ML20196B682
| ML20196B682 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Issue date: | 06/18/1999 |
| From: | NRC COMMISSION (OCM) |
| To: | |
| References | |
| REF-10CFR9.7 NUDOCS 9906230256 | |
| Download: ML20196B682 (117) | |
Text
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ORIGINA.
a UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
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NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 1:
4
Title:
BRIEFING ON i
i NRC INTERNATIONAL ACTIVITIES PUBLIC MEETING Location:
Rockville, Maryland r
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. Date:
Friday, June 18,1999 g'/
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DISCLAIMER m-This is an unofficial transcript of a meeting of the United States Nuclear Regulatory-Commission held on June 18, 1999,1 in the Commission's office at One White Flint
. North, Rockville, Maryland.
The meeting was open to public attendance and observation.
This transcript has not been reviewed,. corrected or edited, and it:may contain inaccuracies.
The transcript is intended solely for general i
informational purposes.
As provided by 10 CFR'9.103, it is not part of the formal or informal record of decision of the matters discussed.
Expressions of opinion in this 1
transcript do not.necessarily reflect final determination or j
i beliefs.
No pleading or other paper may be filed with the Commission in any proceeding as the result of, or addressed to, any statement or argument contained herein, except as
-a the' Commission may authorize.
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UNITED STATES OF AMERICA s
2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3
4 BRIEFING ON 5
NRC INTERNATIONAL ACTIVITIES 6
7 PUBLIC MEETING 8
9 10 Nuclear Regulatory Commission 11 One White Flint North
)
12 Rockville, Maryland 13 14 Friday, June 18, 1999 15 16 The Commission met in open session, pursuant to L
17 notice, at 9:40 a.m., Shirley A. Jackson, Chairman, 18 presiding.
19 20 COMMISSIONERS PRESENT:
21 SHIRLEY A. JACKSON, Chairman of the Commission 22 NILS J. DIAZ, Commissioner 23 GRETA J. DICUS, Commissioner 24 EDWARD McGAFFIGAN, JR.,
Commissioner 25 -
JEFFREY S. MERRIFIELD. Commissioner i
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STAFF AND PRESENTERS SEATED-AT THE COMMISSION TABLE:
2 AtINETTE-L. VIETTI-COOK, Secretary of the 3
Commission 4
KAREN D.
CYR, General' Counsel q
5 JANICE DUNN LEE,-Director, Office of International 6
Programs 7
MALCOLM KNAPP, Deputy Executive Director for 8
Regulatory Effectiveness 9
ROY ZIMMERMAN, Deputy Director, NRR 10 ASHOK THADANI, Director, NRC 11 CARL PAPERIELLO, Director, NMSS
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-16 17 18 19 i
-20 21 22 23 24 25 ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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PROCEEDINGS 2
[9:40 a.m.]
3 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Good morning and welcome to the 4
last Commission meeting I will chair.
If I am correct, this L
5 is more or less Commission meeting number 311 since I took 6
over as_ Chairman of'the NRC in July of 1995.
I noted that 7-in Inside NRC they talked about fewer. Commission meetings
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since I've been Chairman than under some previous chairmen.
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As you know, I'm focused on outcomes and not outputs.
10 As I told a reporter today, the metric is what l
11 have we done since I've been Chairman and not.how many 12 meetings.
As Commissioner McGaffigan has pointed out, the 13 issue has to do with the content of the meeting we have and 14 the stakeholders who are involved.
l 15 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Chairman, if.the meeting 16 we had yesterday is any indication of our concern about 17 making sure we thoroughly investigate issues, I think that 18 is a pretty good piece of evidence.
19 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Thank you.
20 I think this is actually the very first meeting of l.
21 this type, the first annual summary of NRC international 22 programs involving not only the Office of International 23 Programs but the other cognizant offices that also have 24 international activities and are part of our overall 25 international program.
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I might begin the meeting by congratulating i
2 Ms. Janice Dunn Lee on her recent appointment as the
.3 Director of the NRC Office of International Programs.
.4 Congratulations, Janice.
5 As many of you know,-I have taken an active 6
interest during my tenure as Chairman in the role of the NRC 7
internationally.
I believe that we provide a truly vital 8
service that is a benefit not only to the mature and the 9
developing countries with whom we interact, but also of 10 tremendous benefit to the United States and to our 11 licensees.
12 We help to ensure the U.S.
common defense and 13 security in our review of export and import licenses.
14 We learn by watching the practices of other 15 regulatory programs.
16 We maintain our knowledge of the state of the art 17 by our participation in technical standards committees.
18 We leverage our research resources by entering 19 into joint programs with our foreign counterparts.
20 And we serve as a role model to our counterparts i
21 in many foreign nuclear regulatory programs, helping to i
22' strengthen the independence, the effectiveness, and the
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23 prograns of developing national nuclear regulatory bodies.
j 24 In point of fact, I had occasion to visit 25 Australia and visit a uranium mine and a site where some 1
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activity was going on that in fact supports our work in high 2
level waste.
As we were traveling there, which was in the 3
Northwest Territory in Australia, the head of the regulatory 4
group in that part of Australia had an NRC paper that he had 5
just gotten, that had been faxed to him and had been 6
downloaded from the net.
7 We should not underestimate that influence, but 8
also, those of you who participate in the nuclear energy 9
agency, who work with countries, both western and eastern 10 Europea and in Asia, you know that it is a two-way ctreet.
11 So the benefit that these interactions provide in terms of 12 the net increase in global nuclear safety is of significant 13 and enduring value to the United States, to the United 14 States domestic nuclear energy industry.
Not simply because 15 of what we learn nor simply because of the safety benefits 16 to the residents of other countries -- all of those go 17 without saying -- but because of the simple truth that 18 public confidence is one of the single largest factors that 19 will influence the future viability of nuclear power, and 20 unsafe nuclear practices, wherever they occur, negatively 21 impact that public confidence.
22 So I am pleased at the opportunity to preside over 23 this meeting and Commission briefing on NRC international 24 activities, and I particularly am pleased because the 25 representation of NRC managers at the table today from NRR, l
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'from NMSS, from Research, as well as obviously=the Office of 12 Ir.1;rn:tional' Programs emphasizes that our international 1
3 activities are not simply matters of OIP focus but of t.
4 benefit and interest to all of our program offices.
5 I would only caution all of us today that this is 6-an open meeting and we need to be careful not to engage in 7
discussions that might involve sensitive or classified 8
information.
9 With that, unless my Commission colleagues have 10 any opening comments they wish to make, I would invite you j
11 to proceed.
Ms. Janice Dunn Lee.
12 MS. LEE:
Chairman Jackson and members of the 13 {
Commission, as Director of NRC's Office of International 14 Programs, I am very pleased to be here today to discuss NRC 15 international activities.
1 16 International programs at NRC represents a low 17.
cost, high impact investment which has achieved much under 18 the Commission's guidance and which has benefited from 19 stakeholder and public input.
I want to thank the 20 Commission for giving the staff the opportunity to discuss 21 this program in a public forum.
22 As Chairman Jackson noted, it is the first public 23 meeting of this kind.
I ask you to forgive me, because it 24 is also a first for me.
While it is a first for me, it is 25' the last for Chairman Jackson in her tenure as Chairman of i
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the NRC.
I would just like to take this opportunity to 2
publicly thank you for your service and commitment to NRC 3
and to this important program.
4 I am pleased to have at the table with me
.5 representatives from the major program of fices which support 6
the agency's international work.
With me is Dr. Malcolm 7
Knapp, Deputy-Executive Director for Regulatory 8
~ Effectiveness; Mr. Roy Zimmerman, Deputy Director, Office of 9
Nuclear Reactor Regulation; Mr. Ashok Thadani, Director, 10 Office of Nuclear Regulatory Research; and Dr. Carl 11 Paperiello, Director, Office of Nuclear Material Safety and 12.
Safeguards.
13 In the spirit of the phrase "they who stay behind 14 still serve," I would like to acknowledge the ot her offices 15 who contribute significantly to the work of the 16 international programs that are not formally represented at 17 this table.
These include the Office of the General 18' Counsel, the offices of Congressional and Public Affairs, 19 and also our regional offices.
Their absence is better 20 recognition that given the time available this presentation 21 will only focus on our major activities and will try not to 22 encompass our entire program.
23 I will also try to be as concise and brief as 24 possible in the interest of time, and also because most of 25 you are familiar with our international activities.
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My objective today is to provide a snapshot of our 2
current activities and to outline how the program will be 3
managed.
I will begin with an overview and then describe 4
some of our major programmatic areas.
I will be emphasizing 5
current achievements and future chrllenges.
6 I will close my presentation by discussing what I
.7 believe our future challenges are and how we might address 8
them.
I believe the future of NRC's international programs 9
can be summed up as follows:
10 We should hue to our fundamental r/asponsibilities 1
11 while we are meeting the challenges posed by change.
In 12 addition, it is particularly important that we not let 13 funding issues shape our programs.
I will discuss this in 14 more detail at the end of my presentation, and then I will 15 turn to my colleagues who will discuss their individual 16 program activities.
17 If there are no objections, I will begin.
18
[ Slides shown.)
19 MS, LEE:
Our international activities are based 20 on legal authority set forth in statutes, executive orders, 21 presidential decision directives, multilateral U.S.
22 Government commitments and agency to agency exchange 6
23 agreements.
There are far too many to name individually, 24 but they do form the legal and the policy basis for NRC's 25 international role.
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A compilation of these can be seen in Reference 2
Chart No. 1 at the back of the briefing book.
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3 The Commission decides on policies and programs 4
related to all international activities.
The Office of 5
International Programs facilitates relations with other 6
nations, multilateral organizations, and other U.S.
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7 Government agencies.
OIP' proposes policy issues to the 8
Commission and provides implementing guidance to program 9
offices.
10 The Commission staff offices implement our program 11 and maintain tha technical, reg.latory, research, and 12 safeguards context.
13 Although some significant programs are externally 14 funded through the U.S. Agency for International 15 Development, substantial resources for NRC international 16 activities derive from licensee fees.
Determining the 17 appropriate level of NRC's international involvement takes 18 cost into account.
The interests of licensees are 19 considered as are the broader interests of the nation and 20 the global community.
