ML20138M734
| ML20138M734 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Millstone  |
| Issue date: | 06/27/1996 |
| From: | NRC (Affiliation Not Assigned) |
| To: | |
| References | |
| NUDOCS 9702260070 | |
| Download: ML20138M734 (48) | |
Text
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! @fficial Transcript of Proceedings
!. ,. NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION i
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Title:
Millstone in nt Rev' Group
- Interview of I
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I j Docket Number: (not assigned) i 1
i Location: Mystic, Connecticut i
4 ( Date: Thursday, June 27,1996
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4 l) Mfp b 2-Work Order No.: NRC-752 Pages 1-42
$4,,.J~~I NEAL R. GROSS AND CO., INC.
Court Reporters and Transcribers 1323 Rhode Island Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20005 1 260009 (202) 234-4433 9702260070 960627 PDR T
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1 1 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
, 2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3 +++++
4 NUCLEAR REACTOR REGULATION !
5 INTERVIEW I I
6 ----------------------------X 7 IN THE MATTER OF: : l
)
8 MILLSTONE INDEPENDENT :
9 REVIEW GROUP :
10 INTERVIEW OF: : Docket No. l 11 : (not assigned) 12 :
13 ----------------------------X 1
14 Thursday, June 27, 1996 15 16 Room CS127 17 Hilton Hotel 18 20 Coogan Boulevard 19 Mystic, Connecticut 20 21 The above-entitled interview was conducted at 22 8:00 p.m.
23 BEFORE: JOHN HANNON 24 RANDY HUEY 25 MOHAN C. THADANI NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBtRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. . 2 1 P-R-O-C-E-E-D-I-N-G-S 2
gle (8:06 p.m.)
3 (Whereupon, as sworn.)
4 MR. HANNON: Good evening. The day is May 27, ,
5 Thursday. It's approximately 8 p.m.
6 MR. THADANI: June.
7 MR. HANNON: What did I say?
8 MR. THADANI: May.
9 MR. HANNON: Sorry. I'm reading from some 4
10 notes and it's late in the day. It's June 27, 1996. My 11 name is John Hannon, and I'm here Hilton Hotel in Mystic, 12 Connecticut as a leader of an NRC Review Team looking into 13 the handling of the concerns and allegations at Millstone 14 during the last two years.
15 I'd like to introduce the people I have with 16 me. Mohan Thadani and Randy Huey are helping us in the 17 reviews. I've been involved in all of the interviews ;
I 18 we've conducted so far. The purpose is to make sure that 19 we're handling them all consistently, treating each person 20 fairly, and making sure that the process we're going 21 through is the same for everybody.
. 22 I'm normally a Project Director in the Office 4
23 of Nuclear Reactor Regulation. For this purpose, I've ;
24 been appointed as the Team Leader. Our purpose in j
^
L4 U 25 discussing these issues with you, this evening is to NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBEIRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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- . , 3 1 focus on tha procaso. We're not going to be trying to 2 rehash any of your specific matters of your case, but we 3 think that you could perhaps help us put our finger on the i
4 pulse of some of the problems with the process that you 5 experienced and maybe help us identify some of the root 6 causes and corrective actions.
, 7 We're not doing an inspection or an 8 investigation, but if we uncover material that is new in 9 that area, we would refer it to the appropriate 10 authorities, either the Regional Office for inspection 11 work or our Office of Investigations or OIG with potential 12 wrongdoing.
13 I appreciate you taking the time and meeting 14 with us. This is a little unusual coming out at night 15 like this, and we want to thank you for doing that. I 16 know it's a little bit of a hardship, but it was, we felt, 17 important to get a chance to interview you, and I thank 18 you for doing that.
19 We're having your interview transcribed for 20 two reasons. One is we want to make sure we focus on what 21 you're saying and not be diverted by having to take notes.
22 Another would be that we want to use it later in our 23 deliberations to assure we make the right kind of 24 recommendations. The accuracy of the transcript you give 25 us is important to us, and we want to afford to you, as we NEAL R. GROSS toVRT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRISE'RS 1323 RHoDE ISt.AND AVE.. N.W.
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, , 4 1 hnvo overyone, the opportunity to review it after we get ,
2 it back, and I'll be handing you a set of guidelines we're 3 going to use during the review of your transcript at the 4 conclusion of your interview. If you choose to not avail 5 yourself of that opportunity, you can sign a form and we 6 won't ask you to do it, but we would prefer if you have 4
- 7 the time if you could do that for us.
i 8 We are planning to place your transcript in 9 the PDR unless you ask us not to, in which case we would 10 not put it in the public domain. But be aware that if we 11 request it be withheld, we would be subject to a Freedom 12 of Information Act request in which case we have 13 procedures we'd have to follow should we get one. If wo 14 do get an FOIA and you have to place your transcript in
- 15 the public domain, it would be redacted and any privacy 16 type information would be removed before that happened.
17 Do you have any questions or comments to us 18 before we begin the interview?,
19 ell, yes. I think first I 20 would like each one of you to identify what branch of the 21 agency you are involved with and your name.
22 MR. HANNON: Go ahead, Randy.
23 MR. HUEY: I'm Randy Huey. I'm with the 24 Walnut Creek Field Office which used to be formally Region 25 5 of the NRC, and I'm a Branch Chief in the Field Office.
[
NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIB$RS j 1323 rho 0E ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. , 5 1 MR. HANNON: Randy has had a background of, in 2 addition to being a Branch Chief, he's also had a number 3 of allegation follow-up activities.
4 Mohan.
5 MR. THADANI: I'm Mohan Thadani. I'm with the 6 Office of Nuclear Reactor Regulations in headquarters.
7 Most of my experience has been in the projects area.
8 Prior to that, technical review.
9 The second comment I would 10 like to make is that I'm almost a d my 11 memory is rapidly failing, so during my lunch break today i
- 12 I wrote down some notes that I might want to discuss or if 13 there are no objections to me looking at some notes I have 4
14 jotted down on a piece of paper, then we can proceed.
15 MR. HANNON: I have no objection to that. In 16 fact, I urge you to do that if it helps you recall.
17 Randy, do you want to start the questioning?
18 MR. HUEY: Okay. As John indicated in his 19 introductory remarks, the purpose of our team is to focus 20 on processes that may not have best served either 21 ourselves or employees who wanted to make their concerns 22 known and get them dealt with. In that context, we're 23 going to be principally focusing down two lines of inquiry 24 with you. The first is going to deal with insights and 25 opinions you have relative to the licensee's processes.
NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 rho 0E ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. . 6 1 Wa'll be asking you to sort of walk us through 2 from the time you first started raising concerns to the 3 point where you thought the process first started failing 4 and get your retroactive insights into what you think may 5 have been the root of those problems and what you think 6 may be needed to correct them. And then we also want to l
7 focus on the same matters with regard to the Nuclear 1 8 Regulatory Commission, what your first dealings were with 9 ': cam and where you feel those processes either did or 10 didn't serve your needs. -
l 11 So with that introduction, I think our first 12 question would be to ask you to just focus on the 13 licensee's process and give us your thoughts on what went 14 wrong there and what you think needs to be done to 15 preclude that kind of problem in the future.
16 Contrary to what you may have 17 read, the utility's position in my case of being quote "a 18 troublesome alleger" was, in their opinion, a problem 19 involving overtime. That is incorrect. The problem that 20 I initially focused on was a problem whereby I had better 21 than average knowledge of reactor operator safety valves 22 which, under NRC Guidelines, had to be rewired to meet 3
23 various requirements of the NRC. That did involve 24 overtime, but it also required that I had worked all day l
25 on a refueling outage at Unit One, then was transferred NEAL R. GROSS l court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBdRS 1 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. . y 1 over to Unit Two to work some 20 1/2 hours which working 2 on the reactor safety systems at that point, te me, after 3 20 1/2 hours of a very exhaustive day, I complained about 4 it.
5 fly initial complaint was to r, gentleman by the 6 name of Ebe McCabe who at that time herded up Region One.
7 MR. HUEY: I gather your ysoint being it wasn't 8 complaining about lack of being pai(,, it was complaining 9 about the safety of the implicatio'/.s of excess overtime.
10 xa ct.ly . It was working on 11 safety-related absolutely necessary safety systems which 12 after 20 1/2 hours one simply it,not cognizant of many of 13 the things that are going on.
14 After my letter to Ebe McCabe which was, I 15 believe, in the month of Janua;ry of 1988, I believe, 16 shortly thereafter, within days, I was handed what the 17 company classified as a work a,ssignment which required me 18 to undertake a psychological examination which I have 19 since learned is not really endemic to Northeast 20 Utilities. It's somewhat of a pervasive debilitating 21 process used by many of the utilities to discredit or to .
I I
22 scare those people who are rais.ing safety concerns, l l
23 whether they be legitimate or not.
l l
24 It surprised me that .I was given that work '
25 assignment for three reasons basically. one, you probably l NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBE'RS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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l
. , 8 1 recognized now by my accent that I am a foreign ~ born 2 national. So when I became at the 3 time I was in the Navy and I was trying to get into the 4 Nuclear Navy, there was an exhaustive FBI check done on me 1 5 which obviously validated my position as being reasonably 6 honest, reasonably upright citizen so that I could proceed 7 with my become involved with the 8 Nuclear Navy. All of those turned out satisfactory. That l 9 was one reason.
10 When I became a reactor operator in the Navy l 11 in the nuclear submarines, FBMs in particularly, obviously 3
4 12 I went through a secret clearance there, so at that point, l 13 that was, I guess you would call it validation.
14 And thirdly, when I was hired by Northeast 4
4 15 Utilities, they, to my knowledge, undertook an exhaustive 16 security check on me which obviously validated that I was 17 a reasonable individual. That was important in a rather l j 18 funny way, simply because my wife found out that she 19 hadn't been living with a crazy man for several years.
20 Having said that, when I went into the quote 21 " psychological process," I walked in Doctor Mitchell's 22 office who was then the medical officer for Northeast 23 Utilities. His opening statement to me was that I was 24 there and he was there to determine my continued 25 suitability in the nuclear industry. Frankly, I was NEAL R. GROSS CoVRT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBfRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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. . 9 1 scared. I was afraid of my job. I was afraid that I 2 would lose my livelihood and be unable to support my 3 family.
4 That vindictive tone continued for about a 45 5 minute session. I was told in no uncertain terms that I 6 should not continue to raise safety concerns, and I raised 7 safety concerns other than nuclear. Many, many electric 8 code violations, NEC code violations. He said that I i 9 would not be looked favorable upon if I continued to do
< 10 so. Up to that point, I had previously worked in the I 11 Quality Control Department for Northeast Utilities.
12 To my knowledge, I can't prove this -- I can 13 prove what I had -- but to my knowledge, I was one, if not 14 the only person at Millstone, who had a full row across 15 the board rating in my evaluations. I think that was 16 unique at Millstone. I think it was unique within the 17 company. Shortly thereafter, my grades started to 18 decrease.
19 MR. HUEY: You said you had raised lots of 20 concerns. Had you been receiving four arrow performance 21 evaluations subsequent to your first raising concerns?
22 Ye . Absolutely.
23 MR. HUEY: Why all of a sudden do you view 24 that it changed? y l eft i 25 Well, because I think I was NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS ]
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. . 10 !
1 bacically holding tha fact of Northeast Utilities to their 2 own procedures. They had continuously and constantly and 3 without any fear of regulatory involvement did whatever 4 they wanted to do. I will try to build from here and I 5 will get to the NRC section in a minute.
6 I followed their grievance process. That is 7 exactly what the company wanted me to do because if you 8 follow either the procedural grievance process wi] thin the 9 company or what they have called their Nuclear Concerns 10 Program, if you follow that to the end, you will become 11 time barred under the DOL process. That is exactly what 12 they wanted me to do. That went on from July through 13 December and, of course, when I got no results from that, 14 I then went to the NRC to Bill Raymond and to Peter 15 Habighorst. Bill Raymond was very, very well aware of 16 what the DOL process was. Made absolutely no attempt to 17 in any way convey to me that I had to operate within 18 certain guidelines under Section 210 of the Energy 19 Reorganization Act.
