ML19256B779
| ML19256B779 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Crane  |
| Issue date: | 07/22/1979 |
| From: | Faust C METROPOLITAN EDISON CO., PRESIDENT'S COMMISSION ON THE ACCIDENT AT THREE MILE |
| To: | |
| References | |
| TASK-TF, TASK-TMR NUDOCS 7908290173 | |
| Download: ML19256B779 (80) | |
Text
i g
_______________________________________x PRESIDENT'S COMMISSION ON TIIE ACCIDENT AT TIIREE MILE ISLAND
_______x DEPOSITION of METROPOLITAN EDISON COMPANY by CRAIG C.
FAUST, held at the Three Mile Island Nuclear Generating Station, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, on the 22nd day of July 1979, commencing at 6:00 p.m.
before Stephen McCrystal, a Notary Public of the State of New York.
1506 218:
~
13EN.TANIIN ItEl'ORTING SERVICE CERTIFIED SIIORTilAND REPORTERS FIVE IIEEls.%I AN HTREI7F NEw voinc.NEW YORK 10038
[212] 374 1138 79082 90l73,,
1 2
2 A P P EA RANC E S :
3 METRgPOLITAN,EDISgN_CgMPANY:
4 SHAW, PITTMAN, POTTS & TROWBRIDGE, ESQS.
('
5 Attorneys for Metropolitan Edison Company 1800 M Street, N.W.
6 Washington, D.C.
7 sy, atxN R.
YUSPEH, ESQ.
of Counsel 8
9 passzogur S COMMISSION ON THREE MILE ISLAND:
10 WINTHROP ROCKWELL, ESQ.
l Associate chief Counsel 11 JOAN GOLDFRANK, ESQ.
12 Associate Counsel 13 ALSO PRESENT:
14 TERRY DOUGHERTY, Representative IBEW Local 503 15 CLAUDIA A.
VELLETRI i
16 LEE TEW 17 ooo 18 MS. GOLDFRANK:
I would like to make part 19 of the record that the President's Commission has 20 objected to the presence of Mr. Dougherty as k.
representing the union, the IBEW, and he has been notified of this objection but insisted on being 23 present.
24 1906,219 25 BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE
1 3
2 C RA I G C
F AU S T having been first 3
duly sworn by Ms. Goldfrank, testified as follows:
4 DIRECT EXAMINATION 5
BY MS. G O LD F R AN K's
~
6 Q
will you state your name for the record.
7 A
My name is Craig C.
Faust.
8 Q
Could you spell it, please.
9 A
C-r-a-i-g F-a-u-s-t, Charles.
10 Q
And your present address?
11 A
RD#1, School House Road, Middletown.
12 Q
And your current employer?
13 A
Met Ed.
14 Q
And your current position there?
15 A
Control room operator.
16 MS. GOLDRANK:
I would like to mark the l
17 resume of Craig Faust as Exhibit 1,
please.
IO (Above-described document was marked Faust 19 Deposition Exhibit 1 for identification, this 20 date.)
l 2I Q
Your resume that has been marked as Faust
~
t l
22 Exhibit 1,
did you prepare that resume?
1906;220
23
^
ve -
24 Q
Did you prepare it for this deposition?
25 A
Part of it was prepared for my job when I c.m BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE
I Faust 4
2 to Met Ed.
Then I just added on a little bit the 3
additional school or what my job is right now at Met 4
Ed, what I went through to get to that point.
5 Q
And when would you have initially prepared
~
6 part of this resume?
7 A
Part of it?
Part of it would have been prepared 8
in 1973, I guess it was October 1973.
It is just a 9
statement of schools I had had up to that time, the 10 military as well as my high school training and college 11 up to that point, and just what you would let an 12 employer know.
In other words, what kind of training 13 you had, background.
14 Q
And for this deposition today, you merely 15 updated it since 19737 l
16 3
- yes, 17 Now there is going to be, as far as the training j
18 provided by Met Ed that I have listed on there, or in 19 relation to my job at Met Ed, a lot of those could be 20 broken down into a lengthy list of systems lectures
('-
21 that if you went to the Training Department, you would*
22 get a printout similar to something like thip., stating 1906 221 23 times, dates of it, just what we have here.
24 Now this is only part of it.
I don't know exactly 25 how fully the Training Department has it documented, but e
B ENJ AMIN REPORTING S ERVICE
1 Faust 5
2 you can have a readout like this from the computer 3
through Met Ed.
4 Q
And is this computer printout a complete 5
list that the Training Department main ta t 'is ?
~
6 A
It would be the most accurate you would get on 7
each individual because I would imagine there might 8
be some s11 pups, as far as documentation of a lecture or something like that at the time, but this gives 9
pretty good background of what the operator is 10 a
11 exposed".to for training.
12 Q
As far as you know, all the courses that 13 you attended while at Metropolitan Edison as part of 14 your employment here are listed on here?
15 A
As well as I can remember then, yes.
It is hard, 16 as you can see.
It gets to be rather lengthy, and if you look at these, chey give you the times, hours 17 in other words, it would be a several-week 18 spent 19 period that you went through a particular training 20 period on that specific thing.
21 lic re is 300 hours0.00347 days <br />0.0833 hours <br />4.960317e-4 weeks <br />1.1415e-4 months <br /> for initial program on Unit 2.
k~
22 That was just one of them.
And they are broken down 23 into hours of lecture time on it or time spent, you 1906 222 24 know, cimulator or otherwise.
25 Q
This printout also includes emergency BENJAMIN REPORTING S ERVICE
1 Faust 6
2 drills that you participated in?
3 A
When they are saying " general emergency training" 4
or " radiation drills," yes.
In other words, you would 5
have this is where I don't know jf they have it 6
broken down that far -- you would have to see what 7
the lecturer had set up as far as what drills we 8
covered in that section.
In other words, monitoring, 9
just reviewing an emergency procedure, or if it is at 10 the simulator, we would actually go in and perform 11 emergency procedures on the simulator.
12 Q
Does this computer printout designate whe-13 ther it was a drill performed at TMI on-site, or whether 14 it was a drill on the simulator?
15 A
Radiation emergency drills are, for the most l
l 16 part, on-site.
Drills either through just plain 17 training on the level of the operators in-plant, as 18 far as response to a radiation drill, or it might be 19 just a classroom discussion on it, and once again, 20 this is where I don't know if they break it down 21 further to be able to tell which was which.
You
{i 22 could probably teli just by the hours on it.
That 23 one I would say was probably in-plant.
If there is 24 an hour or something like that, that is just going 25 over it.
BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE l906 22'3
I Faust 7
2 That is even hard to say that way because you 3
can spend a whole three afternoons just talking about 4
what you are doing if a case came up.
5 Q
Do you know if this initial number is a
~
6 description of the course itself?
7 A
As far as the computer is concerned, I believe 8
it is.
9 Q
Do yo know if the Training Department it-10 self would maintain a description of what that 11 particular course entailed?
12 A
I think it would be safe to say they do.
13 Q
Your resume indicates that you attended 14 Shippensberg State College from September 1965 to 15 March 1966; is that correct?
i 16 3
- yes, 17 Q
You did not receive a bachelor's degree 18 from that college; is that correct?
19 A
No.
I was only there two thirds, two semesters 20 from the three-semester period.
21 Q
And why did you leave?
22 A
simple.
I failed out at the time.
I think it 23 goes a little deeper than that, but the simplest way
~
24 to say it is I failed out of the course at that time.
25 o
where did you go after you left shippensberg B ENJ AMIN REPORTING S ERVI C E' '
F106,224'
1 Faust 8
2 State College?
3 A
I went into a cabinet factory at Danville for 4
the summer, and from there I was going into the Navy, 5
but I had a delay, so I ended up working in a shoe I think it was a month's time 6
factory to cover it 7
before I actually went into the service.
8 Q
What had you been studying at Shippens-9 berg State College?
10 A
Engineering, mathematics and physics.
11 Q
And what date actually did you enter the 12 Navy?
13 A
Can I see that a minute?
14 Q
(It and in g. )
15 A
It is listed right there, something November I
i 16 1965, and I had a delay.
i 17 Now I see what you are asking.
I had a delayed 18, entry of -- the best I can remember, I think it was 19 about a month, a month and a half's time before I 20 actually went in then.
21 Q
so that while you were still enrolled at C
22 l
Shippensberg state College, you had entered the Navy?
23 A
nia I have something crossed there?
No, I'was 24
~
out of Shippensberg.
I have the date wr.ong, probably.
90'6I225 25 It should be 1966.
B ENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 9
2 MR. YUSPEH:
Just change it.
3 Tnz wITNESE:
I see why you are having a 4
problem.
5 Q
From' November 1966 through November 1973,
~
6 you were enlisted in the Navy, correct?
7 A
- yes, 8
Q Did you receive any training while you were 9
in the Navy?
10 A
This list starting here is all naval training.
11 Q
Can you explain what your training at ths 12 Nuclear Power School from June 1967 to January 1968 13 entailed.
14 A
It entailed reactor physics, systems mathematics.
15 I think I said physics -- just plain military procedures.
16 Q
was it classroom instruction?
17 x
- yes, i
18
~
O was there --
19 A
The first part of it was.
In other words, the l
20 first six nonths was classroom instruction at Bainbridge,
~
i 21 Maryland, and this was essentially a 12-month course.
,C 22 In other words, half tock place there in the classroom, 23 and the other half, I went up to Schenectady, New York.
24 It is not a similator; it is a prototype of an S-3G 25 reactor.
It was an actual operating reactor.
And I B ENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906',226
1 Faust 10 2
trained as a machinist's mate during this time, so I 3
spent most of my time operating in the engine room on 4
it, although I was exposed to reactor theory, too, and 5
startups as well as just figuring out from the estimated
~
6 critical rod position, from along the theory end of it, 7
although I didn't operate a
reactor during this 8
period of time.
I operated as a machinist's mate, and 9
later on -- it will show you there -- I am qualified 10 up to an engineering supervisor, which I can control--
11 in other words, the closest I get to it would be 12 control of the throttles on the turbine, the main 13 engine, which is a direct control, really, of the reactor 14 itself.
15 Q
Your resume indicater February 1968 to 16 August 1968 you were a nuclear power plant operators 17 is that correct?
j I
10 Okay.
Now when you talk about " nuclear power A
19 plant operator" in the Navy, there is an RO, there is 20 a machinist's mate, there is electricians.
I was a 21 machinist's mate, nuclear, oka.y?
That is the designa-22 tion.
That is wnat that is stating.
It is not stating 23 I was reactor operator.
In the Navy, it is saying I 24 a machinist's mate performing my functions in the was 25 in other engine room.
