ML20002E123
| ML20002E123 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Allens Creek File:Houston Lighting and Power Company icon.png |
| Issue date: | 01/13/1981 |
| From: | Atomic Safety and Licensing Board Panel |
| To: | |
| References | |
| NUDOCS 8101260472 | |
| Download: ML20002E123 (82) | |
Text
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NUCLEAR REGUIATO R COMMISSION I
9 t
In the Met: tar of HOUSTON LIGHTING & POWER COMPANY )
)
DOCKET NO. 50-466 Allena Creek Nuclear Generating
)
Station, Unit 1
)
m: January 13, 1981 PAGES': 2122 thru 2202 g Wallis, Texas d
6J JAN 2 31981 >.-
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. M NT N.Y O
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+400 Vi ginia Ave., 5.W. W= @ d ag ::n, D. C. 20 024 q
Telephone: (202) 554-2345 c
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$8 L
8101260
2122
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UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2
NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3
-X 4
In the Matter of:
5 HOUSTON LIGHTING & POWER 3
COMPANY Docket No. 50-466
]
6 Allens Creek Nuclear Generating E
7 Station, Unit 1 g
j 8
x d
d 9
American Legion Hall i
Post 200 10 330 Legion Road
_3 Wallis, Texas g
11 B
Tuesday j
12 January 13, 1981
=3 5
13 Pursuant to notice, the above-entitled matter came m
=g 1-4 on for hearing at 2:00 p.m.
2 15 APPEARANCES:
j 16 Board Members:
m g
17 SHELDON J. WOLFE, Esq., Chairman 5
Administrative J4dge y
18 Atomic Safety and Licensing Board Panel E
U.
S.
Nuclear Regulatory Commission I9 g
Washington, D.
C.
20555 n
20 GUSTAVE A.
LINENBERGER Administrative Judge 21 Atomic Safety and Licensing Board Panel U.
S.
Nuclear Regulatory Commission 22 Washington, D.
C.
20555 23 DR.
E.
LEONARD CHEATUM Administrative Judge 24 Route 3, Box 350A Watkinsville, Georgia 30677 l
l t
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2123 1
For the NRC Staff:
2 RICHARD L.
BLACK, Esq.
U.
S.
Nuclear Regulatory Commission 3
Washington, D.
C.
20555 I
4 For the Applicant, Houston Lighting & Power Company:
e 5
h J.
GREGORY COPELAND, Esq.
]
6 Baker & Botts One Shell Plaza 7
Houston, Texas 77002 3]
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ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2124 lEEEE i
STATEMENT BY PAGE NO.
Terry L.
Mikeska 2128 3
R.
E.
Houlihan 2130 4
Dick Schinnow 2133
.e 5
5 2137 J hn Abell 6
Linda Kellner 2139 7
Annie Orsak 2141 8
9 George Thielemann 2142 z
h 10 Ellenor H.
Link 2147 z
jj Leslie K.
Page 2149 m
d 12 Richard Hranicky 2153 E
Anna Mae Brazda 2155 13 S
E 14 Frank S.
Zurek 2156
- s 2
15 Doris Nesbitt 2160 g
16 Herman Clay 2162 as(
17 Frank J.
and Louise Rejsek 2166 M
18 Jerry Sliva 2167 5{
19 Bill Robinson 2170 a
20 Earline Goebel 2174 21 Betty Hein 2176 22 Leonard Kolodziejczyk 2178 23 !
Gene W.
Eschenburg 2181 24 Jim Walters 2184 j
Leona Cope 2188 25 l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
l 2124(a) 1 STATEMENT BY: (continued)
PAGE NO.
2 Patricia Daniel 2192 3
Sharon Liles 2195 4
Dwayne Engelhardt 2196 e
5 Mrs. Adeline Rudel 2199 5
1 3
0 Mrs. Alvin Marek 2200 l
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l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2125 I
P ROCE E D I NG S 2
2:10 p.m.
l 3
JUDGE WOLFE:
All right.
We'll resume 4
the limited appearance statement portion of the hearing 5
on the construction permit application for the construction E
0 of the Allens Creek Nuclear Generating Plant, Unit 1.
,a R
7 Would the parties present identify X
k themselves for the record, beginning to my left.
dd 9
g MR. COPELAND:
My name is Greg Cope-h 10 y
land.
I'm an attorney for Houston Lighting & Power Company.
I'm with the firm of Baker & Botts, Houston, d
12 3
3 13 j
Appearing with me today is Mr. Paul E
14 N
Horn, who is the Project Manager for the Allens Creek E
t 2
15 '
g Proj.ect.
T 16 l
MR. BLACK:
My name is Richard L.
6 17 a
Black.
I'm counsel for the NRC Staff.
m M
18 g
With me today on my left is Calvin I
19 j
Moon, who is the Project Manager for the Allens Creek 20 Nuclear Power Project.
21 JUDGE WOLFE:
For the information of 22 the audience, there are at least 13 other individuals or 23 l organizations who are Intervening Parties in this case.
24 Also, the State of Texas is appearing 25l j
as an Inte, rested State.
l 1
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY INC.
2126 i
We heard limited appearance statements 2
yesterday and will proceed today to hear limited appearance 3
statements.
The oral limited appearance statements will 4
be limited to ten minutes.
Written limited appearance
=
5 statements may be any length.
They will be handed to me, 5
]
6 and I will hand them to the transcriber for incorporation R
R 7
into the public record.
l 8
The board will order that any relevant dd 9
and important or meritorious issues or concerns raised in i
h 10 these limited appearance statements -- we'll order that
=
g 11 they shall be dealt with by the parties in their presenta-3 y
12 tion during the evidentiary part of this hearing which c
13 begins in' Houston possibly on January 15th, but with l
14 certainty on January 16th, and will proceed as set out in g
15 our Order of November 25,.1980.
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16 Limited appearance statements are not w
g 17 :
made under oath.
It is not evidence in the case.
Questions E
5 18 should not be directed to the Board, since these questions A
19 might relate to issues or matters that are presently before i
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20 the Board for its resolution; and such resolution will be 21 contained in the Board's ultimate initial decision.
22 l I understand that yesterday during i
23l the recesses and after the conclusion of yesterday's taking 24li of limited appearance statements that both Applicant's 25 counsel and the NRC Staff counsel discussed with the i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
212) various persons making limited appearance statements any j
2 questions outstanding in the minds or stated by such 3
people during the course of yesterday's proceedings.
4 The Board subscribes to that practice
=
5 ar.d is more than agreeable that such is being done.
We E
8 6
highly approve of that practice of informal discussions I
7 during recesses and, of course, after the conclusion of Xl 8
today's taking of limited appearance statements, d
d 9
Finally, I would add that Mr. Black of i
h 10 the NRC legal staff advises that on his table toward the E
g 11 back, there are extra copies of the Final Supplement to the 3
y 17 Final Environmental Statement and also copies of the draft 5d 13 of Supplement Two to the Final Environmental Statement.
l 14 Anyone who does not have a copy and who wishes a copy, 2
15 of course, may come up now and secure
.a copy if they'd U
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't like to.
e 6
17 {
Anyone?
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18 All right.
We'll proceed then with the A
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19 taking of limited appearance statements.
People have M
20 registered, and when I call your name, please come to this 21 small table with the microphone and identify yourself for 22 the record and give your address -- where you reside and 23 tell us your concerns or problems, and we will hear them.
i 24l All right.
First, we will hear from 25 ;
Terry L.
Mikeska.
Please come forward.
l i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2128 1
STATEMENT 2
OF 3
TERRY L.
MIKESKA 4
MS. MIKESKA:
I am Terry L.
Mikeska of 5
Route 1, Box 2.64B, Wallis.
I live.in Orchard, though.
g 9
6 I'm against the nuclear plant.
I would R
d 7
like to ask HL&P one question, which may seem silly to Xl 8
some, but to others may prove that this is not a good d
o; 9
deal.
10 The question being:
Can you give a.e 11 and the citizens of the surrounding area here a one hundred 3
g 12 percent written guarantee that nothing will or ever can S
5 13 go wrong with the plant; that is, no human life or unborn m
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E I4 child, no plant life or animal life and so on will ever g
15 be affected by this plant.
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j 16 If this can be done, I'll back the e
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plant until -- and I stress "until" something should z
IO go wrong.
After that I shall be on your back from that I'
j day on, if I'm living.
O Next, as far as the WOISD citizens, 2I when they passed the bond to build Brazos High School, we did not pass the plant.
Very simply, we cassed the bond 23 l for a high school for our children to go to school, because l
24 we did not have the room or the buildings to let them 25l have enough room for their studies and all.
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2129 1
Let's not mix school business with the 2
plant business.
They just don't mix.
3 After all, when Wallis and Orchard 4
consolidated, both schools were needing to do something as e
5-far as getting the government off of our backs.
Orchard 5
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6 was c?? inking about going in ' tith East Barnard.
Wallis was R
E 7
thinking about going in witi Sealy.
M 8
And when HL&P cade and they gave us thin 0
y 9
deal to do, Wallis and Orchard just jumped at it.
And we z
h 10 cannot have a Three Mile Island here, so let's not mix 11 school in with this plant.
I 12 Thank you, sir.
5 5
13 JUDGE WOLFE:
Yes.
If you'll hold on m
l 14 just a moment.
This is not a question directed to the 15 Board, and as I indicated before, the Board does not a
j 16 answer questions, 2
h I7 l Mr. Cop 21and, would you care to
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18 respond, or do you w at te just discuss this later with E
I9 8
Ms. Mikeska off the record.
It's your choice'.
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20l MR. COPELAND:
I would prefer to dis-21 cuss anything off the record.
22 JUDGE WOLFE:
All right.
Thank you.
4 A.
P.
Grigar.
25 MR. GRIGAR:
He has already answered my e
t I
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
vy
2130 1
question.
I don't have a question.
2 JUDGE WOLFE:
R.
E.
Houlihan.
3 4
STATEMENT 5
OF
]
6 R.
E.
HOULIHAN R
R 7
MR. HOULIHAN:
You want an address?
Xl 8
JUDGE ROLFE:
Give your name and d
q 9
address, please.
z 10 MR. HOULIHAN:
I'm R.
E.
- Houlihan, II P.
O.
Box 396, Simonton, Texas.
3 g
12 I live immediately across the river 3
5 13 from the lake which is used -- or in conjunction with this
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l 14 plant site.
Let me say at the outset that I have z
j 16 no objection to the nuclear power plant as such.
I had d
h II rather it was a gas-fired plant.
But it's a lot better x
18 to be a.suelear than a coal-fired plant.
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I do have a concern, however, about 20 the cooling lake and particularly the lift pumps that are 21 required to lift water out of the river to supply the 22 l lake.
I'm sure that the 11.ht compe.ny and the en;ineers 23 '
involved in this are familiar with the extremely severe 24 j
erosion that occurs on that river bank.
It's on the outside 25 l of the curve of the river, and it's a steep bank and it is I
i l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC.
2131 1
eroding steadily.
2 My selfish concern has to do with this i
3 lift station, which because of this severe erosion, I 4
think, would have to be a very substantial structure.
A
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5 large structure of that kind on the river bank, I am very h
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6 much afraid will' divert the current and bounce the current k7 off of that structure and impinge on my land and cause
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8 severe erosion on my land.
This, I guess, is a selfish d
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interest on my part.
