p
~
3
16,876 EVENING 1
FROM THE FLOOR:
Excuse me.
I was wondering if I
- 1 1-SueW 2
could take a minute of your time?
I am not on the list until 3
later but I have to go.
I would appreciate it if I could 4
speak.
5 FROM THE FLOOR:
Let him speak.
6 (Applause.)
7 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Yes.
8 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 9
OF 10 VINCENT GARY 11 l MR. GARY:
My name is Vincent Gary.
I live in 12 Shoreham.
I have no new facts to lay before you.
I have no 13 new ideas that you have not heard.
14 What is at issue for me is my outrage that my 15 elected officials are being ignored and that the body of 16 knowledge that is here -- I mean, here right now -- it seems so 17 absurd, and it seems so fruitless for me to be speaking to you.
l 18 If you had a meeting about any subject, you could fill a room 19 like this with people who have very strong opinions.
20 The Suffolk County Legislators speak as a single 1
21 voice that this is an absurd notion.
The Governor speaks, 22 the United States Senators speak as a single voice.
23 And yet we are called back over and over to speak to
'm 24 you about what?
About something that has been established for
. Ace-Feder:1 Reporters, Inc.
25 such a long time.
16,877
- 14-2-SueW 1 I was not here in the beginning.
I assume that you O
2 cannot speak back to me?
3 JUDGE MARGULIES:
That is correct.
We are here to 4
listen to you.
5 MR. GARY:
I -- again, I -- it is such a-shame that 6
the people that represent me are being ignored in so many 7
different things.
8 (Applause.)
9 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Erith Labrock.
1 10 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 11 OF 12 ERITH LABROCK O
13 MS. LABROCK:
I have been here all morning.
- And, 14 then I went to Huntington, and I was late tonight because I 15 got caught on the LIE coming back.
16 (Applause.)
l l
17 MS. LABROCK:
Well, thank you for the opportunity l
l 18 to speak to you tonight, but I'm not fooled.because I know 19 that anything I said tonight, or anybody said tonight, won't j
20 make a difference in the licensing of Shoreham because your l
l 21 minds are made up already.
They were made up when you took l
22 your jobs, as far as I'm concerned.
23 (Applause.)
24 MS. LABROCK:
I read something in "Newsday" that --
Ase Federot Reporters, Inc.
25 are you Mr. Margulies?
1
16,878
'#1 3-SueW 1
JUDGE MARGULIES:
Yes, Margulies.
2 MS. LABROCK:
That you said that these hearings are 3
to determine "whether there are any flaws in the emergency plan. "
4 Is that -- this is what "Newsday" quoted you as 5
having said.
To me, that just says that it's a sham.
6 Anyway, I'm glad to'be living in this relatively 7
democratic country where I'm allowed to speak my mind, and people 8
are allowed to do that and maybe change a few laws here and 9
there.
As a person born in another country, Isreal, as a 10 daughter of parents who were born in Poland and Russia, as a 11 traveller across South America, I know what democracy is.
- And, 12 I cherish it.
What freedom is.
()
13 But, democracy in this country seems to go so far i
14 and then stops.
This is a prime example of how it stops.
T 15 Nothing makes any sense about Shoreham,.not economically, l
16 physically, socially, psychologically.
Yet, the fact that 17 Long Islanders don't want it, it's going to be rammed down our l
18 throats.
That's the way I feel.
f 19 I feel so frustrated about this, and helpless.
- And, i
20 as a result of this issue, I'm losing my idealism in this
[
21 country.
I'm also losing my hope for the future as a result l
l 22 of learning more about radiation and radioactive waste and l
23 the hopelessness of that problem.
j 24 The most depressing of all, I'm losing my faith in Ass.c.ews p.oonwi, inc.
25 man and the human spirit that has true caring and devotion for i
16,879
- SueW 1 his fellow man.
A s a p e d i a t r i c n u r s e,: I know what suffering 2
is firsthand.
Not many people get that opportunity; nurses.do.
3 They know the suffering from cancer, childhood leukemia, 4
genetic dar. age.
It's unbelievable.
5 But, anyway, despite that, a little information 6
about myself that I just need to say because it's happening 7
right now.
My husband is a Long Island high school teacher for 8
20 years.
He teaches chemistry and physics.
And I'm a 9
pediatric nurse here for 11 years.
I'm also a Lamaz instructor.
10 I just met one of my -- the baby that I never saw, sitting back 11 there.
I met another one this morning.
12 We live on a farm two miles away from*Shoreham.
- And, O
.13 we worked very hard on this farm.
We grow a lot of fruit an'd 14 vegetables and honey and eggs, and we have our own meat.
- And, 15 we really love it there.
But, we sold it.
And we are going to 16 get off the Island.
I 17 I've been fighting this for a long time.
And, we 18 are going to close in two weeks -- I'm sorry, the tears.
I 19 didn't expect this.
20 (Pause.)
21 MS. LABROCK:
Anyway, we are giving up our jobs and 22 our dreams over here, because our children come first and their 23 safety first.
And, yes, it's a free country and we are free
(
24 to move.
And, that's what people say:
Oh, you don't like it, Aesfederd Reporters, Inc.
25 you move.
And, that's what we are going to do, because nobody l
16,880
- 14-5-SueW 1
is going to dictate our lives to us and tell us to live in O
2 fear.
And, nobody is going to tell us to live with blind-3 folds on, because we know the truth.
And, nobody is going 4
to tell us to live with false reassurances like this plan is, 5
a false reassurance, because we know better.
6 We are not going to sit by and see what the little
~
7 puffs and spills that every nuclear plant eventually gives out 8
and see what it does to our little children's bodies and their 9
genes in the fudure.
We are not going to sit around and see 10 that.
We are not going to worry when every time.we hear a 11 fire siren, even for a split second, wondering if that's going 12 to be one of the LILCO sirens.
We are not going to worry.
(
13 We are not going to calculate how we could run back 14 from our jobs in western Suffolk and get our kids in Shoreham, 15 because that's what we would do.
We are not going to worry 16 about that.
And, we are not going to swim at the Wading River 17 Beach with the plant sitting smack behind us, wondering what 18 the water is like, what the air is like, what our children's 19 bodies, what's happening to them, what lies LILCO is telling 20 us.
21 We feel very strongly about this, and that's why 22 we are leaving.
But, it's very hard.
My son cries every 23 night.
And, I cry all the time.
?~.
8
)
24 Anyway, I know you are really not here for Am-Feder3 Reporters, Inc.
25 emotionalisms.
So, I will just stick in a few little things
16,881
- 1 6-SueW 1
.about evacuation like everybody else is doing, but that's what 2
you want to hear.
So, anyway, I do work in Stony Brook.
I'm 3
a nurse there.
And I've thought about what I would do in 4
the case of an evacuation.
It's a very hard decision for a l
5 dedicated person.
But, there is such a thing as mother 1
6 instincts, and there is no way that I'm going to let my 7
children be in anybody's hands.
I'm going -- even if I have 8
to walk on top of cars, I will go 20 miles back and get my j
l 9
kids.
That's what I would do if I had to do this.
10 I happen to be work in a newborn nursery.
It's a 11 little easier decision, because I could just take the babies 12 and give them to their mommies.
But, if I was working in NICU, 1 o 13 newborn intensive care, which sometimes I do, it's a very hard i
i 14 decision.
But, I think what would happen is that nurses who 15 don't have children will end up staying.
16 But, then again, 20 miles away, if you think about 17 Chernobyl, I mean, you know, that really has to be evacuated, l
18 too.
l 19 Just another little thing, a little flaw that you 20 are looking for.
I also used to work in the Riverhead Jail.
21 And, I just wonder if you have any -- it is within the 10-mile 22 radius.
I know that, as a nurse over there, if I wanted an i
23 inmate to go to the emergency room you need five guards for one j ()
i 24 inmate.
So, obviously you are not going to evacuate the inmates, I se#ederd Reporters, Inc.
A 25 Not that I -- you know, I'm not fighting for inmates, but it's t
16,882
- SueW 1 just a little flaw.
You are looking for a flaw.
2 Since you are not going to evacuate them, I guess 3
you are playing God.
You are telling who shall live and who 1
4 shall die, corporal punishment.
Do you have the ability to 5
enact that?
6 Anyway, the -- and, we know that a certain 7
percentage of people in the jails are perfectly innocent.
I
~
8 begged my husband to come here and talk.
He's a very eloquent 9
speaker, but he refuses to talk because he says he doesn't 10 want to talk anymore because you don't listen.
But, he did 11 tell me, as a joke, that he would come here with a sign saying:
12 Ten-mile zone.
And one side of his face would be charred and
)
13 burned and the other side would be dlean.
One side of his 14 body would be all tattered and torn, and the other side would 15 be just fine.
The 10-mile zone.
16 But, he's not coming.
And I don't think he's going 17 to come again to these things.
I really asked him to come, l
18 because I think maybe there's a tiny bit of feeling left --
I 19 well, maybe not, l
l 20 I had a little sentence here, but looking at your l
21 faces I guess I won't.
Thank you, i
22 (Applause.)
l 23 MS. LABROCK:
Maybe -- I can't.
24 FROM THE FLOOR:
It might make a difference.
Ase Fessord Reporters, Inc.
25 MS. LABROCK:
You know what I'm asking.
Thank you l
16,883 l
8-SueW I very much.
(APP ause.)
l 2
JUDGE MARGULIES:
Wai Chinn.
1 3
MS. ROBINSON:
She had to leave.
May I read her 4
. statement.
5 JUDGE MARGULIES:
She did appear at Happauge, and 6
I just wonder if it's a repeat of what went on before.
We 7
have a lot of people here who wish to be heard for the first j
8 time.
9 MS. ROBINSON:
May I submit it?
10 11 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Yes, you may submit it.
MS. ROBINSON:
She has a Resolution from the Mt.
12 O
Sinai Teachers' Association, 13 JUDGE MARGULIES:
She did not speak to the ja Teachers' Association, so if you wish to read her statement 15 16 you may do so.
37 (Applause.)
l 18 l
19 t
l 20 21 22 l
l 23 24 Assfesord Reoorters, Inc.
25 l
i
16,884
'#14-9-SueW 1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT
(%
R-)
\\
2 OF l
3 WAI CHINN, GIVEN BY HELEN ROBINSON 4
MS. ROBINSON:
I am here today to represent the l
5 Mt. Sinai Teachers' Association.
1 6
Three years ago, a number of Mt. Sinai teachers 7
were ready to take time off and testify before the NRC on the j
g issue of role conflict.
Unfortunately, the NRC chose to 9
accept LILCO's so-called realism argument and, in effect, 10 muzzled some of the people who could have most clearly told 11 them about the workability of LILCO's evacuation plan.
12 Despite the fact that LILCO has made school teachers 13 in the evacuation zone an integral part of its evacuation 14 plan, the NRC has not, to my knowledge, called on this group 15 to find out what they would really do in an emergency.
16 Well, today I'm here to let you know what they have 17 to say.
I have here a copy of a Resolution passed by the Mt.
18 Sinai Teachers' Association.
The main point of this statement, 19 which I will submit to you, are:
(1)
Shoreham is unsafe; 20 (2) Evacuation in the event of an accident is not workable; 21 (3)
Most of the teachers, regardless of what LILCO says, 22 will not remain at the Mt. Sinal schools to help supervise 23 evacuation.
Most of the teachers will be leaving immediately, 24 because they have children of their own to take to safety.
A p.e.o n.oort r. inc.
25 A poll, the results of which were sent to the NRC,
16,885
- 14-10-SueN showed that of the 200 plus Mr. Sinai teachers, over 70 h
i 2
percent of them would not participate in LILCO's evacuation 3
plan for the schools.
4 In addition, to further emphasize their position, 5
many teachers signed statements which unequivocally state 6
that they will leave their schools in the event of an accident 7
to tend to their own families.
The statements will be de-8 livered to you this evening.
Even if we accepted the LILCO 9
fantasy that evacuation is feasible, a plan is only as effective 10 as the people involved.
'l l If, as the Mt. Sinai teachers, and others have 12
- said, the people are not there how effective can LILCO's plan b'
13 be?
14 (Applause.)
15 MS. ROBINSON:
Shall I read it?
16 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Yes.
17 MS. ROBINSON:
Resolution.
Whereas, the federal 13 regulations for full power operation of the Shoreham Nuclear 19 Plant require an emergency plan for communities surrounding 20 the plant which will assure those communities adequate pro-21 tection in the event of a nuclear emergency; and 22 Whereas, the Long Island Lighting Company, in an 23 effort to meet federal regulations, has prepared an emergency 24 plan, which LILCO, lacking coordination with local or state
' Ase Feder:J Reporters, Inc.
25 governments will attempt to implement; and i
I 16,886 11-SueWj Whereas, the LILCO emergency plan includes pro-2 tective actions to be taken by schools; and 3
Whereas, this association has identified the 4
following weaknesses in the LILCO emergency plan:
5 1.
