ML073200564
| ML073200564 | |
| Person / Time | |
|---|---|
| Site: | Callaway  |
| Issue date: | 11/01/2006 |
| From: | NRC/OI |
| To: | |
| References | |
| 4-2006-035, FOIA/PA-2007-0335, NRC-1313 | |
| Download: ML073200564 (65) | |
Text
Official Transcript of Proceedings NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION Interview of(b)(7C)c
Title:
Docket Number:
4-2006-035 Location:
Fulton, Missouri Date:
Wednesday, November 1, 2006 Work Order No.:
NRC-1 313 Pages 1-64 NEAL R. GROSS AND CO., INC.
Court Reporters and Transcribers 1323 Rhode Island Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20005 (202) 234-4433 Information in this record was 9*0§*l 19 accordance we Freerdm q! IMP,"RPR A Exemptions _-
FOIL4PA 9.-E
I 1
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2
NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3
4 OFFICE OF INVESTIGATIONS 5
INTERVIEW 6
x 7
INTERVIEW OF 8
C CASE NO.
04-2006-35 9
(bLOSED) 10 x
11 Wednesday, November 1, 2006 12 Callaway Nuclear Plant 13 Fulton, Missouri 14 15 The above-entitled interview was conducted at 1:00 P.M.
16 BEFORE:
17 Special Agent, STEVE ROMERO 18 FOR THE CALLAWAY NUCLEAR PLANT:
19 PILLSBURY,
- WINTHROP, SHAW,
- PITTMAN, LLP 20 2300 N. Street, NW 21 Washington, DC 20037 22 202-663-8000 23 By: Mr.
J.
Patrick Hickey 24 25 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 P-R-O-C-E-E-D-I-N-G-S MR.
ROMERO:
For the record, this is an interview of Mr.
middle initia last name r77_7who is employed at Callaway Nuclear Plant.
The date is November 1st, 2006, and the time is approximately 1:04 p.m.
Mr.
Zc could you please state and spell your full name for the record?
MR, b)(7C)c b)(7C)c (b)(7C)c MR.
ROMERO:
- Okay, sir.
What is your job title?
MR.
IIm the b)(7C)c b)(70)c MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
Present at this interview are Special Agent Steve Romero for the Nuclear Regulatory Commissions's Office of Investigation,'Region 4, Arlington, Texas.
Also present is Mr.
b)(7C)c who is being interviewed; Mr. Patrick Hickey who is an attorney and is representing Mr.
and also Callaway Nuclear Plant.
The court reporter is Ms.
Lisa Banks.
And this interview is being tape-recorded and will be transcribed by Ms.
Banks or Neal Gross and Associates.
The purpose of this interview is to ascertain facts concerning an NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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allegation regarding~discrimination against a ObC 7(,)CP"N for raising safety concerns.
Mr.
iG
, will you please stand and raise your right hand?
(Witness sworn.)
MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
These questions are concerning Mr. Hickey's presence.
Does your employer require you to have an attorney present when you talk to the NRC?
MR.[
No.
They do not require me to have an attorney present.
MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
Is Mr. Hickey acting as your personal representative today?
MR.,
C.
Yes.
MR.
ROMERO:
Did you select him or did the company select him for you?
MR.
I He was selected by the company, and I endorse his presence here.
MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
So you agree to have him present?
MR} 10 C
So I agree to have him here.
MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
These for Mr.
Hickey.
Mr. Hickey, who is your MR.
HICKEY:
I'm with the yes.
I-agree questions are employer?
firm of
-NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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Pillsbury Winthrop Shaw Pittman, Washington D.C.
2 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
Are you acting as 3
Mr.
=
personal representative today?
4 MR.
HICKEY:
I am.
I also represent 5
AmerenUE and will represent other witnesses in this 6
proceeding.
7 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
Sir, do you 8
believe --
first of all, if a personal --
a potential 9
conflict does arise, sir, during the course of this 10 interview today, sir, what would you do, sir?
11 MR.
HICKEY:
I would have to address 12 that with Mr.
b)(7c)c and we'd resolve it appropriately.
13 But I don't anticipate any such conflict.
14 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
All right.
This is 15 for you, Mr.
Mr.
do you understand 16 that Mr. Hickey represents other parties that are 17 associated here at Callaway that are also part of this 18 investigation?
19 MR. [b)(Tc Yes.
I do.
20 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
With that 21 understanding, do you still want Mr. Hickey as your 22 representative here today?
23 MR. b(CcYes.
I do.
24 MR.
ROMERO:
All right.
Thank you, sir.
25 DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR.
ROMERO:
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10 ii 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q.
All right, sir.
For the record,
- sir, could you please tell us what your educational background is?
A.
[(b)(7C)c I.
(b)(7C)c Q.
Okay.
Sir, have you had any training subsequent to that concerning your field of training here at Callaway?
A.
I have completed a substantial amount of training at Ameren over thej years that I have worked at Ameren.
I came to work at Ameren as anl(b)(7C)C (b)(7C)c I
J(b)(7C)c In fact; I subsequently helped to develop the initial training program at Caliaway Plant for thej(b)(7C)c I went throughf(b)(70)c training program, obtained a(b)(7C)c Also went through the upgrade program to upgrade my license to senior reactor operator.
I have been through various management courses as a supervisor with the company.
I'm currently(7C)c I so I'm on a rotation as lb.(7C)c I1
ýL)(-7C)c NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 So Q.
what is your A.
Q.
A.
Ameren Union the last ten All right, sir.
For the past ten years employment background, sir?
I'm sorry.
For the past?
Past ten years.
The past ten years have all been with Electric and AmerenUE.
Specifically, in b)(7C)c years I've primarily been I was a b)(7C)c supporting the b)('C)c I
II 1
I Was promoted to
'm not sure exactly.
inning of D )
I was It was towards the end of "" "eg an for a years.
I rotated back to the b)(7C)c qr thejb)(7C)c I That was the point where began to report to me.
And my job title and responsibilities NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 were modified somewhat in December of when I became theJ(b)(7C)c 1(5)7Gj And at that point, I took on some of the' I I (b)(7C)c I(b)(7C)c Q.
How long have you been in your current position?
A.
As I described, really, from the
](b)(7C)c I(b)(7C)c And my current job title was changed in December of Q.
Okay.
Sir, and what are your responsibilities?
A.
I'm responsible for the "b)(7C)c (b)(7C)c 24 25 (b)(7C)c woulc say.
They report to me.
And I'm responsible for th(b)(7C)C NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 (b)(7C)c J(b)(7C)c We basically split that up, and I have a counterpart that is thei(b)(7C)C (b)(7C)c hat takes care of more of the administrative-type work in our department, such as (b)(7C)c So if typically I'm respcn project-related, the that.
Q.
Okay.
sir?
A.
I rep Q.
Oka" A.
He is J(b)(7C)c I
Q.
Okay.
J¶b)(70)c A.
Yes.
Q--
- And, A.
I hay 1988-1989.
He came it's (b)(7C)c I
sible for it.
If it's more n my counterpart is responsible for Sir, and who do you report to, Sort tj(b)(7C)c And what is his title?
thel(b)(7C)c Sir, do you-know a Mr.(b)(7C)c I do.
- sir, how long have you known him?
re known since roughly 1989, to work for the company as a new NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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employee at the time.
Q.
And that's how you got to know him?
A.
Yes.
Q.
Okay.
All right.
And have you ever supervised Mr. (b)(7C)c A.
Yes.
Q.
And when did you first begin supervising him?
A.
I was temporarily upgraded to 1(b(7C )c
- [in my dates are going to be approximate here because Q.
- Yes, sir.
A.
it's been a little while.
Q.
For the record, sir, if you don't have the dates just say approximately this year, if you don't know for sure.
A.
Approximately January of 1998.
And when I replaced an 1(b)(7C)c to allow him to work on refueling preparations, and one other operating supervisor at the time worked for me while I was in that position for approximately three months.
That was the first time that I superviseEIbiI And then, when I became the T j-1(b)(7C)c
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9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 10 in the spring of 2004, which was --
I believe that ended approximately in June of 2004 went back on shift as a(b7 C)C at that point, and he reported to me then.
