ML19274G131
| ML19274G131 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Crane  |
| Issue date: | 05/03/1979 |
| From: | Espy L METROPOLITAN EDISON CO. |
| To: | |
| References | |
| NUDOCS 7908290721 | |
| Download: ML19274G131 (16) | |
Text
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UNITED STATES OF AMERICA I
j NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION I
lj In the Matter of:
l 2!
IE TMI INVESTIGATION INTERVIEW l
3l of Mrs. Lorraine Eleanor Espy l
Radiation Chemist, Junior, Train i
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Trailer #203 9
NRC Investigation Site TMI Nuclear Power Plant 1 01 Middletown, Pennsylvania 11!
May 3, 1979 12!
(0 ate of Interview) 13 June 21, 1979 (Date Transcript Typec) 14l t
104 15!
(Tape Numcer(s))
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NRC PERSONNEL:
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Mr. John R. Sinclair L/
23 Mr. Gregory Yuhas 24i l
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SINCLAIR:
The following interview is being conducted of Mrs. Lorraine 2
Eleanor Espy.
Mrs. Espy is a Radiation Chemist, Junior, Train, at the i
31 Three Mile Island Nuclear Power Facility.
The present time is 3:24 p.m.
4 Eastern Daylight Time.
Today's date is May 3, 1979.
The place of the S
fr.terview is Trailer 203, located immediately outside the South Gate to the 6
Three Mile Island Site.
Individuals present for the interview will be 7l Mr. Gregory Yuhas, Radiation Specialist, Region I, US Nuclear Regulatory C mmission.
The tape machine will be operated by myself, Mr. John R.
8 I
Sinclair.
g I'm an Investigator, Office of Inspector and Auditor, US Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
Prior to the interview being recorded, Mrs. Espy 10 I
was provided' a copy of a document explaining her rights concerning informa-
' tion to be obtained regarding the incident at Three Mile Island.
In addition, Mrs. Espy was apprised of the purpose of the investigation, its scope, and g
,4; the authority by which Congress authorizes the Nuclear Regulatory Commission 4
3 to conduct the in*/ stigation.
On the second page of the advisement document, 151 Mrs. Espy has answered three questions.
The questions and Mrs. Espy's 16!
I replies will now be recorded as part of the interview.
Mrs. Espy, do you 17{
understand the above?
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19l ESPY:
Yes.
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SINCLAIR:
Do we have your permission to tape the interview?
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23 ESPY:
Yes.
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1 SINCLAIR:
Do you want a copy of the tape?
2 3
ESPY:
No.
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SINCLAIR:
At this time, I will ask Mrs. Espy to briefly give us some.
61 background information concerning her employment with the nuclear industry.
i 7l ESPY:
I began employment on March 12 of this year, as a Rad Chemist Techni-g g;
cian Junior, in training.
Formal training is to last three months, at i
10l which time we were tested.
Did you want previous employment or
......?
I 11!
YUHAS:
Are you a high school graduate?
12 13 ESPY:
I have a BS in Biology.
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16 17f ESPY:
Juniata College.
181 19!
YUHAS:
When did you graduate from college.
21 I'
ESPY:
1968.
22 23 YUHAS:
Could you describe the training program?
I realize that you only 24, j
probably got into it about two weeks before everything went to pot.
Can 25i 2003 2%
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you give us a synopsis of wnat training you had been provided up until the 2l incident?
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4 M:
The first week I was at the plant after an initial day or two of 5
f rms to fill out and finding my sy around with an escort.
I obtained a 6
badge which permitted me access to areas without constant escort, although 7
it did not permit me access to any RWP areas.
I went to Unit 2, Health 8
Physicist Department, and began informal training, which is the normal gj procedure which involves observation of methods used as the workers perform their daily tasks.
Formal training comes after several days of observation 10 f
of this type.
The formal training would consist of one of the foremen or i
supervisors officially showing us how to do something, giving us opportunity 13l to perform the task, and then testing us on our performance.
So I was in the beginning intermediate stage of observing other people perform.
I did get into some routine smearing work, and we were shown how to operate 15i several different machines, although I was not tested on their functions, 16!
formally.
Then, the second week I was there, I was switched to chemistry, i
not because I was finished with the HP, but because this is where they had 18i wanted to start me and they wanted me to start at a certain time; so I started secondary count procedures.
I spent one day in Tom Mulleavy's i
office, reading and' scanning all the procedures that we have for chemistry, 21!
and then I would report to the lab, and on-the-job train how to run machines, what the procedures were, and how to do certain tests - silicate, hydrozines 23 and pH's.
I was taken to sampling areas and shown where we get samples.
24 At times I took samples as part of on-the-job training.
I would be shown i
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11 how to do something and then they allowed me my turn to try to do it, I
2; perfect techniques and that type of thing.
