ML19208B132
| ML19208B132 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Crane  |
| Issue date: | 07/07/1979 |
| From: | Fasano A, Wright T Metropolitan Edison Co, NRC Office of Inspection & Enforcement (IE Region I) |
| To: | |
| References | |
| TASK-TF, TASK-TMR NUDOCS 7909190092 | |
| Download: ML19208B132 (44) | |
Text
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1 I
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA l
NUCLEAR REGULAT0nf COMMISSION i
In the Matter of:
2 IE TMI INVESTIGATION INTERVIEW 3!
of Mr. Thomas Wright, Instrument Man, Nuclear i
Si Gi i
71 8!
Trailer #203 9j NRC Investigation Site l
TMI Nuclear ?cwer Plant 1 01 Middletown, Pennsylvania 11!
June 15, 1979 12' (Date of Interview) 13!
July 7,1979
_ (Date Transcript Typec)
- 310 15I (Tape Numcer(s))
16i 17' 18!
196 20i 21; NRC PERSONNEL:
29' Mr. Anthony Fasano Mr. James S. Creswell 23;:
fir. Owen C. Shackleton 24' QC, l
C"U CU) 7909'90 0 9,2 Y
l l
l lj SHACXLETON:
The time is now 2:32 p.m., Eastern Daylight Time, and my 2
name is Owen C. Shackleton, and we are present conducting an interview 3;
of Mr. Thomas, first name is the usual spelling, T as in Tom, HOMAS, f
middle initial J as in Jim, the last name is Wright.
It's spelled W 4
5l as in William, RIGHT.
Mr. Wright is an instrument man, first class, 6i nuclear, with the Metropolitan Edison Company assigned to the Three 7j Mile Island Nuclear Power Station. This interview is taking place in I
8!
Trailer #203, which is parked just outside the south security gate at g;
the Three Mile Island facility.
Present to conduct this interview 10!
fr m the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission is Mr. Anthony, first name y
usual spelling, ANTHONY, middle initial N as in Nancy, Fasano.
Last g
name is spelled F as in Frank, ASANO.
Mr. Fasano is an Inspection 13 Specialist, Performance Appraisal Branch, Inspection and Enforcement, h
Reactor Construction Inspection presently assigned to Region I.
Also 15i present from the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission is Mr. James S.
Creswell.
g The first name is the usual spelling; James, middle initial S as in Sam.
The last name Creswell, C as in Charlie, RESWELL.
Mr.
g.
Creswell is a Reactor Inspector assigned to Region III.
My name is Owen C. Shackleton.
First name is 0 as in Oboe, WEN. Middle initial C as in Charlie, last name Shackleton, spelled 5 as in Sam, HACXLETON.
I'm an investigator assigned to Region V.
Just prior to beginning this interview on tape, I presented to Mr. Wright a two paged document t
from the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission, which explains the authority 2 31 of the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Ccmmission to conduct this interview 241 and the scope and purpose of the interview.
It also identifies Mr.
C h h, Ohb
I 2
lj Wright's right to refuse to be interviewed and the right to refuse to 2!
submit any form of a signed statement.
It also advised Mr. Wright of i
3i his right to have a person of his choice present for this interview.
4 On the second page of this document are three questions and I'm going 5;
to ask Mr. Wright at this time, to respond to them orally for the I
6; purpose of the record.
Mr. Wright, did you understand the two paged 7
document that I'm referring to?
I 8l g;
WRIGHT:
Yes.
10I 3
SHACXLETON: And do we have your permission to tape this interview?
12' 13)
WRIGHT:
Yes.
14)
SHACXLETON:
1 And on the third question, in which we ask you if you
. g; 16; want a copy of the tape, you responded "no."-
Is that correct?
17' WRIGHT:
Yes, that is correct.
19i SHACXLETON:
Alright.
Thank you.
Mr. Wright, now for the purposes of
,0, the record and for those persons wno will be interestad in your testimony, would you briefly give us your education and work experience in the nuclear field.
23l 24!
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WRIGHT:
Education would be... I'm a graduate of Lebonan Valley College, 2{
a B.S.
I was a physics major.
As far as work, past work experience 3;
before I was hired by Metropolitan Edison, I worked as a TV repairman 4j for 7 years.
In the course of that I've met an instrument foreman by l
the name of Don Barry and he got me, he got me interested in applying r
6i for the job since I have the electronics background that was needed.
7j And I applied and I was hired as an instrument man, Second Class.
I g
worked as an instrument man, Second Class, for about a year and a half g
to..., yeah, about a year and a half.
And then I was promoted to 10 instrument man, First Class.
11!
SHACKLETON:
Thank you.
This interview is taking place on June 15, g
13l 1979.
I'll now turn the questioning over to Mr. Creswell.
14:
reswe spea ng.
e ryu g
ack to 15 e
y arch 2m, M, and teH us when you came on dug and 16 what the conditions were whenever you came onsite.
18i 1
WRIGHT:
191 I got into the gate out by the Unit 2 Search Trailer there, we can still come in through that way.
We got to the gate approximately
<.0 10 minutes to 5 minutes of 7 and the guard had just informed us as he 21; locked the gate behind us that we better get up to the control room; 22!
they just declared a general emergency.
So, I wasn't sure what was 231 going on, so we, my partner and I wera riding together at the time.
24)
So, we both walked up to the control room and when I walked into the 25i g
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1l control room I saw quite a few people standing around.
I looked over 2{
at the control room panel and I saw the radiation monitor lights that 3j were lit up and I saw my one foreman standing at one corner right at t
4l the door, and his name Doug Weaver.
I saw him and I said, "This isn't Sj a drill, is it?" and he said, "No.
Its the real thing." So, that's l
6 were I started at about 5 minutes of 7.
7 CRESWELL:
Jim, you mentioned that the guard said there had been a g
g general emergency. Was it a general emergency or a site emergency?
10I WRIGHT:
He said, just as we got inside the gate, you know, when he
]
locked the gate behind us, he said that they'd just declared a general emergency.
14!
se a eme en y.
ay.
, y u went on up in the 15i control room, you mentioned somebody was with you.
Who was that?
S 17!
WRIGHT:
Yes. That's my partner who was on shift at the time with me.
18!
His name is Willie Wrignt.
19!
20!
CRE5WELL:
Willie Wright?
22l WRIGHT:
Yes.
Same last name but the first name is Willie.