20 What did that mean to me? I think I can best 21 exemplify to you and best give you an understanding of 22 what the end result of that would be. When our initial --
23 in my case, both were combined by the ALJ, the 24 Administrative Law Judge. Just prior to that process of 25 going into the courtroom with the ALJ, my attorney, N*
NEAL R. GROSS CoVRT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBfRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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y 11 l 1 ontacted Mr. Raymond and asked him would i
2 he provide some form of testimonial, either verbally, i
3 written or by an actual appearance in front of the ALJ, to j 4 at least validate the fact that I had gone to him and ,
i GN
! 5 asked for some advice. Mr. Raymond's response to was 4
.6 that NRC policy precluded such actions on his part, that 7 he did not want to become involved, that he wanted to l l' 8 maintain an attitude of fairness, of segregation from the
! l i 9 company. However, at the ALJ process he provided an l
.' l j 10 affidavit to the ALJ on behalf of'the company saying that i
j 11 the company had a valid process by which we could have l
! 12 taken our grievance to, that the company was on the right i
j 13 track and that, in fact, we should have taken our !
4 4
j 14 grievance to the company which, of course, I did. I l 15 exhausted that process but then I become time barred.
4 16 MR. THADANI: You said that Bill Raymond gave 17 an affidavit.
I 9.4 18 Yes, he did.
I tib 20 Yes.
21 MR. THADANI: Supporting --
22 The company's position.
23 MR. THADANI: -- NU's position?
I -th 24 Absolutely. That's on the I w 25 record.
NEAL R. GROSS ,
CoVRT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS I 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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12 1 MR. HUEY: Was that a concern that you 2 subsequently expressed to the NRC's Office of 3 Investigations?
g4(e 4 Yes.
5 MR. HUEY: So that was considered by them.
6 'e ll , I got no answer back, 1.-
if that was considered.
7 I guess it was. I think it has '
8 become standard in the repertoire of Region One that once l 1
9 you file a claim with the NRC, at least i.t was at that l
10 point through Bill Raymond mainly, that he took it l 11 directly to the company which has since been admitted and l
12 is a matter of public record. He received the company's 13 response back. I gave you the company's response. You 1
14 rebutted that response and it died on the vine. It went i 15 nowhere after that.
16 That raises, to me, some very, very important 17 issues. #1, the process of psychological testing of 18 employees who raise concerns should be totally and l I
19 unequivocally barred by the NRC. The fact that one raises 20 a legitimate safety concern and it is legitimate until it 21 is proven illegitimate, that does not give carte blanche 22 license to any licensee to force psychological testing on 23 that individual. That is a crime against humanity as far I
, 24 as I'm concerned.
25 MR. HUEY: Can you expand briefly on what your NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIB5RS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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13 1 opinion or understanding of exactly what prompted the I
2 utility to recommend the psychological evaluation?
3 My understanding from Jack l
j 4 Keenan, who was the Unit Superintendent at the time, was i
j 5 the fact that because I had raised so many concerns of l 6 safety significance, he questioned my stability or my l l
7 ability to raise such concerns. That's what I was told. (
8 MR. HUEY: What do you believe? !
Mb 9 I believe that the company j l 10 was being profiled in a public manner and that our cases i
? 11 were solid, were provable, and they had to do anything 12 possible to discredit any alleger. They even refused to 13 call us whistle blowers in front of a state legislative 1
14 hearing. They called us allegers, which I objected to.
h !
15 16 17 18 19 20 21 MR. HUEY: Was February of '88 your first 22 going to the NRC? WaP that your first --
23 lieve the letter was in 24 January of '88.
25 MR. HUEY: Yes. January 2, '88.
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- .. ,=- . . - . ._ . . - . _
l l d'l 14 !
1 Yes.
2 MR. HUEY: The timing sequence that I'm trying 1 3 to focus on is you were referred to Doctor Mitchell more ;
4 or less about ',
5 I believe, but i 6 it could be the 7 MR. HUEY: Early And you l 8 were told that it was strictly due to the number of 1
9 concerns that I guess the company viewed as being spacious a
j 10 concerns or trivial concerns o what?
11 They were never classified as i
j 12 spacious or trivial. They were classified as concerns.
l l 13 The numbers were exorbitantly high of concerns. To the 14 best of my recollection, they were never classified at all i
j 15 other than the fact that there was an extraordinary number 1
16 of concerns raised. That was Jack Keenan's position.
l i
l 17 Doctor Mitchell's position was that he was there to i
j 18 determine whether or not I was suited to continue my
! 19 employment in the nuclear udustry.
l 20 MR. HUEY: I guess just on the surface that t
- 21 would appear to defy logic that just the number of
! 22 concerns. I mean it would only seem to make sense if they l
23 were maintaining that you were just raising nonsense for 24 the purpose of being disruptive.
25 I I hink the best way to
- NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE. N W.
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i , ,
15 1 encwar that question is look at the DOL findings. The 2 initial finding in the DOL hearing was that A) I was 3 harassed, discriminated and intimidated by Jack Keenan and 4 by Northeast Utilities supervisors and coworkers because I 5 raised concern. That was validated in my first DOL 6 hearing.
7 MR. HUEY: All right. Well, maybe I shouldn't j 8 beat arer.nd the bush. I guess the connection that I'm
) 9 trying to draw and get your opinion is it's my 10 understanding from reviewing your files that January of 11 '88 was your first occasion to go to the NRC, and I'm
. 12 trying to understand if you're of any opinion that your 1
i 13 having gono to the NRC pushed the utility over the line of 14 --
15 Ye , there's no question
- 16 about it.
17 MR. HUEY: Okay. So it wasn't just the fact 18 that you had raised a lot of concerns. You think that 19 maybe the precipitating event having them referring you to i
20 the physician was the fact that you went to the tac then?
21 Jack Keenan told me right out 4 22 I should have not written the letter to Ebe McCabe.
23 MR. HUEY: How would he know about that?
%'t' 24 Because Ebe McCabe contacted I
25 him and Mr. Raymond contacted him.
NEAL R. GROSS court REPoRTEMS AND TRANSCRBEIRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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i 16
, 1 MR. HUEY: Okay. ,
sp '
\
2 Which I think raises some 4
3 serious ethical problems wi] thin the regulatory agency.
t 4 MR. HUEY: So for the clarity of the record
)
5 then, it's your position that you having gone to the NRC l 6 is really what precipitated your being asked to go have a 7 medical examination.
