ML20206D862
| ML20206D862 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Issue date: | 12/09/1986 |
| From: | NRC OFFICE OF INSPECTOR & AUDITOR (OIA) |
| To: | |
| Shared Package | |
| ML20206D809 | List: |
| References | |
| FOIA-87-622 NUDOCS 8811170305 | |
| Download: ML20206D862 (16) | |
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a UM1ED STATES NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION W/G/gg DOCKET NO:
IN THE MATTER OF:
1 INVESTIGATIVE INTERVIEW LOCATION:
ARLINGTON, TEXAS PAGES:
1 - 14 DATE:
TUESDAY, DECEMBER 9, 1986 ACE-FEDERAL REPORTERS INC.
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Ofici.tl Et;vrtm set ii70303 ou10 ?l, m North Capito! Street l
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(202)347 3700 l
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NADOWDE ComAct Attach:nent 6
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BEFORE THE
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2 OPPICE OP INSPECTOR AND AUDITOR 3
NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION
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'S Interview ofa
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WILLIAM L. BROWN t
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8 Room 1029, Rogion IV Offices Nuclear Regulatory Commission i
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611 Ryan Plaza Drivo l
Arlington, Texas 10
- Tuesday, i
11 December 9, 1986 I
12 13 APPEARANCES:
14 For the Commi.ssi.on.
il CHARLES R. KRAUS, Criminal Investigator f
DONNA M.
ROWE, Criminal Investigator l
16 Of fich of Inspector and Auditor Nuclear Regulatory Commiosion l
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I MR. K RAUS :
This is an interview of Mr. William 2
Brown, counsel for Region IV, relative to allegations regarding q
3 the destruction of documents within Region IV which may or may l
4 not have been pertinent to a current, ongoing Freedom of Infor-l i
5 mation Act request.
t 6
Mr. Brown, before I get into the text and context t
7 of this interview, I would like to advise you of your administra4 I
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tive rights within OIA, and I hand you a copy of a narrative r
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of the rights.
And I'd like to read them into the record before i
10 we go on with the interview.
f 11 "I am an investigator with the Office of f
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12 Inspector and Auditor.
One of my functions is to investigate f
i 13 the possibility of regulatory violations and other employee i
14 misconduct which could lead to administrative disciplinary i
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- action, i
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i 16 "I
intend to ask you a number of specific
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17 questions regarding your officialy which you are required to f
t is perform and your conduct.
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19 "You are advised that you are required to answer i
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i 20 fully and truthfully my questions relating to your official 21 duties.
Here refusal to answer these questions may be a basis t
22 for disciplinary action against you, thich action may include I
f 23 dismissal.
i 24 "Neither your answers nor any information which 1
25 is gained by reason of your statements can be used against you
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in any criminal proceeding, except a prc:ccutien for perjury cr I
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giving a falso statement."
3 Do you have any objections to signing this as 4
an acknowledgement of your rights, sir?
5 MR. BROWNt No, I don't.
6 MR. KRAUS:
Would you please do so at this time?
7 (Whe reunon, the Interviewee complied with the 8
reque st. )
9 MR. KRAUS:
Mr. Brown, would you raise your 10 right hand, nicase?
11 Whe reu pon,
12 WILLIAM L. DROWN, 13 having been duly sworn to tell the truth, the whole truth and the truth, was interviewed and answered as follows:
14 nothing but 15 gy gg, gg3gg, 16 O
Mr. D'rown, this interview is based on an allega-II tion which was made by an employee during the course of another relative to another inquiry which was conduu r ed by 18 transcript OIA.
During the course of that interview, the employee alleged I9 advised 20 that his supervisor, who at the tine was 2I him to destroy some draft reports.
And he told him to do this basedonthefactthatanFOIAwascominginonthisparticularl 22 23 item--
on this particular issue.
I>
24 What I would like you to tell me first, Mr.
Broun, is what is the policy within Region IV, as you know it.
25
a 4
I rolotivo to documents which may or may not bo rocchablo by FOIA I
requests?
3 A
The--
Our policy, first of all, is to comply 4
completely with the Freedom of Information Act.
5 I've brought a cooy--
I don't know if you have 0
it.
--of Regional Policy Guido, 0200(5), Revision 0, which g
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7 I wrote.
d 0
okay.
9 A
That indicates what we should do as far as 10 maintaining records and keeping drafts.
