ML20100B721

Intervenor Exhibit I-MOSBA-248,consisting of to B Lyons Re Filing of Quality Concern of Actions Taken by Vogtle Plant Review Board on 900208 at Meeting

ML20100B721
Person / Time
Site:	Vogtle
Issue date:	09/15/1995
From:	Mosbaugh A AFFILIATION NOT ASSIGNED
To:
References
OLA-3-I-MOS-248, NUDOCS 9601220216
Download: ML20100B721 (15)

Text

J4 % oyg  !

~ ~$ ,T-/240S88-2kT M. is mo C'

~fo : bill 1 yon.s, @sah4y loncern froy ra n (wrchndo??

95 c1T 20 P4 08 T on -flhny a Ovably Concern dh you g gega(hy ochons laken by lhe lle g +1e Plad Sev:ew Soc [ od$$g,ino klj j af meeb n390-15.tKonntn);n O, +hal dde , % Pla,4 Review Boed

' 8~ f, f voled in favo r of99peovalg(w4remporary moA;barl ion A-10-co

$ which brecahed +he in.0alld;on of 4he FQ VA R Hev skid, I

l ou f cu ahi s;d mdwa.de -}reafme,J [bheie $'^W# "pc<;oj

'b '

$ 'ueNo 6 non%.S, The Beacd,emapproval -% 4e mpo a<y mod;fi< bon 7

f b defde knowin %4 he FAVA fil4rr Sk4 J./ not med fhe l rey; e me nks o 8eyIclory Cafe I.143 ., %e ASHE coSes s+dions .

E s aok z, anj q and a99;f cable Quality Axurance Preyam s. Qua7;ons oak Eva n3 % cov<>c rf' 3 PR6 meehn3reyard;n3 %e abovs non-congfiance s we<e no+ answered or -lhe ans.wers Pro v; dc8 io/;cafed %t ohpde safely, fech,. cal ,, e,3;nece3 l

onS rry afory cong(;asce revu ws h ad ud- been a cco m9i ;>heh.

The Pfa.h Rev.ew Board has a d; verse membersh:p bwk on brinj i ,3 f y e rh a p in a varie4y of ddfere,q g, sag, yo ibe fable. A> a mem ber I a <teff %+ &reniayof hes

, be h;flererit viewpoin$s and %$ %ere may be differtoces

[g! of profe>>ional opinion, 'This case is not one of profw;o,al h$ d;fferences. .Tf is one ,? adetsde co dvd of bo3;ne.5.5 ana y ful5:nmany of -fhe P60'.s reseons:6;hhes under Techacal f 3gect&shon.s as de>celbed in adm; ne.Nea7;ve Pro teAvee

??, ocooz -c

• Plan 3- Revi ow Ben.) - D.h es an A Re>PonsWl*lieb ,

E)9ecially parnya ph 2.o ong pa , ,,p6 3,3 ,

G I an, % .senion nyresenlahve a,, he bearA rep <ex,hy

+he l

' eyan occiy , feeh,,; cal , o,,A rey a4ary comphas ce areas of %* %g4fe .skaH. I prese n 4ed +be fe}lowi,3 ;nformaiion lo he Boa <f reya < A;g resaIabovy, code , an/ gudly regare,en W ca b le 4o % far,,y m,M: cdion A - eo-ooi :

i

O \/gfle is co+,,iHed fo Reg J a b y Octe f H3 in chaght I.9 of %e FSAR o

@ The FAVA f:H,< skad was berg a/ded 4 ffic plad's 1

0*st.gn by a +emporary moliCicakten v.jer- prosdv<e 00307-C

" Temporary tiokficaitons )

,,,,,,4

@ The te s,,po rary m o Micd;o n h- 90-00( ls 5 y s.

eclaked ' a os / Arc h mc d , desgn (Gv;< w.s- a'l 3aldy e valvblon.> are rega; r+0 by yeecefum I

i 003o7-c.

@ The Qvafi4y A.uarance depadmes) and

Vicc-Pre >\ Aed- hen t1cGy have recedly .sleessd +<ed ;

femecea<y an0 venfee egn;pmed- des;g I;k,e  ;

fermanent.  ;

^

@ The FAVA f:Ree skid 7.5 a syefe," ha4l'inj ra$ionbhe maler;al in hp: hs

• as deSned in Jedion 8 4 R e3 vlatory 69de 1.i +3.