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10 But I don't feel that the light company 5
11 or anyone else has the authority to put in a structure of 3
y 12 this kind which could conceivably do severe damage to my 3
5 13 property.
m l
14 As I say, I have no objection to the n
15 power plant as such.
But I am concerned, and I've never j
16 heard discussed. this problem of this lift station on the e
I7 l river bank.
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18 MR. LINENBERGER:
Excuse me, sir, a cs 19 point of clarification here.
Is your property across the 20 river from the proposed lift station?
2I MR. HOULIHAN:
It is across the river, 22 yes.
MR. LINENBERGER:
So you think a i
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24l possibility might exist that the station structure would 25 divert the cutting edge of the water over to your side?
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ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
1
2132
]
MR. HOULIHAN:
Yes, sir.
I have seen 2
this happen.
I have watched this I have lived there 3
for 4 1/2 years.
I have watched the. erosion.
I guess i
4 everybody knows the Frydek road is about to fall in the e
5 river because of erosion.
3 6
I think someday your lake is going to 7
fall in the river.
Ml 8
But I have watched obstructions on the d
c 9
far side of the river cause diversion of the current and i
h 10 change the erosion patterns on my side of the river.
E:
y 11 And I'd like to have some comments from j
12 the engineers on it.
Frankly, I brought this up three or 5
y 13 four years ago at a hearing that was held in Houston, but a
14 I never did hear any particular follow-up on it.
2 15 MR. LINENBERGER:
All right.
Thank 5
g' 16 you.
s 6
17 JUDGE WOLFE:
Is there anything fur-
/
18 ther, Mr. Houlihan?
I9 MR. HOULIHAN:
No, sir.
That's it.
20 Tha-k you.
21 An. I going to get an answer or a com-22 ment?
I know not from you.
l 23l MR. COPELAND:
Yes, sir, I will be 24 glad to talk with you when we are off the record.
25 j
JUDGE WOLFE:
As I indicated before, ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2133 1
before, all these problems or concerns, such as perhaps 2
the one raised by you, Mr. Houlihan, if the Board deems 3
that it is signficant and has not been covered, we will 4
direct certainly Applicant and Staff to cover that dreing e
5 the course of the evidentiary hearing.
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But for now, we'll give consideration R
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to it.
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8 MR. HOULIHAN:
Thank you.
dd 9
JUDGE WOLFE:
Dick Schinnow.
k b*
10 5
h 11 STATEMENT m
(
12 OF E
g 13 DICK SCHINNOW m
=
14 MR. SCHINNOW:
My name is Dick Schinnow, g
15 and I live in Rosenberg, Texas.
x j
16 To begin with, I'm opposed to the w
N 17 construction of nuclear generating plants anywhere.
But E
5 18 if they have to be built, the one question that occurs to e
19,
me is that why are they built out here and not in Houston g
n 20 where most of the power generated by this plant is going to 21 be consumed.
22 If the people in the metropolitan 23 ;
Houston area are going to use this oower, then I feel that 24 they should bear the risks that go along with generating 25 it.
4 ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2134 y
One of the reasons that electricity is 2
such an inefficient kind of power is because of the amount 3
of it that is lost through transmission lines.
And by 4
locating it in Houston, they could cut down on at least
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5 45 miles of the lines.
I j
6 But I see this location of power plants R
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outside of the areas that they are servicing to be sort of aj 8
a national pattern-I feel that it's probably built out dd 9
here because the company finds it easier to do s.t.
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10 Some Houstonians are already alarmed by 2
l 11 the prospect of the plant being located 45 miles away.
You 3
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12 have to wonder how they would react if they were being built
=l 13 in their midst.
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14 And my feeling is if the plants are as g
15 safe as the proponents say they are, then they ought to
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j 16 build the damn thing right next to City Hall in Houston.
2 y
17 l (Applause.)
m 18 MR. SCHINNOW:
I think that the pattern P
"g 19 of building out in the country the way that they're doing 20 here and elsewhere in the country has to do with the 21 fact that it's simply ecsier.
There's less resistance 22 here because there's a small population.
23 And the populations of towns like Wallin 24l are very hesitant to take stands against anything that 25 smacks of being against progress.
i l
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2135 1
But I don't feel that in opposing this 2
plant we have to feel that we're against something.
I like 3
to think that we're for things, like solar' power, coal 4
power (if that's what.a needed), gas.
I like to think of e
5 for life in general.
5 6
Small towns like Wallis are often sold R
d 7
on the idea of new. jobs and the prosperity that comes.with a
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constructing such a plant.
But the prosperity is more of d
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a short-lived, disruptive type, which puts severe pressure 10 on schools and services and drives rents unnecessarily E{
11 high, then disappears when the construction is completed.
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12 Presently, this is the kind of town 4
g 13,
that many Houstnnians long to move to, to get away from
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l 14 the craziness of the city.
I wonder how many of them would 15 want to live in the shadow of the huge cooling towers of a
j 16 such an installation, w
h I7 How many of us would choose to move here E
18 l 5
to make a home for our families?
.~s" 19 2
I think that building these immense M
20 plants is a part of a national program which actually moves 21 us from using more smaller coal or oil-fired electrical 22 generating plants to fewer giant nuclear plants.
23 :
This makes us more vulnerable, I think.
24 When one of these gian a is forced to shut down, the 25 impact on the total energy an be devastating; whereas, 2
l ALDERSON REPORTI'.6 COMPANY, INC.
2136 if we have smaller, more modest sized plants, if one of them is forced to shut down, the possible results are not s
ataclysmic.
And this is going on nationally, and it 3
really bothers me.
4 Besicce that, the smaller plants could
=
5 5
be located much closer to their markets, and indeed, 6
probably right within the markets.
And they would be 7
f8 practical and economical enough to attract private invest-a N
ment, which is showing no interest now in investing in 9
i h
10 these huge nuclear plants.
E g
My last point is that I just don't jj d
12 think a plant of this kind is good business.
As I pointed E
out before, the American business community is reluctant 13 E
l 14 to invest in them, especially since Three Mile Island.
2 15 And it looks as if these plants will 5
16 now be pretty much totally financed by us -- by the people 3e g
17 who use the power.
18 Houston Lighting & Power has already 5
~
19 spent some $215 million on this site, which has not yet R
20 been approved by this Board.
And the money -- the S215 21 million has already been approved in a rate hike from our 22 utility rates.
23,
A nearby project, the South Texas 24 i Nuclear Project, which consists of two reactor units which i
25l are now being constructed was originally estimated to cost 1
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
j i
I
2137 i
one billion dollars.
That facility is now one-third 2
completed.
The billion has already been spent.
3 The latest estimate now made by 4
Houston Lighting & Power in the fall of '79 was that the e
5 thing will cost $2.7 billion.
h j
6 This is the same kind of boondoggle R
7 that gives us bombers that won't fly and a giant American X]
8 automobile company, Chrysler, which is now on welfare.
dd 9
The difficulty here is that once you've got a billion i
h 10 dollars invested in something, even if it's only a third of 11 the way along, it's awfully hard to abandon that inveetment 3
y 12 So there just becomes no end to the cost overrides.
=3 5
13 The only practical solution, I think, a
l 14 to that kind of nonsense _is to nip it in the bud and to
$l 15 stop it before it begins.
g 16 Thank you.
A g
17 (Applause.)
E E
18 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr. Schinnow.
19 John Abell.
?
n 20 21 STATEMENT 22 op l
23 JOHN ABELL 24 l MR. ABELL:
My name is John Abell.
I 25 I live in Sealy, Texas, just six miles from the proposed i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
l r
2138 l.
l g
nuclear plant.
2 I want to bring up some of my past.
3 I was in the Marine Corps during World War II on Okinawa 4
when the first atomic bomb was exploded.
And thank God,
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5 Harry Truman did it.
5j 6
I later went into the occupation of R
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Japan and saw the immense devastation in Nagasaki.
And 3{
8 look what happened later.
d d
9 We came back -- Japan beat their power i
h 10 into little cars.
We beat our power into big autos.
3}
11 These figures -- and taking statistics provided by the t
y 12 Department of Energy and the National Safety Council --
E 13,
in the more than 20 years that commercial nuclear reactors a
i l
14 have been operating in the United States, not a single zj 15 radiation-related injury to a member of the public.
s j
16 1,265,074 people have been killed by w
6 17 motor vehicles.
More than 40 million have been injured.
/
M 18 The oil cartel in Houston does not have I
19 to worry about nuclear power.
But the oil cartel is 20 worried they have none.
The cost of oil has went up 21 one hundred per.:ent in the last two years and is expected 22 to go up 50 percent this year.
23; I say let's go forward and build this 24 plant.
What are you going to say when the lights go out?
25j The oil runs out, what do we say?
You ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2139 say nothing.
You reach back, there's no power left.
I am y
l all in fav r f nu lear-p wer in the Wallis area.
2 3
Thank you.
4 (Applause.)
=
5 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr. Abell.
3 6
Linda Kellner.
=
3 7
xl 8
STATEMENT dd 9
OF z
h 10 LINDA KELLNER E
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MS. KELLNER:
I'm Linda..Hellner, and k
d 12 I'm from Orchard, Texas.
3o 13 I just wanted to say that I oppose the a
i I
l14 nuclear power plant, mainly because of safety factors.
I 2
15 don't oppose progress.
I think some kind of plant will ax g
16 be needed, if we continue to rely on electricity as our e
i 17 l main source of energy.
- z 18 But I think that you should be answer-e
=
19 ing the question:
What are you going to do with the M
20 waste from this plant.
It's going to sit around hers 21 somewhere.
22 And if there's a leak, or there's some 23 probleu, we are going to be the first caes affected.
Our i
24 children and our grandchildren may have defects.
We may 25 !
not even be here to see them.
I I
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
i
2140 1
And I think that the safety factor is 2
the main problem.
When you look back on Three Mile Island, 3
their land value is nothing now because they had an accident..
4 We wouldn't be able to sell any'hing.
No one could come t
e 5
here to live.
5 g
6 And, because we are human, there are K
R 7
going to be errors.
Look at the Bay City plant.
There 2l 8
have been numerous errors -- human errors in building d
d 9
it.
z h
10 Whether it was in the construction, the 11 design, the actual manpower, there were errors.
m j
12 And unless we can be guaranteed of the
=
13 safety, I'm not for it.
I'm for progress, I'll say that
=
l 14 again; but I think there are other avenues to follow.
15 That's really all I have to say.
I'm j
16 just concerned about my family and their safety.
M g
17 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Ms. Kellner.
5 M
18 (Applause.)
?
C 19 JUDGE WOLFE:
Albina O'rsak.
R 20 (No response.)
2I JUDGE WOLFE:
Annie Orsak.
22 fjj
///
///
///
\\
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ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2141 j
STATEMENT 2
OF 3-ANNIE ORSAK 4
MS. ORSAK:
My name is Annie Orsak.
e 5
My address is Route 1, Box 159, Wa211s, Texas.
h j
6 I do not want a nuclear power plant G
R 7
in Wallis or anywhere near me.
I know that Wallis needs l
8 progress, but if a nuclear power plant is the only source, dd 9
I do not want progress.
i h
10 I do not want this kind of progress.
3l 11 Not enough is known about nuclear power.
There are too 3
y 12 many if's about it.
5g 13 I do not want my life or the lives of a
14 generations to come to be in danger because Wallis wants g
15 progress.
a j
16 There must be a more safer way for w
d 17 progress.
I feel this way because I've lived in Wallis all 18 my life.
And when trouble cemes, I have nowhere else to
?