21 While we have not formally engaged with Arthur j
22 Andersen on the planning, budget and performance management 23 process, OIP has begun to focus international activities on 24 the NRC strategic goals and outcomes.
These include i
25 maintaining safety, increasing public confidence, reducing i
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2 effectiveness, efficiency and realism of NRC activities and 3
decisions.
4 Some of the criteria we use for setting I
5 international priorities include improving the safety and f
6 security of NRC licensed facilities, enhancing U.S. national 7
security, supporting foreign policy objectives, achieving 8
improved financial and personnel resources, supporting U.S.
9 reliability as a supplier of' goods and services, and l
10 developing and maintaining NRC influence and institutional 11 capabilities.
12 Our next slide is our budget slide.
I just want 13 to point out that there is an error in the last column under 14 the travel.
We are policy people, not mathematicians in 15 OIP.
So I apologize for that.
It should read 499K in the 16 very last column.
17 As the chart indicates, NRC international 18 resources are relatively level from FY 1999 to FY 2000.
In 19 FY 1999, 6 FTE are reimbursable from AID funding for the 20 workload associated with our assistance program.
Please 21 note that the FY 2000 budget request is for 6 FTE in the 22 general fund off'the fee base.
As part of the total NRC 23 budget it is pending congressional approval.
If the general 24 fund FTE are not approved, staff is working with AID to 25 continue to have AID reimbursement for some FTE in FY 2000.
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1 The next slide provides a little road map of the 2
areas that I am going to be discussing.
3 NRC licenses exports and imports of nuclear 4
material and equipment which are defined in 10 CFR Part 110.
l 5
The departments of Energy, Commerce, and State exercise 6
control over exports of related technology, equipment and l
7 commodities, including dual use items.
NRC has a 8
consultative role in the review of these exports.
9 U.S. agreements for peaceful nuclear cooperation 10 provide the basis for our exports and applications are 11 approved only if export control requirements of the Nuclear 12 Non-proliferation Act of 1978 are satisfied.
13 A benefit to having NRC as the primary export 14 licensing authority is that NRC provides a technical 15 independent perspective, and decisions are a matter of 16 public record.
l 17 I will not dwell on the accomplishments or the l
18 future challenges on the briefing slide except to conclude 19 by saying that the export licensing process is fairly 20 routine now, but it may face some serious tests in the 21 future.
Examples that come to mind are potential exports to 22 North Korea and China.
1 1
23 Now I am going to speak about our other nuclear 24 non-proliferation activities.
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widely adhered'to' multilateral arms control treaty in
-2 history, with 185. parties.
We participate in the 3
inter-agency. working group formulating U.S. policy, and we 4
~ are currently preparing for the review conference in'the n
5 year 2000.
6 We also provide technical assistance to the IAEA 7
in support of NPT Article 4, Assistance Obligations, which 8
were designed to. reward-developing countries adhering to NPT.
9 obligations.
10' Under safeguards initiatives, I'm not going to 11 speak to this issue in particular because Dr. Paperiello 12 will mention most of them in his presentation, but'I just 13 want to say that we do have an extremely significant, 14 important role in safeguards.
15 In core conversion, NRC provides technical 16
' assistance in. implementing the U.S.-Russia agreement for 17 permanently halting the production of plutonium for nuclear 18,
weapons.
Specifically, we provide technical assistance to 19 GAN, the Russian nuclear regulatory authority, to look at 20 the safety aspects of converting the cores.
DoD reimburses 21 us for this work.
22 This project allows two important national 23 objectives to be brought together, and these are nuclear 24 safety and non-proliferation, which are two sides of the I
25 same coin.
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1 Under plutonium disposition, we have been involved 2
in DOE's dual track program for plutonium disposition, 3
including the vitrification and the MOX options.
Our 4
primary interest is in monitoring what the Russians are 5
doing and identifying regulatory issues.
6 In Fissile Material Cut-off Treaty, we have been 7
asked to participate in inter-agency working groups 8
developing U.S.
negotiating positions on the treaty.
NRC's 9
technical assistance during negotiation and implementation 10 of the treaty are important because some of its provisicas 11 could affect NRC facilities.
12 An underlying benefit to NRC participating in 13 these non-proliferation activities is that NRC contributes 14 an independent technical viewpoint to determinations for 15 which other agencies have primary responsibility.
16 I am next going to focus on some of our 17 multilateral nuclear safety exchanges.
As you can see from 18 the list, there are several here which I will very briefly 19 mention.
20 At the June 1992 G-7 Economic Summit in Munich a 21 major initiative was introduced to improve the safety of 22 Soviet designed reactors.
Three nuclear safety institutions j
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23 were developed.
They are the G-7 Nuclear Safety Working 24 Group; the G-24 Nuclear Safety Assistance Coordination 25 Mechanism, which we call NUSAC; the Nuclear Safety Account ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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administered by the European Bank for Reconstruction and 2
Development; and in 1998 the Chernobyl Shelter Fund was 3
added to these institutions.
Each of these groups has a set 4
of responsibilities and a process for coordination.
5 Under accomplishments, I want to note that Russia 6
is now including GAN representatives in official delegations 7
to the G-7 Nuclear Safety Working Group, which helps to 8
increase their stature and visibility.
9 Under future challenges, I think a significant one 10 is the implementation of the NSA grant agreement closure 11 conditionalities.
Decisions will be very difficult for 12 certain countries as they weigh plant closure against j
13 possible extended operation based on improvements that have 14 been derived from assistance programs, as well as national l
15 energy production needs, replacement energy costs, and 16 issues such as the nuclear policieF of the European Union 4
17 and national intentions for accession into the EU.
18 Under treaty implementation, I just want to say 19 that after four years before the U.S.
Senate the Convention 20 on Nuclear Safety was finally ratified this spring.
In 21 spite of our limited participation in the first review 22 conference meeting in April, the U.S. was able to submit the 23 U.S. National Report, including a supplement describing our j
24 changing regulatory program.
25 Two other conventions are currently pending.
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One is the Joint Convention on Radioactive Waste 2
and Spent Fuel.
While DOE has the primary lead for this 3
conventien, the convention focus is on safety.
Therefore 4
NRC should actively participate in its implementation.
5 There is also the Supplemental Convention on 6
Liability, which is under Executive branch review.
f 7
The IAEA is one of the primary multilateral 8
organizations where we play a significant role.
The budget 9
of the IAEA is about $290 million, to which the U.S.
10 contributes approximately $73 million.
OIP provides 11 centralized programmatic liaison on nuclear safety issues 12 and activities.
We also play a significant role in the 13 safeguards arena, which NMSS will later address in this 14
_ briefing.
15 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Madam Chairman.
16 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Please.
17 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I have a clarifying 18 question.
I know there has been some question by a number 19 of our stakeholders about the monies which the NRC spends on 20 various international programs.
My understanding is that no 21 money from the NRC directly goes towards that $72 million 22 you mentioned, the U.S.
contribution to the IAEA.
23 MS. LEE:
The money is not directly funded from 24 NRC; it's funded through the State Department.
25 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
No licensee fees pay for ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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16 ll those ' activities,-correct?
2 MS. LEE:
Correct.
~32 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Thank you.
4' MS, LEE:
That's a very good point.
5 I'm not going to dwell on the accomplishments but 6
Ljust to note that one additional.one that is not noted on 7
the sheet is that the~NRC is cosponsoring with the IAEA, the 8
EPA, and the Department of Energy the Symposia on 9
Restoration of Environments with Radioactive Residues in 10 November of this year.
11 A future _ challenge for us would be to maintain and 12~
strengthen NRC support for IAEA activities, given reduced 13 financial and staff resources.
i 14 The Nuclear Energy Agency member states represent 15 the most advanced nuclear 1 countries, with approximately 85 16-percent of the world's installed nuclear energy capacity.
17 The agency's regular budget is on the order of $12 million 18 to which the U.S.
contribution is approximately $3 million 19 per year.
NRC is represented on five main committees, and 20 the individual program offices will address their work 21 through the NEA during their presentations.
22 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Madam Chairman, may I 23 ask the same question regarding the NEA?
Are there any 24
. monies that directly go from the NRC to that $3 million the 25 U.S. contributes towards the NEA?
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MS.' LEE:
No.
The State Department also funds 2
directly that' contribution for the U.S.
'3' COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
So none of the fees from 4
our licensees go towards that funding?.
1 5
MS. LEE:
Correct.
6 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Thank you.
i 7
MS. LEE:
In the area of accomplishments, former 8
Commissioner Rogers was a U.S.
representative on the OECD 9
high level advisory group which considered the future of th'e l
10 Nuclear EnergyLAgency.
They produced the so-called 11 Birkhofer Report, which had many recommendations and 12 suggestions.
Some of these have been implemented, which 13-includes the-development of a mission statement and a 14 strategic plan, 15 The future challenges that remain to be worked on 16 are the restructured committee system and also an MOU with 17 the IAEA to reduce overlap and duplication.
18 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Are there any actions that you 19 think the Commission or the NRC staff should be taking 20 relative to preserving our interests with respect to NEA 21 committee structure or focus?
22 MS. LEE:
Many of our NRC staff serve at very high l
23 levels on these committees.
The committees will be tasked l
l 24 by the NEA director general to look within their own 25 structures to find methods and ways to streamline and become ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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more effective.
2 This issue was discussed at the last NEA Steering 3
Committee.
The results of that meeting were that it was too 4
difficult for a steering committee to pick and choose which 5
committees should survive and which shouldn't, that it was 6
better to ask the committees themselves how they might 7
become more effective.
8 MR. THADANI:
Chairman Jackson, in fact the 9
individual committees have already initiated moves to look 10 at how they can be more effective and efficient.
In the 11 committee I'm active in, CSNI, Committee for Safety of 12 Nuclear Installations, we are working very hard to see how 13 we can reduce the number of working groups and be more 14 efficient and focus on the goals that we have been talking 15 about.
16 MS. LEE:
I want to talk next about the 17 International Nuclear Regulators Association.
As you know, 18 this is a forum for our senior-most regulators to discuss 19 nuclear safety policy issues.
It was established in 1997; 20 it meets twice a year.