23l 24l 25!
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CRESWELL:
Now you entered the control room, you mentioned that there 2!
were cuite a few people in the control room.
i 3!
4!
WRIGHT:
Y.e s.
Si 6
CRESWELL: Were there a number of people back behind or in front of 7j the panels whenever you got there?
8!
WRIGHT: What do you mean by in front of the panels?
g; 101 CRESWELL:
There's a line that is drawn across...
11:
12' WRIGHT:
131 No, everybody was pretty well standing back letting the 74 operators do their job. They were just, they were concerned onlookers that's what it seemed...
But, I don't know exactly who all was there g;
because everyone was mulling around in the back, you know, trying to watch what was happening and see what was going on.
18!
CRESWELL:
Okay.
, 91 1
20:
WRIGHT:
And we were told that the maintenance pecple that were there were all mustering over into the one office that was what was called the startup office.
It's now Sample Board Meter's office.
It's a little room to the left of the control room.
We were mustering there 241 to standbv until the time that we were needed.
25r 4
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1.!
CRESWELL:
Is that where you saw Doug Weaver?
l 2 '
3j WRIGHT:
Doug was standing right inside the door of the control room i
4j and that's, he's one of the first people I saw as I entered into the 5j control room.
i 61 7
CRESWELL:
Could you give me an estimate at to how many people were at i
8l the control panels themselves?
9i WRIGHT:
101 I honestly don't know how many were at the panels.
There is g
just, you know, there's about 30 or so people standing in the back
]
corner there by the door, you know, trying to say back out of the way.
13ly CRESWELL:
You couldn't give me an estimate as how many were actually at the panels?
15, 16!
I WRIGHT:
No, because I really didn't see.
I looked up at the monitors 17,,
ISl and I saw that they were lit up and then Doug just said, you know, go back and stand by and we all tried to stand back and wait to be called.
20!
CRESWELL:
What's the next thing that happens?
22l WRIGHT:
The next thing that happened for me? We were told by Doug that Ivan would want us to hook up some things.
They were talking,...
24i Let me just try to comprehend...
Yeah,wewerestandingbywaitingto[]
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be called, that's how it was, and Doug came in and said, "Ivan's gonna 2j want some things hooked up.
Go and get a fluke ready and go with 3j Ivan." And, now this wasn't right away, its about maybe half an hour 4
to 15 minutes, somewhere in that area after we got there...
5!
CRESWELL:
Is that what from...
Gi 7!
WRIGHT: So that's since about quarter after to 7:30, somewhere in that area.
g 10i CRESWELL:
Okay...
12!
WRIGHT:
I really don't know.
So, we were told by Ivan that he wanted i
13) tr.; take some temperature readings on the incore thermocouples that the computer had, the computer was reading offscale, so it was just reading question marks.
So, what he wanted to do was go down and take the thermocouple readings down at where the thermocouples came into the IT I
comouter cabiret.
So, we got a, we hunted around for a digital thermoccuple reader that would take type K thermoccuple and when we found it then we went down, and he said, "Just take some random data.
Take the ones 20!
that are easy to get to, or, you know, just take some data whichevers, 21:
you know, whichevers the best, and, you know, take about 5 or so and 22!
then let me know what you get."
So, we proceeded to take off the 23!
thermoccuples from the computer cabinet and hook them up to the thermocouple 24!
reader. We took just a spattering list of the ones that were easy to 25i c, up, c
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Ilj get te since we didn't have any set ones that we were told to measure.
2 And we may have put those on the thermocouple reader and marked those, 3
jotted those down on just a scrap of paper that we had handy so that f
we could transmit the. data time.
After we got about the 5 or so, Ivan 4
5 had come down at-that same time.
He was down there right as we were I
6 just finishing up taking the first couple sets of data; the first 5 or 7
And he, we showed him the numbers that we got and a couple of so.
I 8j numbers were fairly low; you know, like one in particular was a reading, g;
I guess, around 200 some degrees.
We had most of them reading somewhere 10j around 400 to tiOO, I believe, and we had one at least that was around y
2,100, 2,200, somewheres slightly over 2,000 degrees.
And Ivan said he didn't know that looked good.
You know, he sas in the process of getting quite a few other things, too.
But he said that the data didn't look good.
He wanted us to try another means of measuring the data.
So, we went up and we were trying to find another thermocouple reader, but then it was suggested to use a millivolt meter and simply measure the millivolts...
17;:
18!
CRESWELL: Who did suggest it?
20l WRIGHT:
It was made by, I believe, Skip Bennett.
I'm not sure because Ivan mignt have said it also.
But we decided to measure the actual I
millivolt output and see, you know, then we could correlate that 23i temperature over into degrees.
So, we took a fluke down, this was 24l maybe 10, 15 minutes later.
Again, I'm not sure of my times because 25i W7i cW v
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we did quite a few things very fast.
We took a millivolt reader down gj there and then measured every input with the millivolt reader and took I
3l the data down for that as well.
And in the process there, we ran into i
4j some high, again, like we had, of 2,000 degrees.
A couple which read Sj quite a bit more than that.
Now, I'm correlating the degrees because 6
I know what its been since.
But the average millivoltage was very 7{
close to what we knew from, you know, from the first points, what we 8j read.
We had the millivoltage varied, but some millivolts were like g
down around 10 millivolts and we had one or two that was somewhere 10i even up around 75 millivolts, which correlating, is ran somewhere around 4,000 degrees.
But we had almost no way of knowing if it was a good point, if it could have been damaged that we were reading two in
]
series, that kind of thing.
So, we, you know, we didn't'know what we were reading at the time.
We, you know, if it was good or bad or j
where its core location was, or anything.
We just took the data as it came in millivolts and read that the whole way up and down.
17i CRESWELL:
Did Mr. Bennett have a Leeds and Northreo conversion chart 18t from millivolts to
...?
19!
20t l
WRIGHT:
He looked it up, he found either an L&N or whatever other 21:
type of conversion chart that we have.
We found our charts, and then i
22l l
we were able to correlate how many millivolts would be approximately 23i how many degrees.
But considering the temperatures, they didn't 2 41 bother correcting, I don't believe, for the cold junction of the 25i i
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lj temperature and things like that. We were just trying to get a ballpark 2j area of what the temperature really was. We didn't really care to pin 3
it down to the exact degrees.
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5l CRESWELL:
So, what happened.