19 go, 20 I won't be able to run away.
I'll be 21 stuck here.
I won't be able to hide myself and say, 22 "Well, I can get away from it.
So what?"
i 23 l I'm a property owner here.
I think 24 ri ve got the right th is is my home.
I would be for a 25 different source of power, but not for nuclear.
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2142 j
Please, people, I beg you to consider 2
this carefully.because our lives are in danger.
3 And that's all I have to say.
I'm 4
against nuclear power.
=
5 Thank you, b
~
6 (Applause.)
R E
7 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Ms. Orsak.
A{
8 Ms. Orsak, is there another party by J
d 9
the name of Orsak?
Y 10 MS. ORSAK:
Yes.
E g
11 MS. ALBINA ORSAK:
I didn't have any n
(
12 questions.
Thans you.
~
3g 13 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
m l
14 George Thielemann.
2 15 JUDGE WOLFE:
Would you give your name U
j 16 and spell it, please, sir.
2 i
d 17 i MR. THIELEMANN:
T-h-i-e-1-e-m-a-n-n.
b 18 19 !
STATEMENT k
l 20 I OF 21 GEORGE THIELEMANN 22 MR. THIELEMANN:
I would like to 23!
speak for the plant myself.
The construction of Allens 24 Creek Nuclear Power Plant, I think it would be beneficial 25l to Austin County and also to the Fort Bend and Waller i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
v
2143 1
counties.
2 The company has said before that it 3
would work as many local people and hire as much local 4
service as possible to work in this plant.
I think it e
5 would be something worthwhile to this area.
E j
6 This would certainly not attract as R
R 7
many foreign people to come in because I think if we Xl 8
utilize only local labor, and Houston only a small dis-d d
9 tance from here, which would be traveling back and i
h 10 forth and wouldn't take a great deal of people outside El 11 of the area to build this plant.
m i
12 And, of course, once the plant is 5
13 completed, I have had the privilege of seeing a nuclear l
14 plant, going through it, visiting it and thought it was 2
15 one of the cleanest, whitest, most attractive places I y
16 had ever seen.
w N
17 I would be very proud to have it in 18 our neighborhood.
A 19 )
', too, live here.
My family lives 20 here.
And if I had any reason to be afraid of nuclear 21 power, I certainly wouldn't be talking for it.
22 My grandchildren are also in this area, 23 and I think a lot about them and really hope that someday 24 maybe they'll be working in the power plant itself.
I 25j have heard of no accidents, no one ever being killed in l
I I
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2144 y
any way in a nuclear plant.
And, of course, accidents can 2
happen in any plant, regardless of what make they are and 3
whether they burn coal or gas or whatever.
Accidents can 4
happen.
=
5 I think it's very good for us to know H
l 6
-that no accident has ever happened at a nuclear plant.
I a
1 R
7 don't know how you could better a situation like that.
N]
8 I also feel that the people in the dd 9
area are going to have a great deal of business from this.
z h
10 People traveling to and from the plant would pick up items 5
j 11 in small stores in the communities.
It will give them 3
y 12 business and also attractive property is in the area, 5
13 especially in the Simonton area where people will want to l
14
- live, g
15 It has been said that it would lower x
j 16 the value of land in the area.
But in my opinion, it would M
h 17 increase the value of land because people, after completion m
18 l of the plant, will be looking for a permanent home.
And F
j 19 certainly one of the nicest places I can think of is living n
20 in the Simonton area along the Brazos River land.
2I I can't see how in the world it could 22 { devalue any property at all.
I 23 :
And services and machinery, you'd be 24 surprised how much of that is available in the three 25 surrounding counties that could do lots of local work.
i l
l ALDERMN REPCRTING COMPANY,INC.
2145 1
I think it would be beneficial to all 2
the contractors and subcontractors that are in the area.
3 And as far as undesirables, as has been l
4 said many times who come in on construction, I suppose
=
5 that's probably true, that some will infiltrate into a l.
E
]
6 construction area.
7 In every place, in every different Xl 8
project that there is -- we have one of the finest law dd 9
enforcements in this county.
I know that they have already 10 agreed to take care of the problems, if any arise.
I'm not 3
l 11 a bit afraid that we can't handle the situation locally.
t i
12 One good thing to think about is after 5
13 completion of a plant like this, most -- and the fact is g=
l 14 all of the people who will operate this plant have to be
$l 15 higher skilled and well educated to operate a nuclear
=
g 16 power plant.
e g
17 l And those certainly would make good E
h 18 neighbors and good assets to our communities.
A 19 We all like to see progress.
We' 1 20 have to be happy with whatever we can get, and I think this 21 is one of the most attractive things that, in my opinion and 22 from what I have seen, that we could get in this entire 23l area.
24 And also we have promise of a park, 25 ;
good fishing and boating and recreation for the families, ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
v
2146 which we know we do not have enough of in this community, including Houston.
1 l
Houston is only a short ways away,
'and they'll be mighty proud to go somewhere 50 or 40 miles rather than have to drive several hundred miles to go to a recreation area.
3 0
A 7
That will certainly be -- and I cannot 3
see how it could eliminate a lot of wildlife that's now g
8 j
located in the area.
When it's cleaned up and a nice lake, 9
2 i
h 10 there would still be enough timber left to make a real home z
5 for what wildlife we have.
And I think it will increase g
11 m
the wildlife in the area, rather than to eliminate a lot c
12 Z_
f it.
13 m
E 14 At least we can see it then.
Now, we U
15 can't see anything.
It's all under brush, and there's a U
T 16,
danger of fire there.
And if one fire could -- which.we've
- W g
17 :
already had -- could certainly destroy much of the wildlife b
18 that's located within the area now.
And that would be a I
19 matter of a day's time.
R 20 The only thing I can say:
It was more 21 disappointing to more people in the area that I have ob-22 served that it takes so long to get a permit to get this 23 thing started.
And we'd like to get underway with it.
24 That's my Thank you.
25 ;
JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, sir.
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
~
2147 j
(Applause.)
2 JTIDGE WOLFE:
Ellenor Link.
3 4
STATEMENT
=
5 OF 5
{
6 ELLENOR H... LINK R
d 7
MS. LINK:
Hello.
My name is Ellenor Nl 8
Link.
I live near Orchard.
d d
9 I'm against a nuclear plant being z
h 10 built here or anywhere else at this time.
I have three i
g 11 reasons.
y 12 The first reas6n is the safety reason.
5 13 I became more concerned about it after I talked to someone l
14 who is very well-to-do in Houston and builds cooling 2
15 systems for people like HL&P and knows a lot about it.
E y
16 And I asked him what he thought about building a plant out e
6 17 l here after what happened at Three Mile Island.
E 18 And he said, "Our; plants.are.just P
19 about one hundred percent safe; they're beautifully g
3 20 designed.
It's too bad you can't eliminate the idiot 21 factor."
22 What he meant by that was the fact that 23,
the plant is run by people.
People panic and people make 24 mistakes.
And the reassa, as was explained on the news 25 many times after Three Mile Island, that the problem ever ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2148 became so big there was because the people who were sup-y 2
p sed to be masterminding it are the ones who made the 3
mistakes, not the system.
4 And since we can't get the people out e
5 of the system, I don't see how we're going to correct 3
8 6
that.
e 7
My second reason has to do with what X
j 8
we call progress.
It would be wonderful to have a plant dd 9
being built here and having everybody who lives here making i
h 10 two or three times as much as they've ever made before in Ej 11 their whole lives.
t y
12 I love it when my husband gets a 5
I 13 raise.
But I don't think it's that simple.
If there ever E
l 14 is an accident at this plant, our land values will go down 2
15 to nothing.
E g
16 What we made five years ago will be e
i 17 very unimportant to us.
And the big construction jobs 5
16 will be gone after the plant is built anyway.
So that is 5"
19 a very fleeting illusion.
(
k l
l 20 We could have just as much progress 21 and money in the area if this were to be a coal plant.
And i
l 22 I don't think we'd have the same safety factor considera-t 23 !
tions.
24 l When I was a kid growing up in the i
25 East, Pittsburgh was a filthy coal town.
Today Pittsburgh As.DERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
l
2149 is a clean town.
Don't tell me we don't have the technology to create our electricity with coal and do it right, because I kn w we d have it.
3 4
That's mainly what I had to say.
JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
5 5
6 (Applause.)
7 JUDGE WOLFE:
Leslie Page.
M j
8 N
STATEMENT 9
i 0
10 OF o
3 g
gj LESLIE PAGE 3
6 12 MR. PAGE:
I wanted to leave this l
E written statement with you.
May I read it and then leave 13 2
l 14 it with you?
E 2
15 JUDGE WOLFE:
Well, if you --
Ten 16 minutes?
md g
17 MR. PAGE:
Not that long.
l k
18 JUDGE WOLFE:
All right.
You may read g
19 it as an oral statement or you may give it to the reporter 9n 20 for incorporation into the record.
Which do you prefer?
21 MR. ? AGE:
I'll read it.
22 JUDGE WOLFE:
All right.
23 MR. PAGE:
My name is Leslie Page.
I 24 i live in Sealy, Texas.
I 25,
It is my judgment that construction and i
l I
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2150 j
operationcof nuclear power generating plants in general 2
should proceed with all deliberate speed, including the 3
Allens Creek Nuclear Project planned to serve the Greater 4
Houston area.
5 A big factor in today's high energy 5
6 costs is the fact that we have been dragging our feet in R
R 7
expanding this power source with delay after delay, some X{
8 of which were of questionable merit, to say the least.
d d
9 Furthermore, forces of inflation and Yg 10 nuclear negativists have already increased costs of plants Z
h 11 presently planned and under construction to deplorably high s
n
(
12 levels.
3 5
13 I have even read that some light com-a l
14 panies have now thrown in the towel rather than gamble on R
15 further delays and indecision.
j 16 It seems obvious that additional delays d
i d
17 '
can only acerbate this problem of spiraling costs.
It us E
18 ironical that one of the of t-repeated arguments the nuclear P
19 negativist gives for opposing nuclear power development is l
20 the cost, when it is they themselves who have contributed 21 to these increased costs as much, if not more, than in-22 flation by their incessant delaying tactics, demonstrations l
23l and negativism.
24l It is also said by some that our course l
t L
25 should be to seek alternate sources of energy, that others I
l' i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2151 O
are safer, chenper and as readily or more readily avail-able.
2 If this be true, what are they and where are they?
I have not heard of the repeal of the ld saw, "I
y u build a better mousetrap, ti.e world will 5
=
5 beat a path to yo?tr door."
6 Neither have I heard of anyone's advo-7 ating that we put all of our eggs energy eggs, that 8
is -- into one nuclear basket; nor do I.
9 2
h 10 But we do need more energy.
And nuclear z
j powered plants can do much to help meet our energy needs jj l
d 12 n w, in the short term and in the long run.
E The chief question in my estimation 13 5
that should bear the most upon whether we do or do not E
14 U
h 15 proceed with further nuclear power development is one of U
16 safety and health.
- W d
17 !
More than minimum prudence must be U
18 observed to assure that adequate safeguards exist in all 1
I l
I 19 phases of construction and operation, including the N
I
~
20 installation of safety features against all probable and l
21 reasonably possible hazards.
l 22,
Having said that in all sincerity, I i
1 23 l must also say with equal sincerity that I see no conceivable 24 way any program, plan or plant in which men are involved l
25l can be made person-proof.
Some say fool-proof.