9 The Reyldery f'oisikn .sedlen C.I.I.I re t";res ihd

• The sy.slem3 3A,vid be desped ad i

4e>4ed lo rey:< men}.s se+ 4er4h in to des an A Aandsch h>4e d a n Toble n .s w fe.,e,de/

by yqvlakoyy pa;>ilton s 1. I.2 onJ 4 of %1s ynde."

_ _ . _ . . _ . . _ _ _ . _ _ _ _.____._m _. . _ . .

1 4

_ _ . . -_ - . .-.. .I 0,

i  ;

i TABLEI '

l EQUFMENT CODES CODES i

i, I wends,  !

Deatpa and Queldisastee insporties l

! EQUlFMENT 8

~

Fahstenesse Weser6ain med Presederes and Temens AMSE Code ASME Code ASME Code ASME Code Premure Vesels 5 Section Vill. D.v. I Section il Sectaos IX 5ectase Vill. Dw. I 8

Atmo.phenc Tanks A5ME Code: ASME Code 8 ASME Code ASME Code l Section IX 5ectase Ill.Clas 3,

- Section Ill. (1am 3 Secnon il or apt 650, or AFI 6$0 or AWWA D 100 3 or AWWA D LOO 8

ASME Coas 8 A5ME Code 8 ASME Code ASME Codr 015 P51G Tanks section lil, Ga.s 3, Section il See 6es IX Secuse Ill. Clas 3.

8 ur API 620 8 or API 620 Heat Eachampers ASME Code ASME Code ASME Code ASME Code l

'Sectaos Vill. Dw. I section il Sectnee IX Secess Vlif. Der. I

/

and TEM A ANSI 831.1 ASTM and ASME Code ANSI 838.1 i Pipms and Vaives

" ASME Code Secteon IX i Section it  !

1 8 Wu 6,twurs' ASME Code ASME Code ASMECode i l Pump, '

5 tan.sares* 5ect6se Il er Secuse IX Seemes Ill.Clas 3L ,,

j Ws -

Im ,e,s.o.1 . .re ies e.s I Standards I,

.,. se - - . ., s , -

i

%- -. - a .,-..,m...- -

4 vemG ~fe.aar m - . e.e p u.

. _ 1 i

>m c .

..m., u_- e _ ., . . . . o

. - m. . . - t.,e m. m. -

4 l @ Ry d akery Wsi+io n C u.2 does 4

8.8.3 ManuMen Ier pseamme.esemamens sounpemames

! meute ammfesa es es sogemousses of sin speedesmene i Aus mamuists Ruand as tesene E W es ASIS Sment and I Premme Veemi Cats.s ,,,,,, g,, ,,g,,gg,, ,,,,ggg, ,,

! ease ses asessesh and passes pipe seiened not to emed.

MammMM esund me mpeanes -se me mem=ss pairinsd.

4 and memasses an.eromment et spas.es appessmens emnes senmal aumentmas and esenteseed opersnamed w_.

I Masudasemess' meamstal saranseems ed sanophense w. sis l I mesmesi speamsomens suset as these semessmed a she entus sueuumand to Tates I muy be poemedad a has ad sum maammut emus separen, j l i j

l i A-Ib

@ t

@ T4 is %e policy of %e Cxogia Power Co mpaay A+ ".shovf a

• regs;rn en+5 in Rep l a4 cry Gales Posihons a<e am f.e/

as s6a(I ", in +ha+ % +y a<e a ee3 v fdo vy repirm ent.

@ Table i preseks %e coles 4e wbich RaAwa>+e Syrfem> ace 4o be

\ O rsi9 " + / Ao" ! " c Y an/ +rsked. Y av:ewse w;% +6e board %r rey;<med.s fo< prexure vezel>

as an ex n yle.

@ Reg la4cvy Posi4)on C.G pasen4s 4he %h+y hxwance yey;rmehs h< rodwas+e nan agmedi SY3fems. S9eci E cally T reviewed +;% %e Boa <c(

\ i$e m A. 2.3 oa,d 4. 2,3,) as er ameles, 4

T provided lo the boa <d lhe I n 5 cmaS;en 0

le flo w:n3 l Nyva'di.3, he co,plia.,ce of 46e PAVA S;Her Skid cmd the .sdeby a-d inge e<;ng en(vako,, d Te.,,pora,y11,2% hon A -4o-col w;h 4be above- rege rne~il.s.