The U.S.
just completed chairing the 21 first INRA sessions and has passed the chair on to tha UK, i
22 who will act as chair for the following year.
23 Some of the accomplishments of the INRA include 24 development of some policy papers that were distributed in 25 different forums.
There was a Key Elements of Nuclear ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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There was also a statement on Y2K and the 2
development of five fundamental concept papers was recently 3
. completed.
4' A future challenge will be whether the U.S.
I-continues to participate and possible member expansion.
5 6
COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Madam Chairman.
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7 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Please.
8 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I know the General
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Accounting Office is currently in the process of conducting 10 an analysis or a report to be delivered back to the Senate l-11
'sometime soon.
I am wondering if you have any sense of the 12 timing and where that analysis is at this point and whether 13 we have-gotten any reaction yet.
I know I was interviewed 14 as were other Commissioners.
15 MS. LEE:
My understanding is that they are l
16-wrapping up their audit of the INRA.
I don't have an exact 17 date and time when the report is going to be delivered, but 18 it will be a written report.
That's my understanding, and 19 Lit will be in the near future.
20 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Will they be sharing.
21 that with us prior to it being published?
l 22 MS. LEE:
Absolutely.
23 The next area I'm going to cover is the bilateral 24 nuclear safety exchanges.
With regard to the binational 25' commissions, let me just say that we participate in two i
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- 1 binational commissions, i
-2 The first-is the U.S.-Russia Binational j
3 Commission, which is co-chaired by Vice President Gore-and 4
his Russian counterpart...Over the past 18 months the j
5 Russian side has been represented by Prime Ministers 6
Chernomyrdin,'Kirienko and Primakov.
7-The second is the U.S.-South' Africa Binational 8
Commission, which is led by Vice President Gore and 9
Mr. Mbeki, who.was recently elected.to succeed President 10
'Mandela, 11 For us the meetings provide useful high level fora 12L to advance nuclear safety and security objectives..
- However, 13-given-that the year 2000 is an election year, it is difficult to predict if the'e commissions will continue or 14 s
15 what form they may take.
16-COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Madam Chairman.
17 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Please.
18 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I don't mean to put you 19 on the spot.
Do you have any kind of count on the number of 20 visits that the commissioners receive on a yearly basis from
-21 some'of our international partners related to these?
22 MS. LEE:
Related specifically to in general?
i 23 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
In general and in terms 24 of our bilateral agreements we have with some of those l
25
. nations.
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.MS.
LEE:
I don't have a number for you here at 2
the table, but I'm happy to provide that for you after the 3
meeting.
4 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
If you had it, that 5
would be great, but the fact you don't is fine too.
The 6
point I'd like to make for the benefit of the audience and 7
the public is to share with them -- we as a Commission 8
frequently have individual meetings with participants from 9
all over the world.
This week we hosted the president of 10 the Korean Institute for Safety.
It seems like on a weekly 11 basis we are having visits from these folks.
12 For me, having been here seven of eight months, it 13 has been a very valuable tool and opportunity to gain a 14 variety of experience and knowledge about where our fellow 15 regulators are and how their programs are progressing, and 16 similarly, it also provides a terrific opportunity for us to 17 explain to them where we are and the changes that we are 18 making in terms of our programs.
19 I think people who look at some of the activities 20 undertaken by the Commission relative to visits that we'make 21 abroad or activities where we are involved with IAEA and NEA 22 may not have an appreciation for the vast number of visits 23 that we have on a yearly basis.
So perhaps next year or the 24 next time we have this briefing you may want to include some 25 synthesis and show the degree of those kinds of visits.
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MS.' LEE:
I would be happy to do that.
I could 2-
.probably give you a ballpark figure right now that we would 3
--receive on the order of maybe 25 high level visits.
That's 4
just Commission visits.
But there are a number of exchanges 5
that go on at the technical level.
They happen almost on a 6
daily basis with different countries.
.I'll get you a better 7
number, though.
8 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Thank you.
~
9 MS. LEE:
International arrangements establish 10 NRC's regulatory information exchange and cooperation 11 program.
Five-year arrangements are signed with regulatory 12 organizations in 31 different countries plus Taiwan.
At 13 Reference Chart No. 2 you can see a list of all the 14 arrangements that we have.
15 These arrangement provide NRC with direct access 16 to safety-significant information.
They set the framework 17 for NRC technical advice and assistance.
They support U.S.
18 foreign policy objectives.
19 I would like to move on to talk about the mature 20 countries with which we have exchanges.
I'm going to do 21 this by way of the comparative study that was done with the 22 U.S.,
French, Japanese, and UK regulatory authorities.
23 A Tim D. Martin and Associates report was 24 referenced at the June 1999 hearing before the U.S. Senate 25 Subcommittee on Clean Air.
The report implied that the U.S.
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.NRC_had' proportionately far more. regulatory' personnel than L
2 other countries.
NRC was requested to review this issue,
~
3 and the Commission' asked-the staff to prepare an apples to 4
apples comparison.
t 5
'We found that' aggregate comparisons are not 6
. meaningful;because they do not compare like programs.
Not 7
only_are they not-apples to apples; they are really more 8
like comparing fruits and vegetables.
l 9
Our programs are conducted in substantially l
10 different ways because of.different infrastructures and 11 regulatory approaches.
NRC's regulatory approach is largely 1
L 12-shaped by expectations of the U.S. public, che Congress, 1
13 past operational experience, and Commission policy.
14 Let me just say that I thought that the activity 15 itself was very, very useful in that it brought the staff 16
.together and provided for in-depth knowledge of three major 17 foreign partners.
It validated what we knew,.but it also 18 identified areas which we did not know.
19 From the point of view of immediate access to 20 reliable information, the study also affirmed the benefits 21 of our international arrangements.
22.
COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Madam Chairman.
23 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Okay.
24 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I happened to have the 25 opportunity to travel internationally for the first time.
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1-On behalf of.the Chairman I signed a bilateral arrangement 2
between ourselves and Slovenia.
Although they are not one 3-
.of the major countries that were in this comparative study,
'4
-I think it's instructive that I had some very positive 5
' discussions with the chief regulator there.
It became 6
readily apparent to me the degree and the knowledge that he 7
.had of our regulations was reflective of the fact that they 8
take them almost verbatim.
~
9 I think there is something. instructive here, that 10 there are a number of countries out there, even the mature 11 countries, which heavily rely on the rulemaking capacity of 12 this agency to develop their own programs.
Obviously that 13
' inures to their benefit.
They are obviously adopting health 14 and safety practices that are the highest -- ours.
But it 15 also makes it difficult to make international comparisons 16 since'we'are the lead in terms of making these. safety 17 decisions.
To the extent that others can borrow those l
18 without having to have the research capability and the 19 capability in their own equivalent of NRR does make a 20 difference there, and I think that needs to be pointed out.
l 21 MS. LEE:
Thank you very much for that.
22 Next I'm going to turn to our relations with what 23 we call transitional countries.
24 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Madam Chairman, I think 25
.the study that we did was a very important study.
I commend 2
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the people who worked on it, and Jim Blaha, who is not'at 2
the table.
I b'elieve that we really do have a. lot to learn
]
i 4
3 from~the mature countries.
They really are our benchmark.
j i
4 One'of the benefits that you had on your chart was l
.the in' depth knowledge of major foreign partners.
I think l
5 6
we have to increase' our knowledge of these major countries.
1
'7 As'Ashok, I'm sure, will say later, the French have a larger 8
research. program now than we do.
We are still working off 9
of 45 years of leadership in this area, but especially with
{
10
' mature countries, with mature programs at this point we have 11 a lot to learn.
They are still learning from us.
12 The ' French are going through a major effort, which 13 the Consul'd' Etat threw a little bit of roadblock into 14 recently, raising some constitutional issues.
They are 15 creating a body very similar to us.
There is a question 16 whether under the French constitution we are constitutional, 17 but' luckily we are under the American Constitution.
18 I think~we have an awful lot'to learn.
I would
)
19 actually encourage the staff on an ongoing basis, both in 20 international programs -- and I guess I will raise this with 21 the individual program offices later.
I fear hubris cn1 our 22 part.
I fear that because we always were in front that we 23 will not learn.
I don't think that's true, but I think it's j
24 something we have to guard against.
25 We've had conversations here with the ACRS about ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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1 the Europeans as'a group having greater. desire to have very 2
Llittle early release'because of the density of their
'3 populations.
So they impose things like corium spreaders 4
and containment liners, et cetera, on their new reactors 5
which we don't impose on ours.
We have to understand'the 6.
differences so we can justify the differences to the public, 7
and I'think sort of constant benchmarking against the mature 8
programs is one of the most important elements of our 9
international programs.
10 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
For the record, would you say 11 what those three countries are?
I think we know them.
12 MS. LEE:
The three countries are the French, the 13 UK, and the Japanese.
COMMISSI'NER McGAFFIGAN:
I might even add that O
14 15 many.in NEI would look at this study and say, well, gosh, if 16 we had only lost the Revolutionary War, we would have the 17 British system, and they are the least expensive regulator.
18 I'm putting words in their mouth.
19 I talked to a British licensee recently who liked 20 the structure that we had under our decommissioning rule.
21 In Britain, when we were working on Westfall we were trying 22 to figure out what are you doing with Dounreay.
You've got 23 the same problem there and they'll know it when they see it.
]
24 We, for better or for worse, recently said we will apply our i
25 decommissioning rule.
This particular licensee liked the i
I
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structure of having a rule under which they would operate as 2
opposed to the more flexible system.
So I think constantly 3
trying to think about the differences is very helpful.
4 Sorry for the delay.
5 MS. LEE:
Thank you.
6 Next I'm going to talk about the transitional 7
countries.
I'm going to specifically mention Russia and 8
Ukraine but also note that the CEE countries fall into this 9
category, Central and Eastern Europe, and also Armenia and 10 Kazakhstan.
11 NRC has been providing regulatory assistance to 12 Russia and Ukraine since 1992.
The program is intended to 13 enhance the independence and capability of the nuclear 14 regulators.
15 The areas covered include both technical and 16 managerial acsistance.
Our programs have succeeded not only 17 in providing tools of regulation, but also infusing the 18 concept of safety culture.