I would be required to do B ENJAMIN REPORTING '. S ERVidE 1906 227-
1 Faust 11 2
words, as far as operating the steam plant, pumps, 3
supporting the reactor itself, in other words, as 4
far as auxiliary systems go; I did not manipulate 5
the control rods for the reactor itself.
It was done
~
'~
6 by the reactor operator at the time.
7 Q
So it is not correct to state that you were 2
8 a nuclear power plant operator from February 1968 to 9
August 19687 10 A
If you understand what that means, I operated 11 on a nuclear power plant in the Navy.
12 Q
So it would be accurate to state that you 13 were a machinist's mate?
14 A
Right.
I should have probably put " machinist's 15 mate" after that.
l 16 Q
From February 1968 to August 1968, you 17 a machinist's mate in the Navy at this prototype were 18 nuclear plant; is that correct?
19 A
Right.
Q And that was part of you'r training in the 20 21 Nuclear Power School; is that correct?
A Part of my training in the Nuclear Power School 22 23 covered that, yes, going into that.
24 But I am just saying that at that point --
25 Nuclear Power School at that point, you were BENJAMIN REPORTING. S E RVICE 1906 228-
1 Faust 12 2
designated in your rate, but your training didn't just 3
stay within your rate.
In other words, you cross-4 trained on other systems, like the reactor itself.
C 5
Everybody was to know how the reactor, why it operated
~
6 like it did, but there were specific people that 7
trained specifically on that area like I trained in 8
the engine room area for the compo.nent I would operate.
9 Q
But you would have also been trained to 10 do other responsibilities?
11 A
other than -- are you trying to say --
12 Q
other than machinist's mate?
13 A
well, the machinist's mate rate aboard a boat 14 like that covers a variety of things.
There is 15 maintenance you take care ofs we do maintenance our-16 selves as well as operate.
It is different than it 17 is in a union background plant like this, where spe-18,cific jobs belong to certain people, they are hired 19 just for that in those areas.
So we not only do the f
20 paperwork, the maintenance, the operations we do it in 21 the Navy on board the boat, and that is the areas you 22 would be training in.
I don't know how else to say it.
23 Q
But you would not have been trained to be 24 a reactor operator; you were specifically trained to 25 be a machinist's mates is that correct?
BENJAMIN REPORTING S ERVICE 1906 229~
1 Faust 13 2
A That is right, although I don't want you to miss 3
the point that I did have training in reactor theory 4
aboard the boat.
The training wasn't split in b
5 other words, when we went into training, I sat in
~~
6 with the RO's in their lectures as well as they sat 7
in on ours.
8 In other words, we were trained in a group.
It 9
wasn't split as far as one or the other.
10 Q
So you received the theoretical training 11 but not the practical training; is that correct?
12 A
Yes.
13 Q
could you explain what was covered in the 14 Naval Submarine School that you attended from August 15 1968 to November 19687 16 A
All the Naval Submarine School is just familiari-17 zation with the whole boat itself.
In other words, 18 e'n g i n n a r i n g, and just a general cook on board, in 19 other words, would go through Naval Submarine School;
~
20 everybody would.
l 21 Engineering Department people would go through 22 reactor theory.
In other words, they would go through 23 the reactor program at one of their prototypes like 24 I did at S-3G in Schenectady, New York.
25 Q
So from August 1968 to November
- 1968, B ENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
.1906 230'
1 Faust 14 2
that was just a general introduction to the submarine?
3 A
Right, the overall components on a submarine.
4 Q
That everybody on a submarine would be
~
5 required to attend?-
~
6 A
Right.
7 Q
From February 1967 to June 1967, you 8
attended a school for machinist mates, Class A7 9
A That is your basic pipe and valve theory 10 course where in other words, you learn about 11 structure, what is inside that valve you are operating, 12 what type it is, pumps, pump theory itself.
That is well, also maintenance <.
13 the end of it, about as far as 14 associated with it, how you tear a pump apart:and fix 15 it, purifier maintenance, reduction gears, high-16 pressure air compressors, things like that; components 17 that you are going to be operating on board the boat l
i 18 that aren't necessarily related to the nuclear power 19 end of it but would be on any conventional steamship,
~
20 just about something similar to it.
21 Q
Your resume lists numerous courses and 22 subject areas.
Are those the subject areas that were 23 covered in that course?
24 A
These were schools that I attended during my 25 time in the navy on specific areas.
Like I was saying BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE 1906 231
1 Faust 15 you see the one down here that talks about 2
about 3
turbine throttle control, where you just went in and 4
learned about the hydraulic end of it, right down to 5
the mechanical, how it worked, why it did what it did,
-~
6 how you could fix it if you needed to.
7 Q
And these were required courses for your 8
position in the Navy?
A These were courses that were actually just to 9
10 make me a better operator in the Navy to be able to 11 perform my duty better.
I did not get them all at the same time, like prior to going into the boat.
I 12 13 received these courses that you are looking at now 14 while I was on the boat.
15 we would have a period of time where we would 16 be three months out and three months in, okay?
Where 17 during the three months off, I would be attending l
18 s'c h o o l s, various schools throughout that period on I
19 something that I might be working on, and a lot of 20 times you would end up -- it wasn't that clearcut --
21 you would actually have cross-training.
Again, an RO f(
might get into that or an electrician's job might 22 23 be easier if he knew what a nachinist mate should be 24 doing.
Cross-training, depending on what' the manning 25 was at that time and it would allow it.
In other.
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 232
~
16 1
Faust 2
words, there might be an electrician's course, and 3
there was an opening, and I had a chance, if I wanted 4
to, to get into it.
5 Q
Your resume indicates that from January
~~
6 1969 to November 1973, you were a machinist mate, First 7
class, on the USS GEORGE WASHINGTON CARVER, right?
8 A
Yes.
L 9
Q What was your position in the Navy from 10 the time you finished your Nuclear Power School on 11 January 19, 19687 12 A
Machinist mate, Third Class, at that time.
13 Q
And where were you located at that time?
14 A
I was up at Schenectady, New York.
15 Q
From January 1968 until January 19697 l
i 16 A
I thought I had that pretty clear.
I would have 17 to look at my records on that to break it down exactly in other words, I N
where T was.
If you want that 19 can get my military recore out that I have that will j
20 break that down finer.
21 Q
You don't ee nember of fhand?
22 x
no, 23 Q
From November 1973, when you left the Navy, 24 until you came to work for Metropolitan Edison in 25 September of 1976, what did you do?
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 17 2
A Say that again, now?
3 Q
You left the Navy, did you not, in November 4
of 1973?
C 5
A Right.
o
,ecember 5, 1973, I was hired at
~
6 Metropolitan Edison.
7 Q
You were hired in December of 1973 at 8
Metropolitan Edison, and your first position was 9
Auxiliary "A"
operator; is that correct?
10 A
Right.
That "NUC" is my abbreviation for 11
" nuclear."
It may not be correct, but is my designa-12 tion of it.
13 Q
was that an auxiliary operator for Unit 14 1 or 27 15 A
It is an auxiliary "A"
operator at the time, to 16 be used wherever the company needed you.
In other words, l
17 if they needed you on Unit 2,
you would go down to l
18 Unit 2.
But at the time, you have to understand that 19 Unit 2 was under construction, and you were just 20 operating, if you were doing anything, it was just 21 l
starting to go over and do lineups of the systems, 22 far as just, for instance, to see if the whole as system was there.
In other words, it was still in 23 the construction phase during that initial period of 24 25 time, and we did very little over there at that time.
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 234
1 Faust 18 2
But you could say we were station operators, if you 3
want to look at it that way.
4 Q
You were station operators for both Unit 1 5
and Unit 27 6
A As auxiliary "A"
operators, yes.
7 Q
At that time, were there designations of 8
auxiliary "A",
"B",
and "C"
operators?
t I
9 A
I think it was still being -- it wasn't at that 10 time, there wasn't "A",
"B",
and "C" program initiated 11 at that point when I came here.
I was hired in as an "A."
12 Now, it might have been, and I just didn't know 13 it because I was hired in as an "A"
operator.
I can't 14 remember ever seeing any "B"
or "C"
operators at 15 that time.
I don't think one existed because the program was meant to be there but--I don't know how 16 the company didn't institute it 17 I want to say it 18 yes at that time.
19 Q
Do you know why you were hired on as an 3
~
20 auxiliary "A" operator?
t 21 A
Because of my past experience in the Navy.
22 Q
Because of your experience in a nuclear 23 submarine in the Navy, you were designated as 24 axuiliary "A" operator?
A I was hired in as an auxiliary "A"
operator, a 25 BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G. SERVICE 19'06 235 -
I Faust 19 2
trainee at the time.
In other words, I went through 3
a training program when I came here, prior to going 4
out in the plant.
5 Q
And what did that training program 6
consist of?
7 A
Again, it consisted of getting to know the plant, 8
getting to know the plant, and then you have to know 9
the systems.
So one of the first things you are going 10 to do is learn your way around the plant.
One of the 11 other things you are going to be doing during this 12 time period is reading descriptions on the systems 13 that are available, and at that time you also got 14 involved in actually writing up or correcting errors 15 in system descriptions that existed that when you went 16 out in the field and actually looked it over, you found I
l 17 out it wasn't actually what the system description said, 18 s[ you made l
the change to it.
19 Q
was this for Unit 1 or Unit 27 20 A
At the time, this was Unit 1.
l l
21 Q
Was t.his formal classroom training?
22 A
Part of it was, yes, it was formal classroom 23 training where we would receive lectures from an 24 instructor, and part of it was just going out and
~
25 learning it on your own, too.
Like I said, when you BENJAMIN R EPO RTING. S ERVICE 1906 236
J l
Faust 20 2
go out and trace a system out, find out just where it 3
is and what is there and what isn't.
4 Q
And would that formal classroom training b
5 have been at Metropolitan Edison?
6 A
- yes, 7
Q All of it was given at Metropolitan Edison?
8 A
At that time, yes.
I 9
Q Did people from Metropolitan Edison teach 10 those classes?
11 A
They had their Training Department, yes.
12 Metropolitan Edison had its Training Department that 13 gave the lectures at the time.
14 Q
Were you given handouts to read?
15 A
Yes, we had handouts given to us at the time, i
16 that we read, but like I said, we sometimes did the i
17 correction on the handouts, and sometimes we
.v o u ld 18
, rite up the handouts because one might not have w
i 19 existed that really told what the system was all about, 20 what was there and what was not there.
21 Q
So that prior to you taking this auxiliary 22 operator training program, had there been another 23 training program for auxiliary operators?
24 A
When I came to Metropolitan Edison, there had 25 always been some form of training progra.m:for. operators.
BENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE 1906;.237'
I Faust 2
This initial 21 operating program 3
was heavy to also geared pretty reactor theory 4
training for that point becaus I think I have said it before 5
one of the things the company looks for when axuiliary operator is they hire you in as 6
an 7
that you a cao, control room operat can bid up or become or.