8 Yes.
9 MR. HUEY: Okay.
10 Shortly thereafter, they
- 11 attempted -- well, sometime later, I think it was in May l i
4 12 that a second attempt was made to subject me to a 2
13 psychological exam. This occurred by Mr. Walker, who was j 14 then an attorney for Northeast Utilities from one of the 15 Washington' law firms. I forget exactly which one. I think it's now Winston and Strawn but it wasn't at that 16 17 point. He showed up at the medical director's office in 18 Millstone demanding my records, to see my records.
19 MR. THADANI: Let me ask a question. When 20 they wanted you to undergo medical psychological 21 examination, how did they do this? Was there a process 22 whereby you were notified or what's the mechanism?
23 was handed a letter by my 24 immediate supervisor whose name was Harry James Ferriell 25 which basically gave to me a written work assignment to go NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIB8RS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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17 1 diractly to Doctor Mitchell's office from tle Millstone 2 Plant to the Berlin office where Doctor Mitchell was 3 housed. Of course, I complied because it was a work 4 assignment.
5 Sometime in May that same process, like I
'6 said, was tried again. Mr. Keenan and Mr. Walker, the 7 attorney representing, showed up at the health director's 8 Millstone office, whose name was Nurse Marien, I believe, 9 who by the way, is presently undergoing some horrendous 10 HNID processes at Northeast Utilities. She refused to 11 give up the records. She was ordered by her boss at 12 Berlin to send all my records to Northeast Utilities 13 office, Doctor Mitchell's office. She was so cencerned at 14 the time that the. records would be changed that she 15 ordered one of her nurses to completely photostat my total 16 medical file and remove it offsite. That I absolutely 17 know was done. Whether or not the records changed, I 18 don't know. I never saw the records again. They were, to 19 my knowledge, and probably still are a part of Doctor 20 Mitchell's -- well, Doctor Mitchell is no longer there, I 21 don't believe, but they're probably still a part of that 22 file in Berlin somewhere.
23 So I don't want to lose my train of thought 24 here. After the DOL hearing, and this was a continuing i
25 process, as soon as it became public knowledge that I had l I
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. _ . - . . - . . - - - ~ . - . _
18 l 1 filed DOL complaints, the harassment and intimidation I l
i i
2 increased logarithmically. It was, in my opinion, a 3 sanction process, not only sanctioned but deeply j ,
4 encouraged by front line supervisors and by senior l f 5 managers to isolate, harass and intimidate. This took 1
! 6 many forms. l i 7 In the form of the company, from the l
I 8 standpoint of, shall we say, executive management, not l
i 9 only did the psychological testing profile take place, but I
j 10 they ordered a complete background check. Excuse me.
I 11 12 i 13 which I deeply resent. I mean I thought we did not live J
l 14 in a Gulag state. I was at that point that we were. They i
l 15 investigated my family, my background, and that's what
- 16 surprised me more because of the horrendous and exhaustive 17 searches that had been undertaken by FBI, by Naval 18 intelligence, and by NU themselves.
1 20 21 That is a gaffe 22 of enormous proportions. That is totally unacceptable to 23 me.
24 All of those concerns were brought to Bill 25 Raymond. Bill Raymond sat on his ass and didn't do NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCR!BERS
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? .. . ,
_.._m __ .__ ___ _ . _ . . _ . _ . . _
19 l 1 onything about it. Not only didn't do anything about 2 that, he actually circumvented and fed all of my l 3 communications directly back to the company.
4 MR. HUEY: One point I meant to confirm when '
I 5 you were mentioning the initial harassment and ;
- 6 intimidation by NU. When you first went to the NRC, were I
\
5 7 you immediately advised of your DOL rights?
th 8 Never. The gentleman who l 9 advised me that a DOL process even existed was a gentleman 1 l
10 by the name of who was an instrument lab 11 technician. He told me the DOL process existed.
12 MR. HUEY: When was that?
13 t was some time, I think, in 14 the May or June deadline of '88. The NRC never advised me 15 that a DOL process existed until way down the road when we 16 were already in front of ALJs several times. Keep in mind 17 that I was in front of an ALJ five or six different times 18 with various complaints.
19 N.i. HUEY: So you ended up going to DOL in 20 July, I believe, of '88. g(p 21 I think it was July. I think GL 22 it was May or June that old me about the DOL 23 process existed.
24 MR. HUEY: And who was he again? I'm sorry.
25 at that NEAL R. GROSS coVM REPoMERS NO TRANSCRSCRS 1323 RHoDE lSLAND AVE., N W.
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, 20 1 particular time worked as an instrument test technician, I i 2 guess I would call him. in the Instrument Laboratory of l
l 3 INC Unit 2.
i
{
~g '
4 MR. HUEY: So it's the same 5 It's the same 6 It's the same hat whole mess subsequently 4
7 led to a four day hearing, I believe, when the NRC finally
- 8 thought that something at least to show the public that 9 they were at least casually interested in straightening I i 10 out the Millstone mess. ,
11 nd another gentleman by the name of/ n
- 12 relation and never was an NU employee, met with four i
i 13 gentleman, Jack Durr, Fitzgerald, Blumberg, and Guy I
14 Vissing at a Howard Johnson Motel in Niantic.
l 15 That was quite interesting for the fact that i
1 16 we had a hell of a time trying to keep them awake.
, 17 Vissing slept more often than he was awake. Fitzgerald
] 18 I'm not even sure was sober, and he only lasted a part of i 19 a day. Blumberg was probably one of the most obnoxious I 20 individuals I ever met in my life. I think I would j 21 classify him as, to paraphrase Archie Bunker, he made me i
j 22 feel like I wanted to go throw up on somebody else's
! 23 shoes. Jack Durr, Jacque Durr, I guess, who presently
/
l 24 heads up the so-called exhaustive investigation at i
! 25 Millstone, clearly fed most of the information back to NU.
i l NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBl!RS S
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. . - - - -. . . .- ..~-- -. - . -- -- . - - __ -.
-)
21 1 Thsy hed procsocad what thsy wanted to procaco and uesd
~
1 2 all that information to discredit us. j i
3 'So I guess in summary, and I'll let you guys !
4 answer the question, there's a few recommendations, if 5 that's what you want to say. I think the initial
.l 1
6 suggestion I might make that needs to be cured is during I 7 OI investigations of HNID, the licensee must absolutely be 8 precluded from having their attorneys present under the 9 pretext'that they're there representing the employees.