You're in the cable room at this period...
6i 7j WRIGHT,:
Yes.
This is down under, beneath the control room in the i
cable room.
g 9!
CRESWELL:
Okay.
So, you've taken some, a few at random, Ivan says 10t g
they don't look too good, look at them on another instrument, you use a millivolt meter, you take several more, some of them are high...
131 WRIGHT:
Yes.
14) 15.
CRESWELL:
Up about 2,000...
171 WRIGHT:
Some were high, some were low.
Yeah...
19!
CRESWELL:
Some were low...
20!
21l WRIGHT:
Its, we had a, there was enough low readings that I, myself, 22' figured, well, we either had some fail or some were being shorted out, 231 or there was a definite failure of the elements themselves, from the 24{
indication of the temperatures.
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11 CRESWELL:
Okay.
As an instrument technician, what did that mean to lj 2:
y u?
3l WRIGHT:
By seeing this spattering of data, or? Well, in general, I 41 Si could assume that the ones that were in the middle were probably still Si g od, as far as they were probably reading somewhat close to what the 7;
true ones were.
Like any statistical average, the highs you throw out I
gj and the icws you throw out and you know, you can assume that the rest g
of the readings are fairly good.
It could have been that all of them were good.
It Could have been that, you know, some of them are shorted, some of them were open.
All I can say is its not my duty or job to y
analy:e the data.
But, from what I could tell, I assumed that most of i
them were reading properly.
13i 14:
CRESWELL:
And the ones that were reading properly, what would have been the maximum value?
16i 17l WRIGHT:
The ones that were reading properly, I'd say, 2,000 degrees 18t was, I was tending to accept the 2,000 degrees as being a good input.
20 CRESWELL: What would 2,000 degrees on a thermocouple reading mean to 21!
you?
Inside the core.
22, 23:
j WRIGHT:
As far as 2,000 degrees; normal operating range, from what 2 41 I've understood is somewhere around 500 to 600 degrees.
Seeing 2,000 2'l i 9
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degrees would either indicate possibly that the detector had'been I
gj exposed, which meant a steam bubble would have exposed the core, j
31 and/or that that particular fuel assembly would have become very hot, i
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you know, somehow it would possibly be grounding out.
What I say, if 5l I was assuming it to be good, which I, looking at the data, I figured l
that it probably was, I assumed that some fuel damage had occurred and 6
that that was a very hot spot from the core.
8l gj CRESWELL: Would.t be, could I make the assumotion that you say that 10!
whenever a void had occurred that the core had actually been uncovered?
11!
WRIGHT:
I assumed from when I say what I know of, you know, the design of the reactor and things like that, I assumed that the core at g
least been for a little bit and was probably covered again, you know.
gl But, yeah, because the temperatures were, we watched them for a while.
They were showing a very, very slow decrease.
They were coming down 17;!
in temperatures. We watched them for about a 5 minute period of time and they did decrease in general.
Some of them went up and down a little bit, some of them stayed about the same.
But most of them, in 19t general, were decreasing.
And, you know, it was slowly, of course.
So, frem what I could tell from within aoout 15 minutes looking at data and things, I could probably assume that the core had been uncovered 22l to where it suffered damage.
But that it probably had been covered again and that it was in effect cooling.
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CRESWELL:
Okay.
Did you or did anybody with you make a statement 1l 2j that they thought that the core had been uncovered?
i 31 4
WRIGHT:
My partner who works primarily in Unit 1; we have four people gj per shift, usually, and two people in the Unit 1 and two people in 6
Unit 2.
My counterpart, I suppose, the First Class on the team that y
Unit 1 was also along as my helper in the relay room, his name is Bill gj Yeager.
He had made the remark that the core's uncovered, "look at that.
The core's uncovered." Now, again, people say things, but g
10j that's, he did come up and say that.
11:
CRESWELL: Okay. Was Mr. Porter there whenever he said that?
13 WRIGHT:
Ivan came down, like I said, when we were almost done taking y
the first five readings and by looking at the one that was 2,000 degrees, he, you know, he turned around and said to Ivan, "Look, you 1p; know, it's uncovered.
You got 2,000 degrees down there." But, of course, you know, you can't really make that type of decision, but that's what he did say.
196 20; CRE5WELL.
You would be careful about making a decision based on one 21:
reading, is that wnat you're saying?
231 l
WRIGHT:
I, mysel f..
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CRESWELL:
You personally...
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WRIGHT:
I, myself don't stick my foot in my mouth, to speak.
I've 3!,
4; learned enough to step back and look at things a little bit more 5;
before I jump to conclusions, and...
Si 71 CRESWELL:
After the second set of figures, where a second set of I
gj measurements were made.
Do you feel that a statement like that could be made...
g; 10i RIGHT:
I feel...
11!
12' 13l CRESWEtt:
Here rationally...
1 41 WRIGHT:
I feel then that there was a definite sign then that the core had definitely been uncovered to the point where it suffered damage.
16 But it, I still say that, you know, I'm there to take the data.
I'm g,
not there to analyze it.
So, I gave them my personal opinion as in the, yeah, I do believe we did suffer some damage there.
20!
CRESWELL:
That's the time...
21i 22!
i WRIGHT: Which, by that time Ivan already knew that anyhow because he 23t had said, " Yeah, it doesn't look good," or something similar to that.
24!
Like I said, we were doing quite a few things and quite hectic.
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h CRESWELL:
Now after the second set of measurements are done, do you h
go back upstairs to the control room?
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WRIGHT: Yes. We went back up and we stood by, you know, waiting for 5;
them to call us if we were needed for anything else.
Si I
7j CRESWELL: Would you say, what time would you say that you got back up in the control room?
l 9!
WRIGHT:
After the second set of data?
I get so confused because we 0;
were down and up so many times and I was on other jobs. that I get confused when I even sit and think about it, myself.
I hooked up an RTO bridge in '3etween jobs and I also went out on a, to assist the 131 electricians with some reactor coolant pump interlocks that they were 14:
working on.
And, I'm not sure where it fits in as far as time.
The first thermocouples were measured, I'd say, at least by 8:00, the first thermocouples were probably measured. The complete set of 17!
thermocouple data, I'd say, probably at quarter of 9, somewhere in 18i that area.
That seems to strike about that area, 8:30 to quarter of 9 19!
to 9:00, somewhere in that area.
20t 21!
CRESWELL:
Okay.