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2152 j
It appears to me this is a point the Commission must recognize, and more especially as nuclear 2
3 negativists keep adding "but what if's" along the way.
4 Nothing in this life is,.or can be, e
5 absolutely safe.
Matches kill; cars kill; ropes' kill; 5
6 cigarettes kill; people kill; candy kills; food kills, 7
ad infinitum.
8 As long as people are the way they are, d
d 9
this will continue to be true.
Our government's obligation i
h 10 is to provide reasonable protection and safeguards for us, 3
g 11 especially in ways that we're unable to do for ourselves.
3 d
12 At best, safeguards can do no more than N
13 lessen the likelihood and reduce the opportunities for us l
14 to harm ourselves.
This is why I use the term, "with all 2
15 deliberate speed."
E j
16 We need additional energy now.
And 2
g 17 1 each day of delay makes our need more critical.
But we do 5
18 not want nuclear powered p.'. ants without regard to safety.
t" 19 Neither do we want to forego this needed energy source in 20 search of ways to overcome astronomical odds against some 21 imaginary, but extremely farfetched risk.
22 Legitimate, reasonable questions of 23 safety must be thoroughly deliberated, considered and 1
24 l resolved, so construction can begin and be completed with 25l all reasonable safeguards in place; and an abundance of I
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2153 nuclear energy can then be made available.
I strongly urge you to act expeditiously 2
an cau usly, so that needed nuclear power becomes avail-3 able sooner, rather than later, or not at all.
4
=
5 Thank you.
E g
6 (Applause.)
7 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr. Page.
c X
l 8
Richard Hranicky.
dd 9
Mr. Hranicky, would you spell your last i
h 10 name, please.
}E ))
MR. HRANICKY:
H-r-a-n-i-c-k-y.
3 o
12 JUDGE WOLFE:
And your first name is z
5d 13 Richard.
5 E
14 And your residence?
- x 2
15 MR. HRANICKY:
Wallis, Texas.
j 16 w
g 17 STATEMENT E
18 OF E
19 RICHARD HRANICKY A
I 20 l MR. HRANICKY:
I didn't come with a 21 prepared script or anything today.
So everything I'm 22 going to say is off the cuff.
23,
JUDGE WOLFE:
All right.
24 MR. HRANICKY:
I feel like, as the 25, speaker before me, Mr. Page, said, that we should proceed I
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2154 1
with all speed forward.
I don't think that if the 2
Houston Lighting & Power figured that there was a 3
even an inkling feeling that this plant could be hazardous, 4
that they would push it because they themselves live within
=
5-the area..
g
]
6 All the men that I know of in the R
7 Houston office, if this community is contaminated, they'll Xl 8
be contaminated also, d
C 9
I have interests two small businesses 2
h 10 which are fully dependent on electricity.
And I can already 3=g 11 feel the pinch now, because our power costs are going up.
R g
12 We need the electricity; we need cheaper electricity.
3g 13 I feel like that this nuclear power s
l 14 will give us that cheaper electricity.
$j 15 And as far as extra hazards, very few a
y 16 people sitting in this audience today realize that we have w
h 17 !
a hazard right here in town every time the Santa Fe Rail-s 5
18 road rolls through at high speed.
ch
!9 If they would ever have a derailment g
20 here with all these chemical tanks that they're hauling II through here, we could have a real disaster.
22 So like I say --
I don't have any-23 '
thing else much.
But I feel like that the Commission 24 should act on this permit to regulate.
25 '
Thank you.
l
[
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2155 i
Thank you.
2 (Applause.)
3 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr. Hranicky.
4 Anna M'ae Brazda.
e 5
Would you spell your last name, please.
5 g
6 MS. BRAZDA:
B-r-a-z-d-a.
R R
7 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
~
3l 8
ao 9
STATEMENT i
h 10 OF g
11 ANNA MAE BRAZDA j
12 MS. BRAZDA:
My name is Anna Mae sg 13 Brazda.
I'm a resident of Wallis.
I've been raised in this 8
I
]
14 area, and I'm against the nuclear plant being built here,
$l 15 because I feel it would be a health hazard.
x y
16 I'm concerned about my children and d
i d
17 i the other children in this area.
This has been a nice 5
I 18 ' quiet little town and a good place to raise our children.
c8 19 But if this plant comes up, unless it g
i n
20 can be oper?*si with coal, I'm afraid we're going to have 21 another Three Mile Island.
We don't need that.
22 It would cause us to lose our homes and i
i 23 ; all the hard work we've put into it would be a loss.
I 24 know accidents can happen, no matter how safe they say this 25 i plant is.
t l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC.
9 I
.)
2156 1
That's about all I've got to say.
2 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
3 (Applause.)
4 JUDGE WOLFE:
Frank Zurek.
e 5
Would you spell your last name, please, 5
6 sir.
R b
7 MR. ZUREK:
Z-u-r-e-k.
~
Kl 8
JUDGE WOLFE:
And your first name is dd 9
Frank?
i h
10 MR. ZUREK:
Yes, sir.
Ez II JUDGE WOLFE:
And your residence?
k Y
II MR. ZUREK:
Wallis.
E 13 m"
l 14 STATEMENT t
2 15 op E
I0 i
FRANK S.
ZUREK d
I h
II i MR. ZUREK:
I've been a resident of z
IO Wallis for the past 52 years.
I've always taken an active II part in the local organizations that were for progress M
20 of this community.
21l I attended all of the hearings in the 22 seventies that were held here by the NRC and HL&P, in
. which an overwhelming majority of those appearing endorsed the nuclear project.
25 Since then many newcomers have moved i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2157 4 -
)
into this community of Wallis, as well as Rosenberg, Rich-2 mond, Orchard, Simonton, East Barnard and Sealy, unaware 3
that the project may some 12y be reactivated since the 4
HL&P have put so much investment into the nuclear energy e
5 Program.
h
~
3 6
As time went by word came out in '76 E
7 that the Allens Creek Unit 1 has been reactivated and the Xl 8
Unit 2 cancelled.
This has increased our encouragemu.t d
d 9
again that something must be done to increase our demand 2
h 10 for new energy that will be so badly needed to compensate 3) 11 for the increase in population in the surrounding com-3 y
12 munities.
=l 13 f Since then new homes have been built.
a l
14 More electrical appliances have been added on to our present 2
15 homes.
Yet no one would stop to think if in the future 5
g 16 will there be enough KW's to supply the demand continuously e
6 17 ! since it cannot be stored like other fuels.
E M
18 Yet peopl'e were depending on HL&P to c
i s
i 19 l provide us with enough electricity, regardless of what 2
I 20 source it would derive-from.
Everything was going well 21 with Allens Creek Unit i until Three Mile Island, and also 22 the construction of the South Texas Project.
23l All these accidents were caused by i
24l human error.
At Three Mile Island no lives were lost, nor 25} did it cause any radiation fallout to harm anyone around a i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC.
2158 populated area.
But big issues were made of this inci-2 dent, as it was at Watergate where no lives were lost; yet 3
n account of 52 hostages, several innocent lives were 4
lost due to human error.
e 5
5 But that has been forgotten.
Everyone 6
is so concerned about the safety of the nuclear power 7
8 plants, what it will do in the case of an accident and
-N everything in everyone's mind is cancer from radiation.
9 2
h 10 But the people don't stop to think for themselves how many z
ij millions of lives are in danger throughout the course of 24 d
12 hours1.388889e-4 days <br />0.00333 hours <br />1.984127e-5 weeks <br />4.566e-6 months <br />.
z For instance, in the morning before~you 13 5
E 14 reach for a pair of socks, you light a cigarette.
- Yet, u
2 15 it warns you on the package that it's dangerous to your 5
j 16
- health, e
p 17 Then you eat bacon for breakfast.
The E
18 additives and preservatives cause cancer.
Using any
=
19 aerosol spray -- hair spray -- can contaminate the whole
+
20 l house.
It causes cancer.
21 Using spray paint or any insecticide
~
22 on your garden causes cancer.
The farmer has all his 23,
crops sprayed with all kinds of insecticides from an air-l 24l plane that the wind carries on populated communities.
25,
And it's overlooked by the general public ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
I
2159 because it's considered progress.
Anything to add to his increase in productivity.
Yet this causes cancer if you inhale 3
it.
If it kills insects, what will it do to a human?
4 But as time goes by, no one can pinpoint e
5 b
r say that anyone has died from any of these cancer-8 6
causing items or make any statements that radiation sighted 7
fr m Three Mile Island and nuclear testing grounds in j
8 N
Utah has caused cancer, when it has to be proven first 9
z h
10 that there were the factors.
E g
jj And the individuals that were here B
d 12 yesterday and today at this hearing are so concerned about z=
3 13 the safety of nuclear power plants and are so afraid of 5
E 14 nuclear radiation in case of a fallout which will cause a
2 15 cancer, I think the proper place to protest would be to the E
1 16 medical society -- medical experts or medical science.
3 m(
17 Since they have found the causes of cancer, they should 5
5 18 have been able to come up with a cure to counteract the 3"
19 causes of cancer.
R 20 We're not looking at putting dollars 21 ahead of public safety in our community, or are we having 22 people outside the Wallis community do the thinking for 23 us.
i 24 We as individuals with common sense 25l and local government and business groups do our own thinking ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
~
2160 1
whatever is the best for th'e progress of our. community 2
and for the generations to follow us so they will have a 3
nice,_ clean, safe and educational community to live in.
4 "Prc ress forward" is our motto, not s
=
5
" Falling backwards."
b 6
I support the HL&P nuclear plant in R
7 Wallis, Texas.
Ml 8,
Thank you.
d c
9 (Applause.)
z, h
10 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
3=
11 Ms. Doris Nesbitt.
3 Y
12 Would you give your name and address.
=3 5
13 MS. NESBITT:
I'm Doris Nesbitt.
I'm m
l 14 from Brookshire, but I have -lots in Orchard which my
].
15 family has owned since 1909, so I thought maybe I'd z
d I6 qualify.
M M
17 E
l
{
18 STATEMENT C
D 19 op A
1 20 DORIS NESBITT 21 l MS. NESBITT:
I came to add my two 22 cents in fear of having one here, partly for safety and I
23 '
l partly for --
l 24l I missed the earlier sessions because 25
! of not knowing when they were.
So I don't know what was I
i d
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2161 said ahead of time.
But how about transportation of the major substances coming in and out for installation and supplies later?
3 I've seen the things at Oakridge, 4
e 5
Tennessee and how things were packaged.
I have lived in 5
6 El Paso for the past 20 years.
And just before I left, they were trying to get an ordinance -- or passing it 7
g through -- I don.'.t'know too.much about it because. I was getLig 9
ready to leave -- to restrict the transportation of i
10 hazardous minerals through the town and various routes, E
gj with the exception of the Army, but in El Paso that's most t
6 12 of it anyway.
3 13 3ut it seems to me that is a considera-5' 3
14 tion fc everyone concerned.
It's just not at the parti-Ek 2
15 cular spot, but the radius around there.
E 16 And on the other side, I don't know 3d i
g 17 l how much it would cost I haven't seen the. local. light E
k 18 bills, but in El Paso one reason that I wanted to hurry up 5
[
19 l and get out when I retired was my light bill was so much, l
M 20 but all the extras added because of building the Palo 21 Verde Plant in Arizona for E'
Paso Electric just about 22 doubled my light bill.
23 !