Q.
So he's been reporting to you since April of 2004?
A.
That is correct.
Up until he was rotated to our work control center, and that happened approximately Septemberof this past year, so September of '06.
Q.
Okay.
Sir, did Mr. (b)(7C)c'ever bring to your attention a safety concern regarding another employee by the name of Mr. j(b)(7C)c that he was inattentive in the )(control roomY,?
A.
No.
Q.
He never brought that to your attention?
A.
Not that I recall.
Q.
Has anyone ever brought that to your attention, sir?
A.
Yes.
Q.
Can you tell me who?
A.
I had YDavej Hollabaugh brought that to my attention as the supervisor of Employee Concerns.
Also had a reactor operator bring that to my attention, (b)(7)c NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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Q.
Okay.
Let's start with Mr. Hollabaugh.
2 When did he bring this to your attention?
3 A.
That was in January of this year.
4 Q.
And what did he tell you?
5 A.
He -- I'm sorry.
Let's back up.
And 6
would you please restate exactly what the question was 7
again?
8 Q.
Okay.
I had asked you initially,
- sir, 9
if anybody had brought that matter to your attention, 10 and you stated that Mr. Hollabaugh andj(b)(7C)C 11 had.
And my next question was, when did Mr. Hollabaugh
- 12 bring that to your attention?
And you stated it was 13 January 2006.
And then I said, "What did he tell you 14 exactly when he brought it to your attention?"
15 A.
Okay.
And we're talking about an issue 16 with inattentiveness on shift; is that correct?
17 Q.
Yes.
Concerning Mr. (b)(7C)c 18 A.
Concerning Mr.U(b)(7Cc j Okay.
19 Mr. Hollabaugh came to me and said that a concern had 20 been raised with inattentiveness to duty and 21 interviewed me -- by Mr.
C and interviewed 22 me and asked me questions regarding Mr. (b)(7C)c and 23 his performance.
24 Q.
So you were interviewed by 25 Mr. Hollabaugh?
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A.
That's correct.
2 Q.
Okay.
And he was interviewing you for 3
an investigation he was conducting?
4 A.
That's correct.
5 Q.
And he told you that at the onset, 6
before he talked to you?
7 A.
Yes.
8 Q.
Okay.
And when he was interviewing you, 9
that's when he told --
I want to know what he told you, 10 exactly how he --
I mean, what did he bring up?
How 11 did he bring it up to you?
12 A.
He came to me and told me that an
.13 allegation had been made that Mr. J(b)(7C)c was 14 inattentive to duty, and that he was investigating that
- ;15 allegation.
He asked me questions like, had I ever 16 observed Mr.
T being inattentive to duty.
Had 17 people come and talked to me about Mr. 1(b)(70C)c being 18 inattentive to duty?
OrnI had --
you know, had I 19 observed that and basically what I knew about that.
20 Q.
Okay.
So what did you tell 21 Mr. Hollabaugh concerning his questions, the ones you 22 just stated that he asked you?
23 A.
I told him that _(b)(_
_)_
had 24 come to me and asked --
and made a comment to me that 25 the that work on Mr b)(7C)c had NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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a concern with I61 1attentiveness, and thatI I had 2
asked me to look into that.
3 Q.
Okay.
When did](b)(7C)c bring 4
that to your attention?
5 A.
That was in December of '05.
6 Q.
Okay.
And when he brought that up to 7
you, what did he tell you, exactly?
8 A.
He told me that the[
ad some 9
concerns with ability to be alert in the control 10 room.
1i Q.
Okay.
And when he told you that, sir, 12 what did you tell him in return when he told you that?
13 A.
I told him that I would follow-up and 14 look into it.
15 Q.
Did you follow-up and look into it, sir?
16 A.
Yes.
I did.
17 Q.
What did you do, sir?
18 (b)(7C)who was the w19 r(b)(7C)c with this crew, and I 20 askedl(b)(7C)c
ýif there were any concerns 21 expressed by the reactor operators on watch regarding 22 Mr. (b)(7C)c attentiveness.
23 Q.
And what did he tell you?
24 A.
He told me that they had not expressed 25 any concerns.
I also asked him if he observed any NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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behaviors that caused him to be concerned, and he told 2
me no.
3 Q.
And Mr. i would've been their 4
supervisor, the supervisor --L(b)(7C)c 5
Correct?
6 A.
,-cThat's correct.
7 Q.
Okay.
And he would've been over those 8 (b)(7C)c 9
A.
That's correct.
I 0 Q.
Mr.[*(
11 A.
Yes.
That's correct.
12 Q.
Okay.
I'm just asking this question,
- '13 sir.
Why didn't you ask any other personnel such as 14 theg n that shift?
15 A.
Based on the schedule rotations, I had 16 to look for people that I could.contact.
AndjJ lc 17 as a person that I was able to get a hold of 18 to talk to.
And my practice is to work with the --
19 work through supervision, and I wanted to get firsthand 20 from Mr.1 bj-j what he had observed and what concerns 21 were raised.
22 Q.
Did Mr. ((b)(7C)c lever tell you that 23 the[J idn't want to go to the supervisor but wanted 24 to express this to someone else?
25 A.
No.
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Q.
No?
2 A.
No.
He did not.
3 Q.
Okay.
So when you checked into it, you 4
just checked into it with one person, which would've 5
been (b)(7C)c 6A.
I talked t (b) (7C-) C That's 7
correct.
8 Q.
All right.
And Mr.
7_
informed you 9
that he did not see any problems with Mr. (b)(7C)C 10 being inattentive in the ýcontrol roord?
11 A.
That's correct.
12 Q.
All right.
Nor did he have any 13 information about anyt making any type of comments 14 or complaints to him about that issue?
15 A.
He did --
I don't know if he was aware 16 of any other comments or concerns.
He did not express 17 any to me.
18 Q.
When would this have taken place,
- sir, 19 this conversationI with MrI(b)(7C)c 1 20 A.
It was at the end of December.
It was 21 near the Christmas holidays.
22 Q.
End of December of 2005?
23 A.
Yes.
24 Q.
Okay.
And once you obtained that 25 information from MrD(b)(7C)C] did you then provide that NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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information to Mr. r)(7?)c 2
A.
Yes.
I did.
3 Q.
Oh, you did?
When did you provide that 4
to him?
5 A.
It was after the holidays.
It was the 6
first part of January.
7 Q.
Okay.
And did you summons him -- did 8
you have him come to your office, or how did this 9
occur?
10 A.
I really don't recall where I met with 11 him at.
12 Q.
Okay.
Would it have been a face-to-face 13 meeting?
14 A.
it was a face-to-face discussion.
Yes.
15 Q.
Okay.
And then, what did you tell him?
16 A.
I told him that I had talked with'7 c7 and that th n had not expressed any 18 concerns.
And he said -- he seemed a little bit 19 surprised by that and said he was going to follow-up 20 and get back with ther and ask them about it.
21 Q.
Mr.)(7C)c said that he was going to 22 follow-up with the b)(7C)c 23 A.
That's correct.
24 Q.
Okay.
Did he --
let's go back to his 25 reaction.
He just had a reaction of being surprised.
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Is that what your interpretation was?
2 A.
He seemed like he was surprised that I 3
said there was nothing that I was told, that there was 4
no concern or nothing was observed.
5 Q.
Okay.
6 A.
And that's just my, you know, observance 7
of 8
Q.
Oh, I understand.
9 A.
-- his facial expression.
10 Q.
And that's what I'm asking you, sir.
11 A.
You know, like, hmm, I need to go back 12 and talk to those guys.
13 Q.
Okay.
And do you know if Mr. (b)(7C)c 14 ever did go and follow-up with any of these b 15 A.
No.
I don't know.
16 Q.
You didn't know -- you don't know 17 because he never told you or nobody ever told you that 18 he had followed up with them?
19 A.
I don't know because he did not tell me 20 that he did.
I also know that this issue came out on 21 the table not too long after that.