Early Dismissal.
Our emergency early dismissal 6
procedure, which LILCO's plan incorporates, wouldn't being 7
school children to an uncontaminated area quickly enough to 8
protect their health and safety.
9 2.
Transportation.
The requisite number of 10 buses and drivers required for successful early dismissal are 11 not available to the schools.
This will prolong childrens' 12 stay at schools in contaminated areas.
x-)
13 3.
Needs of Teachers.
We cannot guarantee that 14 the teachers will stay in schools to supervise early dismis-15 sal.
Many of us may need to attent to the safety of our own 16 families and, therefore, may not be available to perform 17 emergency-related tasks.
l 18 4.
Lack of Parental Supervision.
The success of 19 an early dismissal plan depends not only on prompt dismissal 20 from schools, but on prompt evacuation of children from 21 their homes.
In those cases in which parents will not be at 22 home during the day, children will be sent to unsupervised 23 homes from which they will not be able to evacuate promptly.
OlJ 24 5.
Parental Intercession.
We cannot be Ase-Federd Reporters, Inc.
25 confident that parents will wait at home for their children to
A 16,887
- SueWj arrive.
Many parents may attempt to retrieve'their children 2
at schools, perhaps causing increased confusion and chaos.
3 6.
Relocation.
If a Shoreham emergency develops-4 quickly and requires an evacuation of children from schools 5
directly to relocation centers, this district does not have 6
sufficient buses or drivers to transport all children to 7
relocation centers in a timely, effective manner.
8 7.
Supervision at Relocation Centers.
We cannot 9
guarantee that teachers will travel to and remain at relocation 10 centers to supervise school children until parents arrive to 11 retrieve them.
12 8.
Trust in Public Information.
In the LILCO plan, CE) i 13 the only public information upon which to base decisions for 14 protective actions will come from the utility.
- LILCO, 15 through its public schools coordinator and WALK radio, which 16 backed out, will both describe through its public -- will both 17 describe the extent of the emergency and recommend actions.
18 Because LILCO would be both operator of the plant 19 and initiator of emergency actions, potential for conflict 20 of interest exists.
School administrators receiving informa-21 tion only from LILCO and not from any governmental agency will 22 he forced to decide upon actions with potentially serious 23 consequences without the benefit of a directive from a 24 responsible governmental source.
Ass.Faseral Reconen, Inc.
25 Now, be it therefore Resolved that the Mt. Sinai
16,888
- 14-13-SueW1 Teachers' Association finds that LILCO's emergency plans for U
2 schools do not offer children or school personnel of this 3
district adequate protection in the event of an accident at 4
the Shoreham Nuclear Plant; and, be it further 5
Resolved that this association believes that 6
licensing of the Shoreham Nuclear Plant should not be permitted 7
unless or until complete and reasonable resolution of these 8
cutstanding, critical emergency planning problems can be 9
achieved.
10
( APpla'..s e. )
11 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Donna Andreoni from Rocky Point.
12 (No response.)
13 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Joanne Morello from Ridge.
14 (No response.)
15 JUDGE MARGULIES:. Kirk Billing.
16 (No response.)
17 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Kate McCormack.
18 19 20 21 22 23 24 Ace Feders! Reporters, Inc.
25
16,889 14-SueWl LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 2
OF 3
KATE MC CORMACK 4
MS. MC CORMACK:
Good evening.
My name is Kate 1
5 McCormac_k, and I live in the Springs portion of east Hampton, 6
which is out on the east end of Long Island.
7 I begin this evening with the following quote:
8 "The Shoreham plant was constructed to provide safe, economical, 9
and reliable energy as electric utilities are required to do 10 for the benefit of the customers in their service area.
The 11 operation of the Shoreham plant is the only way for the public 12 to realize those benefits."
O.
13 Firstly, there has never been an independent in-14 spection made of the nuclear plant at Shoreham.
It's safety 15 is certainly questionable in not only my mind but 74 percent 4
16 of Long Island's population.
17 Secondly, studies have proven that Shoreham will 18 never be economic to Long Island.
We already pay the second j
I-19 highest rates in the United States.
Compound that with the 20 cracked diesel generators, numerous delays due to construction 21 errors, faulty machinery, sloppy workmanship and poor decisions 22 made by LILCO management, and we have electricity that only a 23 few will be able to afford.
O 24 Presently, I pay over a hundred dollars a month i mm.e esrw nesenen. anc.
1 25 for electricity.
My brother, a resident of Rockville Centre,
16,890
- SueW I Long Island, which has its own utility company, pays eighteen 2
dollars a month.
3 (Applause.)
4 MS. MC CORMACK:
Thirdly, reliability.
Please 5
don't try and tell me that we can expect to have efficient, 6
uninterrupted service by Shoreham's operation.
Who do you 7
plan to get to run it?
LILCO has demonstrated to all of Long 8
Island that they are not capable of meeting our needs even 9
if they had all of the power in the world.
10 Now, I would like to quote the following:
"We are II confident the NRC will resolve the outstanding emergency 12 planning issues at Shoreham in a manner which ensures public cs l
t
)
l
%,_j t
13
. safety, recognizing that the safety of the Shoreham plant has 14 been reaffirmed at every level of review."
i 15 How, I ask, members of the NRC, are you going to l
16 resolve the outstanding emergency planning issues at Shoreham?
17 Do you have a secret plan, perhaps some magic?
Do you believe 18 this place is exactly what it says it is?
An island, Long 19 Island, with one way out?
20 LILCO claims only a 10-mile radius of people need 21 be evacuated in case of an emergency at tne plant.
What 22 happens if the accident occurs when the " normal" amount of 23 people are travelling that route, which is already congested?
24 Do you tell them to go home?
West, okay; east, forget it.
Ace-Federd Reporters, Inc.
25 Do you tell them they are in the way of an evacuation
16,891
- 1 16-SueW l and you didn't plan on them so they should move over until the 10-mile radius people leave?
2 3
(Applause.)
MS. MC CORMACK:
Do you-arrest the people that try 4
to be included that live beyond that 10-mile radius that 5
just might want to get away from the poisonous radiation?
Or, 6
maybe, do you just construct a bridge to Connecticut?
7 What, NRC members, can you possibly do to resolve 8
the outstanding emergency planning issues we are all facing?
9 Look the other way and say okay?
10 It isn't enough for LILCO that the majority of 11 the people and the County and the State government do not 12
'~'
want Shoreham in operation.
Is it enough for you?
13 Is a make-believe drill, designed to move make-14 believe people on paper, enough evidence for you that it is a 15 1
16 workable plan or an effective drill?
l The sentences which I quoted in the beginning of 17 my presentation were taken from a letter dated June 18th, 18 1
1986 from Mr. Michael C. Sellers, External Affairs Manage'-
19 Office of Nuclear Energy, Department of Energy of the United 20 States of America.
And I have a copy right here for you.
21 What I hope is that this licensing committee is 22 really here to listen to us and believe what we say.
We hope 23 p
this is not another charade which seems to be characteristic iJ 24
- A=-F d.c aeponen, inc.
25 of the Long Island Lighting Company.
Shoreham is not now, or
16,892
- 14-17-SueWI ever will be, safe, economical or reliable to the people of 9
2 Long Island which, according to Mr. Sellers, was the purpose 3
for its being here.
4 The only way for the general public of Long Island 5
to realize any benefits is to close the doors of Shoreham, 6
turn off the equipment, lock the gates and place a huge sign 7
which reads, "This plant has been abandoned because we, the 8
people, knew it was in our best interests of survival."
9 (Applause.)
10 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Laure Ridgeway.
11 (No response.)
12 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Peggy McKennan Clark.
/, X t
'~'
13 Ms. CLARK:
Good evening.
I spoke with you 14 briefly earlier, because --
15 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Step up, please.
I I
16 j MS. CLARK:
Okay.
Hi, May I give my time to I
i 17 someone else?
I spoke to you briefly before when you broke 18 for dinner time, and I didn't think we could come back this 19 evening because we are expecting guests and we have to meet a l
l 20 plane.
However, we found that we could spend this little bit l
21 of time.
22 But, I would like to give my time to someone.
May 23 I do that?
l I
i l
24 FROM THE FLOOR:
May I take it?
Aco-Federal Reporters, Inc.
25 MS. CLARK:
Betty Hoye.
Thank you very much.
1
16,893
- 1.4-18-SueW1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT O
2 OF 3
BETTY HOYE 4
MS. HOYE:
My name is Betty Hoye.
I'm from Shelter 5
Island.
A few months before the Brenner Board's inauspicious 6
hearing in Riverhead, the NRC published a tract entitled, 7
" Proposed Policy Statement on Safety Goals for Nuclear Power 8
Plants," which disclosed that the NRC is more interested in 9
die public's perception of safety than safety itself, which is 10 not just a question of semantics but the crux of the whole 11 Shoreham conflict.
12 Perceptual psychologists know that the way we feel
, ()
13 or perceive th'ings is colored by past experience and accumulated.
14 knowledge.
They know that the only way to change these per-15 ceptions is to change people's experience.
Generally speaking, i
16 there are two ways to change experiences that shape the way 17 People feel about things.
One is to change the image, and the 18 second is to alter reality itself.
19 And that in exactly the process at work here on l
20 Long Island -- mind bending, gentlemen, in its simplest form, 21 an unsavory business total unbecoming a democracy.
22 Repeated t.v. speels in the Shoreham safety report, l
i 23 authored by a group of Brookhaven scientists, and printed and
)
24 distributed by Citizens for Shoreham Electricity, a LILCO s-
, Am.Feesc Reportm. inc.
25 subsidiary, have attempted to change Shoreham's bankrupt,
16,894 i
19-SueW1 public image for the better, but in vain.
2 Any induced perception of Shoreham as safe 3
achieved obsolescense with the eruption at Chernobyl.
It all 4
went to show us, Abraham Lincoln liked to call out, " Calling 5
a dog's leg a tail don't make it a tail."
6 (Applause.)
7 MS. HOYE:
Altering reality is the last hope for 8
LILCO and the federal agencies., LILCO's completion of the NRC-ordered FEMA drill is offered in evidence that the im-9 10 possible is possible.
We remind this Board that 138,000 times i
11 zero is still zero, and that Frank Petrone, FEMA's Regional 12 Director, could not, on the basis of this drill, give C) 13 reasonable assurance that public safety could be protected.
14 Back in 1982, the Communications Council of i
15 America -- do you remember them?
They are the public 16 relations firm that warned the DOE and NRC to " control what i
17 goes into the record or the minds of the listeners."
18 Those Kremlin-like instructions were followed to l
19 the letter.
FEMA omitted a mandatory public hearing, Petrone 1
20 has been fired, and his offending remarks deleted from FEMA's 21 report.
But, what does that change?
22 An evacuation has been proven possible on paper, but 23 where else?
Certainly not in the hearts and minds of Long O
24 Islanders who perceive this drill to be a flimsy falsity,
, ase.c.e r.i seconm. inc.
25 foisted on them by federal flim-flam men.
16,895 20-SueW1 (Applause.)
2 MS. HOYE:
Reality reels with NRC's attempted 3
alterations.
Case in point, the. unreal realism argument 4
which assumes, for licensing purposes, assistance in a real 5
emergency from Governor Cuomo and County Executive Cohalan, 6
despite their sworn statements to the contrary.
7 The Commissioners are playing mind games and have 8
put the cart before the horse.
This Board, having been in 9
touch with reality long enough to acknowledge the fact that 10 Shoreham cannot legally be licensed without State and County 11 participation in emergency planning, should now admit the 12 truth, since there cannot be a legally licensed plant then
(:)
13 t here cannot, therefore, be any real emergency.
1-4 The emergency, in fact, has been prevented.
15 (Applause.)
16 MS. HOYE:
Orwell once wrote, "There was truth and I
17 1 there was untruth.
And if you clung to the truth even against 18 the whole world, you were not mad."
19 And, it is our sincere hope that this Board is not 20 mad.
Thank you.
21 (Applause.)
22 1 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Bob Alcorn.
23 24
-o a 25
16,896
- 14-21-SueW 1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT C
2 OF 3
BOB ALCORN 4
MR. ALCORN:
I would like to speak to you today as 5
a resident of Long Island, as a teacher in a Long Island 6
school district, as the father of four children, and finally as a citizen of the United States of America.
7 8
I reside in Wading River, just two miles from the 9
Shorehem Nuclear Power Plant.
I have lived on Long Island all 10 my life, and I drive the roads in the 10-mile radius each and 11 every day.