8 their So they actually had.
own reactor theory training program going o 9
this time, and n at this was as an "A",
10 Q
designated as You indicated previously an "A."
11 that to with respect certain systems there 12 were not that you adequate and descriptions would correct those.
13 A
A vendor manual would co 14 me And usually the manufa out on systems, okay?
cturer 15 of a would provide system description as some form it was 16
- know, supposed to be, as they initially sold you 17 the package.
you get over here But when l
and you actually start putti 18
- together, ng it you will find that you can't always put 19
..whoic l
thing in as per, the I
20 would imagine, the anyway told it to be descriptien 21
- there,
.e and you might be and f
find out, going on yes, this l.
22 valve doesn't might be exist here in the wrong position, ev i
or it t
23 I
error in en due to just construction, s ome.
{
24 and at that you would make time, you know, 25 notification of it Department the Training l
to to get it j
corrected in the procedure
- anyway, BENJAMIN REPORTING
. SERVICE-I
~
5' M06 238
1 Faust 22 2
so you knew exactly what you had out theres or if it 3
was something out of position, as far as being in the 4
wrong place in the system, that definitely wouli' 5
have gotten noted.
6 The biggest' thing I can remember like somet'2ing 7
that would be a valve I found was in the wrong on i
8 part of the pipe.
It was supposed to be a bypass 1
9 valve around a component that was downstream of the 10 component, bypassing nothing but a section of pipe.
11 So that is my way -- what I am trying to use as an 12 example.
It just comes -- whatever the hangups are l
13 as far as just problems in construction of a power 14 plant, any power plant, fossil or otherwise, that i
15 you have.
I 16 Q
so there were times that you would indi-i 17 cate to the Training Department that corrections were 18.needed on these handouts?
I 19 A
Yes.
That is the best way you can do it.
20 Q
And there were times you would not receive 21 handouts on certain systems?
22 A
We always received some form of a handout, okay?
23 what I ouess I am trying to say is that we would incresse 24 it to make it better or more descriptive of a handout 25 on the system itself.
Because the operators, at this BENJAMIN REPORTING. S ERVIC E
$906239
1 Faust 23 2
time in the initial constructio-of the plant and 3
startup on it, were the best ones to actually get 4
involved in putting input into system descriptions
(
5 so you ended up with something that was accurate.
~
6 Q
on Unit 2,
correct?
7 A
This is on Unit 2, and this happened at Unit 1,
8
- too, 9
Q But Unit 1 was in operation at that time?
i 10 L
No, it was not in operation in that time; it was 11 in the startup program.
In fact, I was here before 12 i t, startup program began.
I did not get involved in l
13 that part of it, so I am just saying this happened in 14 Unit 2 on systems, and it would definitely be the same i
15 in Unit 1.
f 16 Q
so you would receive certain handouts i
17 that you felt did not adequately describe the system, 18 and you would attempt 19 A
I received handouts that described the system.
l 20 I went down and looked at systems and found out that 21 the handout didn't say what was actually there, okay?
k 22 That is because of -- what I am trying to.say is,due-23 to construction.
I think you will find it:anywhere".
i906 240~
~
24 you go.
25 Q
so you would either try to make that BENJAMIN REPORTING
.S ERVICE
1 Faust 24 2
description more :omplete 3
A night.
4 Q
Or if it was in error, you would correct 5
it and report that to the training people?
~
6 A
Yes, report it to operations at the time, you 7
know, depending on where I was in the plant.
If I 8
were back at the Training Department, I would report I
9 it to the Training Department, and it would end up I
10 just getting corrected in the handout, or if it were 11 something that was vitally wrong in the design, you 12 know, just wasn't supposed to be that way in the system, 13 the n we would correct it from that point.
14 Q
Who in Operations would you have reported I
15 that to?
~
16 A
The shift foreman right off the bat would be 17 the first one.
If it happened the supervisor was 18 present, the foreman would inform him.
But it just 19 depends who I saw first at the time.
20 Q
Was there ever an instance where the design 21 was not as it had been described to you in these l
h _'
i i
22 handouts?
I l
23 A
Yes.
24 Q
Do you remember any specific example?
25 A
The one I tried to tell you about was a bypass BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G SERVICE 1906 241
1 Faust 25 2
valve that wasn't bypassing the component it was sup-3 posed to; it was just bypassing a section of pipe 4
downstream of the component.
(
5 Q
And to whom did you report that?
6 A
The. f oreman.
You see, this one was during 7
the initial, when we were initially -- I went over 8
to Unit 2 and just started looking at systems.
In 9
other words, this system I am talking about wasn't l
10 even all assembled yet, but this part of it was just 11 put in wrong, this valve was, so it was a matter of --
12 I don't think I can tell you the name of the person 13 I told.
It wasn't my regular foreman.
14 Q
But it would have been a shift foreman?
I 15 A
I can't answer that.
16 Q
Did you tell the Training Department also?
17 A Yes, because that is what got us out there.
18 That was part of our job at the time, just going around 19 making sure that the systems were getting installed 20 the way they were supposed to.
i 21 Q
Do you know if the change was made?
22 A I believe it was.
It was cut out and put in 23 the proper way.
24 Q
were you given an exam at the-end of 906;242' 25 this course?
B ENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 26 2
A Yes.
3 Q
A written exam?
4 A
Yes.
5 Q
were you given a grade on it?
~~
6 A
I was given a grade.
once again, you can get 7
this from the Training Department.
I don't remember 8
what it was offhand.
There was testing in between 9
us as well as -- in other words, we had tests after l
10 each systems then we went out and looked over and 11 studied it, and then we got a test on that, and at the 12 end of the whole course, we got an overall exam on it, 13 plus we took a mock NRC exam at the end of our AO 14 training course.
Wha I am trying to say is there were 15 a lot of exams, tests given, that I couldn't specifically 16 say what I got on each one.
It is on the record, and 17 Met Ed has the record in their Training Department, 18 and you can find that out by going to the files and 19 asking for them or whatever.
20 Why would you have been given a mock NRC i
I 21 exam?
(',
22 A
I guess purely from the fact that I might be 23 a CRO in the future and see what I picked up out of 24 the training.
25 Q
This would have been a mock NRC exam BENJAMIN R EPO RTING. S ERVIC E
1 Faust 27 2
similar to the ones you would have received in prepara-3 tion for taking an unc licensing exam?
4 A
A written exam,
- yes, the written part of the 5
exam.
We also walked around -- that was part of the 6
test, in other words oral, where you just walk around 7
the plant and ask different questions of the component, 8
piping, where things were, what they did, what they 9
didn't do, things along that line.
l 10 Q
so you were given a mock oral and written 11 NRC exam?
12 A
By the company, by the Training Department at 13 that time.
4 14 Q
And this was because they anticipated that 15 auxiliary operators would eventually become control 16 room operators?
17 A
That is my impression of it, yes. The company's 18 idea was they had auxiliary operators trained to the 19 point where any one of them could become a CRO.
They 1
l 20 would go through further training after that, once they l
21 bid for the position or were accepted in it, but this l C_.
22 is telling the company, yes, they have a supply of 23 people that they can turn into control room operators 24 if they need them, in other words, to advance them.
25 Q
Did you receive any other training while' BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 244
1 Faust 28 2
an auxiliary operator?
j l
3 A
I think I covered it all.
It amounts to familiari-8 4
zation with the plant, getting to know the plant and 5
theory behind operation of it.
i 6
Q And then from October 1975 to January 1976,
^'
7 you were a control room operator in Unit 1; is that I
8 correct?
i 9
A Right.
10 Q
Does that mean on october 20, 1975, you 11 would have been licensed by the NRC7 12 A
No.
What that means is I was an RO, a control 13 room operator, unlicensed, in Unit 1,
and as an un-14 l'. censed operator, I had to be supervised by a licensed i
i 15 cRO for what I did, controls that I may have manipulated.
16 In other words, there is somebody watching over me to 17 know what I was doing.
18 Q
Did you ever become licensed on Unit 17
'-~
19 A
No, I did not.
20 Q
Did you receive any training while you 21 were control room operator at Unit 17 L
22 A
When I was in the control room in Unit 1,
my 23 training amounted to training myself at the time
~
24 because of -- normally it would have been directed by
~
25 the shift supervisor, who at this time was having B ENJAMIN R EPO RTING S E'RVI C E' i906 245
1 Faust 29 2
medical problems, and I ended up a great deal of the 3
time just training on my own during that period that 4
I was up at the control room in Unit 1.
5 I had guidance from the Training Department in
~
6 the form of training packets that they would send up 7
to me, and I would be required to finish certain sec-8 tions of it over, I think it was, about a six-week 9
period, and the Training Department would then send 10 somebody up, and I would take an oral exam by the 11 Training Department on those specific areas that I had 12 studied on, as well as a written exam.
13 Q
What were your medical problems that 14 prevented --
15 A
It wasn't my medical problems.
I am just saying 16 at the time that my shift supervisor that I would have 17 been on shift with was having medical problems, and 18 therefore we had other shift supervisors crossing to 19 cover his position while he was absent.
so I didn't 20 necessarily get the direction from them right off 21 that I would have had, had I been under the one
(,
22 supervisor.
23 g
was your training, since your shift
~
24 supervisor was not available, was your training 25 different?
B ENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 246
1 Faust 30 2
A It was different in that I didn't have -- he 3
would normally direct the operator -- in other words, I
4 he would have questions and answers with him and talk 5
to him about areas he thought he was weak in or some-l
~
6 thing like that, just to see what he was doing, what 7
he was supposed to be, as far as the training packets 8
required.
It was up to him to recommend whether the
[
9 operator would go, be advanced to the next stage or not.
10 Q
Why did you never become licensed on Unit 17
!5 SR 11 A
Because I disagreed with my shift supervisor, 12 when he came back, in the way my training was going.
13 I was training -- at one point I was training 14 along what I considered to be what the training packets l
that I received required me to go, and I felt that he 15 was stepping in, when he did get back, and just shifting 16 17 me out of that area into what he said I should have
,been doing, and we iust got into an irritable situation 18 19 because of it between the two of us, and I just thought 20 the best thing I could do would be to drop back and become a auxiliary "A"
operator again at the time.
Then 21 I bid up for Unit 2; it was eight or nine months later.
22 23 MR. YUSPEH:
You voluntarily transferred j g Q h } 4 [-
24 to move to Unit 27 25 THE WITNESS:
I voluntarily dropped back B ENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 31 2
to an auxuiliary "A"
operator, and then when a 3
bid came up for Unit 2,
I just bid the position, 4
and I went to Unit 2 then.