11 Now, this is not our--
We have a separate policy 12 guide--
I don't know if I brought that or not, but--
- Well, 13 it's referenced here, Regional Policy Guide No. 0203 involving i
14 the Freedom of Information Act.
15 And once again, that requires us to comply with 16 NBC regulations and requirements with respect to Freedom of 17 Information requests.
18 If you're qctting to the coint of how we handic 19 drafts, I'll be hapoy to speak to that.
20 Q
Yes.
Before you do that, though, I'd like to--
21 I have a copy here in my possession which I brought with me from j
22 Washington entitled "Regional Office Policy Guido No. 0206, 23 Revision 0",
dated January 28, 1985, subject:
Completeness of l'
24 official Files.
25 Is this the same document that you're referring
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I to in your commento?,
I A
Checking quickly down here, it certainly appears l
I to be.
My copy is an unsigned copy that was in my own personal 4
file.
5 It looks like, somehow along the way, and I O
haven't seen t.he of ficial file, that they've redesignated the l
7 number.
But it appears to be exactly the same thing.
I will 8
give you my copy as well.
9 0
All right.
10 A
Because I made this extra.
h 11 O
Based on your review at this particular moment, I
12 would you say this copy that I have dated 28 January 1905 is 13 the current regional policy?
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14 A
Yes, it is.
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l 15 0
Okay.
l' 16 A
okay.-
i, 17 0
Now, would you address what you brought up on i
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18 the notes--
the draf ts.
I 19 A
Okay.
This particular thing envers how--
what f
l 20 the Region is suppowed to with regards to draf ts, our policy is j
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21 that--
And I'm not talking right now about--
I'm talking in 22 the context of not having a Freedom of Information request.
f 23 our policy is that once a document is final, l
24 employees should destroy drafts.
If they want to keep a draft,
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25 if their--
if the draf t contains substantive information or--
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I for whatever good reason they might have, then they are required f
I to make a notation of that on the draf t and, with the approval I
of the superviror, go ahead 'and put it into our central file 4
room.
5 And, indeed, a number of employees do do that on r
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occasion.
7 Otherwise, as a part of good records management, I
8 we do not want a number of drafts laying around when the final i
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document is out.
I 10 Now, obviously, and it is certainly Regional i
11 policy, if we have received a frecdem of Information Act request, f
i 12 then no one is to destroy anything.
Every thing is potentially
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i 13 capturable by that request.
We make a determination at that
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i 14 time, say, if it's a draft for instance, if it's exempt.
But IS under no circumstances has it been, or is it now, the policy f
16 to destroy any document that has become the subject of a 17 Preedom of Information Act request.
It may or may not be f
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la subject to that request, but that determinatAon is made 19 separately.
I 20 0
Are there occasions when it becomes known to you l
l 21 that an POIA request is at the Commission in Washington and is j
l 22 en route to Region IV?
Does that happen on occasion?
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23 A
Oh, yes, it does.
You know, I don't--
I'm
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Like, Linda Robinson who is in charge of.
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25 the Freedom of Information 9 ranch may call and indicate that a l
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I certain request is coming, yes.
I mean, that's not routinely 2
done, but it may be with some peopic, but not with me.
I O
In that regard, if a call is placed from Linda 4
Robinson to the Region saying, hey, this la on thc. way, would 5
your restrictions on the destruction of documents take ef fect I
at the time you got that call or subsequent to the document 7
reaucating the information arriving at the Region?
8 A
Well, my personal opinion is once the agency I
roccivos the request, then, you know, we have a Freedom of 10 Information request before us, I think it would be inorocer to II destroy a draft.
12 o
so, what you're saying is that once it reaches 13 Linda Robinson's desk in Washington, the FOIA request is here.
14 A
That would be my personal opinion.
- Frankly, 15 the question has never come up, so I really haven't looked into 4
AV N 16 it from a purely legb1 standpoint.
But my personal opinion 4 pf 17
.med I certainly would not advocate or advise anyone to destroy 18 a draft.
19 0
To the best of your knowledge, would that be the 20 stated view of the Region in a situation as I've just described t
21 to you?
22 A
Yes.
And I think it's certainly consistent with 23 the spirit of our policy guide.
24 0
Mr. Brown, I'd like to draw your attention to a 25 documen t I have here, which is an extract, apparently, of i
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I Region IV Staff Meeting Minutes.
2 A
Uh-huh.