It was at the end 22 of January.
And so --
23 Q.
That would've been the end of January 24 2006?
25 A.
Yes.
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, 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q.
Okay.
So let's go back to Mr. Hollabaugh.
He was doing an investigation pertaining to that allegation.
Correct?
A.
That's correct.
Q.
Do you know what the findings --
investigative findings were pertaining to that allegation, done by ECP?
A.
Yes.
I do.
Q.
Can you tell us for the record what it
- was, sir?
A.
The --
I was, along with Mr. (b)(7C)c asked to come down to Mr. Thibault's office approximately the 30 -- or 30th or 31st of January of
'06, and was informed that the investigation revealed that there was some basis there.
Indicated that there was some concern or some truth such that we were directed to remove Mr. J(b)(7C)c from watch standing duties.
Q.
When was Mr. ý(b)(7C)c removed from watch duty?
A.
Q.
Immediately.
That day.
On January --
it would've been the day that you --
A.
did that that The day that I met with Mr. Thibault, we I actually met with Mr. (b)(7C)c the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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next morning.
But we immediately made the decision to 2
remove him from shift duties.
I don't recall where he 3
was in his watch rotation at that time.
I do recall 4
that he was not on watch that day.
And I do recall 5
that I met with him -- with the very next morning.
6 And we removed --
I informed him that he was removed 7
from watch standing duties.
8 Q.
Okay.
Sir, Mr. (b)(7C)c-- who is 9
Mr. 1(b)(7C)c Isir?
X 10 A.
Mr. (b)(7C)c is the(b)(7C)c 11 1(b)(7C)c He is my boss.
12 Q.
Okay.
Did Mr. [(b)(7C)cl ever have a 13 conversation with you pertaining to Mr. I(b)(7C)cj
- 14 stating that he was aware that there had been
<15 complaints made about Mr.
b)(70c about being 16 inattentive in the [control room]?
17 A.
and I had a general discussion 18 about there being some concerns with b_
's alertness.
19 Q.
When did that take place, the initial 20 conversation pertaining to that subject?
21 A.
I really --
I'm not certain.
22 Q.
Would it have been prior to December of 23 2005?
24 A.
Yes.
25 Q.
Can you --
would it have been January NEAL R.GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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2005, that early on?
2 A.
No.
I don't believe it was that early 3
on.
I think it was most likely sometime through the 4
summer.
5 Q.
So it would've --
summer would be 6
defined as see if you agree with me --
between June 7
and August.
Would that be the correct characterization 8
that you're trying to make, sir?
9 A.
Again, I can't be certain.
It was 10 sometime in the latter part of the year.
11 Q.
. And did Mr. (b)(7C)C ever tell you where 12 he had learned this information from?
13 A.
Where he had gotten the information --
14 Q.
- Yes, sir.
15 A.
from?
I do not recall him 16 specifically telling me anyone that raised a concern
'17 with him regarding Mr. (
attentiveness.
18 Q.
So what were these general 19 conversations?
Can you tell me what the scope of them 20 were, what was said?
21 A.
I(b)(7C)c 22 J
And b )(7C)c had a close working 23 relationship with based on his previous work 24 history.
In other words, 04 had worked for in, 25 the past on shift.
And was a person for to NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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talk to about his I(b)(7C)c issues.
2 I
~approached 7
and asked him about 3
how things were going at (b)(7C)c 4 (b)(7C)c And I 5
don't know for a fact how much discussion took place 6
there.
I don't believe that
._was willing to share I
7 much, if anything, with bVK__
on that.
8 Q.
Did Mr. 1 7<c.
tell
- you, "Well, I've 9
received complaints that Mr. (b)(7CQ)c is inattentive in 10 the kcontrol room]l'*?
Did he ever tell you that?
11 A.
No.
He never told me that he received 12 complaints thati(b)(70Cc was attentive --
was not 13 attentive or inattentive in the 1control roor4.
We did C'14 have a conversation, and it could've been more than one
- .*15 conversation, about having trouble remaining alert.
16 And I may --
I'm drawing --
making a difference here, 17 because I don't know how we're defining inattentive.
18 l~iIlwas having some trouble --
in other words, like I'm 19 sitting here looking at you right now, and perhaps I 20 would do this (indicating).
21 Q.
- Well, I mean, if you would do that, I 22 mean, having trouble staying awake, that's you know 23 what I'm saying?
24 A.
That is struggling to remain alert.
25 Q.
Okay.
So he had told you that he had --
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22 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 he knew this information.
But how did he know this information?
A.
Apparently someone had brought that his attention.
Q.
But you don't know who?
A.
I don't know who he specifically had to talked to.
Q.
A.
Q.
He didn't disclose that to you?
Not that I recall.
Okay.
And what did Mr. (b)(7C)c Isay he i
l was going to do about that?
A.
He, as I mentioned, went tod and was going to talk to
\\
And Q.
When did this conversation between Mr. J(b)(7C)Ond Mr.l(b)(7C)C
=
take place?
A.
I don't know.
- Again, it was in the latter part of '05.
Q.
Okay.
MR.
HICKEY:
I understand that you need to get some background information about the context of your current investigation.
But all these questions about Mr.
b 1
7C)(TC) and Mr. (b)(7C)C[and their dealings with them, I guess I'm wondering whether they really bear on the question of whether Mr. J(b)(7C)C in 2006 was the victim of some kind of discrimination.
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23 1
MR.
ROMERO:
We can go ahead and go off 2
the record.
Going off the record.
3 (WHEREIN; a short recess was taken.)
4 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
We're back on the 5
record.
The time is 1:32 p.m.
6 BY MR.
ROMERO:
7 Q.
All right, sir.
Let's move on, sir.
8 Did you -- are you the person that --
9 A.
And before we 10 Q.
Okay.
Go ahead, sir.
11 A.
Before I go on, I haven't had a chance
ý,12 to completely answer your last question.
13 Q.
Okay.
'14 A.
So I just want to make that clear, that
'::15 I haven't completely answered your questions about who 16 may have brought anything to my attention and what was 17 done with that information.
So I just want to make 18 that clear, that I haven't been given the opportunity 19 to completely answer that.
20 Q.
Okay.
Go ahead and finish that, then, 21 sir.
22 A.
Okay.
23 Q.
And then we'll 24 A.
The other entity that brought to my 25 attention bl0-alertness was the training staff.
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24 1
w having some trouble remaining alert in 2
training.
And I was made aware of that by the training 3
staff.
And 4
Q.
Okay.
5 A.
that was part of my discussion with 6
(bAC)c also.
7 Q.
Who was on the training staff, sir?
You 8
said training staff.
I need to know who the people 9
are.
10 A.
b)(7C)c-is one name that comes to 11 mind.
And, really, and b)(7Cwc was the 12 coordinator for that.
13 Q.
Do you recall when this --
when they 14 provided you this information?
15 A.
This was in the summer.
Again, Summer 16 of '05.
17 Q.
And what did Mr. t!cDc tell you, sir?
18 Did they tell you together or separately?
19 A.
We have a -- at the time, we were having 20 an end-of-training-cycle meeting with the continuing 21 training instructors.
And in that meeting they brought 22 that to my attention, that M
was having -- was 23 struggling in a few of the classes remaining alert.
24 Q.
In their class?
25 A.
In the class.
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25 Xb)(7C)c 1
Q.
So these -T 2
told you this during this 3
A.
That is my recollection.
4 Q.
Right.
Okay.
5 A.
And I as best I can remember, those 6
are the people that talked to me about (b)(7C)c 7
attentiveness or inattentiveness.
8 Q.
Okay.
So they would've told you this in 9
2005, the summer.
And then, what did you do with that 10 information?
Did you provide that to your --
11 A.
That was information that I discussed 12 with
)(7c)c And as I mentioned just a few 13 minutes ago while we were off the record, I haven't 14 really discussed with you the reasons why b(3 and I 15 handled this the way we did.
16 Q.
Okay,.
Go ahead, sir.
Tell us why you 17 handled it 18, A.
Okay.
And I'll try to be brief with 19 this.