5 g
Therefore, from January 19, 1976 to
~
6 September 13, 1976, you were an auxiliary "A"
operator 7
specifically for Unit 27 8
A No, I was an "A"
operator on Units 1 and 2 be-9 cause at that time we were gearing up to work in Unit 2,
10 getting Unit 2 on-line, and I was coded as operating 11 over in Unit 2 as well as Unit 1.
12 Q
Are there presently auxiliary operators 13 for each unit, or is there still the system that you 14 are an auxiliary operator for the station itself?
15 A
Right now what they have, it is sort of hard 16 to answer.
There are operators that aren't specifi-17 cally Unit 1 and Unit 2 on the "B"
and "C"
level.
18
,"5A operators in Units 1 and 2 usually cross and operate 19 in both units.
In other words, they will spend one i
j 20 of their weeks over in Unit 2,
an operator from Unit 1,
l 21 and operators from Unit 1 will send -- depending on j
22 the situation at Unit 1 and we tried to operate 23 that way if the manning allowed and conditions allowed
~
24 far as workload at the time so you end up with as 1906 248 25 a cross-licensed -- not " license," but with a BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 32 2
cross-trained auxiliary operator capable of functioning 3
in both plants.
4 Q
Did the differences in Unit 1 and Unit 2 l
5 make it difficult to be an operator for the station, 6
as opposed to an operator for Unit 1 or Unit 27 7
MR. YUSPEH:
Are you talking about a control 8
room operator or an auxiliary operator?
l 9
Q Auxiliary operator.
10 A
That depends on the person.
I don't know if you 11 can --
12 Q
Just answer for yourself.
l 13 A
For myself, I like operating in both units, i
14 having that capacity, but for others, it might not.
15 g
But do the differences in design of the 16 two plants create a problem in being an auxiliary 9
17 operator for the station?
~
i 18
.A That is a hard question to answer.
I don't 19 know if I can answer that one, and I don't think it 20 would be for me, but '. t might be for somebody else.
l 21 Q
For you it was not a problem being an
(,
22 auxiliary operator for the station, considering the 23 differences in design on Unit 1 and Unit 27 24 x
go, ggg 25 g
Did you receive additional training as an BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G S ERVICE
1 Faust 33 2
auxiliary operator from January 1976 to September 19767 3
A Just the regular training that we went through, 4
you know training week.
If they had lectures, we 5
attended them, as long as the plant conditions allowed:
6 once again, if the workload allowed it at that time.
~
7 In other words, an auxiliary "A"
operator is 8
subject to being pushed out of his training week at 9
that period of time for plant operations when the 10 workload gets to where they need him.
I j
11 Q
When you say " training week," do you mean 12 that week --
13 A
The designated initial training program was 14 actually set up for CRO and SRO license people.
As 15 far as I know, there was no commitment to auxiliary 16 operators, but the company would have them there just 17 for the benefit of training, the experience of getting i
18 training.
This is after the initial training program 19 in the plant.
20 In other words, they would parit:icipate as long 21 the workload in the plant wasn't too heavy to pull as 22 them out of the training program to support operations 23 in the plant.
~
24
~
Q This was one week that there would be 25 training?
B ENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G. SERVICE
~
1 Faust 34 2
A We had six sections, and you go to the classroom 3
and receive lectures on different systems.
4 Q
How often would that be?
5 A
That amounted to once every six weeks.
l
~
6 Q
And that would be a training session for 7
control room operators and auxiliary operators?
i 8
A Where it came into systems, systems descriptions 9
and operations, other than reactor theory; in other 10 words, it would be safe to say that where it was 11 involving theory, it didn't pertain to the auxiliary 12 operator at that time, yes.
It would be geared to all t
13 of us.
In other words, they would sit in and benefit l
I l
14 whatever they got; out of it from the lecture.
There were times when the information was just for the CROs, 15 16 and once again, depending on workload and what was 17 going on, sometimes the auxiliary operator wasn't in i
18, ol the training.
19 Q
So this week training course that occurred.
^
20 about every six weeks was not required for you?
.1906 251 21 A
As an auxiliary "A"
operator, no.
22 Q
And only if your duties in the plant 23 allowed, you would attend that training session?
^
A we were scheduled for it.
We would, a lot of 24 25 times, get on training during the week and actually BENJAMIN R EPORTING. S ERVICE
1 Faust 35 2
be pulled out of the classrooms, depending on con-3 ditions in the plant, as far as the workload gces.
4 Q
Was your attendance taken at these sessions?
5 A
- yes, 6
Q were you given any kind of exam at those 7
sessions?
8 A
As an auxiliary operator?
9 g
- yes, 10 A
I would say yes and no.
In other words, it de-11 pends on whether it was a regulatory or. non.
The 12 auxiliary operator wasn't required to take it.
A lot 13 of times I took it, but they weren't required to do it.
I4 Q
During this period of January 1976 to 15 September 1976, did you take any exams during that 16 period?
17 A
Not that I can remember.
I probably took tests 18 dur'ing that period, but I can't be specific now on 19 exactly what ones.
20 Q
Would you have been given written' handouts?
21 g
- yes, 22 Q
Were there exams given to you while you 23 were an auxiliary operator for the period January 1976 24 to September 1976 similar to that exam given to you-25 while you were an auxiliary operator during the period e
BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G SERVICE
I Faust 36 2
September
'7 to October '757 3
A no.
l 4
Q Why not?
- ('
5 A
secause in dropping back to an "A"
auxiliary 6
operator from control room operator didn't require 7
an exam.
I was essentially more qualified when I bid I
8 up than in the training as control room operator in e
l 9
Unit 1.
I was just furthering my knowledge.
I made 10 a better auxiliary operator.
11 Q
Could you explain the process of " bidding up."
[
12 A
It is just where if there is a job in the union 13 that is posted, and if you meet the qualifications for l
l 14 it, you can submit a bid on it.
15 It is just a matter of putting your name in, in 16 other words, and they will take the list of people that j
17 they get the bids from and see who, seniority-wise, 18
..i s there, and that is one of the main considerations 19 in taking the job.
Also, it has requirements.
l 29 Q
What would be the requirements for bidding 21 up to control room operator?
22 A
One is that you would have to be an "A"
auxiliary 23 operator right off the bat.
I mean, you need to be an 24 auxiliary operator to meet the requirements to be a 25 control room operator.
That is one I met.
I was BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G S ERVICE
1 Faust 37 2
rehashing over everything else I talked about.
That 3
is why they hired us from the Navy as auxiliary l
4 operator "A" because we had experience as well as
[
5 training in nuclear power plants.
6 Q
And who would set the criteria, aside from
~~'
7 the union, as to what was needed to bid up to a 8
control room operator?
9 A
The union didn't set the criteria.
The Nuclear 10 Regulatory Commission, as far as I know, set up basic 11 guidelines that people bidding up -- in other words,
{
12 you were given a test by the Nuclear Regulatory 13 Commission.
The company has a feel and knows what 14 they require in the person to become a CRO, to obtain 15 reactor operator's license.
That is the kind of a
16 background they are looking for.
17 Q
That is where you indicated previously that 18 you had become a control room operator?
19 A
Unlicensed.
20 Q
Unlicensed prior?
1906 254 21 A
I was training to get my license, that is right.
(
22 I became a control room operator trainee; I think that f
23 would be the best way to say it, and I did not have the 24 capability to go up and operate controls without a 25 licensed person watching me and directing me in what e
BENJAMIN REPORTING. SERVICE
5 1
Faust 38 2
I was doing.
3 Q
Who determines what qualifications you need I
4 to have, to bid up,to be a trainee control room operator?
5 A
Metropolitan Ediscn would be the one setting that,
'~'
6 and they go along with knowing what the requirements are that the NRC would expect in order to give a 7
I in other words, mathematical background, 8
license i
what they feel you need to 9
science, you name it 10 do the job.
11 Q
And Met Edison would tell the union what 12 l
qualifications were needed?
13 A
Met Edisor. would make a note to the union what l
i 14 qualifications were needed, yes.
15 Q
And did you become a licensed control room 16 operator on Unit 27 II A
On Unit 2,
yes, I did.
18,,, ' "
Q When did you receive that license?
I A
I received my license on the 20th of October 1977.
19 l
l 20 Q
And what training did you undertake t o' i
i906'255-21 receive that license?
A Part of the training would be my initial "A"
22 23 auxiliary training program when I first came to the 24 company in
'73.
25 What I am listing here is that I had reactor B ENJAMIN REPORTING. SERVICE
I Faust 39 2
theory.
I had several weeks on just reactor theory, 3
where we sat and studied that.
4 Other courses were a series of training programs C
5 in Unit 2,
which would be covered in things like you
~~
6 are looking at in front of you here, just systems.
7 It is listed.
8 Q
Would the reactor theory course have been 9
offered by Met Edison?
10 A
Met Edison did the reactor theory program.
11 Outside training, outside of Met 2dison, would have 12 been Penn State University, TRIGA Mark III reactor, 13 and also the Babcock & Wilcox simulator reactor operations.
14 Q
Other than that, all your training was 15 received at Met Edison?
16 A
on the Island with Met Edison.
17 Q
Your training at Pennsylvania State 18 University, what was that geared to do?
19 A
It was to give us actual operating experience on 20 reactor.
It was doing startup and shutdown and a
21 maneuvering on it, to show what would be expected,-
to see nuclear instrumentation and reactivity controls 22 1906 256 23 and changes in reactivity in the core itself.
~
24 You actually operated, under supervision once 25 again, whercyou did man' ulations with a senior reactor BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
I Faust 40 2
operator at that time up their on their TRIGA.
3 Q
Is that a research reactor?
4 A
Yes.
C 5
Q And did you receive a grade on that?
~
6 A
I received a statement from Penn State University 7
saying that Craig Faust did so many reactor startups I
8 and operating transients on their reactor, which is what 9
it is geared for.
It was a requirement -- I am not I
10 sure I can truthfully state which way it was I
11 think it was just a requirement of Met Edison, just l
12 one step beyond what was needed for licensing, to 13 say, "we exposed him to this kind of training."
14 I don't know if that part of it was strictly an
[
15 NRC requirement.
The startup might have been because 16 you were required to do a startup on a reactor by NRC, l
17 and I did my startup on a simulator down at nsw.
18 But this kind of thing was actually on an operating j
19 reactor that we did startups and shutdowns.
~
6 20 Q
How long was your training at Pennsylvania 21 state University?
22 A
It was a week course up there, 36 hours4.166667e-4 days <br />0.01 hours <br />5.952381e-5 weeks <br />1.3698e-5 months <br />..
1906 257 23 Q
Did they give you homework?
24 A
No, it was in class discusions, going outs we 25 had a workbook that we did some calculations on B ENJAMIN REPORTING
.S ERVICE
I Faust 41 2
different reactivity controls and things that we were 3
trying to find out, where we wanted to be when we 4
pulled the rods out and what we were going to see on C.