I am telling you, in no uncertain terms, despite 12 the absurd drill that was held on February 13th, despite the
(~'\\
\\/
assurances of the Long Island Lighting Company, and despite 13 14 the findings of the NRC that there is nothing unique about 15 the geography or road network of Long Island, that the orderly 16 and safe evacuation of all people within the 10-mile radius 17 is impossible.
i 18 I invite any one of you to start on Route 25-A in 1
19 Shoreham at the plant entrance, drive your car west towards 20 Port Jefferson on any given day, particularly on a week-end 21 in the summertime and reach Port Jefferson in under 45 minutes.
22 And it's not even 10 miles, with no panic.
1 l
23 You can stage all the drills you want; you can
(
24 make all the findings you want, but nothing is going to
, Aa caserm a.comn, inc.
25 change the basic fact of life on the roads of Long Island.
l
16.897
- 4 22-SueW1 You can't get there'from here.
As a teacher in 2
the Longwood School District which currently services almost 3
10,000 pupils, and whose schools are all within the 10-mile 4
radius of the plant, I can assure you what my actions and 5
the actions of my colleagues would be should there be even 6
the hint of an accident at that plant.
We would leave our 7
classe.s, we would leave the school in an attempt to reach our 8
loved ones.
9 And, no one in a yellow rain slicker with a LILCO 10 logo'on it would present much of a deterrent.
11 (Applause.)
l 12 MR. ALCORN:
Maybe you people in Washington' really 13 don't understand the depth of feeling that Long Islanders 14 possess with regard to the Long Island Lighting Company.
15 (Applause.)
16 MR. ALCORN:
If I said that they were the most 17 d espised, arrogant and greedy corporation to ever do business 18 on Long Island, I'm sure I would be understating the contempt 19 that Long Islanders have for them.
20 Now, these --
l 21 (Applause.)
22 MR. ALCORN:
-- are the same people who are going l
23 to safely guide my family and me to their corporate head-s 24 quarters where I am told that I will be decontaminated by l
l Ass.c o c.s neponen, inc.
l 25 LILCO personnel.
You three people must be kidding.
Can you l
16,898 i
.#14-23-SueW honestly deep down inside'of you believe that in a real emergency things will go as smoothly as LILCO wished their c
3 so-called drill of February 13th had gone?
If the answer to 4
that question is no, then you must find that their plan has 5
a fatal flow, namely that no one from the Governor and the 6
County Executive, down to the man on the street,'will follow 7
that plan.
8 As a high school social studies teacher for the 9
past 15 years, I have tried to teach my students the meaning 10 of the words " freedom, democracy, and representative govern-11 ment."
These are the three words which set the United States 12 a part from the rest of the world.
13 As I have followed the Shoreham' saga for the past 14 15 years, it is my belief that these three words are being I
15 relegated to nothing more than words in a book.
l 16 (Applause.)
17 MR. ALCORN:
How can I possibly tell my 13-year old 18 students that these words really mean anything when every 19 elected official on Long Island, along with the Governor of 20 the State, and the two United States Senators from New York, 21 have determined that Shoreham is too unsafe to operate because 22 there could never be a safe evacuation?
23 And, yet non-elected officials in Washington, D.C.,
(
24 many of whom have never even been to Long Island, say that r
Amemwd Reorwrs. W.
25 evacuation is possible.
I'm afraid, gentlemen, that there is
16,899
- 14-24-SueW 1 more at stake here than the lives and safety of Long Islanders.
(~
2 If this plant is allowed to operate in total disregard for 3
the wishes of Long Islanders, who just happen to be' citizens 4
of the United States, then I fear that the peoples' belief in 5
freedom and democracy and justice will have been dealt a 6
fatal blow.
7 (Applause.)
8 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Sue Heggerty.
9 (No response.)
10 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Mike Heggerty.
I 11 (No response.)
12 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Anthony Rossi.
r) 2 13 (No response.)
14 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Karen Garrett.
l 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23
()
24 W Reporters, Inc.
25
16,900
- 14-26-SueW1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT q
2 OF 3
KAREN GARRETT 4
MS. GARRETT:
Gentlemen, I live in Mastic, outside 5
the proposed 10-mile evacuation zone but well within the danger 6
zone.
To my knculedge, you have not dismissed the possibility 7
that in a future accident radioactive material will be released 8
into the atmosphere in quantities greater than that at Three 9
Mile Island.
10 Radiation, winds and other weather variables don't 11 much care if they pass the boundary of a 10-mile radius.
Don't 12 demographic ~or geographic factors that make emergency planning g'
13 for Long Island impossible?
LILCO's spokesman and the NRC 14 apparently agree on this point.
15 Long Island.
A very appropriate name.
We cannot.
16 evacuate to the north, to the south or to the east.
17 You asked us earlier today to try not to repeat the 18 same issues, to come up with new facts and figures.
Well, I 19 think that's a job for the professionals.
Maybe one of us will 20 say it in a way that it will click with you.
21 You cannot evacuate to the north, south or east.
22 We could try to evacuate to the west, but I imagine if you are i
23 sitting in a gridlock on the LIE or the Sunrise Highway being 1
(
24 bombarded with radiation, running to the beach and praying for Asefederal Reporters, Inc.
l l
25 a boat or a helicopter would become a relatively attractive
- - - -. ~,
,4.-
n,,
16,901
- 14-27-SueW1 alternative.
Picture the wind coming from the northeast fh U
2 making inhabitants possible targets.
Are you going to tell 3
them to evacuate?
But, in order to do that, you have to drive 4
into and through the mass of atmospheric radiation.
5 School districts stagger their various school's 6
opening and closing times, because their buses can't be every-7 where at once.
Even if there were enough drivers that wouldn't 8
Put their families' evacuations first, which schools would 9
they evacuate first?
Won't the children and parents of'the 10 last school feel chivalrous?
11 Many of us are members of commuting families, 12 separated by driving times of one hour or more on good days.
O' N-13 Heaven forbid we have a pickle spill.
You may not get home for 14 four hours.
If there's a blizzard, you occasionally have to l
15 wait until morning to get home.
16 You can all imagine dozens of scenarios where your I
17 l children or other dependent loved ones would not be with you I
18 at the time of an accident.
Are we to trust LILCO to take 19 care of them?
20 During Gloria, the phones didn't work due to over-21 load.
I imagine that would happen again.
And, during the 22 aftermath of Gloria, we lined up at the fire department two 23 or three times a day for water.
LILCO couldn't even tell us 24 how long to plan for such an existence.
Ase Peders Reporters, Inc.
25 FROM THE FLOOR:
We survived, though.
l l
l l
16,902
- 14-28-SueW l MS. GARRETT:
During an accident, if we stay in 2
our homes, as LILCO is likely to tell us we should do outside 3
of the 10-mile zone, will they deliver our water,. food and 4
important communications?
Surely, they don't expect us to 5
drink the water that comes out of the well in our contaminated 6
yard.
7 Gloria was one big scavanger hunt, wondering which 8
town to go to for your next battery, propane, kerosene, mayo, 9
jug of water.
I've never experienced brown-outs until I 10 lived here with LILCO.
I lived with NSP in Minnesota, San 11 Diego Gas and Electric.
I know what brown-outs are now that 12 I live on Long Island.
We have them frequently.
OV 13 And, I think we should expect consistency in an 14 accident.
The schools are not cooperating with an evacuation 15 plan.
Nassau Coliseum has pulled out.
The sole participating 16 radio station has pulled out.
17 The sham of a drill LILCO held was worse than make-18 believe.
They didn't even have people within a 10-mile zone 19-pretend to evacuate, but they would have us believe it was a 20 real drill.
21 Have the allegations of substandard and criminal 22 construction practices at Shoreham been adequately investigated?
23 Let's prepare for the worse.
24 My family participated in the march to stop Shoreham ws neoonm. inc.
25 several years ago.
We signed petitions, we answered political
16,903
- 14-29-SueW1 questionnaires.
But, I would feel guilty when I have not found I ')
2 the time and energy to do all I can to stop the nightmare 3
called Shoreham.
At those times, I hope and pray that some 4
other concerned and responsible people will speak'out and act
~5 on my behalf.
6 Today, it's my turn.
Do not pass this hot potato 7
to our children.
L'et them live free of nightmares, free of 8
cancer.
9 (Applause.)
cnd #14 10 11 12 f%
13 14 15 16 17 18 i
l 19
-l 20 21 22 23
(
24 Ass Federd Reporters, Inc.
25
16,904 15-1-gjw 1
JUDGE MARGULIES:
David Willmott?
2 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 3
OF 4
DAVID WILLMOTT 5
MR. WILLMOTT:
Before I start, I would like to 6
request that this hearing body hold over the hearings for 7
at least another day.
8 You have sitting on those sheets probably another 9
sixty or seventy people who~ have not had an opportunity 10 to be heard.
I know it is late and night, and I know Il these hearings can be very. tedious, because I have set in 12 your position before.
O 13 In the context of Shoreham, I don't think another 14 day or two is going to make a hell of a big difference.
15 Thank you.
16 JUDGE MARGULIES:
We are scheduled to hold hearings 17 in Mineola starting tomorrow morning at 9:30, 18 MR. WILLMOTT:
That, sir, is not out here in Long 19 Island where most of the people are concerned, and the 20 most effected, and will be effected in case of an accident.
21 It would not hurt you, it would not kill you, it would not 22 break the Federal budget for you to come back here for one 23 or two more days to listan to the people.
24 Gentlemen, I want to thank you for providing the Assfeder*J Reporters, Inc.
25 residents of Long Island with an opportunity to input their
'-15-2-gjw.
16,905 i
I comments and concerns regarding the Long Island Lighting 2
Company's emergency evacuation plan pertaining to the Shoreham 3
nuclear reactor.
4 As a way of int' oduction, I am David J. Willmott, r
5 Editor and Publisher of Suffolk Life Newsapers.
I have 6
personally and my newspapers have been actively involved in 7
the Shoreham question for over a decade.
We have devoted an i
8 inordinate amount of our staff time and our news hole to 9
cover this issue.
We are acutely aware of the frustrations, 10 the feelings, the briefs and the opinions of the areas'our II newspapers serve.
12 I personally was Suffolk County's representative on 13 Governor Cuomo 's Shoreham Commission.
Over several months, I 14 heard expert - testimony concerning the planning, the 15 construction, the training, the management of the plant.
16 A large amount of the time was devoted to the probable or 17 possibility of evacuating Long Island in case of a nuclear 18 accident.
19 When I first went on the Commission, I read the
}
20 feelings of my fellow members.
I and another party would 21 be considered opposed to Shoreham.
Two members were 22 definitely in favor of opening the plant.
Seven other i
23 members were in favor of opening the plant.
After many 24 months of testimony, after reading many volumes of material, Ass.cesores n corms, Inc.
25 at the conclusion of the hearing, after we had been educated y
.,-,,--_m.,.
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m_.
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16,906 15-3-giw I
and knew the facts, three members f avored opening the plant, gS V
2 and ten members were opposed for various reasons, most 3
concerning safety and the impossibility of evacuating 4
Long Island if an accident were to occur.
5 In relation to the' evacuation, I would like to 6
remind the NRC that this is not a new question, but was fully 7
discussed at the pre-construction hearings in 1970.
8 On March 2, 1970, Irving Like, an atporney, 9
pleaded with the Commission to examine the evacuation question 10 at that time.
Not after the plant had been built, but be fore.
II He logically brought out that Long Island is an island, a 12 dead end, and then even in the ' 70 's there was too much O
13 population to move on its limited road network.
14 LILCO through its representative, Vice President 15 Andrew Wolford on December 1st and 2nd 1970, at thesenhearings 16 stated:that for an evacuation drill to be accepred for a 17 license to be issued, the Company was aware that the plan 18 had to be accepted bt the Atomic Energy Commission, local l9 government, and LILCO.
20 By their own testimony, they were forewarned that 21 they must have local governmental participation and accepted 22 this fact prior to building the plant.
23 A planner for'the Atomic Energy Commission who O
24 testified at these hearings that evacuation was possible on Ass 4Besseral Reporters, Inc.
25 Long Island was cross-examined.
Mr. Spickle of the Atomic l
-e-
16,907 15-4-gjw 1
Energy Commission, the planner, did not know that Long Island 2
was an island.
3 He did not know that it was a dead end.
He did not 4
know how Long Island was to be evacuated, but he said evacuatio n 5
was possible.
Then it was almost as much of a charade as it 6
is today.
7 I presume, by reading the testimony, all he knew 8
was where his pay check was coming from and doing the job 9
he was told to do.
10 (Applause. )
11 The Atomic Energy Commission, that is now known 12 as the NRC, at that time said the question of evacuation 13 will not be taken up until the -plant was build.
This was 14 ludicrous then, and it is ludicrous now.
You proceeded with 15 the licensee application which brings us to today.
16 Suffolk County government performing their duty 17 as a government, as a constitutional entity, attempted to 18 prepare an evacuation plan.
They spent over one million 19 dollars of our taxpayers money to develop a workable scenario.