One or two days we had some--
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"we" would be one of the other employees also in training--had a meeting at 4!
Houser's office, and we were beginning some of our formal training.
Met Ed 5
keeps.1 book on HP's, and as each part of the formal training is comp.leted, 6j the black book is marked whether we have succeeded or not succeeded,. or 7
whether we need to try harder or what not, and this was started within the g
second week that I was there.
They basically want to find out where they 9
need to start, if there is any problem with lack of knowledge of chemistry, 10 r if there is any problem with routine mathematics, or they want to kind y
of assay with what they have, what they are starting with, and they determine j
'how much study and how much preparation they need for each individual.
And that's about it.
3 14
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ESPY:
No, it is not.
My first job af ter college was as a teacher for the 17l l
Government Equivalency Diploma Program, connected with Fort Richardson, 18{
l U.S. Army, A'aska.
At that time I also taught in Anchorage Burroughs 19!
i School System.
That would be 1968-1971, at which time I had my first 20i child, moved back to the lower forty-eight and resided in Virginia, and had my second child--that would be 1973, at which time my husband and I moved to Pennsylvania.
And after 1972, I took employment as a waitress.
I think it was 1972.
I worked at that for a while, and in '76 I took employment as 24 a Medical Secretary for an Ophthalmologist in Camp Hill.
And I worked for 25r 2003 207 i
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him for three years and then I came here as an opportunity to better my 2
position and to better fit the field that I had trained for in college.
3 4
YUHAS:
Did any of the previous positions involve work with ionizing radia-5l tion?
6!
7l ESPY:
No they did not.
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g' YUHAS:
Did any of your formal education involve courses dealing in ionizing 10 radiation or biological effects of ionizing radiation?
lit 12f ESPY: We had some in chemistry.
13 YUHAS:
14 When you accepted employment with Metropolitan Edison, did they 15 pr vide y u a standard indoctrination, pursuant to 10 CFR 19? This is that 16l part of the indoctrination that would have covered basic radiation safety, effects of radiation?
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ESPY:
Yes, they did.
That was prior to my badging.
g 20l YUHAS:
All right, fine.
Did that involve a dissertation on prenatal exposure?
23 ESPY:
Yes, it did.
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1 YUHAS:
OK, fine.
Can you pick up and give me a brief scenario of your 2,
involvement witn the incident that occurred on March 28, 1979?
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4 ESPY:
Yes. When I left for work, I can see the stacks from where I live,
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Sj although its twenty miles away and I come up over a hill and I notice.d that 6
there was no river water steam coming up, so I knew there was a problem, 7
and came in the North Gate and entered the plant.
I work the 7:00 to 3:00 8
shift, presently, and at the time I was working 7:00 to 3:30 training I
gj shift.
As I entered,.I was informed that I should go to the North Auditorium i
and wait, that we had a problem and no one knew exactly what severity, 10 I
although I learned at the time that the turbine had tripped and the reactor
'was down.
I went into the North Auditorium and looked around and didn't see any of our HP people, so I inquired.
I was told, "oh, they are all in Unit 1 lab," which I went to,'as I would normally do.
I went into the lab and we were doing some basic monitoring at that point, trying to detect air 16l and background levels and, at the time when we took an air sample, the air I
levels were high.
So those of us with the least experience left the lab 171 and went to the holding area outside Unit 1 HP Lab. We were there for 18l l
about five minutes, at which time everyone bailed ou't and we all went up to 19l Unit 2 control room, via the outside walkway.
We stayed in the control room for, what I recall to be, about twenty minutes, gerhaps twenty-five minutes; at which point the air index indicated that we should move.
And 22 we went to the hallway by the North Auditorium, and began to monitor the 23 I
people with RM-14s, basic frisking procedures, so that we could clear 24l l
people out and ascertain that they were not dragging out any contaminated 25 2003 M
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articles with them.
After we got the last of them through, then--this was l
2' the other trainee and I--we went to the observation center, and at sometime 3
after that--I'm not exactly clear how long this took-we went to the 500KV 4
substation and began general frisking of, it must have been hundreds _ of 5l people because it lasted for hours.
And we frisked clothing, and fee.t, and
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6i hair all through that day.
And also~, towards the end of the day they set I
7 up three lines of cars and we started to frisk vehicles, checking the 8
tires, radiators especially because that seem to have been affected.
We g
park--when we park in the North parking lot we park facing the plant, so if 10, the radiator showed something, that was what I usually checked first, and 11 tires especially because that would have carried anything, and then all top surfaces or dusty areas.
And we probably did one-hundred and fifty cars.
I think we--I personally found one that showed some indication that it was 13 contaminated.
And at that po' int, I recall that we did know that most of g
e c n am na n-e reas n r
ese g rea ngs was xenon.