19 The greatest challenge for us remains in the area 20 of funding and continuing a positive momentum.
- However, 21 with regard to Russia, there are three additional 22 challenges.
23 The first is to continue to make positive 24 contribution to GAN despite the 50 percent cut in funding 25 imposed by Congress.
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.1
' Secc ad, to : assure that the momentum started in *
'2 1992 does not dissipate, our continued presence is necessary 3:
'to protect our investment.
4 Third, the stability of the government and the 5.
country's economic health ~are continuing problems.
~
6 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Could I again raise a 7
question or two here?
Maybe it's going to be addressed 4
8 later by Carl.
9' One of the challenges is clearly in the materials 10
. control accounting area with the Russians.
We have a recent 11' Academy of Sciences report that Mr. Hearn and Mr. Meserve 12 and others worked on that suggested that we needed to 13 continue the program and not declare victory because there 14 is not a lot more to do.
But this is also an area where DOE 15 has the clear lead, for better or for worse, and all funds 16 are appropriated to DOE.
The last time I checked with you 17 all, ten months'into the fiscal year we were still waiting 18 for DOE to tell us what it is that they thought we could 19-contribute to the MPCNA efforts.
This may be embarrassing, 20 but it's not classified.
Could you tell us where this 21 stands, or was this going to be part of Carl's presentation?
22 MS. LEE:
I can address that unless Carl would 9
23 prefer to.
We might say two different things.
24 MR. PAPERIELLO:
We are real t getting very 25 far.
We received a letter from them o..
20th which says, ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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yes, we are going to fund you but we still haven't figured I?i 2
out how we are going to do it, and maybe it will just be s.)
3 another contractor.
Which doesn't make us very happy.
4 On May 28th we sent them a letter, basically l
5 sending them a reimbursable agreement, saying that we need l
l 6
to hear from you by the end of June.
l l
7' We have spoken to them this week.
They are still
'8 trying'to_ structure their own agreement.
If we don't hear 9
'from them by the end of June, we will be sending the 10 Commission a paper with possible options, including just 11 terminating the program.
12 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
I think that would be l
13 unfortunate.
It may be reality, but I believe -- and you q
i 14 guys can correct me -- I'll ask a question rather than 15 making a statement.
Isn't it true that our work in this i
l 16 program, our little piece of it, has been uniformly praised 17.
for the quality of the work?
18 MS. LEE:
Yes.
19 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Is it true that GAO is
)
20 currently looxing into the program again?
21
'MS. LEE:
Yes.
They are doing an update of a l.
22 review they began three years ago.
l 23 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Would we have been 1
l 24 better off had the Congress given us a piece of a mission in 25 this area initially?
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MS. LEE:
Yes.
2 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
And giving us, 3
therefore, presumably some general fund appropriations to go l
4 with it?
5 MS. LEE:
Yes.
6 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
This annual going hat in 7
hand to DOE has served no~one well but certainly has not 8
served the one little piece of the program that I think has 9
been' uniformly considered excellent.
10 MS. LEE:
That's correct.
11 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
It has been noted that we have l
12 had'GAO reviews and others that have indicated the quality 13 of the NRC contributions in this arena, but the 14 arrangements, particularly vis-a-vis the funding, have made 15 it particularly difficult for us.
16 MS. LEE:
That's correct.
17 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Let me go one step 18 further in case there is a GAO person in the audience or 19 they read the tape.
I honestly think GAO in its current 20 analysis should consider whether it should make a 21-recommendation to Congress in.this area.
Hot to put words 22 in their mouth, but something for them to consider would be 23 to give us a statutory role here and a very small amount of 24 money for the part of the program that GAO believes that we 25 can make a contribution to.
We would clearly coordinate ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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with DOE; we would clearly not go off on our own; but the 2-current arrangement'doesn't seem to be working.
3 MS. LEE:
That's correct.
I think we would be in 4
a much'better position if that were to occur.
I just don't 5f
'know the likelihood of that happening in the Congress.
6.
I would like to move on to talk about our 7
relationships with the developing countries.
We find in 8'
this~ area.that the IAEA is really the most cost effective 9
way to facilitate assistance.
10 I'm just going to talk a little bit about one area 11 where I think it.has been particularly useful, and that is 12 the area to address orphan sources in member states.
The 13 IAEA has a model project for upgrading radiation protection 14 and waste safety infrastructures.
The project focuses on 15 five regional areas:
Latin America, Europe, Africa, and 16 East and West Asia.
17 The IAEA also has several assistance projects to 18 help countries such as Georgia, *urkey, Pert respond to 19 emergency lost source incidents.
I think they have been 20 very effective in this area.
21 Moving on to the foreign assignee program, this 22 program started in 1974 in response to requests from
~
23-developing countries for on-the-job regulatory experience l
24 and training in the U.S.
From 1974 to now NRC has hosted a 25 total of 270 foreign assignees from 32 countries.
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Reference Chart No. 3 in the back provides a list of 2
assignees by country and by year.
3 Applicants for the program are proposed by their employing. regulatory organization or by the IAEA fellowship 4
5 program.
The assignees are expected normally to be given 6
duties and responsibilities similar to those of regular NRC 7
employees, and subsistence expenses and cost of travel are i
1 8
paid for by the IAEA or the sponsoring foreign government.
9 Security considerations are, of course, first and 10
- foremost, We have a very detailed arrangement.
We do 11 background checks.
We provide stand-alone computers and 12 they are given very limited access to our building.
13 The program enhances regulatory awareness 14' capabilities and commitment in developing countries.
15 We view the program as an excellent mechanism for 16 developing quality relationships with key personnel in 17 foreign regulatory agencies.
Some of these individuals now 18 serve'at the office and division director levels in their W
19 regulatory organizations.
20 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
How do you define what is a 21 mature country and what is a developing country?
Is 22 belonging to OECD the definition of maturity, or is the definition of maturity something else?
23 24 MS. LEE:
There is no clear-cut criteria that 25 defines these programs.
I would say that we talk about them t
m t
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-1 in. generalities, that the mature programs are the countries cPh 2 ~
that have what we call significant nuclear power programs, w/
3 that have' nuclear power ~ reactors, materials regulations, 4
that. type of thing.
5 The categories' are just categories that we lump 6
together.
They are not very good ones.
It's hard in fact to define countries that are mature versus some developing.
7:
8; Numbers of reactors don't necessarily provide definition.
~
9 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
Not just OECD participation?
10 MS. LEE:
I think that is factored in but not 11 really a criteria.
12 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
So we kind of have a magic 13 wand.
14 MS. LEE:
It's a case by case basis.
15 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
I would also like to put 16 in a~ plug for the foreign assignee program.
I think we 17 benefit in really understanding some of the foreign
-18 programs.
There is a.v4ery interesting article -- I will 19 commend-our French assignee -- in Control, I think they call 20 the journal that they have.
He was talking about what the 21 French could learn from the American program and what we 22-could learn from the French prottea.
23 I wish every assignee wrote a little article like
+
24 that or a larger article at the end of their assignment, 25 because there were some real insights in that.
I appreciate ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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~1 the foreign assignees when they bring that sort of value 2
added.
3
. COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Do we talk to them at 4
the end of their assignment to get lessons learned?
5.
MS. LEE:
.Yes.
They provide an assessment 6
evaluation to us.
7L COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
This was a broader 8
. assessment evaluation of where is the U.S.
regulatory 9
program and where could it improve.
I don't know whether 10 they do that.
If they do that, that would be good.
I think 11 the assessment more is how did the assignment go rather than 12 what I suggested this French assignee did.
13 MS. LEE:
But we could talk to them about that.
14 We'could broaden it.
I think that is an excellent 15 suggestion.
16 As a final piece of my presentation, I would like 17 now to turn to an examination of the challenges which face 18 us and my vision for NRC's international programs.
I 19' encapsulate my vision in three phases:
keeping to the core, 20 challenging the process, and fostering cooperation.
l 21 It is important-to remind ourselves what NRC's key l-
- 22 strategic international goal is.
It is to support U.S.
j-23 national interest in safe and secure use of nuclear i-24' materials and in nuclear non-proliferation.
I refer to this 25 as keeping to the core.
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S-35 11.
To know if we are achieving this goal, we need to l
2:
ask ourselves, are we'doing the right things?
Is the work critical to our mission outcomes?- Are we doing it 4
effectively and efficiently?
We should not find ourselves j
5 focusing exclusively or_ primarily. on the question, can we f,
6
' afford'to do'this?-
l-7 The policy basis.for participation in 8
international activities was set by the Commission in its
~
1 9
1997 Strategic Assessment and Rebaselining Initiative.
1 10 Af firming to this end, staff will continue to actively 11 participate with Executive branch agencies to maintain NRC's 12 role in policy formulation.
We will continue to participate
.13' in exchange activities, and we will continue to provide a 14 wide but carefully selected range of safety and safeguards 15 assistance.
16 Staff, with Commission guidance, will measure our 17.
effectiveness through the strengths and the unique 18' contributions that we bring, in other words, our value 19 added, and not condition our participation based on what our 20
' resources will allow.
21 Under challenging the process, what I mean by this 22 is NRC continues to undergo change.
It is not business as 23.
usual.
I believe any OIP program officer would readily 24 state that even in the past six months we have increased the 25
. emphasis on.how we plan, how we budget, and how we implement ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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our plans and our budget as individuals, as an office, and 2
as manialrs of larger programs.
However, we must also 3
challenge the process to make sure that we do not omit 4
conducting important emergent activities simply because they 5
have not been planned for.
6 The Commission itself, interested in the scope and 7
depth of our work, has led us through some of this change.
8 You have emphasized the need for more thorough and timely 9
analysis, a better coordinated process, avoiding overlap and 10 duplication, and demonstrated in-depth knowledge of the 11 countries with which we interact.
12 I thank you for your feedback and your guidance.
13 I have communicated your expectations to the OIP staff, and 14 we are focusing on performance.
15 We need to do a better job at fostering 16 cooperation internally and externally with our stakeholders.
17 This cooperation should be based on a shared belief in the 18 benefits of international cooperation.
19 On the internal front, as we face the challenge of 20 securing funding, we need to speak with a single voice.
21 After consultation with the directors of program offices and 22 the Office of the Executive Director for Operations, we have 23 agreed to form a council to address international policy and 24 program implementation.