20 During these procedures, which took over a year, the experts 21 that they had hired, the top people in the field from around 22 the country, concluded what we all knew, a safe evacuation 23 plan could not be developed that would assure the safe escape 24 for Long Islanders.
I Asp #ederd Reporters, Inc.
25 People would die.
People would be injured.
Trapped
16,908 15 gjw
)
1 in a radiated environment.
Long Island is an island.
It O
2 is surrounded by water without bridges.
The island dead ends
~
3 on the east end into the ocea and the sound.
There are only 4
three limited east-west roadways.
Two go as far as Smithtown 5
and Islip, about thirty miles out of the evacuation zone.
6 One goes into the evacuation zone, the Long Island Expressway, which' has been called the biggest parking lot in the world.
7 8
(Applause.)
This road, under normal conditions is overworked, 9
and the slightest accident causes traffic to stop and grid 10 11 lock to be created.
Just this past summer, a single accident 12 caused an eleven hour gridlock.
One single accident.
This accident took place on a normal mid-week day under normal 13 14 road conditions.
It wasn't snowing, it wasn't raining, it 15 was a beautiful day.
Eleven hour gridlock.
Think about it, 16 gentlemen.
An eleven hour traffic jam.
Warm, sunny 17 conditions.
Warm normal.
Non-fearful people.
People who 18 did not feel threatened or intimidated.
The LERO plan developed by the Long Island Lighting 19 20 Company is nothing more than a charade.
It is a paper plan that according to testimony before the Cuomo Commission was 21 described by a senior LILCO official, as a test of a test.
22 This was their description of this plan.
23 It has no meaning or bearing as real people 24 Ae>#edersi Reporters, Inc.
25 are not moved, real conditons were not simulated, and none
- 15-6-gjw 16,909 1
of the parties who must be brought into play even notified 2
that a crisis exists.
3 The plan was so bad and the results were so 4
inconclusive that your own FEMA regional director, Frank 5
Petrone, resigned a high paying position for he feared 6
the consequences of approving such a falsehood and damnable 7
outright lie.
8 (Applause.)
9 He was the man most directly responsible and inti-10 mately familar with the workings of the plan, a career govern-11 ment employee with a rapidly accelerating position in 12 government saying that we are lying to the people.
We cannot OO 13 guarantee their safety, their welfare, but for the sake of 14 whoever is ever pushing us and their financial interests, we 15 will tell the people that they will be safe, when we know they 16 won't.
17 The real effects of an emergency evacuation were not 18 taken into consideration.
Real facts were not paid attention 19 to, and neither were suggestions of experts.
20 May I remind you of the Sandia National Laboratory 21 Report that was released in November of 1982 at a Congressional 22 Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigation.
23 The report was based upon an WASH 740 study prepared
(
24 by the Brookhaven National Laboratory in the late '60's and Aasfederal Reporters. Inc.
25 early '70's, concerning the consequences of an SST 1 accident
16,910
'15-7-gjw 1
and the effects of release in a class 7, 8,
9 scenario.
O 2
Although the study was done in the late '60's and 3
early '70's, the results were never released until acting under 4
the Freedom of Information Act, t-e results were brought out 5
by the Congressional Oversight Committee.
6 Let's look at the consequences and we will understand 7
why they were hidden from th'e American public for so long.
8 If an accident of this degree was to happen at the Shoreham '
9 Nuclear Power Plant, the report states peak early deaths, 10 forty thousand; peak early radiation injury, seventy-five 11 thousand; peak cancer deaths, thirty-five thousand.
Peak 12 fatal radius, seventeen point five miles.
Peak injury
()
13 radius, fifty miles.
Damage in billions, in 1962 dollars, 14 one hundred and fifty-seven billion dollars.
15 Gentlemen, according to dis report performed right l
16 here at Brookhaven National Laboratory, kept from the public, l
17 we have virtually wiped out every living person in the ten 18 mile radius surrounding Shoreham.
19 I heard many people from LILCO, from the Atomic 20 Energy industry, ridicule this report saying we have never 21 had a nuclear accident.
We would never have consequences this 22 severe.
They used the probable risk assignment to calculate 23 than an accident of this severity would not happen but in 24 one in one hundred thousand years.
When they brought out
' Ass easse Reconen. Inc.
25 this information at the Commission hearing, I asked a very
16,911 15-8-gjw i
simple question:
Do we know which year in the one hundred 2
thousand the accident will take place, the first or the last?
3 Of course, there was no answer, but let us now 4
look at the f acts.
5 Three Mile Island was in commercial operation only 6
a hundred and twenty-one days when they had a major catastrophe 7
Fermi, Detroit took place after only three years 8
of operation.
The reactor was nine seconds from total 9
meltdown according to testimony before. it stopped. This 10 would have caused the devestation of the city and the area.
11 Chernobyl, although accurate info.rmation is still 12 hard to come by, is probably the prime example of realism O
13 supporting the WASH 740 study.
14 It had back up systems for safety that some 15 scientists claim are superior to ours.
It had a containment 16 area.
The accident is alleged to have been caused by a 17 combination of human and mechanical errors.
The plume of 18 radiation was not contained within fifty miles, but was 19 carried over one thousand miles.
The area of worse 20 devastation covers a hundred and ninety miles.
21 By comparison, this would be an area from Boston 22 to Washington as the wind blows.
The effects of the Chernobyl accident will be felt 23 24 for years to come.
As projected in the WASH 740 report, the Aes.Feder9 Reporters, Inc.
25 land will not be inhabitable for at least twenty and probably
15-9-gjw ~
16,912 1
one hundred years.
People who eat food stuffs that have been O
2 contaminated by sightless, tasteless, smelless radiation are 3
receiving huge doses of radiation that continually multipy and will create cancer properties in their body, creating 4
5 suffering and death.
You just read last week of the huge reindeer herds 6
7 in Finland, almost eighteen hundred miles, that are being slaughtered so their meat will not be eaten by human 8
9 beings.
A whole' culture has been wiped out.
We are' talking 10 about reindeer here, but what we are talking about here in 11 Suffolk County is our lives and our childrens lives.
12 (Applause.)
O 13 I bring up the Sandia report because the facts 14 were there, but we ignored
-- but were ignored under the 15 LERO plan, making it a charade.
16 Also ignored were the tr e facts pertaining to 17 Eastern Long Island's population and how it relates to 18 evacuation.
19 The respected police chief of the Town of Southampton Conrad Teller, spoke at the Shoreham Commission hearings 20 21 about the impossibility of evacuation.
He stated there are 22 just over one hundred thousand residents according to the census
-- the 1980 census in the five East End Towns.
23 l
24 What is not stated in the sensus is that there are
' Asefederd Reporters Inc.
25 over a hundred and fifty-thousand semi-permanent residents who
16,913
^
15-10-gjw own second homes on Eastern Long Island.
j Contrary to Bureaucratic opinion, these pecple are 2
not summer residents, but year-round residents.
They are here 3
occupying their homes several days a week, at least ten months 4
a year, most twelve.
5 In addition, on any weekday from May to October we 6
can have up to two hundred and seventy-five thousand. additional 7
pe ple here on Eastern Long Island.
They are called day 8
trippers, our vacationers.
Their length of stay ranges from 9
twelve to twenty-four hours up to one mont.h.
10 These people were not taken into consideration 11 f the LERO plan.
If you can find it, I will eat it.
12
/*)
Realistically, the one hundred thousand population 13 jumps to a half million people.
Four hundred thousand of ja these people do not call Eastern Long Island home.
Their 15 homes and their familities are to the west of the evacuation 16 zone.
In case of an accident, the vast majority of them are 37 expe ted to flee in mass.
Normally, many of these people 18 leave in a systematic f ashion, starting at-noon on Sunday 39 and going through the early hours of Monday morning.
20 On a normal Sunday afternoon, it is not uncommon 21 f r these people to create traffue jams and gridlocks 22 throughout different areas on the north and south forks.
23 Teller predicted that it would be impossible 24 AsafederrJ Reporters, Inc.
to conduct a quick, orderly evacuation with this number 25
f5-ll-gjw 16,914 1
of people on the east end.
The Commission also heard Donald O
i
-2 Dilworth, then Suffolk County Police Chief, estimate that i
3 during a normal day without the east end effect, and with 4
normal conditions, the best that he could hope for would be 5
a fourteen to thirty-two hour evacuation span.
6 Based on this estimation, the Chernobyl accident 7
and the WASH 740 report right that much truer.
8 How LILCO in the LERO plan was able to complete 9
an evacuation in two hours, when you have the experts who 3
\\
10 control traffic on Long Island saying that it is impossible, 11 and the quickest they could do it, the normal would be thirty-12 two, is beyond my imagination.
I don't know about you,.maybe o
13 you are geniuses.
14 Gentlemen, I don't want to be one of those forty 15 thousand fatalities..
I don't want my readers to be either.
16 I don't want you or any other bureaucraft in Washington or the financial wizards that have pushed Shoreham nuclear power 17 18 plant to be sitting back in Washington or in their plush i
19 surroundings of Palm Beach saying: Oh, we erred, its too 20 bad those people had to die, so that we can live the life 21 we have become accustomed to.
i 22 Gentlemen, ylu havernard testimony for the past l
23 three days.
A lot of it emotional, but most based upon i
l 24 fact and common knowledge.
In good conscience, you cannot l Asopesord Reporters,Inc.
l 25 allow the NRC to grant an operating license to Shoreham.
i
15-12-gjw 16,915 j
(Applause.)
2 If the bureaucracy is too big for you, too big
~
3 to be stopped, I say at least then be a man.
Do what 4
Frank Petrone has done, resign.
Your resignations might 5
start a new trend in Washington.
Honestly, principles in 6
place of greed.
7 Thank you.
(Applause.)
8 JUDGE MARGULIES:
John Kiskill?
Dr. Carl J.
9 10 Nelson?
Elizabeth Ferguson?
Jim Durnan?
Stephen Megard, 11 from Bridgeampton?
12 AUDIENCE:
I am speaking on behalf of Mr.
13 Megard.
~
14 JUDGE MARGULIES:
All right.
Will you step up 15 to the mike, please?
16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 Aarfederd Reporters, Inc.
25 L
15-13-gjw 16,916 1
LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT v
2 OF 3
LISA DALE 4
MS. DALE:
I am speaking on behalf.of the group 5
of the South Fork.
We are an environmental protection 6
organization, representing over twenty-five hundred 7
households on the east end.
8 I am going to voice our strongest opposition 9
to the licensing of Shoreham.
We wholeheartedly endorse 10 the position held by the Suffolk County Legislature and the 11 State of New York, a position upheld by the State Supreme 12 Court, that the responsibility to protect public safety O
13 prevents the adoption or implemention of any. emergency 14 evacuation plan, because of limited road network, combined 15 with the. density of the population, precludes safe 16 evacuation in the event of an accident.
17 The New York State Department of Transportation 18 classes Road 25-A, which runs past the Shoreham, as a 19 level of Service F.
20 Level of service F is rarely rated on any road, 21 and it is the worst possible rating, characterized by 22 gridlock, cronic traffic delays, and congestion.
It is 23 an unacceptable level of service.
24 The traffic problems on Montauk Highway on the Asofederd Reporters, Inc.
25 South Fork are notorious, especially during summer weekends
16,917 15-14-gju 1
and in fact, a study of last March by State DOT concluded O, 3 2
that there is no workable solution to the South Fork 3
traffic problem, but no amount of money spent on highway 4
construction will solve the problem here.
5 And at no point in time I would venture to say 6
are everyone on the roads at the same time, but they would 7
be in an accident.
8 If the traffic situation is bad now, it can 9
only get increasingly worse.
The population of Suffolk 10 County continues to grow.
By the year 2010, the Long 11 Island Regional Planning Board projects the County's 12 population to increase by three hundred thousand, to f';T u-13 over one point six million people.
14 This increase is comparable to adding another 15 town the present size of Brookhaven, to a region already 16 experiencing serious traffic problems.
17 It is clear that safe evacuation becomes less 18 and less feasible with each passing year.
19 The so-called evacuation drill held by LILCO 20 last February was a meaningless charade.
Not a single 21 member of the public was moved, no schools or hospitals 22 were evacuated.
It was a paperwork exercise, an 23 imagination, and mistakes and miscalculations were corrected O
24 by an eraser.
Ameesed moonm, inc.
25 The drill failed to consider that the majority
16,918 15-16-gjw of Suffolk County residents,. a huge population went far r
beyond the ten mile evacuation zone, have indicated that 2
they would leave their homes and enter the highways in the event of a nuclear accident, even if they sere told not to evacuate, and I read in the NRC Partial Initial Decision that what people say they will do is no basis.for determining what they would actually do in a crisis situation.
I want the people here to know that.
That it doesn't even matter when we say we won't listen to LILCO, because they people have determined that we will.
Surrounded on three sides by water, and the fourth by Shoreham, eastenders much choose bet, ween driving through a radioactive plume, or the ocean.