So at 15 g
that time the car that we found, we just let sit a couple of hours and checked it again, and at the time we checked it the second time the levels were within the normal limits.
And then the next day, I reported to the
,8j Observation Center and went to KV and I worked down at KV substation moni-19!
l toring vehicles, for the most part, for about a week or so, maybe a week 2 01 and a half, before we finally could get over on the Island.
21l 22 YUHAS:
Okay, thank you.
Let me go back now and ask you a few questions.
When you first entered the North..oltorium, who was in the North Auditorium?
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ESPY:
I believe Catalytic workers were there and a lot general Met Ed.
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didn't know all the people at the time, because I'd only been there two and I
3i a half weeks.
Mostly yellow hats.
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4i Sj YUHAS:
Did you hear any site PA system announcement that there was e.ither I
6 a site emergency or general emergency declared?
7 ESPY:
Oh, we had those spilling, yes.
There was definitely a PA system 8
involvement.
I don't remember if they called it a site emergency or a 9
general emergency.
I was more concerned with going to the HP lab because 10 I
that's where my group was, and seeing what I could do to help out.
I
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YUHAS:
Can you describe the environment when you arrived at the Unit 1 HP lab? Was Tom Mulleavy in can' trol, or Dubiel? Or how many people were i
14!
15l-there rcughly? What were they doing?
i 16i ESPY:. Yes, Tom was there, because he was the one who told us to clear out.
17!
I probably was there all of about ten minutes before we left.
They were in 18l the process of monitoring and taking some readings.
I know there was air monitoring going on.
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YUHAS:
Okay.
Then you went to the Unit 2.
Can you describe the condition 22 of the Unit 2 control room when you arrived, as to the number of people, 2 31 the general atmosphere, what was going on?
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ESPY:
Things were a little tense.
People seemed to know what was going 2
on, that was my general impression.
We came up there as a group and, I 3
know I had in mind that I would be able to find out more and more, first 4
hand, what was going on since I hadn't had too much of an opportunity to 5{
stop people in the middle of doing things and say, "well, what's happening?"
l 61 I would say, probably between forty and sixty people, I would say off hand, because there are several little offices around.
And I talked to Barry gl Kilenovich at the time, and he told me some of the temperature readings that they were finding, and kind of explained, to some extent, what was 10 happening, because I didn't know much about it at that time.
11!
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YUHAS:
From the Unit 2 control room, you and another individual, you said i
a trainee?
13) l 141 15f ESPY:
Yes.
16 YUHAS:
Who was that?
181
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ESPY:
Peg Pelen.
7g 20j YUHAS:
You went to the hallway, just this side of the North Auditorium?
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YUHAS: And began frisking people?
2 3
ESPY:
Yes.
f 4!
5 YUHAS: Were these people from the North Auditorium, or just others egressing 6
the plant?
l 7!
ESPY:
Both, mostly we wanted to clear out the auditorium.
There wasn't 8
gj any need to hold people there.
The air was good, but there really wasn't 10 any reason to keep them at that particular' point.
At the time someone, saw that it was best that we move them out.
I don't know who gave that order.
^i 12l YUHAS:
What instructions were you and Miss Pelen given, in terms of frisking people out? Had you previously been instructed, I mean as far as monitoring techniques?
15i 16!
17l; ESPY:. Oh yes, yes.
18!
YUHAS:
And wha were the limits that you were given?
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ESPY:
Well, I was using an RM-14, and a hundred counts per minute over 21!
i background would have indicated greater than a 1,000 dpm.
We could use up 22 to about a hundred and a quarter over background, allowing some for the efficiency of the machine.
Most everyone that I recall was fairly clean.
24l The ones that weren't, it was mostly a clothing thing.
I don't recall 25i l
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anyone at the time having any skin contamination, that I know of, at that i
2' time.
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4l YUHAS:
After you cleared these people out, was someone keeping a roster as 5
to who was leaving the site, a muster list?
l 6l ESPY:
Oh yes, there were muster lists.
7 8
YUHAS:
Who was doing that, do you know? Was it security force or HP?
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ESPY:
Probably security was doing that.
And I know when I went into HP
' office, of course, that's a control area.
We have our own roster slips there.
I was on a roster, because when I went to Unit 2--I don't know who 3
it was, I probably didn't know his name at the time, but I did say be sure 1w.!
you get that I'm going up to 2.
And they were checking people and I wanted to make sure that I had my name for the correct area, but there were roster sheets.
l 18l YUHAS:
When you got out to the Observation Center,'did you stop there long l
or did you go right to 500 KV?
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l ESPY:
No.
We were at the observation station for awhile.
22'
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23 YUHAS:
What was going on at the observation station?