@ The FhVA Alke, .skib's prem wnel and he .5yde.,,-

ofher pre.ssver rebaini ny componen are nof code

.sla ped vusels er co mpon ed> . No ;rformcfion was Prov; del to % % d %& %,y nef any of 14e Au Code ret a emed.s d Table I, This Hcivdes ASME sed;on E , 7lTr, .DC and Aust 63t.\ Ts,a ;,elsdo ret-;rmeds 4- De>ig,, a, [ Q g d w Ho % tala_ h--W

l weIde< %(;%% a.,1 9,,ce d ,es, ,j r.,4,c; .,

and Ted;g.

@ The Shdup as No whe% e< .Sfa$em hylwf bic

+e.03 had been compiske cf was r a is e A re > a co mp(ello >, of a 1 eshon to %e boa <d. The of % f:l'er codainer

5 NS 8esdn b1Sn50 c hff U &dok GS havi g D6fn ro H 9l6 fed in Section ittL of Ut Engi% +eriy Euaf wdto n reseense fo REA v'G-9037 r

Paje 4 de rw Icinkdll-23-1M[ed

,, Thi3 i3 ed as. jud;fceicn for hoY meek;ng reqv;emEnh> b 863C~ide UA3, No iAhormbion %1as 9ttJtcc8 ko $he bog *) *ihcN[Gi.s hf.sk ha$ hten PEkor m e h, & l-MO Q pcbaSt 9b-6ccal7t, 0" $E%h adk ino -; aNe0 +o ve 7.c> f .ssehdo u.,en kko ,

from 4hs ven fo e, A 3 yrem 6 y dms la fic +< dis <* co<"~ enleef in 8E A - VG-905 7 3ecy;on X ile m C . A/o Socvmeddion wa> fee.senl6d h the boaed ikd 14i.s % f had W n .5a%ladov{y co4(s hd pcio<

to +be P68 vob3 .

@ 'ne FAVA fMc< .sysh6m is cons k Ne k oIm W exc)vaveIy of PVC pipig a<,/ Shy wkieh is -yet;6c, fly erok; b;frJ by 8 "laby 6"'le' 5

l.k3 .s+r;ow C l.L2 . There w A e6ns ofevc 5511ihy,., valves an A 099m si m de Iy so ormc+

home && A exo;- w The e.,a r, -: . os

g review respo">E ko W ' % ' 905 Y S4sk%S W .section 'il 0) The a. iud d Pvc fc3 v>=f 73 nd edensive and i> ro,,4 ar*ed en he FAVA Mer sk,it(. " The _ sam e REA in . set 4 ton I S4 des 'the FAVA Mer -- - " voe has been kn9o<s.ih d;s conhnaed he 4o a con ce rn raud rega rdi3 comgil asce w;% fieylg4ery Gutdc f.to (ic. ,se of Puc 9,pe) foe a pech on d 4he inktv connedt3 4tm g erav y ?"*'*b5 ho+>(adecti mdek; to hea< fref fofal lengh for f 6e f;Her ;nle and ed(et) en the FAVA f.%< Acl.

~ihe ea3i neesig revi<w and e,59 3 de4y m ( d .o-

,ju>hfy % vse c6 PVC pi 9tn3 b e cause  ;& i 5"

.5ch ecfv le so anc( .$s,'4ahle. [or- -M;.s scevi ce " , pie,.e h avv bet n no Ytycdcd (6ak,s" , beawh6

'% ideyded dose f, 4ke Pvc pp woJJ be J btIow 'fhe Ya$; bion 007Aje Ovebh c0 cmcl huafly ,

i the 'Pvc ppe we.A d v e be saaedeJ 4e n as>

p,en vee condi} ions s\see +6e m an mu m ovajlabIr initi Pr* Dv'E h $hc NN Ib EO 5*

• f#'3 WAa4 the en3 ineewing rev;ew o ,d so,.59 M

. e<dsb;on -fa:) 40 a ucen ere n.eny dhec

• chn; <af inve.> haf wovId be need' d 4 aHe y f ;

l e

+o dohfy the v>e d Fvc such as res;>}a,ce.4.