The drill also failed to consider the effects of fear and psychological stress en drivers.
In short, the LILCO drill bears no resemblence to reality.
It is the ultimate form of irony that planning for the high technical nuclear industry, one of the most highly technical industries, that your logic will be so g
fundamentally flawed, This statement goes on with the rest of our opinion, and things you have already heard.
And I am going to let somebody else talk, and I just want to say as a citizen, I just don't want to give you O
emy more 1oeio or emy more enouehte, heoeuse it seeme thet u
"'g if you read the court documents and decisions by you, that
16,919 15-17-gjw 1
the facts and the truth are twisted and clouded over.
2 You can twist logic to make.it say anything you 3
want, and we have totally lost faith in what you are doing.
4 That is my own personal opinion.
5 I just wonder whether you are going to leave here 6
and say:
Well, certain people found flaws with the plan, 7
maybe LILCO needs to improve its school evacuation.
8 This is what we got out of these hearings.
You 9
are going to write a report, and I wonder if these are the 10 kind of things that are going to show up in the report, and 11 I wonder if you think that these people are going to be 12 satisfied with that.
O 13 These people here are sending you a message.
And 14 I comment all of them for coming out.
15 They are sending you a message that this whole 16 thing is out of hand, it is unacceptable, and we don't want 17 it.
18 Thank you.
19 (Applause.)
20 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Anthony R. Rossi?
William Miller?
21 Adele Geiger?
E.
Perifel, of Southold, New York?
Charles 22 Colombo?
23 24 25
15-18-gjw i
1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT O.
2 OF
^
3 CHARLES COLOMBO 4
MR. COLOMBO: uGood evening.
According to Newsday, 5
Morton Magulies,-and that is you, I suppose, Chairman of the 6
NRC. Licensing Board, said the Board hopes this public 7
testimony will help them, quote, determine whether there 8
are any flaws in the LILCO emergency plan.
9 The plan is fundamentally flawed in its lack of 10 support outside its completely subjective sponsor, and it i
~
11 lacks this support because it presents no credible evidence i
12 that it could work.
)
4 13 It is unreasonable to assume that the State and d
14 local governments would step in and follow LILCO's plan 15 because in the educated opinion of our elected officials, it 16 is unrealistic in its assessment of the range, numbers, and i
17 dynamics of an evacuation of this sort.
1 i
18 In the assembling of data from independent sources i
j 19 would quickly dispell the myth of a workable evacuation of i
[
20 Long Island.
21 A Newsday - poll last week revealed that sixty-two l
22 percent of the population of Nassau and Suffolk Counties l
23 would flee in the event of an accident at Shoreham.
(:)
l 24 This evidence cannot be disregarded because LILCO
- As>ess-w n conm. inc.
i 25 attempts to gloss over the issue, claiming that, quote, a i
i
16,921 15-19-gjw 1
public survey-is not a good predictor of the way people would 2
respond in an emergency; but perhaps it is not.
In view of 3
the anomosity between LILCO and its consumers, the situation 4
could be much' worse.
5 A realistic plan would have to include unacceptabl'e 6
death toll figures due to radiation exposure, increased by 7
climatic conditions as common as rain.
8 We have learned from Chernobyl that one of the 9
first measures taken by the Soviets to limit radiation in the 10 surrounding countryside was to chemically inhibit the clouds II from raining.
Rain would have carried down with it intolerable 12 concentrations of radioactivity, but if it were raining
~
O 13 at the time of the release, by no means uncommon on Long Id Island, what does would result?
15 A total release of radiation from Chernobyl is 16 estimated to equal that of all nuclear weapons detonated to 17 this day.
How much of this radiation would fall upon the 18 people of Long Island, hopelessly stranded, possibly for 19 days, as they attempted to flee?
20 On January 28th of this year, I had volunteered 21 to drive a friend to a medical appointment in Rockville 22 Center, but we ran into a slight problems.
Icy conditions 23 that day had traffic at a standstill on all west bound O
24 routes.
I called the State and County Police, and was Aso Federd Reporters, Inc.
25 told that all roads, the parkways, and the LIE were impassable
15-19-gjw 16,921 g/f 1
public survey is not a good predic' tor of the ~way people would O
'/
V 2
respond in an emergency; but perNaps it is not.
In view of-3' the anomosity between LILCO and its consumers, the situation
/
4 could be much worse.
,/
/
5 A realistic plan wo,uld have to include unacceptable i
4 6
death toll figures due to radiation exposure, increased by 7
climatic conditions as common as rain.
8 We have learned from Chernobyl that one of the 9
first measures taken by the Soviets to limit radiation in the 10 surrounding countryside was to chemically inhibit the clouds Il from raining.
Rain would have carried down with it intolerable 12 concentrations of radioactivity, but if it were rainisg 13 at the time of the release, by no means uncommon on _Long 14 Island, what does would result?
15 A total release of radiation from Chernobyl is 16 estimated to equal that of all nuclear weapons detonated to i
17 this day.
How much of this radiation would fall upon the 18 people of Long Island, hopelessly stranded, possibly for 19'
~ days, as they attempted to flee?
20 On January 28th of this year, I had volunteered 21 to drive a friend to a medical appointment in Rockvil1e 22 Center, but we ran into a slight problems.
Icy conditions 23 that day had traffic at a standstill on all west bound O
24 routes.
I ce11ed the seete end County eatice, and wes Am pes c Reconen. Inc.
25 told that all roads, the parkways, and the LIE were impassable s
.,. _ - -. -,, - ~, _ _,,.. - - -,. _ _ _ _ - - _.....
15-20 -gjw 16,922 1
This condition continued from morning rush hour O
2 through mid-day and beyond.
It was not a major storm, and 3
it did not involve an exodus of one point seven million 4
people.
5 The real version of an evacuation would have to 6
consider that the diredtion and concentration of the flight 7
would be west bound to New York City and beyond.
8 Now, obviously, sixty-three percent of Nassau 9
County is going to flee.
They are not going to go east.
10 The blockage of traffic into the city would be ingenetrable, II and many would abandon cars at the city line, hoping to use 12 mass transit or some other form of transport'ation.
L 13 The backlash of this on Long Island would mea'n Id an evacuation on foot, or none at all.
15 A realistic evacuation plan at this date must 16 also face the fact that you witnessed today, obviously, that 17 Long Islanders are angry and frustrated because in our 18 discerning vision, we see a bureaucracy and and industry I9 that are ultimately insensitive to the promises of our 20 democracy.
21 You must examine the collective psychology of 22 an entire population who already angry and frustrated, and 23 suddenly enticed to panic.
24 The result would not be an orderly evacuation; we n.oo,ws, inc.
25 it would be carnage.
16,923 15-21-gjw 1
For seventy-four percent of Long Island, LILCO's 2
plan is a truly tasteless joke, but what else could be expected.
3 from a monopolistic industry somehow allowed to represent 4
itself on our behalf.
5 They criticize 'our elected officials for playing 6
politics, for responding to the wishes of their constituency.
7 Now, if our state and local representatives are there for 8
some other reason, please let us know.
9 Thank you.
10 (Applause.)
II JUDGE MARGULIES:
Susan Jergens?
12
(~)"d15 13 s
14 15 16 17 18 19 l
20 21 22 23
()
24 Assfederd Reporters, Inc.
25
.16,924 SLm 16-1 1
JUDGE MARGULIES:
John Hurley?
2
/~}
LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT
(/
3 OF 4
JOHN HURLEY 5
MR. HURLEY:
My name is John Hurley.
I am an 6
electrical engineer, and'this plant is one of the best 7
things that ever happened to our profession.
Any time 8
you try and take an 800 megawatt plant and stuff into 9
a building that was designed for 500 megawatts like LILCO 10 did with Shoreham, you are guaranteed employment for 11 engineers forever.
12 (Laughter.)
(...
13 They will go to that plant and they will patch 14 and they will repair and they will find out like the 15 plumbers that the lines go into concrete walls and no 16 one will know what is going on.
They will be employed 17
=!
forever in trying to clean up this mess.
18 I
Now you have a company here that can't even j
19 repair diesel generators properly.
Crank shafts keep
,i 20 g
breaking on them.
They don't buy the right things in 21 first place.
They go out and buy cheap generators, cheap r
22 diesels in trying to save a measily $100,000.
That was 23 the only difference in the bid.
They bought the cheapest 24 things going.
\\.(
25 The crank shafts kept cracking and they kept
16,925 trying to repair them and finally they gave up.
They
,,,y couldn't do it.
They can't even fix generators or diesels.
r 2
I)
How the heck are they going to run a nuclear plant?
\\/
3 You don't allow every Tom, Dick and Harry to come 4
along and design and build his own 747s, and yet you 5
allow every little power company in the nation to go out 6
and buy a plant here and buy a plant there and buy a plant 7
another place.
8 You are the NRC.
As a patriotic American I am 9
ashamed of the way your organization is run.
10 (Applause.)
11 It breaks my heart to see the French, of all 12 people, who are noted mainly for cooking, frank out nuclear 13 l ([
plants of the same design by the same outfit continuously, 14 just like the way we build planes.
15 Here you allow this company to build one plant 16 3
and a other company to build another plant.
If they 3
17 2
want to make changes in the middle, make changes.
.This 18 g-e thing has a history of corruption that has been documented 4
j 19 g
by Barrons Magazine, by 60 Minutes and by a number of other
. I 20
' s outfits and nothing is done about it.
21 j
The problem is the NRC is the wrong outfit to r
22 do anything in this industry.
23
( Applause. )
24 When it comes down to Shoreham it should be the 25
~
16,926 Sim 16-3 1
FBI.
There should be investigations up the Kazoo just on l
2 the basis of corruption alone.
But also it is a matter 01
\\#
3 of treason.
Here you have a company that seems to think 4
it is an independent sovereign nation.
They won't pay 5
their taxes.
6 The most productive parts of our economy, the 7
Small businessman, if he doesn't pay his taxes he winds 8
up in the local jail, but LILCO doesn't.
They grab the g
taxes that I am paying as a ratepayer, they hide it in 10 an account in LA, they brag about it and nothing is done.
1 11 Nothing is done except they are given a pat on the back.
12 Oh, well, now they return the taxes after three years.
13 Hurray!
Things are wonderful.
The county budget is back
['d 14 to normal.
The next point.
Twelve years overdue, 25 times 15 16 over cost, and this is a company that you are trusting 1
3 with our lives?
You are trusting these people to regulate 37 our evacuation?
You are saying that these people are h
18 i
not only are they assuming state powers by not paying j
ig a '
taxes, they are also acting as a bunch of cops.
What gives 20 3
them the right?
21 i
The plans are absolutely incredle.
They are 22 g ing to block the expressway with their own trucks.
You 23 have seven police departments on this end of the island, 24
(]
)
and you think that a bunch of cops from each police 25
'ryy-y,_.
_y..,
16,927 Sim 16-4 department are going to dig up their lousy LICO evacuation 3
plan and say, Oh,.let's see, well, we'll get up on the i~
2 expressway.
If they.see one of those yellow trucks up there 3
.the local cops are going to kill them, if the public doesn't 4
first.
5 6
Now this thing is absolutely a national disgrace.
7 You people are judges and you are supposed to decide, and 8
you have probably taken an oath to abide by the law in this g
Case.
If you don't turn down LILCO and if you don't turn down this plant after all the evidence and all the things you are hearing, you are violating that oath.
There is no way around it, and I can't wait for the next Congressional 13
, _.O heerines to ce11 vou geog 1e og if voe de eesrove this 9 ene.
1 14 I can't wait to see you people stand before t.he Congressmen and explain your actions.
I (Applau se. )
g 17
' I It will be right across this main street.
Across 18 I[
here there is the office of our local Congressman who is 3
19 i
still in office.
This is his last term.
He will be out l
20 4
A in a few weeks.
The reason is Shoreham.
The reason is 21 l
that the man went with the money and with the powers that 22 be and betrayed his people.
23 Now we will probably have a new Congressman.
We 24
(
have enough with Congressman Markey who is the guy that^
16,UMW Sim 16-5 1
runs the oversight on your group, the NRC.
I keep writing 2
to this guy and I am sure there will be an investigation.
o 3
This thing is an absolute national disgrace.
4 Now I would like to read two short letters.
5 One is to Mrs. Reagan because I don't seem --
6 nothing seems to get through to the President.
7 (Laughter.)
8 Absolutely nothing.
Of course with all the 9
people on his cabinet who come from the nuclear industry 10 like Schultz and Weinberger and the had of the CIA, Carey 11 from LILCO, I don't wonder.
The thing is a complete farce.
12 This thing is a kargaroo hearing.
13 Really, unless you people have the guts to "s i at like Frank Petrone and try and protect your fellow 34 citizens and disavow this plant, you can await the hearings 15 and you can await the distain and you can await the 16 contempt of the people of this island.
j7
Dear Mrs. Reagan,
I am writing to you because 18 i_
no one in the Administration seems to be concerned with g
39 a
the three million people who live on Long Island.