I explained, in our organization -- that I came 20 back to the b)(7)c 21 And then, in the b)(7)because of some 22 performance issues we had in our department, (b7cc 23 (b)(7c)c Imade the decision to create the position that I 24 was put in
-- into, which was anb)(7)c I I
25
ýb)(7)c position, which put me over the shift NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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26 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 (b)(7)c
- However, it was a --
just a functional working title and not really a --
an organizational structure type title, meaning that I had some responsibility to coordinate and oversee what was going on, but I did not necessarily have the true line authority, so to speak.
In other words, if you looked at an organizational chart in our company, I would --
I was a[b)(7)c that was put Sto monitor what they're doing.
We had a concern that involved a
[b)(70)c b)(7C)c itb)(7U)c and so forth, pretty significant.
b)(7C)c
ýas closer to this person than I was from a personal relationship.
And the --
based on the significance of it and the way our work schedules fell out, took the lead on addressing (b)(7C)c performance.
So that is why I did not --
in that time period,.I didn't 7-did notnecessarily proactively approach that.
and I talked, and
- said, "I'm going to take --
I will take care of this.
I will talk to fb)(7C)c And I accepted that.
So you wondered why his direct supervisor did not intervene.
Q.
Right.
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27 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 "9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A.
That is the why.
Q.
Okay.
A.
Okay.
Q.
So the person you're talking about when you were getting into all of those issues was Mr. i(b)(7Cc Right?
You were talking about Mr.
(b)(7C)c A.
I'm talking about Mr. [(b)(7C)c Yes.
Q.
Right.
That he dealt with him because he knew him better.
A.
That Q.
Plus, he had aL(b)(7C)c 1(h 7 n
Cý%)
rRight?
\\*\\
-I--
in s,-~'
A.
That's why(D)(fu)C dealt with b7(
J(b)(7C)c as opposed to me dealing directly with J(b)(7C)c.
Q.
Okay.
All right.
All right.
Now, once Mr. j(b)(7C)c -- were you familiar that Mr.
ha gone to Mr. I(b)(7C)C told him about Mr. 1(b 0
's inattentiveness?
A.
No.
Q.
You were not aware at all?
A.
No.
Q.
Mr. ý(b)(7C)C never told you that?
A.
No.
He did not tell me that 4j7*_
had
)
d NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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28 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 come to him and expressed concerns.
Q.
Okay.
bid anybody else tell you that Mr.a(b)(7C)O ad gone to Mr. J(b)(7C)C i A.
No.
I don't recall anyone telling me that.
Q.
When did you ever find out that he did?
A.
When did I find out that Q.
That Mr. J(b)(7C)c had gone to Mr.
and made the allegations about Mr.
i(b)(7C)c A.
What I heard as a side conversation with one of our other (b) (7C)cC that there was discussion about b nc alertness.
And I believe~pgand hI(riJhad had a discussion about that.
But neitheri or b-r Icame directly to me and said, "I have a concern with this."
And neither of them said to me, "I went to I"
that either of them had went to b*.
and expressed a concern about that.
Q.
Okay.
So you weren't aware of Mr.' (hl(7C'.r~l making any type of allegations to Mr.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
And when you say --
.Of the --
"allegation" you say --
I'm talking about --
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1 2
3 4
5 6
7 8
9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 29 A.
You mean just going --
Q.
going --
A.
expressing a concern?
Q.
Expressing any concern concerning Mr. J(b)(7C)o Jbeing able to --
struggling to stay awake or inattentive.
A.
That's correct.
I was not aware that (b)(7Cc had specifically went toI*fl J and talk to him about K
- 9 Ialertness.
Q.
And this discussion you had with Mr.
was itlIbI Could you -- what was the name?
A.
Q.
J(b)(7C)c Okay.
You had this discussion with him when?
A.
I really have no idea.
It would've been in the -- again, in that six-month period, second --
Q.
So--
A.
half of '05.
But it was a general --
more like a --
it was a peer scuttlebutt discussion.
It was not coming to me and say, "I'm concerned about this."
Q.
Okay.
All right.
Are you the person to give Mr. (b)(7C)c I his evaluation?
A.
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30 (b)(7C)c 2
3 4
5 Q.
Okay.
Let me ask you a question, sir:
6 Are supervisors --
Mr. J(b)(7C)c ris considered a 7
supervisor.
Correct?
8 A.
Correct.
9 Q.
He would receive if a supervisor or 10 anybody that's non-bargaining --
I don't know.
What's 11 the terminology?
Let me get that terminology first.
12 A.
Management employee?
13 Q.
Management employee.
How do they 14 receive bonuses?
Based on what?
What is it based on?
15 A.
What kind of bonus are we speaking of?
16 Q.
Well, jeez.
I don't know what the 17 exact -- do you receive bonuses based on your, 18 performance?
19 A.
We are all in a bonus program that is 20 tied to key performance indicators for the company, the 21 division, and the department.
22 Q.
What does KPI payout mean?
23 A.
KPI payout means key performance 24 indicators; and the payout is the money that's awarded 25 to employees based on the performance of the company, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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31 1
the division, and the department, and the individual.
2 Q.
So would a supervisor's performance have 3
a bearing on the amount of money or if they get a 4
bonus?
5 A.
For the --
the performance of the 6
company --
- again, it's there it's tiered.
Okay.
7 So the way it works is, the company establishes key 8
performance indicators, and then they're it's 9
divided up into percentages.
First of all, the company 10 has to achieve a certain earnings per share level.
11 At that point, then, we look at the 12 division.
In our case, the nuclear division.
The 13 nuclear division had --
and I don't know the numbers --
14 four or five performance indicators established that 15 drove our payout for our KPIs.
For example, one of 16 them --
and I'm just going to give an example.
I'm not 17 going to say this is one of them.
18 Q.
Right.
19 A.
This is an example.
Our refuel was 20 scheduled to be less than 65 days.
Our refuel was 21 sixty-three and a half days.
So if that was a KPI 22 and I don't believe it actually was -- then we would 23 get a payout commensurate with whatever was allocated 24 to that particular item.
25 Q.
Okay.
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A.
One that I that we did have was 2
related to our dose for the year, our cumulative 3
exposure, and we did make that particular KPI.
It was 4
less than what our threshold was.
So we were allotted 5
a percentage of payout for that.
Then it gets broken 6
down to the department.
7 So in my department, we had performance
- 8.
indicators for number of refueling milestones that we 9
met.
And as a department, we all -- all of us together 10 supported that initiative, so either the whole 11 department made that KPI or they did not make the KPI.
12 In our case we made the KPI.
Then we went down to the 13 individual level.
14 And the reason I'm explaining it this 15 way is this is where each individual has control over 16 his KPI.,
We had a goal for numbers of observations we 17 did of our employees over the year, and we established 18 a number.
If you did "X" number of observations, then 19 you met the requirements for that KPI that was 20 established.
Okay.
So really, it was based on the 21 individual's performance; it was based on the 22 division's performance; it was based on the 23 corporation's performance.
24 Q.
Okay.
And who would be the person that 25 would determine how much a certain employee would get NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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as far as that bonus, that KPI payout bonus?
2 A.
We use a system that's called Merit Net 3
(ph).
It is our pay system.
It's a pay calculator 4
type thing.
5 First of all, our Board of Directors 6
meets in February and determines what the official 7
earnings per share is.
That determines the thresh --
8 whether or not we even met the point where we can pay 9
out performance indicator type pay.
Our division --
10 our managers and vice presidents --
look at the 11 corporate -- or not the corporate, but the division 12 performance indicators, and they make a call on whether 13 or not those were met, and then there's a percentage 14 tied to those.
15 Then the ones that are internal to the 16 department, the department --
so me, J(b)(7C)c 17
~b1jQ jho is my counterpart --
generally we would 18 determine which department-level indicators were met, 19 and then we would determine those that we supervised.
20 For example, I would determine whether, in this case, 21 (b)(7C)c I-would determine whether 22 (b)(7C)c met the requirements for the individual KPIs 23 that we had -- for example, number of observations.