5 starcup rate.
6 Q
How many people were in the class?
~~
7 A
There were six of us.
8 Q
Were they all people from Met Edison?
9 A
Yes.
f 10 Q
How long was your training on the B&W l
11 simulator?
I 12 A
Eight weeks.
That was eight weeks with the B&W 13 simulator that was spent.
14 Q
And how did that training differ from 15 your training a t Pennsylvania State?
16 A
okay, the Pennsylvania State does not have a j
17 simulator.
They have an actual operating reactor, and 18 iCis not geared -- in other words, it is not simulating 19 controls to what we were actually operating at Three 20
~
Mile Island.
21 B&w had a simulator that simulates the nuclear 22 control Ics, Integrated control system, that we were 23 actually manipulating, very similar to what we have 24 in the control on the reactor at Three Mile Island.
25 As far as the Ics gces and the support systems, SERVICE j -} }{ } }
BENJAMIN REPORTING
1 Faust 42 2
they were basically the same that you would be operating.
3 It did not mirror Unit 2,
other than in the Ics because 4
that is what it was designed for, as far as giving 5
the operator experience on it.
~
6 Q
In what way did it not mirror Unit 27 7
A well, I am talking about control switches, pumps.
l 8
It did not mirror in that you had, yes, high-pressure i
9 injection pumps, and you went over, and there were two i
10 little buttons for the high-pressure injectio., whereas 11 up here, the first thing is you are actua*.ly moving 32 switches to make up and let down the system.
i 13 The valves were not the same.
Yes, you shut a i
14 valve and isolated it and let down, but in reality it 15 wasn't exactly the setup at the plant here.
It did 16 the same intended function, you know.
When I am in an 17 accident situation or something like that, and I want 18 to shut off this component, I will shut the valve, and 19 it gives you that, and you can go over and do that.
20 But it wasn't the same controls in the control room, 21 except for the ICS system itself.
22 Q
Did it take you a while to learn the 23 simulator system?
24 A
Being familiar with the Three Mile Island and 25 the simulator, when I first went down, it took me a B ENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE 1906-259.
1 Faust 43 2
while to get used to operating with the control panel 3
down there.
once you are there for about a week, you 4
are all right.
(
5 0
And then how valuable would the experience 6
at B&W be?
7 A
very good.
8 Q
Even though the control room was 9
different?
10 A
Even though the control room design was different, 11 yes.
I don't know where else you can do it if not on 12 simulator.
You are not going to swing the plant a
13 like some of the. transients you took down there.
You 14 don't want to.
You are asking for trouble if you 15 try it.
16 Q
Did you have classroom work while at B&W7 l
17 A
Yes.
18,,. " '
Q And what part of the time was spent in 19 classrooms, and what part of the time was spent on the s
20 simulator?
i l
((
21 A
We spent four hours in the classroom an* four i
22 hours2.546296e-4 days <br />0.00611 hours <br />3.637566e-5 weeks <br />8.371e-6 months <br /> on the simulator.
That is a day.
23 Q
And you would then be given homework?
24 A
You had the option.
You had time given.
25 usually you could study this at the simulator.
If BENJAMIN R EPO RTING. S ERVICE 1906:260 R
1 Faust 44 2
you wanted to take homework home, you did it.
It was 3
on your own strictly as a person.
4 Q
Do you remember if you took homework home?
(
5 A
yes.
~
6 Q
You did take homework home?
7 x
- yes, 8
Q Ifow many people at a time would be on the 9
simulator?
10 A
we operated in twosi my group did, at least.
11 There was other times I went down to the simulator for 12 recall training where there was three of us.
I 13 Q
But in the initial period of time i
14 A
Usually two of us at a time on the panel.
15 Q
And were you given an exam at the end of i
16 this eight-week course?
17 a
- yes, 18 Q
Were you given a grade?
19 A
Yes.
I think I got -- I believe I got an 89%
20 grade on it.
21 Q
And were you asked to evaluate that 22 simulator course?
23 g
- yes, 24 Q
And what was your evaluation?
25 A
For what it was intended to do,.I. thought it B ENJAMIN R EPO RTING. S ERVIC E 1906,26.1
1 Faust 45 2
was good.
3 Q
And what did you think it was intended to do?
4 A
To give me a good feel of operating with the ICS.
5 o
were you instructed on multiple casualties 6
on the simulator?
l 7
A You were directed in the form'of individual 8
casualties.
In other words, they would fail something 9
on you, and it was up to you to find out what it was 10 and try to correct the condition or bring the reactor 11 down safely.
i 12 As far as multiple casualties, we didn't. train 13 for multiple casualties.
14 Q
On your reaction to how you handled that 15 single casualty, were you critiqued?
16 A
Yes.
we went over what we did wrong and what 17 we might have missed and what we were looking at.
18..And if we weren't looking at the right place, if we 19 had something like tunnel vision, looking at one gauge 20 only, watching it move around and not watching the rest 21 of the plant move, to see what was happening to it.
22 Q
were you told if the transients that were 23 utilized in the simulator had actually happened at 24 other plants?
25 A
If the transients that we were given?
JJ AMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE 1906 262
1 Faust 46 2
Q Yes.
3 A
Yes.
Some of them had happened at other plants.
4 Q
And did the B&W instructors tell you which 5
transients had happened at other plants?
~~
6 A
I don't remember them telling me which ones.
I 7
think it just came out in general discussion.
We were 1
8 just talking about things like, "Let us fail this and see what happens.
This happened at another place, and 9
we will see what we are going to see."
10 I
11 Sometimes we would just leave it go to see where 6
12 it ended up before the operator actually did anything.
l 13 Q
Did you receive any other training prior i
14 to taking your NRC license exam?
15 A
From where?
I think I just, overed everything.
16 You mean besides just what I listed?
f 17 Q
Besides the things that you have listed 18 on your resume.
A That is a list that actually covers quite a lot.
19 20 It covers it all, I think.
When you break it down 21 with the resume sheets that accompany it, it will cover
(-
22 what we had before.
It includes my prior experience 23 in the Navy, if you want to look at it that way.
24 Q
Were you given a mock NRC exam prior to 25 taking your exam at NRC?
your BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 47 2
A Yes.
P 3
Q How far in advance was that given to your 4
taking the NRC exam?
5 A
I don't really remember the date.
~
6 Q
was it a mock oral and written exam?
7 A
- yes, 8
Q And was it given by Met Edison?
9 A
we had a -- we had a mock oral and written exam 10 by Met Edison, but we also had a group come in and give 11 us an oral exam.
I can't remember if they gave us a 12 written.
We have had a lot of exams, and I just can't 13 remember if we had them all or not.
14 Q
Do you remember what the outside group was?
15 x
no, l
16 Q
would they critique your oral and written 17 exam, the mock oral and written exam?
~
18
,A we would critique it ourselves.
In other words, 19 it took a while to correct them, and those were people 20 from other plants that actually came in and gave us k.-
21 an exam.
By the time we got them corrected and got 22 them back, we just went over what we answered wrong 23 and wh't we did wrong.
g 24 As far as the oral went, they would sit down 25 with us afterwards and talk about what they felt wasn't BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE
v 48 1
Faust 2
covered enough or we didn't say enough about it or what 3
we might have had wrong on it.
4 Maybe it was just a case of clearing up a mis-(t 5
understanding by the two of us when we were talking.
~~
6 Q
When you took your. license exam for Unit 2,
7 were you given a grade?
8 A
No.
I just got back notification that I had f
9 passed and that there were two sections that I got 10 less than 80 in.
11 Q
And why did they inform you as to the two e
12 sections you got less than 807 13 A
Because they wanted us to beef up on it.
l 14 Q
But you still had then been licensed by 15 the NRC?
16 A
At that time I received my license, when I stated 17 I received it.
Just because you get less than 80 18.doesn't mean you fail, because this is a multi-faceted exam.
There are several areas that are going on here.
19 20 The overall grade was above passing.
Apparently, 21 like I said, I only got a pass or fail notification.
,k, 22 0
which two sections did you receive less 23 than 80?
A I think, emergency procedures, and I will 24 25 have to look up the other one.
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 49 2
Q And the two sections that you received 3
less than 80, you were supposed to receive additional 4
training in?
5 A
yes.
l 6
Q And where did you receive that training, 7
Met Edison?
O A
Correct.
I 9
Q with respect to amergency procedures, what 10 additional training did you receive?
11 A
Usually it is in the form of packets that are I
12 sent up to us that we will review and then take a 13 quiz on it sometime later by the Training Department.
[
14 Q
Packets that were sent to you, were they 15 prepared by Met Edison?
16 3
- ves, 17 Q
Did you receive an exam on the emergency i
18,, procedures?
19 l
A we received an exam sometime later.
In other 20 words, I trained on it, and later on I would get an 21 l
exam by the Training Department on it.
()
l 22 Q
Did you receive an exam sometime later i
23 on emergency procedures?
~
n A
Didn't I say that?
I said we received an 906 2-66 b
exam on it later on.
B ENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE
1 Faust 50 2
Q And were you given a grade on it?
3 A
There was a grado put on it, yes.
4 Q
And did you receive any other training
,.('
5 after that?
I 6
A we continually receive training.
7 Q
with respect to the fact that you had 8
received less than 80 on the emergency procedures 1
9 section of the NRC exam, and the NRC directed that 10 you receive additional training.
11 A
Right.
Once I get a grade greater than 80, 12 I don't get these packets any more, but I still go in 13 for additional training during my regular training 14 week that has been set up for i.a CROs and SROs.
i f
15 Q
It would cover emergency procedures 7 l
l 16 A
It would cover other areas as well that would l
17 be required for retraining, not just emergency pro-I8 ce'dures all the time.
l 19 Q
In response to the fact that in one sec-20 tion, specifically the emergency pr6cedures section 21 of the NRC licensing exam, that you received less l
(
22 than 80, you were directed to review certain packets, h
23 and at the end you would have an exam, right?
24 A
Right.
25 Q
And once you received these packets and 1906'267 BENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE
1 Faust 51 2
you reviewed them, you received an exam, correct?
3 A
- yes, 4
Q And was that the only additional training 5
with respect to the fact that you received less than 6
80 on the emergency procedures section of the NRC exam 7
that was required?
8 A
Yes.
Is that what you were looking for?
9 Q
Yes.
10 A
I already said that.
I am sorry.
11 Q
And you don't remember what the other 12 section was on the NRC exam that you received less 13 than 907 i
{
14 A
I think it was facilities design, but I can l
15 look it up.
Once again, through Training, I can get 16 it from my records.
17 Q
With respect to that section, which you 18,.think was facilities design, would you also have 19 received packets?