This international council will 25 meet regularly and will improve information sharing and ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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coordination of NRC's international programs.
2 I appreciate the support and the enthusiasm with 3
which my colleagues have agreed to this idea.
4 On the external front, the public and NRC 5
licensees derive tangible and intangible benefits from these 6
activities.
The public perception of how safely plants are 7
run as well as how secure they are influences its confidence 8
in nuclear energy.
The U.S.
as a major supplier of nuclear 9
fuel, equipment and technical services depends on an orderly 10 and predictable export licensing regime to enhance their 11 marketability.
12 In addition, our safety assistance program allows 13 U.S.
companies to expand their business interests.
14 Cooperation with foreign countries in nuclear safety 15 research provides a larger experience base than exists in 16 the U.S.
alone.
Together we can identify and resolve safety J
l 17 issues in an economical manner.
j i
18 Our assistance also helps in the prevention and 19 mitigation of problems in countries with weak or embryonic 20 nuclear safety cultures.
Given that the operators of 21 nuclear facilities spend millions of dollars per year on 22 insurance, imposing a small cost on licensees to support NRC 23 staff for assistance is on balance a very cost effective 24 insurance policy.
1 25 NRC's participation in international safeguards i
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and non-proliferation helps us assess potential threats 2
'against the U.S.
3 We must remember that NRC's regulatory strengths 4
influence U.S.
credibility-domestically and abroad.
We 5
should be ready to emphasize these points, as appropriate, 61 in our dialogues with the Congress, the domestic industry, 7
and our relevant stakeholders.
8 This concludes my portion of the presentation.
I 9
would now like to turn the briefing over to Dr. Knapp, who 10 will introduce.the program offices individually.
11 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Madam Chairman.
If the 12 French think it 's iny rtant to have people come to the U.S.,
13 and reading Control again, I see the British inspectors 14 spend some time, and the French inspector, mostly in the 15 reactor area, do we think it's important to send some of our 16 folks to France, to England, to Germany, to Spain?
17 MS. LEE:
Yes, we do.
18 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
It wouldn't really be 19 part of our international program.
It would be like sending 20 somebody to Capitol Hill, another foreign country, on a 21 political science association exchange.
We think that is 22-valuable because it brings us knowledge of that institution.
23 If we don't have the hubris that we have nothing to learn, 24 then we should be sending people out and trying to tap and 25 understand and benchmark ourselves against those regulators.
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I ask if that is happening.
2 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
I can give you a recent example.
3 This last spring we sent a senior reactor analyst over to 4
Franct for several weeks to look at the way they do their 5
inspection planning and process, particularly with regard to 6
outages.
We have found that to be very useful.
7 We have done it and look for opportunities to 8
continue to do it, as well as participate in other direct 9
inspection activities at facilities.
So in addition to 10 taking part in multilateral and bilateral meetings, we are l
l 11 also looking at having a direct observation of activities in 12 the field and close working relationships with the 1
13 regulator.
j 14 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
I would be interested to j
15 see how much of that we do and how that is planned into ou'r 16 programs, but that is something I can explore another time.
17 MR. THADANI:
If I may make a quick comment on 18 that from Office of Research, it seems to me that we tend to l
19 get more assignees from other countries here than we send 20 our people.
I think France is a very good example.
From 1
21 the Office of Research we did send one person about two 22 years ago'to France to spend a substantial amount of time to l
l 23 truly. learn from them.
But I think we don't do enough, and 24 we need to think hard if we can get additional benefit from 25 this.
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COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Thank you.
2^
MR. ZIMMERMAN:
Also sending individuals not only 3
from the headquarters but from the regions to give them that 4
opportunity as well.
5 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN: 'Right.
At times we do 6
it.
Joe Callan, when we were starting up the program with 7
the Ukrainians, didn't he spent a significant period of time 8
there in a sort of assistance mode?
9 What I am saying is I suspect and the British and 10 French and other examples indicate that they are going off 11 in a learning mode, where we are not in assistance but we 12 are really trying to benchmark and learn.
13 I'm glad we do some of it, and I would just 14 suggest to this council that you think about whether that 15 should be expanded and how to do so cost effectively and
,16
. whether there are language issues.
I know there may well 17 be.
The Europeans all speak English and can come this way, 18 but other than Commissioner Diaz we are a little bit short 19 on our foreign language capabilities.
20 My main concern is that we not suffar from hubris.
31 MS. LEE:
I would just add one more point.
We did 22 have an NRC individual spend a year in Japan.
-23 COMMISSIONER DICUS:
Also, haven't you assisted in 24 some way or the other state people going to assist in 25 foreign countries?
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1 MS. LEE:
I think we have been involved to a l
2 certain degree with that, yes.
l 3
COMMISSIONER DICUS:
Commissioner Merrifield.
4 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
One question.
We talked 5-a lot today about the activities we have under way in Europe 6
and some of the activities we have under way in Asia.
It i
7 has struck me to a certain degree that our relationships in 8
many teays are sort of east-west related.
I would commend 9
Commissioner Diaz for teking some time with our southern 10 neighbors in Mexico, Brazil, and Argentina.
I believe, I 11 think.as he does, that those are important relations for us, 12 as well as with Canada, the north-south.
13 I am wondering if you have any thinking in terms 14 of ways in which we can strengthen those relationships as we 15 move forward with international programs.
That may be some 16 work that'we as Commissioners have to do; it may be some 17 work we have to do as a Commission.
18 MS. LEE:
I think that is an excellent point.
We 19 have had visits to Canada and Mexico that have occurred 20 throughout the recent years.
We have had technical teams 21 exchange visits and information.
I would like to see more 22 of that, quite frankly.
I think we can think about that 23 area in a better way, and I would like to see that happen.
24 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
That will certainly be a 25 priority for me in the coming year.
Thank you.
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MR. KNAPP:
On behalf of the EDO's office, a 2
couple of comments on Janice's presentation.
We are quite 3-interested in international and I think that we will be
~
4 seeing increased attention at the.EDO' level in the coming 5
. year.
6' I'm.looking forward to working with Janice and 7
working'on the international strategic arena as we go 8
through the PBPM process and as we agree to and pursue an
~
9 ou'tcome-based program.
I think we will see stronger 10 incernal coordination and a more outcome-based process 11 within the next year.
I'm looking forward to that.
12 As I turn it over to the office representatives to 13 talk about their programs, I would note the presentations 14 this morning in' fact will begin with desired outcomes 15 followed by a discussion of their activities and a 16 discussion of the benefits which they foresee from each of 17 the programs.
18.
With that, I will turn it over to Roy Zimmerman of 19:
NRR.
20 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
Good morning.
21 Our desired outcomes in NRR are clearly to benefit 22 from our international experiences that contribute to our 23 four performance goals that Janice mentioned, that are shown
'2 24 here in the middle of the-slide.
25
.We recognize that there is a wealth of information ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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that we can' gain from the operating experience with our
~
2 international peers.
We also recognize our responsibility 3
to assist in the fulfillment of not only NRC's but the U.S.
4-international nuclear safety obligations.
We appreciate the 5-
' opportunity to be able to do that as well.
6 With regard to resources, approximately one 7
percent of NRR's budget goes into the international area.
~
8 Most of our international activities are designed 9
.to gain safety information.through bilateral and 10 multilateral exchanges.
11 For example, over-the past four years we worked 12 closely with our peer regulators from Canada, France, and
^
13 the UK to understand the challenges.that these countries had 14-in the area of digital I&C.
We were experiencing both 15 hardware and software challenges.
16 These insights that we worked with them on helped 17 us to finalize our SRP in this particular area of digital 18 I&C.
We then were able to take this SRP and use it to our 19 advantage with regard to the advanced reactor design 20 certifications, particularly with the Westinghouse reactor.
21.
It also nas assisted us in contributing to our 22 review of the Y2K program.
International insights brought 23 to our attention challenges with regard to embedded chips 24-that may not necessarily be readily observable to us in 1
25 ce.rtain systems.
We found that very valuable.
i ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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Also, the standard' review plan for digital I&C i
2 allows us to complete our reviews of modifications that 3
plants make as they go from analog to digital systems and 4
will continue to assist us as we move forward in the license
)
5 renewal area.
s 6
Discussions with peer regulators from Spain and 7
Taiwan have helped us gain information on safety performance 8
of-high burn-up fuel,-and likewise this contributed to
~
9 developing our standard review plan and acceptance criteria 10 for review of extended cycle times.
We were able to receive 11 data from both Spain and Taiwan associated with corrosion 12 measurement techniques associated with that fuel.
13 With regard to material issues, France provided 14 extensive data to us on steam generator tube integrity 15 issues, including crack growth rate, which is useful in our 16 review of steam generator issues in this country.
17 We have also benefited from exchanges with Spain, 18 Japan, and Sweden on techniques for examining and repairing 19 core shroud degradation.
20 The standard review plan associated with digital 21 I&C is also going to get an opportunity to get a good test 22 as the Temelin reactor, which has a Westinghouse digital I&C 23 system, comes on line in the fall of next year, as well as 24 the Lungmen dual unit facility, a GE facility in Taiwan.
We 25 were able to participate in the review with the appropriate ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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1 regulators.
It assisted us in the development of our SRP, i
l 2
and now as those two plants go through pre-operational 3
testing and initial startup of those systems in the fall of 4
2000, it will be a good operational test of our SRP.
5 Over the past several years we have also provided 6
assistance to Russia and the Ukraine, the regulatory 7
authorities there, and we were able to describe for them and 8
assist in their development of an inspection program 9
development of a framework for their regulatory process.
10 Specific areas like fire protection and challenges in their 11 ventilation systems as well as working in the license 12 renewal area are some of the primary areas where we are 13 lending assistance to those countries.
14 We spoke recently to Commissioner McGaffigan's 15 point associated with our assignees going into the field and 16 benefiting from extended stays, visiting France where we are I
(
17 able to gain insights on inspection planning in that 18 country, and we had a number of individuals that visited 19 Sizewell.