Can you fix in any time to when you first started 22!
hooking up the digital volt meter to the resistance temcerature devices i
23l on the hot legs,
?
24j 25
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t WRIGHT:
I believe it was after I took the readings for the first 1!
2j time.
They took the five readings down there and while Bill, I'm not i
sure if it's Bill.
Somebody else is trying to find another type of 3
digital thermocouple reader. They said to me that they needed the 4
fluke hooked up across the hot leg because the hot leg was also pegged 5
high and they wanted to see what the actual temperature indication was 6
p there.
So, I got the fluke digial volt meter and I had some leads made up previously for testing ilTD's and I grabbed those and went out 81 to Cabinet A of the RPS cabinets and since I had known which wires to g
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Y9 10f the four leads coming in from the RTD, coming from the hot leg, and, I put those onto the digital volt meter.
And the digital volt meter
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will read out directly in ohms, because it has it's own constant current source.
You can use it as an RTD bridge. When I hooked it up 14!
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across there, we, one of the other bosses, I don't know if it was Skip 7
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7" 16, or if it was Doug, they also dug out our calibration data on the RC 4 a
or RC 5, whichever the instrument numoer for the RTD was.
They dug 17i I
out the correlation as resistance versus temperature.
And they brought g4 18t that out for us, too.
And when I correlated the resistance reading
,.,4 ;-
191
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e that I got to the temperature that it was indicating, it was indicating 20; sy 720 degrees.
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22l (HACKELTON:
Excuse me.
May I just interject.
For the record, Jim, 23!
could you identify what RTD stands for?
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If WRIGHT: ~RTD is Resistance Thermal Device.
It is a, as the resistance 2{
goes up the, I'm sorry, as the temperature increases, the resistance 1
3j of this element will also increase. And by using an electronic circuit, 4
known as a bridge circuit, they can precisely measure a small change 5!
in resistance and be able to determine and correlate what the temperature 6l is at that element.
7f SHACKLETON:
Thank you.
g Si CRESWELL:
g Did you report this 720 degrees to anyone?
u!
WRIGHT:
Yes.
My boss wanted to know what it was, and I told him what 8
it was.
That was Doug.
14:
CRESWELL:
Doug Weaver?
16!
WRIGHT:
17; Also Ivan Porter wanted to know also.
181 CRESWELL:
So you reported to both of them?
20l WRIGHT:
- Yes, I did report the data and we left at hookup so that the 21:
operators would be, and we left the conversion chart plate on top of 22l the meter so that if the operators wanted to know what the hot leg 23i temperature was, all they had to do is come back, read the meter, and 24) then correlate it from the 25i
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1!
CRESWELL:
More than likely, if you took these RTD readings between 2
the first set of thermocouple data and the last, it would have been in 3
a time period of, what 8 to 8:15?
4!
Si WRIGHT:
Between the first, I think it in points at more around 8:30, t
Gi probably 8:15 to 8:30, probably would be better one.
I, like I say, 7
I'm very vague on times, alright?
31 CRESWELL:
Okay.
After you take the second set of thermocouple data, g
10t yug back upstairs to the control room.
Do you report this information to Ivan Porter or...?
g 12l WRIGHT:
Yeah.
He wanted us to take down what all the readings were with all the point numbers and we had, again, we just had like a scrap g
of paper with us that we marked this stuff down on.
And we took all the readings, you know, as in.1 through.20, I'm not sure how many points there are, but we took them all down with the corresponding 18; not sure if it was directly to Ivan or if we gave them to, say, Doug or Skip or whoever.
But, eventually we were supposed to get to Ivan, 20 :.
I'm not sure.
I'm very sure he saw them, you know, but I don't know i.
if he saw the converted figures as far as wnat the temperatures were.
He, you know, we had them in millivolts then.
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CRESWELL:
Did you get any indication of what his impression was in 1
the second set of readings?
2 3
WRIGHT:
I didn't talk to him about the second set.
Let's see.
I 41 5j know that we said that we got it.
He said there's some there that are, that looked too high, that looked like we came, you know, that 6
looked like they'd been damaged.
Now, as far as anything more, I 7
couW t really recollect 8
91 CRESWELL:
Okay, so we're in the time period of about 8:45, when you 10 f
get back up to the control room, 8:45 to 9:00.
What's the next thing that happens?
13t WRIGHT:
I was also confronted with helping the electricians.
The 15r electricians that were on the emergency repair party were also over there and they were told by either scmeone in Operations or, again, an 16,r engineer, or something.
I don't know who wanted them to, but they 17;:
wanted to start one of the reactor coolant pumps and I,'for what ISI reason, I really don't know.
But, they wanted to start it, how.ier, the interlocks that are built into the reactor coolant pump did not let them start the pump.
So, they wanted the electricians to go down 21!
and jumper out these interlocks so that they could start the pump and 22' I
see what would happen. Since I had done quite a bit of work on the 23!
reactor coolant pumps in the past, I told them when I found out that 24j the electricians were gonna run down there, I told them I had a sheet 25!
a l
20 1!
of paper that would tell them what contacts or what as far as, you 2j know, we didn't have to bother looking orints and going through the 3j trouble, you know, I knew where to go.
So, they sent me with the 4l electricians to go down and work.on the, to go into the switchgear 5
cubicle and jumper out the interlocks strain so that would allow them l
to start the pump.
6 7!
8; CRE5WELL:
Do you recall who the electricians were that you went down gj with?
10i WRIGHT:
One of the electricians was Bill, now let me think.
Bill 1...u Con...?
I always get these two mixed up.
Bill Condran, CONDRAN.
g, i
He's an Electrician Chief, and I don't know who he had as a helper at 136 the present.
I don't know who else was down there, but I know he was
,4 1
15l.
one for sure.
16; CRESWELL:
Okay.
181 WRIGHT:
Okay. We went down and we found the appropriate switchgear, 191 you know, for the pump that they wanted to start.
And, we then jumpered 20l out the relay strain, the interlock strain which prevents some starting 21!
it.
But, we jumpered that out so that the control room could start 221 l
the pump.
We informed the control room that this had been done and 2 31 they said, "Okay.
They'll give it a try."
24i 25i t
o Q I. 's
I l
21 l
lj CRESWELL:
How did you do that?
l 2l 3;
WRIGHT: We went over to a page phone that was around the corner from 4
the switchgear cubicle and called up the Unit 2 control room.