We 20 2
d v ted for your husband (this is GOP country for now).
We 21 i-r believed his election promises to keep the feds off our 22 backs, especially when he put the promise not to push 23 Shoreham in writing and signed it.
24
([)
Now that promise is being violated.
The 25
=
_- =
16,929 Sim 16-6 Administration or at least part of it claims.that the President's promise can't be kept because the NRC is an 2
independent agency.
3 Now as an aside, the NRC may claim or it may be e
4 allegated that the NRC is an independent agency.
That is 5
t true.
The only independent agencies are really the 6
courts.
You guys are under the Administration.
I don't 7
care what the law says.
I don't care what anything says.
8 That is the way it is.
i They have some poor clerk in the Treasury crank out a pro-utility letter right away.
THey are constantly i
11 interfering with our local business.. They are endangering our lives with phony evacuation tests.
13 The fed who managed-the test resigned rather than 14 j
sign a false support.
That guy should get a medal.
15 4
l (Applause.)
16 l!
That guy should get a well-paying life-time job il U
I in this County or in this State because he has got more 18 ll courage than anybody down in that Washington place.
j 19 iI (Laughter. )
li 20 t
All of this is a brewing scandal that does little lf 21
'i for the honor of the President, and instead of listening t
22 to us or our County or our State, your husband seems to 23 listen only to an outlaw utility and its investors.
r 24
- (
)
Outlaw is right.
These people have disobeyed the i
i
16,930 Sim 16-7 1
law so many times that I can't understand how they can get 2
away with it.
The only reason is money.
3 So we beg you to intercede.
Please ask him to 4
stop this rip-off.
Avoid the future Watergate type hearings 5
Avoid the Shoreham scandal.
No banker's wallet is worth 6
the life of a single Long Islander.
7 Okay, not the next short letter.
8 Dr. Senator D'Amato:
This is our Senator who g
is up for re-election now, and it was all of the sudden 10 mysteriously that he came up with anti-Shoreham sentiment.
11 He can see the writing on the wall.
I am sure the senti-12 ment will last only as long as the election.
When it is 13-over, it is back to business.
14 He is the best funded Senator in the country, and 15 a lot of that money has come from the very same banks 16 who have loaned money to LILCO to pay for this fiasco.
17 Dr. Senator D'Amato:
Thank you for your fine 18 letter.
Yes, drugs are a massive problem that threatenes
- l 19 our nation.
But dressing up or down and making a crak a
l pie is useless grandstanding.
It does nothing to solve 20 a
d this terrible dope mess.
21 I
If y u really want to solve a croblem that threatens 22 23 one-fifth of your constituents you would work to stop Shoreham and go after the dopes who run LILCo.
24 25 (Laughter.)
(Applause.)
Gim.16-8 16,931 1
Several state agencies say that this nuclear 2
plant is unnecessary.
As an electrical engineer I agree.
3 It is probably the worst, most expensive, most unreliable 4
and most dangerous way to provide to Long Island.
5 People who live in this part of the United States, 6
especially in New York. State, should have some of the 7
nation's lowest electric rates.
Instead, we are among 8
the highest because of Shoreham and LILCO.
And because 1
9 of Shoreham they will double again.
to It is obvious that Shoreham is a massive swindle, 11 and ratepayers,-otherwise known as voters, are reminded 12 of this every time they receive one of LILCO's excessive i
13 bills.
'-)
14 We are also reminded of useless politicians who 15 offer promises and lip service to the anti-Shoreham 16 effort.
So this family, and that means six voting people,
- . j 97 will vote against any encumbent who hasn't taken a firm L
j 18 anti-Shoreham stand.
And unless you shape up and really c
g 39 move on this issue before election time, this conservative
- i I
20 Republican family will vote for Bree.
a d
P.S.
Your latest performance after the Crak 21 i
t l t 22 Act where the NRC won't let you, a United States Senator, 23 testify before one of their boards is more phony grand-standing.
This is almost as untrue as the Administration's 24 25 claim that the President can't honor his written pledge i
16,932 Sim 16-9 1
to us about the feds in Shoreham because the NRC is
/
2 independent.
4 3
If this man really believed what he said and really 4
testified before you guys and you wouldn't let him testify, 5
heads would roll at the NRC.
There is no way about it.
6 If he really believed and he really meant it, you guys 7
wouldn't stand a chance.
There would be no NRC, there 8
would be no boards and ther would.:be.none of this.. phony 9
nonsense.
10 Now I appeal to you.
You have probably'taken an it oath, all of you, to do what is right in this case.
I 12 appeal to you to follow this guy Petrone.
He is a hero and 13 he probably deserves a medal and a good job.
Why not?
C_r -
14 Why not do what the evidence says?
Why not cancel this 15 plant?
It is only 500 megawatts.
We have paid for 12,000 16 megawatts of hydropower upstate.
Because of LILCO the 17 island isn't getting any of it.
h 18 We live next to two Candian Provinces.
They both g
3g want to sell.
Their circles of electricity happens to J
l coincide with our need during the Year.
Quebec's power 20 3
is doubling with the hydroplant that they call James Bay.
21 I!
I Why don't we get it?
We don't get it because of LILCO.
22 W1 are being robbed.
It is not only our safety.
Our I
23 safety is the primary thing, but it is also larceny.
We 24 are being taken.
25 l
l 1
-n
,,,.,.,._,.e-.
Sim 16-10 16,933 1
You go out to the West Coast and there is a 2
transmission line that is old fashioned, kind of out of 3
date, not really up to snuff and really doesn't match what 4
is done around the world called the Pacific Intertie. It 5
brings power down from British Columbia,'from Washington 6
and Oregon to LA, to a little bit south of LA.
They have 7
some of the lowest rates in the world.
8 Why don't we have it?
That thing is over a 9
thousand miles.
We could go 500 miles to reach Canada.
10 Why don't we get it?
We don't get it because of money, 11 because this whole thing is greed.
12 You give lip service to safety and you give lip 13 service to compassion and you give lip service to the 14 citizens and the real thing about the entire nuclear 15 industry and the NRC is greed.
I don't understand how 16 your agency can operate.
You have a schizophredic 17 mentality.
You are split between ---
~18 (Applause. )
j 19 You are split between two opposing charters, i
20 two opposing parts of your charter.
You are supposed to 3
21 promote nuclear power on the one hand and you are supposed i
I 22 to regulate it on the other hand.
Promote it!
You certainly do.
You haven't turned 23 24 down a nuclear plant in this country.
There are about lk 100 nuclear plants and you haven't turned own a single 25 5
---~...--,--.w--.
e---.
-#.,-.--_.-..,..,s.-.r--,-.-
,,.,r..,_.-,--------4.
1 16,934 Sim 16-111 one.
Everything is hunky-dorry no matter how they are 2
built.
There are so many differnces between then that I O
3 don't understana how you can even decide that this thing 4
is good.
How do you keep track of it?
The plants are
~
5 all different.
6 If you find an error in one plant, what do you do?
7 It doesn't apply to the next one.
You don't know what 8
is going on.
9 This thing, for the last 12 years they have been to -
trying to build this piece of junk.
They claim this 11 concrete pour, the concrete isn't right.
The concrete isnt 12 even up to date.
The County won't accept it for the roads.
13 It is filled with beer cans because nobody is watching 14 over what anybody is doing.
15 The allegations of corruption are fierce, and 16 if you vote for it you are not only endangering our
- j 17 safety, but you are just profiting a bunch of crooks.
I doh't understand. I really don't.
~
18 1
j 19 (Applause.)
a l
Now if you won't abide by your oath and turn 20 a
d this thing down, I can't wait for the Congressional 21
- r hearings to grab you guys.
I just can't.
You have to do 22 what is right.
You have heard enough emotionalism over.
23 the last three hearings and you know how these people 24
(
feel about this thing.
You now that this thing is not 25
f 16,935 Sim 16-13 necessary at all.
Three State agencies say that we don't need it 2
f r p wer.
We just don't.
As'a matter of fact, if it goes 3
on line, forgetting the safety issue, if it goes on line 4
it is a collossal fraud.
We don't need it.
So.that should 5
be enough to just cancel it right off the line.
This is a kangaroo hearing.
We don't even need a hearing.
7 Thank you, gentlemen.
8 (Applause. )
l One last thing.
Instead of the NRC, we should 10 do what is right.
This thing shouldn't be handled by the NRC at all.
There is so much corruption and so much fraud that it should really be handled by the FBI.
And I hope to God that if the NRC approves this thing that i
there will be investigations afterwards.
(Applause.)
I JUDGE MARGULIES:
Robert Pike.
l 17 (No response.)
18 g
George Raisewood.
j 19 I
(No response.)
j 20 f
Mary Lee Hasbrook.
21 i
(No response. )
r 22 Scott Weiss.
23 (No response.)
24 Robert Stroble, Shelter Island Heights, New York.
16,936 *
-Sim 16-13 (No responre.)
3 Joan Hennessy.
2 (No response.)
3 Michello Pilkyte, Rocky Point.
4-
.(No response.)
5 Gaile Capone.
6 (No response.)
7.
Veronica Lazoo.
8 (No response.)
9 Maurine Maddigan.
10 (No response) 11 Heather Qusak.
12 (No response.)
{
Kim Detrault, Old Harbor Road, New Suffolk.
14 (No response.)
15 Rosemary Weisberg.
16 (No response. )
g l
17 Joe Paparado.
18 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT
- l 19 OF e
20 a
JOE PAPARADO 21 l
MR. PAPARADO:
Good evening.
22 I want to tell you what the people of Long Island 23 think about LILCO's emergency responso plan and LILCO's 24 bO' management.
25 (Mechanical laughing machine-placed near the microphone.)
16,937' Sim 16-14 1
(Laughter.)
2 Well, everybody in this room -- well, yes, we 3
think it is definitely a joke, and everybody in this room 4
who thinks LILCO's plan is a cruel joke, please say.
5 (Loud YES response emitted from the audience.)
6 That.is the sentiment echoed by 75 to 85 percent 7
of Long Islanders.
8 Can I ask you a question?
I would like to ask 9
you if you are taking the plan seriously, Mr. Chairman.
10 (Laughter. )
11 JUDGE MARGULIES:
We will take that as a rhetorica l
12 question.
13 FROM THE FLOOR:
But it is a real one.
..s J
(_/
14 MR. PAPARDO:
Are you taking this plant seriously?
15 It seems that you are takingsit seriously, and I don't 16 think it should be taken seriously basically.
g 17 Are you allowed to speak to me?
18 JUDGE MARGULIES:
We wish to hear from the j
19 parties and we wish to hear what you have to say.
iI 20 MR. PAPARADO:
Does that mean that you are here 3
21 to listen?
Ir 22 JUDGE MARGULIES:
That is correct.
23 MR. PAPARDO:
Do you think these gentlemen are 24 really here to listen to us?
'( )
(Loud NO emitted from the audience.)
25
16,938 Sim'16-15 MR. PAPARDO:
I agree, I don't think you are 2
really here to listen, and we all know that this hearing 3
process is a sham because the' drill'was a sham and these hearings should not have even taken place in the first x
5 place.
6 If the NRC is hell bent on licensing this plant, 7
then your Board never would have existed in the first place 8
if this evacuation plan was possible.
8 I would just like to also say that the people of j.
10 Long Island will not give up.
People power is greater than 11 the NRC's power.
12 (Applause. )
13 And if you give the Shoreham Power Station a i
J 14 full' power license and the court challenge by the County 15 and the State fails, the the people of Long Island will 16 then have to respond with a massive non-violent, civil l
disobedience at the plant site and at LILCO facilities 17 ll 18 so that the workers and employees of LILCO will not be ld 19 able to carry out functions relating to the operation of i
l 20 Shoreham.
5 21 We will never give up.
- e 22 (Applause. )
l 23 And we have been trying a long time and maybe 1
1 eventually we will get the police to join us on the 24 Ib 25 non-violent, civil disobedience blockades.
Then there i
f
.m.
16,'939 Sim 16-16 3
will be no one to arrest us.
i c
2 (Laughter. )
x 3
~Because they should be arresting LILCO people.
4 And I have one last comment.
When we win this thing, and I feel very confident that we wil'1 because 5
the people.will win, we are going to have one hugh party, 6
1 7
believe me, because we have been waiting for it for a long 8
time and a lot of people have worked on this issue for 9
a long, long time, and I am get kind of burnt out about 10 it, and a lot of people are, but we are waiting for a party 3i.
And if you people deny LILCO their license and 12 say no to the ludicrous LILCO plan, we may even send you 13 invitations.
34 (Applause.)
15 Thank you.
H5 (Applause. )
g 17 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Roger Sneider.
j pg LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT s
j 19 OF 4
ij ROGER SNEIDER 20 d
21 (Cardboard display of the Shoreham Station i
e 22 brought by Mr. Sneider to the table.)