l va+e r hammer,ivewu%cda ge p g o acy  :

c 5 ,,,

5!rts.>e$ fon Pff svgyok.5, $herm s] t-xpan><o n au ,

Becaux % ndenal e,J t ys;<al h predie.s of Pvc a<e so d:R;<eJ t<an .s4rel, the emivdion is .,

- r .- .. - o. < x - Wi '

g

[' 0%e< e n c e.> and omisic > in %e e.,j w <ir,y .

j anA JaNeky Fva[vsy;on fn.ak.e -fhe dwdi% cafio n i of aas94 aM dy of Puc 99,3 ined; A. The  ;

{

hvida.,3 9a y % a c9ead hcak geenv<e of aber i 1/5 fi ij Pr Aarry FAVA. The FAVA .:4,id  !

} doo nd conha;n a relief vafve. As a resd+

l 0f +4:.s , Pac pipe cadd be .svbGec{ed 40 eucess  ;

i P<exu< e con Jilt on > faom +%<m al espansion ,

l  ?<o., rod;o )y41'c e4F ys19 and fro., w raov> l Pa rNj opratien 3, bsure rafing e4 WC PWe -

i de ILo *F.* Amba 6nk a Akion in,

%ges/esAR6 rap;dly app oocl> af iM) I' vel O*;na *h! 3"'"m *-

l 0 ~ihe FAJS fd4e< p<env<r vene( (a, r,en%d ake l 1s ud p<deded by a rdef v'dve, Wo esgla;nanon l l wa> prov;ded in %e engiseer;,3, evdua0;en or.

in fw% v Ques 4;cn;g e] Sc3 cte>; p e n3 , m es, l

. a3 4. ~b y his i3 accepfa h le. A> >% a heve  !

l %e ageea<.s 4o be con dih o s % d c w ic(

l .5uh3eek % e pesur e vene lo exevivc prenv<f5 Adeqde ove r - Preavee P'N'c h *" 'Y prenv<e vene(> is a rey'<^rd of A>HE l Code

! secIio n W.  ;

l @ Sc5 en p ee<> 3 pekresed 44r egime l and so,59 afefy evaivahi on Ge hFAo!A f,W :

a Md. On a 4s Is9houe call in he pre.sence of r M e P6 B .5C) enjee-;,ij a d a.;#e f f 4 d ' # o engru.e, )

or nere.se.>kfive of N;r A.,4,3,eng;,,e,7,3, g,.9 n-ih \

i . .

L .

~

had eve e seen o,- walked Aa,, * %FXVA i i M;l Cird han/. M ere as it m,y h e aam4abt< ia cec 4an, ci,cv,,A a,,ce , 4 , y. t. <,,, a ,

l

. e ngiwrg ruiewp.b4 v;,w;,3 #e ef#e,4 G,, .

! d ra* h33 o d g+efacien3 ; G wid n.4 he ou@ 7 l foc~ PAVA sh S. The slo / we no pro curved do an .

here Ll .

fanka* kS or b9&dh5 thong,ihm do nb ,

eM nom aJ h;h r edWi ajo A4 45 dis 0"***A "'" I4'#h 8 l no Ova (hy As>vea,ce eroyam we rih Eed. exauw ;

! cf A 3 4he re viewsr co uld n.4 A now "' A a* y

! certwy wad w asb.:14 co,h nr3, c,,6g J;or >

G=d (on dih on of N h15/ Wah. _ , , .

l So eng,me;ny ad,,ikr0 ou %c ne9%e 9

j cnI( Mr tkey had n 4 dew, o hne Jy 6ne l co v ari.so n " of fA, . sob co r,po eds w;fh

! co Res a 4 deq> Shu n/o ds a~d ce y r me nh. M. l a.> b.,;Ii- d r. .i are ce,4 oi d in A e,y,,,9 ;

33 eval vdion . Th ere ;> only a sr.,p fe. P e I p .s h , , , '

j j @ A p>4 on wa3 mixa a3 4 whAer- %e PyIneeA n3 review hak cen> hs-GA freviou5 i Yaki ahlo n typ.5vre Oh Ne hlGh, hee er was

! Pr* v> Ae A o,,ly %ak- V 's cohv1h);on w a s S n.al\. i

{ Look,ag d pay 4 e$ % S,5,+, ev.GJ;s, l l 4e d 4 i,/ W e f5,4 re iew3 v e g o.w re w o n h (

can.u acceJ.