And 5!
whoever was there, I don't know who answered, but it was one of the 6l CRO's and we said thst we got the jumper installed; go ahead and try 7j to start the pump.
So, they informed us to stand by, that they were 8;
gonna give it a try.
I don't know if they didn't start it right away or what, but in the process we were told just stancby and wait.
Ivan g;
Porter then came down again, down to see how we were doing.
10 11!
CRESWELL:
Excuse me.
You said again?
131 WRIGHT: Well, he came down, like I say, he works in and out with us.
He's on various other jobs and then he stops by to see if we got whatever he wanted done and to take whatever readings he wanted to l
take.
But he stopped, you know, that's the next time that I saw Ivan.
17!
He came down to the switchgear cubicle.
And, I believe at that time 1St they tried starting the reactor coolant pump, and by watching the amperes, that the moto. pulls, and there's a amper meter on the front of the switchgear cabinet.
By watching the amps and by seeing, like 21!
say, for starting current should go up and-then stabli::e, the current 22!
I went up as a starting current but then fell back to almost nothing, 231 which Ivan and I both kn2w, at least I can make the assumption that he 24 knew what was going on.
When a motor doesn't pull its normal amount 25i i\\v
(.
'l a
s,
l 22 t
i It doesn't have lj of current, out pulls less, it's not really pumping.
So, we could make the assumption, but again, it was 2j any resistance.
3i just a, rather fast assumption that the pump was pumping nothing but i
So, they shut the pump down again after just a matter, a 4j s *.e am.
couple of seconds they had it running and then they shut it back down 5
But, within that amount of time we could take the readings i
6i again.
The current that we wanted to see as far as normal operating currents.
7 lo ked lower than what it normally runs at.
8l 9!
Have you been dcwn with Ivan to that area before you CRESWELL:
Okay.
10 went dcwn with the electricians?
g 12; 73f WRIGHT:
No, no.
14!
So, this was the only time you were down wnh Ivan ay.
15 16i 17!
We were down with the electricians and we were told to l
WRIGHT: Yeah.
ISj stand by a little bit and they didn't know if they wanted us to put y!
the jumper in right away and then they got back to us on the page and col And, after about mayce 5 to 10 minutes then we called back and forth.
21t And we worth of standing by they said go ahead and put the jumper in..
22!
put the jumper in, called them back up and said it's ready, and they I
told us to standby again, and then, within that time, Ivan came down 24l to where we were at.
25i
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23 1
CRESWELL During this period or time, did Mr. Porter try to jar in 2;
theralaysonthe'pe:jal?
3; WRIGHT:
As far as wnen I was there, ILdidn't really take note to h1m 4
5l trying to do anythi0g, because the elen!.edcfans and I were all there, 6
you know.
I don't think Ivan tried to M.o any'.hing at that time.
7l gj CRE5WELL:
Okay. 'He,just cbserved.
9!
WRIGHT:
Yes.
10!
11.
CRE5WELL:
Okay.
So we're to the point where they started the pump, the current rent up to startup current, and then dropped back to 131 practically nothing, ano,'the pump was eventually in a few sec'and step back of f.
15i
~
f 16 171 Right.
~
WRIGHT:
ISI C9ESWELL:
what is the next thing that happens?
191 s
20:
WRIGHT:
After that I was told ta, you know, I asked if we vere done 21; because I wanted to go up to the centrol roca again.
I believe the 22, electricians still stood by in c;ue they'd have te r4aiove their jumper.
23l But, I went back up to the control rocm an.d I stood by up there.
241 25i i
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CRESWELL:
What's the aaxt thing they have you do..
How long would l
2:
you estimate you're down at the...
/
31 i
WRIGHT:
I was down at the switchgear ter, it's hard to say.
Probably Sj about a half an hour, altogether.
I 6l CRESWELL:
Okay.
i 8i g;
WRIGHT:
And this puts us somewhere around maybe 9:30.
I don't really 10i i
11:
g; CRESWELL: Okay, i
- ..' t WRIGHT:
And when we came back up again, they infomed us that they "E * ~** *
- 9" "' ** **"
- 9 15>
hook a couple off permanently to the thermocouple reader.
15 ),
So, I believe it was Bill and I again, went down with this...
17;i ISt CRESWELL:
Bill Yeager?
20!
r WRIGHT:
Bill Yeager, yes, I'm sorry.
We went down to tha relay room 21:
again, which is the cab)e room, and pulled off, I'm not sure if he 22' 23l told us which ones to pull off or he just had us pick some random again.
24j But, we hooked up at least 5 to the thermocouple reader all at one time.
It has a switching circuit that you can hook 5 inputs up to 25!
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it and then just push a button and select one input at a time. We 2
then hooked about 5 thermocouples up, and I believe ne, I believe we 3f hooked on purpose one of the ones that was reading like around 2,000 i
4[
degrees. We wanted to watch that one as well.
1 5!
5 CRESWELJ:
Had that one decreased any of those at least'since you had measured before?
7; i
St WRIGHT:
It had decreased but only a small amount.
Something like maybe a half a degree to a degrees, you know.
You couldn't really say that it decreased because they were, you know, they were fluctuating up and down.
But, from what I remember, I'm pretty sure it had decreased by about a degree.
131 14:
CRESWELL:
You only picked one that was high?
16; i
WRIGHT: We picked, I'm not sure if it was the first 5 that we picked 17!
l and we just hooked those up again or if we took random or if we. were 18!
tcld to hook certain ones up, I'm not sure.
But, we picked them up and I distinctly remember that we had at least one of the ones that 20) was fairly high. We put that on the thermocouple reader.
I don't 21!
know if we hooked one, I don't know if we hooked it up at that time or 22l i
not, but we might have hooked the one that was reading, you know, like 22I l
4,000 degrees up to.
I know we had it on there for a little bit, but 2 41 l
I think that might have been just to take the data, to see what they 25j were reading.
s 4
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l 26
!lj CRESWELL:
Did anyone take any of this data down as...?
2l 1
3j WRIGHT: We took the data down initially, like I said, on like scrap 4{
paper, you know, whatever paper was available at the time because it gj was, you know, such a rushed job. We took the paper, the data down on i
6i like the back of a computer printout.
But, as to my recollection what 7
happened to it, I couldn't honestly tell you.
It might have just l
gl gotten thrown out with all the rest of the paper that was floating gj around at that time.