But on the overall picture, it seems 24 to me if people are interested in keeping the town as a 25, unit, a lot of -- I heard someone saying when I was looking i
i i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2162 for directions while ago, that the people who really want y
it here when it gets to be a boom town, they'll move out 2
and those of us who are still here be having to cope 3
with what's left.
4
=
5 JUDGE WOLFE:
.Thank you.
5
~
6 (Applause.)
7 JUDGE WOLFE:
Herman Clay.
Mj 8
dd 9
STATEMENT b
10 OF 5
11 HERMAN CLAY d
12 MR. CLAY:
My name is Herman Clay.
I z
5 13 live outside of Wallis and within about five miles of the l
14 proposed nuclear power plant site.
2 15 I have a doctorate in environmental 5
g 16 engineering.
My training included both nuclear and atomic e
g 17 ;
physics, as well as radia tion: health.
My current practice E
M 18 is in the area of water pollution control engineering.
5 0
19 !
So I certainly claim no particular R
20 expertise in the area of nuclear power generation.
21 I have no commercial or real estate 22 interests in the Wallis area, so I feel like I have an 23 arm's length view of the subject to be undertaken in this 24 permit.
In other words, there I can't see where I'll 25, benefit in the short term from the influx of construction i
l ALDERS,0N REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2163 workers, and certainly may in the short term suffer.
However, I strongly support a national 2
p li y f en uraging the construction of nuclear power 3
. plants.
4 And in that light and consistent with 5
A my views, I strongly urge that the NRC issue the requested 6
permit to HL&P in a timely manner.
o.
7 N]
8 Thank you.
N JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr. Clay 9
i 10 (Applause.)
jj JUDGE WOLFE:
Are there any other d
12 individuals in the audience at this time who wish to make 3=d 13 limited appearance statements?
5 E
]4 (No response.)
a 2
15 JUDGE WOLFE:
All right.
Our practice E
16 has been where we have run out of limited appearance
- 2 6
17 i persons, we would recess for an hour and then reconvene U
I 18 and, hopefully, by that time additional people will be E
19 '
available.
R 20 So we will recess 21 MR. COPELAND:
I would like to make one 22 l comment on the record before we recess.
That is, I would i
23l like to encourage, as the Board did yesterday, everybody 1
24l who is 1ere who has had questions about this project, to 25 ;
try and attend as many of the days of the hearing as they i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2164 possibly can.
y 2
Many of the questions that have been 3
raised here today will be answered in that proceeding.
4 For example, Houston Lighting & Power
=
5 Company has retained as an expert witness Dr. Leonard 5
8 6
Hamilton who.is a doctor at the Livermore National e
R 3
7 Laboratory.
N]
8 The man has spent his entire career d
d 9
studying the health effects of low level radiation releases, i
h 10 accident releases from nuclear power plants.
I'm only a El 11 lawyer, so I don't want to go on the record today in front a
p 12 of all you people and tell you what Dr. Hamilton can tell 5g 13 l you.
m l
14 I really encourage you, if you have a 2
15 deep concern and want to hear what an expert has to say, E
y 16 please come into Houston and ccme to the hearings.
His e
d 17 i testimony is in written form.
I'll give you a copy of 5
5 18 '
that, if you'll send me a letter asking for it.
t 19,
I am not trying to duck your questions 20 here today.
All of your questions are going to be 21 answered in those hearings.
22 We will explain why Houston Lighting &
23 Power Company needs to build nuclear plants.
We will 24 explain why in our view the law prohibits us from building 25 ; natural gas-fired plants.
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2165 But again, I want to underscore the fact that it's not proper for me as a lawyer here today
_to go on the record and testify about all of these things.
3 My interest in talking to you off the 4
rec rd is where people like Mr. Houlihan have specific e
5 5
questions about the project-that we do not intend to 6
address at the hearing, I want to try to address those 7
E here off the record.
8 N
N I will be happy to talk with any of 9
2 10 you about my own personal views about nuclear power.
But c
E I
11 I don't feel that's appropriate to go on this record.
d 12 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
z 5d 13 JUDGE WOLFE:
Yes.
I certainly 5
E 14 subscribe to that.
And as I've indicated -- or hopefully a
E 2
15 indicated earlier -- our evidentiary hearings in Houston E
16 will be open to the public.
Ed i
b 17 l You're all most welcome to attend
~
E l
18 i them.
5 E
19 :
During the course of the recess you g
20 may wish to check with the Staff or Applicant's coansel 21 to P.now the exact dates of these hearings.
And as." say, 22 l you're most welcome to attend them.
l I
23 I We will now recess until 4:15.
I 24 l (A recess was taken.)
l 25l JUDGE WOLFE:
The proceeding is resumed.
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2166 I have been handed a written limited appearance statement signed by Frank J.
Rejsek -- that's R-e-j-s,e-k, and by Louise Rejsek -- that's R-e-j-s-e-k.
3 I give it to the reporter for in-4 c rp ration into the record.
e 5
5 g
6 j
WRITTEN STATEMENT l
8 OF N
FRANK J.
AND LOUISE REJSEK 9
i h
10 "1-13-81.
Nuclear Regulatory Com-E 5
11 mission.
Gentlemen.
d 12 "My wife and I would like to express 3=d 13 our opinion about the proposed Allen's Creek 5
E 14 Nuclear Generating Station.
m 2
15 "We live about 3 miles south of Wallis E
16 on a farm.
My wife was born and raised in Wallis.
I M(
17 I have lived in Wallis since 1974.
We farm land also 18 in East Bernard.
e; 19
" Simply, we are in favor of the a
20 proposed project.
We have no fear of it being built 21 in this area.
22
" Surely there will be some things that 23!
should be considered detrimental, but they will be j
\\
24 l offset by the many benefits derived by the plant being 25 ;
here.
I i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
l 1
l 2167 "So please do not stop the wheels of j
2 progress and vote yes to the project.
3 "Thank you.
Signed Frank J.
- Rejsek, 4
L uise Rejsek.
Frank J.
Rejsek, Rt.
1, Box 166, e
5 Wallis, Texas 77485."
5 g
6 JUDGE WOLFE:
Would Jerry Sliva come e
i I
a[
7 forward, please.
8 Come right this way, sir.
Come to this dd 9
small table.
Give your name and address, please.
i h
10 MR. SLIVA:
Jerry Sliva, Wallis, Taxas.
E I
11 JUDGE WOLFE:
That's S-1-i-v-a?
E o
12 MR. SLIVA:
S-1-i-v-a, that's right.
3 3
5 13 m
E 14 STATEMENT Ek 2
15 OF g
16 JERRY SLIVA w
g 17 MR. SLIVA:
Honorable Members of the 18 Atomic Safety and Licensing Board, in 1974 I,
Jerry F.
5 E
19 Sliva, at that time the Mayor of Wallis, had the pleasure N
20 of welcoming you to Wal'11s at the Allens Creek Nuclear 21 Power Plant hearing, with the hopes that Wallis would 22 become the future home of the HL&P nuclear power plant.
23,
Now, as in 1974, I again welcome you 24 gentlemen to our city with the same hopes and expectations.
25; We wish you a pleasant stay in our i
ALDERSON ** PORTING COMPANY, INC.
2168 1
midst.
2 At that time we were advised to prepare 3
for the impact that sucn a plant may have upon our com-4 munity.
So in preparation for the impact such a plant e
5 would have, the citizens of Wallis voted to incorporate E
6 the city so as to have complete control over the growth of 3
7 the city and to provide all the conveniences and neces-Kl 8
sities for the increased population.
d c;
9 The Wallis Volunteer Fire Department j
10 ordered additional fire fighting equipment.
3sg 11 The Wallis incorporated for that y
12 purpose.
3 y
13 Another deep water well was completed, s
=
E I-4 doubling the water supply.
z!
15 The sewage plant and lines are being a
d 30 enlarged and extended.
e h
17 I City police chief and several city z
5 18 policemen were employed.
A" g
19 l The Austin County Emergency Ambulance O
service is now in operation 24 hours2.777778e-4 days <br />0.00667 hours <br />3.968254e-5 weeks <br />9.132e-6 months <br /> a day manned by local 21 drivers and trained paramedics, and is being housed in the 22 local fire station in Wallis.
23 :
A new $5 million school building has 24llbeen built.
Several new housing subdivisions have been 25l annexed to the city, as well as many mobile home parks have ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2169 been laid out and are ready for occupancy now.
1
-I feel we are capable and ready to 2
take care of any increase in population the proposed plant 3
may bring.
In the same conversations in 1974 5
A h6 with the neighboring city officials to the Edison Common-wealth Plant Nuclear Plant in Illinois and talking 7
8 the concerned people residing in the immediate vicinity t
N of the plant, by touring the plant and seeing all the 9
z h
10 safety precautions taken by the operators and by studying z
5 the prescribed safety measures set out by the Nuclear jj 5
4 12 Regulatory Commission for the construction of the Allens z
5d 13 Creek Nuclear Plant, we are thoroughly convinced that the 5
E 14 proposed plant will be as safe as any industrial plant can Y!
15 possibly be.
16 We, therefore, welcome the Houston 3m
(
17 Lighting & Power Company proposed plant because this E
18 section of Austin County needs an industry to boost the E
(
19 economy with its employment, payrc11 and property n
20 valuations.
21 Every community is seeking an industry.
22 We know of no other industry that would be as financially 23,
stable, air and water pollution free, safe and beneficial l
24 l to this.section of the state as the proposed nuclear power i
25l plant.
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2170 The Allens Creek dam itself with the planned recreational facilities and the proposed state park will be an asset to this.section of the state.
3 4
And with the need for the energy at e
5 the present time, gentlemen, we hope all the hearings that 5
8 6
y u have scheduled will provide all the information you 7
need to make it possible for you to grant the permit for 8
the construction of the nuclear generating plant.
dg 9
We Therefore, we are looking z
h 10 f rward with pleasant anticipation to working, cooperating 5
3 ij and planning with the plant officials in making this a d
12 sound, stable and clean community to live in.
z 5d 13 l Thank you, gentlemen.
5 14 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
m 2
15 (Applause.)
E 16 JUDGE WOLFE:
Bill Robinson.
g W
g 17 I E
18 STATEMENT h
19 l OF M
20 BILL ROBINSON 21 MR. ROBINSON:
My name is Bill Robin-22 son.
I live in Richmond, Texas.
I 23 l I'm against nuclear power.
I work 24 near the Parrish Power Plant, which is eight miles from 25,
Richmond.
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
)
4
s 2171 Every day I see several shifts get off y
werk from the plant and immediately hit the bars.
It 2
may be right that there will be a handful of highly trained 3
technical people controlling the plant after it is built, 4
but the ten years that the plant-is being built, the little
=
5 5
towns of Wallis and Simonton wi11 become bar havens.
6 7
These types of people do not upgrade 8
the community.
They are roughneck-type people who may not d
d 9
live in the community, but take everything they can from i
h 10 it.
s g
11 The people that others say will be m
'4 12 flowing into the community will then have to be spent E
A:
13 I'm sorry.
5 E
14 The money that others say will be u
2 15 flowing into the community will then have to be spent on j
16 increased police protection and criminal facilities, not w
g 17 to mention the cost of the community's peace of mind for 5
i 5
18 the fear or rapes, car accidents and gun mishaps.
~
e 19 I am for solar and wind energy systems.
3 20 Instead of costing you money, these systems will save you 21 money.
22 Solar and wind energy systems are tax-23,
free and have a gradual payback over the years it is used.