20 A
Yes, same thing.
21 Q
same procedure?
22 A
It would be on that area, but the same procedure 23 would be followed, yes.
24
~
Q Would you have any classroom instruction 25 with respect to these particular sections, or was it 1906 268.
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
e 1
Faust 52 2
purely a self-taught review?
3 A
I guess it would be a self-taught review.
4 Q
Did you receive any classroom instruction
- C' 5
with respect to those two sections of the NRC exam that I
6 you received less than 807 7
A No.
It was designed for the operator on his own.
f 8
What it amounts to in this case is just pulling out an l
9 emergency procedure and going over it and trying to t
l 10 memorize the whole EP or AP, whatever the case may be, 11 because I am not sure how they grade them.
I had never 12 seen them grade them.
Each person is different in what 13 he is looking for in something like that.
i i
I 14 I might have left out a word, or I might have t
I 15 left out a whole step in what I was supposed to do in I
16 the AP, but I didn't think about
- hat in the exam t
ij l'7 when I was taking it.
~
18 Q
Is the only NRC license you received this 19 control room operator's license that you got on i
20 October 20, 19777 21 A
Yes, that is the only one I received.
(
22 Q
Have you had to go through any requalifi-23 cation training?
A We are always going through requalification.
I 24 25 find it hard to distinguish between where our BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G. SERVIC
I Faust 53 2
requalification starts and begins because we are always 3
getting training, and it is always geared to requali-4 fication.
5 g
since october 20, 1977, have you been sent 6
back to the simulator of Babcock & Wilcox for training?
7 A
I was scheduled ta go there the week after the 8
28th of March.
9 Q
Between october 20, 1977 and March 28, 10 1979, you did not go?
11 A
I am having a hard time remembering where this 12 fits in.
I wen' down for approximai c 3 y a week -- I 13 don't remember if it was before or after.
I think it 14 was shortly after the eight weeks I spent down in 15 Lynchburg, where I went down with the shift.
The 16 eight weeks w.+s on my own.
17 When I c sme back, I went back on my shift, and 18 my" shift was e.:heduled to go, so I went along with 19 them.
I believe I went down, it wasn't too long after 20 that eight weeks down there that I went down again.
21 That is just something I would have to look up.
(
,I l-}
22 g
You went down for one eight-week simulator 23 training period?
24 A
Yes.
Then I went down for another week, and I 25 can't remember whether it was before or after that BENJAMlN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 270
54 1
Faust 2
eight weeks that I was down there.
I 3
Q The first eight weeks that you went down 4
to Babcock & Wilcox would have been in preparation
{'
5 for your taking your control room operator license 6
exam?
7 A
Well as the startup.
I got my startup certifi-8 cation from the B&W simulator, and it was a requirement 9
by the NRC.
eight-week period?
l 10 Q
And that was the same 11 A
That was the eight-week period, yes.
12 Q
And that was when your control room operator i
13 training was for Unit 27 I
14 A
Yes.
t j
15 Q
When you were there?
16 A
Yes.
That is another area that is sort of hard I7 to define because wo were all licensing at that time 18 on' Unit 2.
19 There were people in Unit 2 that had licenses on 20 Unit 2.
This was prior to fuel load.'
There wasn't any 21 fuel, so it wasn't a requirement to have a licensed l
(
22 operator on the control room at that time.
Licenses l
fuel in the core, so 6
23 required only when you have are
~
we were all in the training status.
We were not 24 25 licensed operators at the time.
We were CRO in Unit 2.
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906:271
1 Faust 55 2
Q And you went down for a second eight-week 1
3 session at asw?
4 A
No, I went down for a week.
5 Q
For a week?
~~
6 A
Right.
7 Q
And that would have been with your shift?
8 A
Right.
9 Q
And do you know when that was?
l 10 A
No.
What I am saying is I don't remember right 11
- ogg, f.
12 MR. YUSPEH:
In any case, it was with 13 reasonable proximity to the eight weeks?
l 14 THE WITNESS:
Yes.
15 MR. YUSPEH:
You are not certain whether 16 it was before or after?
17 THE WITNESS:
I think it was after, but 18 I just don't remember what period of time it was.
19 I don't remember exactly when.
20 Q
was it before october 20, 19777 21 3
- yes, 22 Q
So between October 20, 1977 and March 28, 23 1979, you did not go back to the B&W simulator?
24 A
As far as I remember, I didn't.
I am trying.not 25 to make an absolute statement on something I can't BENJAMIN REPORTING IC
1 Faust 56 2
remember which you could find in the records from the 1
3 Met Ed's Training Department.
4 Q
But you are required by training to attend I
5 the simulator about once a year?
6 A
Yes.
I believe it is every two years.
Now I 7
think it is changed or it has been changed to every 8
year.
9 Q
Prior to March 28, 1979, it was every two f
10 years?
II A
I think it was being changed at that time to i
12 every year, prior to it, I believe.
13 Q
In your simulator course at B&W, were you l
14 instructed as to small break LOCA?
15 3
y,,,
16 Q
Do you remember specifically what you were i
i 17 instructed?
i I8
,A Hold it.
Small break LOCA at that time, there 19 two differentiations of small break LOCA.
There was 20 is one where you just have a leak, and there is another 2I one where you either lose your vital power supply to L- '
22 your makeup pumps or lose the capacity of the makeup 23 pumps.
That is the small break LOCA which is different
~~
24 from the small break LOCA which is a leak in the primary 25 system that you can keep up with the capacity of your BENJAMIN R EPO RTING. S ERVIC E
4 I
Faust 57 2
makeup pumps.
3 we were trained in the small break LocA that we 4
could keep up the capacity of the makeup pumps because i
5 this other requirement hadn't been out there yet.
~
6 This has come out since then, where we actually have a 7
procedure written up, and we trained on shifts and-in 8
classrooms for the small break LocA requirement that 9
now you pick up one of the emergency procedures for l
10 that sp'ecific thing.
11 Q
And do you remember what you were instructed?
i I
12 A
well, we ran the drills on it is what it amounted 13 to.
As far as the instruction on it, you carry out 14 what the emergency procedure tells you to'do.
On the 15 small break LocA, what it amounts to is trying to deter-16 mine where your leak is from.
You know you can keep I7 l
up with the capacity of it.
f 18 The next thing you want to do is determine what t
I 19 the size of the Icak is, so that you are within your 20 toch spec limitations, 10 gpm; if it is a secondary 21 leak, it is 1 gpm.
If you exceed those, you end up
([,I 22 shutting down.
I 23 Q
were the emergency procedures used at 24 Babcock & Wilcox the ones that you used at Three Mile i906274 95
~
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 58 2
A Yes, as well as they could apply it, yes.
That i
3 is what I am saying.
We would use our EP, but they just didn't apply to Babock & Wilcox's hardware, what 4
5 they had.
In other words, you are feeding into a
~ ~ ~
6 computer bank down there, and up here you are feeding 7
into a piping system.
You are actually controlling i
8 your valve out here, but there you were telling your 9
simulator on the tape and just pushing a button, and 10 it repeats it back and says that you might have to do 11 something, and at TMI up here you get the same result.
12 Q
You would use emergency procedures as 13 approved and drafted for TMI?
f 14 A
Right.
15 Q
At that point for Unit 1 or Unit 27 l
16 A
At that point, I think we were using Unit 1's; l
17 I could be wrong on that.
I know we were still doing 18 ou'r procedures in Unit 2 as far as going over EPs and 19 ensuring that they applied fully to the situation that 20 was called for.
21 I don't remember if I had Unit 2 copics there or I
l 22 Unit 1 because a lot of them -- all you were doing a 23 lot of times' was just changing a couple of valves and
~
~
24 enable the procedure from Unit 1 to 2,
that is.
a small break 25 Q
now would you identify that BENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE a
1 l
1 59 i
Faust 2
had occurred?
3 A
Decrease it mikeup tank level with MUV-17 opening, 4
increasing pressurizer levels in other words, an increase i(7 5
in demand for makeup.
6 Some of the other things you might be looking for,-~
7 depending where it is at, you could be looking for two i
8 main symptoms.
You would he seeing an increase in e
i 9
demand on the makeup system with decreasing pressurizer I
10 level, possibly.
When I say decreasing pressurizer P
11 level, you get to the point where you have got to put 12 the other makeup pump on, that one makeup pump isn't 13 keeping up with it.
i 14 So what you would actually be looking for is 15 decreasing makeup with Muv-17 opening and maintaining l
16 or attempting to maintain the pressurizer icvel at 17 220 inches, and you would be batching in, feeding 18
~
the makeup tank to keep the makeup pumps up.
_into 19 That would be an indication of, did you say small 20 break LocA?
21 l
g
- yes, A
Right.
I am gearing it to a leak in the system, 22 23 small break LocA in that sense with a loss of vital a
power supply, which would be either one of the two 24 a makeup pump did not pick up or could not 25 v-buses, or BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE 19.06 276
i 60 1
Faust 2
be started, along with decrease in makeup tank, with j
l 3
the opening of Muv-17 or increased demand in your 4
primary system within the capacity of the makeup pumps, 5
which are also high-pressure injection pumps.
6 Q
What would let you be able to identify 8
7 where the break occurred?
8 A
That depends.
One of the places you would look 9
or could look on something like that would be you could 10 look in the reactor coolant drain: tank. This is just 11 to try to indicate where a leak might be from, in j
v 12 which under normal situations, you could look for an 13 increase in temperature in the drain tank, an' increase 14 in pressure in the drain tank, an increase in level in i
i 15 the drain tank, and you could also look for scaled tight, l
16 temperatures that you are hearing about, which under l
17 normal situations -- what I am saying is normal -- no 18 leakage through the code relief valve, or the electro-19 matic relief valve, in which the temperature would be i
20 less than 130 degrees.
21 Then you could be looking for an increase in I
22 temperature there.
This is just to locate it to a i
23 possible leak through your codes or electromatics.
24 To find the general area it is coming from, 25 that is one place you could look.
Another place BENJAMIN REPORTING. SERVICE 1906 277"
1 Faust 61 2
you could look would be for a change in steam generator 3
level for a possible leak, in which you would have a a decreasing 4
possibic 7 or 8 alarm, or you could have 8
5 rate into this steam generator if the leak break were 6
large enough.
In other words, the steam generator power levels 7
level, you wouldn't have the same flow as f
so given power level, you wouldn't have that flow.
The 8
[
9 flow would be less than what would be required at that 10 power level.
That is a hard area to see.
It would 11 have to be a large leak to be able to determine that.
12 Then if you had a leak in the makeup system, 13 somewhere in your letdown lines, you could try iso-f 14 lating portions of it to see if the leak were downstream 15 of it.