I 24 would make that call, if he met 100 percent of that or 25 whatever.
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34 1
Q.
Did he --
how did he do in 2005?
Did he 2
receive a bonus, a KPI 3
A.
- Well, my recollection is that he met the.
4 requirements to receive a KPI, to receive the bonus-.
5 Q.
Okay.
6 MR.
HICKEY:
When you say 2005, are you 7
talking about a bonus paid in 2006 for the performance 8
of 2005?
9 MR.
ROMERO:
It's called the 2005 bonus 10 payout.
I don't know if they pay --
11 MR.
HICKEY:
Okay.
12 MR.
ROMERO:
it out in 2006.
I 13 believe that this would've been paid out prior to --
14 THE WITNESS:
It is.
15 MR.
ROMERO:
I mean, after 2005.
16 MR.
HICKEY:
Right.
17 MR.
ROMERO:
But it would've been before 18 this date, before November 2006.
19 MR.
HICKEY:
Right.
Because the 2005 20 bonus payment comes after the end of that year.
21 MR.
ROMERO:
Right.
22 MR.
HICKEY:
And so it's paid out in 23 early 2006.
24 THE WITNESS:
It's paid on March 15th of 25 the following year.
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MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
2 BY MR.
ROMERO:
3 Q.
And my question to you, sir so you've 4
already answered one of my questions.
You said that 5
you would've been the one that would've been 6
responsible for evaluating if Mr. (b)(7C)c would've 7
received a KPI payout.
Correct?
8 MR.
HICKEY:
Related to his individual 9
goals.
10 MR.
ROMERO:
Well, he's the supervisor, 11 and he already made that statement, that he does it 12 based on that.
Right?
Correct?
13 THE WITNESS:
In the system, in the
,.14 Merit Net system, I identified that --
I identify how
- 15 each individual performed on their key performance 16 indicators.
17 BY MR.
ROMERO:,
18 Q.
And do you recall, how he did?
19 A.
I don't recall the specific value.
I 20 recall that he did meet --
my recollection is that he 21 met the majority of the requirements for that.
22 Q.
Did he ever come and inform you or talk 23 to you and say, "Hey, I don't believe that I received 24 what I believe I should've received'?
25 A.
I don't remember.
I don't remember him NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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36 1
coming to me and specifically saying that.
I do know 2
that our corporation made a decision to differentiate 3
between those that were rated [needs improvement] and 4
those that were -- that -- those that were rated above 5
that in terms of how the KPI was paid out.
6 So when I did my baseline KPI 7
performance and pay recommendation - - and I guess I 8
should call it a recommendation as opposed to an actual 9
final determination of payment --
my determination of 10 payout was that he would receive the bonus commensurate 11 with the objectives that he had met.
12 Q.
All right.
Okay.
So it is tied to his
- 13 performance evaluation, then.
Right?
Because you were
- 14 talking about [needs improvement].
That would've been
Ž15 documented on the evaluation that he received for that 16 year.
17 A.
That is the way that it was handled.
I 18 was not --
I did not know it was going to be handled 19 that way when I did the performance indicator pay 20 portion roll-up.
21 Q.
You didn't know that?
22 A.
I did not know that that bonus was not 23 going to be paid.
24 Q.
Is it something they didn't pass out to 25 the managers, or you just didn't get that information?
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A.
That decision had not been made at that 2
time.
3 Q.
About being tied to needs the people 4
who got bwouldn't receive that full 5
amount?
6 A.
That's correct.
That decision had not 7
been made at the time that I did salary review, roughly 8
in February/March time frame.
I don't remember exactly 9
when it was.
b)(7C)c 10 Q.
Do you know if Mr.
ever went to 11 Mr.
b)(70)c and stated that he didn't believe that he 12 received the amount of bonus that he felt he should've 13 received?
14 A.
I don't no.
I don't know if *b(C)c 15 went to him and talked to him.
I know that they had 16 discussion.
I don't know if b))
specifically went to 17 b7ýýc Jnd talked to him.
18 Q.
Okay.
Let's talk about the evaluation 19 itself.
b)(7c)c 20
'b)(7C)c I
21 A.
(Witness nodded.)
22 Q.
How did he do on his 2004 evaluation?
23 A.
He was marked as[b(U)c 24 Q.
Did he have any --
I know I've seen the 25 evaluation.
It has -- what is it?
five different NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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38 1
2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 I1 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 levels.
Correct?
A.
I believe that's correct.
Q.
Right.
And the meets expectation is in the middle, and then you have the needs to improve.
Correct?
And they're all A.
That's correct.
Q.
And there's different categories on there.
Correct?
A.
Yes.
Q.
Do you recall,.on the 2004 7-and I know you don't have it in front of you -- but do you recall if he had received any marks in any category stating that he needed improvement in 2004?
A.
I don't recall specifically.
Q.
But you do know his overall rating was j(b)(7C)c I
A.
Yes.
Q.
All right.
And how was his 2005 evaluation?
A.
His 2005 evaluation had areas marked on it as (b)(7C)c and also the overall rating was i(b)(7C)c Q.
And then that's the rating you're talking about, how it would've affected his 2005 KPI buyout.
Correct?
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A.
That is
-- that rating was subsequently 2
tied to the way the KPI bonus was paid out.
3 Q.
So if he would've known the information, 4
that it would've been tied -- that the KPI buyout for 5
2005 would've been tied to that criteria, which stated 6
that if you were overall (b)(7C)0 that you 7
wouldn't receive the full amount, would you have given 8
him something different?
9 A.
No.
10 Q.
So then why did you tell you said 11 earlier you didn't know the information, you didn't 12 have the information when you made the rating that that 13 would've affected the KPI buyout that he was given as 14 far as the bonus.
15 A.
Because there was no link --
I was 16 provided no information that there was a direct link 17 between the overall rating in the performance appraisal 18 and how the bonuses were going to be paid out.
That 19 was a decision that was made at a later date by our 20 vice president.
21 Q.
And for the record,
- sir, Mr. (b)(7C)c 22 had never come to you and told you, "Hey, Mr. b70) 23 has been inattentive in the %control roomA."
Right?
He 24 had never told you that.
Correct?
25 A.
He had never come to me and directly NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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told me that.
No.
2 Q.
Okay.
And so, that would not have had a 3
bearing for you giving him that rating?
4 A.
It hadn't.
It's not related at all.
5 Q.
Okay.
All right.
Or the conversations 6
that you did have with Mr. J(b)(7C)c 1 7
A.
Regarding?
8 Q.
Regarding when Mr. (b)(7C)c jtold you, 9
"Hey"
-- well, Mr.
first of all, for the record, 10 Mr.
x ever told you that Mr.
had come 11 to him.
12 A.
That's correct.
13 Q.
Right?
14 A.
That's correct.
15 Q.
All right.
So you wouldn't have had any 16 connection with that?
17 A.
That's correct.
18 Q.
Am I summarizing this correctly?
19 A.
You are correct that b(never 20 told me that C
had come to him and 21 expressed a concern.
Therefore, you're also correct 22 that there could be no relationship between ýrating 23 of b)(7C)c
- I and any discussion that may ha 24 had with because I was not aware of that 25 Q.
Were you ever instructed by NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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41 1
Mr. [
.b)(7C)c,
-- Mr. (b)(7C)c is your supervisor.
2 Correct?
3 A.
Uh-huh.
4 Q.
Were you ever instructed by 5
Mr. (b)(7C)c and I'm talking about you, Mr. (b)(7C)c-6 A.
Uh-huh.
7 Q.
to give Mr. (b)(7C)c a lower 8
evaluation because he had come to him and made the 9
allegation about Mr. t(b)(7C)c 10 A.
No.
11 Q.
That never occurred.
Correct?
12 A.
Never --
that never occurred.
13 Q.
And you gave him his rating based on 14 what?
15 A.
Based on his job performance.
16 Q.
And nothing else?
17 A.
That's correct.
18 MR.
HICKEY:
I have one other question, 19 because you brought out the fact that the evaluations 20 for 2004 and 2005 reach different conclusions.