24 Why spend billions of dollars on a centralized power 25l source that will keep your monthly utility bills forever I
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2172 i
rising, when we' could spend money on a natural energy 2
source, such as solar, wind or biomethane.
3 Once there is an operating nuclear 4
plant in Texas, places like Austin County and the vast 5
areas of West Texas will become dumping sites for huge f
j 6
quantities of highly radioactive nuclear waste from all R
R 7
over the country.
^
Xl 8
The reason that there has not been any dd 9
nuclear waste disposal in Texas yet is because there first 10 has to be a plant that is generating some waste in Texas.
3l 11 In a-country which through inef-3 y
12 ficiency is wasting 45 percent of the energy is consumes, S
5 13 it is simply dishonest for anyone to claim that banning
=
l 14 additional nuclear power plants.would interfere with 15 economic growth and employment.
16 g
It should be self-evident that any e
{
17' country which is using its energy with only 55 efficiency 18 should almost double its economy without spe.; ding more E
19 money on plants of any sort.
M i
20 The USA uses energy with only 55 percent 2I of the efficiency with which Sweden and West Germany use 22 it.
So I would propose a simple policy:
The monkey see, 23 l monkey do plan.
.24 Let's hold our annual energy consumption 25l steady ee its present level and increase our efficiency by i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
~
2173 three percent a year, y
2 For the farmers and ranchers in this 3
e unty who own most of the country, if one plume of 4
radiation is rele..ed from the proposed nuclear power a
5 plant, what is grown or raised here will not be worth a 3.
6 dime.
R 7
Think about trying to sell milk or 8
beef or soybeans or milo if they bave been contaminated d
d 9
with radiation.
z h
10 I was born and raised in Houston.
I El 11 know its pitfalls and the degradation it breeds there.
I 3
d 12 ak the people of Wallis:
Why do you want to lose this z
5 13 rural beauty for the sake of progress, which Houston l
14 I symbolizes?
2 15 Do you want that?
5 g
16 In closing, I say that the people of d
I i
17 l Wallis, Texas should make history by saying no to the 18 proposed nuclear power plant, instead of saying yes.
3 19,
Take pride by making history and saying M
20 no.
21 !
Thank you, i
22 !
JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
23 (Applause.)
24 JUDGE WOLFE:
Earline Goebel.
25 fff t
\\
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2174 STATEMENT 1;
OF 2
EARLINE GOEBEL 3
4 MS. GOEBEL:
I am Earline Goebel from e
5 the Milheim community'here in Austin County.
l 6
JUDGE WOLFE:
And that's G-o-e-b-e-l?
G R
7 Is that correct?
'M g
8 MS. GOEBEL:
Correct.
y d
9 I am opposed to the Allens Creek Nuclear 10 l Power Plant Project.
I am opposed to the construction of Ej 11
'all nuclear power plants because of the probable hazards 3
j 12 to the environment.
Ej 13 No method for long-term storage or a
l 14 disposal of radioactive waste has yet been proven.
The E
2 15 insurance industry is not convinced that nuclear power E
j 16 plants are safe.
w
(
17 '
No insurance company would underwrite E
}
18 full coverage against nuclear accidents because the risk o
P 19, is simply too great.
n 20 The decision we make today to build a i
21 nuclear power plant is a decision to dedicate the reactor 22 site as a permanent monument to future generations to 4
23 maintain hazard free as long as time exists on earth.
24 Is mankind prepared to do this?
Is 25j HL&P prepared to do this?
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY,INC.
i
2175 I heard Mrt Szymanski's comments from y
the Wallis Chamber of Commerce for the power plant yester-2
. day.
Ask Mr. Szymanski who he works for.
3 4
Mr. Thielemann is a retired employee of HL&P biso.
e 5
i l
6 In response to the recreational lake, Gg 7
the NRC now says that it doesn't believe the lake can be Xl 8
recreational.
dd 9
Mr. Cathey said yesterday that he 10 would like to be free of OPEC.
Nuclear power will not E
i 11 free us of OPEC.
Oil use would only be cut 12 percent, d
12 7.ccording to the studies cited in the magazine, " Foreign 3!
13 Affairs."
5 l
14 And the gentleman who said he had been
's 2
15 with Shell for 45 years and they had never had an accident E
y 16 which killed anyone needs to be reminded that if a refinery w
g 17 blew up, it would be a terrible tragedy for everyone at U
5 18 l that site.
E "g 19 '
If there is a class nine accident at a i
20 nuclear power plant, everyone in a radius of 70 miles will 21 I die.
Everyone in a radius of 160 miles will suffer from 22 radiation sickness.
23l That's loss of hair, vomiting, radia-24 tion burns.
The magnitude of the disasters would be quite 25 different.
3 l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2176
)
These facts came out of A report 2
which was kept secret by the nuclear industry for a number 3
of years.
That report was chock full of bad news about 4
what could happen in a serious accident.
=
5 Thank you.
5 k
6 (Applause.)
~
7 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
Ml 8
Detty Hein.
d6 9
i 10 STATEMENT 3}
11 OF 3
I_
I2 BETTY HEIN S
5 13 MS. HEIN:
I'm Betty Hein and I z
l I4 JUDGE WOLFE:
That's spelled H-e-i-n?
g 15 MS. HEIN:
Right.
s j
16 And I live in Sealy.
d I
g First of all, I want to say that I'm z
~
opposed to having a nuclear power plant built in this 19 g
area.
I 20 I'm a concerned citizen of this area 21 because we are property owners approximately five miles 22 from the Allens Creek.
I 23 !
i First of all, there is no hundred
)
i 24 l l
percent guarantee the plant is safe.
And there are so 25l many dangerous factors about the plant that could spell ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2177 disaster for this area once it is built.
I 2
There have been so many bad things that have happened in other plants that it frightens me to think 3
that we have to live in constant fear about the plant 4
after it's built.
5 5
l 6
I personally would feel'better if I 7
were protecting the lives of our people in this area 8
rather than another plant being built here.
9 And secondly, I personally feel that 10 the reservoir is a big joke.
It's to be open to the E
g ti public.
m j
12 First, you say you want to provide more 4=
13 energy for our area.
And then you turn right around and E
l 14 you want to open a big resort area.
2 15 Do you realize how much energy is used E
16 going back and sorth to resort areas?
And if these things g
e 6
17,
would be cut out, we could save a lot of energy and put E
18 it into natural gas or coal-operated plant, or whatever.
5 I
19 i And there's also solar energy, we R
20 know, and the sun will always be there, and we can count 21 on it because it's not man made.
The sun is put there by 22 God.
23 If solar energy or natural gas or 24 coal is used for this plant, nature would not be destroyed l
25l and our lives would be safer.
l i
l i
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2178 i
Thank you.
2 (Applause.)
3 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, M s., Hein.
4 Leonard Kolodziejczyk.
=
5 Would you give your name and spell 5
l 6
your last name.
R d
7 MR. KOLODZIEJCZYK:
Leonard
~
Ml 8
Kolodziefczyk.
I live at Yorktown at the present time.
dn 9
I used to be the landowner of where the plant site is ii 10 supposed to be.
3l 11 JUDGE WOLFE:
Would you spell your it y
12 last name.
5 13 MR. KOLODZIEJCZYK:
5m l
14 K-o-1-o-d-z-i-e-j-c-z-y-k.
2 15 E
10 STATEMENT as 6
17 Op a
18 LEONARD KOLODZ'IEJCZYK E
I 19 '
MR. KOLODZIEJCZYK:
I didn't come l
n 20 here with the intentions of speaking; I more or less came 21 to listen.
But after some of the comments I have heard 22 some of the people make that are going to have to live 23 here if a nuclear plant does go in, it scares me.
M I live in DeWitt County.
Just'about 15 D
or 20 miles from where I do live, we've got several uranium ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2179 mines.
Some of these mines are already mined out and y
2 shut down.
3 The cattle that is grazing on the land 4
that hasn't been ruined, because your top soil is covered a
5 and what's on top is probably a mile or two beneath the 5
l 6
surface.
7 of course, they have to water out of X
g 8
these pits.
It's a pitiful sight to see some of the c5 L
9 cattle that have died.
Your Angus cattle turn to a light i
h 10 shade of pink.
El 11 Then eventually they dry up to the 3
g 12 size that you can thrown them on your back and carry them 5
13
- away, g
a 14 Everyone is blaming the uranium for 15 this.
I don't think it has been proven one way or another, j
16 But if just the bulk can do that to livestock, think of 2
6 17 what it can do to people in concentrated form if you ever E
18 have an accident.
F*
19 And another reason that I oppose any 2
20 nuclear plant is for the simple reason that usually your 21 best land goes into a location like this, and the people 22 that are located on that have to go to some isolated 23 spot that isn't fit for anything.
24 The light company spends thousands of 25
! dollars studying what's going to happen to the environment, ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2180 the insects and snakes and skunks.
But they never put 3
human beings in a cage and try to figure out what's going 2
3 to happen to him when he has to get away and start all over.
4 5
Y u can be surrounded by hundreds of 5
l 6
People and still be so alone when you move that far away, f7 and you have to establish a new credit rating that 8
although you might have the money in the bank, you have to dg 9
wind up showing everybody your driver's license or social i
h 10 security card, or whatever you have, for your identity.
3l 11 And I think a lot of these people should a
g 12 really stop and look and figure out if that dollar is 5g 13 actually worth giving up all of the good land that they're
=
l 14 going to give up and what it's going to be worth if you 2
15 ever do have an accident.
E 16 j
Thank you.
w g
17 l (Applause.)
Y l
18 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr.
o E
19 Kolodziejczyk.
(
M 20 Gene Eschenburg.
21 Would you spell your last name, 22 I please.
23 !
MR. ESCHENBURG:
E-s-c-h-e-n-b-u-r g.
24 JUDGE WOLFE:
Your first name is Gene?
25,
MR. ESCHENBURG:
Gene Eschenburg.
I I
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2181 y
JUDGE WOLFE:
And you reside?
2 MR. ESCHENBURG:
I'm from the Frydek 3
community, and I'm talking for the Frydek community.
4 e
5 STATEMENT 5
6 OF S
R 7
GENE W.
ESCHENBURG Ml 8
MR. ESCHENBURG:
One dgy we -- everybody d
d 9
down here at Frydek is -- well, they don't want to talk i
h 10 about against it, but let's say -- I mean, they oppose 1l 11 it.
m j
12 But they hate to come and talk, so S
13 I'm talking for them at this time.
5 8
l l
14 I asked one question one night on 15 KTRH.
I asked what are they going to do with the waste j
16 from the nuclear power plant whenever they're going to have w
6 17 to dump it.
18 And someone made the remark and said E
l9 a
they could not answer this question because it hasn't come M
20 yet.
21 JUDGE WOLFE:
I'm sorry.
What hasn't?
22 MR. ESCHENBURG:
It hasn't come here 23 yet.
The waste they don't know what to do with the 24 waste.
Okay?
25 And nobody can tell me this answer.
I I
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
i 2182 called down to Houston Lighting & Power to talk to a man y
that was on TV one night.
You know who he is; he's sitting 2
here in this room.
He never did return my call, because 3
I told his secretary what I was calling about, because 4
e 5
I'd like to know that.
5 6
And if somebody can tell me that, then I will f7 be glad to go ahead and let's say -- could you tell me 8
that or could somebody in this room tell me what are they dd 9
going to do with the waste whenever it has got to be i
h 10 dumped.