l A-/h

l ,

8. T qued,anel how % en3:nre<ing o,d saMy Fvniviion cov1A lyo's a l b ' " i"3 +4 e lo M la k i 4g Oval:4y A550<an ce Pr. yam o

• A + d e u j n ., .

l conh<veton a d 4 e.s k3 of % sktd . No l ann * <s we<c provided % rey:rmed.s d l M e h i a b le Q v d i 4 y Avva-ce Proyan.s is se+ 44h in fbe F54R . sed; on /7.z k,,8 f4ru _ sed;on M. A <cdv dien in awh a ble Ova (;4y %.,c&

! P<q ra ms ran only be done w.% 9 to r ee<m;nio, of +6e A/6C.

i 9, The Cadily Anv<a,ce Mmayv slaled lo k l

bee.J tha4 s.-e 4; ses a av M y M a,cs .

froya m could be use) le duhfy 14cco d at-

? con la st& wi+h Codn on.d some41mo role comglio,ce could be v>ea MMy ceds;, ;fe,,

C0ah4 1 Assovece p<oyams, l l o4 non-cmb a ce +i%

bu4 he dsdn'4 xe how we 'd d J udify a l<<k \

\

of b.%.

• n , ,. + ma<ai w \

e eaa. l 4 l, i Tn somma<y +6, Bea d iyored y-ecal no( .9,cc;te l

l guadio v,.> as self os nesde ve infor ,a ios espoule.,3 r*rlabon ., code, p<oceducal , ed osa(,4y Annce y,3,,,

^

o a r,r

. Come(i""ce an d ,n,~ a m aI 4 e y e,.av y ,,,o a A ic d ;o n A - To -ml, The Bew& .serm+cf +o be pc,,s> veeg by +s,

~

l fast %d %e vendev , hacry Fava ,was on sF e and ready 4. re tutal) 4he .Ai A. Th, vote w e co h d -fer

?%?*Y !*deg.t 8 h ned- issuc.> o~ *a.+;"1 h ,

pe,4 ne,c de m ,e J a b n. Tbe vde was cake 4

-(cv in bt 0C6 Ch b~ re og Ob d Ethi on bom NC vie c6a;<ma n and was ag eved 5 k .t in & m O femeravy' meds-b< bion A- 90-w I,

Since Raht, Sy>hms hoo, r+y l atory a,c(

qali4y nivrmeds W A s.n cc 4ki> Te,,9entay tied;ficaion l was des 3nhed ' 3ckly Rela 4cA " t%s j IJ A v A f[I y c o n (G r q #,

)

.* f i

4 4

d4 . / n

Subseqvcd k -lhe Pno meeliy d 2-g-go I hav+ r+ vie wel odd:];on d in fo rmdton ed dnwn O khihi O '14 COHCfvaigny suehh rf.,$vNEhy foM(frr7h Os

[6 }fow.5 Davenk: r4 e c:rcala< %o-18 : to cf 6 50.59 Sedr4y Evalvdion.s,

$0e Chong f> habio#ChiVV Wak6 Tredment .sp% .

[0%loison i Fro ,  % Ctsca;on " >edi on , eeSe<r,,cc-ib madE bo Permanenk o< b~ eor *<Y Sf>bmh wMch implies bak reyd<mNd>

06tP(y GToelly do ++m pove. y sybtna, Conc lu.> ion : Fyo , %E hie 4 ice " gchion ,' " % W~

Po h a s b le> CFR 20,30 s 50,71 MS '**

N fed $i$y T ees,ical Spee;(icdien>, o,J 4ecF

eno(E~;wlu( 9ec a,ies Ik> S4 ~do-d) i a-c wp(. ca%." Be cavre c4 kk, eval 8 d fadure mode > tcs- Hi.ny in 5 9 ea ying do ~ ,  % b4/in cnd

% pdedaf fa,y relas+ ,L oavenJs 6 vwd:AS O ce mud be a4Lexed. These have hok bren $*e vio4.$f60lveJJ6h N("&

khE $*cht bl('b y & V*E 0 loke r&,

Dys4rms is vt<y [ow.

---

A:Ib

l .

O<aff . sos 9 Pe))c yh a ,a W3ACI25.