And I 21 wanted to ask Mr.b 22 (b)(7C~c,.,
22 23 I)b C])(I hether you were given any direction from 24 management about the overall performance appraisal 25 process and how it should be implemented for the 2005 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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performance appraisals.
2 THE WITNESS:
Okay.
I guess what I'd 3
like to do is just talk through that process, how it 4
- evolved, if 5
MR.
HICKEY:
Sure.
6 THE WITNESS:
I could do that.
7 MR.
ROMERO:
Go ahead.
8 THE WITNESS:
At roughly the end' of 9
December, beginning of January, I prepared initial 10 performance appraisals for all of theI b)(7C)c 11 that work for me.
I obviously prepared one f.or b)(Cc (b)(7C)c 12 on the initial appraisal that (b)(7C)c 13 in draft form as meets expectations.
I had 14 mixed feelings on that, frankly, because I felt like he 15 was borderline.
16 HoweVer, given the way that we have.done 17 performance appraisals over the years that I have 18 worked here, typically if you're rated()c 19 b)(7)c there's a very large gap in performance.
20 And
)(7c)c I
21 did have in the written comments some significant 22 comments regarding his performance, particularly 23 related to standards, expectations, ownership and 24 initiative.
I felt like he's very lacking in those 25 areas, and as a leader of people, a leader of crew, NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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those are key attributes to be successful.
2 On the 10th of January, we had a 3
performance appraisal calibration meeting that our vice 4
president and director of plant operations and some of 5
our managers and department heads attended.
That --
6 and the purpose of that meeting was to do a calibration 7
of performance appraisals to basically raise the bar in 8
the interest of improving the performance of our plant, 9
because our plant performance had been poor.
10 And one of the opening statements that 11 our vice president made --
I believe it was our vice 12 president; it could've been our director of plant 13 operations made is that our performance appraisal 14 system doesn't seem to make sense because we have --
80 15 percent of our people or more are rated meets 16 expectations or above, yet we're a poor performing NPOW 17 3 plant.
And it's just not possible thatwe're being 18 objective enough and critical enough of the performanceý 19 of our employees.
20 And the purpose of us having this entire 21 group meet was to talk through that and talk about 22 individuals and get input and perspective from others 23 on people that we were rating.
It was also stated that 24 the final decision for the rating rested with the 25 supervisor that was completing the evaluation.
So in NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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this case, for (b)(7C)c 2
In that discussion, what was described 3
to us as being meets expectations is a person that 4
comes to work every day, does their job every day, 5
requires no real intervention or oversight from the 6
supervisor, meets commitments and all those sorts of 7
things.
8 And then we talked about individuals.
9 (J]*1P*s one of the people that we talked about.
And I 10 got input from a few folks that had some concerns 11 similar to concerns I had with his ownership of 12 training and making effort to improve in training; some 13 responses via e-mails that were less than professional; 14 some documents that he generates and the level of 15 professionalism of those; meeting commitments like 16 making sure his crew remains qualified; and I'm not 17 having to constantly follow-up behind him and say, 18 "Hey, make sure this happens,".or, "You need to take 19 care of such and such before, you know, tomorrow" type 20 things.
21 And when we discussed meets 22 expectations, one of the minimum requirements there is 23 that you meet all your commitments. IiTI clearly 24 doesn't -- does not meet that definition.
And it made 25 it very simple for me to say, "This is one of those NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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people that doesn't belong with the 60 percent" or 2
whatever --
of that 60'percent we had right in the 3
middle here.
He's one of the ones that needs to move 4
over one notch to the left and be rated asb 5
(b)(7C)c So that's how we got to that.
6 I went back, based on the feedback from 7
our leadership team and my own opinion, and went back 8
and revised the performance appraisal.
And then I 9
submitted it to[(b)(7C)c J
for approval.
- Actually, 10 we sat down and talked about it, and he gave.me some 11 feedback.
And I made some further adjustments to it 12 and made adjustments to the wording.
And then he 13 approved it, and then I discussed it with bi 14 But the decision of where 1 1 fell 15 (b)(7C)c it was a clear 16 call.
It wasn't I had.no question in my mind that 17 that's where it belonged.
And the difference between 18 2004 and 2005, really, is standards and expectations 19 that we as a site have implemented.
20 MR.
HICKEY:
And when you completed the 21 meeting on January 10th that you've just been 22 describing where all this discussion took place, where 23 was rating at the end of that meeting?
24 THE WITNESS:
At the end of that 25 meeting, he was in the (b)(7C)c c.ategory of NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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the supervisors we reviewed.
2 MR.
HICKEY:
Were there others in that 3
category --
4 THE WITNESS:
Yes.
There were.
5 MR.
HICKEY:
Other(b)( 7 C)C -\\
6 THE WITNESS:
Yes.
There were.
7 MR.
HICKEY:
Peers of Kb)(7C)cI 8
THE WITNESS:
Yes. (ýb)(7C)c
)was in 9
that category, and (b)(7C)c
[was in that category.
10 There were a couple of other (b)(7C)c 11 BY MR.
ROMERO:
12 Q.
What okay.
This occurred January 13 10th, 2006?
14 A.
Yes.
15 Q.
Okay.
And you said the leadership.
Can 16 you tell me who this leadership team is, the names of 17 the --
18 A.
The 19 Q.
-- individuals that are on this 20 leadership team?
21 A.
- Well, I use that term generically.
22 There's not --
we don't have what we call a leadership 23 team.
But I'm talking about our vice president, Adam 24 Hefflin (ph) ; I'm talking about our director of plant 25 operations, which is Thibault; I'm talking about NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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Q.
What's his first name?
2 A.
Ludwig Thibault.
3 Q.
Ludwig.
4 A.
(b)(7C)c I was not there that day.
He-5 was off site.
I don't remember if he was on vacation, 6
but he was not present at the meeting.
Chris Younie 7
was there.
Ron Roselieus was there.
8 MR.
HICKEY:
Any HR people?
9 THE WITNESS:
Right.
HR people were 10 there.
Betsy Fennigan and I cannot recall his name 11 right now.
Dan Regelean, I believe it is.
The two HR 12 people facilitated the meeting..
13 BY MR.
ROMERO:
14 Q.
And who were the people that gave you 15 feedback about Mr. b70 duringthis meeting you 16 were having this meeting?
17 A.
I specifically remember getting feedback 18 from (b)(7C)c I remember getting feedback 19 specifically fro (b)(7C)c There is no one else 20 that specifically comes to mind that had something to 21 say-that stuck in my mind.
22 Q.
And so, when you revised it, you went to 23 Mr. (b)(7C)c Iand you had a discussion with Mr. l(b)(7C)cI 24 about revising this evaluation.
Correct?
25 A.
Yes.
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Q.-
And did Mr. [(b)(7C)c Ifully agree with 2
you, concur with you?
Or what did he say?
3 A.
I made some further adjustments based on 4
his feedback, and my recollection is that I actually 5
adjusted it a little bit in the positive direction.
6 Based on the feedback I had gotten in the calibration 7
- meeting, I had moved over into the (b)(7C)c 8
category on several items.
And we sat down and went 9
through those and talked about them.
There were a few 10 of them where, you know, we said, "Well, this --
maybe 11 this one should be over here."
12 And I think the adjustments we made 13 actually raised the rating in a couple spots.
But 14 there were certainly numerous areas markedi§ 7 (
15 J(b)(7C)c that resulted in the overall rating being 16
[(b)(7C)c I
17 Q.
So then Mr.[.b)(7=C)cj would have to sign 18 off on it to concur with it.
Correct?
19 A.
That's correct.
20 Q.
And he did?
21 A.
And he did.
22 Q.
And then --
23 A.
I took it back and made the revisions 24 that we discussed and brought it back to him for his 25 approval, and he approved it.
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Q.
And then you spoke with.Mr. (b)(7C)c 2
You presented it to him.
Correct?
3 A.
That's correct.
4 Q.
Do you recall when that occurred?
It 5
will be on the form, if you don't recall.
6 A.
It was on the 16th of February, I
7 believe.