.You could try and isolate, let it down to see 16 if you isolated your leak source from there.
You could 17 look for building radiation alarms that you theoretically 18
_sho$1d get on a small leak also in the 727 RMS. system.
it monitors the fuel-handling 19 I doubt if you want l
20 bridge in the reactor.
It monitors to~try to determine l
if you have an increase in activity level, so actually 21 k-3 22 if you have a icak inside the reactor building, which l
23 is a pretty large area, you try to figure out where you are at, that is, where the leak is at.
This is
~
'4 just to determine where the leak is from..
25 A
BENJAMIN R EPORTING S ERVICE M06.278~
i 62 Faust 1
2 What we would use to determine whether we are 3
shutting down in a small break LocA would be the toch
{
4 spec criteria that I stated earlier, that I stated one 5
of, and which determines whether we operate or not.
l s 6
We had a classic examp.le where we were operating 7
within tech spec limits with a known that was less than 8
that required for unidentified leakage from the primary 9
on March 28th.
10 Q
Itow long would it take you to recognize 11 that you did have a small break?
12 A
With or without loss of makeup pumps?
13 Q
Without.
14 A
It is hard to answer.
It shouldn't take long.
15 You have to figure out what your leak rate possibly I
i i
16 was, depending on how fast the makeup tank went down, I
i 17 that would draw that operator's attention to it.
There 18 would probably be a low-level alarm in the makeup tank.
19 hhat depends on whether you have a 10-gpm leak down e
20 to a half-gpm, and with,30 gallons a minute in the 21 makeup tank, you figure out if the operator happened 92 to be looking right at the tank, he would know.
23 If the operator, which we were doing, were making 24 batches into the makeup tank to make up for evaporation 25 of the pressurizer, he would be aware of a slivat BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906.2.79..
l 63 1
Faust 2
increasing leakage, a leak rate in the plant.
l 3
Therefore, we were getting closer to our tech o
l 4
spec limits where we would have been required to shut 5
down.
6 It'is just not a flat out answer.
You can't just~-~
7 say yes or no on something like that.
)
8 Q
In your D&W simulator course, were you I
9 instructed as to voiding in the core?
there was a period of 10 A
We talked about it f
11 time, in other words, somewhere in our training where 12 we talked about voiding in the core itself.
We did not l
13 talk about what we would see in relationship to, like, f
14 pressurizer.
15 Q
Do you remember what you were instructed?
16 A
No, not right off.
I can tell you the way I 17 believe it was.
i 18 Q
okay.
19 A
I don't remember right off what I was instructed.
20 voiding in the core, for one thing at'that time usually was associated with a major LOCA.
There wasn't any 21
_')
22 question about where you were going. and you would end 23 up on high-pressure injection eventually on the piggy-24 back operation in cooling the core.
I believe it 25 involved a break in the hot leg and/or a possible B ENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICC 1906 280_..==
f 1
Faust 64 2
break in the hot leg or break in the cold leg on the 3
reactor, which just depressurized, and what you ended 4
up doing was high-pressure injection cooling the core 5
and removing the decay heat.
It is the basic thing 6
you end up doing.
7 As an operator, you verify certain things that were coming down to ensure that they occur as they 8
are supposed to.
If they don't, you work on it so it 9
10 does.
I 11 Q
That is the only example you would have 12 been given concerning voiding in the core?
13 A
Concerning voiding in the core, this is what I am saying.
Specifically, I can't remember talking 14 15 about voiding in the core in that sense because this was realized.
I mean, you shear a line like that, 16 17 and you lose your pressure, and you definitely will 18.have a boiling in the core.
It is not that terrible f
19 in that sense as long as you keep your high-pressure i
20 injection going and you cool the' core,' that you won't 21 have core damage.
That is the point of view that we were instructed on it that I can best remember.
l 22 3
23 (A brief recess was then taken.)
24 1906 281 25 BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G SERVICE
t 65 1
Faust sm/ew 2
Q Could you explain to me what happens a.1 3
routinely on a shift?
4 A
Routinely on a shift, one man there are two
(
5 operators normally in a control room, minimum, as far i
. _ ~
6 as control room cnos and one of them would assume 7
switching and tagging duties, and the other one would 8
assume the desk, which is usually referred to as the 9
panel.
In other words, he would be primarily in charge f
10 of watching, monitoring the panels for the plant, what f
11 is going on, manipulating control valves if necessary, f
I2 or adding batches, borating or deborating, correcting 6
13 auxilliary operators, which is usually just a function f
l 14 of him relaying the message of what the foremen want 15 done or just things that we know have to be checked 16 into depending on what is happening in the plant.
That i
17 would be his, as a contrcl room operator, job on the l0
, panel.
I9 Switching and tegging involves writing up safety
~
20 plans.
sometimes it gets involved in surveillance 21 during a shift.
Ile also takes normal readings on the
([ }
22 different parameters in the plant during a shift which --
23 in other words, he is there not only to keep the paper-94 work end of it out of the way of the man who is "5
watching the panel, but he is also there in case th e re B ENJ AMIN R EPO RTIN G SERVICE
4 1
Faust 66 a.2 2
is a problem.
The panel is too hard for just one man 3
to4 handle to be able to safely look at everything and 4
try to determine what is happening in the plant.
That 4
)
5 is where the switching and tagging operator comes into 6
the play too.
7 Is that routinely enough?
8 g
would you monitor certain gauges routinely?
9 A
Yes, just the logs that I take require I look at 10 certain gauges on the panel.
Shift and Dailies require 11 tech spec items that have to be looked at each shift f
12 as far as putting just a checkmark s a yin g,
"Yes, the 13 operator looked at it and it was in the rangs it was 14 supposed to be in ce reading what it was supposed to l
15 be reading."
Specific valves that are to be checked 16 in position are also on this list which are checked off 17 l
each shift, depending on the requirements by tech spces I
18 for duration of checking it.
19 A lot of times I think you will find -- in fact, 20 you will find it all the time, that it is done more 21 frequently than is required by tech specs as far as N!
)
22 checking items on the plant as far as valves and 23 readings that are taken.
In that sense, yes.
~
4 Q
What re adin gs are you required to take?
25 A
I will go over and get you a copy of the procedure BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 283
l 1
Faust 67 I
2 if you want, instead of just listing them all on it.
a.3 operating procedure ?
3 Q
Is there an 4
A It is a shift and Dailies that will give you the 5
list of everything that I am required to look at during
- ~ ~ ~ ~
6 the shift time period, each shift. That would be 7
easier than me trying to rattic them all off.
O MS. COLDFRANK:
Off the record.
I 9
(Discussion was held off the re co rd. )
e 10 MS. coLDFRANK:
we would like to request t
l 11 that you provide us with what has been re fe rre d l
12 to as Shift and Dailies.
I 13 Q
Is there any monitoring done pursuanc to 14 Metropolitan Edison's procedures that are not re qui re d 15 under the tech specs?
16 A
You mean in addition to the tech specs?
{
17 g
y,3, It is hard to separate tech specs for me because 18 j[~
19 it just becomes every day that you just get used to l.
20 doing them.
2I Q
You referred to something called the log
(
)
22 book.
A Yes, okay, in that sense, yes.
There are other
- 3 things that aren't tech spec requirements that we do
~
94 that are just general good enginee ring practices to 25 B ENJ AMIN R EPORTING SERVICE 1906 284
i 1
Faust 68 i
I a.4 2
keep in tune with what the plant is doing.
If you see 3
them changing over a period of time, it can tell you of 4
a problem source developing in the plant.
p/
5 Q
And these are recorded in something called
~
6 a log book?
7 A
It is not a book, it is a log sheet.
I just 8
don't remember offhand -- I don't know if there is a 9
specific name given to it.
10 Q
And this would be something that would be 11 gone through in each shift?
l 12 A
Right.
13 MS. GOLDFRANK:
I would like to request 14 that we be provided with a log sheet also.
15 Q
Do you remember what specific things are t
16 monitored daily on each shift on a Jog sheet?
i 17 A
Yes.
Do you want me to list them?
If you get the 18 s h'e e t, it will save you a lot of time writing.
If you 19 just want to find _out if I know it, I will tell you 20 them.
21 MR. ROCKWELL:
Off the record.
I fQ 22 (Discussion was held off the re co rd. )
23 Q
In a routine shift, is radiation monitored?
1906 285 24 x
ye"-
25 Q
And that is something that you would --
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
1 Faust 69 a.5 2
A It is on the logs.
We are required to check our 3
radiation monitors every eight hours at the end of the 4
shift.
In other words, it is a checkoff for -- the r'
5 monitors on variable pen recorder monitors at the back
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
6 of the panel that we go and pull out the log sheet and 7
look to see if there was any change, in other words, if 8
se had an increase, and note why an increase -- in Ii 9
other words, find out the reason why it might have gone 10 up, or if it just went up and came down, try to figure f
11 out why that happened.
It is a daily routine to do i
12 that, shiftly routine to do that.
13 Q
In your training at n&w, were radiation 14 monitors something that you were taught to observe?
i 15 A
Yes.
We were taught in the sense that B&W did i
i l
16 not focus on reading the radiation monitors, that was 17 not their job, but in our training they had alarms and 18 monitoring panels mock setups -- in other words, of an i
19 RMs system -- it might not have been a Victorene --
l 20 I don't know what brand they were -- but, yes, they had f
21 radiation monitors that would give us an indication in
,;(
one of our systems that we have this alarm that is 22 f
f 23 pending up on the recorder.
24 Q
And when you would go through a simulation, 25 these radiation monitors would be geared into the t906-286 BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE lyUO LUJ
I, P
1 Faust 70 a.6 2
instrument?
3 A
Right.
If you want to look for something specific 4
thete,that was one of the major differences between a 5
major steam leak and a LoCA.
It was one of the total 6
separating distinctions between them, is getting that 7
radiation alarm, because it tells you whether you have 8
a steam leak, which would be giving you all the 9
symptoms of a LoCA, versus a primary leak.
10 Q
Earlier you had been describing some small 11 break LOCAS, one involving the makeup tank level.
12 Could you describe to me what you were assuming was 13 causing that change in the makeup tank level?
14 A
Could have been a leak anywhere in the system, 15 primary system anywhere, could have been packing leak, 16 could have been a body or structural leak in the valve, 17 in the material itself, a welt, could have been a leak 18 from the top of the core, could have been a leak from i
19 you name it.
Every square inch of that pipe in there, 20 it could cover a leak from that point.
21 It is unlikely that it would be, in my opinion,
((-
i 2'9 a leak from the piping itself for a small leak like that, t
23 to me.
That is not saying it wouldn't happen.
~
Q Why do you say it would be unlikely?