10 Those employees are intimidated. The alleger's attorney 11 is barred from there. The alleger is barred from there.
12 The attorneys get all the information they want and they 13 use to discredit.
14 First of all, I think that raises some serious 15 legal consequences that the NRC may want to address to the 16 local bar commission, but I think at the very least that 17 is an intolerable and vindictive and miserable situation 18 that has to be barred.
19 I think another recommendation I would make, 20 that is if and when the DOL's initial finding is in favor 21 of the complainant, that the NRC should then post a cease l 22 and desist order at various conspicuous places throughout 23 the plant forbidding management and employees from 24 continued harassment and intimidation and as a corollary j 25 and a follow-up to that, I think it is imperative that NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCN98R8 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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4
. . 22 1 individual managara and individual employees be held , ,
l 2 criminally, civilly and financially responsible for !
3 continued harassment after the initial DOL finding if it's
- 4 in favor of the individual.
1 5 MR. HUEY: Are you aware of NRC's enactment,of 6 the 50.5 regulation?
i &y 7 with all due respect, sir, l
8 I'm -- of the NRC and they haven't done a damn thing for
- 9 me. There's nobody within the NRC agency I trust at this I 10 stage.
i i
ll 11 MR. HUEY: But I guess the only point that I'm j l
- 12 trying to clarify is the individuals who discriminated or a
} 13 who were involved in your claim of discrimination --
e +W 14 ,
It's not a claim. I mean it
- /
~
15 was proven by DOL. It's not a claim.
16 MR. HUEY: I always say that in that the NRC 17 concluded that it wasn't discrimination.
18 he NRC did not conclude 19 that.
20 MR. HUEY: Well, the NRC took no 1
21 discrimination enforcement act on.
22 There's a vast difference.
23 MR. HUEY: I lost my train of thought. Oh.
i
! 24 the point I was trying to determine was the individuals
- 25 that committed those acts preceded the regulation that i
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23 1 would provida individual accountability and holding tha 2 individual accountable. Now that that rule is in place, 3 there is the regulatory framework to --
4 f you believe that that's an 5 effective situation, in the words of Dan Rather, you'll 6 believe that rocks grow. That same discrimination, 7 harassment and intimidation, and passing of nasty letters 8 and 3:00 in the morning telephone calls and nasty pictures i
9 are continuing to this hour at Millstone Plants. So don't 10 be naive.
11 MR. HUEY: So you're saying that even with 12 that regulation, the NRC today still isn't enforcing it.
13 Absolutely not, and I don't 14 believe have any intention of enforcing that. I think the 15 whole concept of private investigations should be 16 sanctioned by a judge, and I think the NRC has a part to 17 play in that. If such a tactic is allowed, then I think 18 that has to be taken out of the hands of the utility and 4
19 something very similar to seeking a warrant would have to 20 be sought and approved by a magistrative judge so that 21 that kind of a process can continue legally, ethically, 22 and morally, and I think the NRC has been hopelessly inept 23 for the oversight of the enforcement of any of those 24 regulations.
25 I'think that the whole concept of the nuclear NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBCRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. , 24 1 concerno progrcm end the process of the grievance , j 2 procedure within the company structure has to be abolished 3 because that precludes, automatically precludes an j 4 individual going to the Labor Department. The NRC has to 5 be involved with the Labor Department. They have taken a 6 hands-off position, at least in my case, until such time !
7 as the DOL finding. And then it was a passive, 8 genuflection in the direction hopefully to soothe raw 9 nerves. j 10 And most important, I think, of all, to ask l l
11 the region -- and I specifically talk about Region I here 12 although I have talked, by the way, to whistle blowers at
)
13 Palo Verde, I've talked to whistle blowers in the 14 Tennessee valley, so this is a constant and accepted i 15 process, but to ask the region to regulate themselves is 16 asking the fox to guard the hen house.
17 MR. RUEY: Who do you mean regulate 18 themselves?
19 Th Bill Raymonds and tne 20 Region I have adequately proven to all whistle blowers at 21 Millstone, and we are increasing in numbers daily, that 22 they are entrenched on the side of the utility. Don't 23 ever be surprised if five or six or seven years down the 24 road that Bill Raymond will end up working for Northeast 25 Utilities just like one of your board members, just like NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRSIRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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1 25 1 Mr. Curtio who wne o commissioner and went to work for 2 Winston and Strawn who was, by the way, directly involved 3 in my case.
4 There is such a thing, as you all know, as a l
l 5 China Wall in the legal process. That was never adhered j 1
6 to in Winston and Strawn in my case. That was blatantly, 1 7 if not immoral, certainly unethical. The NRC sat on their 8 hands and didn't do a darn thing about it. It was brought I 9 up at an NRC meeting right here at the Radisson Hotel in !
10 New London. I brought it up. Other whistle blowers I 11 brought it up.
12 MR. HUEY: This was before Mr. Lieberman and 13 his group? y 14 Yes. That's another -- well, 15 I will not comment on Mr. Lieberman. You have to ask OI 16 and IG and, by the way, I absolutely convinced and I think 17 most whistle blowers are although I'm not speaking for 18 anybody else other than myself. If you do not combine OI 19 and IG, you are not going to get an independent, concrete, 20 fair minded investigation. The region is hopelessly 21 biased on the side of the utility. They are controlled by 22 the Taylors, by the Martins, by the Russells, by the 23 Wensingers, by the Kelleys, by the Ebe McCabes of this 24 world who, as far as I'm concerned, have no business in 25 the public service. Unless you combine both of those NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. . 26 1 cgancios cnd lot thcm do tha invostigation, OIG, you are ,
2 never going to get to the root of the problem at Millstone 3 or the Millstones of this world.
4 Any questions you have, shoot.
5 MR. HUEY: Well, I guess one question I would 6 have, I thought the thrust of your comment was that OI 7 coming under the Executive Director for Operation, that is 8 the fox guarding the hen house, and you've got to get OI 9 separate from the staff.
Chg 10 Yes.-
11 MR. HUEY: But I thought it was also your 12 point that you weren't satisfied with IG's investigations 13 either. Now I'm kind of confused.