8 Q.
Okay.
And what was Mr. (b)(7C)c f 9
reaction?
10 A.
He --
my understanding --
and~~)i told 11 me that he had mentioned to that we had rated him 12 as (b(Ccprior-to us sitting down on the 13 16th of February, so (J)(Cknew that that was what the 14 rating was going to be.
So came in, sat down.
We 15 discussed it.
It was obvious to me that he wasn't 16 happy, he was not pleased.
He wasn't surprised because 17 he knew that was going to happen.
18 He didn't really have a lot to say.
I 19 suggested to n
,that he take his copy of the 20 appraisal and think about it, you know kind of digest 21 it< a little bit, and then we could get back together 22 and talk later about it, and he said okay.
And so, 23 that's where we left that at.
24 Q.
Did you have a second meeting with him?
25 A.
We had a second meeting.
It wasn't NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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until afterTF7-and
~had talked there in the first 2
part of March.
I was gone on vacation the whole first 3
week of March.
And with the rotation of the schedules, 4
I did not --
we did not get back together until the 5
first part of March.
6 Q.
And then what took place in that 7
meeting?
8 A.
Well, let me set the -- kind of frame 9
this.
I was on vacation the first week of March.
I 10 came back to work on the 13th of March.
)
)rabbed 11 me that morning and said, "Hey, I had a blow out with 12 (PI 'xlast week and -- about his performance appraisal 13 and about his performance."
And my understanding is 14 that j
basically told to go home and think 15 about what how he felt about the performance 16 appraisal and just things in general, then they would 17 get together and talk again the following week.
18 So I was back on Monday.
And I told 19 2
-- you know, well, yl.
told me, he said -- he wa 20 really concerned about in terms of the direction 21 he was headed, because he was really going in a 22 negative direction, I'm going to say, regarding 23 attitude and so forth, based on the informationib1L.
24 gave to me.
And encouraged me to make -- to get 25 with j
right away and sit down and talk to him.
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And, you know, I had been gone for a 2
week, and I had come in that Monday and it hit me cold.
3 And I did not want to try to just at the drop of a hat 4
sit down and have a discussion like that, so I made --
5 I talked to Cdj Jthat day, and I said, '4*I*
I 6
understand we need to get together and talk.
How about 7
if we get together tomorrow morning and we sit down and 8
talk?"
9 And we sat down and talked on Tuesday 10 morning.
And so, he had a little bit longer to kind of 11 think about all that had transpired.
He came into my 12 office.
We sat down and we had what I would call a 13 very good, open, frank discussion.
We talked about how 14 he and I communicate with each other.
We talked about
/
15 how maybe we've misunderstood each other or he has 16 misinterpreted some of the things that I have said or 17 done.
We talked about how we could improve the way we 18 communicate and work together.
We aired out some, I
19 guess -- apparently, there was some baggage associated 20 with how 'we've communicated over the last several 21 months.
And we came to some agreement on how we were 22 going to go forward.
23 And I because I was concerned about 24 us having a common understanding, one of the things I 25 asked p)t Ito do was to sit down and write down what he NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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understood we talked about and what we agreed to do, or 2
what his perception of the meeting was, and asked him 3
to send that to me.
And I did the same thing.
I sat 4
down and wrote up my perception of what had taken place 5
and I sent that to him. And we both said, yeah, that 6
pretty much describes what we talked about, and kind of 7
tried to use that as a stepping stone to go forward, 8
you know, and to improve both our working relationship.
9 And what I was really interested in was how could I 10 motivate him to improve his job performance, because I 11 wanted him to improve his job performance.
12 Our company has a process, then, that we 13 use to work through people rated as b7 14, So
~and I had some regularly-scheduled meetings in 15 development plan type work we have been doing since 16 then to follow-up on his b 7Cc rating.
17 Q..
But he's --
is he still under you, sir?
18 A.
No.
19 Q.
No?
20 A.
He's not.
21 Q.
He's reporting to someone else?
22 A.
That's correct.
23 Q.
So he'll be reviewed by someone else?
24 A.
He is working on this plan with someone 25 else.
He worked for me for nine months of 2006, so NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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I'll have~a lot of input into his performance appraisal 2
that gets done in 2007..
And I have written one 3
follow-up appraisal since -- because the process 4
requires an interim appraisal.
I've written one 5
interim appraisal for him.
That was at the end of 6
- August, I believe.
Q.
How was that?
8 A.
He had moved up in some individual 9
areas.
I left him marked as j(b)(7C)c
- overall, 10 and I sat down with him and explained to him why and 11 gave him very specific things to work on to get that 12 moved up.
And what I told him was I felt like he was 13-on the right track.
I believe I had him marked in, I
14
- believe, it was nine areas (b)(70 c and we 15 only had two remaining.
But they're the two hardest 16 ones because it has to do with initiative and ownership 17 still and that follow-through stuff.
And that's where 18 he's got to try to focus his attention.
19 Q.
Do you know if Mr. b)70 C has suffered 20 any type of adverse actions for bringing forth his 21 allegation to Mr.
or to the ECP?
22 A.
No.
23 Q.
You don't know of any?
24 A.
No.
25 Q.
Do you know if there's been any other NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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managers that have in any way could be interpreted as 2
giving him some type of adverse action for bringing up 3
that allegation?
4 A.
No.
5 MR.
ROMERO:
Mr. Hickey.
6 MR.
HICKEY:
I don't think I have 7
anything more.
8 BY MR.
ROMERO:
9 Q.
Okay.
Do you have anything to state, 10 sir?
Anything that you want to follow-up on, sir, or 11 fully explain?
This is your opportunity, sir.
12 A.
I guess I'll ask Pat.
I'm not sure that 13 we've clearly described how the KPI program works.
14 Q.
Okay.
If you want to --
15 MR.
HICKEY:
Let me see if I can help 16 with this.
17 CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR.
HICKEY:
18 Q.
KPIs are these key performance 19 indicators.
And you said that there are some that are 20 company-wide.
Is it correct that unless the entire 21 company meets those, then no one in the company gets 22 any payment 23 A.
That's correct.
24 Q.
for those?
Similarly, for the 25 nuclear division, unless the nuclear division meets the NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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2 3
4 5
6 7
8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 nuclear division's KPI goals, no one in the nuclear division --
- you, Mr. j b7(0QC no one -- gets any bonus payment for that; is that right?
A.
Or they would be --
Q.
Or it would be reduced.
A.
would be reduced based on the areas where you fell short.
Q.
Right.
And same thing for the department.
Those are all things that where the payment is across the board and everybody gets it or nobody gets it or they all get the same portion?
A.
That's correct.
It's the same for everybody in the department.
Q.
And so the only portion of the KPI bonus that is tied specifically to the individual relates to his individual KPI goals; is that right?
A.
Correct.
Q.
And you, as the supervisor of Mr. (b)(7C)0 C evaluated whether --
or the extent to which Mr. J(b)(7C)c in 2005 met or didn't meet his KPI goals?
A.
Q.
you concluded A.
That's correct.
And your recollection is that in general that he did meet them?
That's correct.
He did meet the KPI NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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requirements.
2 Q.
And when you reached that conclusion, 3
was it your expectation that he would receive a bonus 4
payment for his individual KPI performance?
5 A.
Yes.
That's correct, also.
6 Q.
Okay.
Later you learned that was not 7
going to happen.
8 A.
Later, I learned that at the executive 9
level, the vice president or chief nuclear officer 10 level, a decision was made that those rated needs 11 improvement would not receive a portion of their bonus.
12 Q.
Did you participate in that --
in making 13 that decision?
14 A.
No.
15 Q.
Were you asked about it?
16 A.
No.
I had no input on that decision.
17 Q.
Okay.
18 MR.
ROMERO:
Let's go off the record, 19 Lisa.
20 (WHEREIN; a short recess was taken.)
21 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
We're back on the 22 record, and the time is what is it?
it's 2:15 23 p.m.
The interview of Mr.
24 REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR.
ROMERO:
25 Q.
Mr.