E g
))
JUDGE WOLFE:
You may not have been here, Mr.
m d
12 Cchenburg, but the Board has indicated that it does not E
13 answer questions because oft times -- many times questions l
14 to the Board relate to matters in issue that will be
~
U 2
15 tried and heard during the evidentiary hearing which U
g 16 proceeds.
w g
17 However, we did make an exception insofar as i
5 18 I did note earlier with some individual who raised the
(
19 j question of what will be done with waste material from n
20 nuclear power plants.
21 And I stated to that individual at tha',
s.
se 22 that it is my understanding that this is now before 23 l congress, that legislation is now being considered on i
24 the methods and proposed sites for burying and disposing 25 of both low-level and high-level waste.
j I
i i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2183 So that is my best answer t'o you at this j
point.
I'm sorry it's not more concrete, but that's the 2
3 way it is.
4 Proceed. Go ahead.
=
5 MR. ESGHENBURG:
Also, at this point if it 5
8 6
can't be answered what they're going to do with the waste a
g 7
and suppose we have, let's say, 25 or 30 of these plants 3
g 8
here, that means that our home is going to be waste --
9 they might drop waste within five miles of our home.
i h
10 They're going to have so many plants in Texas, the way 3
g 11 I understand it, once they get this plant located here a
o 12 at Allens Creek and what they're going to go onto.
3 13 So I'm opposed to nuclear power plants l
14 because of what I've heard about nuclear power plants E
g 15 on KTRH one night.
Some people that worked around the z
j 16 plants -- and this one guy that was on there one night w
g 17 i said that he had to move away from around a power plant E
5 18 because of the radioactive thing or something.
He had P{
19 heart trouble or something, and he had to move away.
M 20 And our best land, which is farm land which is I
21 in the Frydek area, and if you take about four or five of 22 your good farmers out of the Frydek area, that means that 23 we ain't going to have no food to eat.
l 24 Then what are we going to do?
Why can't 25 j people just open their windows and cut off the lights?
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
i 2184
)
And what is money in view of death?
And that's the way I feel about nuclear power plants myself because all the success in the world -- at 3
first, I'll be honest with you --
4 When I first heard about the nuclear power e
5 b
plant,poming down here, I was all for it and everything.
j 6
It wasn't until I kept hearing all about this waste and 7
8 everything and what not.
9 And I asked this question one night -- well, z
h 10 y u probably know about it, the night that KTRH was El 11 talking about these people that was down in Bay City.
m d
12 That's the night that I asked that question.
z 5
13 And so nobody could answer this question for l
14 me, so I feel that I mean, they've got to do something 9
k 15 with the waste.
Where is it going to go?
I don't know.
E 16 I mean, that's all I've got to say.
And aw g
17 thank you for letting me speak.
i M
18 JUDGE WOLFE:
Yes.
Thank you.
E 19 (Applause.)
Ed 20 JUDGE WOLFE:
Jim Walters.
21 22 STATEMENT l
23 OF 24 JIM WALTERS 25j MR. WALTERS:
My name is Jim Walters.
I'm the i
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
i 2185 i
Mayor of the City of Sealy, Texas.
2 I'd like to address the panel, as well as the 3
audience and everybody here.
I have heard from the time 4
I've walked in anti-nuclear registration in regard to what
=
5 is best for the area.
5 l
6 I have not heard any pro nuclear.
It leads 7
me to believe that there is a group of people -- and many
,"j 8
people that have hesitation in regard to nuclear power.
d d
9 I think they have fear of nuclear power z'
h 10 because simply nuclear in itself creates fear.
I believe Zj 11 that to be the fact.
m j
12 I have heard people speak of issues and make D
13 statements.
I cannot argue; I'm not educated in regard E
l l
14 to the field in which they speak.
2 15 I do not have a full total education on both E
16 sides.
And I hope that everybody understands that there j
w 6
17 '
are two sides to every issue; that be it so round, no E
18 pole has one side.
I; 19 I feel like that nuclear power is something n
20 that we must look at or study and must think very much 21 I strong towards.
This nation is no longer energy in-22 ;
dependent.
I 23 '
We are no longer independent to tend to our-l 24 selves as we did when the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor.
25,
It was the people working together to build the country as l
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2186 j
they've built.
2 That's why this nation is as strong as it is.
3 It's very sad to see it being pulled apart over an issue 4
that nobody on the common and general level really under-
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5 stands.
5 6
That's why we have this panel here to listen f7
~
to the individual input of everybody, as well as Houston 8
Lighting & Power's people to explain their side so that dd 9
averybody highly educated in this field can make a reason-i h
10 able choice.
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11 I would like to say that I do not represent y
12 a hundred percent of all of Sealy, because needless to say, 5
d 13 I did not get a hundred percent of the vote when I was E
l 14 elected Mayor.
2 15 I can say that I speak officially for the 5
j 16 majority of Sealy, because the majority of the people w
g 17 did elect me.
5
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18 I think their concern is energy efficiency.
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g 19,
We have.a very serious problem of man-made coal strikes, l
n 20 train strikes.
The government has decided we can't use 21 natural gas.
22 Where would we have electricity or would we 23 have the great blackout, which was very sad in New York.
24 f I think that too many people are playing 25 ;
Chicken Little and afraid that the sky is falling.
I will l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
l
2187 say that I wish as much time, effort and energy would be j
2 spent in trying to perfect and make nuclear power safer, m re better -- not that I safe it's not safe now -- it's 3
4 being done in many nations.
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5 But if we could spend the money and the dollars 5
l 6
and the effort to support the research and to build nuclear f7 power into what it has the potential of being, rather than h
to spend the money and effort of arguing, fighting and 8
a d
~
d 9
quarreling, we would be much ahead of the game in many, i
h 10 many ways.
3l 11 I think nuclear power is a mandatory part 3
e 12 of our society for the next 20 or 30 years if we ever hope 5
13 to get energy efficient and free from OPEC, free from g
14 outside influences that we have now in the Mideast and 2
15 other things.
E 16 We need to get back to be the strong United g
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17,
States that we once were.
We have the technology.
We E
5 18 have the ability.
And I just feel very bad that we have 5"
19 ;
to spend all this time, all this money and all this effort 20 to argue over a pro or con, when if we could all be joined 21 together, pro and con could join hands together and work 22,
towards the safe and rational answer, we all would be much 23.l better off.
24 Thank you very much.
25l JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank yoa.
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2188 y
(Applause.)
2 JUDGE WOLFE:
Leona Cope.
3 4
STATEMENT
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5 OF 5
d 6,
LEONA COPE R
l COPE:
I guess I'm one of the few natives R
7 h3.
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8 who was raised here all my life, and I hope they bury me dd 9
here.
10 This is very personal.
I'm employed here in El 11 town.
I'm not representing anyone.
3 j
12 But I feel that the time has come that we're 5
y 13 going to have to conserve gas and its by-products.
One of a
l 14 the only ways we can do this is by going to other means of 2
15
. supplying electricity to our entire area.
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16 We have many opponents of nuclear plants.
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17 In 1979 I went to Europe, and our tour guide pointed out N
5 18 and he was a European -- the amount, the size of nuclear 4
E 19 plants that are being built in Europe.
X i
20!
And they don't have the problems with the 21 people opposing this because they see -- if they're going 22 to have gas to propel their cars, to furnish other areas 23 that they need the gas from --
24 They've built plants right by freeways.
I was 25 amazed because all of our group was just amazed at the
2189 amount that they have in Europe.
3 Did you ever hear of an explosion in Europe 2
f anY nuclear plant?
You know
..t was it last year that 3
the ammonia truck exploded o.n 610 Loop in Houston?
4 I know that there are a lot of people here
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5 fr m Houston and from that area who oppose the nuclear 6
7 plant.
Well, I'm afraid to go down the freeways in Houston l
because I see 18-wheelers that are carrying loads that are 8
dd 9
probably more hazardous to me than the nuclear plant that's z
h 10 being planned here.
z 11 I plan living here, which will be only about
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12 two miles from here.
I also fear the cities that have z
13 pollution and haze.
These are deadly hazards.
You don't E
14 have this on a daily basis from a nuclear plant from all u
$g 13 of what I have read everywhere.
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j 16 You do have the emissions from cars, from W
g 17 trucks.
You have it from different plants.
The government U
5 18 has not curtailed or stopped this from being.
5 19 We have the DC-10's that were grounded by ga 20 the Federal Government.
These planes are back flying, and 21 people, after they had many terrible accidents with them --
22 but it didn't stop the people from buying tickets.
They're i
23!
back in the air.
They're flying these same planes.
24 If orville Wright, when he was building his 25l first plane, would have thought for one moment that people f
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ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2190 1
were going to get killed in these planes, he might have 2
had second thoughts.
But they perfected the planes that 3
are flying.
4 And today we have a lot of serious accidents 5
with planes.
But it doesn't stop people from flying.
5 l
6 There might be a few shutdowns that we have 7
to have.
Three Mile Island had a shutdown.
But there are XJ8 a lot of nuclear plants that are being built since that dy 9
time, and they're being opened and they're in usage.
I 2
h 10 don't believe we're going to have people from here who E
j 11 are going to move away if this goes nuclear, a
p 12 I've lived here, and I've talked o a lot of 5
13 our citizens who have lived here all their lives.
And 5=
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14 they're not going to pack up and move.
U 15 I feel that if wrecks don't stop people from j
16 driving, thero may be a few shutdowns with nuclear because w
h 17 !
there are going to be regulations that will cause shut-x 5
18 downs of plants, for inspections, for anything to prevent P
"g 19 accidents.
o n
j 20 If these governing agencies of our government 21 are going to be watching this, don't you think that our 22 i
federal government is going to be protecting us at all l
23l times, as they stopped the airplanes from going through, 24 as they're stopping some of the hazardous materials --
25 they're making them route around Houston and the larger I
f ALDERSON REPCRTING COMPANY, INC.
2191 y
metropolitan areas.
2 I think that I have enough faith in the 3
federal government that if they see something that's being 4
done wrong, that they will stop construction; they would
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5 o
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I have never heard of any deaths caused by R
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a nuclear plant accident.
We've had some in Arizona, but 2l 8
these were silos where there were missiles stored.
9 But I think the regulations there again will Y
10 protect our lives.
El 11 I feel that I will be safer living right here a
y 12 near a plant than moving to Houston with all the environ-E y
13 l mental impacts it would have on my life and my lungs.
a E
14 I've lived here for 57 years, and I want to go 2
15 on record that I hope I will be buried here.
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16 If there's a nucl~ ear plant I own property, w
6 17 i farm land -- and I'm not afraid it's going to cause danger 5
18 to it anymore than other environmental things that happen, E
19 even through the grace of God.
20 We have tornados.
We have other ways.
I 21 !
believe that I will not be harmed in any way.
I have read --
22 I'm an avid reader -- everything I can get my hands on.
23 And I feel that I will be safe.
24 I'm for "Let's go nuclear."
25 ;
(Applause.)
l i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2192 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you.
)
Patricia Daniel.
2 3
STATEMENT 4
OF
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5 PATRICIA DANIEL i
6 MS. DANIEL:
My name is Patty Daniel, and I
+
l live in East Barnard.
N I am adamantly opposed to the building of 9
this nuclear power plant.
I think we have the cart before z
5 the horse when ne are willing to become dependent on a form g
11 of energy that pr6 duces toxic waste.
N There is nc way to really dispose of and be g
5 rid of this poisoned good.