25 A
It is just not due to the testing th a t is done B ENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE 1906' 287
o 1
Faust 71 a.7 2
in the system, why, it just doesn't seem like that on l
3 the primary system you would have some of the pipe wall
'l fail like th a t.
It is possible though because of 5
porosity and welts'and whatnot that you may have a
~
6 possibility, which is once again if we detect that, 7
could determine where that comes from -- if we have 8
unknown leakage, we can go up to one GPM on it if we I
9 suspect or have any feelings that it is from a pipe' 10 wall in the primary system boundary -- in other words, f
any leakage from that point.
There is no upper limit 11 on it, it is a shutdown immediately, a controlled shut-12 13 down because it is not an evolution to get upset about.
14 In othe r words, it is not something you just trip the f
15 reactor and come down, you just do a control check on that kind of leakage, if it is identified as that.
i 16 17 In other words, during operations, if we have a 18 leak, we will try to find this small leak and what it 19 will involve.
If we can't determine from outside where 20 it is, during operations, we will actually go into the i
21 building to determine where the leak comes from because 22 the radiation levels are acceptable to entries in the 23 building outside of the "D"
ring, and even at times 24 inside the "D" ring, depending on what th'e conditions 25 are, what the power level and whatnot.
b ENJAMIN REPORTING S ERVI'C E 1906 28~8-
1 1
Faust 72 a.8 2
Q W3th respect to the makeup tank level, is 3
there an alarm connected with it?
4 A
Low level alarm and low level alarm on the makeup
(
5 tanks, yes.
6 Q
What do those tell you?
7 A
That we have a decreasing level in the makeup 8
tank.
It is just an alarm that you have a problem i 9
inside of the tank that once you uncover it or -- not 10 in this type; this type is set up differently.
This 11 comes off the instrumentation itself where you get to 12 certain level in the tank and it keys you to, yes, a
i 13 I have a problem.
If it gets to 18 inches, it does i
{
14 something else; it will also key you that you better f
15 get busy.
i 16 When we get to the low level alarm in the makeup 17 tank, we are con ce rn e d right away, don't get me wrong.
I8 When you get to 18 inches in it, if a valve is out of 19 position, a valve that will ible e d the makeup tank from i
20 letdown -- this is just returning an water from the 21 reactor coolant bleed tank -- shifting this valve to 99 i
vent it into the makeup tank.
So you are not removing i
23 water, you are putting it back into the system.
You eg are taking the water from the system and putting it 19D6 289 25 back in; you are not moving it out.
BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE
?
1 Faust 73 sm/ew 2
Q Could you explain to me again what the
- b.9 3
eight inches --
4 A
18 inches is just another alarm lower in the tank.
5 What that does, if you get down the re and we are doing I
6 a bleed relief operation in the plant, which amounts 7
to taking water out and not putting it in the makeup 8
tank -- if you put it in the makeup tank, you are 9
putting it in the system.
If you position this MUV-8, 10 why, it will feed to the bleed tanks -- this is just 11 another set of tanks off to the side the 18-inch 12 alarm on this tank just merely shifts that valve to 13 feed into the makeup tank to conserve your volume of 14 primary.
You don't want to bleed your water off if 15 you have acleak somewhere, you want to try and keep it
{
16 in.
T l
17 The operator would have done the action long
- i 18 before that.
19 Q
considering a small break that did not 20 involve leakage from valves, how long would it take you i
21 to identify from where that break was?
- h. 1 22 A
Once again, you can't answer that question right 23 out, you have got too many considerations.
You could og try to determine where it leaks from in a specific area 25 of the system by performing isolation on -- what you d'o BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 290
l t
1 Faust 74 9
b.10 in the control room, once you started involving 3
auxilliary operators in it and others to -- in other 4
words go out and isolate specific parts in the plant, 5
t you are talking about a lot longer time period.
6 I am just trying to say it is hard to say.
What I think you are looking for is that the operator 8
recognizes that he has a small leak.
The operator can 9
recognize that he has a small leak, especially if he is 10 looking for one.
Ile is trained to look for one in a 11 small period of time.
i l
12 g
What do you consider a small period of time?
13 A
From where he is
- going, just operating the 14 plan t, well I wou'd say within five minutes time period, i
15 I
I would say, he could identify it, that he had a leak.
t 16 Q
So from the time that he identifies that he 17 has a leak, it would take about five minutes to ascertain j
wheNe that leak was coming from?
A No, he would identify that he has a leak in the i
system.
Determining where it is at in the system is 21 what takes time.
- (~ l I
99 j
We have tech spec limits on things.
One of the
"~
i 23 1
things he would be doing is doing a leak rate, figuring 9'4
~
how much our leakage is so that we would know whether we "5
9 are within our tech spec limits or not.
If we exceed BENJAMIN REPORTING SERVICE 1906 291
1 Faust 75 9
b.ll our tech spec limits that are set and we haven't 3
identified the leak, we then are required to shut down 4
within a given period of time.
If we are within our t
5 tech spec limit, th'en we havi and we can operate l
6 like that -- but that wouldr ' t be the end of it -- we 7
would be looking to determine where the leak is coming 0
from.
9 Q
could you give me a specific example?
10 A
Sure, March 28.
We hadr leakage from the code 11 relief valves, at least we though. we did.
This leakage 19 had been slowly developing and growing, but we were 13 still within our one GPM leakage rate.
We determined, j
I4 from looking at our RTD tail pipe temperatures that we 15 i
felt the leak was from the codes, the code relie f valve,
i 16 6
one of the codes were leaking, because they were at a 17 l
higher temperature than the electromatic RTD excuse me, sorry, they are not RTD, they are thermocouples.
19 These are temperature sensing devices strapped to the 0
outside of the pipe.
So it out us into -- we knew we 21 had leakage and we determined what we thought it was
-)
i
'"99 coming from was from the code relief valves due to the i
23 RTD temperature indications, and we proceeded to 9~4 operate within leakage allowed by our tech specs.
25 If we were to exceed that leakage, we would have BENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE
.1906 292
4 1
Faust 76 b.12 2
had to shut down.
3 So it is right to the case now.
That is why we 4
were seeing high temperatures above 130 and around 5
200 degrees which became normal to use operating at that 6
time because we had been operating for quite awhile with 7
this leakage and we were already doing our required leak 8
rates every shift to insure that we were within 9
required leakage conditions by tech specs.
10 Q
With respect to the instructions th at you l
11 received while training at the B&W simulator, did you 4
12 specifically receive instructions concerning voiding 13 of the core in a small break LocA7 i,
14 A
I don't remember talking about it in that sense l
15 because on a small break LocA we don't have problems l
16 with maintaining pressure.
In o the r wo rds, we are 17 required by our operating procedures to maintain 2155 18 pounds pressure on a small break LOCA to re s tore the 19 pressurizer level to 220 inches and be able to keep up 20 with the rate of leakage by additions to the makeup
~
21 tanks.
k'
)
22 I just don't remember talking specifically voiding.
I 23 That is not saying we didn't.
I don't believe we
~
24 talked about voiding in that sense along with a small 25 break LocA because I don't know why, probably because BENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G SERVICE 1906 293.
i 1
Paust 77 b.13 2
we just never assumed in a leak that we would be 3
controlling that pressure would be allowed to get low.
4 In other words it was just you would trip the reactor 5
off if you went below 1900 pounds on a low pressure 1
~ ~ ~ ~
6 trip and you would end up shutting down.
So it wasn't 7
7 question of operating with a small leakage like that a
i 8
and pressure low.
9 Is that called dancing around a question?
I don't 10 know.
I am not trying to, T am just trying to say I 11 don't remember specifically talking about that combina-12 tion.
I think if somebody would come out and say, 13
" Pressure is getting low, what would happen," we all l
14 knew what would happen, we would start steaming, we
{
15 would shift the bubble from the pressurizei if the l
16 temperature in the pressurizer were allowed to drop into I
17 the core region.
j I
18 Q
why don't we 19 A
If the temperature was allowed to drop in the 20 pressurizer, that is why I am caying it is hard to say.
21 It is hard to say we are not aware of it because we are
(+< s
)
aware of voiding.
If you sat down with an operator and 23
- said, "I
am going to let pressure go down to here, what
~
24 is going to happen with the temperature above satura-25 tion to that pressure?"
l906 294 B ENJAMIN R EPO RTIN G S ERVICE
I Faust 78 b.14 2
g My question was concerning whether or not 3
you received specific instructions at the B&W simulator.
4 MR. YUsPEH:
Why don't you answer that yes 5
or no 7 t
6 A
No.
7 THE WITNESS:
I don't think it is a yes or 8
no answer.
9 MS. GOLDFRANK:
Why don't we recess for 10 today.
We will continue your deposition i
11 tomorrow.
I 12 (Whereupon, the deposition was adjourned 13 at 8:15 p.m.)
14 I
i 15 Craig C.
Faust l
16 i
j 17 subscribed and sworn to 18 be[ ore me this_________
19 day of_________________
r 20 1979 21
()
Notary Public 1
22 i
i 23 00o 24
~
190'6 295~
25 BENJAMIN R EPO RTING S ERVICE
1 79 2
I ND E X
$31EEES E3EESI 4
Craig C.
Faust 3
5 7
8 EXUIaITE 9
FAUST DEPOSITION 10 ggg_IgggIIgIC3IIgg gagg 11 1
Resume of Craig C.
Faust 3
12 13 14 15 16 17 i
oo 18 19 20 21
-(-
22 l
}
23 24 1906 296 2s BENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE
b.15 1
80 2
C-E-R-T-I-F-I-C-A-T-E 3
STATE OF NEW YORK
)
)
ss:
4 COUNTY OF NEW YORK
)
(
(
5 we, STEPHEN McCRYSTAL, Notary Public of the 6
State of New York and STANLEY RUDBARG, Certified 7
Shorthand Reporter and Notary Public of the State of 0
New York, do hereby ce r ti f y that the foregoing depo si tion 9
of CRAIG C.
FAUST was taken before us on the 22nd day 10 of July, 1979.
11 The said witness was duly sworn before the 19 commencement of his testimony; that the said te s timony 13 taken stenographically by ourselves and then was 14 transcribed.
15 The within transcript is a true record of 16 the said deposition.
17 We are not related by blood or marriage to 18 any of the said parties, nor interes ted directly or t
i 19 4
indirectly in the matter in controversy, nor are we in
'0 9
the employ of any of the counsel.
91 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, we have hereunto set
/
i s
99
-- V our hands th i s _ _r, l _ _ d ay of July, 1979.
~~
n i
3 Vj )
_ _ _ _g ; _ _ ad_{sk _ _ fl e qu j 4
_____=_qr___r_i_(J_t,_'__
STEP'l!EN McCRYSTAb STANLEY RUDBARG, CSR 25 BENJAMIN R EPO RTING SERVICE 1906 297
-