,can you please tell me for NEAL R. GROSs COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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the record -- we've been talking about the KPI payout 2
bonus program that you have here at Callaway.
Can you 3
tell us for the record, sir, what is the criteria?
How 4
does it work?
Does every employee -- are they promised 5
a bonus?
6 A.
The bonus is not a promise.
The bonus 7
is established each year.
And the bonus really is made 8
up of two components.
I'll go into this in detail.
9 One component, again, is the corporate 10 part of it.
That's 50 percent.
The other 50 percent 11 has to do with the division and the individual portion.
12 In the --
we use a program that I mentioned earlier 13 called Merit Net, and it is a computerized process that 14 allows us to document how we're allocating bonuses and 15 pay raises.
And it gives guidelines for how --
how we 16 should allot money based on the way a person is rated.
17 In the case for a [(b)(7C)c 18 rating, the guideline in the program is to consider 19 reducing the KPI bonus because of the rating.
When 20 J(b)(7C)c and I did the salaries, we chose not to 21 reduce the bonuses as a result of the rating.
We did 22 not reduce those, and it was our intention and it was 23 our understanding going forward when we submitted 24 the --
our pay information on up in through the 25 organization for approval that that bonus was --
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were recommending that those bonuses be paid.
2 Q.
Okay.
And in this case you were 3
recommending that Mr. (b)(7C)o bonus would've been
- 4) paid?
5 A.
That's correct.
6 Q.
Correct?
7 A.
That's correct.
8 Q.
Was Mr.
ever informed or 9
promised by you or any other person in management here 10 at Callaway that he would've been receiving a certain 11 amount for his KPI bonus?
12 A.
I had a discussion with that 13 related to the -- when I discussed --
I need to think 14 about that just for a second.ý I know that at some 15 point I made a comment toL*Th Jwhen he was rated br" 16 I(b)(7C)C Ithat to my knowledge that was not going to 17 affect the KPI bonus.
I told him that to my knowledge 18 that was not going to affect that.
I also made the 19 statement that things are always subject to change.
20 Q.
When did that discussion take place, 21 Mr. J(b)(7C)cl 22 A.
I can't say exactly.
It would've been 23 in the February/March time frame.
24 Q.
Okay.
February/March 25 A.
February/March time frame.
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Q.
of 2006?
2 A.
Yes.
3 Q.
Okay.
Do you -- did you ever see 4
anything that was put out something similar to this 5
(indicating) concerning the KPI buyout that these were 6
the numbers?
And I believe these would've been the 7
numbers for your area.
8 A.
I'm sure that I received this e-mail.
9 It's addressed to ops management. I(b)(7C)c 10 administers that for us.
So these areý --
as I was 11 describing earlier, these are the KPIS that we used for 12 our department.
13 Q.
For the record, I'm showing Mr.
a 14 copy of an e-mail that I had received which shows the
- 15 KPI numbers for the KPI bonus program.
Correct?
16 A.
That's correct.
So in our department we 17 used procedure quality corrective action budget, outage 18 milestones, observations, which was an individual, 19 department clock resets and crew clock resets to 20 determine how we were paying out our KPI.
Now, this 21 portion actually makes up --
I believe it's 50 percent 22 of the total.
23 So if i(b)(7C). exampe here, based 24 on how we did as a department and then as an 25 individual, a person.that shows 95 percent based on NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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what's shown on this sheet of paper would be receiving 2
95 percent of the 50 percent that's allotted to the 3
department.
There's an additional 50 percent that is 4
based on the division and how the division did.
5 Q.
Okay.
6 A.
And I believe we did --
and it looks 7
like it looking over -- what we have here is we did 8
very well department-wise.
There were a couple of 9
division goals that we did not meet.
And I think that 10 the maximum payout in our department was on the order 11 of low 90 percent 92, 93 percent.
So an individual 12 that did everything right and met all their individual 13 stuff here, added in with the department and then added 14 in with the division, would've been at approximately 92 15 percent.
And I could be off by a little bit either way 16 there, but that is about what it was.
17 MR.
HICKEY:
Ninety-two percent of the 18 50 percent?
19 THE WITNESS:
No.
Ninety-two percent of 20 the total.
21 MR.
HICKEY:
Including 22 THE WITNESS:
Of the total.
23 MR.
HICKEY:
including the company 24 goals?
25 THE WITNESS:
Including the company NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W.
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goals.
2 BY MR.
ROMERO:
3 Q.
So when these bonuses are paid, sir, are 4
they a percentage of a person's salary?
5 A.
Yes.
6 Q.
And so, do you recall what percentage 7
that Mr. (b)(7C)c eceived for his 2005 bonus?
8 MR.
HICKEY:
What he did receive?
9 MR.
ROMERO:
Yes.
10 THE WITNESS:
No.
I do not know what he 11 received.
12 BY MR.
ROMERO:
13 Q.
You don't know those numbers?
-14 A.
I do not know that number.
.15 Q.
Well, let me ask you another question, 16 sir.
Looking at this, sir, would a person be able to 17 calculate what they were going to be getting as far as 18 a bonus based on this e-mail?
19 A.
Yes.
20 Q.
Oh, they would be?
21 A.
They would be able to come very close to 22 calculating that.
And I can take the time to read 23
- this, and it probably would --
or I could probably 24 explain it if you would like for me to.
25 Q.
Well, that was just my question.
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the answer is yes.
Right?
They would be able to?
2 A.
I'm saying generally, yes.
Meaning you 3
could 4
Q.
Approximately.
5 A.
come in you could get very close 6
to that.
Yes.
7 Q.
Okay.
So a person could use these 8
calculations and come up close to the amount they feel 9
that they would receive?
10 A.
Actually, based on this e-mail, since 11 this e-mail is specific to the operations department 12 KPIs, a person could use this e-mail to determine
- 13 approximately how much of the department portion they 14 would receive.
In other words, the 50 percent of the 15 total.
16 Q.
It's 50 percent of the total is their 17 bonus?
18 A.
Yes.
19 Q.
Okay.
Do you know if Mr. (b)(7C)c 20 specifically was ever promised or given a figure on how 21 much he would receive for his KPI bonus payout --
22 A.
No.
23 Q.
Via e-mail or someone sitting down and 24 talking to him?
25 A.
No.
I don't have any knowledge of
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anyone giving him a specific figure.
2 Q.
You never gave him a specific figure or 3
percentage?
4 A.
Not that I recall.
Not that I recall.
5 Q.
One last time just to summarize it,
- sir, 6
is that you gave him that evaluation based on the 7
evaluation on what he had done as far as criteria 8
concerning his work.
Correct?
9 A.
Yes.
That's correct.
Based on job 10 performance.
11 Q.
And nothing to do with him raising any 12 type of allegations?
13 A.
It would've been impossible for me to do 14 that because I didn't know he was the person that made 15 the allegation until March.
16 Q.
Until March.
17 A.
Until March --
my discussion with b)(7)c 18 b)(7C)c in March.
I'm going to say on the 13th of 19 March.
20 Q.
And you had already given him that 21 evaluation?
22 A.
Yeah.
The appraisal was already 23 approved, signed by discussed with It was 24 already complete.
I had no idea that he was involved.
25 Q.
Okay.
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MR.
ROMERO:
Any more questions, 2
Mr. Hickey?
3 MR.
HICKEY:
No.
4 MR. ROMERO:
Mr.
LiC.
anything else?
5 THE WITNESS:
No.
6 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
I just have a couple 7
of closing questions.
Mr.
have I or any other 8
NRC representative threatened you in any way or offered 9
you any rewards in return for the statement you' ve 10 given today?
11 THE WITNESS:
No.
12 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
Have you given this 13 statement freely and voluntarily?
14 THE WITNESS:
Yes.
15 MR.
ROMERO:
Okay.
This interview is 16 concluded, and the time is approximately 2:24 p.m.
The 17 date is November 1st, 2006.
Thank you, sir.
I 18 appreciate it.
19 THE WITNESS:
Thank you.
20 (WHEREIN; the interview was concluded at 21 2:24 p.m.)
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