-- qw b 14 No. I'm not saying that. I L_ -
15 think Mr. Williams did a commendable job in his l 16 investigations. I talked personally with Mr. Williame on 17 a few occasions. You have to get it out of the Taylor 18 mode. You have to get the investigative process away from 19 Taylor, away from Russell, away from Martin. Well, Martin 20 is basically history, I guess. But those are the issues 21 that you need to address. You have to somehow combine OI 22 and IG that they're totally independent out from the 23 control of the Executive Director.
24 MR. HUEY: Did you take any issues or concerns 25 to IG?
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! i gjbs 27 1 Yes, and OI.
i 2 MR. HUEY: I'm familiar with the concerns that t
- 3 you took to OI. I'm not familiar with any concerns you I J
4 took to IG.
mb 5 There were several I took to I 6 Mr. Williams directly.
7 MR. HUEY: I see. Can you just share what the l i
l 8 nature was? l 3 44y '
9 I would rather heed to that.
{ 10 MR. HUEY: I'm sorry? i 11 I would rather heed to that.
i 12 I think that's a matter of record, and there was some l
13 confidentiality involved there that I think that should be ;
14 addressed to both Mr. Hadley and Mr. Williams.
l 4
i
! 15 MR. HUEY: I see. Okay. Because those
)
- 16 records were not available in the files.
17 I can't tell you that.
18 MR. HUEY: But you were happy with what IG did j 19 on the things that --
e+ y 20 Yes. Basically I was. At
) 21 least I think that they -- I think they walked a political
- 22 tightrope, to be frank about it, but I think that they did t
4 i 23 a commendable job in the main part.
I 24 MR. HUEY: Did they respond to you or --
25 Th y responded in this way.
! NEAL R. GROSS i court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBl!RS
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4 28 j 1 The report that I saw that IG started the whole process 2 that Mr. Williams handed out.
3 MR. HUEY: Oh , on t-he whole allegation?
4 On the whole allegation 4
5 process. I think that was a very commendable effort.
l 6 MR. HUEY: But that was separate from a
! 7 specific concern you had raised, or were you part of that?
e I was part of that.
4 9 MR. HUEY: I see.
&J 10 I was part of that.
! 11 MR. HUEY: Did IG directly share with you the 1
J
- 12 results of any of the specific concerns you took to them?
13 The results of their finding 1
14 were shared with a group of us.
j 15 MR. HUEY: I see. , ,
i +% v 16 ktagroupmeeting.
j 17 MR. HUEY: Did anything come of their i
i 18 conclusions? ,
19 I hink that report was one 20 of the things that came out of those meetings. We met, by 21 the way, with both Mr. Williams and Mr. Norton. Both.
22 MR. HUEY: So I gather most of your concerns 23 were process oriented on the entire processes rather than 24 some individual has done something wrong and should be 25 investigated. You referred to your dissatisfaction with NEAL R. GROSS CoVRT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBdRS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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29 1 tha individuals --
2 I raised that specific l
i 3 allecAtion to Mr. Williams specifically on Mr. Raymond, 4 and what I categorized as, if not collusion with the 5 company -- I'm not an attorney -- that certainly it raised )
6 the possibility of some ethical concerns that there was a 7 closeness that existed or that appeared to exist which 8 precluded fair regulatory oversight.
l 9 MR. HUEY: Did IG ever share their conclusions l
10 on that concern with you?
11 No.
12 MR. HUEY: What is your opinion of the I
13 chilling effect letters? Are those of any value at all?
! 14 The NRC issued a couple of those basically after each of 15 the DOL findings.
l I6 obody paid any attention to
- 17 the NRC letters because everybody accepted the fact that 18 -- you have to understand. Once that affidavit appeared i 19 from Bill Raymond in court, which was published by several
- 20 newspapers, ew,rybody who had raised or was about to raise 1
21 a concern at Millstone knew exactly that the NRC was not 22 on their side. So anything the NRC said had no value.
23 I think one of the problems that I had trying 24 to verbalize -- you know, I once said to Bill Raymond. I
- 25 said, I speak three languages well and for some reason I NEAL R. GROSS ,
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. . 30 ,
k 1 ccn't gst ceroso to you. It seemed like the man just shut 2 certain things off and you knew that he wasn't going to ;
3 share important information, but as soon as you walked out 4 his door, he was going directly to the company. So as 4
5 soon as it was published in the newspaper that he provided 6 an affidavit, anything the NRC said about chilling effect 7 was a joke. Nobody paid any attention to it, and that is 8 still the mentality at Millstene, and I'm sure many of the l
9 Millstones of this world.
]
10 You gentlemaa unfortunately are not trusted.
11 That's a fact of life. Nobody trusts the NRC because you 12 have proven over and over -- and I'm not saying you 13 individually, I'm saying you as an agency from Taylor all 14 the way down to Wensinger and Kelley and the McCabes and 15 everybody else in this life. It is absolutely a certainty 16 that people know that if you go to the NRC, within 15 l
17 minutes the company is going to know exactly what 18 transpired in that quote, " confidential" office.
19 My first conversation with Peter Habighorst 20 was I walked in the door and I had no idea what the hell 6%l#
21 he was doing. He said, you have nothing to worry 22 about. The NRC will protect you to the utmost. That was 23 the most fallacious and unbelievable and unsupported 24 argument I had ever heard. That guy should have been 25 flogged at the stake. Although, in all fairness to Mr.
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31 1 Hrbighorce, ha wno on2 of tha fsw psople, I think, that et 2 least gave some genuflection in the direction of 3 supporting us when Northeast Utilities hired a consultant 4 to say we were disruptive employees. I think Mr.
5 Habighorst, if I remember correctly, really said that he 6 thought it was either biased or one-sided, and I would 7 have to agree with Mr. Habighorst at that point, I think.
8 MR. HUEY: Of your several suggestions that 9 you went through on the NRC improving its process, if you 10 had to pick the most important one, what do you view as --
- htb 11 I would have to pick two.
12 From the company standpoint, the NRC should not allow 13 company attorneys to quote " supposedly represent" 14 employees at hearings, either because they will eventually 15 claim quote " client / attorney privilege" --
16 MR. HUEY: And you're largely referring, I i
17 guess, to OI investigations?
18 Yes. Exactly. And I think 19 I've been through that. And secondly, I think that OI and 20 IG have to be somehow combined and totally separated from 21 the Executive Director and those sub-people who regulate.