The attitude "Out of sight, out g
f mind" 15 in regard to dumping or disposal of toxic wastes, 16 whether they be radioactive or not, is proving every day to iw g
17 be a nightmare that always comes back to haunt us.
ul 18 Every day the papers bring news of more toxic h
wastes being discovered, whether it has been dumped by our j9 a
M 20 wn military forces in the Atlantic, or buried under a 21 subdivision in upstate New York.
22 These incidents prove how badly we have failed 23,
to manage waste products from these plants or from any kind 24 of chemical waste.
25 ;
Just this morning in the " Houston Post" on the t
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2193 l
second page, James Edwards, the Energy Secretary designate, g
said he opposes giving states the veto authority over the 2
1 cation of federal nuclear waste disposal sites within 3
their borders, saying that the matter is a national problem-4 Is our dream of the future to be a nightmare, e
5 l
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6 living among life-threatening nuclear power plants on the f7 one hand, and the dump site of radioactive waste on the 8
other?
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9 How much can one planet take?
Some people I i
h 10 hear speaking about our energy problem who say they are E
i afraid of becoming more dependent on the OPEC nations and
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d 12 who are willing to switch their dependency to nuclear E=
y 13 power are the same ones who fail to take responsibility for
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2 15 If we really want to import less oil from g
16 OPEC, then we must take responsibility for our own energy w
y 17 use and conservation.
We cannot be as wasteful as we i
E 18 Americans usually ars.
E 19 We mustn't build nuclear power plants so we 20 can waste more energy.
We will become hostages of our 21 own greed if we are forced to live among these dangerous 22 monstrous plants.
23 At Three Mile Island the people of Harrisburg, 24 Pennsylvania were told for three days that the amount of 25 rcdioactive leakage was no threat to human life.
Can we i
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2194 trust the powers that be -- in this case the operators of I
l the plants -- to know how much is life threatening?
To avoid panic and evacuation procedures 3
people were repeatedly told:
"No threat to human life.
4 But stay inside anyway."
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This is almost like bad science fiction.
We E
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are advised by our doctors that even low levels of 7
E radiation, such as x-rays, are not safe to be taken re-A S
d peatedly.
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Yet, three days of radiation exposure at h
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5 levels now known to be higher than we were first told by g
11 officials is supposed to be "no threat to human life."
g 12 h
We still do not know what the ramifications g
5 of the nuclear meltdown at Three Mile Island are, since g
all rep rts are still not in, and they won't be conclusive 15 for many years to come, since many of the terrible effects g
kw of the exposure may not be seen for several generations.
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18 Those people and their children in effect are guinea pigs for the nuclear industry.
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20 I am n t willing to sacrifice my child's life in the future.
I think there should be a moratorium 21 22 n the building of any more nuclear plants until we have a 23,
safer alternative form of energy.
24 Once these things are built at a cost of bil-25 lions of dollars, there will be no shutting them down; and l
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2195 we will be trapped, and it will all be the result of human y
err r r misjudgment.
2 l
That's all I have to say.
3 4
(Applause.)
JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Ms. Daniel.
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5 5
6 Sharon Liles.
-h7 3
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STATEMENT dd 9
OF i
h 10 SHARON LILES 3l 11 MS. LILES:
My name is Sharon Liles, and I 3
o 12 live in East Bernard.
E 13 I don't have any well composed speech to give l
14 to you.
I just wanted to come and tell you that my U
2 15 ;
family casts three votes no, absolutely no.
E j
16 I am very, very opposed to the building of 2
p 17 this nuclear power plant.
I am not willing to make the E
5 18 sacrifices, to take the risks that are involved in allowing 19 this to come in.
R 20 I'm also concerned about what will happen 21 to the nuclear wastes and saying that "We're looking into 22 l it; we'll check on that later," is not good enough.
23 You've got to have a solution to it before 24 the problem comes up.
25 i I saw on the news one night a gentleman telling 1
l l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
f 2196 us how extremely safe it is, how there's nothing to be y
afraid of, how we can all go swimming in the cooling 2
lake.
I think anyone who would willingly subject their 3
body to that would have to be an idiot.
4 And he also made the statement that if by e
5 5
~
g6 chance some little bit of leakage might happen, that there
~
7 will be insurance to cover the loss of any cattle or Xl 8
property.
9 And I would like to know how much insurance z
h 10 you will pay me for this 20 pounds of beef right here.
El 11 That's all I have to say.
m 12 (Applause.)
j 13 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thadk you, Ms. Liles.
m l
14 Dwayne Engelhardt.
m 2
15 16 STATEMENT j
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17 OF b
18 DWAYNE ENGELHARDT E"
19 MR. ENGELHARDT:
My name is Dwayne Engelhardt.
R 20 I live on Highway 36 between Wallis and Orchard about 21 seven miles from the proposed plant.
22 I'd like to say that I sure do get emotional 23 '
when little babies are brought up here to the microphone, 24 but they don't add a whole lot to the testimony.
25i I would like to say, first of all, that I am l
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2197 for the building of a nuclear plant, especially at the y
2 present time when we as a nation and a world are looking 3
f r alternatives to combustion powered energy.
f 4
I w n't be like anti-nuclear people and try
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5 to scare you about the other forms of energy.
But I would 5
l 6
tell everyone to research acid ring, the presence of f7 radiation in coal (especially lignite) and the presence 2l 8
of radioactive carbon-14 in nearly everything that is dd 9
organic, which means everything that was living at one i
h 10 time or another.
El 11 So I will try to make two points:
First, I m
d 12 believe that all of our energy comes from the sun.
Coal 3
h 13,
and gas are changed forms of plants who use radiation from E
i l
14 the sun in the form of ultraviolet rays and other light 2
15 radiation to make the energy we are presently using.
E y
16 However, our supply of this fuel is limited W
g 17 because the plants of this earth cannot create energy as E
18 quickly as we use it.
5" 19 Secondly, and most importantly, I personally 20 believe in God who created us and this world; and I trust 21 Him.
I bslieve that all we have He has given us, in-22 cluding the technology to use the earth's resources.
23 ;
The technology includes nuclear technology 24 Radioactive products are an important part of medical work i
25 right now, both in diagnosing illnesses and such as.using
?
I i
ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2198 1
x-rays.and tracers and in radiation therapy to treat cer-2 tain forms of cancer.
3 X-rays and radioactive isotopes are used to 4
check parts,in our vehicles, on our bridges and in many e
5 mechanical things to make them safe for us to begin with.
h j
6 I do not believe that our knowledge of R
R 7
radiation, nuclear energy is complete; but that is one more K
l 8
reason that we should keep on working with atomic energy.
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9 We did not create radiation or energy from B
G 10 it.
This is just another one of God's resources.
I feel 3=
II that if we turn our backs from it, we are also turning y
12 away from our trust in God.
3 5
13 He gave it to us.
He gave us the earth and a
l 14 the whole world, so let us use it as well as we know how.
g 15 (Applause.)
s d
I0 JUDGE WOLFE:
Thank you, Mr. Engelhardt.
d h
II Are there any other limited appearance 18 individuals in the audience?
g" 19 (No response.)
0 JUDGE WOLFE:
It is now five after five.
21 We have set aside until six o' clock this evening to conclude 2
l the limited appearance statements.
23 !
As has been our practice, we will, in the absence of any more limited appearance individuals, recess.
i I
25 We will recess until 5:45.
And if there are any other ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY. INC.
2199 j
limited appearance individuals in the room, at that time 2
we will hear their statements.
3 We will now stand in recess until 5:45..
4 (A re. cess was taken.)
=
5 5
l 6
WRITTEN STATEMENT h
7 OF M]
8 MRS. ADELINE RUDEL dd 9
"l-13-81.
Gentlemen, Thank you for giving 10 me this time.
3l 11 "I feel sure that the geological studies on R
y 12 the plant site are thorough and complete.
However, I 5g 13 understand that oil and gas deposits are found and a
l 14 associated with underground faults.
A well site was 2
15 recently located within 2-3 miles of the proposed 5
y 16 nuclear plant area.
My concern is:
Since there were d
I 6
17 l oil and gas deposits found when this well was drilled 5
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I 3
18 and production so close to the actual nuclear plant E
19 site -- what, if any, evidence of a fault formation 4
l 20 could be determined through studies of this well 2I formation.
I 22 "I am not sure whether it is necessary for l
23 HL&P to prove a solid formation of more area than i
24 what the plant will actually sit on.
However, in 25 small towns rumors fly, and at the beginning of the I
i ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
1 2200 talk.of a nuclear plant at this proposed site, rumor y
had it that the plant would never be constructed 2
because of a known major fault.
3 4
"I must also stress my personal concern that it is time for us to face the responsibility of how e
5 5
6 to dispose of the nuclear wastes before another 7
plant is built to create more of these wastes.
I Xl 8
feel it is time that this problem be resolved.
dd 9
"Thank you.
Signed:
Mrs. Adeline Rudel, i
h 10 Wallis, Texas."
E5H
=
d 12 WRITTEN STATEMENT zz 3
13 OF 5
E 14 MRS. ALVIN MAREK a
2 15
" January 13, 1981.
To:
Members of NRC E
y 16 Licensing Board.
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17 i "I am against having a nuclear power plant 5
5 18 on Allen's Creek for the following reasons:
E h
19 a.
Nuclear plants have not been proven 5
20,
safe.
21 b.
There is no really safe place to 22 store the wastes at this time.
l 23 !
c.
The land in this area cracks and l
24 l shifts excessively.
25 d.
There are areas that are not ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2201 populated as densely that could be used for a nuclear plant.
This area being so close to Rosenberg and Sealy is already showing a slow growth and the 3
4 schools are already overcrowded and portable build-ings have been bought to take care of this need.
e 5
5 6
e.
A sparsely populated area would 7
probably welcome a nuclear power plant in their 8
vicinity to attract the employees into their towns.
9
" Signed:
Mrs. Alvin Marek, Box 37, Wallis, i
Texas 77485."
10 c
3 g
JUDGE WOLFE:
Let's resume.
jj d
12 Are there any other individuals in the audience i
E who wish to make limited appearance statements?
13 E
g 14 (No response. )
2 15 JUDGE WOLFE:
There are not.
Therefore, 5
16 once again, the Board invites all present to attend the
- 2 y
17 evidentiary hearings at Bates College of Law, which as I E
5 18 havd stated before,.may begin January 15th, but most 4
k 19 ;
certainly will begin January 16th.
And you're all invited R
20 to attend.
21 All right.
Absent any further limited 22 appearance statements, we now conclude this portion of 23 the limited appearance session here in Wallis.
24 We trust we will see you in Houston.
25j Thank you.
l ALDERSON REPORTING COMPANY, INC.
2202 I
(Whereupon, at 6:02 p.m.
the hearing was 2
recessed to reconvene at 9:00 a.m.,
Wednesday, January 14, 3
1981 in Houston, Texas.)
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This is to certify that the attached proceedings before the Nuclear Regulatory Commissien in the matter of: HOUSTON LIGHTING & POWER COMPANY - Allens Creek Nuclear Generating Station, Unit 1 Date of Proceeding: January 13, 1981 Docket Number:
50-466 Wallis, Texas Place of Proceedings:
9 were held as herein appears, and that this is the original transcript thereof for the file of the Commission.
MARY L.
BAGBY Official Reporter (Typed)
M ^^>> Y Y $
Y
- f Official Reporter (Signature) 4 e
.