It was a mutual benefit as shutdown risk concerns 20 were discussed associated with that facility.
21 We have also benefited from involvement in a
]
22 number of technical groups, such as the Working Group on 23 Inspection Practices.
This is an opportunity for the member 24 country representatives to discuss and learn from each other 25 about nut and bolt issues associated with the way ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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inspections are being' conducted.
2
'Right now, with the development of our reactor 3
. oversight program, there is heightened interest in that
'4 working group and understanding in great detail and 5
following with us as we go through our pilots where we stand 6
in that process.
The personal involvement that I've had 7
with members of that group is that they are very 8
knowledgeable and up to speed on exactly where we are in the 9
process and are anxiously following the developments from 10 cur pilots.
11 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
I ndght use this as an 12 opportunity to ask a question.
I think I saw a trip note 13 that you had written where some of our foreign colleagues 14 were a little concerned about where we were going because we 15 weren't going to be doing enough second-guessing of 16 management.
I'm being pejorative.
They feel much more 17 comfortable in Europe as federal bureaucrats evaluating 18 management of the facilities and making that part of their 19 program.
We as a Commission have decided to do something 20 different because we saw how Senator Inhofe reacted to the 21 notion that we could grade management.
22 Could you give us a little more insight into how 23 those discussions went?
24 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
You said it very well.
That is 25 how it went.
Our presentation brought out where we were ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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.1.
headed in terms of a process that was more objective, more 2
scrutable, more-predictable, and the benefits of that, and 3
to move away from the more subjective nature.
The j
4 discussion on the performance indicators, supplemented and 5
coupled with the inspection program, was our presentation.
6 There was a movement among a number of countries j
7 that there was a desire to get a better handle on management 8
performance.
Some of that handle they wanted to receive was 9
very personal in terms of where they see some weak i
10 management individuals to engage regulator to utility and i
11 address those issues.
12 We came back and indicated that we see a bigger 13 benefit in being able to identify objectively what the issue 14 is, and if that leads a reasonable individual to track back 15 to a particular management individual or management process 16 or safety culture, then it can take you through the facts 17 rather than a more direct issue associated with any 18 particular individual management style per se.
19 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
I think this is a good 20 example of where we have a good discussion with our foreign 21 colleagues and we end up actively disagreeing.
Maybe 22 because of cultural differences between us and them; maybe 23 because even they should consider whether they go to that 24 personal level.
I think Towers Perrin had a few examples of 25 that that didn't look very good when they were shown to the ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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light of day.
We think the right way to go, and 2
Commissioner Diaz has been at the forefront of this, is to 3
focus on results and facts anc not try to second-guess 4
management.
5 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
We are also participating in the 6
Technical Committee on Aging Management and License Renewal.
7 This is a very good opportunity for us to get additional 8
age-related data to assist us in our reviews.
We also share 9
and benefit from diccussions on advances in performing 10 probabilistic safety assessments.
11 Janice discussed safety.
That was an area where 12 NRR had a significant role.
We had 14 of our technical 13 reviewers during 1998 that did a lot of work in preparing 14 that draft.
15 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
Excuse me, Mr. Zimmerman.
16 Following Commissioner Merrifield's lead, who pays for our 17 participation in the Convention on Nuclear Safety?
18 MS. LEE:
I can answer that.
We pay for that.
We 19 pay the FTEs that go to review the country reports, to 20 prepare our own national report.
This is a treaty 21 obligation for which we have made commitments, and we pay 22 for that.
It comes out of the NRC budget.
3 i
23 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
Besides the travel costs and i
24 the FTEs, do we pay any contract costs?
25 MS. LEE:
I'm not aware of any contract costs, but ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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we'do pay travel and staff costs.
2 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
We have looked at the FTE 3
contribution enrolled in travel costs.
It came out to about 1
4 one FTE with a very small contribution in the travel area.
5 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
So it's small?
It's 14 individuals that 7
worked on it.
-It added up to one FTE.
'8 COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
It certainly is an obligation 9
that we have as being part of the United States Government.
10 It could definitely be separated and say this is actually 11 being paid by us.
12 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
This is another one of 13 these leading questions.
I regret that we didn't get to 14-fully participate in the meeting, because from the press 15 reports I saw, it sounded like it would have been an ideal 16 opportunity for some folks from NRR and perhaps NMSS and 17 Research to have had involvement in those peer discussions.
18 The document that came out of the meeting, by any standard 19 I've seen and done with the rapidity with which it was done, l
20 was a very high quality document that the group produced.
21 MS, LEE:
We will have an opportunity three years 22 from now to fully engage.
23 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Right.
I think it will I
24 be a worthwhile cost is all I'm saying.
25 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
Slide 25 on foreign assignees.
We ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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have had some discussion already on foreign assignees.
From 2'
NRR's perspective, we are clearly seeing a benefit, and we 3'
.think it is a mutual benefit for the foreign assignees that 4
we' currently have on board.
5 The listing in front of you is in fact foreign 6-assignees that are currently on board in NRR.
The 7
individuals that are assigned these roles are very competent 8
individuals.
Their up to speed time is very little, and 9
they are able to make meaningful' contributions to assist us 10 in our task and our mission very quickly, and we believe
.11 that they are likewise benefiting from their time here and 12 getting to better understand our processes.
13 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Again I might note I
' l-4 believe it's correct that Japan is the first licensing 15 authority to grant an extension beyond 40 years to an 16 operating license.
I think they did that in the last few 17 months.
Isn't.that correct?
18 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
I think that's right.
19 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
That's based on
'20 Nucleonics Week.
21 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
If there are no further questions, 22 Ashok Thadani will discuss the Office of Research.
23 MR. THADANI:
Good morning.
You've heard about 24 the four outcome goals.
I think most of the activities that 25 we are involved in with the international communities are ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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focused on trying to address the~ outcome goals.that have
'2 been talked about.
3 Central in achieving those goals is the 4
contribution 1of the information.we get from other countries, 5'
a contribution that makes us able to make sound technical 6
fdecisions.
It,has become more and more important as years 7
have gone by..
Some of the experimental work that is going 8
on in other countries is very much first-class quality type 9
of work.
It has been of great value to us in understanding
-10 some-of the issues.
I will come back and give you some 11 examples of those issues.
12 I think you have said it yourselves at this 13
. meeting that it is not just important to get good 14 information, but it's equally important to make sure that 15 information-is shared by the countries.
There are many ways 16 we go about'doing that.
Setting up benchmark international 17 standard problems just happens to be an example of how we go 18 about trying to make'sure the information is shared.
19 Another area where we are fairly active is the 20 issue of international standards.
In some cases I think we 21 are getting some very good input ourselves, but nevertheless 22 to make sure that the best technical information is 23 utilized.
As you have said yourselves aaain this morning, 24 light water reactor technology is global, and it is 25 important to us in terms of safety of plants not just in ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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this country but as well.as in other countries.
2
-I willLcome back and discuss some specific 3
numbers.
We have-been working very hard to make sure that 4
our resources are properly leveraged to take advantage of 5
what the other countries are doing to help us make the 6
decisions-that we need to make.
7 This is'a; bit busy.
As our budget has gone down, 8'
'it really has'become important;that we increase'our, 9
cooperation with international organizations as well as 10 domestic organizations.
11 I believe this is completely consistent with the 12 direction we were given in Direction Setting Issue 22 by the 13 Commission.
The current situation is that we have actually 14 64 bilateral and multilateral research agreements.
15 Commissioner Merrifield and Commissioner Diaz, I may note 16 that we do have some agreements with some of the South 17 American countries as well, and we are in fact attempting to 18 increase our interaction with them.
19 We have 23 additional agreements under negotiation 20 currently.
21 What is the value of these agreements?
There are 22 two cases I would-like to present to you.
23 The first one is we have initiated work in terms 24 of improving our thermal hydraulic codes.
As you know, we 25 have gone down in terms of the work we do in the severe j
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accident-arena.
We have increased-our efforts in the area 2
of: risk assessment.
We decide what it is that we want to 13 -
do.
4'
.We are~ fortunate in that we get about $2-million a 5
year from other countries to participate in the programs 6
that we.are working on.
So this is additional funding that 7
we utilize to help us get to where we want to get and to 8
share'this information with other. countries.
l 9
'AnotherLcategory where we get great value is we 10 contribute about $4 million per year to international 11-research programa.
Some of the research is conducted in 12 other countries and some is conducted in this country.
For 13 example, the lower head failure work that is going on at 14 Sandia Nacional Laboratory is supported by a number of other 15 countries.
16 For this $4 million the other countries' 17
' contribution is about $60 million.
Many of the programs we 18
'could not support clearly were it not for the fact that 19 other. countries have come forward in many cases and put up a 20 fair amount of resources.
21 I will come back to this point when I say a few 22-words about sorae of our future needs and how that might be 23 an important element.
24 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I don't know what the 25 numbers are, Ashok, but we have obviously had a significant ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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reduction in the past years in terms of our own research 2-capabilities and the nt ;Ser -of FTE that we have here in the 3
agency who were engaged in these kind of research l
l l-4 activities.
5' As Commissioner McGaffigan has noted, and I agree 6
with him, because of that, areas in which we had a lot of 7
strength previously we don't have the resources to be strong l
8 in everything now.
So we will have a greater dependence and 9
interrelationship with other international countries in i
10 terms of taking benefit of their research.
That $4 million, 1
11 it would seem to me, is very critical and a good investment l
12 in leveraging the funds we have in terms of getting the best 13 value of r+.earch out there and sharing in the other 14 information that these other countries have.
15 MR. THADANI:
Indeed, I can say with some 16 confidence that the U.S. was clearly a leader in many of the 17 technical areas.
We are no longer leaders in all those 18 areas that we were once, leaders in those categories.
19 You are quite right.
It is essential that we stay 20 in close contact with those countries where they have in 21 fact gone on in considerable additional work.
22 Commissioner McGaffigan talked about the European 23 PWR and the idea of core catchers, and so on.
In the severe 24 accident arena, if I may say, the Europeans are doing much j
25 more work, and we are trying to leverage our resources to ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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S-55 1-get that information.
2 Anothe; major area where we need to catch up-is in 3
the area of fuels We used to be leaders, but for the past 4
20 years,. roughly, we haven't done very much research.