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ESPY:
Well, they were trying to decide a plan of action, what to do with I
2 different people, who was qualified to do what.
Since Peg and I were in training, they wanted us in one of the safer jobs that was still a necessary 3l 4j thing to be done.
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l YUHAS:
So you were assigned from there to the 500KV?
6 7
ESPY:
Yes.
8 Si YUHAS:
And what instrumentation did you have at the 500KV?
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' ESPY:
Oh, we had RM-14's, mostly. We had some E-520's but we didn't use 12j
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those on people.
They're not as good.
We like the RM-14.
You get a much better reading right away.
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, 15 16li YUHAS:
You indicate that you frisked a great deal of people.
Were some of I
thosa contaminated?
I 17l i
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ESPY:
The clothing of some of the workers read above our background, 19I possibly the soles of the shoes, but not many.
There were some.
We do 20l have some bags of clothes we took.
Then we found out frisking them just an 21 hour2.430556e-4 days <br />0.00583 hours <br />3.472222e-5 weeks <br />7.9905e-6 months <br /> later that they were clean.
Most of it would probably have decayed 22 off rapidly or aired out.
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25i ong3 215 LU I
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YUHAS:
Did you have any trouble with background due to emissions from the 2
plant?
3 4l ESPY:
Only during the burp.
Only during the uncontrolled release of 5
radiation that occurred several days later, or radioactive gases that came 6
out.
Then of course we had lousy background.
So at the time... well, we 7
had a radio--two-way radio--we just notified North Gate that they would 8
have to hold people there until our background came down, or send them to a g
place where the background was lower, to be monitored.
10l i
yp YUHAS:
Good.
Were you given any instructions in terms of taking direct I
measurements on individual's thyroids with the RM-14?
13 ESPY:
g It was part of the frisk to cover that area but, no, we didn't specifically throat test everyone by pushing it hard against their throat.
151 We did frisk the skin of the area.
16i 17{;
I YUHAS:
Did you see anyone that was contaminated in that area?
,8!
2 19f l
ESPY:
No, not in my experience.
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20l 21;l YUHAS:
So mostly, the contamination you saw was usually less than knee high, and it was usually on exterior clothing?
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ESPY: Well, it was exterior clothing.
I wouldn't say that it was less i
2l than knee high.
It just depended on whether they were wearing the garment f
3 or brought it out with them.
Some people had contaminated sweat shirts and 4
things like that, but I don't think, I can't say whether they were wearing 5
them or not. They had them off at tne time.
We did find some jacket cuffs--
that type of thing.
6l 7
YUHAS:
And then you continued to serve in that function for the next 8
gl several days?
10l
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ESPY:
Yes.
12!
YUHAS:
OK, fine.
Well, do you have any comments you want to offer with respect to what went on? Anyt.hing you would like to say, we would like to hear it.
13 16i I
ESPY:
Well, the only thing I thought was unfortunate was that the press 17l 18{l would always like to have the information right away, and at times it isn't feasible to hold constant press conferences.
I think, in the first initial days of this, the Met Ed people wanted to kind of get their heads together 20l i
and figure out what was going on to brief everyone, and what should be done 211 about it.
And at the time the press got overlooked.
And I think a lot of the hew and cry and evacuation ana all that, came from that, especially 23 with the hydrogen situation and the bubble, which may or may not have ever 24 been explosive.
And I believe.. I've heard reports lately that some scientist 25 200'3 21)
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said there was never enough oxygen in that water system to provide explosive 21 levels.
You are going to have things you find after the fact, that would've I
31 caused a lot more soothing atmosphere, but, you know, whenever you say 4t radiation, people are going to get upset.
People don't understand the Si difference between radiation and contamination, and unless they do, you are 1
6l always going to have that problem.
We had a lot of emission to the atmos-l 7l phere compared to what we normally do.
I've heard it reported that we had 8
twenty-five times our normal level of iodine, that was reported to the gj press.
Well, if our normal level released from the plant is zero, then 10 25 times zero is going to be zero.
But this is the kind of thing that at 11{
times the press gets hold of, and having no hard facts, it will go with what it has.
So I think one of the things that should've been done was, 12 13 certainly the Mayors of the towns should have been made aware that there 1[
was a problem.
I'm not saying they should have been told the first hour, 15 but certainly formally notified within a reasonble length time and that 16i might have helped the public sentiment, because Met Ed is going to be in a 17 lot of financial problems unless it gets public sentiment with it again.
That's about all the comment I have.
7g l
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- ' ' " "9 20 21l ESPY:
OK.
23 YUHAS:
And we appreciate your time.
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ESPY:
OK, thank you.
l 2l i
3l SINCLAIR:
This is the conclusion of the interview with Lorraine Espy.
The 4
current time is 3:50 pm, Eastern Daylicjht Time, May 3,1979.
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