But, we did take the data, we did jot the numbers down.
7g 11 g
CRESWELL: Who had the data last that you recall?
13l WRIGHT:
I couldn't even tell you.
I don't know.
15 CRESWELL: Who was writing the data dcwn?
17l WRIGHT: Well, Bill took most of the numbers down.
I, Bill Yeager..
19!
CRESWELL:
Yeager...
21l WRIGHT:
Took most of the numbers down as far as wrote them down.
I 22' l
usually don't have a pen so, he had a pen with him.
He took most of 231 the numbers down on the paper while I read with the volt meter.
He 24!
held the meter and wrote the numbers while I switched from input to 25i g
g b t v;
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27 i
lj fnput. And, as far as when the meter was permanently hooked up so that we'd be able to monitor them, I don't think we took that data 2
i 3i dO*"*
41 gf, CRESWEli:
I have before me some data that was copied down into a computer type listing of the points to the computer.
There are handwritten 6
notes here of millivolt readings for some computer points.
Are you aware, Jim, of any other data that exists besides what I'm showing you SI here?
9 10; WRIGHT:
The other data that would exist would have probably been the data that that came from.
Like I say, it would have been our rough 12:
I copy that we took the numbers down.
Then once they were found out 13; wnich numbers in as far as computer points, they correlated to, they 14!
were copied on to that sheet.
The looks like, I'm pretty sure that's 15; either what Skip or Bill did.
I have a feeling that Skip has it, Skip Bennett, our one foreman.
I have a feeling that that is what he did.
17l He wrote it down into the computer book.
I'm not sure wno wrote it, IS; but I think it was him.
191 20!
CRESWELL:
Okay.
Let's see.
I believe the last point in time was 21; tnat we talked about was around 9:30.
You hooked up these five thermocouples 22l l
permanently.
How long did it take you to co that?
231 24l 25i S
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i, 28 WRIGHT:
I don' t know.
Maybe 10, 15 minutes.
It's really rough to 2!
say. We had to get a ladder to prop the thermocouple reader on since we didn't have any resistut, the proper length, lead, and everything.
3 All we had was a very short lead of the wires and the tip.
So, we had 4
5l to get some things around.
I'd say at least 15 minutes.
It's very i
6j r ugh to tell.
7!
ay.
, what do you do after you perform this operation?
8 9I H
As ar as w,
cme back up to the conuol room again 10l and we then stood by for anything else that they would want.
Tfiey had us then hook up, I believe it was after I came back up again.
Like I i
say, I'm very confused. They had us then take a regular fluke which 131 is our regular digital volt meter that we use for calibrations.
It's a hand held model. They had me go over and go over to Cabinet C of the RPS cabinets, which would have been, I believe, I hooked up to the cold leg on one of those. And, they had me do the same as what I did to the hot leg in the ARPS cabinet.
They wanted to rejust the resistance ISI scross the RTD.
Now, you have to worry about correlating your lead 19{
,gth as far as the resistance due to your leads and they decided 20r that, I measured the lead length first and I found that to be approximately 21!
20 ohms.
So, for a ballpark figure they could subtract approximately 22l 20 ohms or 40 ohms from the value of chmage and they'd be able to 23l correlate that into temperature as well.
So, I hockew that other, I 24i hooked a regular multimeter up to the CRPS cabinet.
And, I believe, 25i
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b i
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29 lj that's when I hit it after I came up from hooking up the thermocouples i
2; up there.
i 3!
4; CRESWELL: Okay.
Now, the V hot leg RTD would have been in what 5,i cabinet?
6i 7{
WRIGHT:
I don't know which group it was in.
I, you know, as far as A 8l 1 p r B loop, it was in the CRPS cabinet that they had to go to, which was.
g; They had to go to the CRPS cabinet and pull the lead coming in from dere.
10 11!
CRESWELL: What sort of temperature was indicated by this other hot
'9 13l 141 WRIGHT:
That one I honestly don't know.
aave no recollection of that temperature whatsoever.
17' CRESWELL:
Okay.
At this time we'll turn it back over to Owen.
19t SHACXLETON: We'll change the tape at tnis time.
The time is nuw 3:13 p.m., Eastern Daylight Time.
22l i
SHACKLETON:
This is the continuation of the interview of Mr. Thomas 23i J. Wrignt.
The time is now 3:14 p.m., June 15, 1979.
Please continue.
24!
25!
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30 lj CRESWELL:
Okay.
After you hooked up the multimeters to these other 2
two channels, do you report back what you're finding on the temperatures?
31 WRIGHT:
I told my foreman that I had it in, I had the meter installed 4;
5; and as far as, you know, they said, well, what's it reading? And I knew the number then.
I told them approximately how many ohms the 6
7l meter was reading.
And, they offhand correlated the temperature I
which, I'd say right now I have no recollection anywhere close to what g
the temperature would be.
g 10:
I CRESWELL: Would you report it to Doug Weaver?
12; WRIGHT:
I did report to one of the foreman.
I'm not sure that it was 3
Doug or Skip, but I have a feeling it was Doug that I talked to.
15' CRESWELL:
Did you talk to Ivan again in this period of time?
17, WRIGHT:
I cassed Ivan back and forth quite a few time.
I don't know 18i if I told him or not.
I have a feeling of a firm recollection.
19!
201 CRESWELL: What's the next thing that you recall that happened?
22 WRIGHT:
To be totally honest, I'm almost totally v.an...
I don't 23l know, really, what happened.
I do think that at that time they were 24i' trying to get all non-essential personnel, well, even before that time 25i l
i\\/
c. r,an
I
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31 i
they tried to get all non-essential persaanel off of the Island except 1
2{
for the emergency repair crew, which, of course, by me being onshift designated me as a member of the emergency repair crew.
They tried to 3
get most of the people off either to the muster area, which at first 4
was the North Auditorium and then I was told that they moved them g
1 6l entirely over to the Observation Center.
Much more than that, I really don't know what all was going on.
I pretty much of a blank 7
gl except for the first hour or two I knew what was going on because I was busy and I was taking numbers.
But, after that, I'm shaky.
g ldi CRESWELL: When you do leave the Island, what sort of process did you go through?