22 Take it out of the hands of the region of the Executive 23 Director.
24 MR. HUEY: Let me get your reaction to my 25 surprise at that answer. I would have thought you would l l
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. . 32 I have said that the most important thing that the NRC needs 2 to do is to hold individuals who discriminate accountable 4 1
3 for their act. !
(S * :
, 4 That's a part of your 4
5 charter. I shouldn't have to tell you that.
i 6 MR. HUEY: I know, but I'm thinking certainly l
. 7 one of the conclusions that we're focusing on and we're 8 developing as a result of this review is the enforcement 9 process. l 10 I think that's redundant. I 11 think that has been hashed over by every whistle blower l
. 12 who's ever lived. We know the NRC doesn't enforce their I 13 regulations. I think it's redundant for me to keep i
I
- 14 stating that they, in fact, don't do that. Live by your 15 charter. That should be an accepted part of your charter, 16 of your mission. You don't do it.
17 MR. HUEY: Getting OI to work better sort of 18 after the fact, that's saying that once problems have 19 occurred that the agency isn't effectively investigating 1
20 them, which --
- s 6S(
21 I think that's an 22 understatement. The agency has never effectively 4
23 instituted any kind of a fair-minded, honest evaluation 24 and if such an evaluation did take place, they will not, i
25 in fact, always come down on the side of the employee or NEAL R. GROSS court REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. . 33
, 1 tha allegar or whetover you want to call it, the whistle 2 blower. The whistle blower could, in fact, be wrong but 3 if I remember my citizenship correctly, our Constitution
. 4 allows us to be wrong if we honestly believe that that's 5 thc case. The NRC does not grant you that position. Has 6 not granted that. position. The NRC has never said to me, s th 7 you have a right to be wrong. They have told me that 8 I shouldn't be filing complaints with them many, many 9 times. That's my right. I think I have a valid point.
10 MR. THADANI: The NRC has --
^
Ebb 11 The NRC has many, many times
- J 12 flatly stated to me and to other whiatle blowers that I'm 13 aware of at Millstone, you should go through the company ic process. Don't come to us. As a matter of fact, l 15 Wensinger threatened me that he would personally have the 16 agency Region I take action if I continued to bypass the 17 company process and go directly to Region I. That was 18 another unveiled threat.
19 MR. TRADANI: That's a surprise.
20 eL That was an unveiled threat.
21 MR. HUEY: That's clear on the record. That's 22 very well established. And that was the NRC's policy at 23 the time, and it still is to a large degree.
24 MR. THADANI: Are you saying that the NRC's 25 policy --
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4
! . . 34 l
1 MR. HUEY: No. I'm not saying that. I'm 2 saying that the record is clearly established that the NRC 3 told th he should be taking his concerns
! 4 to the licensee rather than bringing them all the NRC.
5 And when I did, I was 6 harassed. When I followed their procedure, I was harassed j 7 and I was time bought into the dol process. I rest my 8 case.
j 9 MR. HUEY: Okay. Does anybody else have some 10 specific follow-up questions?
l l
- 11 MR. HANNON: Yes. I want to get your reaction 12 to one concern that came up in past interviews that the j 13 result of your whistle blowing activities has put you in a
! 14 position where you potentially could have a fear for your i
l 15 safety, both from the standpoint of the work place and l
l i
16 even some thought that maybe things could happen to you I
17 outside of the work place. Did you ever encounter any
! 18 reason to have that kind of a concern?
19 Ye , I did. Several t mes.
20 i L 21 l
22 l
23 e
l NEAL R. GROSS .
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l
! , , 35 l
3 1
l s
6 8
me Whether that was valid or not, you know, I'm a firm i
j 9 believer that if you tell somebody something long enough l 10 and often enough, they will eventually believe that.
11 Clearly, many of the past known nuclear disasters, shall i
12 we say, crept into my process of thought for a while even 13 though I think that my background suggests that you can
}
4 14 deal with adequately with those kind of quote j
l 15 "inconveniencas," veiled threats, whatever you want to p
16 call them.
17 But yes, to answer your question, for at least 18 three to three and a half years, I was absolutely 19 convinced that 20 21 MR. HANNON: Do you have any knowledge that 22 kind of fear mentality or environment still exists at 23 Millstone?
(
24 Yes. I've no doubt that it 25 does. I speak to people and I actively help some of the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRISIRS 1323 rho 0E ISLAND AVE., N W.
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36 1 p;oplo et Milletona. In particulcr, one parcon at 2 Connecticut Yankee and person at Millstone that I have 3 helped over a period of ycars. They have on several l 4 occasions let me know that they were afraid for their F
5 life, that something would happen, maybe something less 6 severe, but they certainly lived in a caldron of fear for l 7 some period of time occasionally, more often than 8 occasionally and whenever. And those people still are at 9 Millstone today.
10 MR. HUEY: Is your opinion that either within d
11 the licensee organization or within the NRC structure that 12 things are moving in the right direction or moving in the 13 right direction or no change from the time that you were 14 directly involved? Are any lessons being learned from 15 your experience or do you think it's still --
16 I think that the safety 17 issues are totally and irrevocably out of control at 18 Millstone. I think that the documentation that's come up 19 in the last year, not just because Millstone is now on the 20 watch list, but statements from the chief operating 21 officer of *.he company that whistle blowers are a cancer 22 within the organization which is a matter of public 23 record, how can one actually understand that arrogance, 24 that vindictiveness? It's become a joke in The Hartford 25 Current, in The New London Day, in The New Haven Register, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND MANSCRBERS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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. . 37 1 in Tho Norwich Bullctin. It's what is now people refer to 2 you're not even in the nuclear industry. Problem of the 3 day at Millstone. There's a new problem every day. I 4 think it was yesterday there was a problem with the .
5 ventilation system in Unit I. There was a concrete 6 problem in Unit 3 where there's a severe erosion taking 7 place in the foundation, and I heard on the radio tonight 8 on the way down here somebody from Stone and Wabster who 9 was the contractor saying, well, maybe we picked concrete 10 that was not compatible, that there was some kind of 11 corrosive involvement, a chemical reaction to the two 12 different types of concrete. It's the problem of the day.