Some 5
of the new issues are developing, and I will share with you 6
some of those cases.
7 To go back to respond to part of what you said, 8
Commissioner Merrifield, since you gave me an opportunity, 9
five years ago our budget was --
10 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I don't want to give you 11 too great an opportunity.
12
[ Laughter.]
13 MR. THADANI:
In any case, I think as an agency m 14 are getting tremendous-return in terms of our investment in 15 our international activities.
16 Let me say just a couple of words about our 17 involvement in IAEA and NEA.
I am personally quite active 18 in the NEA Committee for Safety of Nuclear Installations.
19 NEA provides us a great forum for making sure we can 20 leverage our resources, because that provides an opportunity 21 to bring issues to the table.
22 There is fairly good technical discussion and a
~
23 lot of discussion of merit for going forward with doing any 24 work at all.
The recent success we had was the Sandia lower 25 head failure example I used earlier where NEA has taken the ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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leadership, and we are getting a substantial amount of 2'
resources from other countries.
3 There is this issue"which I think we alluded to 4
earlier to make sure that'within NEA activities are
'S conducted in an efficient-and effective manner.
I am 6
chairing a-working group within NEA, CSNI, to make sure that
'7 we are actually being effective and efficient.
We hope to 8.
develop some recommendations for NEA in that regard.
9 I think Janice sort of touched on this.
We are 10' assisted GAN and Ukraine regulatory authorities in the area 11 of risk assessment by developing procedures', guides and 12 training, and so on, so they can get a better understanding 13 of.the risk.
14 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Is our degree of participation 15 in the international communities, including standards review 16 gro9ps, sufficient for us to keep up with the state of the 17~
art?
18 MR. THADANI:
I believe it is sufficient at this 19 stage.
Where we are perhaps lacking a little bit is in the 20 area of IAEA.
The number of standards that IAEA puts 21 together is quite significant, and we. tend to do overview 22.
'rather than a thorough review.
So there I think we are 23 probably applying limited resources just because of those 24 constraints of' resources.
25 Let me give you'a few specific examples of some of ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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the benefits that have been derived from our interaction-l 2
with the international community.
3 The very first one relates to the AP-600 design, 4
the passive design that was approved recently.
The 5
experimental programs that were under way by Westinghouse in 6
Italy and with cooperation with us in this country were 7
facilities of very small size.
There were significant 8
questions about scaling.
l 9
Japan had a full-scale facility that we took l
10 advantage of.
If we had to do that research in this 11 country, I'm convinced we would have needed probably about 12
$30 million to $60 million to just construct such a 13 facility.
The value of this facility is that it led to 14 actual changes in design for AP-600.
15 One of the most significant changes was the 16 capability to depressurize and be able to use long-term 17 passive cooling system.
It was very critical to understand 18 the pressures and temperatures properly.
The Rosa facility 19 identified some of the problems.
That was not the only 20 design change that resulted.
There were others as well.
21 Some of the other examples I like to use is our 22 effort with the European Commission's network on evaluating 23 steel components.
This is basically a full-fledged 24 pressurized thermal shock type of effort, not only 25 introducing flaws on the surface as well as subsurface of ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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1 the-vessels, but creating those conditions to see how these 2
vessels would behave.
We are providing a very small 3
. fraction of the overall cost of this program.
4 Another example goes to the issue of fuels I was 5
talking about.
We have not done research over the last 20 6-or so years.
TheLFrench have continued, and in the mid-90s 7
the French identified the potential impact of higher burn-up 8
levels on fuel and the fuel response under certain accident
{
9-
' conditions, and the potential for pretty serious 11 0.
consequences.
That sensitized us.
That was our first 11 information that led us to make sure that we are in fact 1
12 fully engaged in that effort, and with the support of.the 13 Commission we are in fact involved.
14 The whole issue of the need for making sure that
'15' we have the right codes.
There is a lot of work going on, 16 and the international community helps us make.sure we stay 17 up to date.
)
18 Commissioner Dicus knows about this much more than 19 in fact I do, the JCCRER Project 2.3.
It is important in 20 leveraging resources.
We are providing a very small 21-fraction of the overall cost.
This would help us get a 22 better understanding of long-term exposure based on data 23
-from the workers exposure, both internal and external.
24 NEA and our multilateral and bilateral agreement 25 also allow us.to make sure the right technical people are ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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getting-together and debating issues.
I cannot, quite I
2 honestly, understate the importance of that.
'I believe l
.3 firmly.that not just taking information and reviewing 4'
something, but being involved in these things is.how one 5
gets deep understanding of issues.
I think that is very l
6 important.
That is another value that we have from our-7-
interaction with the international community.
8 We have access to a number of international 9
facilities.
NEA is very helpful in helping us get access to 1
10 those facilities.
Examples certainly are Cabri in France i
11 and some of.the facilities in Japan, particularly seismic l
12 facilities.
13 I do want to acknowledge that we have two
]
14 assignees in the Office of Research.
From Switzerland, Dr.
15 Chen.
He has already been very successful in helping us 16 separate two specific codes, a severe accident code from our 17 thermal hydraulic code, because we are trying to consolidate 18 the thermal hydraulic code, and this separation in the 19 modular form helps us.
I want to acknowledge the work he
'20 has done and contribution he has made to separate those 21 codes and help us in our move towards more efficient use of 22 these codes.
1
~
23 Dr. Sanchez has just come on board from Spain.
24 Dr. Sanchez is going to be working on thermal hydraulic 25 codes in the neutronics connection.
We are looking forward ANN R1 LEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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to working with him as well.
2 While there are many areas, I wanted to focus on a 3
selected area for this discussion.
It is very clear that 4
the industry has gone to fairly high burn-up levels now and 5
they are going to go to higher because of obvious challenges 6
trying to optimize fuel designs.
We are going to have to 7
rely on some cooperative effort to get the necessary 8
technical information to confirm those changes that we 9
believe the industry is going to make are going to be 10 appropriate.
11 France and Japan'are two countries we are going to 12 rely more and more on to get the information we need.
To 13 respond to what Commissioner McGaffigan said earlier, France 14-and Japan do have resources which are three to four times 15 our resources in terms of research capability.
I think we 16 are just going to have to make sure we are closely connected 17 with those-organizations so we can get the necessary 18 information.
That relates to both the high burn-up fuel and 19 the MOX fuel area.
20 Burn-up credit is basically an example of 21 unnecessary burden reduction where we are trying to get data 22 to reduc.e uncertainty so we can make sure appropriate credit 23 is given for reactivity in terms of the burned fuel.
Today 24 the assumptions are conservative, and it does cost a fair 25 amount of money.
We are hoping to get the information to be ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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1 more realistic in' terms of reactivity aspects of burned 2
fuel.
3 These are some examples I wanted to share with 4
you.
I assure you there are many other areas that we could 5
talk about if we had the time.
i 6
Thank you very much.
7 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Thank you.
8 Dr. Paperiello.
9 MR. PAPERIELLO:
While the NMSS international i
10 activities constitute about 2 percent or less of our total 11 annual budget, they are a significant responsibility, i
12 NMSS international activities are a consequence of 13 treaties and other international agreements, NRC export 14 licensing responsibilities, and mutually beneficial 15 technical exchanges.
16 The United States has entered into treaties and 17 international agreements to place legal requirements for 18 some nuclear materials activities in the United States.
19-These requirements include making NRC licensed l
20 peaceful use facilities eligible for the application of 21 International Atomic Energy Agency safeguards, ensuring the 22 tracking and use obligations are implemented on nuclear
~
23 materials in the United States that originated or were
]
1 L
24 processed in foreign countries, and implementing export l
25 controls on nuclear and nuclear-related materials, equipment ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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and technology.
2~
These treaties andLinternational agreements 3
include the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty, the U.S.-IAEA 4
Safeguards Agreements, the Nuclear Suppliers Group, and 5
agreement's for cooperation with other countries.
6 We conduct numerous activities to satisfy U.S.
7 treaty and international agreement obligations.
More 8
specifically, we implement certain treaty and agreement 9
obligations associated with bilateral cooperation and 10 international safeguards agreements.
These obligations i
11 include verifying and returning the safeguard seals attached 12 Hby other safep<ards inspectorates, tracking and reporting 13 quantities of materials on which international obligations 14' have been attached, facilitating the application of IAEA l
15 safeguards at NRC licensed facilities selected by the IAEA 16 for the application of safeguards, and reporting exports and 17 imports, transfers and material balance information to the 18 IAEA.
19 The United States is a major exporter of nuclear 20 fuel, equipment,. technical expertise and other services.
21 The NRC is responsible for ensuring that certain exports of i
22 nuclear materials, equipment and services satisfy the 23 requirements of the Atomic Energy Act, which includes 24 requirements relating to the application of international 25 safeguards and the adequacy of physical protection.
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In support of import and export licensing of
.]
2 nuclear materials and equipment, we review export and 3
re-transfer cases to assure that the country to which the 4
United States materials are to be shipped has international 5
safeguards agreements in place, that the IAEA has been able
.6 to implement IAEA safeguards at the facilities in question, 7
and that an adequate physical protection program is in place 8
to protect nuclear materials.
9 NRC conclusions with regard to the adequacy of i
10 physical protection are based in large part on the results 11 of physical protection bilateral meetings held with 12 receiving countries to discuss their physical protection
'13 program.
14 In addition, we support U.S. non-proliferation x
15 goals through participation in U.S. coordinated efforts for 16 strengthening international safeguards.
We provide 17 technical expertise to strengthen the IAEA's capability to 18 verify the accuracy and completeness of states' 19 declarations.
This support is provided through 20 contributions to the U.S.
inter-agency a"tivities to 21 strengthen safeguards, and in some cases directly to the 22' IAEA and states themselves.
4 l
23 We participate in U.S. Government efforts to 24 negotiate and implement the U.S.-Russia-IAEA Trilateral 25 Verification Initiative and other non-proliferation j
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programs, such as HEU down-blending, transparency, and 2
plutonium disposition.
3-Our activities support IAEA and U.S Government 4
verification actions and policy initiatives associated with 5
the irreversible commitment to remove high enriched uranium 6
and plutonium from the U.S. and Russian nuclear weapons 7.