131 WRIGHT: We were told to get into our car and report to the 500 KV substation for monitoring.
So, we got into our car and, yeah, well, I'm very sure we left by means of the North Gate. Went to the North Gate, went out, drove down to the substation across, you know, on the i
17l main land here, the 500 KV substation, ana.:e then pulled up, had our ISi cars frisked as far as to check for any radiation. We were also 191 personally frisked.
And, at that time we were told to go up to the 20!
Observation Center and muster.
And we reported then to in back of the
?.h Observation Center and I don't know if at that time, I don't know if 22 '
they brought sandwiches in or if they told us just to go home.
It was 23 around 1:00, 1:30, somewhere around there.
I'd say between 1:00 to 24i 2:00, somewhere.
They told us go ahead home but stay by your phone; li 25
,)
i s.V
(.p I
N 32 I
lj we might need you.
And Doug, I believe, was the one who sent us home 2
early and he said just go get something to eat since, you know, you 3
lost your lunch and everything.
So, we went, I'm very sure it was 4j that day, we went and got a Sub on the way home and then we went home.
Si l
gl CRESWELL:
Okay.
Were you contaminated any at all when you...?
i 71 WRIGHT:
No, I was not.
The activity level was a slight bit more as g
far as my person, but you could tell it was just primarily gas because g
it was, I stood out in the air and I wasn't, my activity level was not i
10I to a point where it set off an alarm.
You know, it was like, it was 11!
less than wnat was considered an alarm state.
But, by standing out in 12'.
i the air and everything, we noticed the background fluctuated greatly 13; and, you know, they considered us safe; so, that's all I cared about.
14-15, CRESWELL:
Okay.
Was anybody with you contaminated?
t 17!
WRIGHT: With me, no.
Not at that time.
lSt 191 i
CRE5WELL:
Did you wear a mask, a respirator, anytime during the day?
20!
21l WRIGHT:
I'm very hazy on this because I get the first and the second day very confused.
I'm very sure the second day we did wear respirators.
l But, I don't think that at any time during the first day we had a 24:
respirator on.
I don't believe we did.
25i C,?
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,P 33 CRESWELL: Okay.
Tony, do you have any questions?
1) 2!
I 3l FASANO:
I have a few just to go back over.
Fasano speaking.
You said that you were mustered into the startup office...
Si j
WRIGHT:
Yes.
01 l
7\\
FASANO:
Now with the remaining... And your part of the emergency g
repair party.
g; 101 WRIGHT:
Yes.
11:
12{
FASANO:
Do you know who was in charge of the emergency repair part at that time?
14 15-WRIGHT: The emergency repair party were told by previous arrangements.
16i Should an accident occur or should t..ay have a drill, or anything like 17i this, the emergency repair party will muster at the ECS, which stands 18i for the Emergency Control Station. And, the foreman who we worked for 19!
is designated as the Shift Maintenance Foreman that's on duty at the 20!
time.
Now, since it was during daylight hours and my particular 21!
instrument foreman was on duty, we, ha took cnarge of the instrument 22l men as far as the instrument men of the emergency repair party.
He 23!
then took personal charge of leading us.
And, at the time, I believe 241 it would have been Barry Kalenevitch, would have been our normally li 25 scheduled Shift Maintenance Foreman.
.s
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34 1
1!
CRESWELL:
Could spell Kale...
2:
i 3j WRIGHT:
That's gonna be a good question.
KALENEVICH.
I'm fairly 4i sure that's the correct spelling.
He is, he was my foreman at that 5!
time, for that, to be on duty.
And, he would have been the foreman 6l responsible for directing us.
But, like I say, since Doug, who is our 7l lead foreman, so to speak, he is, he took direct charge of the instrument men, and I think they had electrician, they had a regular electrician 8
foreman.
And, if the normal foreman that's there, on daylight is g
there, they take over.
But, if they're not there the Shift Maintenance 10 Foreman is who heads the party.
So, you know, we worked then for Doug-since he was there.
I 13l FASANO:
Okay.
On the, when you went back to remeasure the thermocouples, did you pick some of the same points that you had measured the first.
16!
l WRIGHT: What do you mean by when we went back to remeasure. When we 1.7!
used the millivolt meter the second time?
18!
19i FASANO:
Correct.
20i 21:
I WRIGHT: We measured all points then.
The first time when we measured 22l the points we had to disconnect the wires from the computer cabinet, 23l hook them up individually to the thermoccuple reader; read one point 24!'
at a time and then when we were done reading that point, we reconnected 2fj 0
\\u, s
( ' 4 '[
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I, 35 i
i the wires to the computer cabinet again.
The second time we strictly -
took a millivolt reading across the wires while they were still hooked 2
i 31 up to the computer cabinet. We didn't have to disconnect the wires to take the readings for millivoltage.
4; Si FASANO:
For correlat on purposes then, you knew which ones you haJ 6i done the first time.
I 81 WRIGHT: We knew which ones we did the first time; but we took all the g
data no matter wh&t, you know, we took all' the data the second time and measured the millivoltage.
121 l
CRESWELL:
It's my, exuse me.
Jim Creswell speaking.
It's my understand 131 that the thermocouple reader indicates the temperature here directly...
14 15 WRIGHT:
Yes, yes.
I 17 CRESWELL: And with the millivolt reacer you have to make a conversion...
'91 WRIGHT:
Yes.
20!
1 21:
CRESWELL:
How did, for the ones that you measured both ways, how did 22l they compare?
23l t
24i i
25j
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l 36
!lj WRIGHT:
They compared within a close enough degree of tolerance that 2!
we assumed that the thermocouple reader was correct.
The millivolt i
3{
readings, there's always a slight error in converting and things like 4
that.
But, the millivolt, yeah.
The thermocouple reader, which reads 3
directly out in temperature, is calibrated for the particular type 6
thermocouple that you're using.
And, it did correlate in so many 7
millivolts, did correlate to so many degrees.
You know, it is a, were 8
a correct reading.
91 A ANO:
10!
Have you ever done thermocouple calibrations, say in a laboratory?
]
You did study some of this.
I 12 i
WRIGHT:
131 Thermocouple calibrations, I don't exactly, you know, the term is a little misleading.
Do you mean...?
15 FASANO:
Actually put them in a bath...
17!
WRIGHT:
Yes.
181 191 FASANO:
And actually get a fixed formula...
21!
WRIGHT:
And take a curve from them, yes.
I have done that in the 42!
past In fact, when we calibrated or do a complete loop as part of 231 our acb of temperature calibration, we take a temperature curve first 24!
to make sure that the curve, that the element is still agreeing with 25!
o C U h,
37 i
l i.