13 It's a joke. To answer your question, it has 14 gotten exponentially worse since I left Millstone. The 15 harassment is alive and well, more sophisticated, but more 16 pervasive. How do you cure it? From the standpoint of 17 the NRC, I think you've got to get rid of Taylor, Russell 18 and Martin would be a good start. From the standpoint of 19 the utilities, I think that you've got to get rid of Fox 20 and Busch and you've got to somehow get the U.S. Attorney 21 involved to criminally indict people like Ellis, who was l 22 the CEO before Fox, and Fox and Busch and two other of the i 23 senior managers, I think neither of whom are presently 24 within the company. John Opeka is one.
25 MR. HUEY: This is because of their harassment NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIS$RS 1323 rho 0E ISLAND AVE.. N W.
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38 1 cnd -- g 2 ecause of their harassment 3 and their sanctioned harassment and their encouragement of
, 4 employees at all levels, both coworkers, line managers, 5 middle managers and superintendents, vice presidents, to 6 put in place a sophisticated, ongoing and vindictive 7 process of harassment, intimidation, and discrimination.
8 It is totally out of control. Safety problems are there.
9 They operate with no possibility of NRC ever holding them 10 to account.
11 It is what I call -- I remember when I was 12 studying philosophy in my college days, I took a courss in 13 sociology and one of the things that the professor said to l l
14 me, we have a process known as the problem of solutions, 15 and I will try to explain that to you like this. This is 16 a rather naive characterization, but if you had one person 17 who was a criminal and you had two policemen, if they 18 completely eliminate all criminal activity, they have done 19 themselves out of a job. If you have one person on 20 welfare and you have a welfare agent who completely 21 eliminates that individual, you have no job.
22 I think the NRC is of the same vein. They 23 have to protect -- at least they're giving the impression 24 of protecting the company, safeguarding the 25 confidentiality and the company quote " image" to the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIB8RS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N W.
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l 39 1 datrimant of those raining legitimmte safoty coinplainto. I 2 It almost seems like you have a problem of solutions. If 3 they eliminate the utility or they shut them down, they 1 l
l i
4 have no job. That may be an exaggeration, but I think it i 5 leads you in the path of what I think most of the people l 6 at the Millstones think of the NRC, at least in my region.
7 ,
1 8 MR. HUEY: Well, I think you've been very 9 clear. Your points have been articulated and certainly 10 difficult to misunderstand. I asked the questions that I 11 have. I certainly recognize your sacrifice to be with us 12 here this evening. I don't want to draw this out.
13 I onsider it a public l 14 service. I don't consider it a sacrifice. I think it's a 15 necessary thing and I think if we just cure one of the 16 ills, we have made a major, major step forward.
17 MR. HANNON: Let me follow up on your point 18 about the utility, trying to help it get well. You made a 19 recommendation that they replace the top management. l 20 That, by the way, was also 21 the recommendation at the --
22 MR. HANNON: -- board meeting?
23 - the board meeting, this 24 past board meeting.
25 MR. HANNON: Stockholders.
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, , , g,4h 40 l 1 Stockholders meeting. I'm l 2 sorry.
3 MR. HANNON: Okay. Do you have any other r
! 4 thoughts on what needs to be done there to clean that 1 1 5 place up?
Gh
- 6 ,
Yes. I think the point that i 7 he was -- you recall, he was surprised that I did not make t
8 that I think it is imperative that the employees, the 9 coworkers, be held accountable under CFR process that 10 harassment, intimidation, that they not be permitted to do 11 that. I think, at least in Millstone when I was there, l 12 that was not only ongoing, but it was encouraged by all 13 levels of management and that's where -- have any of you 14 people lived for five years going into work every day and 15 nobody would talk to you? Think about that for a while. l 16 Try it out some time.
l 18 so I'm prepared for silence and I'm 19 prepared for being shunned and I have a good enough 20 background in philosophy and psychology to know and to 21 cope with things like that. But it does, it does get to 22 you after a while. It really does. Like I said, the :
23 salvation to me that my wife decided that I was totally 24 sane, and that was my #1 concern really. A lot of people 25 lose their home, their marriages, their livelihood.
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41 s s 1 That's something they tried on us, but I think that we 2 persisted and we always told the truth. We weren't always 3 correct, by the way. That doesn't mean we were lying. We
- 4 were at times proven incorrect and unsubstantiated but for 5 the majority of the part we exposed horrendous public 6 safety concerns that were never addressed, either by the
- 7 company or by the NRC.
{ 8 I thank you very much for your time. I hope I
, 9 was some help and if there's any follow-up, John, feel 10 free to call me. I'm not difficult to get hold of, but 11 you have to call me after 6:30 at night because I'm not 12 home But if
. 13 there are any questions that anybody wants to follow up 14 on, if you call me between 6:30 and 11:30 at night, I'll 4
i 15 do my best to answer any follow-up questions you have.
g 16 MR. HANNON: Okay. I want to thank you for 17 being here with us and give you this little guidance 18 document on how we're going to process this transcript.
19 I ave no problem, John, with 20 this going on the public record.
) 21 MR. HANNON: Okay. You would like to avail J
22 yourself of the opportunity to read it and make ,
23 clarification.
24 ure. I would like to do 25 that.
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a ,a 42 1 MR. HANNON: Wa'll arranga that after we get 2 the transcript back. With that, the time is approximately 3 9:10. We'll conclude this interview.
4 (Whereupon, the interview was concluded at 5 9:15 p.m.)
6 7
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20 l 21 22 l
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<: **o i -
CERTIFICATE This is to certify that the attached proceedings before the United States Nuclear
, Regulatory Commission in the matter of:
- Name of Proceeding
- INTERVIEW OF 7 Docket Number: (NOT ASSIGNED)
Place of Proceeding: MYSTIC, CT l l
were held as herein appears, and that this is the original i
transcript thereof for the file of the United States Nuclear Regulatory Commission taken by me and, thereafter reduced to i
typewriting by me or under the direction of the court reporting company, and that the transcript is a true and a
accurate record of the foregoing proceedings. ,
f '
f 'r 1,\ ^ek JEFFREY '
INS
'Officia , Reporter Neal R. Gross and Co., Inc.
1 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRWSCRBERS 1323 RHoDE ISLAND AVENUE, NW g 4 234 4433 WASHINGTON. D C. 20006 (204 N