3 o
And as best that I can decipher from the nota-4 tions made on the document, the minutes are from meetings that 5
were held on the 27th of January, the 3rd of February, and the 0
10th of February,1986.
Apparently, the minutes were compiled 7
on the 13th of February 1986 for those three meetings.
There's 8
a cover sheet with a list of names of ecopie who were in atten-9 dance, and attached to it is an extract from page $ wherein a 10 comment made by yourself is referenced.
11 I would like you to look at this and explain if 12 you can the context of that coinment.
13 A
Well, the first sentence pertains to a conference 14 call I had had earlier with other Regional counscis and attorneys 15 within the Of fice of the Executive Legal Director.
16 And, you know, this has been a long time ago, 17 and I don't remember all the detailt,.
But just based on what I had indicated at a later staff meetinq 18 this says and my memory, l
the FOIA requests,"FOIA" meaning F-O-I-A, l
19 of the Region that were discussed, and the f act came up during the discussion tnat 20 O W A p 6 % +.
the Executive hea4-Gwa w3 had been receivina /FOIA requests
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21 22 every Monday morning from GAP, the Government Accountability
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l 23 Project, and that--
into a discussion of, generally, it's 24 Then we got 25 important that people--
And I'm--
You know, I'm thinking now
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just sort of summarizing what I recall on thio.
That p oplo l
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should follow, of ficially, the policy guide and not keep l
3 unnecessary material on their desks.
4 In other words, according to the policy guide, S
we should only have working files or working records on our 4
desks.
Cuirent working files.
We should not be keeping e
is a 7
extraneous material, drafts and other things unless there
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S valid reason to keep that, and if there is, it should go into 9
the central file room in accordance with the procedures set 4
10 forth in our Regional Policy Guide.
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And that g^ basically, essentially a reminder of t
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11 V'ga h to people of the policy guide.
12 peopic--
I 13 0
Okay.
It was not--
Let me rephrase that.
Was it your intent to highlight the fact that r
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FOIAs were coming in and that extra scrutiny should be placed 15 1
on the documents that you had in your retention?
In general?
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17 A
I'm not sure I understand your question.
18 0
Wan your intent in discussing this particular subject to alert people that FOIAs were coming and that they 13 j
should pay extra attention to what they are maintaining in theirl 20 s
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21 files?
d 22 A
Well, I wasn't talking in terms so much of the a
23 FOIAs coming to us.
I was talking about pn FOIA$2r it a r; p'
24 going into headquarters.
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25 0
I understand.
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A And just uoing that so 0--
sort of a wcy to 2
bring up to remind everyone about our policy guide and the 3
l importance of complying with that guide.
4 Because I had had--
Several times, I had had g
I training sessions in the Region on implementing this policy I
guide, and it was a periodic reminder.
7 When an opportunity comes un where I can remind 8
peoole of the importance of this tyco of thing, I use it.
9 0
okay.
Is there a program within the Region--
10 You mentioned training sessions once already.
Is there a j
11 program to koop people abreast of what the requirements are os 12 far as maintaining the files and things of that nature?
13 A
Yes.
Yes, there is.
In fact, I have given, j
14 over the past several years, several talks to the entire Region, 15 Regional staff, or maybe at other times to, like, the resident 16 inspectors' nocting bn Freedom of Information and what NRC 17 requirements are with respect to it.
18 For your information, I brought copies of two of 19 my talks on this, and they specifically cover--
I think both 20 of them cover the subject of drafts.
I can't say exactly when 21 these were given, but over a period of the last couple of years, j
22 In addition, we have had, like this past year, 23 1986, Donnie Grimsley, Director of the Division of Rules and 24 Records, and Ed Shomaker, the Freedom of Information attorney, i
25 como down and give a talk to Regional staff on this very subject, e
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1 The year before that, we h d Ed Shomakor cnd I
1 Linda Robinson, Chief of the Freedom of Information and Privacy 2
3 Branch, come dewn and talk, r
So, wo have made a conncious effort to keep the j
4 staff fully informed of their responsibilities under Freedom 5
O of Inf ormation Act.
i 7
And on other occasions, I know another occasion
' j we had one of our supervisors talked i
8 I joined in with one of--
about Freedom of Information, and I joined in and discussed 9
10 the matter once again with the group.
(
And I think on other occasions I've talked about l
11 this Regional Policy Guide, Completeness of Official Files.
i 12 just can't remember exactly when.