We put it at one temperature and measure the..., we put it I
1l the curve.
in a bath at one temperature, take the reading, put it in the bath, 2
then another temperature, and correlate those temperatures to a given i
3l Most thermocouples use a common table. Type K will be so many 4{
scale.
Type J is a different millivolt gj millivolts equals so many degrees.
i But, we check that initially and for the precision RT3's, reading.
Gi anything that's amount precision, we usually use the RTD's, but, which 7
is the Resistance Thermal Devices.
They operate differently and that i
gj So, for special they go by resistance versus a notable reading.
g 10l applications we have a curve that's taken every.1 degrees or every small increment of degrees.
g 12l i
FASANO:
So, the RTD is a more accurate thing?
13i 14i The precision can be much WRIGHT:
Yes.
It's much more accurate.
closer with an RTD than what a thermocouple is.
But, a thermoccuple 15 16i has an advantage that it can measure a lot hotter the temperatures 17!
i and...
181 191 FASANO:
Higher temperatures?
20!
21I It, a thermocouple can usually measure much higher temperatures WRIGHT:
22!
than wnat a resistance element can...
3:l 2
zw 251 j 'L J g
I
r t
38 i
i li FASANO:
How about response time?
2' i
3!
WRIGHT:
As far as response time, you're getting into engineering 4
questions and things like that...
Si Si FASANO:
Okay.
7l g
WRIGHT:
I couldn't tell you.
Si 10l FASANO:
The, it, okay, then.
I was just wondering if you had a high f
temperature reading or a low temperature reading on, say, thermoccuples, yy.
g if it is lower than you'd expect, you were mentioning that you used a statistical, you'd throw the low ones out...
13 14!
15:
16!
1 FASANO:
And the high ones out.
But...
17l 181 WRIGHT:
Yeah.
That's my cwn, I'm used to taking data like that because of doing experiments and things like that in scncol.
But, I c0I usually throw out the low, throw out the low and then take the statistical average of what's left.
If I wanted to take an average to add it up.
i 23l FASANO:
Okay.
You did say that you did work on the reactor coolant 2 46 pump.
25i
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i l
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39 l
1!
WRIGHT:
Yes.
2 f
3j FASANO: You also had mentioned that by the second series of measurements I
4j on the thermocouples and you had in between this time, you had measured 5
also T '
h l
61 WRIGHT:
Yes.
Well...
7 81 FASANO: Well, T seemed to be high.
g h
10r WRIGHT:
T, let's see.
I did the first readings.
I hooked up the h
ohms and I went back...
Like I say, I get very confused.
But, when I I
13t hooked up the digital volt meter to T hot, my readings before I looked at T hot that the scale on the bridge that is in the RPS cabinet goes 14!
15l1 from 520 to 620 degrees.
That's its normal operating range.
The scale was pegged high when I got to the cabinet.
I took the thermocouple, yeah, thermoccuple, I'm sorry.
I took the resistance leads coming in 17) off of the cabinet, hooked them up to the volt meter, and correlated how many chms I had as far as how many ohms the device was reading.
And by converting with the precision table that we have that comes 201 with the RTD, by converting I, the only reason the numbers sticks with 21; me is it was exactly 100% hotter than high scale, which it was 720 22j degrees, is what it correlated to.
23l 2 41 25!
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l 40 lj FASANO: Now you had another indication that the hot side was being 2
indicated.
A hot temperature above what you'd expect.
The, that was i
j in between, right? You had gone downstairs...
4l 5l WRIGHT:
I went down, came up, hooked it up and then I went back down g
again for readings...
7\\
FASANO:
Okay.
8 9!
WRIGHT: And when I nooked it up is when I...
Oi i
11:
FASANO:
So, now you had three of these three different sets of data 12!
points in your head.
13) 14!
WRIGHT:
Yeah.
15i 15; FASANO:
And you did also work on the reactor coolant pump.
17:
I 18r WRIGHT: Yes.
19l 20i FASANO:
At this time did you start to believe that maybe the hign 21:
temperatures were correct?
22' 23{
WRIGHT:
I had it in my mind, you know.
I never rule anything out to 24!
begin with.
But, I had it in my mind that they mignt all have been 25i
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[
41 l
lj correct. And the idea that we really did suffer some bad damage.
2 But, you know, its, again, its the idea that all kinds of thoug...s go 3
floating through you ; ind.
4l 5l FASANO:
You also been on the reactor coolant pump when you noted that i
6i the amperage was low.
i 7l WRIGHT:
Yeah.
g 91 FASANO:
10t This then, you mentioned that the thought of steam being g
pumped went though you: head.
12!
WRIGHT:
Yeah.
I then thought when I saw the current drop off to almost nothing, I looked at that and we both had, you know, as far as 15i both tell, we knew what we were thinking.
And that, that's just not pumping anything.
18l FASANO:
So, this now gave you another data point of...
20' WRIGHT:
Yeah.
21!
22\\
FASANO:
A possible conclusion.
23!
2 41 25!
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42 l
lj WRIGHT:
I was drawing conclusions all along.
But, like I say, it 2
wasn't a formal conclusion.
3!
4j FASANO:
I'd like to turn it over...
Si g;
WRIGHT:
Go ahead.
l 7!
SHACXLETON:
Mr. Wright, we thank you very much.
The time is now 3:30 g
g p.m. and Mr. Wright has to leave due to another assignment.
We will 10l terminate this interview at this time.
Would it be possible Mr.
%y,
Wright if we need to talk to you, we could call you again?
12' I
WRIGHT:
Yeah.
131 14!
SHACKLETON:
To help us clarify some of these points.
16i WRIGHT:
Yes.
17) 1 18i SHACXLETON:
And may I ask you, were you at any time, prior to this interview, ever coaxed or instructed on how to answer any question?
21!
WRIGHT:
No.
22l 231 l
SHACXLETON:
By the Nuclear Regulatory Commission?
241 r
25i 1-
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n C Nf:
F f.
43 i
f WRIGHT:
No.
I 2!
3j SHACXLETON:
Have you been interviewed by any other investigative 4j bodies?
Si l
6j WRIGHT:
No.
7l SHACKLETON: Al right. We will close now.
3:31 p.m., Eastern Daylight 8
Time.
June 15, 1979.
g 101 11!
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131 141 i
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