MR. NEIDER:
I brought a little audio visual J
23
)
24 to make it clear what would be going on here.
)(()
Y u can tell this is the Shoreham Plant here.
25
16,940 1
Sim 16-17 It is a little worse for wear.
2
-s It starts off that we have a'little accident
(,)
3 at the plant, a little problem going on here.
4 (Flash and then smoke comes from the cardboard 5
replica.)
6 of course, the first thing they try to do is 7
contact William Catacaccinos.
A bit 9of a problem.
William 8
Catacaccinos is off in Europe as usual.
9 (Bur. Sneider placing plastic images as he speaks.)
10 Drinking some wine.
He's all set.
No problem.
11 (Applaase.)
12 So the workers say, all right, we can handle this.
13
_s
(..(,+ j)
Of course LILCO workers are well prepared.
They have 14 got their fire fighting equipment.
They have got their 15 fire extinguisher.
No problem.
They'll take care of it.
16 Unfortunately, it gets a little worse, and I y
17 have a bit of a problem here.
It gets even a little worse 18 so they decide to, you know, they call the county employees j
19 and say you can contact us at the emergency headquarters.
a:*
20 3
(Mr. Sneider picks up a telephone and dials.)
d 21 l
Of course, you go to call the emergency head-t 22 quarters.
You go to dial it up and ---
23 (The message We are sorry, your call can't be 24
- /~N completed as dialed.
Please check the number and dial 25 again.)
16,941 Sim 16-18 1
(Laughter.)
2 So much for the emergency headquarters.
O 3
(Laughter.)
1 4
Well, LILCO comes out and it seems to be 5
getting worse.
They call out emergency -- LILCO brings 6
out their trucks and they are to block off the north 7
fork here.
Of course if you are on the north fork you 8
can't go.
Of course, the people on the north fork say, g
well, we can't do that.
So they just come out and take 10 care of the LILCO workers.
33 (Mr. Sneider takes a plastic water gun and squirts 12 the plastic "LILCO" workers.)
.I.
13 No problem.
- g (Laughter.)
15 Well, of course we have to inform all the people, So we contact the radio station.
Of course, the radio 16 S
station quit and said we don't want to do it.
So that 97 doesn't work either.
18 g
jg Right now we have the tratfic starting to back i
up on the LIE.
Police are trying to keep it going, of 20 a
course, with everything backing up.
You know the LIE.
21 I
E And we end up with a lot of problems here.
22
$bople aren't going to get'.off.
23 24 There is one person who is going to get off.
He 25 is in my pocket.
He is usually in LILCO's pocket. Joe f
16,942 Sim 16-19 Caputto makes it and sails to Connecticut.
O'ne person 2
is safe in that.
(
l 3
(Laughter.)
4 Now I have tried to just show what is going to 5
go on here.
It is just very clear.
You are not going e.
to get off the island.
It is silly to consider the plan.
It won't work.
8 You don't listen to people.
I figured I would 8
show you and give you an idea, you don't live out here, 10 of what is going on.
J l
It won't do any good and I don't expect it to do 11 i
12 any good, but'I tried.
13 (Applause. )
14 endSim Sue-fois 15 16
!l 17 4.
- I Ij 19 i!
20 m
d 21 1
E 22 23 l
24
- (,
25 i
16,943
- 17-1-SueW j JUDGE MARGULIES:
George Schinelson from Calverton.
p
' _)
(No response.)
\\
2 3
JUDGE MARGULIES:
Mary Lee Hasbrook.
4 (No response.)
5 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Barbara Stoob.
6 (No response.)
FROM THE FLOOR:
Are you still on the afternoon 7
8 list?
9 FROM THE FLOOR:
Yes.
I signed up in the afternoon.
10 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Yes.
11 FROM THE FLOOR:
Excuse me.
Could I address 12 the group, please?
r~
k 13 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Come forward.
14 15 16 17 18 i
l I
19 20 21 l
l 22 23
()
24 l Ass.Federd Reporters, Inc.
l 25
16,944
- 17-2-SueW 1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT i
2 OF 3
PETER McINTEE 4
MR. McINTEE:
I just.came here this evening.
I 5
wasn't on the list.
I was looking for an opportunity.
I 6
would like to give some serious input.
7 My name is Peter McIntee.
I am a utility systems 8
supervisor.
My background goes back, engineering, et cetera.
9 It's very strong, a very strong background.
10 I can appreciate theatrics, people they come up 11 here and they have' worked a long time.
I am not associated 12 with any 6f these organizations nor any political organiza-0 13 tion.
I come as an individual.
I come to represent my 14 family.
15 I am privy to, and have been exposed to, and had 16 a number of conversations with journeymen that worked on that 17 plant.
And, I'm talking about responsible journeymen, as to 18 what went on there.
To back what I say, a very good friend 19 of mine for 30 some odd years, he was a second generation 20 steamfitter.
He went to that job in '77.
He was in that 21 plant three weeks.
He lives here in Suffolk County.
He 22 carries enough weight, because he's one of the top three 23 s teamfitters in the whole Local here in New York.
24 l He has the power, okay, to go back to the Local, Aes eeseres nepormes. tae.
25 and told them to get him out and off that job with one proviso,
16,945 717-3-SueW i that his name be removed from ever having been on the roster 2
to be in that plant.
And, that man turned around and had to 3
travel'from Suffolk up to the Bronx Wteran's Hospital to 4
straighten out another mess, but to get out of that plant.
5 I could talk about electricians.
A man with 10 6
years nuclear experience that was brought here in '81 to try 7
to correct it.
All right.
That man was there right up until 8
just recently.
That portion of that plant could be corrected.
9 You can pull wire, you can remove, you can correct.
10 But, the thing you will never get to is the piping 11 and the concrete in that plant.
You cannot get to it.
12 Now, I've spoken to my children.
I have a son 13 and grandchildren and a family here in Mattydale within your 14 zone, so-called 10-mile zone, whoever wants to grab that
~ 15 number.
All right.
I have another -- my daughter living 16 right here.
All right.
l i
17 I will not be here, because I'm ready to retire and l
18 I will be leaving Long Island.
But, I am concerned about my 19 family.
I've already sat down with them, and I've laid it 20 out.
And, it's my own personal opinion and anyone here in 21 this room or anywheres can either accept it -- and I think
+
the economic situation.
We are stuck with it.
22 they have to 23 We are stuck with it.
Regardless of whether that
()
24 plant opens or it doesn't, we are going to pay for it.
- But, As c.ew e n a n m.inc.
25 what I am imploring you to do, all right, I accept that.
I
.-,--~.--,,,.-w,
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16,946
- 17-4-SueW 1
told my children:
You are going to have to accept it.
- But, O
2 the safety.
That plant is an accident waiting to happen.
3 (Applause.)
4 MR. McINTEE:
The total issue is, this Island 5
cannot be evacuated.
I implore you to take that on your 6
conscience, that it cannot be evacuated.
And the people 7
that are here, all right, you can just write them off.
8 That's my total input.
Gentlemen, I hope you 9
take that in your conscience when you sit to review what has 10 happened, what's gone down the pike, and what we are faced 11 with.
12 We live in the shadow of this plant.
You are here
(~h k/
13 and in Mineola, very nice.
Those people got a margin.
They 14 are pretcy close.
I think they should have spent a couple 15 of days out here talking to the people who live in the shadow 16 of the plant, not the people that live on the west side of 17 New York or any other place.
18 (Applause.)
19 MR. McINTEE:
Thank you, gentlemen.
I thank you 20 for the opportunity.
21 I can appreciate your position.
I work for the 22 U.S. government also.
23 (Applause.)
24 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Linda Antonellie.
' Aeofederd Reporters, Inc.
25 FROM THE FLOOR:
Can I say something
16,947
- SueW 1 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Okay.
Go ahead.
2 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 3
OF 4
CHRIS PITTO 5
MR. PITTO:
My name is Chris Pitto.
And I'm 6
representing the children of Long Island.
7 If that nuclear power plant has a meltdown or an 8
accident, we are stuck in our school.
You are playing games 9
with our lives.
We can't get out.
None of the bus drivers 10 are loyal enough.
They will go after their family and their 11 children.
12 What would we do?
On fong Island, there's bridges
(, b 13 but there's not enough roads to get to them.' There will be 14 a long line of people getting onto the Expressway, not on it, 15 just getting to it.
We will never get out.
1,6 And, if that nuclear power plant explodes, what-17 ever, we are all dead.
If this opens, I just don't want to 18 live on Long Island anymore.
1 19 All the children are stuck in schools.
It's just i
20 terrible, because even if it's on a week-end no one can get 21 out.
Only the people with boats.
And, they would have i
22 trouble getting to their boats anyway.
l l
23 Thank you.
1 i' y
'/
24
( Applause.~)
l Ace-Feder",3 Reporters, Inc.
l 25 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Karen Walsh.
i l
16,948
(' o response.)
_#17-6-SueW N
2 JUDGE MARGULIES:
M. J. Blossom.
3 (No response.)
4 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Kylie Bostrin.
5 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 6
OF 7
KYLIE BOSTRIN 8
MR. BOSTRIN:
I will be very brief, because what 9
I have to say here has been said many times before.
But, maybe 10 this speaker after speaker. coming up with the same -- and 11 saying essentially the same message to you, if you came here 12 with any doubts of how the Long Island people felt they O
13 certainly must be disspelled by now, because the people of 14 Long Island are unanimous and overwhelmingly opposed to this 15 plant.
16 And, because of this -- I had been a long time 17 opponent of the thing, but I've quit worring about it, because 18 I know it's not going to open because we have sort of got a 19 situation that's unique in American history with legislators, 20 the Governor and the people opposed to it.
And, it won't 21 open.
This is the way I feel.
22 (Applause.)
23 MR. BOSTRIN:
Because, essentially it is a state's 24 right issue, and if it has to eventually go to the Supreme Court, wee.r:s n.co,wn, inc.
25 it can only be settled one way, in the right state.
And if I
16,949
- 1 7-SueW l
the state and people don't want it, that's how it has to go.
2 However, I think there are several things that 3
have been said before but I just want to repeat them again 4
very briefly.
One is that we did learn from the Chernobyl 5
plant, I think, where the people have setting some arbitrary 6
limit like 10 or 20 miles, whatever is set by any of the 7
experts, the people aren't no longer going to believe it.
8 And any plan now, if it's going to be realistic, 9
has to take the psychology of the people into account.
- And, 10 people are going to go.
I mean, it's quite clear from polls 11 that have been taken and the sentiment here, that even people 12 in Nassau and Queens, if an accident occurs and they hear
/,_S
'~
13 about it, they are going to try to leave, whether they are 14 in danger or not or whether they are outside the 10-mile 15 or 20-mile limit.
They just aren't going to stay; they are 16 going to go.
17 And, this is going to compound the problem just 18 tremendously.
And, you have to take this human factor into 19 consideration which has not been taken into consideration in 20 the plan.
21 The other thing is, I would ask the NRC to hold 22 off all decisions for a time.
We have gone so far in this l
23 state that we are willing to buy that plant out and close it O
(/
24 down.
And, one of the big stumbling blocks all along, of fr Tederal Reporters, Inc.
25 course, is this four billion dollars put into this plant.
If
16,950 SueWl it had been four thousand dollars put in it, LILCO would have 2
pulled out long ago.
But, it's this huge money, 3 I We are willing to buy that plant so we can close 4
it down.
And, although this seems like a big waste of money --
5 I mean, anybody, when you think of wasting four billion 6
dollars, but I think we are willing to do it.
And, we have 7
been willing to spend trillions and trillions of dollars on 8
nuclear bombs.
We all hope they will never be used.
9 I would be glad to waste those trillions of dollars 10 to never have a nuclear bomb explode.
We would be just as 11 happy to spend four billion dollars to never see that nuclear 12 plant explode.
13' Thank you.
'~
14 (Applause.)
15 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Ester Pank.
16 MS. PANK:
I pass.
Someone else can take my time.
17 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Robert M. Chinchettie.
18 MR. CHINCHETTIE:
Here.
l 19 l l
20 21 22 23 1
1
\\J 24 l Ace.Federci Reporters, Inc.
25
16,951
- SueW 1 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 2
OF 3
ROBERT M. CHINCHETTIE 4
MR. CHINCHETTIE:
Members of the Nuclear Regulatory 5
Commission, my name is Robert M. Chinchettie.
I live in 6
Wading River within a two-mile zone.
7 I come to you today in disbelief that the licens-8 ing of the Shoreham nuclear facility is still open to 9
approval in the light of tons of damning testimony presented 10 to date, and with the weight of public opinion on Long Island 11 so solidly against the opening of the plant.
I have not. told 12 you anything you don't already know.