Do<vdr fomro

_ qbhkeme,h and Pceceda<s) bcfosion s 5Safefy Evoluchea in A vo-m is inadequde and % <s-fon e %

FA vA BHe .skJ o.,4 :43 oge.-dio, r+Presed:, an 'unrewewed .sddy ques 4;cn.

I dm %s concIv>;en buause -fai(v e modes , y,,obs,);4,., o-f 4;)s ce, ang a,nse p,ce.,. d' failv res have "O b+

andy sed , reviewed [aTh'W d16e Iicen ciy has;.s.

becaux com ;asceI

\

wi%

, EsAR commi46& Re . L; des, cadu cad sh,cids and <My Au we., ce pmew wo ime(icikIn 4he h <en.si%

basss i4Self. Whofexte devealion was n a h(va fe fy odl< css 16ese imhe d-

lem3, $6s mo0s 5e akio n is'unre<; tmh.

d A. - Ik'

4 i

1 l

been4

A -4o- 0o1 FAVA Tevorauy N4ft cdion )

(ChC$0 SIC V1 : 0n 2 -12  %*J h6 n,W 49 y me&4; cahon was male odive by 44* '

sh;B sugervi. soy , 2,s&ded d vev;4ied.

l

.T( % VAv4 slad re getseds an +rev;ewb

\

bah 4y gut.rion ad Sincs %e skA is now in>N(fed, we are now in as Un analy red cand; hon 69 erusrion, Ms tegess+d.s a dc# cier con /ihon m/may {

be. repohable 14 dekr,; ne) h he sy nthea, 4

i

t -

g A ddik,aJ co..de. a% .

%iahon d A5HE CoAe> o.,d %(i4y h>>v<a ce be a con ce<n lo line

P esykm re@r men 4> ""Y bkc ~t ch & 3 in C6 &oeg ia h kovbe). %ess celss 0 8 o oe NuJe a- Tn>v <er> oh % ; yc,k. ;.1 aft,ae<?

by code and %hty P,c3,om jo ,,4 ;a I ,,ce .

&co z- C wo Pla.,i Alsed>ch e ProceAwe aofd;ft onal  ;;en

it *SI Y rev;>e$ ho inciv/ e clesc,$*

e e on he he Aliv d pan-vna,,,im os decisow'4.3.c.z . l t .

j Th> sn4;on Nas nb bun comphed o as I

have kn ceLdef suce k nm-i Several rneeb.J5 w.,

vna m>movs are a./ no vuelvh on,,,. a am,the ik m

! has byen prese nleA.

8A[ 2 l+-fo J

(

A-YY

mmu As adChna; baeks <ou,8, se F^vA -Ci He<

had been pces.,vsf y 2nk Hej a.,/ of e n k & ;,,

4ke plal w;%d any fe ,pomq mg.;,g ;,

~

-for abou2 6 <"mfhs.

The need Sc< such a 4114ec E<sh ca~e in't ea da ce in "E! V n w g (seeaga u p.,ye ., L ,p den 6a-a>+e,rse,asicy nf ntA esy <> pn e( ag ibey we<e clox lo exceedan3Nobium 95 disc boy 64 The IMfee was 9<ocurre) do %:4 Matun Aachapes.

Mer d -> d.xoveces there we<e "o < der of rnay&fe '

erro<> in 46e p;atum d;> chay 1 4 ralwidrons due So O F vie oh wrony &na:ron men; al con cen&akie n 9e>9;fe Sh;S , %6 fYav~ No Pcocare a Nliee hui 0v5 confkved e,d h e e n9,os;s 1 sh:hrt Co.,, M o k es 95

• o N 35 thkGo. %s khe .5dYsa<c t rr ov.S were cor<eheR , M&u n u L,d> ha ve n d been a 9-d ie >,.

The 9-oblems wkh lhe FAVA .n(W r,ob <>,edig f r b i S 4 lie d appheade rey]a ro y tvgaemer> was by 4he Hdea's a,d Pcocurrne,4 revsew yeues wbo knu % %s $wbl &m 4o %e sNcd;on d v,cn,9mef n Quamy Azurece. Bo>ed w +6ex ca,cerny s t 41(4e< m> re n,ovea Fom serv;ce . a J et%4.s. 4, procure a ay>4s -, +W m d re tu rneds 4 tsun.

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