, program.
8 We also participate in selected mutually 9
beneficial bilateral and other international efforts to 10 strengthen regulatory regimes and create a global nuclear 11 safety culture.
12 For example, we provide support to Russia, Ukraine 13 and Kazakhstan in material protection, control and 14 accounting using support funds from the Department of 15 Defense and the AL3ncy for-International Development.
We 16 also support the strengthening of the safety regulatory 17 capability in Ukraine and Russia using AID's funds.
Both 18 programs are currently on hold pending funding.
19 In the area of waste and decommissioning, to the 20 extent that we see a benefit to our current issues, we 21 participate in selected international workshops and other 22 activities.
23 One important but very small area in terms of 24 budget and FTE is participation in the standard setting
.\\
25 activities of international bodies like the IAEA which can ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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have a direct impact on regulation in this country.
2 NRC participation in the standard setting 3
activities of international bodies provides an opportunity 4
to share our expertise with our international counterparts, 5
learn from their perspectives on issues, and help ensure 6
that the products they issue are compatible with NRC 7
technical and policy views.
~
8 For example, we participated on the Waste Safety 9
Standards Advisory Committee formed by IAEA to develop a 10 series of guides and standards on radioactive waste 11 management and support the radioactive waste safety program.
12 We participated in the International Convention on Nuclear 13 Waste and Spent Fuel, for example.
14 We participated in the IAEA Transport Safety 15 Standards Advisory Committee in developing transportation 16 standards.
We also support the Department of 17 Transportation's international efforts in developing j
18 transportation standards.
Our own Part 71 in significant 19 part and of course DOT's equivalent regulations are based on 20 the international standards.
21 We are involved in radiation protection activities 22 of the International Comm.4ssion on Radiation Protection, 23 which is an advisory body on radiation safety standards, and 24 on IAEA's Radiation Safety Standards Advisory Committee.
25 We also represent the United States on NEA's ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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Committee on Radiation Protection and Public Health.
In 2
these areas we have developed the international basic safety 3
standards for protection against ionizing radiation.
One 4
aspect of that particular guidance document provided support 5
for our own efforts on Part 35 with respect to the dose to 6
friends and relatives to support a patient, a standard for 7
exposure for those individuals.
8 Our efforts on clearance and decommissioning are 9
also being coordinated with these bodies.
10 In all, in fiscal 1999 there are 8 FTE and about 11
$25,000 for activities under the Non-proliferation Treaty 12 and safeguards.
In addition, there is about one FTE used 13 for technical exchanges.
14 I didn't have in my formally prepared remarks the 15 issue of foreign assignees.
We have had foreign assignees 16 in NMSS in a number of areas.
We have also had both 17 headquarters and regional people participate in training 18 activities, particularly in developing countries, on the 19 regulation of materials used in industry and medicine.
20 Thank you.
21 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Let me ask you a question.
l 22 Maybe it is actually to all of you.
You probably addressed 23 it when I had to leave the room and Commissioner McGaffigan 24 was asking a number of questions in this regard.
25 Do you feel having to have DOE fund NRC ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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1 participation in certain assistance efforts has affected the j
2 staff attitude towards participation in those activities?
3 Anybody care to answer?
4 MS. LEE:
I would answer that question.
I would 5
say it has definitely affected the staff's attitude.
It is 6
a real struggle to have to deal with getting money from 7
other agencies.
These reimbursables are not easy things to 8
get.
The classic example is this MPCNA.
We have negotiated 9
with DOE.over the course of the last 18 months and we nave 10 really gotten not very far.
If I was the staff person 11 working on this, my attitude would be a little diminished 12 and very deflated.
I'm not so sure that the effort that you 13 put in is worthy of the outcome., I think it tends to 14 deflate the human spirit in their approach to work.
15 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
You were going to say 16 something, Carl?
17 MR. PAPERIELLO:
I think you expressed it 18 extremely well.
19 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Roy.
20 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
I would share Janice's thought.
21 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Ashok.
22 MR. THADANI:
I think we have not had as extensive 23 an involvement in some of the activities that we have had 24 with some other agencies.
It's a difficult issue in 25 general, I think.
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CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Commissioner Dicus.
1 2
- COMMISSIONER'DICUS:
I don't-have any further 3
questions.
4.
CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Commissioner Diaz.
5-
' COMMISSIONER DIAZ:
No.
6 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
One quick question.
We 7'
have been striking to a great degree'over the last year and
~
'8 a half to reform the way we do business around here in our 9.
. regulations fully consistent with our mandate to-protect
'10 health and safety, to make'them more risk-informed, and also 11-
.to reduce unnecessary burden.
I, direct this at Roy, Ashok 12
-and Carl.
13 Our efforts through the Chairman's tasking memo
~14-and all of the other regulatory activities that we have had
'15 under way, would you agree with the statement that those 16 have benefited and perhaps significantly benefited from the 17
-interactions Sna have had with our foreign partners?
18 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Try not to all speak at once.
19 Ashok.
30'-
MR. THADANI:
There is absolutely no dotibt in my 21-mind that'we have benefited, and'there are many examples we
-32 could get into.
23 CHAIRMAN JACKS'JN:
Carl.
-24, MR. PAPERIEL*sO:
I think the.other way.
We have
~25 been able to budge trem, particularly in the area of ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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1 transportation, to consider risk-informing transportation 2
requirements.
l 3
CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Roy.
l 4
MR. ZIMMERMAN:
We have clearly benefited and we 5
use the process as a filter so that as we.go'about doing 6
work or planning a trip, we challenge ourselves to make sure 7
.it is' driving us toward our outcome goals or another
~'
8 obligation that we might have, and that we expect that the 9
request for the trip or the participation explain it in 10_
terms of our four goals, and that the trip report that we 11
,get back explains the benefit in terms of those four goals.
-12 So we~are trying to talk'and walk along the lines of our 13 PBBM project.
14 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
But there is a tangible 15 benefit we have realized from that process?
16 MR. ZIMMERMAN:
Yes.
17 COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
Madam Chairman, just one 18 last thing.
I want to congratulate you on your 309 19 meetings.
20 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
311.
21' COMMISSIONER McGAFFIGAN:
I wish you well.
To my 22 more eloquent junior colleague this is a cue.
Are you going
~
23 to do that?
I tb aght you said you were.
' 24.
COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
As I have said before, I 25 think the Chairman has done a terrific job here.
I said I
l ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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that to our employees earlier this week.
If you measure 2
this progress of an agency and the individual who has headed
- 3 it, where it started and where it ended in that individual's 4
tenure, certainly if the agency is in a position to move 5
forward in a positive manner, I think in both of those we 6-have benefited and certainly are a measure of Chairman 7
Jackson's tenure here.
8 I did have another comment I wanted to make about 9-international programs.
Do you want me to weigh in on that 10
.now?
11 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Sure.
12 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
I do think that this 13 meeting today has been very helpful.
This Commission has 14 had a number of our stakeholders who have raised concerns 15 about the level of resources that we have invested in 16 international programs here in the agency.
As a 17 conservative and indeed a fiscal conservative, I look very 18 closely at spending in those areas.
19 I do have to say, however, given my own 20 interaction in some of the activities I've had in regards to 21 the bilateral arrangements and discussions we had over the 22 last year, and the reports that we have heard today, I think 23 it shows a clear demonstration that the relatively small
~
l i
24 monies that we put forward in this agency for international 25 programs do have a tangible benefit to our licensees and to ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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the programs that we have here as an agency.
2 I think we also need to recognize that countries
(
3 around the world look to the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory 4
Commission for our regulations and follow them.
.I've had 5
many individuals that quote me almost verbatim on many of 6
the NUREGs we have and many of the regulations we have.
7 So I think these are dollars well spent.
I would 8
challenge those who are raising that as an issue.
I think 9
these programs are worthwhile and we should continue 10 pursuing them.
11 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Thank you.
12 Dr. Knapp.
13 MR. KNAPP:
I have one final comment, if I may.
14 In recognition of the fact that this your 312th Commission 15 meeting and your last, I would like on behalf of probably 16 several hundred people who have sat on this side of the 17 table at one time or another to express our appreciation for 18 your attention,'your interest, your support of the staff in 19 these public meetings, and overall your effective leadership 20 of the meetings.
We appreciate it very much.
21 CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
Thank you very much.
I'm going 22 to cry if we keep this up.
23 COMMISSIONER MERRIFIELD:
Don't worry.
We'll get 24 you there next week.
25
[ Laughter.]
{
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CHAIRMAN JACKSON:
I see.
2 This brings the presentations and our discussions 3-to a close.
I would like to thank each member of the panel 4
today for your participation and insights.
I'm encouraged 5
in fact by your enthusiasm, by your insight.and your 6
commitment;to the future health of these programs.
7 Again, as all of_us have said, while our
.8 international activities comprise only a small part of the 9
overall NRC budget and program, I believe that each of you 10 have demonstrated the breadth of our involvement and the 11 broad spectrum of benefits we derive, as Commissioner i
12 Merrifield has said, from that involvement.
13 I would encourage and challenge you to continue to 14 carry the torch of international nuclear safety, and I thank 15 each of you, and that is a broad "each of you," for the 16 service that you have provided to the Commission and the 17 support and service you have provided to me.
18 Unless my colleagues have any further comments, we 19 are adjourned.
20
[Whereupon at 11:29 a.m.,
the briefing was 21' concluded.]
22 23-24 25 ANN RILEY & ASSOCIATES, LTD.
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57:
1 d
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" i"
./
7 CERTIFICATE This is to certify that the attached description of a meeting of the U.S. Nuclear. Regulatory Commission entitled:
4
' TITLE OF MEETING:
BRIEFING ON J
>NRC INTERNATIONAL ACTIVITIES PUBLIC MEETING j
1 PLACE OF MEETING:
Rockville, Maryland DATE10F MEETING:
Friday, June 18, 1999 was held as herein appears,- is a true and accurate record of the meeting; and that this is the original transcript thereof taken stenographically.by me, thereafter reduced *.o typewriting bysme or under-the direction of the court i
reporting company
)
Transcriber: Mike P&ulus Reporter: Mike Paulus l
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