- 7. _.
t
\\"'/
13 I will, however, share with you my personal 14 experience.on the morning of the LERO drill, February 13th, 15 1986.
I recognize, with you, that a drill is an exercise 16 simulating an anticipated event, providing for the opportunity 17 to practice procedures to be followed that should that event 18 occur.
It's a test of readiness to meet a specific challenge.
19 on the morning of February 13th, while driving to 20 work, I heard on my car radio that although the implementation 21 of the drill had not been formally announced there was 22 considerable activity at the LERO command center to indicate 23 that the drill was underway.
If, indeed, we could know the n
24 exact time and date that an accident will occur, then truly Aeofederal Reporters, Inc.
25 an evacuation plan :iould never be necessary for we would simply
16,952
- 17-10-Sue 1
be able to shut down the plant in advance of the accident.
O 2
Realistically, we know this could never be.
The l
PeoP e at Three Mile Islan'd and Chernobyl could never have 3
4 been warned in advance to begin to evacuate because an ac-5 cident was about to happen.
Yet, the LERO drill did exactly 6
that.
7 I arrived at my office in Hauppauge some time 8
before 8:30 a.m.
I was at my desk, telephone number, 348-427].
9 Ours is a direct line system that does not utilize a switch-10 board.
At 8:44 a.m., my phone rang.
The voice on the other 11 end identified himself as Harry Galkin, phonetic spelling, 12 from Long Island Lighting Company.
He was trying to reach O
13 a Mr. Kooney at my number concerning response to the LERO 14 drill.
I questioned him to try to get more identifying 15 information on Mr. Kooney, as our staff numbers ],500 people.
16 He did not know anymore about Mr. Kooney.
17 As I spoke with Mr. Galkin, I heard a good deal of 18 light hearted banter in the background.
When I told Mr. Galkin 19 he had reached the Department of Social Services, he laughed 20 and said, "Oh, I don't need you," and hung up.
21 I wonder if he ever reached Mr. Kooney.
Don't you?
22 At 8:55 a.m.,
the second call came to my desk, 23 a gain from a second LILCO representative.
He was trying to 24 reach a Tommy McKennan with reference to response to the LERO
, ws n. corm. inc.
25 drill.
I reacted in astonishment that this was the second call
16,953 9 S ueW1 I received trying to locate a LERO person.
Again, I said 2
there was no such person in our office and that he had 3
reached the Department of Social Services.
4 I wonder if he ever reached Mr. McKennan, don't 5
you?
6 (Laughter.)
7 MR. CHINCHETTIE:
I'm an administrator in the
.8 Department of Social Services.
My telephone number, 348-4271, 9
has been assigned to me since January 1985.
I know the staff 10 who had that number before me for several years long before 11 a LERO operation was ever conceived.
12 When I read in "Newsday" -- one of our local O
13 newspapers which has a well deserved reputation for being.
14 the public relations arm of the Long Island Lighting Company --
15 that the drill was deemed a success by FEMA, I recalled my 16 personal experiences of that morning and said a prayer for 17 the people of Long Island.
18 When an organization such as LILCO can be permitted 19 to test a plan, adjudicated in a competent court of jurisdictio:1 20 to be illegal, and can be found to have successfully tested 21 that paper plan when they didn't even have the right phone 22 numbers to reach their personnel to execute that plan, I say 23 our democracy is in danger, not from the Russians, the Libyans 24 or the Iranians but from some of our own greedy industrialists.
A casw:s Reponen, Inc.
25 (Applause.)
16,954 SueW1 MR. CHINCHETTIE:
And from those in our government 2
agencies who would set aside the will of the people our 3
government was created to serve and the safety of the people 4
our government was created to protect.
5 Thank you.
6 (Applause.)
7 JUDGE MARGULIES:
We will take one more speaker.
8 Mark Limbo, Wading River.
9 LIMITED APPEARANCE STATEMENT 10 OF 11 MARK LIMBO 12 MR. LUMBO:
Thanks a lot, guys.
13 (Laughter.)
14 MR. LIMBO:
How do you do, gentlemen?
My name 15 is Mark Limbo.
16 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Didn't you address us previously?
17 MR. LIMBO:
Yesterday, yeah, just very shortly.
18 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Well, don't you want to give l
19 your -- someone else the time?
20 MR. LIMBO:
No, I have a prepared statement.
I 21 would like to speak.
I just spoke for two or three seconds l
22 that day, because people -- you were asking people to come up l
23 and say anything, because there was not many people there.
24 So, just give me a few minutes.
AsmJederet Reporters, Inc.
25 JUDGE MARGULIES:
Well, you will be the last l
L-
16,955
- 1 13-SueW l speaker, then.
2 FROM THE FLOOR:
Well, come back next week.
3 MR. LIMBO:
I won't let you down.
I would just 4
like to say that I would like to thank you anyway for coming.
5 And, I know it has been a very long and tedious thing for 6
you to come here and sit here and listen to all of these 7
people speak.
And, you know, everybody saying the same things 8
about LILCO and about the roads and about all of LILCO's 9
screw-ups, and about our infamous Long Island Expressway.
10 Well, I came here tonight because I have the 11 solution to the evacuation problem.
See, I called Mr.
12 Catacasinos to tell him about it but he is still in Europe.
7, kh 13 And, they told me to call back after the hurricane season, he 14 will be home then.
15 My plan is this.
We have to get out 138,000 16 p eople around a 10-mile zo.ie.
Now, originally we were going 17 to go to the Nassau Coliseum but they gave that up.
They 18 can't use the Nassau Coliseum.
Well, I thought we would build 19 our own Coliseum and call it the LILCO Coliseum.
We will put 20 140,000 seats and then give everybody season evacuee passes.
21 That means, we will go to every event.
We will go to every-22 thing, all the hockey games, everything, so then you won't 23 have to evacuate us because we will already be there.
You
,\\
/
24 know what I'm saying?
wa seconm. inc.
25 (Applause.)
16,956
- 1 14-SueW l MR. LIMBO:
You know, it sounds pretty stupid.
- But, 2
I'll tell you, it's not as stupid as their plan, believe me.
3 Yeah, really.
Mort Stahl would have a great time 4
here with you guys, especially tne NRC, the no-rules committee.
5 Right.
No-rules commission.
6 (Applause.)
7 MR. LIMBO:
Let me tell you, gentlemen, you have 8
broken every rule in the book.
You have made up rules as 9
you went along, and you like to play hard ball.
Fine.
We 10 tell you, we are going to play hard ball, too.
11 We've tried everything, everything to tell the 12 federal government and Mr. Reagan.
We've told all about the
~~
13 ineptitudes of Long Island Lighting Company,'all the in-14 adequacies, all that type of situation where they are not, 15 you know, handling us right and not treating the people 16 right and not being well -- you know, considering our safety.
17 But, let me tell you, when I just described LILCO 18 I'm probably describing the federal government as well.
It's 19 hard.
20 You know, we have appealed to their sense of logic, 21 their sense of scientific ability, moral character, sense of 21 dignity, honesty, conscience; nothing has worked.
And why?
23 Because the concept and implementation of nuclear power
J 24 demands the lack of all these characteristics I've just l
! Amfederd Reporters, Inc.
25 described.
l l
k 16,957
- 17-15-SueW1 See, the industry must be cold and callous and
(~)
~'
2 unfeeling and relentless in its goals, because there is 3
going to be great loss of life, contamination of people 4
that can never go back to their homes, evacuations, uprooting.
5 Feelings can't come into this, because it's the almighty 6
dollar.
And, whoever said that money is the rool of all evil 7
was a very, very, very genius -- a genius of a man, because 8
that is the problem here.
9 We know it, you know it, everybody knows it.
10 But', let me tell you --
11 (Applause.)
12 MR. LIMBO:
I just, you know, want to say that
~
O 13 everyone in the nuclear industry has to close their eyes to 14 this.
You've got to close your eyes to all of this feeling.
15 In other words, anyone with a conscience would go insane.
16 And I understand that.
17 And, the thing is, I think you all have gone insane.
18 T hat's the problem.
19 Let's look at a scenario of the world -- and I 20 shouldn't say this too loud; I should bite my tongue --
21 without nuclear power.
Let's just say nuclear power was never 22 invented, they never did split the atom.
All right.
First 23 of all, there would be no Hiroshima, the largest single act 24 of human destruction in the history of mankind.
No Nagasaki,
- m. n.ponm. inc.
25 a repeat performance.
No human beings being born into the
l 16,958
, SueW1 world with the cloud of nuclear holocaust hanging over their 2
heads, no minute man missiles, no MX missiles, no SALT 3
treaties, no nuclear test ban treaties, no missile silos 4
in Kansas and Missouri and every other state, no big defense 5
budget.
And, that's the key to it.
There would be no big 6
defense budget.
7 The reason we have such a big deficit in this 8
country is the defense budget.
If we didn't have that, we 9
wouldn't have a deficit.
Mr. Reagan -- Mr. Reagan would let 10 us believe that it's our runaway social program.
You know, 11 helping the poor, our senior citizens, education.
But, I 12 don't think Rambo -- I guess he doesn't need any education,
(
)
13 I guess, huh?
14 And, gentlemen, there would be no Three Mile 15 Island, no Chernobyl, no Shoreham, no nuclear power plants 16 at all.
And, there would be no you.
There would be no 17 Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
You guys wouldn't have a job.
18 And, that's the key.
You want to keep it going.
19 And, that brings me to the real issue, the real issue that 20 Mr. Reagan understands, Mr. Bush understands, our new found 21 friend, Mr. D'Amato understands, our Governor understands --
22 politics.
And, people on Long Island, we have the political 23 clout.
That's why we are here.
That's why they are here, 24 because we've got it now.
Acefederj Reporters. Inc.
25 The nuclear industry is watching us.
We know that
16,959
- 17-17-SueW 1 this is the last defense for nuclear power in this country.
(h
\\-
2 If this plant goes down, then it all goes down.
It's all 3
over.
People will know the truth like we know the truth.
4 (Applause.)
5 MR. LIMBO:
When this first started -- and this 6
was about 17 years ago -- I wasn't involved.
There's a lot 7
of people in this room that were, in 1969 and 1970.
There 8
was only a few of them, and mostly senior citizens, a few 9
people, their children.
About 10 years ago, not one person 10 on the County Legislature was against Shoreham.
11 Now, there isn't one left that hasn't gone our 12 way,*not'one.
13 FROM*THE FLOOR:
How about Lou?
14 MR. LIMBO:
Well, Uncle Lou.
We all know about 15 Uncle Lou.
He used to be the presiding officer.
Now, he's 16 not even the presiding officer.
Mr. Blass is.
And, we made 17 Mr. Blass.
He was little known.
He is our candidate, 18 anti-Shoreham candidate.
And, he will be a congressman.
19 And, Mr. Bush had to eat crow and come down and 20 endorse him, and stated to the fact that we need more men 21 like Mr. Blass, young leaders in Washington.
But, still they 22 come back and tell us that they are pro-nuclear.
They want 23 to be nuclear power.
O)
(_
24 Well, Mr. Bush, if he wants to be President he had Asefaser*J Reporters, Inc.
25 better be listening, because if he doesn't change his policy
16,960 i
- 17-18-SueM he won't be the President, because we won't elect hin.
O 2
(Applause.)
3 MR. LIMBO:
Let me just say one more thing.
We 4
have enough clout to destroy his political future _and.a. lot 5
of other people in Washington.
And, that's the message we 6
want you to bring back.
You can tell Mr. Catacasinos this, 7
and you can tell everyone this, that we are dug in.
We are 8
not giving up.
j 9
That's because we are Americans, and we were born 10 in freedom, and that fire of freedom burns in us.
It will 11 always burn in us.
And that's the American way.
That's 12 what this is all about.
(h 13 And, that is what democracy is all about.
- And, 14 we know that the price of freedom is constant vigilence.
- And, 15 we are here; we are on guard; and, we will not be denied.
16 Thank you, gentlemen.
17 (Applause.)
18 JUDGE MARGULIES:
That concludes the session.
Thank 19 you for coming.
20 (Whereupon, the hearing was adjourned at 9:12 a.m.,
21 this same day, to reconvene at 9:30 a.m.,
- Friday, 22 September 26, 1986.)
23 E
bDDDDD 24 Ass.Federse Reporters, Inc.
25 l
l l
l CERTIFICATE OF OFFICIAL REPORTER l
This is to certify that the attached proceedings before the UNITED STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSISON in the matter of:
NAME OF PROCEEDING:
SHOREHAM NUCLEAR POWER STATION DOCKET NO.:
50-322-OL-5 PLACE:
Riverhead, New York DATE:
Thursday, September 25, 1986 were held herein appears, and that this is the official transcript thereof for the file of the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
(sigt)
(TYPED) ~Garrety. Walsh (sigt)
(TYPED )' Sue Walsh (sigt)
A M
(TYPED 4 Maty S g ns Official Reporters Reporter's Affiliation i
O
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