13 In fact, I know I have.
I it's not a subject that has not received a
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14 So, t
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15 lot of attention.
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Okay.' In your position as Regional Counsel, it I
16 0
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is my impression that your primary duty is to provide legal l
t 17 assistance and direction to the Regional Administrator.
f 18 i
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19 A
Right.
1 t
f In the event an employee within the Region is 1
20 0
directed or has knowledge of something going on that he feels f
e 21 is it your policy also to counsel them i
22 needs your attention, 1
23 in regards to these things?
f If anyone has a question about, you 24 A
Oh, sure.
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i like an example, Freedom of Inforastion Act, yes, by all
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- know, t
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I cocno, they como to me end csk my views.
I In fact, I frequently get involved in deciding I
how to properly respond to a Freedom of Information request.
4 Q
How long have you boon in your current position 5
here at Region IV?
6 A
It will be--
since January of
'83.
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,lias there been any occasions wherein an employee
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8 of this Region, either located here with the Region or at one 9
of the sitos, brought to your attention some questionable
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10 instructions from his immediate supervisor relative to FoIA l
11 documents?
f 12 A
No.
13 0
lias it ever come to your knowledge that any 14 supervisor within this Region has made it known to people who i
i 15 are subordinate to him that certain documents should be screened i
16 because they are either under an FOIA request that is currently 17 here or one that is alleged to have been on the way in order t
18 to sanitize the files?
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19 A
No.
20 0
In your opinion, if something of that nature l
l 21 were to have taken place, what would be the reaction of
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22 Regional management to them?
?
23 A
The reaction would be very strong.
They would
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25 Q
Would it involve disciplinary action against the
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I individual who gevo tho instructicn?
2 A
Well, I can't speculate, but I would presume 3
that would certainly be grounds to consider such action.
You 4
know, it would depend on the individual circumstances But I 5
know how stror. gly Regional nanagement feels about this.
I know 0
how strongly the agency feels about it.
And there is no doubt 7
in my mind what the Region's position is and what it would be 8
if such a question came uo that you just referred to.
I O
And this may be somewhat repetitive, but 10 specifically, has *.E.n o over been any indications to you by 11 other e.mployee.: ot come to your attention through other means 12 that has, in any way, circumvented the FOIA 13 requirements?
14 A
No.
And, in fact, I frequently worked with g g on--
15 lie frequently gets assigned Freedom of Informa-16 tion requests, and I*have always found him very sensitive to the 17 fact of what the requirements are and should '
ind whether 18 something--
lie will come to me with, you know Can this be 19 exempt, or should it be exempt?
20 lie is concerned about the regruiements.
I've 21 never had any indication that he wanted to go around the require-22 ments, in other words.
23 MR. n'RAUS :
I don't believe I have any other 24 qu e s t ion s.
Do you have anything you wish to add regarding this s
25 matter we've discussed?
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MR. BROWN No, I don't.
2 MR. K RAUS :
Any areas that you think I should 3
be aware of alleviate any possibility of this being looked at as 4
a violation?
5 gg, ggogy:
1.m not aware of the particular 6
incident that gave rise to this, so I can't add anything other 7
than what Regional policy is.
O MR. K RAUS :
Okay.
For your information, there 9
was an interview conducted during the course of the Comanche 10 Peak inquiry that was done over the recent past.
One of the 11 interviewees did make a statement that, relative to c'ertain 12 document numbers, that an FOIA--
it came to his attention that 13 anFOIAwascominginonthisparticulardocumentthroughjjjj(
14 and it is his contention that indicated 15 to him that he should destroy documents before the demand lit.
16 That was the basis for the allegation.
17 Based on what you have said and then the rest l
l 18 e: af the interviews, it would appear that that was not the case.
19 That's for the adjudication people are concerned.
l 20 I have no other questions, and I appreciate your l
l 21 time.
Thank you very much.
1 1
22 (whereupon, at 4:00 p.m., the proceedings were 23 concluded.)
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REPORTER'S CERTIFICATE 2
3 I hereby certify that the proceedings herein 4
are contained fully and accurately in the notes taken by me 5
during the sworn interview of WILLI AM L.
BRONN on December 9, 6
1986, commencing at the hour of 3:38 p.m.,
and that this is a 7
true and accurate transcript of the same.
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9 Sandra liarden
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10 Reoorter 11 a
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